Lets Expose the Scam and Scammers Trying to Ruin Futures PropFirms

Summary

In this video, Mighty Ox addresses the recent ban on treasury trading by Apex, attributing it to scammers exploiting the system for profit. The host outlines the scam, discusses Apex's heavy-handed response and its PR missteps, and speculates on the future of prop trading firms, suggesting stricter policies and a move towards more live trading. The video also calls out a specific individual, 'Grande,' as a key figure in the scam, urging the community to be vigilant and not to emulate such fraudulent practices.

Takeaways

• 🚩 Apex trading platform has banned the trading of all treasury bonds due to scamming activities.
• 💡 The ban was a response to a scam known as 'treasury sim manipulation', which exploits the simulated trading environment.
• 📢 Apex's communication regarding the ban was poor, with no mass email or notification sent to users, leading to negative public relations.
• 👤 Scammers are targeting prop trading firms that allow many accounts and rarely transition traders to live markets.
• 💼 The scammers aim to avoid live trading and manipulate simulated fills for illegitimate gains.
• 🔍 The speaker will notify other trading firms that might be vulnerable to this scam to protect the trading community.
• 🚫 The actions of scammers have led to increased scrutiny and changes in the prop trading industry, including stricter live trading requirements.
• 🤔 The speaker speculates that the industry may shift towards a model that offers fewer simulated accounts and quicker transitions to live trading.
• 👥 A specific scammer, referred to as 'Grande', is called out for his involvement in the manipulation and is believed to be part of a larger group causing issues.
• 🔑 The speaker advises against trying to learn the scam techniques to exploit other firms, emphasizing the negative impact on the trading community.

Q & A

Why did Apex ban trading of certain bonds?

Apex banned trading of certain bonds due to scammers exploiting a glitch in the simulated trading environment to make illegitimate gains.

What did the scammers exploit to make gains?

The scammers exploited a glitch that allowed trades to be filled at off-market prices or prices that did not exist at the time, resulting in significant illegitimate profits.

How did the scammers operate?

Scammers operated by opening multiple accounts, manipulating simulated fills during illiquid times, and trading for other people without their knowledge.

What was the role of the individual named 'Grande' in the scam?

Grande is considered one of the ringleaders of the scam. He was involved in manipulating simulated fills and trying to avoid going live to continue his fraudulent activities.

Why did Apex start requiring video requests from traders?

Apex started requiring video requests to ensure that the traders were genuine and not scammers manipulating accounts, as part of their response to the scam.

What was the impact of the scam on legitimate traders?

The scam led to Apex banning certain types of bond trading, which negatively impacted legitimate traders who relied on those instruments for their trading strategies.

What changes does the speaker anticipate in the prop trading industry due to these events?

The speaker anticipates that prop trading firms will become stricter, with fewer firms offering multiple simulated accounts and more moving towards a trade-day or earn-trade model.

What was the speaker's opinion on Apex's handling of the situation?

The speaker criticized Apex for their heavy-handed and poorly communicated approach to the situation, which led to bad PR and potential harm to their reputation.

Why did other firms besides Apex also ban or restrict certain types of trading?

Other firms may have banned or restricted certain types of trading to prevent similar scams from happening on their platforms and to protect their own reputations.

What actions did the speaker take to address the scam issue?

The speaker outed one of the scammers, notified other prop trading firms about the issue, and encouraged the community to be vigilant against scammers to prevent further damage.

What does the speaker suggest for the future of traders affected by the ban on bonds?

The speaker suggests that affected traders may need to adapt their strategies or find other firms that still allow the trading of bonds, while also warning against trying to exploit systems.

Outlines

00:00

🚩 Introduction to Apex's Ban on Treasury Trading

The speaker, Mighty Ox, opens the video by addressing the recent decision by Apex to ban all trading of treasuries such as UBZ, BZN, and others on their platform. He criticizes Apex for their lack of communication regarding the ban, noting that it was poorly publicized with just an updated help article and no mass email to users. Mighty Ox also hints at a deeper issue behind the ban, suggesting that it's related to scam activities in the trading community.

05:02

💸 Scammers Disrupt Futures Prop Trading

Mighty Ox delves into the reason behind Apex's ban on treasury trading, attributing it to a scam known as the 'treasury sim manipulation scam'. He explains that scammers have been exploiting a glitch in the simulated trading environment to make illegitimate gains. The speaker reads from an Apex support email that clarifies the ban was due to this scam, which involved trading at off-market prices. He also mentions that other firms might follow suit in banning or restricting certain activities to prevent similar scams.

10:03

🔍 Identifying and Outing the Scammers

The speaker discusses how scammers target prop trading firms that allow many accounts and rarely transition traders to live markets. He shares his intention to notify other firms that might be at risk from these scammers. Mighty Ox also recounts his interactions with a suspected scammer named 'Grande', who he believes is part of a group causing issues in the trading community. He provides examples of how this individual has tried to avoid going live and manipulate the system.

15:03

📉 The Impact of Scamming on the Trading Industry

Mighty Ox speculates on the broader implications of the scamming activities on the trading industry. He suggests that Apex's actions might lead to changes in the industry, such as faster transitions to live trading and stricter account management. He also predicts that the number of firms offering multiple simulated accounts might decrease, leading to a shift towards a more conservative 'earn your trade' model.

20:03

🛑 Conclusion and a Call to Action

In the conclusion, Mighty Ox summarizes the situation and calls out the scammers for ruining the trading experience for others. He urges viewers to be vigilant and not to emulate the scammers' tactics. The speaker also invites viewers to join discussions on social media and his live streams to further discuss the implications of these events on the trading community.

Keywords

💡Mighty Ox Trading

Mighty Ox Trading refers to the presenter's trading platform or brand under which the video is produced. It is central to the video's theme as the presenter discusses issues related to trading, particularly focusing on the banning of bond trading by Apex and the impact of scammers on the trading community.

💡Apex

Apex is mentioned as a trading platform that has banned trading of certain bonds, which is a significant event discussed in the video. The presenter criticizes Apex's handling of the situation, indicating that it has led to a public relations issue and potential changes in the trading industry.

💡Bond Traders

Bond Traders are individuals who trade bonds, a type of debt security. In the context of the video, they are affected by Apex's decision to ban bond trading, which is a key issue that the presenter addresses.

💡Scammers

Scammers are individuals who engage in fraudulent activities. The video discusses how scammers have been manipulating simulated trading environments, leading to Apex's decision to ban certain trading activities. This is a central theme of the video, as it impacts the integrity of the trading community.

💡Simulated Trading

Simulated Trading refers to a practice where traders use virtual money to trade in a simulated market environment. The video discusses how scammers have exploited simulated trading to gain illegitimate profits, which has led to Apex banning certain types of trading.

💡Treasury Bonds

Treasury Bonds are a type of government bond issued by the U.S. Department of the Treasury. In the video, the presenter mentions that trading of these bonds has been banned on Apex, which is a significant event affecting traders.

💡PR Nightmare

PR Nightmare refers to a situation where a company faces severe backlash or negative publicity due to its actions. The video suggests that Apex's handling of the bond trading ban has led to such a situation, with the presenter implying that poor communication has exacerbated the issue.

💡Prop Trading

Prop Trading, or proprietary trading, involves trading financial instruments such as stocks, bonds, and currencies with a company's own capital. The video discusses how scammers are trying to ruin this practice, particularly through manipulation in simulated environments.

💡Live Trading

Live Trading refers to trading in real-time with actual capital at risk. The video suggests that scammers avoid live trading because they do not want to risk their own money, preferring to manipulate simulated environments for profit.

💡Payout Requests

Payout Requests are demands for payment from a trading platform. The video implies that scammers have been making numerous payout requests, attempting to withdraw profits from simulated trading before they are caught or banned.

💡Discord

Discord is a communication platform where traders, including the scammers discussed in the video, congregate and communicate. The presenter mentions that scammers are active on various Discord servers, indicating that this platform is part of the community's infrastructure.

Highlights

Apex has banned all trading of the treasuries ubz bzn.

Apex's decision to ban bonds was communicated poorly, with no mass email sent to users.

The ban on treasuries is due to a scam involving simulated environment manipulation for illegitimate gains.

Scammers have been exploiting a glitch in the system to make tens of thousands of dollars.

Scammers target prop trading firms that allow many accounts and rarely transition to live trading.

The speaker will notify other trading firms that might be victims of this scam.

Scammers have caused additional security measures, such as video requests, to be implemented.

The speaker speculates that Apex and other firms may start moving traders to live accounts faster.

The speaker blames a specific individual, 'Grande', and his group for causing issues within Apex.

Grande was previously involved in a scam that led to account denials by another firm, Lelu.

The speaker shares a conversation with Grande, revealing his intentions to avoid going live.

The speaker predicts that the prop trading industry will move towards a model that transitions to live trading more quickly.

The speaker warns that legitimate bond traders will be negatively impacted by the ban.

The speaker calls out scammers and encourages the community not to figure out their methods to exploit other firms.

The speaker reflects on the potential future of the prop trading industry and the impact of recent events.

Transcripts

the following video is proudly presented

by Min Ox

trading hello everyone and welcome to

Mighty Ox trading of course I am the

mighty Ox in today's video we're going

to talk about the um events from

today what caused the events from today

and how scammers are trying to ruin

Futures prop trading and we're going to

call out those scammers

and even name and shame one so let's get

started by the way yes I know my

lighting sucks I apologize I'm been

working on fixing it sometime this month

I don't do enough of these videos to

invest in lighting but I guess I got to

invest in lighting anyway enough of

that today people woke up Bond Traders

woke up went to trade their Bonds on

apex and found out that they could no

longer trade bonds Apex has banned all

all trading of the treasuries ubz bzn

and the other two that I can't remember

right now all five I don't know if

they've banned the micros I don't know

know if they had the micro treasuries

CFT might have like convinced them never

to add them but anyway so no more

treasury trading on

apex now before I go into the wise that

happened and why Apex and a couple other

firms have have acted like they have

recently

before I act like I'm excusing any of

that because I'm not let's talk about

Apex I'm going to be giving you reasons

why Apex has done a lot of what they've

done over the past couple months but it

does not excuse Apex in my opinion on

how they have done

it they have come in way too

heavy-handed it is very bad PR how

they've been handling this today was

very bad PR nobody knew that bonds had

been

banned it a help article was updated 3

days ago that was it a mass email should

have been sent to everybody I used to

get emails every day of Apex advertising

I used to get text messages from Apex

advertising their sales so I know they

know how to send mass emails mass

communication nothing the fact that they

did nothing to communicate this was just

another big black eye to

Apex again I'm going to go through some

of the reasons why you've seen some of

the changes on apex over the last couple

months but again I am not excusing how

they have handled

this and and it's just been a PR

Nightmare and

I be it's going to be interesting to see

how and if they can recover from this so

with that said let's get into the meat

of this whole issue so why did they ban

treasuries one word

scammers the treasury Sim manipulation

scam now I don't know exactly how this

works don't know I'm not that

smart but I learned of this scam back I

know almost six months ago remember when

Liu started Banning a whole bunch of

people now a lot of what Liu did was

scammy too but there was a group of

people involved in in some of that that

were legitimately banned by lelu because

they were manipulating Sim phills during

illiquid times

on Bonds on treasuries guess I shouldn't

call them Bonds on

treasuries and you know I talked with

Scott from leelu Scott Steve no whoever

it is leelu see Chris why am I thinking

Scott Chris from leelu the CEO of leelu

and he told me there was a group

that were manipulating

sfils and that he he was working with

rhythmic to you know get a case against

them and was going to notify other

companies whether other companies were

notified whether that's how Apex found

out that this was happening or if they

figured it out on their own I don't know

so but this is a you know a known thing

that's been going on for a while now Leo

figured it out now Apex figured it out

fidus I don't know if I pronounce ing

them right they must have figured it out

because they bed uh they banned Bond

scalping a month or so ago month or two

so they figured it out so what exactly

is a scam well you know what even if I

didn't know how to do it I wouldn't tell

you how to do it because I don't want

anyone any other Bad

actors

but let me see here I have it

here I put this together really

quick so I apologize if if I bring up

any of the wrong images no that's the

wrong image I don't know what I do with

it I might not have done it anyway okay

so let me just read it

off this is what Apex sent in a support

email asking why the treasuries were

banned we sincerely apologize blah blah

blah Please be aware that an issue was

identified and reported by our partners

regarding the potential for erroneous

trade fills in the bond markets this

particular issue which only impacts the

simulated environment would in certain

circumstances allow trades to be failed

at off market prices and in some

instances where price did not exist at

that time it is clear from the data

certain individuals have been exploit

this glitch for illegitimate gains these

actions are in direct contradiction to

the rules of the performance account and

the spirit of the trader

evaluation as the end goal of Trader

evaluation and performance assessment is

to prepare a community for the time when

they'll be risking real money out are

theirs in the live market we have the

responsibility to ensure the products we

offer replicate as closely as possible

real life trading

situations as the issue reported is

counter to those goals and the broader

benefits of our community and the

presentation for live trading we have no

choice but to delist bonds from both

trade of a and rhythmic systems at this

time we have no plans for re relisting

bonds of course we regret deeply of any

disruption blah blah

blah

so that's why Bonds

were uh delisted from

Apex so long story short scammers

figured out a way to exploit this and

they have been for and it's not for

little amounts it's not for $100 $200

they're doing 20

accounts multiple contracts tens of

thousands of

dollars tens of thousands of

dollars and this is why and we'll go

into more of this here in a minute but

so this is

why bonds have now been restricted on

apex and you might end up seeing

restricted other places as well if they

can't get a handle on

this so what are the scammers looking

for and I have a misspelling on that

graphic what are they leing for well

like if they got to go to the lou they

got to go to the anyway like I said I

put this together and really quickly

usually takes me like 38 days to put

together video and I put this together

in like two hours so

anyway they look for props that allow a

lot of

accounts

so know words 20 from Apex 20 from lelu

20 you know the the other

ones you know there's other ones out

there fidus flexi and and ft and boox

all allow more than 10 and they look for

props that rarely or never put people on

Live accounts that hit the live

market they don't want live trading and

I'll show you an example of what I would

consider the ring leader I can't say

it's the ring leader for sure but he's

always involved I'll show you example of

how he talks about never wanting to go

live here in a minute so because of this

I will be

notifying uh fast trck I will be

notifying flexi I will be notifying

bolox I will be notifying any others

that could be victim of this scam

because now that these guys have been

outed um by Apex and lelu they're going

to be looking for others and I know he's

already trading at ftt and ftt has

already been notified I sent Sage a

message

tonight I gave him all the information I

told him I'll send them the link to this

video after I'm done but sage has been

notified

so hopefully they'll you know be able to

cover what's going on

there and so I looking to weed out the

scammers because in my opinion they are

causing all our issues so before we go

in who are the scammers because I didn't

put it on the thing you all the those

video uh requests from Apex you want to

know why those started because these

scammers not only do they manipulate

these Sim

fills but Chris melu

inform me they were also trading each

other's accounts or they would find

other people that would didn't know how

to trade and say

hey let's let us use you know somehow

with their computer whether I don't know

connecting through whatever

uh forget those those ways you can

connect to through other people's

computers I don't know exactly how

they're doing it but they're trading for

other people as well so that's why

everyone started getting video requests

because you you had to prove you were

actually TR

so

again these guys have caused all the

issues you've seen coming out of Apex

shouldn't say all the issues again Apex

has overreacted to this bad PR I'm not

taking the the stress off of Apex on on

their part of

this I mean one could argue that they

should have been putting people live

faster so this didn't happen I won't go

into that whole thing we can talk about

that another day seems like that's their

goal now with the emails that went out

today telling people that they're going

to evaluate them over the next 30 days

for move the live so I think we will see

faster moving the live on apex and

probably other places as well but we'll

talk about more of that so who should we

blame I don't know all the names I know

there's groups in various discords and I

will say this guy was in my Discord this

is who I consider the ring leaner of the

gang I don't know if he is or not but

he's everywhere that this is

happening his name is

Grande I don't know it's French we're

going to call him Grande and you can see

here this is DMS with me back in a

March right when the a um sorry leelu

situation was going

on and he was so upset because leelu

wasn't paying him he was they owe him

like you know 50 Grand etc

etc and you can see how

when I first was talking to

him I didn't realize who he was at first

so let's go back a year from here or two

years actually summer of 2022 I am a mod

on ear trade and we just started hearing

about Apex

denying hadn't heard about Apex denying

anybody until this situation came up

denied a guy named constant and his

girlfriend and Grande and constant came

into the earn to trade server to

complain about Apex

darl actually did a video about this

situation so I don't know how Apex ended

up getting scammed again about this

because they caught it once before I'm

assuming it was the same thing maybe it

wasn't I didn't go back and try to find

the video because I personally had

enough of Apex videos

but you know Grande was in there

complaining complaining they they didn't

pay me they didn't pay they didn't pay

blah blah blah and I said you know

enough of this go if you're going to

keep complaining I'm going to ban you I

think I did ban him and he forgot I

banned them

and so fast forward you know we I

started having this conversation when

the whole Leo stuff was coming up and I

put out that Leu about that video about

Leu being a scam so first I'm talking to

him you know thinking he's a victim but

you can see how he talks about here he

says do you have any idea if Apex puts

people alive at some point and if they

do do they pay out every single profit

from the liim

accounts and I you know I told them what

you know what I knew

and he says since I'm in the top 100

Traders from what I've seen from the

merch I've received from them they might

be monitoring my accounts right now

because I was about to ask for 20K

payouts but I heard something about if

they're above 50k they might put me live

so I might just print and ask the

minimum monthly and the day they want to

move me I'll cash out

big and I told them that you know the

one guy knew that they good move to a

live account was after a really big

amount of money and he's right all right

time to just asked for small money

totally trying to make sure he never got

put live then in another conversation

this is after I realized who he was and

after I realized the earn a trade

connection and then Rissa told me that

there were people that were doing this

manipulation Chris was actually wait

willing to tell me the names and I'm

like I don't want to know names I said

number one I I think that violates your

privacy policy number two I just at that

point in time didn't want that

responsibility of

knowing yeah maybe I mean I either way

but you know I realized that this was

one of the guys and it was confirmed by

the way this was one of the guys he told

me right out he was you know denied by

Liu because of this but you can see here

he says I say maybe it's time to go to a

firm that puts people in Live accounts

instead of sim and he comes up with an

excuse well that it' be better to do my

own money then and I was going to do

that after taking K from

leelu my goal is to have a seat at the

CME and go live but here's here's the

kicker but yeah I don't know since I

trade bonds I'm pretty sure bonds are

harder than live SIM for sure so anyway

you will see him now on other discords I

banned him from my Discord after he

started causing issues

and you'll see him now on other discords

and I'm not going to name the Discord

you can go find

him um complaining about how he hasn't

gotten paid from Apex he's been under

investigation now for months blah blah

blah how he's done nothing wrong he's

totally worried now because they told

him he has to start trading something

else he can't trade bonds I don't think

the guy knows how to trade I think the

guy only knows how to manipulate do I

know that for sure no I don't but if a

guy really knows how to trade why

manipulate but my guess is and again

that whole seed on the exchange I bet

you he's probably pulled th thousand

I've seen that he's put in multiple

payout requests

fast trck so I bet you he's pulled out

lots of money and I bet you his group

because he has a group now I'm not going

to name those other names people have

been naming some other names in my

Discord if you really want do that you

know really want to know other names you

come to the Discord do not cause any

trouble though because I will kick you

out or my mods will kick you out as fast

as you

start but so if you want

to you know if you're upset about the

changes that you've seen Apex undergoing

yes partially blame Daron Martin POS

partially

train I'm not talking now partially

blame John Skelton or Mark

Skelton blame Apex for how they've

handled it but blame this guy and his

group for causing the issues in the

first

place and you know that's just straight

up facts

people always find a way to ruin things

they and everything else you know you

can say what you want about the Sim

model of prop firms I there are some

people that always thought well there's

no way that can stay profitable

sustainable but it did because Traders

are

bad and my opinion nothing would have

changed with

Apex if people didn't try and start

taking advantage of the

system so now I expect I expect you're

going to start seeing Apex changes I

mean you already are you're seeing going

to see more people move the Live

accounts I wouldn't be surprised and I

know nothing I know nothing about

anything coming up I wouldn't be

surprised if you see the number of

accounts decreased I don't know anything

I that's just my guessing my my future

you know looking into a crystal

ball and I think you'll see other firms

start doing the same I think live Sim is

going to start um

not going to go away but I think you're

going to start seeing more of the trade

day model the earn the trade model that

put you on for you know 3,000 $6,000 and

then moves you

alive I think it'd be very very start

being rare to see firms

like uh flexi like bolox you know like

Apex has been that hardly ever move

someone live and I think that's also

gonna be the Fallout from this and I

mean it's not a bad Fallout I know some

people hate live and all that and they

want multip they want 20 accounts and I

understand that I totally understand

that I mean I would love 20 accounts so

I can trade one or two contracts I

totally understand it but I think that's

you're going to start seeing that go

away I could be wrong we could be

sitting here you know in a

year and have another 50 Sim only firms

or majority Sim

firms but my opinion

is that

this is where we're headed now because

Apex whether you want to say they're

still a leader of the industry they are

still a leader of the industry of the

I'm not sure if they could be the leader

I would probably say that's TOP Step but

they're one of the leaders and a lot of

these firms look at what Apex is doing

and then they

follow

so again this is why Apex has baned

treasuries this is why you might see

other firms follow Banning treasuries or

putting in at least a specific Tech

amount that you got to you know

get if you're a treasury Trader and a

legitimate treas treasury Trader this

really sucks for you and I you know I

hate that for you because I know it

totally screws up your

strategies because I know that there are

legitimate scalping strategies for the

ultra bonds I mean at$ 3125 a $31 25 a

tick you don't need need a lot to make a

lot but I guarantee you firms are going

to get really

strict and the ones that don't are going

to become

victims

so you know that's why anyway so to wrap

it up because it's already went longer

than I wanted it to that's why Apex

banned

treasuries we have scammers Among Us

that are trying to ruin things for us

I'm outing one of

them you can look to see who's hang who

he's hanging with out the

others you can look for them on the

various

discords don't let the scammers continue

ruining it and don't please don't try

and figure out how they're doing it so

you can try doing it too on other

firms

anyway that's

it let me know in the comments below

what you

think how do you feel about scammers

causing all these

issues my thoughts on how what you think

about my thoughts on the future of the

prop arm

industry and if I was right to call out

this guy and his ban of Merry

scammers that's all I got for today hope

everyone has a great day if you've made

it this far I have CFT te on tomorrow on

my live stream we'll talk about this

more I'm

sure and that's all I got let's go to

the outro if I can find it there it goes

it's always I do remind everybody you

can follow me on Twitter and Instagram

and come join our Discord we've had lots

of good conversation there about this

subject again don't cause me any

problems though or I'll kick you or I'll

for money kick you and join me every day

live on our live streams I'm done see

you next time bye