How Jean Jullien makes light of negative news in his practice | Jean Jullien

Summary

In an interview, French illustrator and artist Johan Papin discusses his creative upbringing and early illustration work during school. He aimed to bring art to the public domain instead of just galleries. Over time his work evolved organically from daily social media cartoons to colorful landscape paintings and installations, influenced by experiences like having a child. He sees humor and beauty as defenses against negativity. Though proud of large temporary installations, he accepts their impermanence. He tries maintaining freedom to experiment and fail within commercial work. Despite anxiety over audience reactions, he aspires to balance commercial and personal projects across platforms to maximize expression.

Takeaways

• 😊 Johan grew up with influences from street culture, theater, music and more which encouraged his creativity
• 👨‍🎨 He started in graphic design but realized he was not very good at it and wanted more creative freedom across mediums
• 🎭 Johan likes to work across high and low brow mediums from commercial work to galleries to reach different audiences
• 😂 Humor is a defense mechanism for Johan against constant bad news rather than an intentional effort to be funny
• 🌅 Painting landscapes was a reaction to negative news and social media, wanting mental space and happiness
• 🖼️ Ephemeral large-scale installation works are some of Johan's favorites though they get destroyed after exhibitions
• 📝 Sketchbooks are an un judged space for experimentation and failure which Johan has kept up for over 20 years
• 👪 Returning to create art in his hometown where he grew up was highly meaningful
• ✨ Johan balances commercial and personal work which motivates him and provides financial stability
• 🗓️ He has several major upcoming projects in Paris, New York, a TV show and more this year

Q & A

How did Johan's upbringing influence his creative path?

Johan's upbringing played a significant role in shaping his creative path. Although not explicitly encouraged to pursue art, he was not discouraged either. His exposure to a mix of highbrow and lowbrow culture, thanks to his father's interest in pop culture and his mother's profession as an architect and curator, provided a rich, eclectic mix of creative influences.

What is notable about the city Johan comes from and how did it influence him?

Johan comes from Nantes, France, known for its street culture, particularly street theater, and events like Voyage à Nantes. The city's vibrant cultural scene, including street performances by Royal de Luxe featuring giants and elaborate narratives, contributed to Johan's eclectic and diverse creative influences.

How did studying graphic design at Central St. Martins impact Johan's work?

Studying graphic design at Central St. Martins significantly impacted Johan's work, embedding a foundation of typography, composition, and color. The playful and experimental approach encouraged at St. Martins, along with the pragmatic training he received in France, has influenced how he composes his artworks, integrating graphic design principles even in his paintings.

Why did Johan transition from graphic design to more personal artistic endeavors?

Johan transitioned from graphic design to more personal artistic endeavors after realizing graphic design might not fully accommodate his creative aspirations. Despite initially not aiming to become an illustrator or painter, his desire for freedom and exploration led him to pursue a path that allowed for broader creative expression.

What was the focus of Johan's final project at the Royal College of Art?

Johan's final project at the Royal College of Art focused on creating a series of minimal and impactful images for a mass audience, rather than solely for art connoisseurs. He aimed to provoke thought and laughter through a visual language rooted in the tradition of poster art, bending commercial communication tools for dialogue on contemporary matters.

How does Johan balance highbrow and lowbrow elements in his work?

Johan balances highbrow and lowbrow elements in his work by not choosing a single direction and embracing the freedom to express different ideas through various platforms. This approach allows him to engage with both social media and museum/gallery spaces, adapting his message according to the platform and audience.

What role does humor play in Johan's work?

Humor plays a significant role in Johan's work as a response to the consistently negative news cycle. It serves as a defense mechanism, where Johan attempts to find and twist something that bugs him into something funny or witty, as a way of countering negativity.

Why has Johan shifted towards painting and landscape artworks?

Johan shifted towards painting and landscape artworks as a natural progression influenced by changes in his personal life, including starting a family and discovering surfing. This shift allowed him to reflect on happier, slower themes and be mentally available for his family, marking a departure from the fast-paced creation and social media engagement.

How does Johan perceive the impermanence of his art, especially for installations and murals?

Johan perceives the impermanence of his art, particularly installations and murals, as a valuable aspect of creation. Although initially fine with the idea of his art being temporary, the actual destruction of his works can be emotionally challenging. However, he appreciates the uniqueness of experiencing art that isn't permanently accessible, aligning with the digital age's ephemeral nature.

What upcoming projects does Johan have planned?

Johan has several projects lined up, including a project in Paris at the B Mar department store involving giants and a story told through window displays. He also has a show in New York, a TV show about his parents in the works, and a significant show about escapism planned for the next year, among other endeavors.

Outlines

00:00

🎨 Creative Beginnings and Influences

Johan discusses his upbringing and the influence of his family's interest in pop culture and architecture on his and his brother Nikolai's creativity. Growing up in Nantes, France, a city known for its vibrant street culture, including street theater and events like Voyage à Nantes, provided Johan with a mix of high and low cultural experiences. He reflects on the encouragement to be creative without being explicitly pushed towards it, crediting his environment for nurturing his artistic side. Johan's education in graphic design at Central St Martins in London is highlighted as a pivotal point in his career, where he was encouraged to explore various mediums, leading to a strong foundation in graphic design principles that continue to influence his work as an artist and illustrator.

05:01

🔄 Balancing Commercial and Personal Work

Johan talks about the importance of maintaining a balance between commercial work and personal artistic endeavors. He emphasizes the value of having diverse platforms to express different ideas and reach various audiences, from social media to museum exhibitions. Despite the challenges of navigating between highbrow and lowbrow art forms, Johan enjoys the freedom his practice offers. He shares insights into his early career struggles with choosing between graphic design and illustration, eventually finding his unique path that blends both. Johan also mentions his influences, including iconic graphic designers like Paul Rand and artists who manage to straddle the line between commercial and personal work, inspiring him to document contemporary matters in a visually engaging way.

10:02

🤔 Humor and Wit in Art

Johan discusses the role of humor and wit in his artwork, describing them as defense mechanisms against the negativity in the world. He explains how he uses observation of everyday situations to create art that makes people laugh and think, applying graphic design techniques to enhance the impact of his work. Johan's shift towards painting, influenced by personal life changes and a desire for a slower pace of creation, is also covered. He shares how painting allows him to reflect on beauty and humor in a more contemplative manner, despite initially fearing a loss of audience interest when moving away from more direct comedic expressions in his art.

15:02

🎨 Evolution of Style and Medium

Johan reflects on the evolution of his art style and the mediums he explores, from drawing and illustration to painting and public art. He discusses the challenge of staying true to his interests while also considering audience expectations, ultimately choosing to pursue what makes him happy. Johan highlights the importance of integrating drawing into his exhibitions in new ways, using his work to comment on various themes such as tourism, childhood, and societal issues. He also talks about a significant project that involved painting a 13-meter-long mural for a museum show, showcasing his approach to creating art that contributes to a collective narrative while being deeply personal.

20:04

🌍 Impact of Temporary Art

Johan shares his perspective on creating temporary art installations and the emotional impact of knowing his work will eventually be dismantled. He values the uniqueness of experiencing art that cannot be replicated digitally, emphasizing the importance of ephemeral projects in his career. Johan discusses his approach to creating art as a form of personal satisfaction and exploration, allowing him to experiment and develop his practice organically. He also mentions how sketchbooks play a crucial role in his creative process as a space for experimentation, failure, and the development of new ideas.

25:06

🔄 Continual Growth and Experimentation

In the final paragraphs, Johan reflects on the balance between his commercial projects and personal artistic development. He stresses the importance of maintaining a space for experimentation and failure, which he finds crucial for creative growth. Johan discusses various significant projects, including public art commissions and collaborations that have allowed him to explore different artistic mediums and narratives. He concludes by sharing his upcoming projects and his approach to staying motivated and innovative in his work, highlighting the ongoing evolution of his artistic journey.

Keywords

💡Graphic design

Graphic design is mentioned several times as the foundation of Johan's work and visual style. He studied graphic design and feels it provides a structure and visual language that carries through even into his paintings and sculptures. Examples given include using principles of typography, composition, and color theory when creating artworks.

💡Humor

Humor and comedy are discussed as ways Johan tries to process or react to negative news and situations. He says he uses humor almost as a defense mechanism or to find something positive in bleak circumstances. Specific examples given are creating cartoons and seeking out beauty or humor when faced with worrying current events.

💡High and low brow

The mix of high brow (highbrow) and low brow (lowbrow) art and culture is mentioned as an influence from Johan's upbringing. He aims to work across galleries and commercial clients, wanting to reach both art world insiders and mass audiences. Johan feels diversity of platforms allows him to connect with different people.

💡Painting

In recent years Johan has focused more on colorful landscape paintings. Reasons given include wanting a slower pace of life after social media burnout and becoming a father. The paintings seem to represent beauty and a retreat from urban living. They mark a shift from his previous commercial illustration work.

💡Sketchbooks

Johan's sketchbooks are described as important free spaces for experimentation and failure, seen as almost private artworks. He explains they allow the creative freedom and lack of inhibition he experienced as a student. Sketchbooks have been featured in several exhibitions to reveal his creative process.

💡Ephemeral art

Some of Johan's recent large-scale murals and installations are temporary or ephemeral artworks. Though proud of them, he accepts they will be destroyed after exhibitions end. To Johan this reflects the pleasure found in the creative process rather than worrying about permanent finished works.

💡Childhood

Johan's hometown Nantes and childhood are clearly key influences. He mentions the street culture, performances and giants parading through city streets. Last year he even did a public art project back in the gardens and spaces he knew growing up, revisiting childhood themes.

💡Storytelling

Storytelling emerges in several projects mentioned. His graphic narratives on museum walls combine painting, text and drawing to share perspective. Ephemeral installation of window displays will lead viewers through a visual story. He is also working on an animated TV show about his parents.

💡Escapism

Escapism is mentioned as Johan's next major exhibition topic. He will explore humanity's inner desire to retreat from challenging realities into creative outlets, relationships and activities - from video games and music to politics and visual art.

💡Anxiety

Anxiety is discussed both personally for Johan around audience expectations and social media, and more universally when describing modern overwhelm. His art seems to be an antidote, with humor, imagination and beauty channeled from difficult emotions.

Highlights

Johan discusses his upbringing and the influence of his family's interest in pop culture and architecture on his creative development.

He talks about the vibrant street culture of his hometown, Nantes, France, which blended high brow and low brow influences.

Johan's education in graphic design at Central St Martins and how it informs his current work as an artist and illustrator.

The transition from graphic design to a broader artistic practice, driven by a desire for creative freedom.

His approach to creating work that is accessible to a mass audience, blending humor and visual storytelling.

The significance of his time at the Royal College of Art for his development as an artist.

Johan's emphasis on not wanting to be confined to a single direction in his art, maintaining a balance between high brow and low brow work.

The importance of humor in his work as a response to the consistently negative news cycle.

How painting became a more prominent part of his work as he sought to explore themes of beauty and nature.

His engagement with public art and the impact of large-scale projects in his hometown of Nantes.

The evolution of his work from digital and graphic to more physical and spatial forms of expression.

Johan's process of creating stylized versions of reality through a limited drawing skill set, developing a unique visual language.

The balance between personal and commercial work as a source of motivation and inspiration.

The challenge and importance of maintaining a space for experimentation and failure in his practice.

Upcoming projects, including a public art project in Paris, an exhibition in New York, and an animated TV show about his parents.

Transcripts

hi Johan thank you very much for joining

us how are you I'm good thank you very

much for having me and everyone for

coming you're in in the bright lights

now yeah yeah I know um well yeah thank

you very much for joining us at Nic of

Tuesdays I thought we would start from

uh the very beginning if that's all

right your your upbringing because I

know your your brother younger brother

Nikolai is also an artist and a musician

um he's a sculptor I think as well um so

how much were you encouraged to be

really creative when you were um when

you were growing up was it a big part of

your life kind of being creative in art

I don't think we're encouraged but we

were not discouraged okay um my my dad

was like really into pop culture so

there was a lot of like comic books and

music and movies lying around and my mom

was um working as architect and curator

so she would take us to some shows she

was curating and so we got uh we got

like a fair mix of high brow and low

brow which was nice and but I wasn't

really pushed on us it was just sort of

like part of the culture and I come from

a city called not uh which is in France

at least known for um a lot of uh Street

culture um not like graph and stuff but

more like Street Theater and um now

there's this thing called Voyage not

which organize a lot of events in the

streets all around we had this company

called royal Deluxe which used to

organize um like you would have Giants

walking through the city you would have

like a giant book opening with the story

of friends being narrated by actors and

this kind of stuff so there was a a nice

eclectic mix of creative outputs

throughout my childhood um yeah oh

interesting I know there's a there's a

contingent from non in in the studio in

the audience tonight

so um and I guess I mean you you

mentioned there like high brow and low

brow which I think is something really

interesting we'll probably come on to

that in a little bit but um you you

studied graphic design you went on to

study graphic design at Central St

Martins here in London um you're

obviously now known more as an artist

and illustrator but how much do you

think graphic design that kind of

background and that grounding in graphic

design kind of plays into your work now

um a lot I think I think that sort of um

yeah it's always been there I studied in

a very um more old school pragmatic um

course in France for three years before

coming to St Martin and to learn like

the basis of typography composition

color and all of that and and when I

came to St Martin it the the way of

teaching was quite different it very

playful and we're encouraged to try

video advertising illustration book

making everything um but I think even

now when I do paintings like surf

paintings and things like that just the

the way to compose the painting is the

same way I would compose a poster and

you know the way I would do the trees in

a in an almost

um turning them as icon in their own

sort of like visual alphabet is the same

I would compose poster with typography

um so I think it's it's sort of like the

the backbone of everything that I do no

matter the medium and what I guess at

what point did you realize that you

didn't want to be a graphic designer I

guess that was at one point the the

dream but um when did you realize I was

just not very good at it um no but also

I I I don't know and you know I never

wanted to to be an illustrator or or a

painter I I don't think I ever wanted to

be maybe uh comic book and animation

when I was younger cuz that's the stuff

that I used to uh to obsess over but

when I was in St Martin's I didn't

decide on a on a path and that was super

exciting I just wanted to keep that

freedom to be able to not have to decide

okay and the next I guess the next step

for you was you went on to the Royal

College of Art for your ma in in visual

communication I I found this statement

on on line which is something that you

wrote about your your final project and

um it is a bit long but I thought I'd

read it in full cuz it is it's also

fascinating I'm sorry I'm sorry no but

it's genuinely fascinating and it kind

of it speaks to your work now even but

you might find this a little bit

embarrassing I'm sorry um but you said

for my degree I've worked on a series of

minimal and practical images that are

aimed at a mass audience rather than

produced solely for a crowd of Visual

Arts connoisseurs to be viewed only in

specialized spaces and Publications I

try to use the commercial and public

domain to create a visual language that

aims to make people laugh and think

visually based in the continuity of a

certain tradition of poster art I've

bent this communication tool used mainly

for commercial purposes to provoke a

dialogue on contemporary matters that

people can relate to which I think is

just like a lovely way of uh that sounds

very

pompus how much of that do you still

kind of agree with or do um I think the

I I totally uh don't acknowledge uh I'm

very embarrassed by it but know I I I I

I know what I was trying to say and and

and for sure like I still still have a

very strong appetite for um a fair

divide between High BR and low BR um

social media or Museum versus gallery or

client work um I don't want to choose

One Direction and that's why I enjoy the

practice that I'm in at the moment is

that I I get to do a bit of everything I

touched the bit in the gallery work and

it's very good because it pays the rent

but then museum is open to all and and

super important socially I think and you

don't actually you don't say the same

thing based on the platform so if you

have many things to say or if you're

unsure but certain things then there's a

platform for that and and diversity

helps you to be able to express

different ideas for different people and

how did people respond to that work I

guess you know you talked about it being

minimal and practical when you were you

know at that early stages of your career

did people I don't know they think it

was maybe too too practical too minimal

how is that received either at the RCA

or or just afterwards um well I think at

the it was complicated at theier because

I got asked to um to decide on a path

illustration or graphic design and I

didn't feel like I was a good

illustrator a good graphic designer and

I I just wanted to continue playing and

the same time I I was lucky to um to

have landed a few commissions uh and I

wanted to make the most of them and keep

doing them so I used the studio and made

some really good friends met some really

interesting people but I'm not sure I

was the best student uh at following the

curses but that's okay yeah no

absolutely that's perfectly okay um I

guess which other designers and artists

were your kind of biggest influences

back then you know we I've read that

statement but um yeah who do you think

was kind of influencing your thinking

about your work back then well I I

always say the same but like in terms of

um all the big names like Paul Rand and

soul bass all the people that sort of

were graphic designers working for the

industry but had that little bit of

um they had something else that you know

they they could function as artist in

the same time as they could function for

an industry and I did find that

extremely interesting that um everybody

has to pay the rent but if you can do

that and still have a bit of your

essence into it then you also paint

pictures on billboards which is better

than just seller products um

and otherwise Tommy angerer and S and a

lot of people that were very good in my

opinion at dividing between commercial

and personal and sort of try to document

uh the world they were living in at the

time someone like Tommy andar did some

children's book He did a lot of amazing

political posters um at the time of the

Vietnam Wars or or other eras like the

Nixon era and he did some very intense p

pornographic drawing at the same time so

it was like playing in many different

fields but somehow it created a a

coherent body of work and that's

something that I was like this is cool

this this is good this is not to have

the freedom to break out of the pth that

you feel like you're being given I mean

how much how difficult is it to kind of

keep those things separate and make sure

that you're working on kind of personal

work and you have your personal practice

and at the same time doing the yeah

maybe slightly more commercial things

that as you say kind of pay the rent um

I mean you always have to pay the rent

so that's the one thing that you've got

to make sure you do otherwise like I

don't know just I try to play it by

Instinct a lot you know when I get sent

to commission

commercially I try to see if it's

something that I agree with uh on a

personal ethical point of view more and

more now that I've got the the luxury to

be able to do that and and the rest of

the time I keep producing for myself and

and and work that try to say something

that I want to say uh so it's it's

always a fair balance you know between

commercial and gallery work or between

Sketchbook and and social media MH yeah

um in that statement you kind of talk

about making people laugh and think

which I guess is is Yeah just something

your work has always managed to do right

from the beginning um to look at

laughter first I mean how important is

humor in your work and I guess what role

do you feel like humor plays like what

are you trying to do when you're putting

a joke into your work I I'm not trying

very hard to be funny because I don't

think I know how to be but um I think

same as everyone the news is terrible

it's been consistently terrible for a

while is I don't think it's getting

worse it's just like we're getting more

news um and I guess through drawing my

reaction was to try to find something

that bugs me and to try to twist it

reverse it and sometime it was funny

sometime it was maybe witty um but it

was it was more of a sort of Defense

mechanism that's the way I try to see it

now like with a bit of of

distance um and and it's going to sound

really Co but it's the same with

painting you know the more I've got

negative things on on my mind I try to

find beauty or to find humor and it's

more of a desperate attempt at

countering the negative and is that what

you mean by it Tak different forms yeah

is that what you mean by defense

mechanism kind of trying to I guess find

a positive in in negative thoughts yeah

I think I mean that's that's the sort of

something that I'm I'm trying

to um formulate in in in the next year

through a series of shows but like it's

it's akin to escapism when reality

becomes extremely dire we all have

different ways of coping with it some

people play video games some will see

their friends some will write a diary

some will do a video um and for me for a

long time my mechanism was to try to do

daily cartoons about it then it was to

do landscape paintings about beauty and

now I'm trying to formulate other things

in that direction that sounds

interesting can't wait to see that um I

mean I guess the last time we spoke was

during the pandemic and that was

definitely a time when you were really

doing that you know finding the kind of

slightly Bleak but also funny sides of

things that were happening in your

everyday life at that time right yeah

but it's um it's good for inspiration

it's like you know whenever you have a

wall in front of you you have to find a

way to climb over it so it's of lend

itself well to creativity you have to

scratch your head to find how you're

going to climb over it and then five

different people are going to have five

different ways to deal with that wall

and during covid I think that's we all

had this wall of covid and then you saw

millions and millions of different ways

to deal with that wall and that was

terrible terrible time socially but for

a lot of people quite an interesting

time creatively and we saw a lot of

people um I think it's the same in

England but in France like you you hear

a lot of new artists comedians musicians

graphic artists painters and a lot of

them say oh yeah was during covid that

you know I had nothing to do but to try

to entertain myself so I came up with

this or this so there was negative and

there was positive response to it yeah

definitely um I guess on the think side

of things of that that statement your

your work kind of often uses this like

subtle Twist of meaning or there's a a

kind of witty reveal I guess to get

people thinking um I'm intrigued about

like what the mental state is like that

you have to get into to to find those

little moments of of wit and and humor

um is there a particular head space that

you have to be in to be that kind of to

find those little funny moments um no

it's like my my work process would have

been based on observation like I was

saying I would see a situation or

experience a situation then try to

reflect on it creatively same as you

find this glass and try to find a

different use for it it's like you have

a situation you turn that into a

question you try to find a good answer

and um for the the the wheat the wit

sorry French accent but um a lot of the

time I try to approach the image making

or the comedy making the same way I

always do um in graphic design how you

would do advertising you need to capture

the attention of the viewer with a

graphic a situation and then once you

had that that um attention grabbed you

would

be able to inate a second more subtle

level of of of meaning or reading and

sometime it's through comedy sometime

it's through graphic Pond it varies okay

so that graphic design background

definitely coming in a lot there um I

guess in recent years you've been doing

a lot more painting and yeah I mentioned

it in the introduction these like

beautiful colorful landscapes of kind of

natural landscapes um and you've been

showing your work all around the world I

guess what's made you want to move in

this direction and do more of that work

cuz it feels like there's you're you're

doing more of that than than ever before

unless that's just my perception no it's

like it's a weird it's it's not like

painting as opposed to um it's not a

divorce from drawing but it it all it's

quite organic like when I was in London

I was in London for 13 years and I was

doing a lot of social media and I I

didn't have a family and I was going out

a lot had a lot of freedom and and then

certain things happened that

maybe affected my um my mental health a

little bit through social media and then

I I had a kid and a lot of things

coincided and I just it lends itself to

taking a step back from a fast-paced way

of living and creating and try to

reflect on other happier things slower

things um I wanted to be available

mentally for my kid and my family and I

discovered surfing at the same time and

you know it's just sort of like planets

aligning in a weird way and and and you

just decide to to follow that but I was

always drawing in my Sketchbook and and

and still coming up with ideas based on

situations but so for a long time it

seemed like a divorce drawing and it was

used I was used to a certain way of

interacting with social media and then

when I started doing painting like I

could see that I was losing a lot of my

audience and they was like oh do I

you know should I continue and and and

try to should I get back into it to

please the people that have been

supporting me or should I try to follow

what makes me feel good and what makes

me happy so I did that and and through a

few years of doing that I've been lucky

enough to to go through Galleries and

then be off nice exhibition spaces and

there I could bring back the drawing in

a different way not through like hyper

di comedy but more through bringing a

bit of my sketchbooks on the wall

actually that's very good timing but um

yeah there you you had like those

paintings we talking it was for a show

at the Museum of Contemporary Arts in in

Leon in France this was talking about

tourism and the paintings were showing

different sets of Tourism and then

through the walls I was playing with the

idea and like rambling on a more comedy

way about it and and now I've got this I

feel like I've got this graphic language

that I'm using for bigger shows like

Museum shows where I can I just finished

a show in Belgium at the Mima Museum

which was school studiolo and the idea

was like I'm talking too much but I feel

like I want to talk about that now

people are here for you I think you can

talk you can talk as much as you want so

so last year in in 2022 had a

retrospective show in in PH which sounds

a bit ridiculous um but uh it it was

quite interesting because I it was going

through my first sketches in my

Sketchbook to all of the St Martin's

years the RCA the first commercial work

um and to the sculptures and the

paintings that I do now so it was like

like looking back it was called then

there and then um I did a show at the

Mima Museum in s in in brussles sorry

last year called studiolo which was

trying to see like where am I now I've

seen where I was and how I got there now

I'm here I'm like I'm 40 I've got a kid

I'm very worried about this and uh you

know and everything seems to be dripping

and um was like you know let's let's use

this Museum as a studi which used to be

like this little um cabinet of curiosity

where you would surround yourself with

art and and and things that you liked in

order to reflect on certain matters so

was that I talked about childhood about

environment ecology anxiety all of that

stuff through paintings and a lot of

drawings and rambling on the walls and

and it felt good and you had this sort

of like dungeon Ascension through the

museum where you would start with like

black and white Sketchbook drawings very

um non realistic and then going into

childhood portrays the individual the

individuals in society etc etc to finish

at the top in this big mural which I

think we've got somewhere there um which

was just painting a 13 M long Fresco

about the world and it was a reflection

on how the collective is made of

individual stories and I just presented

my individual take and this was joining

onto the collective which is like a

theme that I've always been quite

interested in and and I've I feel like

I've treated in many different Endeavors

and next year I have a big show um that

I think is going to be about escapism

like trying to talk about the collective

and how from that Collective we we

really really have this inner desire to

make Society that's what makes us human

and and that's what makes all the good

stuff but equally it's extremely

challenging it's very

uh anxiety given and and and we all find

as as I was saying earlier we all find

ways to deal with that um through like

I'm exploring like role playing games

video games Social Circles of

discussions politics and all of that

stuff um that sounds very messy I'm

sorry I'll I'll I'll make that clear

next year but um that's where I'm at no

it's amazing I mean I wanted to actually

talk about that um this kind of 13 meter

circular room that you that you painted

um this mural yeah depicting the kind of

History of the World in a as you

described it very subjective and

inaccurate way um it disappeared after

the show and I think I just wanted to

ask like what's it like I guess knowing

that something you've made you know you

said it was one of your favorite pieces

you've ever made and knowing that it's

either going to be painted over or

dismantled at the end of a show what's

it like to I guess have something that

you're that proud of that you're

eventually going to say goodbye to well

we had the discussion prior to it when

we were building the show and I was like

it's fine you know it's for the out it's

it's fine and then when it got destroyed

I

cried yeah but but like without without

being as Pumpers as that it it's it's

nice to be able to do stuff like that

it's

um again like in a very digital age

where uh everything is accessible and

that's fantastic but it's also nice to

keep some stuff that you you had to be

there to experience it um and I have

this more and more I'm proposing when I

do shows this fmr um installation the

next all the next shows that I'm doing

have sculptures and and and paintings

and an installation that's going to be

disappeared or painted over after and I

always have this the people that I work

with being like that's just really dumb

and I'm like yeah but I get something

from just doing it like I do my

Sketchbook you know they're not meant to

be shown it's it's just for the pleasure

of doing it and

through also I've always I I was talking

about um the work evolving in an organic

way but it's like it's Serendipity you

know it's just you you unravel some

something and then you you you let it

carry on freely and it takes you

somewhere and when I do work this way I

don't prepare for it I just have this

sort of like graphic and verbal diarrhea

and um and then you look at the the

result on the wall and some stuff is

terrible some stuff is interesting and I

reuse the result of that to to go

further in my practice one way or

another I mean you you've talked about

your sketchbooks a couple of times and I

wanted to touch on this because some of

your my favorite that you've done have

been you know from sketchbooks and

actually there's there's something

really nice about the fact that you've

done them very obviously very quickly

and um I guess there's a sort of Freedom

there and a lack of inhibition how

much but how much is there like a a

perfectionism in you that wants to make

everything perfect versus that desire

for freedom to just express yourself and

as you said kind of let it run because

some of those things end up being kind

of a bit imperfect in ways that are

really they are Charming very imperfect

but uh um that's something that I keep

from St Martin or from the time of being

a student actually just finding having

the the need to fail to have a space

where you can fail consistently and when

you fail it's not failing it's just

trial and errors and the sketchbooks

always been that and when I was studying

at St Martin or or the RCA we were

encouraged to to do that to it was a

non-commercial space so you know the the

implication of the failure not economic

it was just like oh you know you missed

that EX exercise you'll do better next

time and that's just so important and

also when you don't worry about the

results again s DPT helped and and and

you'll eventually find it will create

accidents that you'll look back and be

like oh this is cool this is not cool

this is cool

yeah that somehow doesn't illustrate

that how hard have you found that I mean

you talk about it being you know kind of

drilled into you as a student and I

think you know lot people will find that

that atmosphere that's very kind of

welcoming to that kind of failure is is

what happens at University but how hard

is it as a practicing artist with a big

following to maintain that level of

experimentation and not not be too

afraid of the audience or critique I'm

terrified of the audience right uh no I

really am actually that's why like

social media give me so much anxiety

that I I I approach it differently now

like I I I've taken a step back and I

like to think of

the output that I the work that I do as

um I really like the way musicians do it

a musical carrier when you you put out

albums you know when you're you're

cooking in the dark for months and then

you put out something like a show an

album and then you you advertise it you

show the ropes of it and all of that and

then you you take a step back out and

and you do that I can't remember what

your question

was neither can I that's

um I'd love to discuss a bit more I mean

you've talked about a couple of kind of

recent projects um last year you had a

project at the jand plant uh in which is

where you were kind of Born and Raised

what was it like going back to your kind

of childhood home and making this

amazing project that was yeah took over

a kind of entire Garden there yeah we

did that for three years which was

amazing cuz it's a garden that I used to

walk through when I was a kid um and it

was sort of the first time i' been not

has actually been giving me my twice my

my biggest projects like the first one

was Len and this and the j plant was

another one where it was amazing

cuz it was the first time I was being

paid to do a public art commission where

I could do whatever I wanted and for

that I wanted to revisit um the little

paper characters that I was doing at St

Martin's before I I was sort of like

doing illustration and when I wasn't

confident enough with my line I was just

sort of experimenting with paper

characters and cutting them out

photographing them and these little

paper sculptures then I would put black

lines and this became illustration but I

wanted to take that out and challenge

the um the perception of the audience

and because I was supported by all the

teams of the gardens and the makers that

they had it it was awesome amazing and

it's still on now so like we we did

three years and after the three years

some of them left and we've kept three

one is in the garden is on the the roof

of the Town Hall it's sort of like

pulling plants all over the town hall

and another one is is sort of rolling

rolls of tarmac to reveal plants and the

knes but I'm super happy with that it's

really nice so the one in the middle of

the lake spitting the water up that

one's gone is it yeah we it's actually

very difficult to find new homes for

these things they're big they're very

specific to that place yeah exactly um

we're going to have some audience

questions now because I know um yeah we

had so many great ones uh submitted so

I'm going to go through these ones um

and there's about six of them but the

first one is from Joanna um are you able

to keep your graphic diary still as a

kind of no pressure fun thing or does it

kind of now feel part of part of your

job part of your no no it's definitely a

no pressure thing but it's its content

has changed a lot when we did the show

in SE um we exhibited 20 years of of

sketchbooks and um looking back at the

beginning I was noting down like writing

down every single word that everybody

around me was saying so I had to like

find like one page out of a 100 that was

show that I could show because the rest

was like my brother's filthy mouth and

uh and then progressively a lot of like

Student Life went into it and then first

ideas for projects then using them for

painting experimentations and then when

I started having kids had less time

obviously cuz I would have been pretty

shitty dad otherwise um but now now it's

a mix now when when I travel I can like

do a lot into it but I always try to

keep it as a space of experimentation

for projects and every now and again

doing live drawings but it's something

that I want to keep forever it's just

life gets in the way yeah amazing um the

second question is from Elena how do you

get from what you see in reality to the

stylized version of your work so what's

that process of as you said earlier kind

of seeing something like the the glass

on the table to then the very stylized

version that we might see at the end of

the process um if I was pompus I would

say it's synthetic but um no it's just

I've got I've got very uh limited

drawing skills and um it's very true I'm

not and so from an early early age I was

like I'm I I can't Shadow I can't do

body mass I can't do perspective and all

that stuff so I'll I'll I'll keep it to

a minimum and I'll try to develop a

visual alphabet with that minimum that

is not strong enough but that I'm

comfortable enough with to articulate

the ideas that I want to say um and you

don't need you don't need much I think

like in

general Graphics is about synthesizing

the world into different elements and

that automatically creates an alphabet

that you reuse throughout your work and

mine happens to be with bold colors and

a simple black line so it it's I think

the Simplicity of it and and the fact

that it doesn't evolve um my friend

gwend doc really great illustrator but

he's looking at my work like wow your

your work has not evolved in 20 years

amazing and and I was

like I was so sad but uh you know like

that's what makes it a style it's just a

lack of

progression that's a bit of an egg isn't

it um a question here from Indigo uh do

you have any tips on staying motivated

so what are the the tricks and tips over

the years that you found to keep

yourself inspired and keep yourself

motivated I think it's a it's um a

healthy balance between the commercial

and the personal and when you when I

feel demotivated on a personal level um

like you know when I feel like I'm not

finding the ideas that I want to find

and then I've got a commercial project

that makes me I have to do it because I

have to pay the rent and and when you

have a commercial project and you um you

get given a brief it's simple you have

to come up with an answer it's like uh

going to the gym you know you you do the

exercise and through doing the exercise

stuff happens and you you you get the

pump back and and then you get back into

your personal space and you use that

energy to try to uh come up with ideas

and sometime it doesn't work but it's a

nice idea I understood everything apart

from the bit about the gym but yeah uh

George asks what was the process for

Designing and Publishing your first

coffee table book um I work with my

friend aan lucier she's a really good

designer as well and uh we had done a

book before for um nanzuka g in Japan

where I really liked his his process and

he always tried to approach book making

in a specific way so for the book at

nanzuka was like a a Sketchbook and for

um the fight and coffee table book he

wanted he wanted it to be a

story um originally was meant to be like

a proper story book but it sort of

slowly evolved into to the narrative

that I was mentioning before where you

go from a very personal am I did you put

the sound up from a very personal point

of view to then close friends and family

to then a wider audience and uh so we we

we work like that then first you had the

sketchbooks and the paintings where I

was um talking to my parents and then

the collaboration with people like K

Studio that I've worked with and and

then the more public art and things like

that um finally a question from Marian

so there's a group of friends from non

in the

audience Y how has your work evolved

since Len Len I'm not sure Len yeah you

might have to describe what that is as

well Len was like uh I was still at Thea

when I got given the amazing commission

it was um at the top of um the biggest

building in not and it was to design um

a space that would be as much an

artpiece as a public space and so I I

was a student so I decided to do a bar

and um the idea was to have um a giant

bird was like 41 M long going all around

the the inside of the building

and and then the bar would be inside the

bird you would sit on his neck or on his

head he had like animated eyes that soon

became broken but that was meant to

close and open and then all the seats

and tables were eggs I got to design

posters on on every every you know big

part of the city that I liked it was

like a sort of all-encompassing project

and the stuff that I've taken from that

is

that the the multiplicity of mediums and

to try to create one cent coherent

narrative with different languages it's

something that I've always enjoyed and I

tried to keep doing with like sculpture

product design um painting drawings

everything amazing we're nearly out of

time but one final question for for me

is just um we were talking earlier about

the number of things you've got coming

up this year and um it'd be great to

just hear what what you have got lined

up because um yeah we kind of all want

to know where we can see your work this

year um so I'm currently working on a

project in Paris which is like my first

big project in Paris called um it will

be at the B Mar which is like a really

old department store and we're doing two

giants it's it's something about the

books and in the window displays I'm

creating a a story like a like a story

book by an installation so every window

will show a different chapter of the

story and then uh at the top we have um

a cafe um where you'll step into a

library um but yeah you should see that

and then in in March I've got a show in

New York which will be half installation

half paintings and then working on a on

a TV show about my parents as well an

animated TV show and then I'm working on

that show about escapism um next year um

some other bits but yeah so just a chill

just a chill 2024 for you amazing um

listen we are out of time I'm afraid but

everyone massive massive Round of

Applause for

julan