How to Lose 1 Pound of Fat per Day (20,000 Calories in 5 Days)

Dr. Eric Berg DC
6 Mar 202432:30

Summary

TLDRIn this fascinating interview, Dr. Ian Lake, a type 1 diabetic and medical doctor, shares his incredible feat of fasting for 5 days while running 5 complete marathons (100 miles) during that time. He discusses how he achieved this seemingly impossible task by utilizing nutritional ketosis, a state where the body burns fat for fuel instead of carbohydrates. Dr. Lake delves into the science behind ketosis, dispelling myths around keto acidosis, and highlighting the benefits of a ketogenic lifestyle for diabetics and non-diabetics alike. Through his groundbreaking experiment, he challenges conventional medical wisdom and inspires viewers to explore alternative approaches to health and fitness.

Takeaways

  • 🧑‍⚕️ Dr. Ian Lake, a type 1 diabetic medical doctor, fasted for 5 days and ran 5 marathons (100 miles) in that time period to demonstrate that nutritional ketosis is safe.
  • ⚖️ The key to fat-burning and ketosis is lowering insulin levels, which can be achieved through carbohydrate restriction and fasting.
  • 🔥 During the 5-day fast, Dr. Lake and the other participants reached deep nutritional ketosis, with blood ketone levels as high as 6 mmol/L, without developing diabetic ketoacidosis.
  • 💪 Contrary to popular belief, the participants experienced no injuries or excessive soreness, suggesting an anti-inflammatory effect of being in nutritional ketosis.
  • 🥩 Dr. Lake follows a low-carb, high-fat diet that includes meat, fish, eggs, and some dairy and vegetables, leaning more towards a carnivore approach.
  • 💧 Staying hydrated and replenishing electrolytes like sodium and magnesium is important when fasting and being in ketosis.
  • ⏰ It can take 2-3 weeks to become fully fat-adapted and keto-adapted, but the transition becomes easier with practice.
  • 🏃‍♂️ Once fat-adapted, physical activity can be performed in a fasted state without the need for extra fueling or carb-loading.
  • ❌ Nutritional ketosis is different from and does not lead to diabetic ketoacidosis, a dangerous condition seen in uncontrolled type 1 diabetes.
  • 🔑 The key distinction between type 1 and type 2 diabetes lies in insulin production and the need for exogenous insulin in type 1 diabetes.

Q & A

  • What was the primary goal of Dr. Ian Lake's experiment?

    -The primary goal was to prove that nutritional ketosis is safe and that people with type 1 diabetes can burn fat and ketones for fuel without the need for insulin or carbohydrates during extended physical activity.

  • How many people participated in the experiment, and what did it involve?

    -Eight people participated in the experiment, which involved fasting for five days while running approximately 100 miles (five complete marathons) during that period.

  • What is the difference between type 1 and type 2 diabetes?

    -People with type 1 diabetes cannot produce their own insulin, so they must inject insulin to regulate blood sugar levels. People with type 2 diabetes have more than enough insulin but have become insulin resistant, often due to overeating, particularly carbohydrates.

  • How does insulin affect fat burning?

    -High insulin levels block fat burning by overriding hormones that stimulate the release of fat from fat cells. Low insulin levels are necessary for the body to release and burn fat effectively.

  • What is the difference between nutritional ketosis and diabetic ketoacidosis?

    -Nutritional ketosis is a controlled, regulated process of fat burning that occurs when carbohydrate intake is restricted. Diabetic ketoacidosis is a medical emergency that can occur in people with type 1 diabetes when there is a severe lack of insulin, causing a dangerous buildup of blood sugar and ketones.

  • How did Dr. Lake transition into running on fat and ketones for fuel?

    -Initially, Dr. Lake fueled up with protein and fat before running. Eventually, he realized he could tap into his body's fat stores and run in a fasted state without needing to consume food beforehand, leading to his transition to running on fat and ketones.

  • What were the benefits of being fat-adapted and running in a fasted state?

    -Being fat-adapted and running in a fasted state allowed Dr. Lake to exercise without worrying about managing insulin or consuming carbohydrates. It also provided a sense of freedom and spontaneity, as he didn't need to prepare or plan for physical activity.

  • Did the participants experience any recovery issues or soreness after the experiment?

    -Surprisingly, none of the participants experienced any injuries, recovery problems, or soreness after the five-day experiment, which Dr. Lake attributes to the anti-inflammatory effects of ketones.

  • What is Dr. Lake's current dietary approach?

    -Dr. Lake follows a predominantly carnivore diet, focusing on meat, fish, eggs, and some dairy. He also includes green leafy vegetables and salads but avoids seed oils, nuts (due to potential insulin resistance), and foods high in oxalates.

  • How does Dr. Lake's approach to protein intake differ from typical recommendations?

    -Dr. Lake's protein intake is on the higher side, around 1.2 grams per kilogram of ideal body weight, whereas typical recommendations range from 0.75 to 1 gram per kilogram of body weight.

Outlines

00:00

🏃‍♂️ Introducing Dr. Ian Lake, a Type 1 Diabetic Who Fasted and Ran 5 Marathons

The paragraph introduces Dr. Ian Lake, a type 1 diabetic who fasted for 5 days while running almost 5 complete marathons (100 miles) during that period. The host expresses amazement at this feat and brings Dr. Lake on to discuss how he accomplished this and survived, given the conventional medical wisdom against such extreme practices for type 1 diabetics.

05:01

🔥 Burning Fat and Ketosis: The Rationale Behind the Experiment

The paragraph delves into the rationale behind Dr. Lake's experiment. They aimed to deplete their glycogen stores (around 20,000 calories) to ensure they entered ketosis, a state of burning fat for fuel. Dr. Lake explains the difference between type 1 and type 2 diabetes and how, as a type 1 diabetic, he needs to inject insulin to regulate blood sugar. By lowering insulin levels through fasting and exercise, the body can switch to burning fat and producing ketones for energy.

10:04

🥗 Getting into Ketosis: Dietary and Fasting Strategies

This paragraph discusses strategies for getting into a state of nutritional ketosis. It involves severely restricting carbohydrates to around 30-50 grams per day, forcing the body to burn fat. Fasting can also help by increasing insulin sensitivity. Dr. Lake shares his personal experience of combining a ketogenic diet with running half marathons, eventually realizing he could exercise while fasting by burning his body's stored fat.

15:05

⚖️ Differentiating Nutritional Ketosis from Diabetic Ketoacidosis

The paragraph explains the difference between nutritional ketosis and the potentially dangerous diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA). DKA occurs when there is a complete lack of insulin, leading to high blood sugar, excessive ketone production, and dehydration. Dr. Lake emphasizes that nutritional ketosis, achieved through a controlled low-carb diet or fasting, is safe and distinct from DKA, which is a concern only for uncontrolled type 1 diabetes.

20:05

🏃‍♀️ The Anti-Inflammatory Effects of Ketosis and Fasting on Exercise Recovery

This paragraph discusses the surprising lack of soreness and recovery issues experienced by Dr. Lake and his team after their extreme fasting and running experiment. Dr. Lake attributes this to the potential anti-inflammatory effects of ketones, citing examples of athletes who reported improved injury recovery after adopting a ketogenic diet. He also mentions completing a 150-mile run the previous year without any soreness or injuries.

25:07

🥩 Dr. Lake's Current Dietary Approach and Thoughts on Protein Intake

In this paragraph, Dr. Lake describes his current dietary approach, which tends towards a carnivore diet with some plant foods like leafy greens and salads. He avoids seed oils and is wary of nuts due to potential insulin resistance and joint pain issues. He discusses his thoughts on protein intake, currently consuming around 100 grams per day, which is on the higher side but within a reasonable range for his body weight.

30:09

🍷 Reflecting on the Experiment's Significance and Challenging Medical Dogma

The final paragraph reflects on the significance of Dr. Lake's extreme fasting and running experiment. It challenges conventional medical wisdom that discouraged such practices for type 1 diabetics. The host expresses appreciation for Dr. Lake's insights, which contradict some fixed ideas in the medical profession that may not always be accurate. The interview aimed to shed light on alternative approaches to managing type 1 diabetes through dietary and lifestyle interventions.

Mindmap

Keywords

💡Ketosis

Ketosis refers to a metabolic state where the body uses fat as its primary fuel source instead of carbohydrates. When carbohydrate intake is significantly reduced, the liver starts producing ketone bodies from fatty acids, which can be used as an alternative energy source for the body and brain. In the video, the participants aimed to achieve deep ketosis through prolonged fasting and exercise to deplete their glycogen stores and force their bodies to burn fat.

💡Type 1 Diabetes

Type 1 diabetes is an autoimmune condition where the body's immune system attacks and destroys the insulin-producing beta cells in the pancreas. As a result, people with type 1 diabetes cannot produce enough insulin, a hormone that regulates blood sugar levels. They must inject insulin to control their blood sugar levels. In the video, some participants had type 1 diabetes, making their prolonged fasting and exercise experiment particularly challenging due to their inability to produce insulin naturally.

💡Glycogen

Glycogen is the storage form of glucose (sugar) in the body, primarily found in the liver and muscles. When we consume carbohydrates, excess glucose is converted into glycogen for later use. During exercise or fasting, the stored glycogen is broken down into glucose to provide energy. In the video, the participants aimed to deplete their glycogen stores through exercise and fasting to force their bodies into ketosis and burn fat for fuel.

💡Keto-adaptation

Keto-adaptation, also known as fat adaptation, is the process by which the body becomes efficient at using fat and ketones as its primary fuel source instead of carbohydrates. This adaptation occurs after several weeks of following a ketogenic diet or prolonged fasting, allowing the body to shift its metabolism and enzymes to better utilize fat for energy. The participants in the video underwent this adaptation process to enable their bodies to run on fat and ketones during their prolonged fasting and exercise.

💡Insulin resistance

Insulin resistance is a condition where the body's cells become less responsive to the hormone insulin, which regulates blood sugar levels. As a result, the pancreas must produce more insulin to keep blood sugar levels within a normal range. Insulin resistance is a key factor in the development of type 2 diabetes and is often associated with obesity, a sedentary lifestyle, and a diet high in processed carbohydrates. In the video, the role of insulin resistance in type 2 diabetes is discussed, and its relationship to carbohydrate intake and fat burning is explored.

💡Ketogenic diet

The ketogenic diet is a low-carbohydrate, high-fat diet that aims to induce a state of ketosis in the body. By drastically reducing carbohydrate intake and increasing fat consumption, the body is forced to burn fat for energy, leading to the production of ketone bodies. This diet has been traditionally used for treating certain neurological conditions, such as epilepsy, but has gained popularity in recent years for its potential weight loss and therapeutic benefits. The participants in the video followed a ketogenic diet to achieve deep ketosis and facilitate fat burning during their prolonged fasting and exercise.

💡Diabetic ketoacidosis

Diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA) is a life-threatening complication that can occur in people with type 1 diabetes when there is a severe lack of insulin in the body. Without enough insulin, the body cannot use glucose for energy, leading to the breakdown of fat and the production of high levels of ketones. However, without insulin to regulate the process, ketone levels can become dangerously high, causing a metabolic acidosis. In the video, the participants aimed to demonstrate that nutritional ketosis, achieved through fasting and exercise, is different from the pathological state of diabetic ketoacidosis and does not pose the same risks for those with type 1 diabetes.

💡Fat-adapted

Being fat-adapted refers to a state where the body has become efficient at using fat as its primary fuel source for energy instead of relying on carbohydrates. This adaptation occurs after several weeks of following a low-carbohydrate, high-fat diet or through prolonged fasting and exercise. In this state, the body can easily switch between burning glucose and burning fat for energy, depending on the metabolic demand. The participants in the video aimed to become fat-adapted through their prolonged fasting and exercise to demonstrate the body's ability to run on fat and ketones without the need for carbohydrates.

💡Nutritional ketosis

Nutritional ketosis is a controlled, physiological state of ketosis that is achieved through dietary modifications, such as a ketogenic diet or prolonged fasting. In this state, the body produces ketone bodies at safe, moderate levels to be used as an alternative fuel source. This differs from diabetic ketoacidosis, a potentially life-threatening condition where ketone levels become dangerously high due to a lack of insulin. In the video, the participants aimed to achieve nutritional ketosis through fasting and exercise to demonstrate its safety and benefits for those with type 1 diabetes.

💡Intermittent fasting

Intermittent fasting is an eating pattern that involves alternating periods of eating and fasting. It can take various forms, such as time-restricted eating (e.g., 16:8 or 20:4 fasting windows) or complete fasting for 24 hours or longer (e.g., alternate-day fasting). Intermittent fasting has been associated with various health benefits, including weight loss, improved insulin sensitivity, and the promotion of ketosis. In the video, the participants engaged in a prolonged fast of five days, a form of intermittent fasting, to deplete their glycogen stores and induce a state of nutritional ketosis.

Highlights

Dr. Ian Lake fasted for 5 days and ran 5 complete marathons (100 miles) in those 5 days while being a type 1 diabetic.

The goal was to deplete glycogen stores (around 20,000 calories) to enter deep nutritional ketosis and demonstrate its safety for type 1 diabetics.

Type 1 diabetics cannot produce enough insulin to regulate blood sugar, while type 2 diabetics have insulin resistance due to overfueling.

In nutritional ketosis, the body can switch between using glucose and fat/ketones as fuel sources, depending on insulin levels.

Fat adaptation takes 2-3 weeks, where the body naturally prefers burning fat and producing ketones over glucose.

Diabetic ketoacidosis is different from nutritional ketosis and occurs when there's no insulin to regulate high blood sugar and runaway ketone production.

Non-diabetics cannot develop ketoacidosis from a ketogenic diet since they have baseline insulin production.

During the experiment, Dr. Lake's ketone levels reached 5-6 mmol/L, similar to the non-diabetic participants, indicating safe nutritional ketosis.

Fasting and exercise became easier after the initial adaptation period, with no hunger or soreness experienced.

Dr. Lake had approximately 85,000 calories of stored body fat, sufficient fuel for extended fasting and exercise without needing additional calories.

Consuming carbs or 'gels' during exercise is unnecessary when fat-adapted, as the body can easily access its abundant fat stores for energy.

Dr. Lake follows a low-carb, high-fat diet with emphasis on meat, fish, eggs, and some leafy greens and dairy, avoiding seed oils and excess nuts.

Protein intake is around 1.2g per kg of ideal body weight, which is on the higher end of recommended ranges.

The anti-inflammatory effects of nutritional ketosis seem to aid in exercise recovery and injury prevention.

Dr. Lake has run up to 35 miles in a single day while fasted and keto-adapted, with no need to 'carb up' beforehand.

Transcripts

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not only did he fast for 5 days but he

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ran five complete marathons but not only

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that he was a type 1 diabetic I brought

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him on today to talk to him on how the

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hell he did it and how he survived I

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would argue it's more difficult to get

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into ketosis a type one because we have

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to inject insulin a fat burning body has

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to have low insulin levels in order to

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release the fat do they ever advise to

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go 5 days without any

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food I think you know the answer to

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that so I have a fascinating interview

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today I mean this is going to be a

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bizarre interview because here's a

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person a doctor Dr Ian Lake who did some

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wild wild crazy things that he probably

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shouldn't even have survived this but

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what he

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did not only did he fast for five days

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but he ran five almost complete

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marathons 100 miles in five days but not

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only that he was a type one diabetic so

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I brought him on today to talk to him on

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how the hell he did it and how he

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survived welcome Ian thanks for coming

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on Hello thank you nice to meet you nice

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meeting you so first of all you're a

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medical doctor you're a type 1 diabetic

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if we take a look at like the the main

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consensus of the medical community with

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type one um do they ever advise to go

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five days without any

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food I think you know the answer to that

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um it's very difficult to persuade um

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anyone to um ask us to fast and Skip one

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meal so um I was trying to work out a

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workaround for uh how we can convince

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people that one meal skipping would be

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safe so this was an extreme version of

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skipping a meal

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really you know to to prove this point

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um you you went to the extreme and you

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did this with how many

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people uh eight people eight people did

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this so you you basically uh did a

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combination of a few things that were

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very difficult to do on their own let's

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first talk about how many calories you

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actually burned within 5 days was it

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roughly about what 20,000 calories yeah

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it was roughly 20,000 calories so we

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worked out how many calories we'd need

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to if you believe in the glycogen

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storage depletion idea to exhaust our

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glycogen storage tfold to make

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absolutely sure we were in ketosis so we

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worked out about 20,000 calories would

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be required I think we used a little bit

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more than that from memory but we didn't

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actually physically record it um the the

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other thing we wanted to do really was

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to um show how safe um nutritional

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ketosis really is so we wanted to put

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ourselves into very deep ketosis so that

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was the rationale for doing this ready

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okay so so just to back up on U just for

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those people that don't know what the

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word um glycogen is you depleted your

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glycogen that's just the stored sugar in

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your liver right so when you when you

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exercise you're going to use that as

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fuel and then after that's gone you're

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going to tap into your fat reserves

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right exactly yeah yeah so um typically

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first let's start with a diabetic what

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is the difference between a type one and

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a type two someone with type one

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diabetes cannot produce their own

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insulin in enough volume to maintain

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blood sugar because one of the key

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features of insulin functions of insulin

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is to reduce blood sugar and keep blood

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sugar at at an even rate um and someone

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with type 2 diabetes has more than

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enough insulin in fact most people with

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type 2 diabetes have too much insulin

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and theirs is due to an overfueling

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issue such that their body cannot handle

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the amount of fuel that they're putting

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into their bodies mostly carbohydrates

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so there's a big difference between the

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two conditions type ones we need to

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inject insulin because we don't produce

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any and in type twos they need to adopt

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a lifestyle strategy that naturally

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reduces the amount of insulin they're

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producing so they're not at all

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comparable conditions so if insulin

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lowers blood glucose and a type two has

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high insulin shouldn't they have low

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blood glucose they become insulin

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resistant this is the problem people

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with type 2 diabetes um the various

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ideas on it but their fat cells sort of

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stop the body sort of taking on more fat

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and they become resistant to the amount

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of insulin they've got because as well

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as lowering blood sugar insulin is a

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hormone that stimulates fat deposition

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so it's a fat storage hormone as well as

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a glucose luring hormone and the two

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things work together so in order to

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lower blood sugar you either exercise or

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you you put it into your into your liver

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initially and then into your adpo tissue

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or fat tissues as fat so we think of is

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insulin as a glucose lowering hormone

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and a fat storage hormone primarily okay

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so when someone um is a type one they

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don't have the insulin to regulate blood

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glucose so what's what's going to happen

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when they start exercising and not

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eating they don't have fuel they

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obviously they they have to tap into

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their fat reserves right um and um talk

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a little bit about that as well as a

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really key issue which is is um adapting

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to running on fat or ketones explain

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that process our body can multifuel so

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we can use sugars and we can use um fats

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for our fuel and of course fats will

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break down into Ketone bodies and we can

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use Ketone bodies as fuel as well so in

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the ideal situation our bodies can flick

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between whatever fuel they need for the

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requirements at the time so whether you

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have type 1 diabetes or not if you're

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performing exercise as like a Sprint

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without any Oxygen you will have to use

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glucose for your for your energy source

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but if you're doing a more aerobic or

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more relaxed um uh amount of physical

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activity you're burning oxygen and you

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can choose really whether you're using

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um glucose or fat as your fuel however

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um you're limited a little bit as to how

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you can select your fuel because if you

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have too much insulin on board you're

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blocking fat burning so fat burning is

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impossible if you've got too much

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insulin on board now people do burn fat

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when they are exercising and there's

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this fat burning Zone which is otherwise

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known as Zone 2 because there's a

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hormone that called hormone sensitive

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lipase which is which um enables fat to

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be burned and that is also stimulated by

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um uh lowering insulin or adrenaline

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cortisol growth hormone things like that

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so stress hormones will release that but

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if you have too much insulin it will

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override those hormones and block fat

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burning so then you become entirely

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dependent on on glucose so most people

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with type 1 is will be dependent on

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glucose because they're not encouraged

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to burn fat so we tend to have too much

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insulin on board so our bodies are

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multifuel we can flick between fuels as

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we need them and if we if we're fat

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adapted all that means is that your your

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fueling choice for your for your just

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your food will be low carbohydrate so

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low carbohydrates um require less

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insulin in to to either be injected or

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for your own body to ruce insulin

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because because as type 1es we're

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exactly the same as people with with no

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diabetes and our insulin requirements

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except we just know how much insulin a

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non-diabetic body would need for the

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same for the same requirements so a fat

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burning body um has to have low insulin

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levels in order to release the

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fat am are you still with me that yeah

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so basically um in order to get into the

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fat burning we must lower insulin that's

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really the key factor right exactly so

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then then we can free up the fat burning

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and and when we're adapted and takes

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about 2 to three weeks to fully adapt

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some people would say it takes even

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longer and then the your body will

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naturally burn fat quite happily produce

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Ketone bodies and have a very low

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requirement for sugar the important

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thing about glucose or sugar is that we

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don't need to eat sugar in order to

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produce it our body will produce more

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than enough for our requirements and

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obvious example of that is those poor

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people that get pulled out of disaster

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zones like earthquake zones and they

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haven't eaten for six or seven days but

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they haven't expired because they are

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producing enough energy for their body

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requirements some of which will be sugar

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so we we we respect the fact that our

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body is multifuel and we wanted to show

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in this um 100 mile run that we can

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safely use um Ketone bodies and fat as

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fuel and have no requirement for insulin

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uh sorry no requirement for sugar at all

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incredible okay so um there are a lot of

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people they're trying to um lose more

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weight they're plateaued you know I've

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been telling people the most you can

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lose per week is two pounds of fat uh

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that's if you're healthy but this

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experiment that you did if I'm not

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mistaken correct me if I'm wrong but I

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think um on average um all of you lost

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about what almost almost seven pounds of

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fat in five days right yes okay so um to

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get into this keto adaptation obviously

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you're going to have to either lower

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your carbs and of course fasting is

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lowering your carbs yes and um and then

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on top of everything else you're

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exercising so if someone were even to

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think about doing a

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fast do you have to um work up to it I

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mean you're not going to just start

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running and not eating right away I mean

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you're going to have to you said it

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takes um weeks to get into the keto uh

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adaptation more or fat

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adaptation um tell us a little bit about

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how someone can work on getting

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themselves into the keto adaptation

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state is it just a matter of low carbs

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or do you have to maybe combine fasting

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at the same time both are very useful to

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do um the only way you're going to

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produce ketones being ketosis is to burn

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fat and and and ketones are a natural

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product of fat burning so in order to

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fat burn you have to lowerer your

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insulin in order to lower your insulin

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you have to reduce the the main fuel

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that stimulates insulin namely

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carbohydrates so carbohydrates are the

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prime driver in our diet for insulin

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production so cutting down your

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carbohydrates is is very important and

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severely restricting your carbohydrates

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to what we call the ketogenic zone so

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your body has then to burn fat you have

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to force your body into fat burning

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that's around about 30 to 50 gram of

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carbs a day which is about a tenth of

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what most people would naturally eat

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right it it's not difficult to do but

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you have to sort of you have to

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concentrate on it especially if you're

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um you you like sugar or you're a little

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bit addicted to Sugar it takes a little

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bit more willpower um don't forget when

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your insulin levels drop um naturally as

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a result of not eating carbohydrates you

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will actually um urinate a little bit

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more because your your insulin will

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enable your body to excrete salt or

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sodium

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and with the salt goes the water so it's

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important to replace the fluids and just

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drink more some people say constipation

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is an issue fluids are very very good

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for that and it doesn't last it only

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lasts a few days if if at all and the

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other thing is you may need to think

play11:44

about replacing some of your salt

play11:45

magnesium sodium you know table salt or

play11:48

whatever because of this salt excretion

play11:51

caused by the the lower levels of

play11:53

insulin and after that it's pretty

play11:55

straightforward you go into ketosis

play11:57

within within days um type ones we can

play12:01

go into ketosis after the first meal

play12:02

because we have to inject our insulin so

play12:04

we don't have to wait for it to reduce

play12:06

in some ways um

play12:08

and fasting is is useful because it

play12:12

makes you much more insulin sensitive so

play12:14

if you're fasting you become more

play12:16

sensitive the insulin you've got so

play12:18

you'll naturally be be more able to get

play12:20

into ketosis and that's it really um one

play12:23

of the big breakthroughs I had so when I

play12:26

learned about the ketogenic diet just

play12:28

completely by accident thank goodness

play12:29

through the internet you know I'm a

play12:31

medical professional I've never heard of

play12:32

it in in the training materials that

play12:34

we're given um I started doing a half

play12:38

marathon a month I thought that was good

play12:40

for me because I'm not really an athlete

play12:41

in many ways I'm just an enthusiastic

play12:43

jogger and I thought well if I do a half

play12:45

marathon a month as Keo that'd be a

play12:46

great experiment so the first two I

play12:49

actually fueled up with with with

play12:51

protein bacon eggs or whatever and I

play12:53

thought well you've got to have some

play12:54

energy before you start running you know

play12:57

that's what we're all was told you got

play12:58

to carb up you know you got to have your

play13:00

pasta and your bananas or whatever if

play13:01

you're carbing up so I thought well I'll

play13:03

have that and then I got involved in the

play13:04

bulletproof coffees which were a bit of

play13:06

a fat at the time in the sense of butter

play13:08

and coconut oil in your coffee and then

play13:11

on the third one finally finally you

play13:13

know stupid me I thought well why am I

play13:16

actually giving myself energy before I'm

play13:19

running filling my stomach up and they

play13:22

diverting blood flow away from my

play13:24

muscles if you like when I'd worked out

play13:27

that with my body fat Mass I had 85,000

play13:31

calories of fat and I have a body mass

play13:33

index of

play13:34

23 uh plus I have um so 85,000 calories

play13:39

I have 17% fat Mass so it worked out

play13:41

about 85,000 I think so that's our

play13:43

average sort of fat mass and um so I

play13:46

thought well why can't I just burn the

play13:48

fat that I've got or I take it in if you

play13:50

see what I mean so it took a while to

play13:52

get out of the habit of doing physical

play13:54

activity for pH doing s sorry fueling up

play13:58

for physical activity I thought well

play14:00

I've got the fuel all I all I'm doing is

play14:02

just burning it at probably you know my

play14:04

slow jogging speed twice the rate that

play14:06

I've burning it when I'm walking so it

play14:08

wasn't a big deal to think well you can

play14:10

fast actually when you're doing physical

play14:12

activity of course that that that was

play14:15

wonderful from the point of view of type

play14:17

1 diabetes because there's none of this

play14:20

complicating worry about injecting

play14:22

insulin when you're having carbs so that

play14:24

really freed things up so on top of that

play14:28

I well let's just extend the half

play14:30

marathon and try to just sort of nudge

play14:32

the envelope to to put Beyond doubt this

play14:36

concern that type ones need insulin U

play14:39

need car carbohydrates if they're taking

play14:41

insulin and put Beyond doubt the fact

play14:43

that if you're in nutritional ketosis

play14:45

it's not a risk for what's called

play14:48

diabetic keto acidosis which is a very

play14:50

severe complication of type 1 diabetes

play14:52

and the two aren't the same thing but

play14:54

they're often confused by by clinicians

play14:57

as as as

play14:59

nutritional ketosis will lead to

play15:00

diabetic keto acidosis oh okay so let's

play15:03

talk about this because this is a

play15:04

complex topic we'll simplify it tell us

play15:07

in simple terms to a fifth grader what

play15:10

is keto

play15:11

acidosis okay so if your body is not

play15:15

producing insulin at all um you cannot

play15:19

then um put glucose anywhere so any food

play15:24

that you eat or any sugar that your body

play15:27

is producing natur natur Al um cannot be

play15:30

put into cells actively so you can't get

play15:33

rid of sugar in the blood so if the

play15:36

sugar can't be removed from the blood

play15:39

into the cells the cells are relatively

play15:41

starved of energy so then because

play15:43

insulin is not existent so this is a

play15:45

type one problem it's it's purely a type

play15:47

one problem if insulin is not existent

play15:50

then you you cannot store fat you have

play15:52

to burn fat so not only do you get build

play15:55

up a blood glucose but you get a runaway

play15:57

fat burning now ketones normally feed

play16:00

back on all of this process and stop the

play16:03

KE stop themselves Rising all the time

play16:05

but if you've got no and they make the

play16:07

body produce more insulin but if you got

play16:09

no insulin you can't stop that process

play16:11

so you get a combination of high blood

play16:13

sugar high ketones which the body tries

play16:16

to vent by getting you to breathe them

play16:18

out or pee them out and and also you

play16:20

pass a lot of urine because your your

play16:22

sugars in in your kidneys is so

play16:24

concentrated it drags the fluid out with

play16:26

it and that makes you thirsty so um that

play16:30

becomes a medical emergency um even

play16:33

people like myself who are in

play16:35

nutritional ketosis are a risk because

play16:38

sometimes if you get a septicemia or a

play16:39

very severe infection it means you need

play16:41

a huge amount more insulin and a lot of

play16:43

us are a little bit resistant to taking

play16:45

that so for example when I had covid

play16:48

which was only like a cold for me

play16:50

luckily uh my insulin requirements went

play16:53

up from 20 units a day to 60 units a day

play16:56

if you mean so so person with no

play16:59

diabetes would have the same insulin

play17:01

requirement and but they would not go

play17:03

into keto acidosis because they've got

play17:05

natural insulin on board to protect

play17:06

themselves we have to inject it so it's

play17:09

totally different to nutritional ketosis

play17:11

which is just a a lowering of the natur

play17:14

of the insulin that you inject or your

play17:16

natural insulin and and it's just a

play17:18

regulated process if you got insulin in

play17:20

your body sufficient you will not going

play17:22

to diabetic keto acidosis so the risk of

play17:24

getting keto acidosis really is if

play17:27

you're diab IC and you do forget to take

play17:30

your insulin yes an average person a

play17:33

healthy person starts a ketogenic diet

play17:36

and someone mentions well usually you're

play17:38

G to see this in the news oh yeah you're

play17:40

gonna you might develop keto acidosis

play17:42

that's pretty much a myth yes 100% it

play17:46

doesn't it doesn't um it doesn't work

play17:49

with the science got it yeah I know I

play17:52

I've seen that so many times um now as

play17:57

far as um this adaptation into just keto

play18:00

adapted or fat adapted you work with

play18:02

patients I'm guessing you probably help

play18:05

them with their getting on a ketogenic

play18:07

diet I'm guessing um do you find that

play18:10

some people have a harder time fasting

play18:12

for a longer period of time than others

play18:14

or is that dependent on insulin

play18:16

resistance and it's just a matter of

play18:17

time and and and doing it over a period

play18:20

of time where they can go longer and

play18:21

longer without eating or what's your

play18:23

experience on that my personal

play18:24

experience of fasting was that it was

play18:26

quite difficult in the early stages it's

play18:28

difficult getting through the first 24

play18:30

hours because I think psychologically

play18:32

you you're you're geared to have a hard

play18:34

time you think you're going to have a

play18:35

hard time uh and and I think when your

play18:37

body suddenly gets this shock of not

play18:39

eating um you know it makes you want it

play18:41

makes you hungry and and but I think

play18:44

most of it is psychology um and

play18:47

certainly when I did my first fast I was

play18:49

lying around in the afternoon you know I

play18:51

started my fast in the morning think oh

play18:53

pull me I'm hungry I must drink and I'm

play18:55

feeling weak but after day two and three

play18:57

you get used to that effect and it

play18:59

becomes it becomes normal and from day

play19:01

two onwards um with subsequent fast

play19:03

there's no hunger at all and the choice

play19:05

to break the fast was just really you

play19:08

you got to eat at some point if you see

play19:10

what I mean so subsequent fast became

play19:13

much easier to do um and um because you

play19:17

were aware of the changes in your body

play19:19

the trick was to dial down your insulin

play19:21

because you were not requiring as much

play19:24

insulin when you were fasting so the

play19:26

trick was to get the insulin levels down

play19:27

to to a safe level for you to not have

play19:30

high pose when you're exercising but it

play19:32

was not difficult to do okay and then

play19:36

what about so then we put this layer on

play19:39

top of fasting this

play19:42

exercise um you know people are they

play19:46

have this idea that they have to eat

play19:47

like like you mentioned they have to eat

play19:49

to get the energy to exercise but once

play19:51

your keto adapted after some weeks you

play19:54

probably can then exercise and fast at

play19:57

the same time

play19:59

and um get your fuel from

play20:02

fat that's exactly what I do all the

play20:05

time it's so much easier to to manage

play20:08

physical activity when you're fasted I

play20:11

mean if you think about it the wild

play20:14

animals I mean you never see an eagle uh

play20:17

flying to hunt if it's if it's not

play20:20

hungry I mean we tend as humans to go

play20:22

and get our food when we we're hungry

play20:25

because there's more of a desperation to

play20:26

go and get it so and then we will eat

play20:28

our food satiate ourselves and then and

play20:31

and then you know we we're just

play20:32

naturally lazy aren't we humans so we

play20:34

wouldn't actually go out if we've got a

play20:36

covered full or if if our tum is are

play20:38

full so I I don't think it's unusual to

play20:40

be exercising when you're fasting and

play20:43

because you have such a store of fat in

play20:46

your body you know it's it's 85,000

play20:48

calories compared to say 2,000 calories

play20:51

of of stored sugar which is there more

play20:54

for uh you know sudden energy

play20:56

requirements um it it you don't need to

play20:59

worry about burning you know a couple of

play21:01

thousand calories of fat which will be

play21:04

around 20 miles of of of walking or

play21:07

running and you'll put that back on

play21:09

again when you when you get your food

play21:10

source so you're not talking of

play21:13

depleting your energy source to any

play21:15

significant amount so I think that is

play21:18

the key to it you just have to

play21:19

understand that nothing's going to

play21:20

happen in in a two three days five days

play21:22

of fasting the reason we didn't go

play21:25

further than five days was because we

play21:28

were starting to worry then about are we

play21:30

going to start breaking down protein

play21:32

because at some point you're going to

play21:35

run out of your sugar stores and you're

play21:36

going to start to need to burn another

play21:38

fuel to get the sugar that your body

play21:41

naturally needs to produce so we wanted

play21:43

to restrict it to 5 days so we were we

play21:47

were pretty sure we wouldn't be burning

play21:48

any any protein because at some point

play21:50

you're going to be burning your muscle

play21:52

mass or your protein stores and and we

play21:55

we generally think that muscle mass is

play21:57

is is use useful to have have more of

play21:59

than less of so we didn't want to get

play22:01

into the situation where we were

play22:03

criticized for starving ourselves

play22:06

because this wasn't star it was sort of

play22:08

starvation because we weren't eating but

play22:10

it wasn't what I would call serious

play22:12

starvation because we were controlling

play22:14

the fat burning and not encouraging

play22:16

protein um degradation we had some

play22:19

breath testing to to show that we're in

play22:21

fat burning mode our our respiratory

play22:23

quoti test and it showed that all of us

play22:25

were in fat burning mode all of the time

play22:27

so was quite good and then you also

play22:30

tested your Ketone so typically I know

play22:33

there's a couple different values um um

play22:38

but the the values that they use in in

play22:39

the US would be probably a little more

play22:41

helpful but if you're just doing a low

play22:42

carb diet you're going to be within a

play22:44

certain range what like maybe3 to maybe

play22:48

one to maybe two and then you start

play22:51

fasting you're going to be higher if you

play22:53

had exercise you're going to go higher

play22:54

can you can you just tell me roughly

play22:56

kind of how that works a little bit

play22:58

yeah so 75% of people with type 1

play23:00

diabetes are in the range 0.5 to 1.5

play23:03

that's the blood ketones be that's

play23:06

that's pretty average I would argue it's

play23:09

more difficult to get into ketosis a

play23:10

type one because we have to inject

play23:12

insulin and we tend to have to use more

play23:14

insulin because we put it into the skin

play23:16

and it doesn't act as as naturally as it

play23:18

does in some of no diabetes so that does

play23:20

tend to block a bit of fat burning but

play23:22

we can get safety into

play23:24

ketosis when we did the run my ketones

play23:28

went up to six five and a half six or

play23:31

something like that for a couple of days

play23:33

and my other friend John the other type

play23:36

one who was running with me uh he's went

play23:38

up to around about the same we wanted to

play23:41

test ketones twice a day for 5 days and

play23:44

we wanted every one of the the eight uh

play23:47

participants to do the same because we

play23:51

wanted to show that you don't go into

play23:52

deep diabetic keto acidosis if you're in

play23:54

nutritional ketosis so when we pulled

play23:58

the graph of eight people twice a day

play24:01

for five days and just did bar chart you

play24:04

could not tell the type ones from the

play24:07

non-type ones out of that group of eight

play24:09

so we we we were confident that we were

play24:14

in the same nutritional ketosis State as

play24:17

our non-diabetic peers the other

play24:19

interesting thing that I I heard or I

play24:21

read in your your website that um as far

play24:24

as you would think that uh people would

play24:26

get extremely

play24:28

and very very have to you know really

play24:31

have to spend more time

play24:32

recovering wasn't there a point about

play24:34

there was there was not much soreness

play24:37

going on which is very

play24:39

unusual it was unusual when we started

play24:42

we were we were pretty confident that

play24:44

we'd be okay when we started um it was a

play24:46

bit tricky in the early stages but not

play24:49

one of us had any injuries at all and

play24:51

none of us had recovery problems uh we

play24:54

all managed every single day to to

play24:56

complete our task

play24:58

and none of us had any aches or pains

play25:01

the next day which was remarkable but

play25:04

last year about this time of year I did

play25:06

a 150 mile run in a week it was along

play25:09

the canal network of Britain so it was

play25:11

flat and and equally it was keto is I

play25:14

was on a keto diet then I wasn't fasting

play25:16

but equally I had no injuries or no

play25:18

soreness at all it seems to me that the

play25:20

anti-inflammatory effect of ketones is

play25:23

is is very powerful with in sport and

play25:26

I've met lots of people I've interviewed

play25:28

a professional Rugby Union player uh in

play25:31

the UK and he said when he went keto he

play25:34

was a type had type 1 diabetes he had

play25:37

his best year as far as injuries went in

play25:39

the year after he started his diet so

play25:42

there's something about keto which is is

play25:44

anti-inflammatory and and good for

play25:46

Recovery fascinating what's the uh

play25:50

longest you ever like I know um you know

play25:53

we're talking about 100 miles or 150

play25:54

miles what's the most you've ever ran

play25:56

and uh over period of days I guess in a

play26:00

row well that was the uh in a the

play26:03

longest distance I've ever run is 35

play26:06

miles that's the longest I've ever run

play26:08

that's in one day one day that was a run

play26:11

walk rather than the run more like an

play26:12

ultramarathon type of thing uh mostly I

play26:15

just do 10K 15K I'm not I'm not a great

play26:19

fan of long distances in that sense um

play26:23

you know I I'm not worried about doing

play26:25

20 miles a day it wouldn't worry me but

play26:27

um it takes a lot of time to keep

play26:29

practicing for that so I'm a bit lazy in

play26:31

that sense I mean you're pretty a lean

play26:33

guy right yes so you and and you still

play26:36

had how many calories of fat on your

play26:38

body with your lean body mass well I had

play26:41

a normal body fat mass for for my type

play26:44

and and it was 85,000 calories 85,000

play26:47

calories and someone who doesn't have a

play26:49

weight problem so that's plenty of extra

play26:52

energy to be able to you know do this

play26:55

activity I think that's exactly it isn't

play26:57

it it's just getting the mindset right

play26:59

and as I said it was a it took me quite

play27:01

a long time to realize that I can

play27:02

actually do physical activity without

play27:04

without fueling it first I could fuel it

play27:08

when I was doing it and not have to

play27:09

worry and that is so freeing especially

play27:12

anyone here have type one diabetes you

play27:14

don't have to worry so if someone came

play27:16

up to me said now would you like to go

play27:18

for a run or would you like to go for a

play27:19

cycle ride and say yes let's go I

play27:22

wouldn't say oh my goodness what am I

play27:23

doing with my insulin I'd obviously

play27:25

check it and I'll carry sugar glucose if

play27:28

I needed it but I wouldn't I could go I

play27:30

wouldn't need to prepare for it and it's

play27:32

that spontaneity certainly in type one

play27:34

that is so freeing for people wow when

play27:37

people do marathons I know they um they

play27:39

consume I guess it's called is it called

play27:42

goo or this gel it's some type of starch

play27:45

or or glucose that creates a lot of uh

play27:47

digestive issues and a lot of side

play27:49

effects when they're running I I've

play27:50

heard anyway I don't know if you've

play27:52

observed that certainly I mean before I

play27:55

went into the ketogenic lifestyle diet I

play27:59

I used carbs the same way as everyone

play28:01

else because no one had told me and

play28:03

obviously the conventional way of

play28:05

managing diabetes with physical

play28:07

activities to manage your insulin on

play28:10

board which is the big problem so if you

play28:13

got too much insulin on board which most

play28:15

of us have most of the time because of

play28:17

the way we inject it under our skin not

play28:19

into a natural space um You're

play28:22

vulnerable to host so the the protocol

play28:25

for managing type one sports is to

play28:28

reduce your insulin even the night

play28:30

before and add carbohydrates to your

play28:33

fueling regime 60 grams of carbohydrates

play28:36

per hour is recommended and imagine

play28:39

trying to eat that much when you're

play28:40

trying to to do physical activity

play28:42

because you know as stomachs really

play28:44

should be empty even my mom told me you

play28:46

know when I was eight that I shouldn't

play28:47

go swimming after after a meal because

play28:50

our bodies don't we can't exercise as

play28:53

well when we've got fuel uh in our gut

play28:56

really it needs to be in in the right

play28:58

place so it's so much easier yes and and

play29:01

you don't have that anymore that's not

play29:03

an issue if you do happen to go hypo

play29:06

it's it's six grams of carbs or

play29:08

something it's absolutely nothing

play29:10

there's a lot of different versions of

play29:11

Keto I'm just curious what kind of um

play29:13

plan are you on now or in the past yeah

play29:17

I I I go

play29:18

from different ideas to different ideas

play29:21

at the moment I'm more carnivore than I

play29:24

have been for a while um I will eat

play29:27

green leafy vegetables and salads I do

play29:30

eat fish and dairy nuts I'm a little bit

play29:33

wary of because I think they cause

play29:35

insulin resistance some of the nut oils

play29:37

in in me personally um and probably some

play29:40

of the oxalates cause joint pains a

play29:42

little bit wary of that um I I avoid all

play29:46

seed oils of any sort and um obviously I

play29:50

don't I don't eat sugar or or anything

play29:53

like that I I do take Dairy I find that

play29:56

milk and cream aren't very good but

play29:58

cheese is okay and and for some reason

play30:00

yogurts seem to be okay so it's a mixed

play30:03

diet at the moment tending to carnivore

play30:06

I can never make my mind up on protein

play30:09

I'm still the jur is out for me on

play30:10

protein I've been doing the Burnstein

play30:13

type of more protein than fat type of

play30:15

thing for a while and then I felt that I

play30:19

don't know I mean I've gone more fat

play30:21

than protein for now but I always stick

play30:24

roughly within I'm 75 Kg and I last time

play30:27

I I estimated the amount of protein over

play30:30

a week it was 100 grams of protein per

play30:33

day so

play30:35

1.2 uh grams of protein per kilogram of

play30:37

ideal body weight most people would say

play30:40

.75 to one so it's on the higher side

play30:44

but um yeah that's what I do I I find

play30:47

that some foods certainly the leafy veg

play30:51

can be a little bit Carby and you have

play30:52

to be a little bit more careful with

play30:54

your with your blood sugar control I do

play30:56

find that meat fish eggs um are the

play31:00

easiest foods to use there's no doubt

play31:02

about that but but you know but but I do

play31:05

eat um a variety of foods as well um

play31:10

alcohol I've gone off it Strangely I

play31:13

used to drink like red wine prco I love

play31:15

beer but I can't drink it anymore I'll

play31:17

have probably two two glasses if I'm out

play31:20

on a nice summer's day with friends or

play31:21

something because that's just what you

play31:23

do you know especially in the UK take a

play31:26

h you have to live your life that's

play31:27

right sunny in the UK yeah and um but

play31:30

alcohol I find just my body tells me I

play31:32

don't need it but I have drunk it in the

play31:35

past and I I will drink it but it's not

play31:38

something that features heavily in my in

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my diet anymore you used to more five

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six years ago probably yeah me me too I

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I I can't tolerate any any more than a

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sixpack on a weekend I can't tolerate

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any more than that but um no I don't I

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don't drink at all anymore but uh wow

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this has been fascinating I think um um

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I want to send a lot of people to your

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website I'm going to put your link down

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below but thank you for coming on and I

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really appreciate this these insights on

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this crazy thing you did which actually

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is not very crazy you know it goes

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against what's called what medical

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wisdom which I don't even think is

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wisdom right it's just again the certain

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fixed ideas that the medical profession

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has that end up you know not being 100%

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true so uh this has been fascinating

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thank you so much thank you very much

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thank you

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