WISC V - Understanding the Verbal Comprehension Index Score.

Summary

Dr. Cindy D, a specialist in learning disabilities with her own experiences of dyslexia and dysgraphia, discusses the intricacies of evaluating verbal comprehension in children. She explains the process of the Wechsler Intelligence Scale for Children (WISC), focusing on the vocabulary and similarities subtests. Dr. D highlights the importance of understanding the depth of a child's comprehension and the challenges they may face, such as expressive language issues, word retrieval difficulties, and auditory processing problems. She emphasizes the need for clinicians to query responses to elicit more detailed answers and the impact of these issues on a child's educational needs. The conversation also touches on the significance of assessing for auditory processing disorders and the varied reasons why children might struggle with vocabulary tests. Dr. D concludes by noting the potential for intellectual depth in children who score high on the similarities test, despite their challenges with reading and writing.

Takeaways

• 🎓 Dr. Cindy D is a specialist in learning disabilities with a PhD, who has been working with children from kindergarten through college for over 25 years.
• 📝 She conducts diagnostic evaluations, interventions, and advocacy for children with dyslexia, dysgraphia, ADHD, and other challenges.
• 💬 The verbal comprehension score on the Wechsler Intelligence Scale for Children (WISC) is determined by two main subtests: similarities and vocabulary.
• 🔍 In the vocabulary subtest, children are asked to define words orally, and precision in their answers can lead to further queries for clarification (indicated by a 'Q').
• 🙅‍♀️ Expressive language difficulties can impact a child's score on verbal comprehension, even if they understand the concept but struggle to express it.
• 🧐 Word retrieval issues and auditory processing problems can cause children to provide incorrect responses on vocabulary tests.
• 🕒 The 'tell me more' query allows children to give more detailed explanations, which can help clinicians understand their depth of understanding.
• 📚 Children who excel in the similarities subtest may have a strong ability to make verbal arguments, understand complex concepts, and need intellectual challenges.
• 🤔 Difficulty with abstract thinking and visualization can make the similarities test challenging for some children.
• 🧠 There are additional comprehension subtests (information and comprehension) that can provide a more comprehensive verbal index score.
• 👂 Auditory processing issues, such as not distinguishing between certain sounds, can be addressed through training and may require an auditory assessment.
• 🌐 Children who are not strong readers may still have a vast vocabulary and understanding of word meanings, using context clues to learn about words they cannot decode.

Q & A

What is the main focus of Dr. Cindy D's work?

Dr. Cindy D specializes in working with individuals with learning disabilities, including dyslexia and dysgraphia. Her work involves diagnostic evaluations, intervention, advocacy, and she is also a reading and writing remediation specialist.

How long has Dr. Cindy D been working in her field?

Dr. Cindy D has been working with children with learning disabilities from kindergarten through college for over a quarter of a century, which she realized recently.

What are the two main subtests used in the Wechsler Intelligence Scale for Children (WISC) to measure verbal comprehension?

The two main subtests used to measure verbal comprehension are 'Similarities' and 'Vocabulary'.

How does the vocabulary subtest work in the WISC?

In the vocabulary subtest, a word is orally presented to the individual, who is then asked to define it. The individual is not required to provide multiple meanings, but a definition with enough depth will earn maximum points.

What does the 'Q' notation in the WISC manual signify?

The 'Q' notation in the WISC manual stands for 'query', which is used when an answer is not precise enough. It prompts the individual to provide a more detailed definition or explanation.

How can an expressive language disorder impact a person's score on the verbal comprehension test?

An expressive language disorder can impact a person's score on the verbal comprehension test because it may be difficult for them to find the right words or express their ideas with precision, even if they understand the concept.

What is the relationship between listening comprehension and oral expression?

Listening comprehension and oral expression are closely related because one must listen before they can learn to speak. If there is a listening comprehension issue, it often results in an oral expression issue as well.

How does auditory processing play a role in vocabulary understanding?

Auditory processing is crucial for vocabulary understanding because it involves the ability to hear and recognize the differences in sounds. If a child has difficulty distinguishing between certain sounds, it can lead to misheard words and incorrect understanding of vocabulary.

What is the purpose of querying a response during the vocabulary subtest?

The purpose of querying a response is to encourage the individual to provide a more detailed and precise definition or explanation. This helps the clinician to better understand the depth of the individual's understanding and to ensure that the response is not just a superficial one.

How does the 'Similarities' subtest work in the WISC?

In the 'Similarities' subtest, two items are presented, and the individual is asked to explain the relationship between them. The test starts with very concrete objects and becomes increasingly abstract, requiring the individual to demonstrate their understanding of the relationship at different levels of complexity.

What does a high score on the 'Similarities' subtest indicate about a child's cognitive abilities?

A high score on the 'Similarities' subtest indicates that the child has a deep understanding of concepts and relationships. These children can often make strong verbal arguments and may need intellectual challenges to keep them engaged and prevent boredom.

What are the additional subtests in the WISC that can provide a more comprehensive verbal index score?

The additional subtests in the WISC that can provide a more comprehensive verbal index score are 'Information' and 'Comprehension'. These subtests are about understanding social rules and can help paint a more detailed picture of the student's performance and skill set.

Outlines

00:00

📚 Understanding Dyslexia and Diagnostic Evaluations

Dr. Cindy D, a specialist in learning disabilities, discusses her work with dyslexia, dysgraphia, and ADHD. She emphasizes the importance of diagnostic evaluations, interventions, and advocacy. Dr. D, who has personal experience with dyslexia and dysgraphia, highlights her extensive experience working with individuals from kindergarten to college level. She explains the process of assessing verbal comprehension through subtests like vocabulary and similarities, and how clinicians may query responses for more depth. The paragraph also touches on the impact of expressive language issues on test performance.

05:03

🗣️ Expressive Language and Vocabulary Testing

This paragraph delves into the challenges faced by individuals with expressive language disorders during vocabulary tests. Dr. D explains how difficulties in word retrieval or precision can affect a person's score, even if they understand the word's meaning. The discussion also covers auditory processing issues, where children may mishear words, leading to incorrect responses. Dr. D stresses the importance of allowing children adequate time to think and respond, as rushing through questions may not elicit their full potential. The paragraph also addresses the need for auditory assessments in cases of consistent mishearing.

10:05

🧐 Exploring Similarities and Abstract Thinking

The focus of this paragraph is on the 'similarities' subtest, where individuals are asked to explain the relationship between two items. Dr. D outlines how the test starts with concrete examples and gradually becomes more abstract, requiring a higher level of thinking. She discusses how some children with learning challenges might struggle with abstract thinking and visualization, which can make the task particularly difficult. The paragraph also touches on the importance of understanding a child's thought process and expression, and how their responses can indicate a need for further assessment.

15:05

🎓 High Scores on Similarities and Intellectual Challenges

Dr. D talks about the implications of high scores on the similarities subtest, suggesting that such children often have a deep understanding of concepts and relationships. She notes that these children may not demonstrate their understanding through writing but can comprehend complex ideas when listening to podcasts or engaging in verbal discussions. The paragraph emphasizes the need for intellectual stimulation and challenges for these children to prevent boredom and underachievement. Dr. D also mentions additional comprehension subtests that can provide a more comprehensive view of a student's abilities.

Keywords

💡Dyslexia

Dyslexia is a learning disability characterized by difficulty in reading, typically despite normal intelligence. In the video, Dr. Cindy D mentions that she herself is an adult with dyslexia and dysgraphia, emphasizing the personal and professional understanding she has of these challenges.

💡Dysgraphia

Dysgraphia is a learning disorder that involves difficulty with writing. Dr. Cindy D identifies as having dysgraphia, which complements her expertise in learning disabilities and shapes her approach to working with individuals facing similar challenges.

💡Diagnostic Evaluations

Diagnostic evaluations are assessments used to identify specific learning disabilities or other conditions. Dr. Cindy D discusses her role in conducting these evaluations, which is crucial for understanding and addressing the needs of individuals with learning challenges.

💡Verbal Comprehension

Verbal comprehension refers to the ability to understand and interpret language. The video script discusses the importance of verbal comprehension in evaluating learning disabilities, particularly through subtests like vocabulary and similarities.

💡Vocabulary Subtest

A vocabulary subtest is a part of a broader assessment that measures an individual's knowledge of words and their meanings. In the script, Dr. Cindy D explains the process of the vocabulary subtest, where participants are asked to define words orally without reading.

💡Expressive Language Disorder

Expressive language disorder involves difficulty in expressing thoughts, ideas, and feelings through speech. The video highlights how this can impact verbal comprehension scores, as individuals may struggle to articulate their understanding of words despite knowing their meanings.

💡Auditory Processing

Auditory processing refers to the ability to recognize and interpret sounds. The video discusses how difficulties with auditory processing can lead to misheard words, affecting performance on vocabulary tests and other language-based tasks.

💡Similarities Subtest

The similarities subtest is a part of a comprehensive assessment that evaluates an individual's ability to find relationships between words or concepts. The video script explains how this subtest starts with concrete examples and moves towards more abstract thinking.

💡Word Retrieval

Word retrieval is the process of accessing and using words from our mental lexicon. The video script mentions word retrieval difficulties as a reason why some individuals may not perform well on vocabulary tests, even if they understand the meanings of the words.

💡Non-Readers

Non-readers are individuals who struggle with reading, often due to learning disabilities like dyslexia. The video discusses the phenomenon where non-readers can have a deep understanding of word meanings through context clues, despite their challenges with reading and writing.

💡Bloom's Taxonomy

Bloom's Taxonomy is a classification of learning objectives in a hierarchy, from simple knowledge and recall to the highest level of understanding, which includes evaluation and creation. The video script alludes to Bloom's Taxonomy when discussing the depth and complexity of understanding required in the similarities subtest.

Highlights

Dr. Cindy D is a specialist in learning disabilities with a focus on diagnostic evaluations, intervention, and advocacy.

Dr. Cindy D has been working with children with dyslexia, dysgraphia, ADHD, and other challenges for over 25 years.

The Wechsler Scale uses two main subtests for verbal comprehension: similarities and vocabulary.

In the vocabulary subtest, multiple meanings for a word do not earn extra points; precision in definition is key.

Expressive language difficulties can impact a person's score on verbal comprehension tests.

Auditory processing issues can lead to misheard words, affecting vocabulary test performance.

Children with a lot of ear infections in early development may develop incorrect neural pathways for language.

Some non-readers can understand word meanings through context clues despite not being able to decode or spell words.

The similarities subtest assesses the ability to explain relationships between two items, starting with concrete examples.

Bloom's taxonomy can be applied to understand different levels of complexity in a child's responses.

Children with difficulty visualizing words or concepts may struggle with abstract thinking in the similarities test.

High scores on the similarities test may indicate a child's ability to make complex verbal arguments or understand deep concepts.

Children who can understand complex concepts despite difficulties in reading and writing may need intellectual challenges.

There are two additional comprehension subtests (information and comprehension) that can provide a more comprehensive verbal index score.

A comprehensive verbal index score can help paint a clearer picture of a student's performance and skill set.

Dr. Cindy D emphasizes the importance of understanding the interconnectedness of listening, speaking, reading, and writing skills.

Children's responses to queries during testing can provide insights into their thought processes and potential language or processing issues.

Transcripts

hi I'm Dr Cindy D I have a PhD in

learning disabilities uh I do diagnostic

evaluations a little bit of intervention

a little bit of advocacy and I'm also an

adult with dyslexia and dis graphia and

Kim with her giant mug of coffee today

again I'm a reading and writing

remediation specialist I've worked with

kids with dyslexia dis graphia ADHD and

other challenges uh for the last 15

years um kindergarten through college

and I think you've been once again I

think we need to go back and actually do

your calculation because you've been

doing it a lot longer than 15 oh have I

okay I forgot yeah that's okay but you

know you you lose track it didn't occur

to me that I've been doing this for more

than a quarter of a century until

recently which is kind of mindboggling

right if I if I think about it including

graduate school all right so enough

digressing let's talk about a high and

low set of scores on verbal

comprehension okay so on the Whisk you

have a verbal comprehension score and

there's two main subtests that they use

there's actually four available but

there's two main sub ones that we use

one is

similarities and one is vocabulary now

Kim I know you know what vocabulary is

so what's the vocabulary

subtest um and are you doing this all

orally it's not reading okay so you're I

think you're giving um

you're orally presenting a word yeah and

I I'm guessing that you're are you

giving it in a sentence or you're just

asking for them to give it in a you're

just saying what does this word mean yes

okay just plain and simple yeah and

there are words in there that have

multiple meanings do they get extra

points if they give multiple meetings

absolutely not so they as long as they

give one they got it as long as they

give a definition with enough depth they

get maximum points now there's multiple

points available okay and if your answer

is not precise

enough in the manual after certain

answers there's a letter q and Q means

quer and so I is a

clinician let's let's pick a random word

let's pick a word dog and if you said

furry I would then come in and say tell

me more about that because there are

lots of things that are furry from a

stuffed animal to a sheep to mold in

growing in your refrigerator right

so by you by you giving them um

additional query it allows them to

access in their brain a more precise

definition so you say tell me more about

that and what might you

say um oh uh people have them as pets

and they have four legs and they go woof

woof and okay that point you given me

enough detail that typically that would

be considered a two-point response okay

if you said legs and tail that might

also get another query or that might

just get uh you're done okay and you

unless you're unless you're qualified to

administer the test you don't get to

know the nuts and bolts behind how the

different answers work how many points

you get why certain questions get

queried or why certain responses get

queried and why others don't okay get

mad for asking this question but if you

have a person with expressive language

ulties this would also impact your your

your score on verbal comprehension do

you guys get that yes well let's talk

about that so an oral expressive

language disorder um so there's

there's Dr Doris Johnson would say

there's two kinds of oral language

disorders there is an expressive oral

language disorder and there is a mixed

receptive expressive language disorder

ah because if you have a listening

comprehension issue you're also going to

have an oral expression issue because

you have to listen before you learn to

speak okay so if we go back to this

vocabulary sub test and I give you a

word and you have a hard time finding

the words and you talk around it and you

can't give me the Precision even though

I as a clinician suspect that you know

what it is and that you know what the

word is I can't then give you credit for

it and this is

yes and and this happens all the time at

school and people it happens with

difficulty with written expression you

can maybe verbally express it but you

can't write it so a lot of people don't

understand these are Sydney taught me

these are all connected listening

writing expressing I I did it in the

wrong order but yeah so we learn to

listen to words first then we learn to

speak words then we learn to read words

which is like listening to words and

then we learn to write words which is

like speaking words but we add the gra

graphing component so um okay so on the

vocabulary test there can be a bunch of

reasons that you don't do well one is I

don't know how to express my ideas can

you think of another reason that a kid

might have difficulty on the vocabulary

test uh word retrieval or okay so that's

still an expressive language issue I

can't find the words that I'm looking

for I can't use a

Precision um so we do this frequently

where I say do these two words sound the

same

pet or oh are you talking about auditory

processing issues yeah or they're not

hearing the word distinctly enough and

they're not recognizing the differences

in the words and there are several words

on many of the vocabulary tests because

vocabulary tests are not just unique to

the westler scales where kids mishar

words there's no other support for it so

the clinician is then supposed to go

back and say listen carefully and repeat

the word again but we've had lots of

kids I mean my favorite one is kids that

think consonant means large land masses

on the earth of which there's seven yeah

continent continent continent and con

continent

means any letters in the alphabet other

than you just mixed it that's what kids

will do they will think a consonant is a

large land mass and a continent

is the any letters in the alphabet other

than a vowel or they won't know what a

consonant is that happens yeah we could

go in right depth on that but we won't

okay so if you mishear the

words then you don't provide an

appropriate response I also have kids

that when you query they're like I don't

know or I don't have anything else I

will

often sit and wait for kids now have you

ever noticed that if you say nothing in

a conversation it becomes uncomfortable

and so somebody will respond with

something yes so I'm not there to make a

kid uncomfortable but I'm there to give

them adequate weight

time and often when I give kids enough

time to

think and be relaxed I will get a much

more verbose answer um can you imagine

what would happen in a situation where

you got a lot of kids to Rack through

quickly you can't it's too it's too

disruptive right so will just kind of

move forward they didn't respond we're

just going to go forward and so you may

not actually elicit or get their full

response to know what they're truly

capable of can I clarify a word you used

for parents um you said Miss hear so

miss hear some people might think of

that as not hearing it right but what

you're really saying is the connection

between the symbol sound

discriminating right um it's not

recognizing the differences in sounds um

I have kids all the time that don't hear

the difference between s and Z right

even if you over enunciate it they can't

hear that difference and so we literally

have to go back and train them in

that dyslexia yeah it's linguistic and

yeah I mean I have kids that are very

angry at me in high school because they

think an ornament is an or

dummit the n and D sound are made in the

same part of the mouth but they heard it

differently when they were little and

they refus to believe it's not an

orament yes it's not hearing it's right

it's it's so when we hear sounds it goes

to lower brain stem and then it goes up

into your brain and it's doesn't have to

do necessarily with it can um which is

why we always say hey if a kid is

mishearing words you need to go get get

an auditory assessment and if they still

make those mistakes that's when we say

Hey you know you need to go do a an

assessment for an auditory processing

disorder otherwise previously known as a

central auditory processing disorder so

CPD or

APD um

but it is you have to dig deeper and

we're going to take a pause here for

just a second we'll be right back you

heard

it so sorry we were checking to make

sure that you couldn't hear any

background noise so Kim we were just

talking about the fact that you said

there can be lots of reasons that kids

missar and what was one of those reasons

well it's not necessarily an auditory

processing disorder or a hearing

disorder sometimes a lot of parents

don't realize in that early time of

development what is it baby through

three years if your kid has a lot of ear

infections if they hear something

incorrectly they'll say it incorrectly

they'll read it in I mean it all starts

when they're super little so that could

be a reason why that they've created

this neural pathway um to saying the

word wrong or the sound wrong now let's

also talk about the converse where we

have kids who are not readers but are

like vacuum cleaners in the world and

they pick up every word they have ever

heard and use context clues to figure

out the the meaning of that word and we

see that frequently for our non-readers

and you will ask them this bizarre

question and they'll like give you a

dissertation on it right but they have

no idea what the sounds are inside of

that word they may not they may not be

able to segment the word they may not be

able to decode the word they may not be

able to spell the word can't read it

write it they can know the meaning and

you and I frequently have this where a

word comes up and I'm like oh I think of

me instead and you're like how would you

know that

Cindy yeah it's it's a a gift you know a

gift and a in certain ways it can be a

gift in certain ways it would be helpful

if I could read and spell all of them

but such is life yeah okay so that's

kind of vocabulary now let's talk about

similarities do you remember the

similarities

test I think you're asking um you know

how is a brush like a um broom or

something yes okay so we give you two

items and we ask you to explain the

relationship between them and initially

it starts off with what we call being

very concrete like it's very obvious so

like if I said scissors and a knife you

would say well they both cut right okay

and just like in vocabulary we have

responses that if you give a response

it's got a cue after it you're supposed

to quer and say tell me more about that

to see if the kid can expand upon that

and give more depth to their

understanding now this is another place

where um I often see kids where will'll

say tell me more about that

and they will tell me more about the

answer that they just gave

me without it giving new information

about their understanding of it so let's

go back to in what way are knife and

scissors alike and let's say you said

metal and I said tell me more about that

and the kid would say well there's metal

in the in both blades a knife has metal

and scissors have

metal which is not improving the quality

of the response you're just explaining

the answer that you gave me which

doesn't

then explain the relationship better

let's say a two-point response or the

most point response would be they're

both used to cut

objects and metal get you a query if you

don't go into that blade is used to

there's metal in them and the metal is

used to create a cut then you wouldn't

get the points well and it's also very

literal which a lot of kids with the

suia happen to be sometimes but is it

also difficulty with abstract thinking

going to a different it going higher up

in the category level is that right yeah

and and there's a whole thing on Bloom's

taxonomy which you can go in and dig

into it another time which is

understanding different levels of

complexity um but it starts off so the

similarities test starts with very

concrete objects kind of like the one

that we use with knife and scissors and

then it gets more and more and more ract

and many of the kids when they get to

hire items would say there's no

relationship they're

opposites and time test or not

untimed and when a kid says that I will

just sit and wait because saying their

opposites doesn't get a

query like if you

say

um uh oh I'm trying to think

of uh something that would be

opposite oh plus and

minus if you said those are

opposite yeah sit there and try and give

you time to think about and try and

determine a

relationship that goes beyond their

opposites because their opposites

doesn't tell me how they're

alike okay one more weird

question many more weird questions from

me if if a kid has trouble with

visualization which a lot lot of our

kids do they don't see the words they

don't see the literal letter I see the

letters I see the pictures if they don't

see the picture of the word and they

don't see the letters doesn't that make

or they can't visualize whatever it is

can't visualize doesn't that make this a

very difficult exercise it depends on

the kids yes some kids won't be able to

mentally think about or think through

relationships um I will also have kids

tell me that the words begin with the

same letter they end with with the same

letter again you're not telling me how

the words or the concepts are

related okay and so uh at that point

that's telling us something is going on

there in the way the kid thinks and the

way the kid that expresses what they're

understanding and that normally means we

need to dig more like yeah that this is

very important so this verbal

comprehension um score could a very of

very variety of different things that we

haven't looked

at let's talk about kids that score very

high on

similarities these are the kids

that I don't want to overgeneralize

these typically are kids that can make

great verbal arguments or they

understand deep Concepts or they

understand relationships there's a lot

of depth and breadth to what's going on

there so even though they may not show

that in their writing or even they

though they may not show that in um

other ways in Reading yeah they can have

depth and breadth in their understanding

that indicates that they need

intellectual challenge that they need to

be asked to think deeper Express more

ideas explore and can get bored very

easily when it's just kind of

straightforward a plus b equals c it is

quite fascinating when you get someone

very sophisticated in this you know you

know but then they can't they have

difficulty with reading and writing but

they can listen to podcasts absorb the

concepts and repeat the words it's crazy

it's crazy so um and we'll do

another uh video on this later but

there's two additional comprehension

subtests there's information and

comprehension which is about

understanding social rules and you can

actually administer all four and get a

comprehensive verbal index score which

very few good clinicians do but it can

also help paint another picture of how

the student is performing and what it

means and their skill

set so you could actually go and get

additional those additional subtests

elsewhere you can dive deeper and know

more there's always more than enough

okay all right thanks