Negotiating internationally with Linda Netsch. Part 1. S2 E8

Summary

In this insightful interview with Dmytro Shvets on The Start Global Insights, Linda Nech, founder of Align Consulting and a lecturer at Harvard and Stanford Law Schools, shares her expertise in the Harvard Negotiation Model, also known as interest-based negotiations. Linda's extensive experience as a negotiator and leader across various regions, including the US, Europe, Asia, and the Middle East, provides a rich backdrop for the discussion. The conversation delves into the importance of understanding interests over positions, the concept of BATNA (Best Alternative to a Negotiated Agreement), and the significance of legitimacy in negotiations. Linda emphasizes the universality of negotiation principles across cultures, while also acknowledging the need for adaptation to local norms and behaviors. The interview highlights the power of active listening and curiosity in negotiation, and how these skills can lead to more effective outcomes. The discussion also touches on the impact of personal and cultural development on negotiation styles, suggesting that negotiation approaches are not solely determined by nationality but also by individual values and levels of development. The interview concludes with a teaser for the next episode, which will explore negotiation culture in the US and further insights into the Harvard Negotiation methodology.

Takeaways

• 😎 Linda Nech is introduced as a seasoned negotiator with over 20 years of experience, serving roles such as a lecturer, general manager, and founder of Align Consulting.
• 📝 The Harvard Negotiation Model, also known as interest-based negotiation, is highlighted as a significant method worth exploring for effective negotiation practices.
• 🔥 Linda recounts her journey into the world of negotiation, starting from her military days with no formal training to embracing formal negotiation studies at Harvard Law School.
• 📚 The discussion emphasizes the practical applications of negotiation principles Linda learned, which proved beneficial throughout her career in law and consulting.
• 💬 Interest-based negotiation is contrasted against position-based negotiation using the story of two children and an orange, illustrating the importance of understanding underlying interests rather than surface demands.
• 🖥 Several core elements of the Harvard Negotiation Model are examined, including interests, options for mutual gain, BATNA (Best Alternative to a Negotiated Agreement), and legitimacy standards.
• 🙋‍♂️ The narrative explores various negotiation styles and approaches, from creating value for all parties involved to aggressive, win-lose tactics seen in zero-sum negotiations.
• 👨‍💻 Linda's experiences in diverse cultural contexts reveal that while negotiation practices may vary globally, the foundational principles remain consistent and adaptable to different societal norms.
• 🌐 Dmytro Shvets, the host, shares his own negotiation experiences in Ukraine, emphasizing the real-world relevance and challenges of negotiating effectively in various environments.
• 🎫 The conversation concludes with plans to discuss more about negotiation cultures in the US and further delve into the Harvard Negotiation methodology in a subsequent episode.

Q & A

What is the Harvard Negotiation Model that Linda Nech discusses?

The Harvard Negotiation Model, also known as interest-based negotiation, focuses on identifying the underlying interests of the parties involved, rather than their initial positions. This method encourages finding solutions that satisfy the interests of all parties, which can lead to more sustainable and mutually beneficial agreements.

How did Linda Nech begin her career in negotiation?

Linda Nech began her career as an officer in the US Air Force, where she was stationed at Ramstein Air Base in Germany. During this time, she frequently engaged in negotiations with military members, NATO members, civilian personnel, and defense contractors, despite having no formal training in negotiation at that point.

Why did Linda Nech decide to pursue formal education in negotiation?

Linda Nech decided to pursue formal education in negotiation after recognizing the practicality of negotiation theories during her military service. She enrolled in a negotiation course taught by Roger Fisher and Bruce Patton at Harvard Law School, which provided her with structured approaches and techniques that proved valuable in her professional life.

Can you explain the difference between interest-based negotiation and position-based negotiation?

Interest-based negotiation focuses on understanding the underlying needs and motivations of all parties involved, whereas position-based negotiation centers on the demands or positions that parties initially bring to the table. Interest-based negotiation seeks collaborative solutions that address the interests of all parties, while position-based often leads to competitive, less cooperative interactions.

What is a BATNA, and why is it significant in negotiations?

BATNA stands for 'Best Alternative to a Negotiated Agreement' and represents the most advantageous alternative action a party can take if negotiations fail and an agreement cannot be reached. Understanding one's BATNA is crucial as it provides a baseline against which to measure the value of any negotiated agreement and helps negotiators make informed decisions.

How does Linda Nech apply her negotiation skills in different cultural contexts?

Linda Nech adapts her negotiation approach based on the cultural norms and expectations of the parties involved. She emphasizes the importance of humility, openness to learning, and the need to avoid stereotyping, acknowledging that while some cultural norms might influence negotiation behaviors, fundamental negotiation principles remain consistent across different environments.

What are some core elements of the Harvard Negotiation Model discussed by Linda Nech?

Some core elements of the Harvard Negotiation Model include focusing on interests rather than positions, generating a variety of options that could satisfy these interests, developing objective criteria to evaluate these options, and considering alternatives such as BATNA to ensure agreements align with parties' best interests.

How did Linda Nech's military background influence her approach to negotiation?

Linda Nech's military background provided her with early, practical experience in high-stakes negotiation scenarios, shaping her ability to handle diverse and challenging situations. This experience highlighted the need for formal negotiation strategies and techniques, which she later pursued in her academic and professional development.

What example does Linda Nech use to illustrate interest-based negotiation?

Linda Nech uses the example of two children arguing over an orange, where the parent's solution to split the orange in half doesn't fully satisfy either child's true interest. This example illustrates the importance of understanding deeper interests behind positions to find more satisfying solutions for all parties involved.

What are the educational benefits of teaching negotiation skills, according to Linda Nech?

According to Linda Nech, teaching negotiation skills can help reduce conflicts and improve relationships by enabling individuals to better understand each other's interests and motivations. Simulations and practical exercises in negotiation teach valuable life skills, enhance communication, and help build more collaborative environments.

Outlines

00:00

🎓 Introduction to the Harvard Negotiation Model

The first paragraph introduces Dmytro Shvets, the host of The Start Global Insights, and his guest, Linda Nech, an expert in negotiations with extensive experience. They discuss the importance of negotiation skills in business and the Harvard Negotiation Model, also known as interest-based negotiations. Linda shares her background, starting as an Air Force officer and later studying negotiation at Harvard Law School. She emphasizes the practicality of the principles she learned and how they can be applied in real-life situations. The Harvard Negotiation Model is distinguished by focusing on underlying interests rather than fixed positions, aiming for mutually beneficial solutions.

05:05

🍊 Interest-Based Negotiation and BATNA

The second paragraph delves into the concept of interest-based negotiation, using the example of two children arguing over an orange to illustrate the difference between positions and interests. Linda explains that by understanding the true interests of the parties, more creative and mutually satisfying solutions can be found. The paragraph also touches on two additional elements of the Harvard Negotiation Model: BATNA (Best Alternative to a Negotiated Agreement) and the use of objective criteria or standards to evaluate the fairness of a negotiation outcome. The discussion highlights the importance of considering alternatives and fairness in the negotiation process.

10:08

🌐 Cultural Differences in Negotiation

The third paragraph discusses Linda's experiences with negotiation across different countries and cultures. Despite the perceived differences, she finds that there are more similarities than expected in negotiation practices worldwide. The fundamental principles of negotiation remain the same, but they need to be adapted to the local context and cultural norms. Linda stresses the importance of being humble, open-minded, and observant when negotiating in different cultures, as well as the need to avoid stereotypes and to learn from direct interactions.

15:09

🌟 Adapting Negotiation Strategies

The fourth paragraph continues the discussion on cultural differences in negotiation. Linda and Dmytro talk about how negotiation approaches can vary widely, even within the same country, and the importance of adapting to local norms and expectations. They emphasize that while there may be cultural-specific courses on negotiation, the core principles of understanding interests, BATNA, and legitimacy remain universal. The paragraph also highlights the value of active listening and how it can lead to better negotiation outcomes by fostering understanding and trust.

20:10

🌍 Negotiation and Personal Development

In the fifth paragraph, Dmytro and Linda explore the idea that negotiation styles may not be strictly determined by nationality or culture but by the level of personal and spiritual development of the individuals involved. They discuss how basic needs satisfaction and the absence of fear can lead to more relaxed and cooperative negotiation styles. The paragraph also suggests that the level of development and the values that individuals hold can significantly impact their approach to negotiation.

25:18

📈 Conclusion and Upcoming Discussion

The sixth and final paragraph wraps up the conversation by acknowledging the breadth of Linda's experience and insights. Dmytro mentions that due to the richness of the discussion, it will be split into two parts. The second part will cover the negotiation culture in the US, stereotypes associated with it, and a deeper dive into the Harvard Negotiation methodology, including tools and approaches for effective negotiation. The paragraph ends with an invitation for the audience to subscribe to the Start Global Insights podcast to catch the continuation of the conversation with Linda Nech.

Keywords

💡Harvard Negotiation Model

The Harvard Negotiation Model, also known as interest-based negotiation, focuses on collaborative strategies to find mutually beneficial solutions by identifying the underlying interests of all parties involved, rather than merely bargaining over positions. In the video, Linda Nech discusses this methodology extensively, emphasizing its practical application in real-life scenarios, such as the story of two children and an orange, which illustrates how understanding true interests can lead to more optimal solutions than simple compromise.

💡Interest-based negotiation

Interest-based negotiation is a method where the negotiators focus on the underlying reasons why people want certain outcomes, rather than the outcomes themselves. This approach aims to find solutions that satisfy the interests of all parties involved. This concept is highlighted in the video through examples like the children arguing over an orange, showing that understanding deeper interests can lead to more satisfactory and innovative solutions.

💡BATNA

Best Alternative to a Negotiated Agreement (BATNA) is a term used in negotiation theory to describe a negotiator's best option if current negotiations fail. In the video, Linda Nech mentions BATNA as a critical element in the Harvard Negotiation Model, underscoring the importance of having strong alternatives and how they empower negotiators to make better decisions.

💡Legitimacy

In negotiations, legitimacy refers to the benchmarks or standards that help determine the fairness or reasonableness of an option. Linda Nech discusses this as one of the elements of the Harvard Negotiation Model, indicating how external standards like market comparables or legal precedents can guide negotiations towards more objective and equitable solutions.

💡Cultural differences

Cultural differences play a significant role in how negotiations are approached and executed across different regions and countries. In the video, Linda Nech reflects on her global experiences and emphasizes the need to adapt negotiation strategies to respect and incorporate cultural norms, thereby improving understanding and outcomes in international settings.

💡Zero-sum negotiation

Zero-sum negotiation is a strategy where one party's gain is perceived as another party's loss, often leading to competitive or adversarial negotiation scenarios. Linda contrasts this with interest-based negotiation, where the goal is creating value that benefits all parties. She discusses encountering negotiators with a zero-sum mindset and how she adapts her strategy in response.

💡Simulations

Simulations are used in educational settings to teach negotiation by allowing participants to engage in mock negotiations that mimic real-life scenarios. Linda highlights the importance of simulations in the Harvard Negotiation courses, noting that they provide practical experience and insights, which are crucial for learning and applying negotiation principles effectively.

💡Listening skills

Listening skills are essential in negotiations to fully understand the perspectives, motivations, and needs of other parties. In the video, Linda discusses the importance of listening, asking good questions, and ensuring understanding, which can lead to more effective and empathetic negotiation strategies.

💡Interests

Interests in negotiation refer to the underlying needs, desires, or concerns that motivate negotiators. Linda Nech emphasizes focusing on interests rather than positions to find solutions that genuinely address the concerns of all parties, as demonstrated in the video with various examples, including the illustrative story of the orange.

💡Negotiation education

Negotiation education refers to the formal and informal learning processes that equip individuals with the skills and knowledge to negotiate effectively. The video discusses how negotiation skills are taught through methods like simulations, classroom learning, and real-life experiences, emphasizing their importance in both personal and professional development.

Highlights

The importance of negotiation skills for establishing a presence in the market, whether selling locally or globally.

Introduction of the Harvard Negotiation Model, also known as interest-based negotiations, as a methodology worth attention.

Linda Nech's background as a US Air Force officer and how it influenced her path to becoming a negotiation expert.

The significance of understanding interests over positions in negotiations, as illustrated by the story of two children arguing over an orange.

The concept of BATNA (Best Alternative to a Negotiated Agreement) and its role in successful negotiations.

The role of legitimacy, standards, or criteria in determining the fairness or reasonableness of options in a negotiation.

Different negotiation methods and the contrast between interest-based and zero-sum approaches.

The adaptability of the Harvard Negotiation Model even when the other party employs a different, potentially more aggressive, method.

The value of negotiation education in schools for reducing conflicts and fostering better communication.

The use of simulations in educational settings to provide practical negotiation experience.

Cultural differences in negotiation styles and the importance of adapting the Harvard Negotiation Model to various contexts.

The universality of interests and the adaptability of negotiation principles across different cultures and societies.

The importance of humility and open-mindedness when negotiating with other cultures and the rejection of stereotypes.

The impact of personal development and spiritual growth on negotiation styles, suggesting that negotiation approaches are not solely determined by nationality or culture.

The role of listening skills as a powerful tool in negotiation for understanding the other party's perspective and motivations.

The idea that negotiation is a lifelong learning experience and a skill that can always be improved.

Linda Nech's insights on negotiation in different parts of the world, emphasizing the similarities in human behavior across cultures.

The upcoming discussion in the second part of the interview about negotiation culture in the US and tools for effective negotiation.

Transcripts

Hi, I'm Dmytro Shvets, your host at The Start Global Insights, where I interview experts

from different countries about local business secrets and international expansion experience.

No matter if you are selling locally or globally, to establish your presence in the market you

need to negotiate.

And this is a skill that needs constant development and practice.

There are different styles and approaches of negotiations, but one of the methodologies

is worth paying attention to.

And I'm talking about the Harvard Negotiation Model or interest-based negotiations.

And to dive deeper into this methodology, we definitely need an expert.

And I would like to welcome my today's guest, Linda Nech, the founder of Align Consulting,

a general manager at the law firm Flex by Fenwick, and a lecturer on law at Harvard

and Stanford Law Schools, and a visiting lecturer at Ukrainian Christian University Business

School.

Linda has more than 20 years of experience of helping clients to become better negotiators

and leaders in the US, Europe, Asia, and Middle East.

And before private law practice, Linda served as an officer in the US Air Force.

Hi, Linda.

Welcome to the show.

Hi, Dmitry.

Very nice to be here.

Thank you.

Linda, could you tell us your story, like the short version of it, how you ended up

in practicing and teaching negotiations?

Yeah, well, the short version of that story.

As you mentioned, I started out my career as an Air Force officer.

And my first duty station was at Ramstein Air Base in Germany, where we were putting

together a mobile satellite communication system for NATO and Western Europe.

And at the time, I had no formal training in negotiation, but I was negotiating all

the time with other military members, NATO members, civilian personnel, defense contractors.

So I had a lot of experience negotiating, but not a lot of formal training or theory

behind things that worked or didn't work.

And so when I went back to the States and went to law school, at the time, the author

of Getting to Yes, Roger Fisher, and his colleague Bruce Patton were teaching a course in negotiation

at Harvard Law School.

I took that my first year of law school.

And at the time, I remember thinking it was common sense, as Roger Fisher said, organized

common sense and not necessarily common practice.

But I started to notice that as I went out after law school and practiced law and in

my professional career, I was constantly coming back to some of these principles and ideas

that were very practical, that you can actually use in real life negotiations and can help

you be better, help you learn from your mistakes, help you realize choices that might be more

effective.

So I hope that's a shorter version of how I ended up focusing on this field.

Thank you.

And could you tell what is behind this method of Harvard negotiation?

What's so special about that?

Yeah.

And as you mentioned, you can think about it as interest-based negotiation.

So it is the notion of interests versus just fighting over positions or demands.

That's a core part of the negotiation.

As laid out in the book, Getting to Yes, there are some key aspects, often talked about as

seven elements of negotiation.

I think for our purposes, it's helpful to think through at least four of those, one

being the notion of interests, like what are the things that motivate people?

And how can you think about options, element number two or one of the seven elements, that

satisfy those interests?

And so that's the notion of interest-based negotiation.

The simple example that actually illustrates the point, I think quite well, it's in lots

of books about negotiation, is the story of two children arguing over an orange.

Each child's position is that it's mine.

Of course, the typical parent response to that would be to cut the orange in half, give

half to each child, and that is the chosen option.

However, one child takes the fruit and eats it and throws the peel away.

The other child takes the fruit and throws it away and uses the peel to flavor a cake.

That might be an unusual child that watches too many cooking shows.

Nonetheless, I think it illustrates the point well, which is had the parent understood the

interests as opposed to just the argument over the positions, there was a solution whereby,

a meeting value solution, to use that negotiation lingo, whereby one child could have had more

of their interests met, both children could have had their interests met better with a

different option chosen.

So fundamentally, it is understand the primary interest motivating the parties and then think

through solutions or options which best satisfy those interests.

And then just quickly, two other of the seven elements that are often talked about through

the Harvard program, the notion of alternatives, that if you and I are negotiating but we can't

get a deal that satisfies our interests or we could do a negotiation with someone else

that better satisfies our interests, that alternative, the lingo that's often used is

BATNA, which stands for best alternative to a negotiated agreement.

That's an important thing to think about in your negotiations as well because sometimes

the best outcome in the negotiation you're in right now is not getting a deal and doing

a deal with someone else or some other party that can better satisfy your interests.

And then I guess the fourth element, I often use the term legitimacy, you'll see it in

many books as standards or criteria.

That's essentially what are the benchmarks that are relevant in the negotiation which

might point toward the fairness or reasonableness of one option versus another.

So things like market comparables or legal precedent or laws in general.

So things that are outside of just the pure power or will of the parties that inform which

options among those that are discussed feel most justified and most reasonable to both

parties.

Interesting.

I actually use the same example in my courses when I mentioned negotiation based on interest.

I use the same example but I'm using lemon, not the orange.

And I talk about wife and husband in the case so I don't need to attract parents for this

decision.

Yeah.

And you know, even those kind of simple examples, I think they really illustrate something that

happens in real life more often than maybe we're aware of that we're arguing about a

particular demand or option or offer without really stepping back and thinking through,

wait a minute, what really matters to the parties here?

What really are the variety of interests that can be satisfied?

And can we figure out a way to bridge the gap and get a deal that actually works for

both sides?

Yeah.

And actually get more for both sides, not for only one.

And in connection to that, the question is what are the alternative negotiation methods?

In my life, I visited a lot of these small courses for negotiations and they are teaching

you how to convince other people, buy your product, how to win the negotiation, how to

be the best of the best and actually go with the biggest value for yourself from negotiations.

There are certainly different styles and approaches to negotiation and we certainly see them in

the world in general.

And I think so there might be more of a, if we think of interest-based negotiation, this

notion of you can get a deal that's better for both sides, that might be creating value,

that kind of mindset versus a much more I win, you lose, zero-sum approach to negotiation.

We've certainly all seen that play out.

Some people think that's the way to go.

I figure out how to outsmart you, out-manipulate you, scare you, threaten you and get more

for myself that way.

Very much a mindset of focused on claiming as much for oneself as you can.

And that's out there in the world.

We will encounter people who have that mindset.

And then it's just important when I personally encounter people who I assume have more of

that attitude, then I'm going to be just much stronger around my alternatives, around coming

up with strong standards, benchmark criteria that support a point of view that I'm comfortable

with, understanding the interests of the other side, even if it's just giving small wins

to a win-lose person such that they have that part of their own interests met.

So I think you can be consistent in your...

For me, I feel like I can be consistent in a model that makes sense to me.

I'm just going to use the elements differently if I find someone who has a much more of a

distributive or zero-sum attitude toward negotiation.

So you actually can use this method even if the other party is not using that.

So if the other party is using this zero-sum approach.

Absolutely.

While you were talking, I remembered when I learned negotiations first time, and that

was in 90s after the Perestroika in Ukraine in the streets of Kiev.

So that was the best place to learn negotiation for me at that time.

I was a teenager and we had this gangs of bad guys walking around.

And then when you met them, then you could either fight, but you were alone and there

were many of them, or negotiate.

And I was doing both, actually, exercises.

But at some time, I understood that it is much more better to negotiate.

Yeah, absolutely.

And I think you're illustrating that kind of diagnosis between whether I should negotiate

or I should walk to my alternative.

And if your alternative is a fight, especially one you might not win, then it's particularly

important to think through a different approach and not choose your alternative, but to figure

out a way to negotiate even if the other side doesn't seem necessarily obviously willing

at the outset.

So it's quite a good thing to teach negotiation at schools, I think.

It would definitely help to diminish fights between children and this type of bullying

activities.

Yeah.

And I think in an educational setting, whether it's in grade schools or in your post-graduate

programs or professional education, just the beauty of being able to run simulations and

see the results help you see the differences between a choice that is very much around

manipulation and fighting versus a choice where you're actually looking to try to build

deals, build relationships, understand interests.

You get a little bit of evidence that comes out of that experience when you can see the

outcomes and the impact on long-term relationships and the impact on your own reputation.

Yeah, you can actually hear a lot of times about the approaches and methodologies, but

if you do not use it, if you didn't experience that feeling with your own body and language,

then you won't understand how to use that.

And actually what I was reading about the Harvard approach and I was looking at the

courses at the Harvard website, there are a lot of simulations.

It's like the core of the education system.

Yeah, you know, what Roger Fisher used to say, the Getting to Yes author was, you know,

negotiation is a skill, much like if you were learning to play tennis or to ski, you can

talk about it, but unless you actually get out there and practice and participate and

do the actions of negotiating, you're not going to improve or not going to necessarily

learn the lessons, much like if you were learning to play tennis, you've got to take some swings,

you've got to hit some tennis balls and that helps you learn.

And so it's very much that the power of negotiating is that you can always learn.

I learn every time I teach the course, I still learn every time I interact with different

people, different groups, I see different aspects of negotiation.

It's kind of a lifelong learning experience and it's a skill.

True, true.

I totally agree with that.

Talking about what you just said that you, with different people, with different situations,

you are learning different approaches and as you had so much experience in different

countries, in different areas of the world, have you experienced this feeling of different

approaches of negotiation within different countries or different cultures?

Certainly you notice differences.

I think the biggest surprise for me, again, having taught this material to groups of people

all around the world, is how much more similar we are than I would necessarily, than you

might think when there's an analysis of the differences in cultures, language, governments,

et cetera.

So yeah, if you think about even within a country the size of the United States, I live

in California, but I was born in the Midwest and I've lived in the South.

Those are three very different cultures, if you will, that despite the fact there's a

shared language, same shared history to some extent, shared government to some extent.

And I think you see it throughout the world too.

If I go to Japan, there might be a different kind of cultural norm about communication

and negotiation expectations.

Or if I'm in the Middle East or in Ukraine.

I think the important thing is that the fundamental principles are the same.

They just need to be adapted to the context.

So for example, every person, let alone every culture, has a set of norms and behaviors

that might be different than other places.

And awareness, I think one of the most important things when you're negotiating with other

cultures is be humble and realize you might not understand a lot about what the expectations

and the norms are within that culture.

And be open to even everything you've read that tells you about how people negotiate

in Japan or how people negotiate in China.

Those are stereotypes.

Sometimes they're right, sometimes they're way off.

So learning in the moment by observing behavior, asking good questions, not getting too wedded

to your own assumptions, that's a helpful way to think about negotiating in different

parts of the world.

But every person has a set of interests.

Negotiation is about coming up with deals or options.

That applies.

It just might be measured by different criteria in different cultures.

Every negotiation has an alternative.

It might be a bad one.

It might mean you're going to fight instead of get a deal.

But those ways of analyzing what's happening, you can use the same tools.

But again, you've just got to understand that what people's interests are and what the norms

of a particular society are vary throughout the world.

While you were talking, I was thinking about the approaches again.

So there are several courses or education directions that are teaching about how to

negotiate in Japan or how to negotiate in the Middle East.

What you should know, how they behave, what is the culture.

I remember in my school, in the high school, there was a course about intercultural communication

and they were teaching us what is the distance that is okay for some other nations.

And then you should consider that while you are negotiating.

And then you understand when I was already working with different countries and when

I was in different situations and then understood exactly what you said.

It might be true.

So they might have these rules or norms.

But first thing, that they are already expecting that you will do some mistakes as a foreigner.

And the second thing is that in reality, it is not so strict.

So it is so generalized that there are a lot of different subcultures in the culture.

And even if you are negotiating in your home country, in some cases, you think that you

know the norms, but the norms of the other parties are totally different.

And in this case, there's a privilege of interest-based negotiations when you are expecting to understand

the other party and you are listening more than you are talking, then you can actually

find out whether you are right or you are wrong.

And even if you are wrong, then if you are a good listener and the other party knows

that you are willing to understand them, they will correct you and then you will learn immediately.

Absolutely.

And I think that point about listening skills, I don't think that people haven't thought

about listening as one of your strongest negotiation tools, but it really is.

If we think about a lot of negotiation is predicting consequences and understanding

likely responses from the people you are negotiating with.

And the better you understand the people you are negotiating with, what motivates them,

what they think is persuasive, what they think is the norm that applies, the more you understand

that, the better you can be at anticipating their likely response or the consequences

of a choice or proposal that you are making.

And how do you learn what motivates them?

Well, again, it's those asking good questions, listening to the response, paraphrasing or

summarizing to make sure you understood correctly.

And then if you didn't, they will give you them the opportunity to correct you.

So those skills, while I guess they would be quote unquote soft skills, are incredibly

powerful in getting better at just understanding the perspective of people you are negotiating

with.

You can't influence people very well if you don't understand them at all.

And so the better you get at diagnosing what they care about, how they see the situation,

the better choices you can make around what you are putting into your own proposals or

offers, the more persuasive you can be in negotiating with those counterparts.

Just remembered this case from the fiction book about like far away space, like in the

galaxy some planet was discovered.

And so the humans from Earth started to negotiate with locals from that distant planet.

And I was reading from the negotiator point of view, I was thinking like how it is at

all possible to negotiate with aliens when you don't understand not even the interest,

you don't understand the language.

And then they began to use some basic, like very core communication activities, the pain

and the gain and what do you need and what is good for you, good for me.

And these are so basic things that are actually negotiatable in any culture or even between

species in some distant future.

Yeah.

And it's about being curious about the people you're negotiating with or your counterparts.

As you were talking, as we're talking about the broad topic of listening, from my own

experience this year in Ukraine, one thing that I experienced as an outsider was how

obviously we didn't share a common native language.

Everyone's speaking English because I don't speak Ukrainian.

But I was surprised at the curiosity, the good questions, the good active listening

of the people that I was working with and encountering and what the impact on me was,

it felt so much more comfortable than one might think if again, you don't share a common

language, a lot going on in your part of the world.

But the skills of just being what appeared to me genuinely curious, genuinely interested,

asking good questions, willing to share your own point of view, those fundamental communication

skills are super helpful with negotiation, but they also just are good for a human relationship

building because again, for me, it felt as at an odd time in history to be working with

folks in Ukraine.

I just remember I haven't felt so comfortable.

I'd even say safe if you could say that word.

I think it's about the communication style of being curious, asking good questions, just

feeling like you're really present in the conversation, in the negotiation.

It has a positive impact.

If we get back to our topic of negotiation, the more you're making the counterpart feel

that they're trusted, that they're involved, that they are welcome in the negotiation,

not everyone.

You've got to be careful.

If you're negotiating with that zero sum person, you might have to take a different approach.

But when you see your counterparts are actually interested in doing a deal, understanding

how to make it better, curious about you as a person, I think it creates a much better

environment for a much more likely value creation process of negotiation.

I'm just thinking that maybe it depends not on the nation or the cultural aspect, but

on the level of adulthood of the nation.

What is the level of their development?

What is the level of basic needs satisfaction?

Because if you are not satisfied and you don't have something to eat yet, then you don't

think about somebody else's interests or you don't even imagine that you can talk in this

way.

That's why you are negotiating within the zero sum because you needed so much this attitude

or feeling a feel of power or whatever it might be.

The more I work with Western culture, with developed countries like Sweden, for example,

Denmark, they are so relaxed.

They just don't care.

So they do not expect that you will cheat them.

The more you are going to the East and to the less developed countries, I didn't have

too much experience with Africa, for example, but I had a lot of with post Soviet Union

countries.

Then when I went there, I felt like I was again in 90s in the streets of Ukraine in

some cases.

This type of negotiation of showing you the power and masculinity and that they need to

win and you need to lose.

In these cases, you are gathering this information.

I actually brought this cultural information about this type of cultures and I could teach

about that.

I could say that in Azerbaijan, they behave like that, or in Kyrgyzstan, they behave like

that.

But in the same case and in the same time, in the same countries, I met a lot of people

that were highly educated, developed, and they were negotiating in other style.

It was really not the country-based or cultural-based treat, but more about these levels of personal

development of spiritual development of people and what they value in life.

And then the bigger value they have, the easier communication goes.

They are not so frightened.

And the more frightened they are, the worse negotiation goes.

What I say sometimes is that all people in the world are good people.

And if they are doing something wrong, it means that they are suffering.

They have something bad going on with them.

Either they are frightened or they are not getting something to eat or something very

bad.

That's why they are angry.

That's why they are not negotiating and thinking about your interests, but thinking about their

interests.

Yeah.

And the information that they might be consuming may or may not be accurate, which could motivate

different behaviors.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I think that's right.

It took kind of back to that first principle of what are their interests.

Your interest is just basic survival and the norms you've been exposed to are very much

zero sum.

It's natural that you would be suspicious.

That tends to me at least describe an environment which is very low trust, very much zero sum

you and I lose, which just means I've got to be careful that just my main focus is going

to be protecting myself and having my basic needs met.

That's just a very different context than, hey, let's figure out what you have that's

good for that is useful to me, what I have that's useful to you, whether we can put those

things together to get a deal that's good for both of us.

That's just a completely different context than my life depends on getting as much as

I can no matter what in this particular situation.

Yeah.

True.

Your experience and insights were so interesting that I just could not compress them into one

episode.

We kept talking for more than one hour and I decided to split our conversation in two

parts.

The next part will cover the negotiation culture in the US and stereotypes about that.

We will also dive deeper into the Harvard Negotiation methodology and discuss tools

and approaches that you can use in your negotiations.

So stay tuned and if you have not done it yet, subscribe to the Start Global Insights

on all major platforms for podcasts not to miss the second part of our conversation with

Linda Nech, a practicing negotiator and lecturer at Harvard and Stanford Universities.