THE GREAT BURR BATTLE: Demythologizing the Conical vs Flat Debate

Summary

This video script delves into the debate between cone and flat burrs for coffee grinders, debunking myths about their impact on flavor profiles. The speaker emphasizes that no universal generalization exists, as taste differences depend on specific grinders and their construction, including factors like motor, alignment, and RPM. The script encourages viewers to consider ergonomics, budget, and reputation when choosing a grinder, highlighting the importance of personal preference and experience over broad assumptions.

Takeaways

• 🔍 The debate between cone and flat burrs for coffee grinders is contentious with no definitive answer; it depends on various factors including grinder construction and geometry.
• 👍 The speaker encourages viewers to support the channel through likes and subscriptions, which helps in creating more content.
• 💡 Generalizations that cones always produce a 'chocolatey' taste and flats a 'clear' taste are not accurate; the taste profile depends on the grinder's design and operation.
• 🛠 The performance of a grinder is influenced by its drivetrain, motor, alignment to the axle, and rotation speed, which all affect the coffee's taste.
• 💡 The speaker suggests that one should choose a grinder based on budget, aesthetics, and the reputation of the company, rather than solely on the type of burr.
• 📊 The script mentions that data from particle distribution shows that certain flat burrs can act more like cones, indicating variability in grind profiles.
• 🔄 The difference in RPM can significantly affect particle distribution, with larger shifts occurring between very low and very high RPMs.
• 📉 The script suggests that there is an overlap in the capabilities of cone and flat burrs, with both being able to produce a range of coffee profiles.
• 🔑 The speaker emphasizes that the key to understanding grinders is not in broad generalizations but in the specifics of burr geometry and grinder construction.
• 🌐 The script discusses the importance of pre-breakers, feed rate, and the number of edges on a burr, which all impact the grinding process and coffee taste.
• 🔍 The speaker concludes that bigger burrs do not necessarily mean better coffee, and that smaller, well-optimized burrs can produce excellent results.

Q & A

What is the main topic of the video script?

The main topic of the video script is the comparison between cone burrs and flat burrs in coffee grinders, discussing their differences and dispelling common misconceptions about their impact on coffee taste.

What does the speaker suggest about the relationship between burr type and coffee taste?

The speaker suggests that there is no objective evidence to support the broad generalization that cone burrs always produce more chocolatey coffee and flat burrs always produce clearer coffee. The taste of the coffee depends on various factors including grinder construction, geometry, and other minutiae.

What is the significance of the number of edges on a cone burr?

The number of edges on a cone burr significantly affects the feed rate of the coffee. More edges result in a slower feed rate, which can influence the grinding process and the final coffee taste, especially for lighter roasted coffees.

How does the speaker describe the difference in particle distribution between low and high RPM in grinders?

The speaker explains that varying the RPM from something very low to something very high, such as from 50 to 500 RPM, can result in a big difference in the particle distribution curve, affecting the taste profile of the coffee.

What is the purpose of pre-breakers in both cone and flat burrs?

Pre-breakers in both cone and flat burrs are designed to pre-break the coffee beans before they reach the main cutting or grinding area. This helps to manage the feed rate and the overall grinding process, impacting the final coffee taste.

Why might a flat burr grinder with a larger gap between burrs be more suitable for darker roasted coffees?

A flat burr grinder with a larger gap between burrs can be more suitable for darker roasted coffees because darker coffees are softer and easier to break up, requiring less torque for grinding. A larger gap allows for a faster feed rate, which is beneficial for these types of coffee beans.

What is the potential issue with a grinder having a slow throughput?

A slow throughput can cause coffee grounds to stay inside the burrs for a longer period, leading to more mashing and potentially producing more fines, which can negatively affect the taste of the coffee when brewing for filter methods.

What does the speaker suggest about the correlation between burr size and coffee quality?

The speaker suggests that bigger burrs do not necessarily mean better coffee quality. While larger burrs have more potential due to increased cutting area and surface area, the quality of coffee is more dependent on the alignment, motor stability, and overall grinder construction.

What advice does the speaker give for those looking to upgrade their grinder?

The speaker advises against upgrading based solely on the size of the burr. Instead, they recommend considering factors such as the grinder's construction, motor stability, and user experiences shared in online communities like Facebook groups and Discord channels.

How does the speaker address the subjectivity in coffee grinder preferences?

The speaker acknowledges the subjectivity in coffee grinder preferences by stating that personal taste in coffee and grinder performance can vary greatly. They suggest that finding the right grinder for one's coffee involves trials and relying on user experiences rather than generalizations.

What is the conclusion of the taste test between the Ode and Encore grinders mentioned in the script?

The conclusion of the taste test indicates that there are differences between the coffee produced by the Ode and Encore grinders, but these differences become less pronounced as the coffee cools, suggesting that personal preference and grinder settings play a significant role in the final taste.

Outlines

00:00

🔍 The Debate Over Cone and Flat Burrs

This paragraph introduces the topic of the debate between cone and flat burrs in coffee grinders. The speaker emphasizes the importance of not making broad generalizations about the types of grinds each produces, such as cones being 'chocolatey' and flats being 'clear.' They highlight the influence of various factors like grinder construction, geometry, and motor on the final taste of the coffee. The speaker encourages viewers to consider their budget, aesthetic preferences, and the reputation of the company when choosing a grinder, rather than relying on the hype surrounding certain models.

05:01

🛠️ Understanding Burr Dynamics and Coffee Grinders

The speaker delves into the technical aspects of cone and flat burrs, explaining how the cutting and crushing dynamics differ between the two. They discuss the role of pre-breakers, the number of edges on cone burrs, and how these features affect the feed rate and torque required for grinding. The paragraph also touches on the importance of the grinder's RPM and how it can affect particle distribution, using specific examples like the Niche grinder and the Baratza Sette 270 to illustrate their points. The speaker refutes the idea that bigger burrs are automatically better, emphasizing that performance depends on a multitude of factors.

10:03

📊 The Spectrum of Coffee Flavor Profiles

In this paragraph, the speaker introduces the concept of a 'spectrum' to describe the range of flavor profiles that can be achieved with different grinders. They challenge the common belief that cone burrs produce only 'chocolatey' flavors and flat burrs produce 'clear' or 'tea-like' flavors, suggesting that the reality is more nuanced. The speaker discusses the potential overlap between the two types of burrs in terms of the flavor profiles they can produce and uses specific grinder models to illustrate points on the spectrum, from the chocolatey Eureka Silencio to the clarity-focused SSP Brewer's grinds.

15:03

👁️ The Importance of Grinder Selection and User Experience

The speaker concludes by emphasizing the subjective nature of coffee grinder selection and the importance of personal experience. They caution against relying solely on online arguments and generalizations, which may not be accurate or based on objective evidence. Instead, they recommend joining online communities, such as Facebook groups and Discord channels, to gather user experiences and even try out different grinders. The speaker encourages viewers to find what works best for their preferred coffee style and to approach the topic with an open mind, acknowledging that the 'best' grinder is often a matter of personal preference and specific use cases.

Keywords

💡Cone Burrs

Cone Burrs refer to a type of coffee grinder mechanism where the burrs are cone-shaped. In the video, the speaker discusses the misconception that cone burrs always produce a 'chocolatey' taste profile. The script uses the example of the Niche grinder, which is known for its 63-millimeter conical burrs, to illustrate that the taste profile is not solely determined by the shape of the burrs.

💡Flat Burrs

Flat Burrs are another type of coffee grinder mechanism characterized by flat, disc-shaped burrs. The video script challenges the stereotype that flat burrs inherently produce a 'clear' or 'tea-like' coffee profile. The speaker uses the example of the Eureka Silencio grinder to show that the actual taste profile depends on various factors, not just the shape of the burrs.

💡Ergonomics

Ergonomics in the context of the video refers to the design and usability of the coffee grinders, specifically how the shape and construction of the burrs affect the grinding experience. The script mentions that both cone and flat burrs have different ergonomics, which can influence the coffee's taste due to varying grind mechanics.

💡Grinder Construction

Grinder construction encompasses the overall design and build quality of a coffee grinder, including the motor, alignment to the axle, and rotation speed. The video emphasizes that the taste of the coffee is significantly influenced by these construction elements, rather than just the type of burrs used.

💡Particle Distribution

Particle distribution relates to the range of particle sizes produced by a grinder. The script discusses how varying the RPM (rotations per minute) of the grinder can affect the particle distribution, leading to differences in the taste profile of the coffee. The EG-1 grinder is highlighted as an example where particle distribution can mimic that of cone burrs despite being a flat burr grinder.

💡RPM (Rotations Per Minute)

RPM is a measure of how many times a grinder's burrs rotate per minute. The video script explains that changes in RPM can significantly affect the particle distribution and, consequently, the flavor profile of the ground coffee. For instance, shifting from 50 RPM to 500 RPM can cause noticeable differences in coffee taste.

💡Pre-Breakers

Pre-Breakers are the initial grooves or ridges on the burrs that begin the process of breaking down the coffee beans before they reach the main grinding area. The script describes how the design and number of pre-breakers can affect the feed rate of coffee into the burrs, impacting the grind quality and, by extension, the coffee's taste.

💡Feed Rate

Feed rate is the speed at which coffee beans are fed into the grinding mechanism. The video explains that a faster feed rate can lead to a quicker shatter of the beans, which may not be ideal for lighter roasts. The number of edges or spokes on cone burrs, for example, can determine the feed rate, with fewer spokes leading to larger gaps and faster bean entry.

💡Torque

Torque, in the context of coffee grinding, refers to the rotational force required to turn the burrs against the resistance of the coffee beans. The script mentions that a higher feed rate may require more torque to grind the beans effectively, especially with lighter roasts that are harder and require more force to break down.

💡Finishing Teeth

Finishing teeth are the final part of the grinding process where the coffee beans are finely ground to the desired consistency. The video script describes how the design and size of the finishing teeth can affect the final grind quality, which in turn influences the extraction and flavor of the brewed coffee.

💡Throughput

Throughput refers to the rate at which coffee grounds exit the grinder. The script discusses the importance of efficient throughput to prevent grounds from being over-milled or producing excess fines, which can negatively affect the quality of the brewed coffee. An example given is the DF-83 grinder, where a clogged exit chute can lead to re-grinding and an increase in fines.

Highlights

The debate between cone and flat burrs for grinding coffee is contentious with no objective evidence for broad generalizations.

Different grinders can produce similar results regardless of whether they use cone or flat burrs, depending on construction, geometry, and other factors.

The grinder's performance can vary significantly based on the drivetrain, motor, alignment to the axle, and rotation speed.

The choice of grinder should be based on budget, aesthetics, and reputation rather than the type of burrs used.

The Niche grinder, known for its conical burrs, does not necessarily produce a 'chocolatey' profile as commonly believed.

Particle distribution data shows that flat burrs can sometimes act more like cone burrs, challenging the stereotype.

The impact of RPM on particle distribution is significant, especially when varying from very low to very high speeds.

The perceived profile of coffee ground by cone or flat burrs is not fixed and can overlap significantly.

The Eureka Silencio, a flat burr grinder, is praised for its ability to produce thick, creamy, chocolatey coffees.

High-end grinders like the Baratza Sette 270 and Eureka M3 offer unique grinding characteristics that defy generalizations.

The Weber Key, despite being a flat burr grinder, is reported to provide more clarity than expected, possibly due to variable RPM.

Hand grinders with cone burrs, like the Easy Presto ZP6, can achieve high clarity due to their slow RPM and burr interaction.

The number of edges on cone burrs dictates the feed rate, affecting the grinding process and the resulting coffee.

Conical and flat burrs have different dynamics in cutting and crushing coffee beans, affecting the final taste.

The design of flat burrs, including pre-breakers and finishing teeth, can greatly influence the grind quality and coffee flavor.

The throughput of coffee in burrs and the time beans spend inside can affect the amount of fines produced.

Bigger burrs do not automatically equate to better performance; smaller, well-aligned burrs can produce excellent coffee.

Upgrading to a bigger grinder may not necessarily improve coffee quality and should be based on specific needs and preferences.

The Odes Brew and Encore's Brew were chosen for a taste test to illustrate the differences between popular flat and conical grinders.

The taste test results suggest that as grind size gets coarser, the differences between grinders become less pronounced.

Online arguments about grinders are often based on speculation and confirmation bias rather than objective evidence.

Recommendation to join online communities for user experiences and to try different grinders to find the best fit for personal taste.

Transcripts

today we embark on a most contentious

topic which is better cone burrs

or flatburs

[Music]

now before we continue on I'd ask that

you would take a moment and hit the like

and the Subscribe if you've seen my

content before and you enjoy it doing

something simple like that really helps

the channel helps me create more content

helps me do more education more product

reviews more

tutorials things like that I also have

patreon down below that you can check

out but anyway let's move on so today's

video I want to just chat briefly about

the differences between cones and flats

I see all the time on forums online

people kind of lopping these massive

statements into one of these types of

Burrs like cones are always going to be

more chocolatey than Flats flats are

always going to be more clear than cones

and that's simply not the case there is

no objective evidence to Showcase

something that broadly generalized so

whenever you say Flats have a certain

profile cones have a certain profile

that's not true both of them have

incredibly different ergonomics both of

them were going to show up differently

in different Grinders based off the

drivetrain the motor the alignment to

the axle the rotation speed all of these

different things contribute to how the

coffee is going to taste you can have

flats that taste like cones you can have

cones that taste like Flats it all

depends on how the grinder is

constructed how the geometry is and a

lot of the other minutia that contribute

to the grounds coming out of your

grinder get whatever's in your budget

what looks nice to you and what you

think has a good reputation as a company

because you're going to want something

that you don't have to Tinker when you

begin but what I can assure you is there

it's not as simple as cones equals

chocolate Flats equals Clarity for

instance there is a lot of hype

surrounding something like the niche

grinder they say it's very chocolatey

because it's cones it's 63 millimeter

Coney bursts in reality I've had better

cone style shots from a lot of flat

bursts for instance I got a pair out

here these are the base bursts from the

eg1 now I know you're like well that's

really expensive if you're comparing

that to the niche there are others in a

similar price range but this is a really

really unique situation I've gotten to

see some of the data from the particle

distribution of this and these actually

act more like cones than they do flats

and what I mean by that is because of

the Dynamics of cutting and crushing in

Converse when you vary the RPM from

something really low to something really

high say 50 rpm up to 500 RPM you're

going to have a big difference in the

distribution of that curve smaller RPM

changes has been shown to not be as big

of a deal Dr smirk was just telling me

on the Weber key between 50 and 150 they

didn't see many much difference but

there is much more difference between

say 50 and 500 you have bigger shifts in

the particle distribution as shown on

the eg1 with this between 500 and 1500

RPM with these Burrs in a similar way

you have those same types of shifts with

cone bursts now a lot of the flat burs

that I've seen the data is not similar

to this corber or this baseboard from

Weber normally what you see is the same

distribution just shifting along the

coarseness and fineness linear Spectrum

even when I say things like that I'm

assuming that cones give a certain

profile and flats give a certain profile

which aren't necessarily the truth I'm

going to speak in terms of a linear

Spectrum here all right so instead of

like a boethian Eternal now where

everything's kind of convoluted we're

going to talk in terms of a spectrum

like Everlasting time when we're talking

philosophy of time we're talking

beginning and end okay so on this end

we're going to say is chocolatey body

the Blended flavors on this and we're

talking Clarity we're talking tea like

bodies we're talking florals aromatics

so let's say that we have this

hypothetical Spectrum now oftentimes

people say cones make up this end Flats

make up this end you have for instance

some of the Eureka Grinders like the

silencio can be about right here it's

very chocolatey very coating I think it

has incredible espresso shots I prefer

that to a lot of the hyped Grinders

under a thousand dollars when it comes

to traditional style of espresso I think

it does a great job with thick body

creamy body chocolatey coffees so that's

like here on this full spectrum all the

way over here you also have flats that's

the only things in my opinion that can

kind of get here are something like the

Brewers from SSP or the unimodal

multi-purpose type verse from SSP you

have all the way over here so I think

Flats can kind of fit that whole

Spectrum in my experience I don't find

that cones actually can but I do think

cones can get about to this part of the

spectrum they cover all of that kind of

chocolatey you know thicker body type

stuff but they can also get into the

brighter Clarity depending on the Burrs

depending on the geometry I have not

used a Weber key but I've heard a lot of

people say they actually give more

clarity than they would like I think a

big part of that is because of the

variable RPM going down all the way to

50. I know people know with hand

Grinders you can get some really nice

Clarity from hand Grinders that have

cone bursts like the easy Presto zp6 and

a lot of that is that really slow RPM

and how the Burrs interact with the

coffee so you're able to get more

clarity from these types of Grinders and

in fact I would put the zp6 pretty in

the pretty much in the high Clarity area

what you have though is a higher

concentration of flats live over here a

higher concentration of cones live over

here but there is a lot of overlap I

would argue that this conical grinder

has more clarity and filter bruise than

the Eureka silencio in this situation

this one has more clarity and is more

tea like and is more floral and more

aromatic than this is granted as a cool

and the coarser you go the closer

they're going to get

[Music]

foreign so let's take a quick moment and

just take a look at what a cone Burr

looks like because the Dynamics of

what's going on the cutting the crushing

and all of that very different between

this and a flat bur so what you have

here is you have the cone and you have

the collar that sits on top just like so

now as you see all of these grooves

right here are going to dictate the feed

rate of the coffee going into the Burrs

we call those pre-breakers so what

they're doing is they're pre-breaking

the coffee before it gets down further

into the burst set itself so what we

have here is a heptagonal bur meaning

there are seven edges here seven sides

just like so and then we have these

grooves in the sides so a bean will go

down and as this is turning okay as that

is turning it will cause tension between

the wall the small entries here and will

cause the beam to kind of crack and as

it continues to be fed down through

gravity and and the centrifugal force

and the other forces at play as it feeds

further down it goes through more and

more phases of cutting until it gets

down to crushing okay so you have the

finishing teeth down here that are

really forcing it to come out of a small

Gap so when we're changing grind size

we're moving this Burr or the collar

depending on the mechanism itself inside

the grinder up or down and that's

dictating how much of an aperture there

is for the coffee to squeeze through and

that's going to dictate the grind size

some Grinders like the brats acetate

they actually spin the cut the collar

around the cone so there are different

dynamics that play there as well as

we're looking at this one of the big one

of the big things to understand is the

amount of edges here dictate heavily the

feed rate of the coffee going in a

faster feed rate would mean less of

these spokes so let's say for instance

you had five of these spokes as opposed

to seven you would have a faster feed

rate because the gaps between each spoke

would be bigger so beans can fit through

faster what this would mean is you would

need more torque to grind it if you're

using a lighter coffee a lot of times

for darker coffees you would want

something like that because you can

grind faster darker coffees are a lot

softer they're a lot easier to break up

but what can happen is if you're using

something like a pyptagon cone with a

light roasted coffee the feed rates

really fast it's going to cause too

quickly of a shatter and you're going to

have a lot more torque in order to push

through that which is a bit harder with

a hand grinder or even on a motor of a

typical grinder that's why for instance

a lot of the built-in Breville Grinders

aren't ideal for lightly roasted coffees

they have that five spoke and not really

enough torque to take care of it and in

my testing and in my time doing coffee

it seems that there tends to be a

correlation between more spokes is

better for lighter roasted coffees and

vice versa then when we look inside the

collar here we have initially kind of

angles like so until it goes straight

down for that finishing teeth so what we

have is that initial cracking and

cutting and then it goes down to that

final cutting phase so I guess I guess I

kind of mix those terms up initially you

do actually have crushing and then you

have the final cutting phase so that's

kind of the terminology used in grinding

is you have the crush and then you have

the cut with the finalization so we also

have here an 83 millimeter monster burn

as you see because it's a much bigger

Burr there are a lot more pre-breakers

here to slow down the feed rate if we

kept a heptagonal design with something

this big you would jam every grinder

ever because it cannot accept the feed

that quick it would go straight to the

finishing teeth and that would take a

lot of torque so with Flats you have

something very similar all the same

terminology but what we're doing is two

discs that are faced to each other early

on you had something like the ek-43 that

was a spice grinder you would drop beans

into a hole here and there would be an

auger that would feed at varying speeds

depending on which auger you got it

would feed the beans into the Burrs

themselves so there would be something

opaque here to disallow beans going

anywhere else except inside these Burrs

and as they're spinning what you'll see

is you'll see there's a gap here and so

we have the same idea with pre-breakers

we have these ridges here that are at

varying angles depending on the burst

that you have and they're going to crush

the beans at different ways so there's

different tension points different

stress points different fracture points

that are going to cause differences

between the coffees that are being

ground in it so as it's spinning it's

causing Central Fugal Force so if it's

vertical cool if it's horizontal it

doesn't really matter it's the majority

Factor at play a centrifugal force which

is allowing the pre-break of the beans

with these larger gaps here and then

they go to What's called the finishing

teeth now there are times you'll have

one or two or three phase Burrs so

something that would be more of a one I

guess it would be more of a two-phase

burr would be something like this a

bruber from SSP as you see there aren't

really pre-breakers you go straight to

these cutting teeth into the finishing

teeth so with this one you can you

should not really do with darker roasted

coffees in my opinion uh this is more so

for lighter roasted coffees it's a

really slow feed rate as you can imagine

because when these two birds are

together the Gap is a lot different than

whenever you have these deeper grooves

on something like this when you put

these two together there's a much bigger

space for beans to funnel in a lot more

readily so that's going to cause a much

more aggressive pre-break to make the

grinding process easier so Burrs like

this would require a lot less torque

than something like this or even

something like this

these have just these two big fins right

here which act as one pre-breaker so you

just have just there and then as you see

they have exaggerated teeth like here

and you have exaggerated finishing teeth

these are the pre-2015 ek43 SSP Burrs so

you have differences as as you see here

and the amount of pre-breakers and the

amount of curvature on that entries

which dictates the feed rate you have

differences on the sides of the

secondary cutting and you have

differences on the finishing teeth you

have differences on ridges on the edges

which can also dictate the throughput of

the coffee which shows how long the

coffee stays in there so something else

that people don't really think about is

with with some of these Grinders you

have diff varying times the beans stay

inside the Burrs so the longer beans or

grounds stay inside these burns the more

they're going to get mashed up the more

potential fines so for instance an issue

on a grinder like the df-83 is the exit

Chute tends to get a bit clogged and it

doesn't allow coffee to escape readily

so grounds get caught up and get

re-ground and re-ground and what happens

is you get a lot more fines when brewing

for filter so you want to have a quick

throughput you want to make sure that

your Chute is cleaned out if you're

figuring out that you're getting a lot

of fines on a certain grinder make sure

that it's escaping readily we don't

really know about Burrs it's important

to know that everything is just kind of

in the air right now so we can work with

what we've got and we can do the best we

can but I'm sure in the future a lot of

the things I say is going to be proven

wrong until now these are kind of

working theories so often people are

thinking bigger equals better I think

this is falling to the same fallacy as

kona's chocolate flat as Clarity just

because you have a 98 millimeter Burr

does not mean it's automatically better

than an 80 millimeter Burr or a 58

millimeter Burr I think there is

something to be said about bigger has a

higher potential in the same way I think

Flats have a higher potential to create

more clarity than cones you could buy a

cheap big bird grinder and it produce a

lot worse coffee than something like

this or something like this it really

depends on a multitude of factors it's

not clear-cut bigger does not equal

better I would argue again bigger equals

more potential there's more cutting area

there's more surface area to kind of

play with different cuts there's more

retail space to mess around with if you

perfect a 58 millimeter Burr and you're

getting incredible coffee because you

have a hyper aligned a grinder that has

a robust motor that is not going to vary

on RPM during The Cutting process then

that might be as good as it's going to

get until we can optimize the bigger

Burrs so for all of you watching out

there considering to upgrading to

whatever is the next biggest thing don't

worry about it that is not a fear right

now now if you're in the minutia that

really you're wanting that extra two or

three percent of coffee you're wanting

to unlock or even 10 because we're

probably hitting only 80 or 90 with

typical coffees typical Grinders and

whatnot if you're wanting that final bit

of percent sure you can go ahead and

continue to upgrade to bigger and bigger

and bigger again in my experience bigger

does not necessarily mean better

[Music]

thank you

foreign

[Music]

these three are the Odes Brew these

three are the encore's Brew now I chose

these two because I think they're pretty

indicative of very popular Grinders in

the home the fellow ode has been a very

popular grinder ever since its release

and it is kind of a stereotypical flat

bur kind of coffee kind of grinder in

there I do have the multi-purpose Burrs

inside to optimize the kind of clarity

that people say the flat Birds bring to

the table over here I have the Encore

which has been the most the highest

selling Grinder like ever in the US

um and sells a decent amount around the

world but it gives solid bruise with

this is the one the newer one the ESP so

this has the um the M tubers which are

in the virtuoso the ones with markings

on the bottom are the ode the ones with

nothing on the bottom are the Encore so

misophonia trigger do not watch if you

don't like Slurpee noises because it's

about to it's about to be slurped town

in the city we built this city on

slurping coffees

sometimes it goes down the wrong pipe

come on it cool for one second I'm gonna

go one through one more through I'm

making a switch so let's see all right

all right all right I got one wrong my

second guess screwed me over everyone so

the ones I switched were the uh wrong

ones so I got two of three on both not

bad but there are ways to optimize your

grinder regardless of it being conical

or flat regardless of the type of

conical and the type of flat um what I

found out when I was doing all the

particle size distributions for hand

Grinders is the coarser you went the

more unimodal every hand grinder became

and at one point they almost all equaled

out at around a thousand to 1200 microns

they're very close to being all equaled

out with a really small find some and a

really big um you know modality so this

taste test is more so to show you that

if you have a Comber grinder or

something that's more muddy even with a

flat the coarser you go the less fines

will be produced for the most part when

they were hot the or aromatics on this

were much higher But as time went on and

they cooled I started to get confused

because the acidity really started to

pop here and they tasted it a lot more

equal so whereas these were a bit more

Blended especially at their hottest and

even into the cool they still tasted a

bit more Blended I think what was going

on is the two I was mixed up on had

lower volume so they're both really cool

in relation to the others but over time

they do equalize just just a little bit

there are differences between flats and

Cones don't get me wrong but you have to

be much more specific on which Flats

you're using which cones are you using I

keep seeing people getting arguments

online about these great generalizations

that are just not necessarily steeped in

anything accurate or in reality at all

it's just in shared experiences which

granted is all we really have to work on

right now until more science is done and

more testing is done in order to figure

out more objective connections but until

then we need to be make sure that we

understand all of this is kind of not

proven tldw too long didn't watch let me

give you a quick little summary there is

no actual generalization we can

accurately give to a cone or a flat we

have to be much more specific we have to

talk about grinder we have and even when

we talk about grinder when we talk about

the Burr geometry itself we're still

going based off of experience so maybe

there's a collective understanding of a

certain bird tasting a certain way but

even that is not objective it's very

subjective so take everything you see

online with a grain of salt but that

being said if you're looking to upgrade

your grinder if you're looking into a

specific style of grinder if you're like

just tell me what I need to get for the

most chocolatey espresso just tell me

what I need to get for the most clear

espresso you're going to be relying on

speculation and you're going to be

relying on confirmation bias you're

going to be relying on people proud of

the amount of money they've spent on a

grinder and they don't want to be told

that they're wrong there are Cults

following certain Grinders it's insane I

have a certain style of coffee I enjoy

and there are certain Grinders and birds

that I gravitate towards it's going to

take trials in order to find what you

enjoy and what makes your coffee shine

in the way that you want it to shine so

I would recommend using Facebook there

are groups for most of the manufacturers

out there I'm in a group with for option

O's for malcolonics from lalits for

breville's for all these things so I can

kind of see user experiences of these

Grinders and see what they're saying

when I'm doing my own kind of testing to

make sure I look for certain things so I

would suggest getting on Facebook

joining some of those groups get on

Discord there are lots of big coffee

groups where they have threads of

different brands and manufacturers you

can go on there and ask hey is anyone

the DC area that can let me borrow this

grinder or that I can come and see this

grinder out if you want to then you

should have put a ring on it if you want

a Ninja put a ring on it

I don't know what I'm doing all right I

love you all I hope you brew something

tasty today and cheers