Civilization VII: Interview with Dennis Shirk gamescom 2024
Summary
TLDRIn this Gamescom 2024 interview, Dennis Sher, executive producer at Fexus, discusses the development of the new Civilization game. He highlights the game's innovative features, such as evolving civilizations and the ability to select leaders independently from civilizations. Sher also addresses the game's simultaneous release on all platforms, the introduction of verticality and navigable rivers, and the enhanced UI scalability. Additionally, he talks about the integrated tutorial and crisis system, designed to challenge players and keep the game engaging.
Takeaways
- 🎮 Dennis Sher, the executive producer at Fexus, has been with the company for 19 years and has played a pivotal role in the development of Civilization games.
- 🌟 The new Civilization game aims to break the predictable pattern of previous versions by introducing new concepts and changes, keeping the core game loop intact.
- 🛠️ Sher acts as Ed Beach's right-hand man, ensuring that the development team has all the necessary resources to complete the game.
- 📈 The game has been in development since just before the pandemic and is described as the biggest release in the Civilization series in terms of scale.
- 🗣️ Players are beginning to understand the new mechanics of civilization evolution and merging cultures, as opposed to a binary switch between civilizations.
- 🔄 A new feature allows players to select leaders independently from civilizations, although there is only one leader per playthrough.
- 🏛️ The game includes historical recommendations for civilization and leader pairings to enhance role-playing experiences.
- 🌐 The game world becomes larger as players progress through the ages, simulating the historical discovery of new lands and civilizations.
- 🎉 The game is released on all platforms simultaneously, which required the development team to optimize the game for a wide range of hardware capabilities.
- 📊 The game introduces a crisis system at the end of each age, challenging players to manage unexpected events that can affect their civilization.
- 🖥️ The UI has been improved to be scalable, ensuring that important information is displayed without cluttering the game's beautiful maps.
Q & A
What is Dennis Sher's role at Fexus in the development of the new Civilization game?
-Dennis Sher is the executive producer at Fexus and has been with the company for 19 years, working on Civilization games for almost the entire time. He is Ed Beach's right-hand man, ensuring that the team has everything they need to complete the game, acting as a facilitator for the production process and removing any roadblocks.
What was Ed Beach's vision for Civilization 7 compared to previous iterations?
-Ed Beach wanted to introduce a new concept that would be unpredictable for the fans, unlike Civ 4, 5, and 6 which were iterative. He aimed to keep the same foundation and core game loop but change the approach to surprise and engage the players.
How does the new Civilization game handle the evolution and merging of civilizations?
-The game allows civilizations to evolve and merge based on the player's actions and how their people are changing. It's not a binary switch but a cultural merging, which is a new way of experiencing civilization progression.
Can players select leaders independently from civilizations in Civilization 7?
-Yes, players can select leaders independently from civilizations, but there are historical recommendations to guide players who prefer role-playing. However, each player can only have one leader throughout the game.
What is the significance of the Peabody library in Baltimore in the context of the game?
-The Peabody library in Baltimore was used as a shooting location for the game's promotional material due to its stunning appearance, as suggested by the art director Jason Johnson.
What is Dennis Sher's favorite civilization and leader combination in Civilization 7?
-Dennis Sher's favorite combination in Civilization 7 is Hatshepsut with Egypt, as he enjoys playing as a culture builder.
How does the game's length compare to previous Civilization games?
-The length of a Civilization 7 game is similar to that of Civilization 6, with each age having a cap on the number of turns, such as 200 turns for the Antiquity age.
What is the maximum number of players supported in Civilization 7, and does it vary with the game's ages?
-The maximum number of players in Civilization 7 varies not only between platforms but also between ages of the game. The number of players can increase as the game progresses and new civilizations are discovered.
How does the simultaneous release on all platforms affect the game's development?
-The simultaneous release on all platforms required the development team to ensure high-quality graphics and performance across all platforms, including the less powerful ones like the Nintendo Switch. This influenced the game's art asset creation and engine capabilities.
What new features have been added to the map generation in Civilization 7?
-Civilization 7 introduces verticality to the map with sea cliffs and navigable rivers that flow downhill, adding strategic depth to movement and military positioning.
Are there plans to release a demo of Civilization 7 after Gamescom?
-As of the interview, there were no confirmed plans to release a demo of Civilization 7 after Gamescom.
How does Civilization 7 handle the display of information without cluttering the game's maps?
-Civilization 7 features a scalable UI that allows players to adjust the size and visibility of the interface elements to their preference, ensuring the game's maps remain uncluttered.
What improvements have been made in Civilization 7 to assist new or casual players?
-Civilization 7 integrates an interactive tutorial into the game and allows advisers to interact with the UI to guide players. It also introduces natural breaking points with the age system to help new players manage the game's complexity.
What is the Crisis System in Civilization 7, and how does it affect gameplay?
-The Crisis System in Civilization 7 is a feature where, at the end of each age, players must deal with crisis policy cards that can lead to worldwide catastrophes if not managed properly. This system adds an extra layer of strategy and preparation for players.
Outlines
🎮 Development Insights on Civilization 7
Dennis Sher, the executive producer at Fexus, discusses his role in developing Civilization 7. He has been with the company for 19 years and has been pivotal in the game's evolution. The new game aims to surprise long-time fans by changing the predictable pattern of previous installments. Sher's role is to facilitate the production team, ensuring the game's development progresses smoothly. The game has been in development since before the pandemic and is now the biggest release for the franchise. The interview also touches on the game's new features, such as the ability to evolve civilizations and select leaders independently, and the excitement within the team to see players' reactions and discussions.
🌟 Exploring New Combinations in Civilization 7
The conversation continues with Dennis Sher elaborating on the new mechanics that allow players to combine different civilizations and leaders, offering a fresh experience. Historical recommendations guide player choices, but the game encourages experimentation. Sher shares his personal favorite combinations and the strategic depth they offer. The discussion also covers the game's setting, with the Peabody library in Baltimore serving as a backdrop for promotional materials. Additionally, the interview delves into the game's pacing, player count variations, and the design philosophy behind the game's ages system, which aims to keep the decision-making engaging throughout.
🌐 Simultaneous Release Strategy and Map Design
Dennis Sher talks about the decision to release Civilization 7 on all platforms simultaneously, which influenced the game's development. The team had to ensure high-quality graphics and performance across all platforms, from PC to Switch. The game's map design is highlighted, with the introduction of sea cliffs and verticality to enhance strategic gameplay. The interview also addresses the game's scalability in terms of player count and the importance of exploration and discovery, reflecting historical realities. Sher emphasizes the game's accessibility, with adjustable UI elements to cater to both new and experienced players.
📚 Tutorial Integration and Crisis System in Civilization 7
The final part of the interview focuses on the game's tutorial and user interface design, which have been integrated and improved for better accessibility. The new crisis system adds an element of unpredictability, challenging players to prepare for and manage age-ending crises. Sher explains how these crises can disrupt gameplay and require strategic planning. The interview concludes with a look at some of the game's unseen features, such as the crisis system, which adds depth and replayability to the Civilization experience.
Mindmap
Keywords
💡Fexus
💡Civilization 7
💡Ed Beach
💡Game Loop
💡Production Team
💡Cultural Evolution
💡Leaders and Civilizations
💡Historical Recommendations
💡Ages in the Game
💡Multiplayer Experience
💡Simultaneous Release
💡UI Scalability
💡Onboarding and Accessibility
💡Crisis System
Highlights
Dennis Sher, executive producer at Fexus, discusses his role in developing the new Civilization game.
Ed Beach, lead designer, introduced a new concept for Civilization 7 to surprise fans and break the predictability of previous iterations.
Sher's role is to ensure the production team has everything needed to progress the game's development.
The game has been in development since just before the pandemic, marking a significant effort for the team.
Civilization 7 is expected to be the biggest release in the franchise's history.
Players are excitedly hypothesizing about the game, with discussions focusing on the separation of leaders and civilizations.
The game allows for civilizations to evolve and change, not just switch between binary options.
Players can select leaders independently from civilizations, with historical recommendations to guide choices.
The game introduces a new system where players can experience different historical possibilities.
The Peabody library in Baltimore was used as a shooting location due to its impressive appearance.
Sher's favorite leader combination in Civilization 7 is Hatshepsut with Egypt, reflecting his playstyle as a builder and culture player.
The average length of a Civilization 7 game is similar to that of Civilization 6, with each age having a cap on turns.
The game introduces 'ages' to keep the decision space interesting and avoid the late-game bloat of previous titles.
Multiplayer games can now be limited to a single age, allowing for shorter play sessions.
The maximum number of players varies between platforms and ages, reflecting the historical accuracy of the game world.
Civilization 7 is released on all platforms simultaneously, a first for the series, impacting the development process.
The game includes new map features like sea cliffs and verticality to add strategic depth.
Rivers in the game now have navigable sections, influencing military and trade strategies.
The game's UI is scalable to avoid cluttering the map and to accommodate different player preferences.
Onboarding and accessibility have been improved, with an integrated tutorial and dynamic adviser interactions.
The game introduces a Crisis System where players must manage age-ending challenges.
Transcripts
[Music]
so we're here at Gamescom 2024 with
Dennis Sher executive producer at fexus
for the new civilization game thank you
so much for being here with me maybe you
can start by telling us a little bit
about your role in the development of
the game sure um I've been at fraxis for
19 years working on Civilization games
almost the entire time nice and on uh Ed
came to us at the beginning of
civilization 7 this is when he was
working on the Prototype before the
pandemic started and uh said I've Got a
New Concept he had always talked about
that um Civ four five and six were all
iterative and he wanted to try something
new because our fans always were able to
predict exactly what we're going to do
with every civilization being the order
that the content came out the systems
that were going to be in the game and he
wanted to turn that on its head a little
bit still keeping the same foundation
and that core game Loop but turn on its
head so um I'm basically Ed's right-hand
man when it comes to making sure that
his team has everything they need to get
the game done so the production team
just exists to grease the wheels of
production and make sure that that
everything is progressing forward
removing the roadblocks the whole nine
yards so um yeah we've uh we've been at
this since just before the pandemic and
um it's been exciting it's it's been a
lift because it was a we made a very
very big game it's probably our biggest
release that now I'm pretty sure it's
our biggest release that we've ever done
in terms of a civilization game and uh
really excited to actually be here
showing it to everybody 's in the Next
Room doing interviews now and
um yeah we can't wait for our fans to
actually try it yeah there's a lot of
like just conjecture and hypothesizing
online we love reading that when we go
back to our rooms at night we're like
looking at all the debates going on or
trying to imagine how things are working
super exciting so our play predicting
something already that wasn't actually
shown in the gameplay showcase but that
is actually true oh yeah some stuff
they're actually like figuring out like
what the biggest conversation going on
right now is the separation of leaders
and civs and how you change
civilizations yes and players are
starting to understand that it's it's
not at first when we first announced it
they were like what do you mean you're
just changing civilizations now I'm this
now I'm that and they're starting as
they see more and more of the Articles
and the streamers coming out that it's
not a binary switch it's cultures
merging with each other so now you start
as Egypt and now you've merged with
something else based on the way that
you're playing the game and based on the
way that your people are changing we
talk about it like uh Rome and the way
that there are Roman seeds throughout
the world particularly in Europe woven
into everybody's people everybody has a
little bit throughout their history can
trace it back and find something that
originated back in history that ties
back to Rome and in a lot of places of
the world and that's how he approached
making this game so we see players
starting to Dawn that okay I'm starting
to see what they're thinking here here
but I really have to play it I really
have to see what that feels like and
we're in the same boat we want them to
play it and want them to see what it
feels like so yeah awesome you mentioned
that actually compared to the
predecessors that civilizations can
evolve um and can change one other
feature that was also announced is that
you can now select leaders independently
from civilizations so are there any
limitations except for uh for the
resources and the uh objectives that you
have to fulfill to select leaders so
there's you only have one leader
throughout the game you pick a leader
the AI leaders only have the same leader
throughout the game because that's who
you have the relationship with that's
who you love and hate when you in C six
you start next to manzuma you know
that's going to be a problem the whole
game because he's really aggressive and
that's who you love hate the whole way
through the game it's the same thing
with seven so you have a common foe
that's how you identify each other the
um the limitations that come into place
there's not really limitations starting
out so if I'm chit I can PI from
Antiquity any arange that I want because
we want to give players the idea of role
different historical possibilities
however the game has historical
recommendations when you come in so in
other words if you come in you select
hup suit when it comes to selecting a
civilization you're going to see her
portrait on two of them it says Egypt is
obviously a historical recommendation so
if you're a role player like me I'm
probably going to take Egypt that's
actually my favorite combination when
I'm at the studio not playing a
restricted build I still play hups at
Egypt because I'm a culture Builder and
the Synergy that you have in a
historical pairing is really good nice
um another one example is the other
historical uh in this case geographical
link is AUM because they're just a
little bit further down the Red Sea so
it says well technically you can play as
Egypt but you know let's see if you can
play with this too so that's not a limit
though that's a suggestion to the player
they can try it as some other
combination if they won maybe they've
exhausted playing hat upsuit Egypt after
their you know 10th playr and they're
going to a different combination you
know what I mean um Carl recommended to
me the other day you know you've got
Augustus and you've got you know Rome
but he said you should try Ben Franklin
Rome it's a really powerful combination
so if you're a hardcore player not as
much of a role player but you're looking
at how the Synergy of numbers how the
math comes together the Franklin ability
combined with Rome he said is a lot of
fun and I'm like all right I'll have to
try that um just to see what happens so
it just depends what kind of game a
player wants to play okay so they have
kind of broadening the uh
different types of gameplay that you
allow
okay one other question I that I just
have to ask so in the gameplay showcase
uh we saw this huge library is that
actually part of your office or is that
somewhere outside that would be the most
amazing office ever now that's the
Peabody library in Baltimore um we were
looking for a place to to shoot that and
our art director Jason Johnson suggested
it because he said it's the most amazing
looking Library yeah uh in the area and
um when we saw pictures of it were like
okay yeah that's the place we need to
shoot this yeah it's it's local to us
okay really amazing place to visit yeah
yeah cool you already mentioned this a
little bit but uh yeah a bit of a
personal question maybe uh so what is
your favorite leader in any civilization
game
um right now it actually is still
playing that Hut suit combination in
Civilization 7 my jam in Civilization 6
has been chinchi Wang in China okay um
because I'm a builder and I'm a Wonder
guy I'm a culture player um that was
naturally suited as an AI player they
want all the Wonders as a piece as a
person as a as a human player you want
all the Wonders and he's particularly
Adept at doing that so that's my
favorite play uh games of six if you ask
me to go the whole way back to Civ
5 these all start munging together in my
head I would probably be sitting on Rome
because still good at building yeah
still good at Waring um they have
cultural Pathways with all the roads
they can build if I remembering right I
apologize to the fans if I'm crossing
wires here but after you work on cives
for so many years you start to get your
wires crossed yeah I can imagine but
chinchi hang is burned into my head
because I played so many games as
chinchi Wong in Civilization 6
so yeah what would you say is like the
average length of a civilization 7 round
uh is it similar to previous games and
are there different modes and uh turn
limits um compared to the other games
it's similar in length to civ6 for the
whole campaign all three ages yeah um
each age caps out like Antiquity the
what we just showed you it caps out at
200 turns if nobody's doing anything
right it will go a little bit faster if
people are big accomplishments cuz that
makes the timer go just a little bit
faster for the end of the age but
generally it's about the same length the
cool thing about ages and it's one of
the reasons that Ed decided to go with
an age situation if you remember in civ6
the decision space just gets wider and
wider and wider in a triangle and that
doesn't mean that all the decisions are
interesting so by the late game in C6
you're doing a lot of just like clicking
and benign interesting un interesting
decisions so ages allow us to keep the
decision space about the same because we
have we take some systems out we add
some systems in with each age and we
want to keep the decision space about
the same in each age except there's new
and interesting decisions each time so
like Discovery we feel that in Civ six
as you get to the middle and E game
discover is no longer is interesting in
this one Antiquity you're discovering
your continent in Exploration we unlock
the oceans and you discover other
continents and then modern it's a
different experience so we always want
those decision spaces to be cool
multiplayer
we feel we've opened up because not
everybody has eight hours to play a
multiplayer game inste six um so now you
can play just an age if you want to play
just a modern age experience in
multiplayer you can do that and have a
game wrapped up in anywhere like an hour
and a half to three hours or so playing
on that online speed so you can have
Micro experiences in just playing age
play and multiplayer so that's a a
really cool side effect of that nice one
piece of information that really stuck
with me was that the maximum number of
players uh not only uh differs between
platforms but also between ages I you
already mentioned that um yeah you can
only you can also only play one age if
you want to instead of the whole
campaign y as so was the thought process
maybe also technical limitations between
that kind of led to this de decision
sure um Ed wanted to simulate what the
real world was like at the time um the
new world was undiscovered until the
exploration age that kind of thing and
um there's already going to be civs when
you discover it cuz they get added into
the game they're they're actually
playing the game in the background but
you can't interact with them until you
actually find the common exploration for
example um so when we start I believe
we're supporting eight or 10 I'd have to
clarify that with head I don't remember
off the top of my head because I usually
don't play big games I'm a smaller game
guy that's how I play but um the world
gets bigger you meet more civilizations
as you go through the game and you play
that way so um there's not really any
limitations to that other than map setup
this is a this is an important point
because of the way the game works and
because of the way the oceans are locked
the only thing that we don't have in Civ
6 right now unless you do it in a single
age is the concept of penia yeah because
we want the exploration to go out the
the the idea of finding the new world is
very important to us and and important
to Ed so there always has to be those
core two areas on the map for you to
find you can have you know scattered
Islands you can have different kind of
shapes and really cool stuff but there's
always got to be at least two so there
is some differences there in terms of
how the game
progresses one other thing that is new
uh this time is that you actually
release the game on all platform
simultaneously yes um so how did that
change the development process of the
game it it changes it quite a bit
because before uh when you're dealing
with PC the sky the limit right um this
is the first time that as a team we had
to create you know 1 billion lods levels
of detail on all of our art assets
because we knew that the game also had
to play well on switch you know what I
mean you have to go the whole way down
that rabbit hole to make sure everything
works everywhere so it has changed to
that that hasn't changed the top uh you
can see that in the game we've gone as
high as we can on PC it just changes our
preparation for making sure that we can
go in the other direction our Graphics
team was actually really excited about
this because it gave them the
opportunity and challenge them to create
renders on every single platform because
ctech is a custom engine we're not using
Unreal or something like that we're
using our own Tech so it allowed them to
really dive in and expand what the
engine can actually do so they're
excited about that I also narrated some
uh kind of radicality yeah in the
trailer y the first question was can you
confirm this yeah we uh we introduced
just the uh the concept of sea cliffs
six and we like what that did because it
it created some interesting movement
puzzles and in seven we wanted to
simulate a little more Rivers always
have to flow outward or flow downhill so
we added verticality to the map so that
we can also have a little bit more of
those strategic points that you have to
worry about moving your armies around
Inland as well so you actually have that
where River where where when we do map
generation it's not just this flat
abstract of where rivers go they all
flow downhill we have navigable Rivers
now so we have to actually calculate
that because navigable early nearer the
coast and then they become normal Rivers
further up um so that was all heavily
thought into what we were doing for M
generation though yeah I love that cuz
like rivers are really important history
right and especially now that you're
navigable you bring boats up not just uh
embarking you're actually going to be
able to bring fighting ships up so if
you're looking to penetrate deeper into
a continent and you have support ships
that are coming up it's very cool
awesome do you plan to release a demo
maybe the same one that is showing here
at Gamescom um after Gamescom as well I
don't think we're talking about that yet
okay yeah so civilization is a very
information heavy game so how do you
manage to um keep all of the important
information on the stream without
burying these beautiful stunning Maps
under it um UI was a big lift for us
this time uh we have scalable UI in the
game uh this time before we only had
limited scalling in six for example um
because we have to think through how
console controllers work we have to keep
that in mind that doesn't limit what the
PC has we still have tool tips
everywhere on the map um but at the same
token we only want the UI to be shown
that needs to be shown on the map so
we're not crowding in the the screen at
all times of lots of UI we want to make
sure that that world is there for you to
see so you can scale the UI out and the
tech size out as much as you want as
your tolerance level allows um I wasn't
sure if you got a chance to play the
demo yet not yet but it's all running in
4k so the world is amazing the UI is set
to small text to large so that it keeps
it out of the way you can enjoy the
world it's basically whatever your
tolerance as a player is if you want to
be screen filling and like that that
switch experience where the UI is there
and actually readable you can do that if
you want to push it out of the way you
can do that too okay civilization is a
long game and it's for some new players
it might be a little difficult getting
into it yeah so did that change um
somehow in Civilization 7 are there any
like onboarding things going on
accessibility and onboarding ing was a
huge uh lift for this we uh we did a
version of it in six we had like a
separate tutorial plus we had some
advisers the advisers didn't know how to
communicate directly with the UI in game
so it couldn't point you at buttons or
anything in six so we had limitations we
also found out through Telemetry that
very few people played the Standalone
tutorial because nobody wants to play a
tutorial they want to play the game so
this time around we integrated the
tutorial dynamically into the game
itself and we wrote a system where the
advisers and the UI interact together
and point to this and do this and click
that so we did a big lift for that um so
so far that's been working really great
in terms of handholding yeah the uh the
other nice thing is we have some natural
breaking points um because ages and the
way they're set up they have breathers
so you have a little bit of a shorter
span you don't just have to play blindly
Until you realize oh I lost you know you
have no idea if you're doing well we're
communicating to the player how to do
well if they're doing well and if you
don't care you can ignore it and then
you get to an age at the end of an age
you have a natural breaking point take a
breath regroup come back and go for the
next push so
um it's always critical in a Civ game
that we allow players that are new or
casuals or emotional players to stay up
here not interact with all the complex
death down here they can stay up here
they can build Warriors they can go hit
somebody with sticks until they win or
they lose we want to make sure that's
simple and accessible but when they're
ready all of this depth lives down here
for to Super what they're doing so they
different kinds of lers awesome yeah I
have one last question are there any
other specific features that maybe
weren't shown in the gameplay showcase
that you want to talk
about the CIS system was not shown in
the green play showcase when this went
in earlier this year it was my favorite
thing and I don't know why because it's
a little punishing but it's there for on
a purpose it was Ed's last piece that he
had added to the game ated Beach um
we're modeling as an example Rome you
know the pancake of Rome Rome grows gets
huge new technologies you know
philosophy Golden Age internal crisis um
it can be corruption it can be economic
plague um Barbarians at the gates in
Rome's case split it scattered it to the
wind and um he wanted to model a crisis
system for each age in the game each age
that you're going through is going to
culminate everybody's doing well the a
is doing their thing you're doing your
thing but at the end of the age when
that age ticket ticker ticks down
towards the end those last few turns the
game's going to ask you to slot in a
crisis policy card you have to yeah and
these policy cards represent all
different play Styles usually the first
one is the one that players don't care
about I'm not playing an economic game
so I'm going to take the gold hit and do
that you know minus this much gold for
every city state in your suinos but then
a few turns after that it's going to say
well now you have to do a second one a
few turns after that it's ramping up now
you have to do a third one so you put
that in two off to the side of that is a
worldwide catastrophe that's going to
happen in this case and as an example in
Antiquity Rome's case yeah you're going
to have hostile independent PO is
spawning in the empty space and lashing
out of whoever's closest to them so if
you're not prepared for that if you're
playing a culture game and ignored
military completely you might lose a
couple cities before the age transition
actually happens and you finally get to
breathe having gotten through the crisis
so you always have to be aware of that
as a player that as as you're watching
the age counter turn down that towards
the end of age this is going to happen
and you might have to repare and fortify
for that the first time I played through
it it was a surprise cuz I had read the
design documents but until you play it
and feel it you're like this is really
cool cuz you actually have to be
prepared you and your enemies are
suddenly distracted by something else
you can't just be fighting each other
there's other things that are now
happening so that's a really nice
culmination of the age and like bringing
it all together yes okay perfect well
thank you so much for answering my
questions today absolutely and yeah have
a lot of the games come awesome you too
[Music]
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