Switching Productivity Tools - WHEN and HOW you should do it as a Busy Professional

Summary

In this productivity session, Paco and the host discuss the challenges and considerations of switching project management tools within a business. They delve into the 'shiny object syndrome,' where the allure of new tools can lead to frequent changes that may not always be beneficial. The conversation highlights the importance of understanding tool-agnostic workflows and the impact of migrating to a new system, especially for larger teams. They share personal experiences with various tools like Trello, ClickUp, and Asana, emphasizing the need for a clear advantage before making a switch and the potential costs associated with it.

Takeaways

• 📈 Prioritizing tool usage based on business needs and workflows is essential, rather than simply chasing the latest technology.
• 🔄 Switching project management tools can be a complex and costly process, especially for large teams.
• 🤔 It's important to weigh the benefits of a new tool against the potential disruption and training costs.
• 🚀 Established tools with a proven track record can be more reliable for businesses with high task volumes.
• 🛠️ When considering a switch, evaluate how the new tool will integrate with existing workflows and processes.
• 📊 Understanding tool-agnostic workflows is crucial before adopting new tools, as it allows for flexibility and adaptability.
• 🔧 Testing new tools in a controlled environment can help identify potential issues and benefits before full-scale implementation.
• 🔄 Partial migration of tools can be a viable strategy, allowing for a gradual transition without overwhelming the team.
• 💡 The 'shiny object syndrome' can lead to frequent tool changes, which may not always be beneficial for productivity.
• 📈 A pragmatic approach to tool selection and usage, focusing on the core functionalities and performance, is recommended for long-term success.

Q & A

What is the main topic of discussion in this productivity session with Paco?

The main topic of discussion is about changing project management apps and when it is appropriate to switch tools, considering the effort and cost involved.

What was the situation that triggered the discussion on changing apps?

The discussion was triggered by a member of the Inner Circle cohort who was犹豫 about migrating his project management tool from Trello to ClickUp.

What are the considerations when deciding to switch project management tools?

Considerations include the ease of use, understanding of workflows, the potential advantages of the new tool, and the impact on team members who need to onboard to the new system.

Why is it dangerous to stick to the same tools without evolving?

Sticking to the same tools without evolving can be dangerous as it may lead to falling behind in technology, reduced productivity, and inability to take advantage of new features and improvements that other tools offer.

What was Paco's experience with a project management tool that he used for over 15 years?

Paco used a project management tool for over 15 years that worked perfectly for his company, despite being an older technology. It had a robust database model and allowed them to handle over 500,000 tasks without performance issues.

What does Paco look for in a new tool when considering a switch?

Paco looks for a tool that offers a significant advantage, such as easier time tracking using AI, better integration with financial systems, and improved workflows for his team.

How did the company Paco was part of handle the switch from Asana to Trello?

The company decided to switch from Asana to Trello as the official project management tool. However, after calculating the costs and impacts of the migration, they kept using Asana for certain teams and used Trello in parallel, linking the two when necessary.

What is the IORE framework mentioned in the script?

The IORE framework is a tool for organizing and understanding different types of applications in a business. It categorizes apps into core applications, satellite applications, and utility apps, helping businesses decide which apps to keep and which can be easily replaced.

What advice does Paco give for trying out a new app?

Paco advises to first try the app yourself, then share it with someone who has a global vision of the processes within the company. This approach helps in understanding the pros and cons before making a decision to switch or implement the new tool.

What is the 'shiny object syndrome' referred to in the discussion?

The 'shiny object syndrome' refers to the temptation to switch to a new productivity tool or app as soon as a fancier or seemingly better option appears, often leading to a cycle of constant change without fully utilizing the current tools.

What is the key takeaway from the discussion about changing productivity tools?

The key takeaway is that changing productivity tools should be a calculated decision based on clear advantages and understanding of the impact on workflows and team performance. It's important to be pragmatic and consider the costs and efforts involved in such a transition.

Outlines

00:00

📝 Introduction to Productivity and the Paperless Movement

The video begins with a warm welcome to a productivity session focusing on the paperless movement. The host introduces Paco, the co-founder, and discusses the topic of the month within their Inner Circle cohort, which revolves around changing apps and the considerations involved in switching project management tools. The conversation touches on the dilemma of whether to switch to a new tool even if it appears better, and the challenges of migrating workflows and onboarding team members to new tools.

05:01

🛠️ Evaluating the Need to Switch Tools

This paragraph delves into the reasons and strategies for evaluating the need to switch project management tools. The speaker shares personal experiences with various tools like Trello, ClickUp, Asana, and others, highlighting the importance of understanding one's workflow and the tool-agnostic approach. The discussion emphasizes the need to prioritize the business's core needs over the allure of new and shiny tools, and the importance of a gradual and well-thought-out transition when considering a switch.

10:01

🚀 Success Stories and Challenges with Project Management Tools

The speaker recounts specific instances where project management tools have been successfully implemented, such as using Asana in a large corporation and the subsequent switch to Trello. The challenges of migrating thousands of tasks and the impact on team performance are discussed. The paragraph also touches on the speaker's own experiences with different tools and the evolution of these tools over time, emphasizing the balance between sticking with a reliable tool and the potential benefits of exploring new options.

15:02

🧩 Navigating the Transition Between Tools

This section focuses on the practical aspects of transitioning between tools. The speaker describes the process of testing new tools in a 'playground' mode, the importance of having a core set of features, and the need for a direct comparison between old and new tools. The paragraph also addresses the challenges of managing the transition, especially in large teams, and the potential costs and trade-offs involved in abandoning a reliable tool for a new one.

20:03

📈 Final Thoughts on Tool Selection and Evolution

The video concludes with a reflection on the importance of understanding the different types of applications within a business, such as core, satellite, and utility apps, and the implications for tool selection and evolution. The speaker advises on using the iore framework to assess the current tool stack and make informed decisions about when and how to switch tools. The conversation ends with a reminder of the complexities involved in changing tools for a company versus an individual, and the need for a careful and strategic approach.

Keywords

💡Productivity

Productivity in the context of the video refers to the efficiency and effectiveness with which tasks and projects are managed and completed. It is the central theme of the discussion, focusing on how to optimize workflow and tool usage to improve overall performance in business and personal endeavors. The video explores this concept through the lens of project management tools and the decision-making process behind switching or maintaining certain tools.

💡Paperless Movement

The Paperless Movement is a concept or initiative aimed at reducing the use of paper in favor of digital alternatives, promoting a more sustainable and efficient way of managing information and tasks. In the video, this movement is likely the foundation of the discussion on digital productivity tools and their impact on streamlining business processes.

💡Project Management Tools

Project management tools are software applications designed to help teams plan, coordinate, and track projects, often including features like task assignment, progress tracking, and collaboration. In the video, the discussion revolves around the pros and cons of different project management tools like Trello, ClickUp, and Asana, and the considerations for switching between them.

💡Workflows

Workflows are the defined processes or sequences of steps taken to complete a task or project. They are crucial in productivity discussions as they outline the most efficient way to manage and execute work. The video emphasizes the importance of understanding and optimizing workflows, regardless of the specific tool used.

💡Shiny Object Syndrome

Shiny Object Syndrome is a term used to describe the phenomenon where individuals become easily distracted by new, attractive tools or technologies, often leading to frequent changes in the tools they use without fully utilizing the potential of their current tools. The video addresses this issue as a common temptation in the context of productivity tool usage.

💡Migration

In the context of the video, migration refers to the process of transferring data and workflows from one project management tool to another. It involves considerations of cost, effort, and potential disruptions to productivity, making it a significant decision for businesses and individuals.

💡Tool Agnostic

Being tool agnostic means focusing on the underlying processes and workflows rather than being tied to a specific software application. This approach allows for flexibility in choosing the best tool for the job without being limited by brand loyalty or specific features.

💡Inner Circle

The Inner Circle, as mentioned in the video, likely refers to a group of individuals or a community within the Paperless Movement who share insights, experiences, and support each other in their journey towards improved productivity. It is a term that suggests a close-knit, exclusive group focused on specific topics or challenges.

💡Onboarding

Onboarding in the context of the video refers to the process of introducing and integrating new team members or users into a particular productivity tool or system. It involves training and familiarization to ensure that users can effectively utilize the tool and contribute to the team's productivity.

💡Performance

Performance in this context relates to the effectiveness and efficiency with which a tool or system operates, often measured by the successful completion of tasks and projects. The video emphasizes the importance of maintaining high performance through stable and reliable tools, even if they may not have the latest features.

💡Advantage

In the video, advantage refers to the benefits or improvements that a new tool or system can bring over the existing one. It is a critical factor in deciding whether to switch productivity tools, as the potential benefits must outweigh the costs and efforts involved in the transition.

Highlights

The discussion revolves around the dilemma of when to switch project management tools and the associated costs and efforts.

The paperless movement co-founder shares insights on the challenges of migrating between Trello and ClickUp.

The importance of understanding tool-agnostic workflows is emphasized for smooth transitions between different productivity apps.

The presenter's experience with a 60-person team using an older project management tool highlights the risks of sticking with outdated technology.

The presenter's company has successfully managed over 500,000 tasks using their current project management tool.

The concept of 'shiny object syndrome' is introduced, where the allure of new productivity tools can lead to frequent, potentially disruptive changes.

The presenter advocates for a pragmatic approach to tool adoption, only switching when there is a clear and significant advantage.

The story of how the presenter's team transitioned from using no project management tool to successfully implementing Asana.

The challenges of migrating a large team to a new project management tool, such as the switch from Asana to Trello in a corporate environment.

The presenter's strategy for testing new tools involves a personal trial period followed by a gradual rollout within the team.

The importance of having a solid core set of tools and understanding which tools can be easily replaced or enhanced with 'satellite apps'.

The presenter's experience with an established tool, Intervals, which has been consistently improved over 15 years.

The comparison between Asana and ClickUp, with Asana being likened to Apple in its slow, deliberate feature updates.

The risks associated with betting on younger, less established tools that may require frequent workflow adjustments.

The presenter's advice on using the IORE framework to assess the importance of different apps and tools in a business workflow.

The presenter's cautionary tale about the potential downsides of switching tools, including the opportunity cost and the impact on team productivity.

The value of having a tool that has evolved over time and continues to improve, even if it's not the most 'fancy' or feature-rich option.

The presenter's approach to testing new tools in a 'playground' area to assess their potential impact on the business before full implementation.

Transcripts

all right everybody welcome back to

another productivity like a pro session

here with my dear friend Paco our

co-founder of the paperless movement and

today we will dive into a very

interesting topic as usual paperless

movement your productivity your way what

is it about today Paco well it was about

something that emerged in our cohort the

Inner Circle cohort that we are handling

the this month well every month okay

every month we will have one different

cohort and the point and the topic was

about changing apps one of our members

was hesitating between moving his

project management tool from one to

another I think he was doing quite a few

things in Trello I guess I'm not sure

right now well yeah he was running

everything in Trello actually multiple

businesses and then he started to

implement clickup and migrating and

everything at once and this brought up

the discussion about when should you

actually switch tools over the effort

and the cost that are in evolved and

then when you look at this from a

different perspective maybe you don't

even change it even if the other tool is

better and well we saw there Trello and

clickup and obviously when you hear

these two words then you instantly think

well I'm going for clickup but who is

using Trello anyway today it might be

not the case in many businesses as

Trello is very simplistic and easy to

understand for many people and easier to

handle so many people are used to Trello

or kban boards and and therefore it

might be easier to handle so migrating

not only to a different tool but also

workflows and people onboarding to other

tools this is really the topic that we

want to talk about today when you should

do this but it also applies to your

personal tool usage so when should you

switch any tool overall I mean by the

things that we will discuss today you

will see this from a different

perspective and it also goes along with

the topic shiny object syndrome you you

see a fancy trailer a YouTuber talking

about a new productivity tool and you

say man this is the one and only tool

that I need now and you instantly start

switching and then you well that's what

we want to dive into today yes because

there's a fear and I'm the first about

that fear and it's the sensation of

being behind that you are not taking

advantage of a certain technology or a

tool that you are using or a stick to

the same tools so that you are not

evolving well in my opinion it's quite

dangerous especially when you are

dealing with a lot of users in my case

for instance we are more than 60 people

in one of the companies and for instance

we keep using a project management tool

that I've always said that it works

perfectly it's quite old it was a bet I

made I think over 15 years ago so you

can imagine the technology at that time

and well they have been keep evolving

and if you compare this tool with the

current project managers like aana or

clickup or or linear well if you compare

it with linear man what a difference but

the point is that it works perfectly

okay all the workflows work without any

problem everybody knows what needs to be

done we are able to prioritize we use it

as a communication tool so we don't use

email talking about task related to

projects and the thing is well we are

also registering our recording Sor are

ours that we dedicate to the different

projects and well pretty easy the the

app name

that okay because there's aial it's

quite unknown because in fact the thing

that I love the most about this app it

was the database model behind the tool

because I saw that the different

entities the objects the relationships

between them the links how everything

was pretty well implemented and I think

that the success of any tool we are

seeing like some of the tools like for

instance to do is is leveraging thanks

to have that amazing database model that

allows them to connect anything to

leverage to create new features without

affecting the foundational core and

really fast and this applications for

instance has been well improving little

by little it's something that is not

something fancy it's not something

horrendus okay I have to say that too

but the point is that I will never try

to change it unless I clearly see that

there's a clear Advantage okay without

any hesitation because I have to say

something at the beginning without using

a tool it seems that everything is going

to work pretty well and the moment that

you go really deep into that tool you

see the weaknesses that any other tools

has so beware that's the thing that I

say and the question is now well

obviously the question arises what is

this tool and what is the name and you

said intervals but now is the question

would you recommend it to somebody who

is just starting a new business now I

mean in this case it would be for a

marketing agency right it depends on the

use case for me it's something that it's

a tool really easy to understand so if

you have many uses I do think that it's

a a good bet it's just a matter of

giving it a try and see if it worked but

if you try to compare it with any of

this project management tool the the

current that I have mentioned that you

can find and are the big players like

well even Monday I forgot about Monday

for instance I have to say I have tried

all of them okay I have try Asana and I

currently using clickup I'm currently

using linear I have used Monday in the

past I think I have used most of the big

players talking about well Trello was

something that never worked for me it

was too simple and for me there's a

moment that Canan boards don't work if

you have a high volume of information

and the point is that most of these

tools even intervals you can see the

information in C Bo you can do that in

Monday well in many of the project

management tool you can do it so well

it's a feature that even some of that

are not so board-based I would say they

are currently using it so well why not

for me it's simple it works it's a

company that it's really well

Consolidated because in fact as usually

happens it was a software company okay

who didn't find out the correct project

management tool and then they decided to

create their own tool and well it worked

so well for them that they started to to

sell it and well in fact they've been

doing it I thought and it was one of my

biggest fear in that it was going to

disappear but it never disappear and

they kept running the business and they

kept improving it and they also improve

the onboarding process and well you can

handle many things using that tool but I

could say that it looks like all the

style I could say it works at the end I

am pragmatic and it's a tool that I've

been using it I think that the last year

we handle more than 500,000 tasks so you

can imagine the the volume of this tool

without any problem I mean the database

behind it's really welld developed and

that's why you don't have any

performance issues for instance that's

important when you are talking about big

okay quote 60 people team but well it's

quite quite a white people especially if

you pay the salaries every month and the

point well it's one of the tool and

that's why I cannot move it has to be

something so lifechanging for instance

and really looking forward right now to

an amazing tool to record the hours of

the team much easily using AI using

recommendation using historical data so

people can't record their hours because

of the talking about the profit of each

project each client well a much more

complex tool that it's link to the

financial system and that's why I've

been always looking and in fact right

now I'm trying to look for another tool

but at the moment I haven't changed it

for these big players that I've just

mentioned yeah and Ariel just says how

do you try an app is it not a quite

complex issue and that's exactly what it

is trying an app or especially with the

team and when should you do this so I

would tell a bit of a about my backstory

there when I was part of a team in big

corporate I was advocating always new

tools and improved team performance and

there was a struggle in the beginning

because we instantly implemented new

tools in the team and everybody had to

start to using that but not everybody is

a fan of switching tools and then they

have Daily Business to do and this is

where the first learning I mean we are

talking from more than 10 years ago

there I started to use them myself along

with the exist tools but there what key

is you have to understand the tool

agnostic workflows first and that's what

where iore comes into play when you go

through arel you just joined the Payless

movement well you just joined the

Payless movement membership so welcome

to the party when you go through the

iord Journey now you will get the

understanding of the tool agnostic

Concepts and workflows in productivity

end to end from information collection

and management to also project

management task management and so on to

the action world and this is really key

that's why we are so forcing the things

into the tool agnostic space even though

that we are providing implementation

examples how we Implement these Concepts

and workflows to the tools that we use

ourselves to better explain how they

work in real life but key is to

understand the workflows in your

business in the tools that you're

currently using if you don't have any

workflows or you don't recognize them

this is the moment where you start to

write them out to understand them

because then you can instantly switch to

different tools because the underlaying

workflows will just work in any other

tool you will realize and that's why we

say that you will realize when you go to

Monday assana clickup intervals I don't

care I'm not even scared opening any

other tool up because there will be

always a basic set of features that

every project manager provides and then

you will have the understanding what

features you really need to run your

business and therefore one tool provides

more features in One Direction and

another tool provides features in a

different direction and therefore you

start to understand what is really

helping you so getting back to my

example I was taking over a team was a

team leader myself and they had no

project management tool at all and I was

working in a 300,000 employee company

and there was obviously a lot of

actually human project managers right

they had their tools and we were working

in several projects and I came into this

team and I used aana back then as the

first tool for myself just to collect

projects that my team is working on

because they were firefighters they had

no idea so we had to get some structure

and therefore I was collecting all the

projects that these been working on and

they were working on 150 projects in

parallel with five people globally and

that's where I had them already listed

all in assana and therefore I was able

then to go to the manager and and show

him well these are all the projects we

are working on there are too many now

you see them listed out so we were able

to prioritize the projects that we

really need to focus on so we narrowed

it down to 50 projects and then I

onboarded the team slowly to assana

because this became each project in

assana became a single source of Truth

for this project so we started to

collecting information on this project

and this is where the team then learned

the advantage of having one tool where

they know when they go there they will

find all the information in Need for

this project instead of somebody calling

you about the project and then you start

searching for the information from all

the different sources and uh while this

became so successful that we also got a

different department in the engineering

department and we worked together in the

same tool cross Department wise and then

we rolled out Asana for more than a

thousand people globally all working in

Asana and well we came up to 16,000

tasks handling per month within just

half a year and now we come to the topic

of this podcast we were running this

assana it was very successful the team

performance increased by 40% cross C

Department performance and suddenly the

company decides that Trello becomes the

official project management tool for the

whole company 300,000 employees and we

have to kill aana and actually I was

working in it and I was a business

analyst and it was my job to explain

exactly when we should switch tools and

so I get a request from the management

well you have to kill asan you have to

use Trello now and I just make a simple

calculation how much it would cost to

stop the projects that we are working on

right now to migrate data over 16,000

tasks to the new project to onboard the

thousand people to these new workflows

in Trello because Trello had less

features than aana therefore we were

leveraging a lot more so we had to work

do workarounds so we've been talking

about a million about a million euros

for the migration process itself just to

go to a tool that they say we should use

and therefore this number when they see

costs versus the force that you have to

go over then we stopped it we were able

to keep using Asana on the other hand we

always were forcing the things that we

all using the same tool because it makes

it so much easier to use this so to

overcome this we had to use Trello in

parallel and therefore in Trello

whenever a project manager was in Trello

we were linking out to the relevant

tasks in assana and that's always key so

you're always able to build up systems

in parallel and then have at least the

links to the relevant content in one

Major Tool and that's the same that we

said to our Inner Circle member in this

coaching session where he should slow

down with the migration process as he

was talking about I don't know 160

people something migrating to a new an

API to an AP well there was there was

another there was another in member

trying to migrate from Monday to clickup

that was the apis so he wanted to bring

over dashboards but the one member with

Trello and click up so he partially

migrated and was the right process

migrated just one Department was the

marketing department starting in clickup

and therefore it needs really to be

siloed so they have really their

processes in their Department it's not

affecting the other departments so it's

a big step to really switch tools and it

really needs to have a big advantage to

switch the tools because the moment

where you get excited about oh man when

we are in there in your brain it looks

so fancy everything and it makes all the

sense that you use this new tool but the

moment you go to the new tool this is

where then after one two months you

realize man it's not so much better than

the other one but the opportunity costs

where people weren't able to focus on

tasks not being able to work on new

stuff this migration espe especially

with big teams this is crazy if you just

getting started with your business your

solopreneur I mean this is a lot easier

but even then I was using notion for a

long time then I switched to click up

then I tested all the other things

obviously this was my chob in the side

hustle with the paperless movement

testing out all the project managers in

addition to the ones that already new

this is where I came up with the

playground where the sent box mode where

I just have a closed area where I say

okay I'm testing this tool now but this

is not part of my business I'm just

playing and I'm just pretending that I'm

using it and then you see the friction

points and then you really see if it is

worth migrating or not and even if it is

more effort to run the tools in parallel

it's really worth it because you have a

direct comparison to what you have right

now and what you could have in the other

tool and then it makes sense to really

look into is it worth cost investment to

migrate over all the stuff to the new

tool yes for me the the way to try an

app is well I try it myself that's the

first thing and the moment that I'm more

or less convinced then I have one person

in the company that has a global vision

of the processes because she's in the

middle of everything and then I share it

with her and we theci side okay we see

the pros and cons and the point is that

most of the tools are rejected by us

okay no matter how different they may

seem or how they crucial or that we are

missing something by not using these new

tools because it's really tough it's

really tough when you have to handle

with the people's frustration all the

trade-offs of people wasting their times

people getting angry because they cannot

work comfortable too many things that at

the end at the end and also this shows

that when you have Consolidated

workflows that they have been working

pretty well in a complex system as a

business is you don't need to reinvent a

whe constantly you know it's much better

to stay and bet on good tools that even

you see this is not one of the big

players in the market of project

management but even this tool is

evolving is progressing because I have

to say for during this 15 years it has

evolved okay and and the team with with

them they have been introducing new

features they have been improving they

are constantly well improving the things

so why not having maybe it's not so

fancy or maybe we are lacking some of

the features for instance talking about

Knowledge Management is not a tool at

all okay you cannot compare with those

project management like ca where you can

perfectly combine the bkm area and the

area bkm and BPM bkm and BPM okay I mean

the project management and the knowledge

management related to business but well

it doesn't matter okay behind for be we

have some of the tools like for instance

Google Docs okay and all the power of

Google behind so we just put the link in

that project management and everything

is connected and also we are building a

huge Knowledge Management database based

on on another tool that I always forget

the name strip I think because I'm

always confused with stripe I think it's

strip well it's quite famous and they

are making an amazing job talking about

Knowledge Management for companies and

well we are getting and covering those

gaps but the core element you know the

action the getting things done for the

company especially with that high volume

of data is well preserved we are really

happy people are happy although many of

them complain because they want more

futuristic tools okay but at the end

it's much better for the company to stay

on the things that you know than those

one who may be better at the beginning

but the moment that you start using them

daily and with high volume of data it's

something that sometimes you have

surprises and that's something that I

have well especially about performance

it's something that you never should

take for granted because when you are

dealing with a huge amount of data is

not the same with for instance when

you're in a testing Zone okay with

yourself just one project that you take

as a test and things like that when you

start uploading the things and a lot of

recurring uses for instance too it's not

just a matter of the database model but

also the servers the well too many

technical aspects that when a huge

company is working daily without any

problem changing that a step forward

should be huge okay to justify that move

because the tradeoff and the suffering

of the transition is horrendous

horrendous right now I'm an and this is

being well it's knocking me down for one

year and even three years before that we

were preparing everything well it's a a

mess a mess when you are dealing with

complicated systems the thing is also so

that you bet on intervals makes also

sense with a 15-year established tool

and they keep improving the things they

make probably slow steps because they're

careful not to destroying all the setups

for from their customers if you compare

it to something like clickup that is

fairly young company and now they made a

switch from clickup 2.0 to 3.0 and if

you go to the forums people are really

complaining because all the workflows

need to be Rewritten how to go to the

inbox where they Pro process Sops that

they established already so for clickup

it was the right decision to get to this

next level that was important they had

to do it but if you bet on a young tool

you have to expect these changes right

that's the thing and how crucial this is

so that's why I compared always Asana

and clickup being Asana the apple and

clickup more the Android thing where

Apple also makes very slow changes it's

very small changes but then if they

Implement something it makes sense and

the overall concept of the tool and

that's what you see in aana it is also

of one of the very established tools

since when they launch also more than 10

years or maybe even 15 years ago already

I remember that that was the first one

that we used back then and we wi labeled

it for the big company and they had all

these things as well that you were able

to Wi label this for big companies and

they were targeted towards big companies

so they cannot afford to really make

fancy changes in there there that

interrupts everything or introduces bugs

because as you mentioned imagine that

the project manager stops working for

one week the whole business just stops

working that's the that's really the

issue and where you really have to be

careful with all these fancy new tools

coming out and saying well we are the

next clickup we are better than clickup

and better than notion and so on if you

are solar preneur starting out you can

bet on these things and maybe you don't

have so many tasks but once you as pako

says with 500,000 tasks imagine you go

to a tool that you don't know the future

of and maybe it disappears in one year

from now this is just impossible for the

bigger companies and this is why the

established tools bet on the big

companies and the smaller tools they

really reach out for the entrepreneurs

and so on and try to promote it rather

there yes and it's also it also happens

and it happens to me that when you have

been using a tool for quite a long time

you start to not to pay attention to

certain features you think that they

exist all over the place no matter the

tool and it's the moment that you make

the move when you start well remembering

all those features that meant nothing

for you at that moment when you were

using your current tool and it's now

when you have made the change when you

start saying that it wasn't so bad your

current application and that's something

that it's inherent I could say to human

beings okay that it's the moment that we

lose something the moment that we pay

attention to that no and the moment that

we have it we don't pay any attention at

all so be careful and uh well that

doesn't mean that you don't evolve okay

we are constantly evolving but the pace

for a company is not the same as an

individual because it's impossible okay

because the complexity has nothing to do

and well one thing is well I'm going to

change my task manager for me and

another thing is I'm going to change the

the project management of a whole

company that's totally different and the

approach should be totally different and

that's where the Ia framework comes into

place so for me who join you laying out

your current tool stack on the iore

framework and there you learn the

difference between core applications

satellite applications and utility apps

so the core applications usually are

your project managers the no taking apps

where you have your P Gams in there and

they should be very rarely changed and

satellite apps are just enhancing your

existing core apps and therefore they're

easy to exchange so if this is something

you're interested in and you haven't

done already your IO framework do this

first because then you will very quickly

realize what is really your important

apps in your business that you should

keep running as long as possible and

which one could you replace very easily

with other tools so well I think that

was it about the session everything that

needed to be said res said and if not

then let us know we are happy to follow

up in the next live Q&A so until then

catch you up in the next one okay see

you guys bye-bye