There Is So Much Here..

Summary

The video discusses the recent licensing changes of Redis, a widely-used open-source database. It explores the implications of these changes on the community, contributors, and major cloud service providers. The script delves into the history of Redis, its founder's intentions, and the potential motivations behind the shift from a permissive open-source license to a dual-licensing model. The change has sparked controversy and debate over the sustainability of open-source projects and the influence of venture capital on their development and direction.

Takeaways

• 📜 Redis has adopted a dual-source licensing model, moving away from its open-source status.
• 🤔 The decision has sparked controversy and mixed opinions within the developer community.
• 💡 The change in licensing affects how Redis can be used commercially, particularly impacting cloud service providers.
• 🚀 Redis aims to continue evolving its data models and processing engines with the new licensing model.
• 🌐 The Redis community edition will still offer the source code for free, while the source-available versions will have restrictions.
• 🔄 The fork of Redis by AWS, named 'Valkyrie', is a direct response to the licensing change.
• 💼 The Redis founder, Salvatore Sanfilippo, stepped back from the project in 2020, selling the IP and trademarks to Redis Labs.
• 💰 The investment and funding of Redis by major companies like VMware, and later the shift in licensing, suggest a move towards profitability.
• 🔧 The licensing change has led to the development of alternatives like 'kydb' and Microsoft's 'Garet', offering open-source options to Redis.
• 👥 The impact on the Redis developer community is still uncertain, with concerns about the future of open-source projects and their sustainability.
• 📖 The story of Redis highlights the complexities and challenges of balancing open-source ideals with commercial interests and investor pressures.

Q & A

What is the main change in Redis licensing model?

Redis has adopted a dual-source available licensing model, which means future releases will be offered under both the Redis Source Available License (RSAL) and the Server Side Public License (SSPL).

How does the dual-licensing model affect Redis users?

For individual developers and users, there is no change as they can continue to use Redis under the permissive RSAL. However, cloud service providers and enterprises using Redis as part of their services will need to comply with the SSPL, which may involve licensing fees.

What was the original license for Redis?

Redis was originally licensed under the 3-clause BSD license, which was permissive and allowed for free use, modification, and distribution of the source code.

Why did Redis switch from the 3-clause BSD license to a dual-licensing model?

The switch was made to ensure the sustainability of the Redis project and to allow the Redis company to continue evolving the product and providing support for its users. This change was driven by the need to monetize the project, which had been providing a foundation for many applications and infrastructures for 15 years.

What is the Redis Source Available License (RSAL)?

RSAL is a new license under which Redis will be distributed. It does not require the publication of source code but restricts who can use the software directly, preventing third parties from offering Redis as a service without a licensing agreement with Redis maintainers.

What is the Server Side Public License (SSPL)?

SSPL is a license that requires anyone who uses SSPL-licensed software as part of a service to release the source code for the entirety of that service. It was originally created for MongoDB and has been adopted by Redis for its new licensing model.

How has the community reacted to the licensing change?

The community has had mixed reactions, with some expressing frustration and disappointment, feeling that the change is a betrayal of the open-source ethos. Others are trying to understand the financial pressures that led to the decision and are considering the implications for their use of Redis.

What are the implications for cloud service providers like AWS and Alibaba?

Cloud service providers will no longer be able to use Redis for free as part of their hosted services. They will need to agree to licensing terms with Redis maintainers to continue offering Redis 7.4 and future versions, which may involve paying fees.

Are there any alternatives to Redis that users can consider?

Yes, alternatives like KyDB and Garet, which are open-source and compatible with existing Redis clients, have emerged. Users starting new projects or looking to replace Redis in their existing projects can consider these options without significant issues.

What is the significance of the Redis founder's departure from the project?

The departure of the Redis founder, Salvatore Sanfilippo, also known as antirez, signifies a major shift in the project's direction and leadership. His absence from the project since 2020 and the subsequent licensing change have raised questions about the future of Redis and its alignment with the community's spirit.

How does the licensing change impact the open-source community at large?

The licensing change has sparked a debate within the open-source community about the sustainability of open-source projects, the role of corporate funding, and the balance between community spirit and commercial interests. It highlights the challenges faced by open-source projects in securing long-term support and development.

Outlines

00:00

🤔 Redis Licensing Shift

The paragraph discusses the change in Redis's licensing model from a permissive open-source license to a dual-source available licensing model. The speaker expresses initial confusion and skepticism about the change, mentioning the community's reaction and the potential impact on Redis's usage and development. The paragraph highlights the shift from the three-clause BSD license to the Redis Source Available License and the Server Side Public License, and the implications this has for commercial use and cloud service providers.

05:03

😕 Open Source Dilemma

This paragraph delves into the complexities and challenges faced by open-source projects, particularly focusing on the sustainability of such projects. The speaker ponders the reasons behind Redis's licensing change, acknowledging the need for funding to support development but also expressing concern about the potential loss of community trust. The discussion touches on the moral and ethical considerations of monetizing open-source software and the impact on users and contributors.

10:04

📈 Redis History and Growth

The speaker narrates the history and growth of Redis, from its inception by Salvatore Sanfilippo (also known as antirez) to its widespread adoption by major companies like Instagram and Twitter. The paragraph highlights the initial challenges faced by Redis, such as performance issues with MySQL, and the innovative solution of using memory storage instead. It also discusses the role of companies like VMware and Alibaba in sponsoring Redis development.

15:05

🤯 Redis Licensing Controversy

This paragraph addresses the controversy surrounding Redis's licensing change, with the speaker expressing a shift from initial skepticism to a realization of the potential negative implications. The speaker discusses the involvement of Redis Labs and the investment from major companies, leading to the decision to change the licensing model. The paragraph also touches on the community's reaction, the departure of antirez, and the potential for a fork of Redis under the original BSD license.

20:07

🌐 Redis and the Future of Open Source

The speaker reflects on the future of Redis and open-source projects in general, considering the balance between maintaining an open-source ethos and the need for financial sustainability. The paragraph discusses the potential for alternative open-source projects to emerge, the role of major companies like AWS and Alibaba in supporting and potentially competing with Redis, and the broader implications for the open-source community. The speaker also expresses a sense of disillusionment with the current state of Redis and its licensing model.

Keywords

💡Dual Licensing

Dual licensing refers to the practice of offering software under two different licenses. In the context of the video, Redis has adopted a dual-source available licensing model, which includes the Redis Source Available License and the Server Side Public License. This change has significant implications for how Redis can be used commercially, as it restricts certain uses of the software, particularly by cloud service providers.

💡Open Source

Open source refers to a software licensing model where the source code of the software is made available for anyone to view, modify, and distribute. The Redis project was originally open source, allowing for widespread adoption and contribution from the community. However, the recent licensing changes have led to Redis no longer being classified as open source under the Open Source Initiative's definition.

💡Redis

Redis is an in-memory data structure store, used as a database, cache, and message broker. It is known for its high performance, flexibility, and wide-ranging use cases. The video discusses the history and evolution of Redis, including its development, community, and the recent licensing changes.

💡Community Edition

The term 'Community Edition' in the context of the video refers to the version of Redis that will continue to be freely available to developers, customers, and partners. It signifies the continued support for the open-source community despite the licensing changes for commercial use.

💡Commercialization

Commercialization refers to the process of transforming something, often a product or service, into a commodity that can be sold for profit. In the context of the video, it discusses the commercialization of Redis through licensing changes, which has led to a shift from a completely open-source model to one that includes restrictions on commercial use.

💡Investors

Investors are individuals or entities that provide capital for a business, expecting a return on their investment. In the context of the video, Redis Labs has received significant venture capital funding, which has influenced the company's decisions, including the licensing changes.

💡Forking

Forking, in the context of software development, refers to creating a copy or duplicate of a project, often to make changes or improvements that may not align with the original project's direction. The video discusses the possibility of forking Redis after the licensing changes as a way for the community to continue using the software on their terms.

💡Server Side Public License (SSPL)

The Server Side Public License is a type of copyleft license that requires anyone offering a service that uses SSPL-licensed software to make the entire service's source code available under the same license. In the video, Redis's adoption of the SSPL is a point of contention, as it imposes obligations on companies using Redis as part of a service.

💡Redis Source Available License

The Redis Source Available License is a custom license created by Redis Labs that allows users to access and modify the source code but includes restrictions on how the software can be used and distributed, particularly in relation to commercial services. This license is part of the dual-licensing model that Redis has adopted.

💡Greed

Greed is an intense and selfish desire for wealth, power, or other forms of gain. In the context of the video, greed is discussed as a potential motivator behind the licensing changes of Redis, suggesting that the desire for profit may have influenced the decision at the expense of the community's interests.

Highlights

Redis adopts dual source available licensing model.

Redis releases will continue to offer free use of source code under dual RSV2 and SSPL v1 licenses.

Redis 7.4 and future versions will be released under the Redis source available license and the server-side public license.

Redis will no longer be distributed under the three-clause BSD license.

Redis has combined advanced data types and processing engines previously only available in the Redis stack.

Redis has implemented dual licensing for advanced modules under the Redis stack distribution.

Redis has served millions of developers globally and supports real-time applications the world depends on.

Redis maintains performance and simplicity for applications and data infrastructure powering the modern internet.

The dual licensing model is seen as a monetization strategy for Redis.

The open source community has mixed reactions to the licensing change, with concerns about the future of Redis.

Redis has faced challenges due to the commercialization of the product by cloud service providers.

The shift to a dual license model may impact the open source community's trust and collaboration.

Redis continues to offer a community edition for free use by developers, customers, and partners.

The Redis source code will remain freely available, but the new licenses will affect how it is used commercially.

The Redis partner program offers exclusive access to future release updates and feature development.

The licensing change has led to discussions about the sustainability of open source projects and their funding models.

The Redis founder, Salvatore Sanfilippo, stepped back from the project in 2020, leaving it in the hands of the community and Redis Labs.

Redis Labs has undergone significant changes, including a rebranding and a focus on hosted Redis services.

Investors have played a crucial role in the direction and funding of Redis Labs.

Transcripts

so I've never had this happen during a

article read I had one strong opinion at

the beginning of the experience and I

ended completely different this is a

wild ride what goes on with reddis all

right I know I'm a little late to the

party but apparently reddis has adopted

some dual Source available licensing

thing okay so I I I actually haven't

watched any of this but or I haven't

read on anything and we haven't watched

any videos we do have potentially a

video somewhere on here yeah the

downfall of reddis man it sounds we have

the the the pr that it happened with and

we have a specific comment that

apparently is pretty intense about it

all but we will start right here with

the actual release and then we're going

to go uh forward maybe we'll look at the

video maybe we're going to look at the

GitHub issue maybe we'll do all of them

okay let's just hey let's just run the

let let's hey calm down okay I see

people being like you didn't even watch

the video the video does it let's let's

let's get the whole thing let's get the

whole thing in okay calm down future

reddis releases will continue to offer

free and permissive use for uh of the

source code under dual rsv2 and SSP lv1

licenses so I actually don't I've never

even heard of these licenses I mean this

one sounds like an encryption algorithm

this thing sounds like something my wife

has a a subscription to I don't know

what this I what is this uh these

releases will combine Advanced Data

types and processing engines previously

only available in the Reda stack I don't

even know what are we trying to say okay

anyway so things happen beginning today

all Futures uh future versions of reddis

will be released with Source available

licenses starting with reddis 7.4 reddis

will be dual licensed under the reddis

source available license and the server

side public license consequently reddis

will no longer be distributed under the

three claw Berkeley software

distribution BSD from day one redus has

provided a foundation of performance and

simplicity for the applications and data

infrastructure that power the modern

inter uh internet now 15 years later

we're proud to serve millions of

Developers across the globe by

supporting real-time applications the

world depends on every day we have

already implemented dual licensing for

our Advanced redus modules under the

Reda stack distribution which have has

been well received by the community is

this by the way I is this is this is

this the

truth are people

happy in the advanced reddis modules

that they got this new licensing uh in

fact more than 50% of redis IO downloads

from redis 6 and Beyond come from redis

stack we now believe that extending this

licensing to Reus itself will enable us

to continue to evolve the most holistic

set of data models processing engines

and develop and developer capabilities

for our

users all right so I guess I have a

question right away with what they're

saying is what they're saying this hey

we've been developing this product for

15 years and we've been unable to

effectively monetize this well cuz to me

I assume this licensing is for some sort

of monetization and we're looking for a

new way to monetize and thus we're not

even talking about like our our Advanced

modules we're talking about RIT s we

want to be able to move it into such a

place that commercially using redus will

cost you money yes they need money

because they can't maintain the product

anymore that's I mean that's fair uh is

this another rug pole and software it's

I mean 15 years is entirely too long of

a long con that's a long okay can we all

agree that this is a long con right here

so no my guess is this is not a rug pole

my guess is that um that's exactly how

Boomers operate they think ahead for

decades um they weren't even Boomers

back then okay they weren't even Boomers

okay

they the term didn't even exist when

they did it it's to extract money from

Amazon if I don't know if Netflix uses

reddis or some version of redis I'm sure

they do I think every big company uses

reddis pretty much and so my ass my

assumption is that the point is to be

able to extract money out of larger um

larger corporations correct redus is

effectively everywhere and so by doing

that that's that's that's my assumption

behind this uh goorse reddish yeah uh

rent seeking Behavior well it's not rent

seeking Behavior so let's just pretend

that what I've said so far is absolutely

and perfectly correct it is this is the

same argument that we all recognize and

have said about open source which is

open source is largely a thankless job

in which people will not support it

right do you think that they would have

done this if everybody who used it

commercially all the companies who used

it all the individuals who used it and

had their problem solved they all sent

them some amount of cash proportionate P

based on their usage and usefulness do

you think this would have happened my

guess is probably not but maybe still it

would have happened in that you know in

in an effort to kind of grab B any money

you can but it's truly the problem of

Open Source is that whatever you have a

good product that everybody uses nobody

appreciates it and when nobody

appreciates it it just leads to some

like especially something like reddis

where they need to have money to develop

it you know I'm not saying what they're

doing is good behavior I'm not I'm not

even trying to ad justify their good

behavior I'm just trying to rationalize

why this Behavior exists do I think it's

good I I mean the hard part is you built

it open for people to use you got a

bunch of people and companies to use it

and now you're changing it I can see why

people would feel like this is a rug

pull I can see why people would feel

this is really bad right the new source

available licenses allow us to

sustainably provide per uh permissive

use of our source code we're leading

reddis into its next phase of

development as a realtime data platform

with a unified set of clients tools and

core reddis product offerings the reddis

source code yes okay there you go reddis

product offerings how they make money

right it stinks but it's not morally

wrong or anything yeah I it's hard for

me to justif like it's hard for for me

to say what they're doing is well yeah

it's hard I'd say that this is an

extremely I it's not see okay I know

you're probably just trying to get me to

get all upset but this really isn't cap

don't stop it with the capitalism this

is not a capitalism problem right this

is the fact that people have been

working on a product for free for what

appears to be a decade and a half right

I'm sure there I'm AOL take this is such

an AOL take it's greed isn't it you know

it's this really is the shambles I mean

if you look at the X XZ exploit it's

because one person was exploited for

their work got burnt out got pressured

into giving up full and unified control

and Gan gave us the biggest backdoor

Wing we've ever received in our lifetime

luckily that backdoor wiang got caught

by the way if you don't know the back

door Wing reference that is a sand

bakman freed reference it it sounds like

how it sounds okay so just just deal

with it um anyways

uh so you you get the idea like you get

the idea the the Redd uh the redus

source code will continue to be freely

available to developers customers and

partners through the reddis Community

Edition they're still offering reddis

Community Edition is that for free uh

future reddis Source available versions

will unify uh core redus with reddis

stack so Reedus stack must be because

they're doing capital S on this one this

must be like their commercial product

including search jesson vector

probabilistic and time Seri data models

in one free easy to ous package as now

downloadable software this will allow

anyone to easily use Reedus across a

variety of contexts including a as high

performance key value and document store

a powerful query engine in a low latency

Vector database powering generative AI

applications damn damn even got even

snuck AI in there primon we've seen it

so many times and we'll see it again but

you either change the license and make

money or you stop developing I think

this is a I think this is a fair

statement right which is that I I don't

think it's unreasonable to say that

people shouldn't be forced to cre create

and maintain free products that you use

right because that's kind of the inverse

of this and that's where this moral gray

ground is for me because I I can't I

can't justify I I don't know how to

justify it 10 Amazon did it doesn't it

it doesn't matter yeah they they helped

I get it they helped but that doesn't

justify it like right you're justifying

the fact that you think it should be

something different it's not your

product it's not your cha choice to make

is it shitty that they did this yes I

don't think it's great where a bunch of

these people now feel like they have to

choose a forked version of redis or not

and guess what's going to happen you

know the community Fork that's going to

come out for uh redis it's going to have

the same problem do you think that just

by forking it and a bunch of highly

motivated individuals won't eventually

fall into the same problem Amazon

already backed this Fork so okay so

Amazon's already backed the fork of I

wonder I wonder what what it means for

Amazon to do this really obviously

Amazon did this because it's it's it's

probably very very valuable it probably

would cost them so much dang money that

they uh that they didn't that they made

this choice right which is they can pay

significantly less money by supporting a

fork which I mean can we all take a step

for just a second and realize also the

shittiness of that right can we can we

minimally understand the kind of

shittiness of that right that Amazon is

using something and they're able to

effectively pay less by supporting

someone to Fork it and move forward with

their support right I mean I'm not like

I don't think any of it is like there's

not like some sort of moral High Ground

I I I don't think there's a moral High

Ground argument here why wouldn't they

do that no I agree it's it's it's it it

makes sense that they did it because

monetarily it probably it probably you

know it probably makes more sense yeah

it might as well support the original uh

the original creators yeah I mean

there's a whole problem here you know

this is the problem I have with these

kind of these kind of changes is that

you'll see people that get pissed off

like about AI generating art that's in

the style of somebody else or generating

art that's been trained off of all these

things and like you why W you just

support the original creators and then

you have things like this where it is a

similares vein where the original

creators despite them not I would I'm

still on your team I don't think it's

good I think what they're doing is not

great but at the same time can you not

see how you're not supporting the

original creators here you just a lot of

people did a lot of free work the hard

part is free and open source software is

is is genuinely a lie it's effectively

impossible a few companies will do it

but most will never ever ever be able to

do it or sustain it reasonably for a

long time they're they're not actually

the original creators they're probably

I'm sure there might be original Creator

somewhere on reeda still probably there

except Linux yeah Linux is that's why I

said there probably is something there

uh certainly today we've encountered uh

peculiar issues because of capitalism

yet Alternatives prove more detrimental

when open source projects becomes

monetize it's uh it's for specific

reasons either greed or necessity it's

important not to overlook the fact that

many companies also benefit from this

period it's true many companies benefit

from it I don't know I I have a really

hard time siding with either side in

this one uh llmt he used certainly fact

uh the success of redis has created a

unique set of challenges redis has been

sponsoring the bulk of development

alongside a dynamic community of

developers eager to contribute however

the majority of Reedus's commercial

sales are channeled through the large

largest cloud service providers who

commoditize arus Investments and its

open source

Community I wonder I wonder what company

they're talking about what company could

be com uh commercializing Reddit or

redis like this I mean it feels bad I

mean maybe redis should have done this

for

themselves but despite uh efforts to

support a community-led governance model

our desire to maintain the BS SD license

uh delivering multitude of software

distribution simultaneously across open

source source available and Commercial

software optimized for different on

premise and Cloud platforms is that odds

with our ability to drive reddis

successfully into the future under the

new license cloud service providers

hosting reddis offerings will no longer

be permitted to use uh the source code

of redus free of charge for example

cloud service providers will be able to

deliver reddis 7.4 only after agreeing

to licensing terms with redis the

maintainers of redis code these

agreements will underpin support for

existing Integrated Solutions and

provide full access to forthcoming redus

Innovations so one problem I have with

people getting up in arms about this is

the amount of people always yelling

about companies needing to pay their

fair share when it comes to open source

okay I know but look at what it said it

said if a company uses this if cloud

service providers uses it then they have

to agree to these terms I don't does

this does this account for for

individuals that's that's what I'm

missing here because if

individually then and developers don't

have to pay anything that are just using

it for themselves I don't see why people

are as much up in arms about it they're

reselling it yeah they're reselling it

right am I completely off base here

individuals are not cloud service

providers right one would assume am I

like real talk am I completely off base

in this thinking because I I'm trying to

like I'm trying to I'm trying to

rationalize why people constantly say

how commercials needs to support open

source software open source software

makes license change to force

commercials to support them people say

you're a jerk for doing it I'm trying

I'm like I'm trying to figure out where

where the problem is yeah older versions

are still under there L take for lovely

take people just like the [ __ ] and moan

uh I read it as no change for developers

if if you're just a developer using it

individually then that's I guess that's

the real question I want to know if if

that happens so uh instead of continuing

on down this route let's because it

doesn't look like this is all just like

in practice nothing changes for red

reddest developer Community who will

continue to enjoy permissive licensing

under dual license okay so the community

reddis developer community so at the

same time all reddis client libraries

under the responsibility of reddis will

remain open source licensed redis will

continue to support the vast partner

ecosystem so is that saying what I think

it is is that yeah uh rdus will continue

to support its vast partner ecosystem

including managed service providers and

system integrators with exclusive access

to all future release updates uh

releases updates and feature development

are developed and delivered by reddis

through partner program

hey man there's a bunch of useful

information on this page but I think you

should just sign up okayy do you want to

sign up hey you want to fill in this

form hey this form's right here for you

to fill in just why don't you hey why

don't you fill it in I was just

wondering what the partner program is uh

welcome to the reddest partner program

when Innovation meets

collaboration would you have like an llm

try to be a LinkedIn [ __ ] poster and

businesses thrive on the foundation of

speed performance and flexibility

Enterprise matters and redis partners

understand your business needs inside

and out they deliver tailored Solutions

ensuring you get the most out of reddest

and best-in-class Technology stack scale

smarter and faster with the support of

our Global Partners find a partner I

know there's a lot of arch users that

could use this button in their life that

might have been the harshest thing said

on this stream uh anyways all right so

let's let's let's let's let's let's

watch this

video because now okay so now we're all

on this

page as far as I can tell there's no

change to the individual developer

hosting their own Reddit for their own

site doing something there's only

changes to

commercial we get it

now and people are up in arms saying

reddis is crazy man I hate to I I feel

like

I'm why do how do I feel like the bad

guy for saying this feels really

hypocritical of most people that

complain about open source what if I

told you that redis was not actually

created by reddis if you are confused

right now you are in for a ride R okay

so maybe there's something more that I

don't understand here that actually

makes this more interesting okay so so

we got to let this guy cook so this this

this does show that maybe maybe we we we

got something okay okay okay I could be

wrong it ended in the very recent events

of red is changing their license to

actually not be open source anymore and

scamming their Community contribut this

and even the founder of reddis himself

it all started in 2007 when Salvador San

filipo better known as Entz on the

internet was building a tool called LL o

g it was a very early competitor to is

he competing with Minecraft Google

analytics the main selling point of L

was their realtime visitor tracking

feature which Google analytics did not

support until years later because of the

massive amounts of data written to the

database they ran into performance

issues using MySQL antias believed that

using memory instead of the hard drive

to store the data like masel does would

solve the problem

and yo dummy why don't you just use the

memory instead of the disc of course of

course it's faster duh you dummy what do

you think

dummy what if we lose

power

program the first prototype of what we

will later know as redis in 2009 antiz

published a redis core on GitHub to say

it with his own words at this point the

server may not have been perfectly

stable but soon it will be an essential

part of many web applications and

massively impact how we design modern

software

architecture that is really great

foresight I didn't realize how I didn't

realize the origin I didn't know the

origin story to Reis so that's that's

pretty impressive that that he was able

to say like yeah this is going to become

increasingly important that is one big

Arrow by the way this is a statistically

non- average arrow for those that are

wondering to this day the first hecka

news posting of reddis did not get much

attention at all only 23 uploads and a

few comments but anti continued to work

on reddis and soon reddis started to

spread in the Ruby community and

attracted startups will later turn out

to be unicorns Instagram was entirely

built on reddis in its early years get

wasn't early reddis just like just

purely an in inmemory key value story so

so how did they have any was there no

historical I I didn't use Instagram in

the beginnings so does that mean there

was no like historical data to Instagram

like every time it went down it was just

like everybody starting over everyone

sign up with the new account Instagram

just didn't have a database oh S3

buckets okay it just Jam a bunch of

stuff into S3 buckets reddis does write

to dis okay so it does Peri periodically

our sync okay it's eventually consistent

so you may lose a little bit okay I

thought back then redus was purely just

an in-memory one okay I didn't realize

that it it it also synced with disc and

had like a refresh State okay yeah

that's cool yeah I don't see why you

couldn't do that let's go talk about

talk talk about some Scrappy cating what

was it what was it $32 per us user that

Instagram sold for I can't remember how

much Instagram sold for but it sold for

just an incredible amount of money per

user ithub used it to build a chop

queuing system and Twitter improved

their timeline page performance using

redis after gaining more popularity

VMware started to sponsor and hired anti

to continue his work on the inmemory

database oh in 2013 he got sponsored by

the VMware spinoff pivotal soft ware in

the same time period around 2011

companies started to offer consulting

services for redis oh there's a second

big Arrow here okay we have conflicting

arrows one of them was guarante a data

which will play an essential role in

this entire story in 2014 guarante a

data tried to Rebrand to Red is DB but

after the push back of an they reverted

the rebranding and rebranded to Red is

Labs instead which is still very

confusing around this time Redd Labs

also transitioned away from offering

consulting services and focused on

providing hosted red services on top of

AWS instead in 2015 a common investor of

pivotal software and reddis Labs

suggested moving anes to redis Labs

which employed him shortly after that

and sponsored reddis from this point on

investors play a crucial role in reddest

Labs because that company is stacked

stacked up with VC money they

ra they raised

347 million us damn that screen tearing

hey the screen tearing is for free for

you bed over

$347 million Us in seven rounds from

Goldman Sach the Silicon Valley Bank and

Silicon Valley Bank mentioned let's go

let's go more to set this into

perspective if we wanted to just fund

the open source project with let's say

five developers each a salary of

$400,000 a year this would come to $26

million over the span of 13 years less

than a tenth of the funding of red is

lab okay so I think I'm starting to

understand why this license change was

as bad I I I did not know about a lot of

these uh I didn't know about some of

these changes which makes that things

seem uh a little bit different right

there's some change here so you know

maybe I am the

[ __ ] maybe I am truly the [ __ ]

here after anti transferred over the

Red's IP and trademarks to redis Labs he

left the project in 2020 in the block

post he explained the reasons for

stepping back he never wanted to be a

softer maintainer and used code to

express himself but what G it Chad who

who wants who wants to who wants to

maintain that code who wants to maintain

that one I just want to I just want to

express myself in code I just want to

say how I feel with my code dude G dude

chat chatted anti res is the real deal

yeah yeah well I mean he did predict how

useful Reddit would be and created

Reddit and did it so yeah you you can't

dunk on the guy for not actually he

expresses himself very well in code one

quote Reddit sorry Reddit did I say

Reddit

side of his goodbye blog post hits quite

a lot harder today I believe I'm not

just leaving Redd is in the hands of a

community of expert programmers but also

in the hands of people who care about

the legacy of the community spirit of

redis in there goodbye

Block it's kind of funny you know you

know this is sometimes where politeness

is kind of goofy I'm leaving this in the

hands of the people who care the

most and they kind of you know I it kind

of feels like he got Bamboozled you know

I'm not going to I'm not going to lie to

you there kind of there's kind of a bit

of like bamboozling going on here red is

lab stated that the core of the reddest

project will remain under the three

class BSD license as it has always been

but this will only hold true for a few

more years red is was now led by a team

of five people three of them are from

redest Labs one of them from I can see

why they needed to I I see why they

needed $340 million from Alibaba and one

from

AWS one year later red is Labs

officially rended to just

redis is what they wanted all along

redis the company was still developing

hosted redis services on top of popular

Cloud providers essentially dude this

back door this was a bigger back door

than XZ like real talk this this was the

this was the this was I mean this was

the long Pole right here this is an

actual rug

pole competing with AWS elastic cash and

we'll find out soon that they were

probably not very successful in doing so

or at least not successful enough while

the Redd is core team remains small red

is the

company oh red core team remains small

700 employees

okay you know this could be me being

ignorant hey I could be ignorant I could

hey real talk I could be

ignorant but that just seems like a lot

650 scrub Masters lots of lots of scrub

mastering 700 is small yeah

but okay 300 of them are salese what are

the other 400 how many

people it seems like it's it's you know

again this could just be ignorant

speaking you know sometimes you think

you you're like it shouldn't be that big

but then you realize like okay that's

why it's that big but has gone to over

700 employees today I could not even

make upes for all of those people if I

wanted to but browsing through the

Wayback machine snapshots of the reddest

website makes me think quite a few of

them were busy updating the web design a

concerning amount of time and on March

the 20th 2024 the day arrived where VC

money defeated open source in the

company R is announced in a block post

that they will move away from the three

class BSD license to a dual licensing

model which basically means that they

offer it under two different licenses

and you can choose which is the Lesser

evil while the three class BSD license

is one of the approved ones by the open

source initiative the new licenses are

not which they acknowledged in the

announcement therefore red is will no

longer be called Open Source before I

continue by The OSI

definition so that means yeah because

they're referring to themselves as

Source available meaning that you can

look at the source but it also means

that you can Fork The Source can you

Fork The Source if you Fork The Source

you can't change the license right so

you can only fork The Source starting

from

7.4 not anymore you can't even look at

you can't even look at it Fork The

Source change the license can you do

that you can Fork source and profit and

profit from it I don't think you can do

that it's just text I don't think that

that's how it

works I I'm

I'm try to stop I don't need to try to

stop you but you know that lawyer that's

going to just take you to pound me in

the ass prison they're going to be the

ones that stop you I'm just saying it's

a little it's a it's a little it's a

little bit difficult to be like it's

just it's just some text I just did a f

and replace I don't know uh valky

already forked it yeah but they must

have forked it at 7.4 right they forked

it under the BSD license thus it's legal

to Fork it at that

point now you can do it office space

mentioned that is office space

mentioned social credit score minus 100

yeah yes correct they they forked it at

at a time in which was allowed

to okay I have to say I am not a lawyer

and this is not legal advice in any way

the new licenses are called side public

license and red Source available license

2.0 the sspl was originally created for

mongodb and requires everyone who uses

sspl license software as part of a

service to release the source for the

entirety of the service in hold on with

a modified 13 that requires making SSL

license software available to third

parties modified or not as part of a

service must release the source for the

entirety of the service

so mongod DB had this as a li did did

people that used mongod

like oh is that mean if you use the

source code that's

different that's different than it's

different than than using the product

versus using the source code right but I

guess how do you use the how do you use

the product without a bit of the source

code on there

right it's kind of hard right because

you you kind of need like the the the

thing that communicates to to the item

which is probably a part of this viral

licensing I've heard about the I've

heard about these viral licensing that

are very

um very uh very dangerous yikes

including with imitations all management

software user interfaces application

program interfaces automation software

monitoring software backup software

storage software and hosting software

all such that a US user can run an

instance of the service using the

service source code you made available

well this sounds like a nightmare

especially if you have some sort of

proprietary license software in your

stack that you simply cannot open source

for legal reasons after the sspl was

submitted to the open- source initiative

as they wanted to become an approved

open- Source license the open source

initiative made a hit piece calling it a

fox pen Source license because it

restricts who can use L

it yeah that's that's rather wild this

is a hit piece dude

that you know the this is the part of

software that like I just I literally

have no idea

about it's it's supposed to be faxen

right F A ux is Fox um

but you know what's kind of wild is

that I wonder if you could I wonder if

you could make like a viral hit in node

with you know because you know how many

npm packages there are there's like

literally a kajillion npm packages I

wonder if you could just how could you

do

that if you rebase and throw in

something in the past is that and you

made it like a or you didn't have to

throw in the P you just threw it in

there and you threw it as like 1.01 so

it automatically gets updated in

people's code and then they use it and

if they use it they have to open source

it it's kind of wild like is even s SPL

dude I know how F would that

be it need to be fair what needs to be

fair this isn't a real Tech and no one

is really enforcing it well I mean what

happened if you could I'm just saying

this stuff is super you know I knew this

stuff basically existed yeah a viral

license bomb

dang kind of kind of wild viral license

bombs version attacks like that exist I

know it's kind of this is like yeah a

supply chain license

attack yeah know exactly I mean that's

the thing is people are going to make a

whole whole there's going to be a whole

Cottage can there be an entire cottage

industry of people making somehow money

lawyering off of these type of license

changes I don't know it's kind of wild

the other license in question is the

reddest Source available license 2.0

this license does not require you to

publish the source code but it restricts

who can use it directly in the license

terms it says you may not make the

functionality of the software or a

modified version available to third

parties as a service or distribute the

version or a modified version in a

manner that makes the functionality of

the software available to third parties

now again I am not a lawyer and this is

not legal advice but this sounds like a

very vague definition to me

and you may not make functionality of

the software or a modified version

available to third parties as a service

or distribute the software or modified

version in a manner that makes the

functionality of the software available

to third parties it is

vague so how did they Fork it they

forked it at 7.4 or whatever whatever

was the last one it is extremely vague

right I I can I I can understand why

people are saying this is is extremely

vague right me putting on my various

lawyerings hat and my bird law hat

meaning I'm not a lawyer but just me

trying to logically argue out exactly

what this means I cannot come up with an

exact thing right meaning that let's see

or distribute software or a modified

version in a manner that makes

functionality of the software available

to third parties what does that

mean like does that mean if somebody in

a third party logs in and the logs in

the logging in uses reddis that's like

making functionality available to a

third party which means have we just hit

have we just hit

ourselves into a problem this feels like

bird law okay again my various lawyer

Rings yeah there so that's the people

are saying that's the point that they uh

that the let's see their lawyers want it

to be as vague so they could Define how

they want it in court yeah I mean that

is part of the problem with

this I think that I think it's also hard

to make it stand up in

court because whenever you do something

I mean the problem is when something is

so so vague it's very hard to make it

also stand up in

court but yeah but the judge gets to

decide yeah that's that's the that's

that's the hard part um yeah I wouldn't

I I would probably I would probably not

uh I would probably not touch this with

a with a 10ft pull right like this

sounds wildly even though it's only

$5 a

month or distributed version or a

modified version in a manner that makes

the functionality of the software

available to third parties now again I

am not a lawyer and this is not legal

advice but this sounds like a very vague

definition to me yeah it is very and

when we look at the fqs for redis

modules which were already relicensed to

the same licenses before they State

multiple times that the change should

not affect you but if not even reders

themselves can tell me with certainty

who can no matter where exactly the

limits are it is very clear that under

none of the new licenses Cloud providers

like AWS will be able to provide HED

reded services without paying a fee

which I mean again I think that we can

all agree that that's probably in some

sense

fine

right I don't know is that fine man I

have such a hard time going back and

forth on this one but I mean AWS now

forked it and now that they forked it at

7.4 or whatever it is it's just like

that's valky is already out

there I know everyone's okay with AWS

the L

right you should never you should never

make a rule in your head because you

know that one big company can get

screwed right like a a generally good

rule of thumb is you should try to think

through a problem and what its

implications are not that we all can't

agree that like yo yeah yeah make Amazon

pay right like sure but you got to think

through the problems and what does it

actually mean to the people that aren't

Amazon cuz once you do once you do it

with the big company it keeps on on

goinging right it doesn't stop at Amazon

Amazon's just the first it Amazon's the

precedent that wins all the future cases

right and that's where things kind of

get in the murky Waters and so so Amazon

isn't going to eat that price yeah I

don't think they

will that's why it is a problem that's

why this is a problem [ __ ] flows

Downstream yeah

yeah which was obviously the goal but it

is also important to note something else

if redis would have had this license

from the very beginning guarante a data

would have never been able to offer the

services in the first place without open

sourcing their entire infrastructure

they destroyed the very thing that made

their company exists in the first

place yeah that's a fair

take okay you know what I have

officially changed my

stance I have I have officially changed

my stance this is is a rug

pull I played myself played myself like

a fiddle hey I'm willing to be wrong I'm

always willing to be wrong it's a

scumbag move they themselves profited

off of something in which they then in

turned were able to capture the whole

thing maybe potentially just due to how

close their naming was and however the

VC incest party went that caused those

two people to like work together right I

mean the fact that the original redis

guy sold all the IP or whatever happened

I mean he just wanted to cash out it

sounds like he wanted to be done with

this crap I don't probably blame him

probably was like hugely political super

super awful not something you want to be

a part of not something I want to be a

part of I think we can all give the

original Creator uh a free pass here i'

take the money too right I don't if

anyone thinks they're like on this moral

High Ground that they would have been

like I would have stood up for truth and

Justice it's like nah you wouldn't have

no no you you you you wouldn't okay okay

you really you really would not have

stood for truth and Justice

okay you know all heroes uh all heroes

costumes eventually wear out yeah I'll

stand for it after I get the bag I'm

gonna get the bag and then I'm super

angry that they did it

right all right hold on someone someone

just posted a a good comment here all

right it's time for a solid fork with

custom restrictions Banning uh reddis

Labs from ever using the new code from

new Forks let's starve them yeah I would

actually say that you you you theoretic

could do this and how you would do this

is you would have to create a public

Fork I mean can we be real here for a

quick second

Amazon Amazon is most certainly

profiting the most from this okay

they're the ones that are going to be

able to effectively make it out like a

bandit while everybody else carries the

tax right they're the true winners in

this

situation cuz they're the ones that are

going to be like oh man we're going to

give you guys a 100,000

a

[Applause]

year

hey yeah and they're going to be just

like hell yeah sponsored by Amazon

they're like for five years two correct

we're going to make a we're going to

make a billion dollars off this [ __ ]

right because that's their most

profitable Center is AWS they make in in

just inordinate amount of money off of

it sponsored by fizer and

Amazon don't forget to get your new

migraine medication um anyways let's see

honestly I don't care if reddis would

use code from the new Fork it's open

source for a reason we can't become the

thing we are bashing and block blocking

Rus from pulling commits really defeats

the purpose of original license we are

all upset over them

removing man this

guy's we have found an honor we found an

honorable

individual

Gilda is just like yo [ __ ] that

guy principal to a fault yeah it's it's

principal to a fall

which I

think if you the here so here's like

kind of like my take on this one which

is that if you really want to make sure

you don't become the thing you don't

like you have to even allow the thing

you don't like to be able to Pro like

you have to be able to even allow them

to use you I I do actually agree with

him if you wanted to be fully like this

is the Open Source One then you'd have

to make it open source for

all

right because once you put in

restrictions the restrictions can

grow and then who knows hey extreme

Ownage principal stat principal stance

though I can see why people would be

upset about

it I don't know how to thumb apparently

am I not signed

in I'm not even signed in what a loser

new computer still okay just switch

browsers okay just switch BR don't don't

judge me like this here [ __ ] fire

Firefox oh gosh don't get

embarrassed what was his it was it it

was what is it

Ownage thumbs up see I dude I I I I code

I'm not just an influencer

guys you know what I mean I'm one of I'm

one of us you know what I'm talking

about

Bros I'm not a

Dev I'm not a devell stop I'm not a

devell with the license by the way that

just single-handedly just like made so

many people's day worse by me just

dunking on on devels like that alone

just made a bunch of people's days worse

and I'm

sorry I'm

sorry that you've chosen to be a Dev all

right all right all right got him all

right let's go let change the AWS

employee medeline Olen who worked on the

project for 4 years announced that she

will no longer be able to win work on

the project and that there was a real

price to pay with losing such a beloved

open-source project but not only some of

the main contributors are unhappy with

the change the pool request with the

license change is flooded with un and

users of reddis again this is not legal

advice but redis did just relicense code

that was contributed under a completely

different license and they removed all

bstd notices which are required by the

the three Claus BSD license I cannot

imagine that is what anti meant when he

was talking about caring about the

legacy of the community Spirit

of remember when I said polite comments

you know this is one of those things

where you know I I talked earlier about

like always being wise with your words

and communicating in kind of like a

polite way because you don't want to

come back and haunt you but if you have

like hey these people are dangerous

maybe you should be willing to say that

right

there just throwing it out there it's

definitely a

balance is with the legal un people will

look for Alternatives and to say

honestly to be real he's probably he

probably had to sign some sort of like

hey you're going to sell it all these

things and you get all these things but

you have to leave and you have to leave

and you have to say good terms and you

can't say yo these people are a bunch of

[ __ ] don't trust them that they will

find them there is already kydb which is

a drop in replacement for redis and just

a few days before redis announced a

license change Microsoft released garet

a cashore that can be used with existing

redest clients both of them are open

source and it would really come as a

surprise if AWS won't jump in as well

and develop their own red is Fork as

well as they did with open search when

elastic search changed their license it

is really a Nob brainer for anyone

starting a new project to use any of the

Alternatives and for the most part you

can probably replace them in your

existing project as well without any

problems so when the license

change man I feel I I I feel like

completely Bamboozled right now I I

honestly feel like I haven't had this

big of an emotional swing on something

in a long time I I am chook right now I

am

genuinely I'm I I feel Bamboozled right

now which introduces so many more

challenges and legal uncertainties

driving away the community from reddis

why on Earth would they do it it's not

first off this video is extremely good

but it's the fact that we read only

their their statement without

much understanding of the the history

and so how many people don't have I mean

I'm sure there's a a bunch

of there's a bunch of people that didn't

have the the the history of it it's just

like you can't understand the change of

it and so I mean I'm I'm I'm eating some

serious Crow right now I'm eating some

pretty serious Crow right now because I

was out there

like and then now I'm just

like it's okay it's okay you're okay man

I

I damn anyways they have to have known

the consequences of their actions we've

seen those exact scenarios play guys I

did have the flu okay I I had the flu

I I I I was taking medication for the

flu I'm sorry for what I said before in

the end it is hard to see how this is

not a big cash grab by a massively V

funded company where the investors

finally wanted to see a return an

investment can I be real here for a

second just a little quick second just a

little quick thing I love Investments

capitalism stock market and all those

things but the constant drive for

greater and greater returns has most

certainly caused a lot of issues and it

does make me sad you know what I mean

like don't get me wrong I'm not a fool I

don't somehow think that that some

alternative system is just gallons ahead

right the problem is is that greed alone

is bad right greed with virtue like if

Society said we don't need to make as

much money but we want to make like a

good Market where people can exist like

that's a good thing right I think we can

all agree with that but man The

Continuous the Unicorn

internet ultra wealthy potentials has

really caused like a lot of problems and

it makes me a little bit sag about it

you know what I mean because really what

happened here is I mean you can you can

just watch it happen like it's it's it's

this 300 whatever million dollar

investment coming home to roost right

rampid greed is damaging everything uh

I mean I think I think the underlying

thing the underlying truth to this is

that any of like the bad motivations

even if the initial outcome is

good does lead to a lot of a lot of

problems and nuke he licensing the

co-founder over Bengal stepped down as a

CEO and was replaced by Ren tou who is

also the person that published a license

change announcement on their blog Wen

trob was not involved with r before

whatsoever he was previously the CEO of

a call center provider called 59 and was

probably put in this position by

investors to finally make the company

profitable is this Jack

Attack is that who we're seeing right

here is this Jack Attack for those that

don't know the reference what's Jack's

last name

avato Jack Attack was the brought in CEO

that makes the box it's from Silicon

Valley and and he comes in as Jack

Attack and Barker the conjoined

triangles of

success like is this guy the conj dude

is Rohan trop trollope is he the

conjoined triangles of success action

Jack

Barker literally is this guy

[Laughter]

literally oh my goodness the story

somehow is actually worse than what it

was before how's it gotten this

bad

damn I know I know the fact that troll

in is in his name it's just too on the

nose is this nominative

determinism is this what this is

supposed to be it's unreal I know is

this nominative determinism like this

has to be right Silicon Valley writers

didn't even realize they were both

saying what existed and accidentally

predicted the future where is the

company will will probably make a lot of

money in the coming months and maybe

even years from companies that use Redd

is deeply integrated into the stack or

as a hosted service but this comes at a

cost the cost of losing such a beloved

open source project hold on I have to do

something flip marker marker flip it's a

marker marker flip take it

out you know he would sometimes leave

those in just to mess with me

do you know that flip he literally

called me up and he said that he spends

most of my his time he said it in more

colorful language than I'm going to say

it he spends most of my time or his time

making me not look like an idiot just to

find times to make me look like an idiot

and there's like this irony here that he

lives he lives this this dual life where

one half he's just like well I got to

prevent you from looking like an idiot

and then on the other side he's like and

you're an

idiot

there is a debate to be had about the

funding of open- source projects but

this is not about funding AWS and

Alibaba showed that they are willing to

contribute to this project by paying

people to work on redice while there are

way too many of them

this I think the hard part I have

generally with with with this stuff

right or they're just like Alibaba and

Amazon are going to you know pay them to

work on this product the money in versus

the money out is incredible like what

they're getting out of what they're

putting in is like an investment that

any sane person would make add infinitum

and it's one of the hard Parts I have is

that redis will still or reddis 2

whatever we're going to call it um is

still going to have a lot of the

probably some very similar funding

issues and so I don't see like I don't

know how much it's going to change you

know I

it's always sad I mean I think open

source is is wonderful and sad all at

the exact same time because there's just

so many issues to begin with you know

they never had a funding issue they've

never had funding issues I just somehow

doubt that I don't really know much of

any projects that aren't always wishing

they could have more

funding right open source is rough open

source is rough this is not a story

about faed open source funding this is a

story about a company that failed to out

compete the competition was pressured by

investors to deliver and did so by

destroying it for everyone else as of

the moment I'm recording this video

neither anti nor the two other main

contributors employed by Rister company

have spoken up about the LI is that

literally Gil foil change so we do not

really know what happened behind the

scenes or what their actual opinion

about all of this is but it is hard to

see how they are not feeling wared by

all of what happened if you want to find

out more about the history of anti-ras

and reddis I highly recommend you to

check out this blog post which I Linked

In the description down below if you

want to see what antes is up to now and

better understand how he views the world

you should take a look at his blog where

he regularly posts updates on his

projects since leaving redis he also

wrote a science fiction book about

artificial intelligence and also one

man's living the dream out there writing

books that previous one was doing

something with doing something with

hardware and not using a digital analog

converter the the the man's out there

renaissanc thing right now he's probably

wearing a shirt with poofy

sleeves one more special shout out to

this blog post by momento who I might

have stolen some memes from all the

sources for this video are linked in the

description down below I hope those

memes were MIT what happen if those

memes weren't properly

licensed then

what this might slowly disappear over

the next few years but the art of antes

and its Legacy will live on see you in

the next

video Dang there was a lot to

that there was a lot lot I was not ready

for that damn someone's did whoa did you

guys see that damn someone's putting I'm

definitely not attracted to a a bunny is

this Lola I definitely not attracted to

a bunny guys

um okay is this furries or is what

what's her name is it

Lola is that from Space

Jam okay is that the space j furry

confirm okay it's not a I'm not a

furry you're programmer airgo for okay

okay okay there okay there um man that's

a that was a that was a much

deeper that was a much

deeper Rabbit Hole than I was

expecting I take back everything I've

said and I would just like to say that I

think

um rabbit hole I'm not a

furry just okay just because

Lola makes me feel certain ways does it

mean I can't even look at chat I can't I

actually can't even look at chat you

guys are redacted chat right now this is

the most redacted chat I've ever seen in

my lifetime the name is the primagen