Nick Neuman: Bitcoin Multisig Collaborative Self-Custody and Inheritance Planning with Casa

Summary

In this episode of Coin Stories, Natalie Brunel interviews Nick Neuman, co-founder and CEO of Casa, a company specializing in multisig Bitcoin custody solutions. They discuss the importance of secure Bitcoin storage, the concept of multisig technology, and how Casa simplifies the process for users. Neuman highlights Casa's focus on removing single points of failure and enhancing security without compromising user-friendliness. The conversation also touches on inheritance planning and privacy concerns, emphasizing the company's commitment to helping users maintain control over their Bitcoin holdings.

Takeaways

• 😀 Casa is a company specializing in multisig custody solutions for Bitcoin, aiming to simplify the process of securing private keys.
• 🔐 Multisig, or multi-signature, custody involves multiple keys safeguarding a pool of Bitcoin, requiring a certain number of these keys to authorize transactions.
• 📱 Casa utilizes a mobile app for one of the multisig keys, which can be encrypted and backed up to the cloud, enhancing resilience against loss.
• 🔒 The inclusion of a mobile key in Casa's multisig setup does not compromise security; it's just one part of the required signatures to move Bitcoin.
• 🛡️ Casa's design philosophy focuses on removing single points of failure, ensuring that users maintain control over their Bitcoin even if one component of the system fails.
• 🌐 Casa operates as a non-custodial service, meaning they do not control user assets, which aligns with global regulations that do not require KYC for wallet software providers.
• 🚫 Casa's system allows for 'sovereign recovery' where users can regain access to their Bitcoin even if Casa is no longer operational.
• 👪 The company offers inheritance planning tools that allow Bitcoin holders to securely pass on their assets to designated beneficiaries.
• 🔒 Casa has a feature that enables account holders to lock out and prevent unauthorized access attempts by designated beneficiaries during a six-month waiting period.
• 💡 The discussion highlights the importance of self-custody for Bitcoin as a means to protect against systemic financial risks and to uphold individual financial sovereignty.

Q & A

What is Casa and what problem does it aim to solve?

Casa is a company that specializes in multi-signature (multisig) technology for Bitcoin security. It was created to address the challenge of securing private keys, especially for larger amounts of Bitcoin, by providing a system that reduces the risk of loss or theft through the use of multiple keys.

How does multi-signature custody work in the context of Casa?

Multi-signature custody with Casa involves having multiple keys that protect a single pool of Bitcoin. To spend the Bitcoin, a certain number of these keys (for example, two out of three) are required to approve the transaction, providing a layer of security against loss or theft.

Why did Casa decide to incorporate a mobile app into its multisig solution?

Casa decided to include a mobile app in its multisig solution to provide a resilient and convenient key that can be encrypted and backed up to the cloud, reducing the risk of losing access to the key. The app also contributes to a more controlled and secure environment compared to a browser, especially for holding one of the necessary multisig keys.

What is the significance of Casa's approach to not being a financial service company?

By not being a financial service company, Casa is not required to perform KYC (Know Your Customer) procedures for its users, allowing for greater privacy. It also means Casa does not have control over users' assets, which is important for maintaining the principle of self-custody.

How does Casa address the concern of trusting a company with one of the multisig keys?

Casa addresses this concern by ensuring that the key it holds is not enough to move funds on its own. Even if Casa's key is compromised, the funds cannot be accessed without the other keys. Additionally, Casa has a feature called 'Sovereign recovery' that allows users to recover their Bitcoin even if Casa is no longer available.

What is the process for inheriting Bitcoin through Casa's system?

Casa has an inheritance planning tool that allows users to designate a family member or a friend to inherit their Bitcoin. The designated person can request access to the Bitcoin after the owner passes away, which starts a six-month timer during which the original owner can revoke the request if they are still alive or if something seems amiss.

Why is it important for Casa users to consult with an attorney about inheritance planning?

Consulting with an attorney is important for Casa users to understand the legal and tax implications of inheritance planning, especially to ensure that the transfer of Bitcoin aligns with estate planning laws and to avoid potential issues down the line.

What is the philosophical reason behind Casa's encouragement for users to self-custody their Bitcoin?

Casa encourages self-custody of Bitcoin because it aligns with the core principles of Bitcoin, which include individual control and freedom. Self-custody allows users to have direct control over their assets, which is a significant advancement in financial autonomy.

How does Casa's approach to Bitcoin security compare to traditional financial institutions?

Casa's approach to Bitcoin security differs from traditional financial institutions by offering a decentralized and self-sovereign model. It provides tools for individuals to secure their own Bitcoin without relying on a central authority, reducing systemic risk and enhancing personal control over one's assets.

What is the 'Sovereign recovery' feature in Casa's multisig setup and why is it important?

The 'Sovereign recovery' feature in Casa's multisig setup allows users to recover their Bitcoin even if Casa is not available. It is important because it ensures that users maintain full control and access to their funds, regardless of the status or existence of Casa as a company.

Outlines

00:00

🔐 Introduction to Casa and Multisig Custody

In the first paragraph, Natalie introduces Nick Newman, the co-founder and CEO of Casa, a company specializing in multisig custody for Bitcoin. Natalie, being a new Casa customer herself, expresses her excitement to discuss how Casa helps secure Bitcoin through multisig technology and inheritance planning. Nick explains that Casa was founded in 2018 to address the challenges of securing private keys, especially for larger Bitcoin holdings. He emphasizes the importance of not losing or having the key stolen, which could lead to total loss of funds. Casa aims to simplify the process of securing Bitcoin through an easy-to-use multisig system, which requires multiple keys to access the funds, thus enhancing security.

05:01

📱 Multisig Explained and Casa's Mobile App

Paragraph two delves into the concept of multisig (multi-signature) custody, where multiple keys are used to secure a single pool of Bitcoin, similar to multiple keys needed to access a bank vault. Casa uses a two-out-of-three key system, with one key on the user's phone, one on a hardware wallet, and one held by Casa. This setup allows for secure transactions without Casa's direct involvement. The discussion also addresses concerns about security on mobile devices, with Nick arguing that a mobile app can be more secure than a browser extension, especially due to the controlled environment and security features like the secure element on smartphones.

10:02

🔑 Casa's Approach to Security and Privacy

In the third paragraph, the conversation continues with Nick explaining Casa's commitment to removing single points of failure in Bitcoin security. He discusses the option for users to replace the mobile key with a second hardware wallet key, providing flexibility and addressing security concerns. The discussion also touches on privacy, with Nick highlighting that Casa, as a non-financial service company, does not require Know Your Customer (KYC) procedures, allowing users to maintain anonymity while using the platform.

15:04

🛡️ Casa's Sovereign Recovery and Privacy Features

Paragraph four focuses on Casa's 'Sovereign recovery' feature, which allows users to access their Bitcoin even if Casa is no longer available. This feature ensures that users are not locked out of their funds if something happens to the company. Additionally, the conversation covers Casa's privacy measures, emphasizing that the company does not sell or facilitate trading of Bitcoin, thus providing a higher level of privacy for its users.

20:06

🏡 Inheritance Planning with Casa

The fifth paragraph discusses Casa's inheritance planning tool, which allows users to set up a secure process for their family members to access their Bitcoin after they pass away. This is done through a multisig setup that does not make family members a security risk before the owner's death but enables them to access the funds afterward. The process is designed to be simple, even for those less familiar with Bitcoin, and includes a six-month waiting period before access is granted, providing an additional security measure.

25:09

🌟 The Importance of Self-Custody and Casa's Mission

In the final paragraph, Nick reflects on why people should consider self-custody of their Bitcoin over convenience options like ETFs, especially considering the potential for systemic financial risks. He argues that self-custody aligns with the core values of Bitcoin as a hedge against such risks and offers unprecedented control and freedom over one's money. Nick shares his personal journey from investment banking to entrepreneurship and his passion for empowering individuals through Casa's products, which aim to help people take control of their most important data, starting with their Bitcoin.

Keywords

💡Multisig

Multisig, short for 'multisignature', is a requirement in a cryptocurrency wallet that necessitates more than one key to authorize a transaction. In the context of the video, multisig custody is a method of safeguarding Bitcoin by requiring multiple signatures to access the funds. Casa, the company discussed, uses multisig technology to enhance security, ensuring that a single point of failure, such as the loss or theft of a single key, doesn't compromise the entire holdings. For instance, Casa's setup might require two out of three keys to validate a transaction, providing a robust security model against loss or theft.

💡Self-custody

Self-custody refers to the practice where individuals hold the private keys to their cryptocurrency, giving them full control and responsibility over their assets. The video emphasizes the importance of self-custody for Bitcoin, as it allows users to maintain sovereignty over their holdings without relying on third-party intermediaries like exchanges. Casa facilitates self-custody through its user-friendly multisig technology, which is central to the company's mission of empowering individuals to securely manage their Bitcoin.

💡Inheritance planning

Inheritance planning in the video pertains to strategies for passing on cryptocurrency assets after an individual's death. Casa offers a feature that allows users to plan for the inheritance of their Bitcoin by setting up a process where designated family members or beneficiaries can access the assets using Casa's multisig technology. This planning is crucial for ensuring that Bitcoin does not become inaccessible or lost, aligning with the video's theme of secure and responsible asset management.

💡Private key

A private key in cryptocurrency is a secret number that allows Bitcoin owners to access their funds. The video underscores the importance of securing private keys, as losing them results in the irreversible loss of Bitcoin. Casa's multisig solution mitigates this risk by spreading the responsibility of key management across multiple keys, reducing the reliance on a single, vulnerable point.

💡Hardware wallet

A hardware wallet is a physical device used to store private keys offline, providing a high level of security against digital theft. In the video, Casa's multisig setup includes a hardware wallet as one of the keys required for transactions, highlighting the company's commitment to robust security practices. The use of hardware wallets is a common theme in discussions about secure cryptocurrency storage.

💡Sovereign recovery

Sovereign recovery is a feature mentioned in the video that allows users to regain access to their Bitcoin even if Casa as a service is no longer available. This underscores the video's message about self-determination and control over one's assets, aligning with the broader ethos of Bitcoin and decentralized finance. It ensures that users are not entirely dependent on Casa's infrastructure for their asset security.

💡KYC

KYC, or 'Know Your Customer', is a regulatory requirement for financial institutions to verify the identity of their clients. The video discusses how Casa operates within legal boundaries by not requiring KYC for its services, thus offering a non-custodial solution that respects user privacy. This is a significant point in the discussion about the balance between regulation and individual privacy rights in cryptocurrency management.

💡Systemic risk

Systemic risk refers to the risk that a failure in one part of a system can cause a collapse of the entire system. In the video, the concept is used to argue for self-custody of Bitcoin as a hedge against potential systemic failures in traditional financial systems. The discussion implies that holding Bitcoin in a self-custodial manner like Casa's multisig setup can protect against such broader financial risks.

💡Decentralization

Decentralization is a core principle of Bitcoin, meaning that it operates on a peer-to-peer network without a central authority. The video connects this principle to the idea of self-custody, suggesting that just as Bitcoin is decentralized, so too should the custody of Bitcoin be in the hands of the individual. Casa's services are designed to support this decentralized ethos by providing tools for individuals to manage their own keys.

💡$5 wrench attack

A '$5 wrench attack' is a colloquial term used in the video to describe a physical theft or coercion scenario where someone might use force or threat to obtain access to a person's private keys. Casa's multisig technology is presented as a defense against such attacks, as it requires multiple keys to access the funds, making it harder for a single compromise to result in a total loss.

Highlights

Casa is a company focused on multisig custody solutions for Bitcoin security.

Founded in 2018, Casa has become a major provider of self-custody solutions for Bitcoin.

Multisig technology requires multiple keys to access a pool of Bitcoin, enhancing security.

Casa's system is designed to be resilient against loss, theft, and human error.

Users can choose to have one key on their mobile phone, increasing convenience.

Casa provides the option to replace the mobile key with a second hardware wallet for those desiring more security.

Casa's multisig setup allows for the secure inheritance of Bitcoin, even if the original owner passes away.

Casa offers a non-custodial service, meaning they do not control or facilitate trading of users' Bitcoin.

Users can sign up for Casa without undergoing KYC, maintaining privacy.

Casa's 'Sovereign recovery' feature allows users to access their Bitcoin even if Casa is no longer available.

Casa's inheritance planning tool is designed to be user-friendly, even for those less familiar with Bitcoin.

The account owner can revoke access requests from beneficiaries during a six-month waiting period.

Casa's CEO, Nick Newman, shares his journey from investment banking to entrepreneurship in the Bitcoin space.

Casa's mission is to empower individuals with control over their most important data through private keys.

Nick emphasizes the importance of self-custody for Bitcoin as a hedge against systemic risks.

Casa's product is designed to be simple and secure, making it accessible for users of all technical levels.

Transcripts

[Music]

welcome back to the show joining me this

week is co-founder and CEO of Casa Nick

Newman I'm really excited to talk to you

Nick and full disclosure I am a new

customer of Casa and recently partnered

with them I'm super excited to share

more information on how you can safely

um secure your Bitcoin with multisig

custody and talk about inheritance

planning so Nick welcome to the show

thanks Natalie I'm Rel I've been wanting

to do a show with you for a while so I'm

really excited to be here well let's get

right into it um tell us a little bit

about Casa because when it comes to

multisig custody I feel like there

aren't a lot of solutions out there so

how did CA start and what makes it so

special yeah so Casa was really one of

the O probably the OG multisig company

and so what we when when we created Casa

as it is today back in 2018 we were

talking to people who owned Bitcoin and

just realizing that everything really

comes down to the private key and very

many people were feeling just nervous

about securing their private key

especially when you're securing larger

amounts of Bitcoin you have to really

make sure you don't lose that key or

else you've lost all your money or you

have to make sure it doesn't get stolen

or you know for uh stolen through a $5

doll wrench attack these these kinds of

things are real things that bitcoiners

have to think about and it was just

really difficult to do that we as humans

are not meant to be perfect around

keeping one thing safe right we can

barely secure the passwords to our

Facebook how are we going to keep this

like password to our Bitcoin secure

forever and so we looked into multisig

as a way to solve that problem and

realized that while multisig was doable

in some kind of difficult ways with some

of the the software that was out there

there was no company that was really

making that easy for people and so we

built Casa to use multi- sake technology

to make Bitcoin security easier and so

we've been around since 2018 we are one

of the largest providers of self-

custody for Bitcoin in the world we

protect billions of dollars worth of

bitcoin today and all of that comes down

to back to just making it really easy

for people to secure p multip private

keys to protect their Bitcoin through

multisig technology and to do that in a

way that just feels simple and safe and

that that it one it needs to actually be

simple and safe but the feeling part of

it is pretty important because when it

comes to people's money they really want

to make sure that they feel comfortable

with whatever they're doing and so

everything we've built in Casa is really

built to in uh impart that feeling to

people and that's really important for

us well I can attest to that um it's a

very simple mobile app we're going to

have a how-to video that you can check

out so that you can um just follow along

follow the steps and have your handheld

while you're putting your uh Bitcoin

into multisig custody so for people that

might be listening or watching that are

brand new what is multisig multi-

signature custody how do you describe it

simply to people yeah so most of the

time when you think about securing

Bitcoin and self custody you've got one

private key and that one private key is

protecting all of your Bitcoin you lose

that key you lost the

Bitcoin uh with multisig you've got

multiple Keys protecting one pool of

Bitcoin so it isn't like you have a

little bit of Bitcoin on each key think

of it like you've got a pool of Bitcoin

and then you've got a set of keys

protecting that so just like if you have

a a safety deposit box at the bank or

you imagine like a bank vault you go to

the the actual Vault they've got

multiple keys that they have to put in

and turn at the same time in order to

actually access the Bitcoin and so um

with multi-sig on on bitcoin what you're

doing is let's say you have three keys

you need any two of those three keys to

actually spend your money so you um with

Casa you've got one key on your phone

you've got one key on a hardware wallet

and you've got one key that's held by

Casa so anytime you go to spend B

Bitcoin typically what you're doing is

starting in the mobile app approving a

transaction from your phone and then

going to your Hardware wallet plugging

that into Casa through your computer and

approving the transaction from the

hardware wallet so that gives you the

two out of three signatures or approvals

that you need to move Bitcoin so let's

say that and in that way you can move

Bitcoin without Kasa ever being involved

let's say you lose your Hardware wallet

normally if you didn't have your seed

phrase you'd lose your Bitcoin but with

Casa you can use that key that's on your

phone and the key that's held by Casa to

still access your Bitcoin and then get a

new hardware wallet rotated in to the

set and still get back to full health

and be able to to S uh remain very

secure with your Bitcoin and so it gives

people the ability to make mistakes

without having that lead to catastrophic

loss and one of the things that Jameson

says all the time and Jameson Lop is is

my co-founder at Casa is he always says

Casa is all about removing single points

of failure we really want to make sure

that you don't have a single uh mistake

that's able to make you lose your money

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such a great point you actually took the

words out of my mouth because with

Bitcoin you don't have a single point of

failure it's decentralized you also want

to decentralize the risk with your own

self- custody um and before when I've

done multisig custody I did not use my

mobile phone so why did you decide to go

in that direction of having an app and

for those who might think well I'm

worried about this being on my phone

what do you say to them yeah so what's

really nice about Casa is that yes one

key is on your phone but that's just one

key out of the set that you need to move

Bitcoin and so what we've tried to do as

we as we designed Casa was create a

system that is resilient against many

different types of problems so one of

the things that you get from a mobile

key that you don't get from a hardware

wallet key is you can encrypt that

mobile key and back it up to the cloud

and so that makes it actually a very

resilient key so now normally in Bitcoin

security everybody's like don't put your

keys in the cloud that's Danger

dangerous right that's true if it's the

only key protecting your Bitcoin because

in that scenario if somebody were

somehow compromise that account then

they can get all of your Bitcoin but

with a key that is just one of a set

it's actually great to be able to

encrypt that and back it up to the cloud

because it means it's really hard to

lose that key so if you lose your phone

all you got to do is log in Casa log

into iCloud or Google uh your Google

account and boom your key magically

syncs back to the new phone and so it

gives you a level of resilience that is

different than a hardware wallet now a

hardware wallet is going to give you

protection against hey this uh it's

going to give you protection against

compromise of online accounts so this

Hardware key is always offline you know

somebody would need physical access to

this key in order to use it but it's

much easier to lose that key than it is

to lose a encrypted and backed up key

that's in the cloud and the last thing

that we say on this point is just in

case people are really worried about the

mobile key especially in the three key

Vault where it's a two of three multisig

they can always switch that out for a

second Hardware wallet and so then you

know if you really don't want to trust

Casa you can have two Hardware wallets

in a casa key that are part of that um

multisig setup so I thought that this

was really cool that you have that

optionality because um when Nick and I

were talking last month offline I was

one of those people I was very worried I

um I'm kind of I have my tinfoil hat on

all the time I'm worried that there's

some back door in these devices and that

somehow it it's more vulnerable if you

if you access your Bitcoin via your

mobile phone um and and so if there are

other people out there that are a little

bit worried about just the security

component I mean you you basically are

saying that your phone is more secure

than your desktop browser right I think

in in certain scenarios it it definitely

is because your it depends on you know

what is on your computer and how many

extensions you have in the browser and

all of that but um a phone especially

like an iPhone is just a much more

controlled environment than a browser

and so you you have a better sense for

what is running on that phone and what

the phone is capable of doing and and

you have a better sense for things like

using a phone secure element to

segregate really critical key material

and so we think that a phone is more

secure than using a browser in order to

actually hold Keys like if you for

example compare it to holding a key in

an extension in a browser extension um I

I think a phone is is much more secure

than holding the key in a browser

extension now you might still choose to

use a browser extension for things that

are much lower risk or like smaller

amounts of money because you get some

level of convenience from doing that but

um it's all in this it's all in this

tradeoff that that everybody has to be

thinking about between security and

convenience yeah well I want to dig into

that a little bit more because um what

if people are watching and they say why

why would I trust a company with one of

my keys because essentially that means

you know how much Bitcoin I have and

what if what if something happens at the

company or what if there's a bad actor

at the company what do you say to that

so one of the great things about Casa is

that we hold one key for you and that

one key in all of our multisig vaults is

not enough to move funds so even if

somebody were to completely compromise

Casa and compromise that key they could

not access our our client funds and then

the second layer to this is go actually

goes back to um removing single points

of failure one of the things that we've

done is even remove Casa as a single

point of failure so let's say casa

disappeared overnight no warning we're

just gone you don't have access to the

casa servers no access to the casa key

you can actually take all of the keys

that you have go plug them into another

multisig wallet like an open- Source

multisig wallet like a sparrow or

something like that and syn it all and

boom you've got your Bitcoin right there

and we we call that Sovereign recovery

so it's something that where you have

the ability as a sovereign individual to

still access your Bitcoin even if Casa

is not there to help you and that's

really important because it means uh it

sets us apart from something like an

exchange like FTX or Celsius or one of

those guys where they went bankrupt and

they locked down and all of their users

funds were were locked down with them

with Casa if something were to happen to

us everybody could use a completely

different set of software to move their

Bitcoin

out well what about the Privacy element

because I thought that this was

interesting too your company doesn't

sell Bitcoin or facilitate trading it it

is a custody solution an inheritance

planning solution so if I if I wanted to

sign up and I didn't want you to know

who I am or how much Bitcoin I have

what's what do you offer for that yeah

so one of the things that people worry

about is they say well Kasa knows how

much Bitcoin I have and so if I'm

worried about somebody coming knocking

or from a government perspective or I'm

worried about a hacker getting in and

and seeing the data base or something

like that um I don't think I feel

comfortable with from a privacy

perspective with using Casa and the

first thing to know is that we um we

have to know your balance in order to

show you the balance in the app that's

just how that works right and so how do

we give you the ability to protect

yourself against some of those problems

well well because we aren't a financial

service company and because we don't uh

facilitate trading or anything like that

you can sign up for Casa without going

through kyc and this is completely

within the laws um globally where uh

wallet software providers do not have to

kyc their customers because we don't

have control over your assets we're not

a custodian we're not facilitating any

any money transfer so you can sign up

for Casa with a anonymous proton mail

address if you want to and then you

would never know that it was you using

Kasa so there's really no way to tie the

balance as a line item in the database

that you see in the app to your identity

as a person I this is a huge selling

point I really think so yeah I think

it's a really compelling thing for

people who who are worried about this

and we've got we've got clients who uh

because we part of our service is that

we'll actually get on a call with our

premium clients and our Private Client

members and help you set everything up

right we're going to go through a little

bit of that later in the in the tutorial

that we're doing some of our clients

will never show up on camera for that

they'll be there they'll just be called

in from their phone but they don't want

us to even see their face and that's

totally fine with us like if you if you

want to remain that private that's

that's totally fine other people say no

I actually want you to know who I am I

want you to know my family because then

you can be there and actually get to

know us as our advisor and help us and

so we we serve this really wide range of

desires and people around the Privacy

aspect and we like to be very flexible

with that that's awesome yeah once I

learned that I I found that to be

fascinating because there are a lot of

questions and controversies around kyc

and this is literally non kyc within the

boundaries of Regulation and law whereas

a lot of other companies are kind of

operating in the shadow

um so I I find that to be awesome um

okay so anything else you want people to

know about the company because one thing

that I really respect is both you and

Jameson you're really passionate about

the technical side and you do make the

the the user experience really simple

really clean whereas um you know

sometimes these these technical aspects

of Bitcoin can be very intimidating

especially if you're just starting out

you're worried you're going to somehow

lose the Bitcoin um so what do you want

people to know

we put uh basically half our effort goes

into making sure that the product is as

secure as possible and the other half of

our effort goes into making sure that

it's as easy as possible and so we've

built things that over the years that

address all of the major problems that

you might have when you are self-

custody in your Bitcoin so we've talked

about just the general kind of loss

aspect in protecting against loss

protecting against theft or $5 wrench

attacks uh what we haven't talked about

is protecting against uh the problem of

what happens if you die so this is a big

problem for people when they are self-

custody Bitcoin because you have to make

sure that your family members or whoever

is your next of kin can actually access

that Bitcoin or else it can just be lost

forever and what we realized was that

multisig actually enables you to do this

in a safer way because without multisig

you're in a scenario where you've got to

give access to your one key to a family

member and that opens up a security risk

where now they are suddenly in attack

Vector for the Bitcoin that you're

holding because they know the location

of or they know the actual key with

multisig and the way that we've built it

with Casa you can actually set things up

so that your family members are not an

attack Vector before you pass away but

they can still access the assets after

you pass away and we do this by sharing

just enough key material with them that

when combined with the casa key after

you pass away your family members can

access your funds and so this is

something that is we released this

earlier this year and we really built

this to make it comfortable for the

family members to use use not just the

original owner of the Bitcoin but their

family who's often less Technical and

less familiar with using keys and all

that and so we've built it in a way that

all your family member has to do is scan

a QR code on your phone to get things

set up at the basic three key multisig

security level and it takes three

minutes literally like I I set this up

with my wife who is a little bit less

Technical and she you know we were kind

of thinking uh she was thinking it's

going to take some time it's going to be

kind of a pain we were done in 3 minutes

and I was like yeah we did a good job

building this product I'm I'm proud of

this product that we built because it

was it's so simple even for the the

people who aren't as familiar with

Bitcoin it's time for a quick break to

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to the show yeah I'm I'm really excited

for people to see this and go into the

show notes the show description you will

find the howto for signing up with Casa

setting up multisig as well as the

inheritance planning tool because um one

cool feature is let let's say you you

offer that um to a family member or a

friend and they try to access it in a

way that's maybe nefarious you can

literally lock them out you'll get an

alert and you say uhuh no way um can you

talk a little bit about that yeah sure

so part of the security model is that

after the original account owner passes

away the person that they designated as

a recipient goes into their Casa account

and says I'm requesting access to this

Vault and that starts a six-month timer

so we don't give that access right away

because that's that's part of reducing

that attack Vector from a security

perspective so they go in they request

access to the Vault it starts a

six-month timer and it sends a

notification to the account owner that's

saying hey access was requested to this

fault you can go in then as the account

owner and reject that access at any

point during that six-month period and

we're bothering you the whole time we're

sending you a notification every month

like saying basically like hey are you

actually dead if not please go in here

and cancel this thing and so then you

can go in and and revoke it if you're uh

if it was a mistake or if there's

something nefarious going on and if

there isn't then after the six months

the person gets access to the assets

they get access to the casa key and they

can um get some help from us with

actually moving the Bitcoin and they can

put it into a new Casa account that is

fully healthy that they've set up for

themselves or they can move it to an

exchange if they're you know selling it

as part of the estate liquidation

process or or however the plan works out

yeah and make sure to consult um an

attorney I know that sometimes people

are worried about that and and you have

to um account for the tax implications

and and so um definitely consult your

your financial planners and estate

attorneys for that but um okay um before

we start to wrap up I wanted to ask you

there are people out there who are maybe

newer and they're used to just their

traditional brokerage accounts and now

the ETFs are available and so it's

convenient right going back to your

earlier point it's just convenient to do

it the old Fiat way why do you feel that

that is the wrong decision why do you

want people to actually become sovereign

and take custody of their

Bitcoin this is a great question and I

think it is a very timely question for

our industry right so I think there's

really two reasons why you would think

about doing this the first is a more

practical reason I would say think about

why you are investing in Bitcoin a lot

of people are investing in Bitcoin to

hedge against

inflation um and overall inflation risk

but another benefit of investing in

Bitcoin is that you're actually hedging

against systemic risk and when I say

systemic risk I'm talking about

problems in the Legacy Financial system

that are very widespread problems that

tend to be like Black Swan events like a

uh great financial crisis type of

situation and a lot of people when they

think about it are actually investing in

Bitcoin for those systemic protection

reasons and that could go even as far as

like something as bad as the collapse of

the dollar system right so if you think

about that and that is a reason why

you're investing in Bitcoin because it

would protect you against that if you

are holding that Bitcoin in an ETF which

is very tightly tied with that Legacy

Financial system what is the chance

you're going to be able to get that

Bitcoin if that entire system is melting

down very little so so that's the first

thing think about why you're investing

in Bitcoin and if systemic risk hedging

is part of that then then you want to be

holding it yourself because you need to

have it held outside of that Legacy

system so then the second thing is more

of a philosophical

one one of the big benefits of Bitcoin

is that it is the first time ever that

you can actually self- custody digital

money or any form of digital data using

private keys and we've had centuries or

Millennia basically of human behav

Behavior being built around money needs

to be stored with a bank because

physical money was too difficult to

self- custody practically it was Heavy

it took up a lot of space you know you

don't want to there's a reason people

make fun of uh cash under the mattress

type of people because it's just so

impractical but now for the first time

in human history it is the easiest it's

ever been to self cost

any amount of money in the form of

Bitcoin and so this is a huge

advancement just for human freedom and

individual control over over things that

you care about like your money and so if

you aren't taking advantage of that are

you really missing this entire part of

the Bitcoin movement that is so exciting

about Bitcoin I think it's an it's an

under uh talked about aspect compared to

the inflation resistance side of it it's

under talked about that you have this

level of Freedom through self- custody

of Bitcoin that we've never had before

in human history and it's so easy

compared to at any other point and so

that's something that um that's part of

the reason why we built Casa that's what

we actually get excited about at Casa

and that's I think something that people

should really think hard about when

they're trying to evaluate do I want to

invest in this through a vehicle like

the ETF or do I want to actually own my

own money it's so true um and and such a

powerful point so many people take for

granted that something like a bank run

can can still happen today and you won't

be able to access your funds and or in a

you know at the drop of a hat your your

savings is inflated by 50% like some

people in in Nations literally wake up

and their savings have been devalued

because they printed so much money or

they devalued the currency so never take

that for granted because Bitcoin can't

be confiscated can't be seized you can

take it anywhere it does offer you that

transactional freedom that is so core to

our human rights um well I usually start

with this question but I'm going to end

with it can you just tell us more about

you why you're so passionate about this

and a little of your your background

that led you to Casa yeah so I um I

started my career in finance actually as

a investment banker so I always say I'm

a recovering investment banker and uh

that'll be for the rest of my life I

learned a lot of great things would

never do it again so the first couple of

years I I worked in finance and I would

say that kind of gave me a little bit of

this like Banking and money background

right and then I really wanted to start

doing things with startups I the

entrepreneurship was really attractive

to me from just a level of

responsibility control and influence

that you can have in such a small team

right and early on in your career it's

just all about like can you just get

after it and do the thing versus in kind

of the finance world it's like you got

to wait your turn you got to make the

you got to make the presentations and

the analysis for the partners and

somebody else to make the decisions

whereas in the in the startup world you

make the decisions and yeah maybe you

don't know what you're doing right away

but you figure it out so I moved into

the tech startup ecosystem and was at a

travel Tech start up as a product

manager for a couple of years and then

really started getting interested in

Bitcoin end of 2016 early 2017 and and

finally was like I got to do something

about this as 2017 and 2018 happened um

and the bull market you know a number go

up really drives a lot of interest for

people right so um I participated in a

hackathon actually in 2018 and built

something very similar to Casa and um we

ended up winning that hackathon and so I

quit the company that I was at and I was

going to start a company around this at

the same time the previous CEO of Casa

called me up and said hey uh we're

building something very similar Jameson

Lop just joined the team you should come

join us and be our head of product and

so I was like well they got Jame they

got Jameson that's an unfair Advantage

so I

joined as head of product and was head

of product for like the first year and a

half of Casa's life basically from early

2018 through the end of 2019 and then at

the end of 2019 the previous CEO decided

to step down there were some family

health issues going on and I'd kind of

been the number two and so he asked me

to take over as

CEO and that was crazy because I had no

idea how to be a CEO but luckily we'd

also we were in the depths of a of a

bare market right luckily I had a good

support system around us our team was

amazing our investors were were amazing

and I was able to grow very quickly into

the CEO role through 2020 and then you

know for the last four years we've just

been continuing to build the business

into what it is today which has been one

of the the greatest things I've been

able to be a part of and so um as far as

th that's kind of my journey and then

from the why am I doing it it really

goes back to what I was saying earlier

it's we think private keys are a

technology that really lets people

completely change how they interact with

the data that's most important to them

in their life and that starts with their

money with their Bitcoin and so we want

to build software and products that help

people do that and Take Back Control in

their life of what matters most to them

and that's that's why Kasa exist and why

I'm doing this that's awesome well Nick

you casa pilled me um I'm excited to be

a customer join me guys go to the link

in the show notes it's also on the

screen if you're watching this and make

sure to check out our howto videos it's

super simple that's what's so great um

so thanks so much Nick I really

appreciate you coming on the show yeah

thank you Natalie this has been great

thank you so much for checking out this

episode of coin stories this show is for

entertainment and educational purposes

only nothing should constitute as

official investment advice and you

should always do your own research my

inbox is open if you want to share

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