Devon Canup reveals his most profitable faceless YouTube channels

Summary

In this interview, Devon addresses skepticism about his claim of earning over $1.5 million with faceless YouTube channels. He shares insights into the challenges of revealing his channels publicly due to past demonetization and the competitive nature of the industry. Devon discusses the importance of niche selection, content sourcing, and the role of creativity in YouTube success. He emphasizes the value of long-format content for revenue and provides tips on avoiding common mistakes, such as rushing the ideation process or not emulating successful strategies granularly. The conversation offers a candid look into the world of faceless YouTube channels and the strategies behind their profitability.

Takeaways

• 😀 Devon made over $1.5 million with faceless YouTube channels, which sparked skepticism and criticism from some viewers.
• 🔍 Devon addressed the criticism by showing actual channels making six figures per year, but did not disclose specific channel names to protect them from potential malicious actions.
• 🚫 In the past, Devon's channels faced demonetization by YouTube due to grey-area content, leading to a significant drop in income.
• 🤫 The anonymity of faceless channels helps Devon avoid revealing his business operations publicly and protects the channels from being targeted.
• 📈 Devon's revenue example shows one channel made over $650,000 and another with 188 million views in a year made about $108,000.
• 🎯 Success in YouTube niches can vary greatly and depends on factors like audience trust and the type of content being produced.
• 🛑 Devon emphasized the importance of sourcing content legally to avoid copyright issues, which can lead to channel shutdowns.
• 💡 To avoid copyright strikes, Devon suggested studying successful channels in the niche, understanding the content sources, and applying best practices for transformative use.
• 📚 The production workflow involves separate roles for sourcing footage, writing scripts, and editing, with tools like Trello for project management.
• 🌐 Devon hires editors from different regions due to cost efficiency, but this requires careful quality control to ensure cultural relevance in the content.
• 🔑 The key to success in creating faceless YouTube channels is long-term commitment, learning from successful examples, and adapting strategies over time.

Q & A

How much money did Devon claim to have made with his faceless YouTube channels?

Devon claimed to have made over $1.5 million with his faceless YouTube channels.

Why was Devon initially hesitant to show his faceless YouTube channels publicly?

Devon was hesitant because in the past, when he became well-known for running faceless channels, he faced an influx of competitors and his channels were demonetized, causing a significant drop in his income.

What was the impact of Devon's viral video on his faceless YouTube channels?

The viral video led to a rapid increase in competitors within his niche and eventually resulted in his channels being demonetized, drastically reducing his monthly earnings.

How did Devon address the skepticism from people who doubted his success with faceless YouTube channels?

Devon addressed the skepticism by showing actual revenue numbers from his YouTube channels, proving that they are indeed making six figures per year.

What is the typical revenue pattern for a successful YouTube channel according to Devon's experience?

According to Devon, a typical successful YouTube channel follows the 80/20 rule, where 20% of the videos make 80% of the revenue.

How does Devon source footage for his YouTube channels without running into copyright issues?

Devon hires people to find clips and ensures they are resourceful in sourcing content that doesn't violate copyright laws. He emphasizes the importance of using content strategically and being aware of the content's ownership.

What is Devon's strategy for dealing with potential copyright claims on his YouTube channels?

Devon adopts a long-term perspective, acknowledging that channels may get taken down but can be easily replaced. He focuses on creating new channels rather than worrying about individual channel losses.

What are some best practices Devon suggests for avoiding copyright issues when sourcing content for YouTube?

Devon suggests studying the biggest channels in the niche to understand where they get their clips, using overlays or color grading to transform the content, and ensuring the content is transformative rather than just reposting others' work.

How does Devon structure the production workflow for his YouTube channels?

Devon structures the workflow by having separate roles for sourcing footage, writing scripts, and editing. He uses project management tools like Trello and Google Docs to manage the process and ensure quality control.

What is Devon's approach to hiring editors for his YouTube channels?

Devon hires editors from locations where there is a cost advantage, such as the Middle East and Eastern Europe. He ensures they are good at their job by conducting rigorous interviews and testing their skills through a trial period with a reduced rate.

What advice does Devon give to people starting out with faceless YouTube channels regarding the idea selection process?

Devon advises spending a significant amount of time studying content within a niche to understand the market opportunities. He emphasizes the importance of finding a niche and content format that feels right for the individual, rather than jumping into a trend that doesn't align with their interests or values.

Outlines

00:00

🤔 Addressing Skepticism on YouTube Success

The speaker, Devon, returns to address skepticism about his claim of earning over $1.5 million from faceless YouTube channels. He explains his initial openness about his channels and the backlash that led to increased competition and demonetization. Devon shares his revenue figures to prove his success and discusses the challenges of revealing too much information online due to potential malicious intent. He emphasizes the importance of anonymity in protecting his business interests.

05:01

📈 Navigating the Dynamics of YouTube Niches

Devon delves into the intricacies of different YouTube niches, explaining how some, like history, have established brands that are hard to compete with, while others may be more open. He discusses the concept of 'crossing the chasm' in business, where early adopters and skeptics create a gap between the pioneers of a niche and the mass audience. Devon also touches on the 80/20 rule in channel revenue, where a small percentage of videos generate the majority of income.

10:01

🛠️ Sourcing Content Safely for YouTube Channels

The speaker outlines the process of sourcing content for YouTube channels without falling into legal issues. He emphasizes the importance of hiring resourceful people to find clips and the challenges of ensuring that sourced content does not lead to copyright strikes. Devon discusses the unpredictability of YouTube's copyright ID system and shares best practices for avoiding copyright issues, such as using content from established media companies and modifying clips to avoid detection.

15:04

💻 The Workflow Behind Creating YouTube Content

Devon describes the production workflow for creating YouTube content, including sourcing footage, writing scripts, and editing. He explains the division of labor among different roles and the importance of using project management tools like Trello for organization. The speaker also discusses the process of quality control to ensure cultural relevance and accuracy in the content, especially when working with editors from different cultural backgrounds.

20:06

🌐 Finding and Testing Skilled YouTube Editors

The speaker shares his strategy for finding and testing editors for YouTube content. He discusses the use of platforms like Upwork and the importance of conducting rigorous interviews to find reliable and skilled editors. Devon also explains the policy of paying half-rate for the initial videos to ensure the quality of the editor's work before committing to a full partnership.

25:06

💡 The Role of Creativity in YouTube Success

Devon challenges the notion that creativity is essential for YouTube success. He argues that success comes from identifying and replicating successful formats rather than coming up with original ideas. The speaker suggests that the creativity lies in the execution of a concept within a proven format, and that the best YouTubers are those who can effectively plug trends into these formats.

30:09

🚀 Key Factors in Successful Faceless YouTube Channels

The speaker identifies the key factors that differentiate successful faceless YouTube channels from those that fail. He emphasizes the importance of playing the long game, having a large addressable market, and being adaptable. Devon also discusses the mindset of successful creators, who are open to learning and not hindered by ego or the need for short-term results.

35:09

🧐 The Broad Appeal of Faceless YouTube Channels

Devon discusses the wide range of people involved in creating faceless YouTube channels, from individuals with physical limitations to older professionals looking for retirement options. He highlights the accessibility of YouTube as a platform that allows anyone, regardless of background or social skills, to create and monetize content.

40:10

📱 The Impact of YouTube Shorts on Channel Growth

The speaker considers the role of YouTube Shorts in channel growth, concluding that while Shorts can drive traffic, long-format content is more lucrative due to its ability to generate platform time. Devon suggests that Shorts are best used to build brand recognition rather than revenue, and that the real money lies in creating content that keeps viewers on the platform for longer periods.

❗️ Common Mistakes in Creating YouTube Content

Devon outlines the top mistakes made by new YouTube creators, including rushing the ideation process, emulating poor success, and not going granular enough in studying what makes successful videos work. He advises creators to spend time understanding the market, focus on what works, and reverse engineer successful videos to create their own content.

🔍 The Importance of Granular Success Analysis

The speaker emphasizes the need for detailed analysis of successful videos, including understanding the nuances of titles, thumbnails, intros, and content structure. Devon suggests that creators should aim to emulate the top-performing videos and consider what elements are missing in their own content compared to successful ones.

📘 How to Get Started with Faceless YouTube Channels

In conclusion, Devon offers advice for those interested in starting faceless YouTube channels, suggesting they follow him on social media and subscribe to his newsletter for guidance. He reiterates the importance of learning from successful channels and finding the right niche and approach for one's own content.

Keywords

💡Faceless YouTube Channels

Faceless YouTube Channels refer to YouTube channels that do not reveal the identity of the creators, focusing on content rather than personal branding. In the video, Devon discusses how he has successfully monetized such channels, which has been a point of skepticism for some, as they questioned the legitimacy of his claims due to the anonymous nature of these channels.

💡Revenue

Revenue in this context is the income generated from the YouTube channels. Devon clarifies the doubts about his earnings by showing actual revenue figures from his channels, emphasizing the financial success achieved through his faceless YouTube strategy.

💡Demonetization

Demonetization on YouTube occurs when a channel loses its ability to earn revenue from advertisements. Devon mentions that his earlier channels were demonetized, which drastically reduced his income, leading him to adapt and create new channels that comply with YouTube's policies.

💡Niche

A niche refers to a specific segment of the market that has particular interests or needs. Devon talks about the importance of choosing the right niche for a YouTube channel and how different niches have varying levels of trust and acceptance among viewers, which can affect the channel's success.

💡Content Ideation

Content ideation is the process of creating and developing ideas for new content. Devon emphasizes the importance of finding the right idea for a YouTube channel and warns against rushing this process, as the idea is crucial for the channel's success and monetization potential.

💡Resourcefulness

Resourcefulness is the ability to find quick and clever ways to overcome difficulties. Devon values resourceful people in his team who can source content effectively for his YouTube channels, as it is crucial for creating videos without running into copyright issues.

💡Copyright

Copyright refers to the legal rights that protect original works of authorship. The video discusses strategies to avoid copyright infringement when sourcing footage for YouTube videos, as using copyrighted material without permission can lead to legal issues and channel strikes.

💡Transformative Content

Transformative content is a term used to describe new works that use existing copyrighted material in a way that adds new expression or meaning. Devon mentions that YouTube looks for transformative content, which is a key strategy for avoiding copyright claims on his channels.

💡Ego

Ego, in this context, refers to an inflated sense of self-importance that can hinder learning and growth. Devon points out that people with big egos who think they know everything are less likely to succeed because they may not be open to learning new strategies or accepting advice.

💡Consistency

Consistency in the context of YouTube refers to the regular production and uploading of videos. Devon mentions that many people give up too soon and do not maintain consistency, which is crucial for building an audience and increasing revenue over time.

💡YouTube Shorts

YouTube Shorts is a feature that allows creators to upload short, vertical videos. Devon discusses the impact of YouTube Shorts on channel growth and monetization, noting that while they can attract viewers, long-format content is more lucrative in terms of ad revenue.

Highlights

Devon addresses criticism and skepticism about his claim of earning over $1.5 million with faceless YouTube channels.

He explains his initial reluctance to share his channels publicly due to past experiences with rapid competition and demonetization.

Devon shares actual revenue figures from his channels, one having made over $650,000 and another with $108,000 in a year.

The importance of niche selection and understanding the market's trust dynamics is discussed.

Devon talks about the challenges of content sourcing and copyright issues, emphasizing the need for resourceful employees.

He mentions the use of various techniques to avoid copyright strikes, such as video overlays and changing color grading.

The interview covers the production workflow, from sourcing footage to scripting and editing.

Devon discusses finding and vetting editors, including using platforms like Upwork and conducting rigorous interviews.

The concept of 'transformative content' is introduced as a strategy to avoid copyright claims on YouTube.

The interviewee emphasizes the importance of long-format content for generating revenue over short-form content like YouTube Shorts.

Devon shares his view on the distinction between playing the 'Fame game' versus the 'Wealth game' on YouTube.

The interview delves into the mindset required for success, highlighting the pitfalls of short-term thinking and ego.

Devon discusses the diversity of people creating faceless channels, from young creators to older individuals looking for retirement options.

The interviewee provides advice on avoiding common mistakes, such as rushing the ideation process and not emulating successful strategies.

The importance of granular analysis of successful videos is stressed, including studying thumbnails, intros, and content structure.

Devon concludes with an offer to help those interested in creating faceless YouTube channels through his social media and newsletter.

Transcripts

so a few months back I interviewed Devon

on how he made over $1.5 million with

faceless YouTube channels there were a

lot of comments like ninjas here that

thought he was lying and full of crap so

I brought him back on to address the

criticism and pull back the curtain and

show his actual channels that are making

six figures per year so let's do it

Devon dude pump for round two of this so

like I showed opening up this video some

of the comments were uh we have some

doubters in the room so to speak so let

to kind of reiterate some of these uh

someone said not sharing his channel

should be reported for lying something

doesn't add up extraordinary claims but

doesn't show proof like when when people

say stuff like this uh first off like

why why are you hesitant to to show like

these faceless YouTube channels that are

making a ton of money back in the day

you know I this isn't my necessarily

first go around with uh publicity and

having a bunch of people know that I run

faceless channels back in the day I was

very uh I was very open about it

and I you know people saw the channels

that I had and I had a video that went

viral that got a few hundred thousand

views of me talking about it and then

overnight I think we went from having

like 20 competitors in the niche that I

knew very personally like I talked with

all of them and stuff to where we had I

think we were getting like a 100 a day

after this interview kind of like after

this content went out there and so it

went from and back in the day too I was

kind of doing a little bit more gray

area content like we figured out how to

like make a soft make all the videos and

we were just making way too much money

for how old I was at the time but uh it

got to a point where it got so big and

everyone knew about it that I don't know

maybe someone at YouTube or something

heard about it and they basically like

made it so people couldn't do those

channels anymore and they demonetized

all of them and so I went from making

like $70,000 a month down to like $3,000

a month and so I share with people what

channels I do I'm just not like hey

here's my YouTube channel this is the

exact Channel that I made $600,000 to

$600,000 on out to like 100,000 people

just anonymously just because I don't

know like some people could send like

you know I have a good personality I

believe in like Karma do good to others

so you can receive good to yourself but

uh you never know so what someone's

intentions are they could have like

10,000 people go like report the video

and then crush and kill the channel too

you know people like people could have

malicious intents and stuff so I have no

idea so I just I you know I don't the

reason why I do faceless YouTube

channels is so I don't have to have

people know what I what my business is

all the time um you know I have some

channels that I'm a little bit more

vocal about if you want to go on my

website you can go actually it doesn't

take that much work to go find them I'll

will say that if you want to know what

channels I run it'll take you 20 seconds

to go find out what I do I just don't I

don't uh I don't I don't just publicly

try to say it out to like 50,000 100,000

people this is what I do can you share

any of the revenue stuff for any of the

channels yeah so this is one channel

right here I just have it zoomed in on

the revenue at least just you know you

guys can see what's going on and over

the revenue tab you can see we started

this thing around like I think July of

2020 uh and then now it's made over like

just about

$650,000 so far off of this channel um

and then here's another channel it's

done almost 188 million views just this

year and you can see this year it's done

about $108,000 and this is one we kind

of

started we started up mainly in kind of

like November last year October November

so

between those two uh it looked like the

the first one it took a lot longer to

kind of get up and running if we kind of

look at that that kind of view chart or

even the revenue chart uh is that pretty

typical is it is it kind of like hit or

miss on kind of how fast one of these

gets takes off or is there is it more

formulaic or what it depends on the

niche and like the industry that the

channel is in so those two channels

actually I showed you both the the

travel one is kind of a little bit of

the same as well uh yeah the second one

I showed you the thing is is there

certain demographics there certain

people that are very like not trusting

of the information in certain nches like

if you think about

it for let's say like an industry like

history you know it's like there's a lot

of garbage out there and it takes a

little bit for people to catch on and be

like Oh yeah this is the brand and if

you like understand kind of the

different types of markets if you've

ever read the book or heard the book

crossing the chasm I forget who it's by

but it's like a classic Business book

where there's always like the there's

the Pioneers in the there's the Pioneers

for the the industry there's the first

movers and then there's this huge Chasm

you have to cross that is the mass

audiences which is like the early

adopters and then you have the Skeptics

on the back half of it and so some

niches the early

adopters are kind of hard to like tap

into for like kind of more just like old

school you know know like for if you're

in like the history Niche you know

there's a History Channel they've been

around for years people just trust them

with their history knowledge and going

and listening to those like the people

that get into that market there's just a

lot of trust in the brands that are

there and it's just like they're not

very like oh I want to watch other stuff

people are comfortable with watching

their type of content that's in front of

them and so certain niches that are a

little bit more like just you know aged

I would say uh they take a little bit

longer to get into so you know like some

of my niches that were're in like

history space travel uh even Tech

techology Sometimes some of those

they're just like very uh Evergreen and

so they take a little bit to kind of get

that like that fire started but once the

fire is going it's a very slow burn like

people are watching the videos for like

the second Channel I showed you we

haven't had a

single uh video get over like 20,000

views in the last three

months but the channel still makes like

$15,000 a month 95% of the revenue is

from videos that are like older than

like 6 months on that Channel and so do

do does a channel typically fall into

the 8020 role where 20% of the videos

make 80% of the

revenue yeah yeah yeah I would say so

yeah you can definitely apply paro's

principle to it so kind of you mentioned

Like A History Channel uh meaning

YouTube channel and that brought up one

of the the questions that someone left

on YouTube was like how do you Source

footage for this stuff right so if you

have a a channel and it's about history

right you obviously you have seems like

maybe two options you can either uh

animate what's the thing about history

or you can show footage from the event

in history which obviously we're not

there filming the [ __ ] so we got to get

it from somewhere and we don't want to

get these channels are meant to be

business assets and make money not get

taken down for copyright strikes and

stuff like that so like how do you

Source this footage so that you don't

fall into any of these like legal issues

I have no idea I really don't cuz the

way that I do it is I just hire people

to go find the clips and if they can't

go find the clips then I just go find

somebody else it's just it's their it's

their job application I guess to work

for me is in order to work for me you

have to go find the stuff and if you

can't find it then you're obviously not

going to be a very uh what's the word

that I'm looking for like a

very resourceful person yeah yeah you're

just not resourceful I want resourceful

people working with me you know it's one

of my company values or one of my values

is that I work with resourceful people I

don't like to work with people people

have to tell them exactly what to do all

the time so and I don't like to

micromanage people so the way that I do

it is I just tell people to go find it

so now I know not everybody has that

luxury

or how do you prevent those how do you

prevent those people from uh like

sourcing clips and using them in your

videos that end up getting your channel

taken down for some type of copyright

issues so that's the thing about YouTube

is every Niche is different I mean

there's like some rough rules that'll

apply to

everything but depending on the niche

and the type of cont content that you're

getting from people is variable that's

why I'm just like I don't know you just

like I I don't care about individual

channels I just I just play The

Five-Year long-term game uh if a channel

like I put it up and it gets taken down

it's okay we just set up another one

it's the internet you don't have to go

build a building it's just a YouTube

channel it's all like it's all like we

have to go hire a bunch of contractors

and stuff it's like you literally just

go create a new channel you have a new

channel like immediately but if you got

if you got this channel that's making

30,000 bucks a month like you'd be kind

of upset if that channel gets taken down

right uh I used to but now I don't

really care because it's happened a

bunch you know it' be frustrating but

it's just part of the game at this point

is the perspective of the mindset that I

have I really don't give a [ __ ] about

the 30 grand a month you

know sounds like it sounds like with

with what you guys do it's kind of

inherent that you're going to run into

these issues right at least that's what

I'm getting from your reply you know

it's like it it would suck yeah but it's

not the end of the world world I just

know that it's just like dude it's the

internet you just throw up another

Channel or something I've had I've made

$70,000 in a month of the next month I

was making two grand a month I've had it

like rise and falls and collapses the

thing I had to learn was like how do I

do better next time okay but the answer

the question like how do you what's the

rough guidelines here you know there's

like rumors I don't know if there's an

exact science like where they're like oh

you did six seconds of this clip and

it's not 5 Seconds they broke the rules

you know here's the copyright claim you

know you're copyrighted because you did

6 seconds not 5 Seconds of somebody clip

there's really

no uh strong format but I can give you

best practices like there's not like a

here's the guidelines of like copyright

and how to exactly avoid it it's not an

exact science it's just like here's some

rough guidelines so a few things that

you can do um I guess how you find the

content you can use anything on the

Internet it's just you have to be

strategic with how you use the content

and you also have to ask yourself who

owns the content who's the creator of

this content is it an individual is it

some random social media Tik Tok thing

cuz that matters or is it like a you

know the NFL or is it a does that matter

if it's a individual versus like the NFL

content that you just rip from Tik Tok

or Instagram or just random creators

that just throw like videos out on the

social

medias those people you want to like be

those are very high-risk content to use

because you never know it could be like

eight months down the road they're not

in the copyright ID system they see that

video they're like wow that video got 3

million views that's my content you know

like I don't like that yeah cuz at at

vidsummit uh I was chatting I don't if

you know these guys I was chatting with

the owner and the CMO of B viral and B

viral they own like 52 million pieces of

content uh in their library and most of

them are these they basically buy rights

of all these like little videos that go

viral on the internet they basically buy

the rights to those yeah and they

license them out to people and they have

he was telling me they have software

where literally they automatically can

tell if you're using their content in

your stuff and they can send you out

uh basically letters that say Hey don't

use our content anymore please take this

thing down so it sounds like stuff like

that is where this risk comes in that

you're yeah versus if it's like a media

company you know like they probably

already just have their stuff uploaded

into the system if you upload the video

and you use their clip the system will

know immediately it'll notify them and

then they probably even system meaning

like YouTube like in the video upload

process yeah they have like a copyright

I don't know what it's called copyright

ID system or something where it's just

like when you upload the video that has

a copyrighted video from like if I took

it from History Channel and I put it on

my thing if they already have that thing

loaded into the system the system will

know immediately and it'll say hey you

got a copyright claim there's this clip

at this time stamp at this exact spot oh

it tells you like exactly what it is

yeah so that's why it's less risk as in

like you'll know immediately it's not

like eight months down the road like

someone sees that use their video and

they're like pissed off you know instead

this it's just it's already in the

system they're already like pretty

established they know um and then

there's there's some like weird

occasions like I know like Japanese like

anime uh recap channels are like a big

thing or even just using like uh movies

that are like from India or like these

random countries and then doing like

Recaps like that's a big Trend them like

there's certain anime companies or like

certain companies that like if you even

like you they know that you use their

name to like make money they'll just

like try to tear your channel

down so it's very dependent on the niche

it's very dependent and what I always

recommend best practices is to go find

the big biggest channels in the niche

and if they're uploading videos

consistently and they're obviously you

know like they're not doing it for free

and like obviously there's like probably

a business behind going on behind the

scenes study the way that try to figure

out where they're getting their clips

and then how they do it some like best

practices you can do is you can do like

you know there's companies like uh like

software is like production crate where

you can buy like overlays over over your

video where you can like add a little

like you know where it looks like the

snow's falling or it's like an old film

kind of look uh you can also change the

color grading of it you can even

increase like the speed or slow down the

speed of an audio by like

0.1% where it's not even noticeable to

like the ear but it's like enough to

where the copyright ID you can't notice

it I see people you'll see people where

they put like a video in a TV on on

screen instead of it being the entire

thing but they'll put it on over like as

a TV you can also like mirror the video

as well so it's just like anything to

kind of like trip up this like ID system

that uh that you can't really tell now

obviously you shouldn't do like a whole

30 minute video of just someone else's

clip what YouTube is looking for

explicitly

is uh like being adding to the content

not using other people's content as your

content but using it as substance like

transformative yeah transformative is

the word yeah so looking for they're

looking for transformative content not

just purely you know just ripping other

people's content so as long as you're

more moving towards the size of

transformative any sort of copyright

claims they're just little fixes and you

just tell the editor and if like

whoever's editing your videos and then

you know if they keep hitting if they

keep running that issue then it's like

just bu normal business you got to be

like hey we got to probably find

somebody else if this is a constant

bottleneck so you've got this Source

footage right somebody's finding that

Source footage for you right then you

also have someone that's writing a scpt

for the video and you have someone

that's editing it is that person that's

sourcing the footage is that person the

script writer as well or is this like a

separate role like where does that fit

in I'm trying to think about like the

production workflow yeah so for the

production

workflow we've tested all the different

ways I found it best that you can keep

it out of like the editor to go find the

content the

better uh We've even hired people that

are purely just like a sourcing person

or like a like a basic video editor

that's more of a sorcerer and then we

have an editor that like adds the music

adds creates the animations makes things

look prettier and stuff and it makes it

a lot more enjoyable of a Content um so

you can also have like we'll also have

like our script writers we have them

just like as when you're writing a

college or a high school essay where you

just cite your sources we just have them

site the sources and then like kind of

attach the images or like the the videos

that they're getting for reference on

these things is that happening in like a

Google dock or something yeah yeah so

like a lot of what we use is just for

the workflow specifically we just you

can use any project management tool we

just use Trello cuz it's anything that

has like a can band view I think is the

best cuz then you can just see the

stages of all the processes like

visually I'm more of a visual guy but uh

yeah so he'll we'll just use Google Docs

and then they'll uh they'll write out

the script and then I'll have like one

of my managers qca and they'll just like

uh like highlight and comment on the

parts that they want fixed or if things

don't flow well and stuff like that and

and then and then yeah so then usually

we'll have them try to sort like Source

like 10 different places that they found

their content so like cite different

like 10 different sources and have the

videos and images so then the editor can

just go through to those places exactly

where the content was and then find it

cuz a lot of times the editor these like

what we do is we hire editors that are

out of like the Middle East like from

like uh Pakistan India like Egypt

Eastern Europe uh type of you know

people cuz they're a lot more affordable

but they have like the right they have a

really good brain for like the

editing and a lot of times they don't

really understand American culture

so you know we'll have things where

we'll be like show talking about let's

say like Miami and they'll be showing

like Booker Ron or something or they'll

be shown like Tampa you know and so a

lot of times we'll have like you know it

needs a good amount of QC of like the

the the manager the script writer kind

of adding that input as well kind of

assisting a bit but yeah yeah

how how do you um so one of the things

on here a couple of the questions were

how do you find editors that will

because one of the things we talked

about in the other interview was like

Netflix like quality um so how do you

find editors that are like really good

for a really cheap rate obviously you

just said like geographically where

they're located but H how do you like

how do you make sure they're good like

how do you test their skills when you're

bringing them on board I mean it's the

best thing is like how to understand the

stuff is the best is just the more data

sets the better you know I just did like

a a position I was hiring for my team

and I did like 12 different like group

interviews and on each group interview I

had six people so I however however many

people I interviewed over all those

interviews and after all that I picked

two people out of all of that and I knew

that they were the best just because of

the like just the numbers so the best

way that I learned it is just interview

every like I mean if you want the like

real answer that's like not the lazy

just like how do I make like passive

income with no work answer cuz I hate

that [ __ ] the real answer is just you do

the [ __ ] work you just go interview a

ton of people and what you do how I find

these people is I did 250 job posts on

upwork we've hired over 150 people and

then now we have it down to our best

kind of like 15 people or so 20 people

that we're working with and so we've

just done a lot of rep so a lot of times

I just you know with people that we work

with I just like here's all the people

that we worked with that we just don't

have a project for them right now or um

I'm also like here's the exact job post

that I have just throw these up and do

them every once a week or so but the

main thing is just interview a ton of

people you want to find uh people that

are like Fast turnaround times you know

they're consistent you don't ask them to

do some work and then they say yeah I'll

do it by Friday and it's done by like

you know like two Fridays from then so

it's just kind of like finding the right

people so how we find them is like upw

work and just being very rigorous with

like the the the interviewing process I

are you having them edit anything for

you before you're hiring them yeah so

then the trick that we do right now is

just because people aren't always who

they say they are this is like a very

genuine thing I'm not trying to get like

it's it's such a big thing we've tried

to

hire so many people and it turns out

they have like fake portfolios or like

you know they just they'll grab other

people's stuff throw it in a Google

folder and send it to you and say it's

theirs and then as soon as you get them

to do work you're like where's the

person that edited this stuff at because

you're obviously not that person yeah

yeah I like upwork for the sense that

the thing I don't like about upwork is

they take like 10% but the thing I do

like about it is they have a middleman

type of thing to where you can fund a

contract but the freelancer doesn't get

the money until you say contract has

been fulfilled on their R yeah es they

know the money is there because the

thing about most Freelancers is they do

a project they put 20 hours into it and

then they don't get paid cuz the guy's

like you know like they're like oh

actually we can't afford you or

something you know like that's their

nightmare so you got to think of it like

Freelancers is kind of a nightmare being

the freelancer sometimes and sometimes

there's scams too there's so many scams

on all these platforms on the freelancer

perspective um and then so I like upward

CU it like it funds the contract you

don't release it until they like have

satisfied your request and then another

trick that we do is just because we've

been burned so many times I don't know

probably 50 times it's just it's just a

numbers game as the way we play it but

is we just tell them not everybody who

said we just tell them this is our

policy like not everybody is who they

say they are and so for the first video

or maybe even sometimes the first three

videos we're going to pay you at a half

rate of what your normal rate is just so

that way you know you're getting paid

but at the same time you know we're not

we're not sure who you you are if you

are who you say you are and we just want

to like be certain that this is the case

because we want to have a long lasting

relationship we don't want to just have

an editor for like two videos we want to

have an editor for the next like three

years and consistent work and also other

opportunities that we're going to be

able to give you and so that's kind of

that's how we mitigate that aspect of it

yeah makes total sense we we'll normally

uh we'll tell somebody like if they have

a desired rate they want to get paid

we'll say cool for the first three

months we're but we're going to work at

this rate yeah and then if you like

prove yourself to be like good and an

asset then we'll get to that rate after

three months yeah yeah that's cool uh

looking at some of these other questions

on here so someone said um I disagree

with that he said great video lots of

gold nuggets we'll start with the

Positive however I disagree with Devin

with this phrase you don't have to be

creative in YouTube so what what's your

what's your kind of uh comeback to that

where someone's like essentially what

they're saying is no no no you do have

to be creative on

YouTube what do you think about that uh

I mean for that guys explicitly I would

say uh uh I'd love to see that you know

I'd love to see your YouTube channels

and I'd love for you to show me you know

how how you're able to make you know 30

or 50 or $100,000 a month with your

YouTube channels and I'd love to for you

to shoot me over the analytics with you

tell me that you don't have to be

creative you look at someone like Mr

Beast that guy's like the most

uncreative person ever the only

creativity comes from after the decision

the one decision he makes is the video

idea which the idea that he comes up

with is super freaking unoriginal all of

his if you look at his channel and I I

think I said this in the last interview

I can't remember you look at his Channel

all the videos are the same you can even

look at it now all the videos are the

same the creativity comes from how do we

make this idea

happen so I will say you have to do you

have to be creative in like how do you

make the idea happen but when it comes

to an

idea creativity thrives from constraints

the best poets use constraints for their

poem you know there's a there's like the

different types of poems I'm not some

expert on this but let's say there's

like a Sonet and you have to have so

many parables and so many lines for it

to be a sonuna I think whatever I'm not

an expert let's just say it's 15 lines

and eight Parables per line or something

like I said um you know and the best

poets are the best at that type of

poetry that's the format that is there

the creativity isn't in the like the

format is very cut and dry this is how

you write a poem this is how to do it no

creativity whatsoever this is exactly

how to write this type of poem same with

YouTube there's no creativity in coming

up with ideas like other than how do you

fill in the blanks with this and there's

a market that wants to watch this so

once you figure out what the formats are

and what people want to watch takes no

creativity whatsoever it's a very like

emotionless decision-making process and

it's just like it's very black and white

what you need to produce and what you

don't need to produce and then the

creativity I will say yes there is

creativity but the creativity comes from

okay this format Works what are some

other things that we can plug into this

format that it's a complet completely

original idea that hasn't been done

before and good artists create great

artists steal so the greatest people on

YouTube what they do is they just find

the Trends on YouTube and plug them into

the formats mhm no creativity whatsoever

the creativity I guess is just you just

did MX plus bals y you know with the

formula and you just look like a

creative genius and then the production

it's the same exact thing they talk

about you know why is the sky blue

you're talking about why trees are

green you they they talk about this in

this video that's proven that got 5

million views okay we talk about this

that's about this topic over here in

this in this exact kind of like

aspect so you know I imagine a lot of

people kind of in the faceless YouTube

game right I'm sure you know a bunch of

the other people that are crushing it at

this and you probably worked with a lot

of people and know a lot of people also

that haven't made this happen that have

tried and failed like what do you think

what's the biggest differentiator

between someone that succeeds going down

this path of of creating faceless

YouTube channels that make decent money

and those that don't I mean most people

they give up too

soon so I'm not gonna talk about those

what is what is realistic expectations

yeah I think most people give up to soon

you know they do three ideas in a like

they do three videos and then they pivot

they do another five videos they're like

oh I Tred and then they pivot so I'm not

going to talk about those people cuz

obviously they have like deeper like

mental psychological issues that they

have to kind of overcome that's just

like a consistency thing you know so

let's not let's not talk about those

people um you know let's talk about the

people that are like 30 you know like

shooting like shooting for the long game

of this that are you know doing I mean I

guess that's the main problem that

people have is just they they play so

shortsighted for me I didn't make like

three grand a month for like a year and

a half and then after after a year and a

half I was making $3,000 a month I made

400 videos at that

point and then I started a new channel

and I started making $3,000 a day

because I had I now I did all the work I

had all the skill sets I knew how

YouTube worked all I needed was a better

vehicle like it's like Warren Buffett

says not about how hard you roll a boat

but it's about the stream that you're on

I just needed a better stream I was in

just my Tam was so low my total

adjustable Market there was only like so

many people in that market but I had the

skill sets I was like one of the top

like five in the niche but the biggest

person in the niche had like 20,000

subscribers that I was in which was you

know like a real estate Niche so it's

was like I can only become so big unless

I wanted to build a business on the back

end where I was telling a bunch of stuff

which is just a lot of work not to say

that you can't do it it's just you're

building a business on top of a

distribution thing um so what I did was

I switched over to a different Market

which was doing fa's channels for back

in the day was these like ask Reddit

videos where we'd take Reddit posts and

we'd have like a voice like a a robot

read the the videos and in two

weeks it I hit like 1.4 million views in

a day and I got uh you know was making

like three four five grand a day with

that channel and so the main thing I

think is just most people are playing

such a short game they're like I need

this to

work

and they're so much like they have to

have a result in the short term also

people have huge egos where they're just

like I know everything the people that

have like that like I know everything

mindset are very like shutting

themselves out for the information I

can't tell you the amount of times I've

like people had like a $30,000 a month

opportunity in front of them I tell them

exactly what to do and they do like one

of the five things I tell them to do or

you know they take two weeks to

implement the thing that I told them to

do when for me like my time to like App

application is you know sometimes

minutes like there's a like I built a

business the other day in like 2 hours

like we already had the domain the

website the logo everything already

built and we already had some like leads

and and and some potential you know

prospects for this like side business

that I built so it was just like my lead

to my my idea at the time was like you

know a few hours for building a business

other people they would take like a

whole month to be able to do that thing

do you see like is anything changing in

your strategy as like more people become

aware of faceless channels like is like

the saturation quote unquote of more

people doing this type of content like

does that impact your strategy moving

forward in in any type of way for me my

strategy is

just I'm just playing the long game I

know that if I do these run these the

best the channels that are doing like

million dollars a year consistently are

all like channels that are older than

five years unless there are some crazy

genius that came in with like a specific

strategy but 90% of the channels that

are like doing continuous $100,000

months are channels that have like been

doing this for like longer than five

years have been doing in the market for

a while so I'm just playing that game at

this point where I know that the rise

and Falls of channels you know I don't

as long as we're getting videos out and

the the company is able to like cover

its own expenses I really don't care

that much that's my strategy and that I

just you know we're constantly like

reworking things every like every few

months every six months or so kind of

making sure that the the ship's heading

the right direction but for I guess the

the average person getting into this is

yeah I think everybody's about to get

like in going to be in like a financial

Whirlwind I think with maybe the economy

and stuff and trying to figure out what

the hell they're going to do with their

life and I think you know the people

that are getting in now learning these

skill sets of how to generate an income

by themselves and how to make money

online are the people that are you know

that are be going to be when it's in a

position of necessity rather than just

of um just of like wanting for the

situation they're going to be better set

for success I think you know I think

there's going to be a lot of change in

the economy in the next few years of

like you know it's it's kind of crazy

you could be like 16 making $300,000 a

month just playing Minecraft with your

friends these days you know there's like

there's some disrup there's some

disruptions I guess in like finances and

the market and like what money is and

you know like everybody like after coid

they could work from home and so now

everybody's gotten a taste of like being

able to spend more time with their

family and their kids and being able to

do the things that they want so I think

but at the same time there's going to be

always a bunch of people that are

very you know there's always going to be

the people that are like lazy you know

and that are just trying to figure out

what it's going to be to just get by I

guess you know so I think there lot

people go ahead do you have uh people

that you know building faceless channels

that are like also like you know

40-year-old like mid-level managers and

like corporate and this is like their

side thing that they're doing or is it

always just like young 19y olds like

what is it what do you see in kind of

like the faceless landscape of people

actually building these channels

everybody honestly at this point because

it's such a like you can be anybody and

it doesn't matter you know you don't

have to have any sort of social skills

really I mean obviously to work with

people you have to get better at that

but um you know I've talked from like

guy that has like you know bless his

heart and it's sad but you know he's

like paralyzed and you know he's like

not able to really have any he's not

able to get majority of jobs and he's

able to like have like the amount of

excitement and passion he's able get out

of being able to do something for the

World by making a faceless YouTube

channel is just like so amazing to him

and he's just like eating this stuff up

and he's just super excited because he's

able to provide value to the marketplace

when otherwise 90 you know there's like

would otherwise be no option for him so

we see stuff from that to we're getting

a lot of people that are you know in

their 40s 50s where they're starting to

think about retirement and they're

starting to kind of look at the

landscape and they're like this doesn't

really make a whole lot of sense um you

know there's definitely people that are

10 20 years into their career career

that are just like I have like literally

seen the transformation of this company

and all I got was some slight pay raises

and some slight bumps so I it's

definitely yeah all over the map for

sure yeah does YouTube Shorts play any

part in these faceless Channel growth or

no I think that YouTube shorts is

like like the you got to think uh like

as ra Ray Delio talks about first

principles the thing that makes you

money on

YouTube

is like what they want is platform time

and so if you're able to create the most

amount of platform time then obviously

they want to give you as much

advertising eyeballs as possible and as

much ad dollars as possible and they

want to reward you for it because you're

getting people onto the platform Stu so

first principles it's just like how long

can you get people to stay on the

platform short form content all it takes

is like you're just it's a freaking

mixed bag of stuff and all it takes is

one content to rub you the wrong way off

the platform versus if your content is

like a is a safe bet it's like 10

minutes 20 minutes 30 minutes long or

you got like 50 videos that are 10

minutes long that are like all for like

a specific audience um they would love

to reward you and pay you a ton of money

I see a lot of shorts creators where

they're getting 100 million views and

they're making less than the channel

that's getting like 2 million views with

long format videos so you have to be

like a virality just like expert and

being able to execute for you to make

any sort of like actual Revenue off of

it so the main thing is like long format

content is where the money's at so if

you're just trying to make money long

format content if you want to have

people know who you are and play the the

Fame game like as Nal RAV talks about

there's like the Fame game and the

wealth game people play most people are

idiots most people are idiots and they

play The Fame game like Will Smith talks

about when he was famous he was he was

broke when he first like had his first

success and he had to go sit on a bus

and everyone was making fun of him

because he was like they were like oh

you're the Fresh Prince or whatever but

he was broke and had to ride the public

transportation most of these people

they're just trying to become famous and

then they become famous and they realize

like there's no money in that like

there's so many people with like 3

million subscribers they make like two

grand a month because they're famous but

the YouTube isn't rewarding them because

it's like they're not creating loads of

like platform time and so if you want to

make money then you need to do long

format content all that shorts does of

short form content that's really good at

is just getting you more eyeballs to the

brand if you don't have a brand that's

really worth anything in the first place

it's just eyeballs for the sake of

eyeballs which doesn't doesn't

equivalent to like sending your kids off

to college or you know being able to buy

a nice house or to be able to go travel

the world it just means that people know

who you are other than that that's it

interesting what's the what would you

say is the number one or maybe top two

like biggest mistakes people make when

they're like just starting out so like

let's say like they're not that person

that takes you know two months to go

from idea to execution they're like

somebody that's getting on it running

and it's going to be committed to it but

what's the top two mistakes you see

people make once they're like hit the

ground running what are they doing wrong

that you would say no no no no do this

instead yeah the main thing is the idea

the idea is like all the money on

YouTube like I told about my story where

I started like I did YouTube for a year

and a half got to three grand a month I

literally just changed my just into a

different Niche I didn't become a better

person skill set wise I just learned how

to edit those types of

videos and I was making three grand a

day so you have to ask yourself like

what I always recommend for people to do

is just go spend like you know 100 hours

studying content through the lens of

like I'm about to make a channel and

once you've done that 100 hours and you

see all the opportunities on the

marketplace and you just like just put

in the work you're going to find what's

going to work best for you I think some

people find like a Soo idea and they

jump on it because they feel obligated

to make money on YouTube instead of just

like finding what's for them and they

jump into it and then they're talking

about like serial killers or something

like that and having to talk about

bodies getting chopped up in the video

or something and they're like that

doesn't make me feel

good and doesn't matter how hard they

work they just feel shitty inside making

these videos and it's going to be really

hard for you to make 30 grand a month if

you feel gross about making the content

that you're making or you're not

interested in it not to say you have to

be some person like not to say that I'm

a huge fan of my channel

I was just interested enough in it that

I felt good about putting it out there

and then on top of that I you know like

me learning a bunch of random

information about these industries was

kind of cool you know I was like oh this

is cool I I'm not going to go out of my

way to go find this stuff but I'm

naturally just becoming a higher value

person of like by creating this content

so most people I think they just like

they Rush the ideation process they just

like oh everybody's doing this so I'm

going to go do this instead of finding

what's for them cuz you know I went to

we both went to vid Summit let me ask

you Ryan how many people did you run

into that you were blown away that that

that's how they made money on YouTube

like what were some of like the weird

ways that you heard people were making

money on YouTube there I mean there's

there's all kind of stuff there were

people that had uh physical product

brands on the back end of stuff there

were like what like what like what weird

industry barbecue stuff like cook

grilling yeah yeah so barbecue I talked

to one dude he had a he was a scrap guy

he would just record him like he would

just be doing like junk and scrap and he

loved that [ __ ] yeah you know yeah I met

another guy that his was uh documenting

Route 66 so like the famous road that

goes through the US uh and he just like

films stuff about Route 66 and like he

moneti I think he was making like uh I

think it was like 20 grand a month or

something like that through that yeah

yeah he probably didn't even have to be

a face creator for with something like

that you probably could just like look

at like Google Maps and then try to like

you know try to tell the tales of sign

the tell the tales and stuff like that

but yeah there's like you know there's

people that like did like every day in

World War II where they documented like

they said exactly what happened on every

single day um it's just the thing is

there's so many ways of making money on

YouTube and so just because you see

there's an opportunity to make

money you know it may not be for you

just like with YouTube there's you know

like in the like I I went and found the

I did a like I did research the other

day and I found I wanted to just show

people what like the opportunity of

YouTube so I found in the span of like

10 hours 15 hours I went and found 200

channels that were making over six

figures uh that were in this faceless

Niche and I think inside of there there

was like 40 different niches and so

there's just so many different ways of

making money on YouTube you just need to

find the one that's right for you it's

okay if it takes like an extra week to

come up with the idea just be just to

find what you feel like is that perfect

fit for yourself now obviously I don't

want people to have like analysis

paralysis you should have a rough

combination of just maybe like maybe

I'll try like maybe I'll go three

channels deep maybe the first channel

I'll do it just to learn the second

Channel I'm going to take those

principles and apply it and then the

third Channel you know like by then

you'll have a bunch of knowledge and

you'll know how things work and if you

just view that you'll have to set up and

start over a few channels and at the end

of that you're making 30 grand a month

you know that's the thing people are

like oh that's work at the end of this

you're making 30 grand a month and your

life has changed for the rest of your

life so if you just do the work and it's

like maybe it's 1,000 hours on the other

side of that you're making 30 grand a

month what other like world industry can

you do that you can't do that in like

most in any corporate worlds you know or

anything like that um so the main thing

is just I would say the main aspect of

it all is the

idea and then from there the other

aspect I see people getting hung up is

they don't go too granular with like why

people are liking the other videos

or I think this I'll give you three the

second part is is more so like uh

they're emulating like poor success so

like there'll be a channel they'll have

like 100 videos on it they'll have three

that get over a million views let's say

and then they'll have like another 97

videos that have like less than like

100,000 views let's say just for the

sake of the example they'll look at all

of the channel as a whole and study

everything and try to recreate

everything instead of just picking the

three things that were their most viral

videos and emulating that for

me I'd rather emulate a 5 million view

video then like 100,000 view video cuz

if I only do 10% of that success of

100,000 view video is only 10,000 views

which is only $50 versus if like that I

would make on ad Revenue versus if I

made a 5 million view video and I got

10% of that I would get 500,000 views

which you know that would be like $2,500

in Revenue that I make from that so like

you want to emulate success and then the

third thing is just they don't go very

granular in studying success as well so

you know first of all it's not they

don't find a niche that's good in the

market or for them and then second it's

like they're studying the just all

videos instead of just the upper echelon

of success and EM emulating upper

echelon of success and then third is

they're not going crazy granular with

the like why what makes that video a

good video you know there's like the

title the thumbnail like what font color

they use in the thumbnail what type of

font do they use in the thumbnail what

type of image do they use in the in the

thumbnail what type of image you know

there's like Charlie monger's like

inverse thinking inverse problem solving

which is like what are not only what are

they doing but what are they not doing

that you're trying that you're

doing and so what are the things they're

not doing in their thumbnail what are

the things they're not doing in their

title and then the same thing for the

intro the first 30 seconds of the video

what are they doing in the intro what

are they not doing in the

intro and then for the subjects of the

rest of the video what are they doing

inside of that and then and then you

have to go really granular what music

are they playing you know when do they

entertain a certain subject you know

when do they talk about stuff how do

they go about doing it you know I I have

this saying and it might for me I don't

care if it Rubes people the wrong way

it's just if you're not getting cease

and toist letters you're not going

you're not doing business well

enough yeah there there's a very similar

saying right in in marketing where it's

like uh if you're not getting somebody

to like hate on your brand every day

you're not marketing hard enough yeah

yeah yeah that aspect of it too you

should be reverse engineering what

worked for other people as if you just

got hired by their company to make their

next video and they just lost all their

production team and make that next video

obviously you're not going to remake an

old video right you're going to make

whatever that next video is you have to

like go make that next video for them

that should be the video that you upload

onto your

channel that's an interesting way to

think about

it seems like a good way yeah and I

think I just people don't go granular

enough with like it they're just you

know they're like they're skipping over

things and like some some audiences like

especially like in natural health health

sciences and stuff like that

people aren't trying to go watch those

videos to be necessarily entertained

they're just looking for the secret

formula that's going to change their

life right so it's not like they're in

there to like have like a dopamine like

crazy type of experience they just want

an answer for their problem or a

solution to their problem so if you have

a solution to their problem your video

is going to do extremely well and

so it's not about the editing they have

the poorest editing quality videos ever

you could hire some dude from Pakistan

pay him $30 have the same quality but

for them it's just about what is the

idea and what are they talking about

inside of there and I've had people go

try to get into that n those niches and

they try to remake the content like and

try to like do Mr Beast Style with like

you know how to you know how to like

what are some solutions for colon cancer

or something like that you know and the

thing is is nobody wants that it's like

the demographic watching these things is

like 40 to 80 they don't they're not

watching Mr Beast videos you have to you

need to figure out what is already

working in that market and then be that

market and become the person that's that

and then the things that you can do

better are just little things you know

instead of like showing a picture of

this you could have just shown a picture

of this instead and it would have been a

better representation of how to see

things and so I think most people they

try to like either recreate the wheel or

they don't go too granular in modeling

emulating the success yeah that's cool

dude so I think you you shared a ton of

value here today uh if somebody's

interested in getting into the faceless

YouTube game and is is there a way that

you help people do that yeah just follow

me on social media if you just look me

up if this is on YouTube or whatever

plat I'm on I'm just look me up on all

platforms you'll get into my stuff

somehow and get EMA like I have like a

newsletter and stuff like that so yeah

cool dude yeah well it was uh fantastic

to chat with you again uh and tackle

some of these questions and haters that

uh that we had in the comments of the

last video and I appreciate you coming

on here again dude