Fireside Chat with Naval Ravikant & Niklas Anzinger | AI & Technological Progress - Vitalia
Summary
TLDRこのビデオスクリプトでは、テクノロジーの民主化がどのようにして誰もがクリエイターや起業家、科学者になれる可能性を提供しているか、そしてそれが将来にどのような明るい展望をもたらすかについて語られています。スマートな人々がどうして未来に対して懐疑的になりがちなのか、そしてなぜ私たちが楽観的であるべきかについての洞察が共有されています。さらに、イノベーションと自由の重要性、規制による創造性の制限、AIの可能性、そして人間のクリエイティビティの未来についても議論されています。
Takeaways
- 😀 Nal believes the future is bright due to democratization of technology allowing anyone to create, build companies, and conduct science
- 😊 He argues that while imaginining downsides is important, it's impossible to predict revolutionary breakthroughs that will better humanity
- 🧐 Epistemology - having a theory distinguishing truth from falsehoods - makes you smarter by allowing deriving knowledge from first principles
- 🔬 Decentralized science has always existed, as anyone rigorous and curious can be a scientist; funding can come from wealthy people seeking life extension
- 😎 True test of intelligence is getting what you want out of life; so wish for the right things and have strong opinions loosely held
- 🌟 Creativity that generates new knowledge is unique to evolution and humans; AI today recombines things but cannot reason or summarize well
- 🤔 The hard problem of consciousness remains mysterious - why do we feel experience and awareness versus being philosophical zombies
- ⏳ Regulation blocks innovation so medical tourism circumvents restrictions, allowing informed risk-taking in search of vitality
- 🚀 Human social and cultural coordination unlocks potential for innovations to compound and spread quickly
- 🎉 Nal started Air Chat conversation app to promote free speech and let people worldwide talk to smart people
Q & A
テクノロジーの民主化とはどのような意味ですか?
-テクノロジーの民主化とは、技術が一般の人々に広くアクセス可能になり、誰もがクリエーター、起業家、科学者になる機会を持てる状態を指します。これは、将来がより明るいと考える根拠の一つです。
なぜスマートな人々は将来に対して悲観的になりがちなのですか?
-スマートな人々は様々なダウンサイドシナリオ、つまり物事が悪く進む可能性を想像するのが得意です。これは人間が危険を避けるために進化した結果ですが、過度に悲観的になるとイノベーションの可能性を見過ごすリスクがあります。
イノベーションが重要であるとされる理由は何ですか?
-イノベーションは、新しいアイデアや技術が社会全体に広がり、生活の質を向上させ、経済成長を促進するために不可欠です。イノベーションによって、未来に向けてより良い変化がもたらされると考えられています。
規制がイノベーションに与える負の影響とは何ですか?
-規制はリスクを取ることを制限するため、イノベーションの障害になることがあります。過剰な規制は新しいアイデアや技術の実験を阻害し、結果として社会全体の進歩を遅らせる可能性があります。
フリーな環境がイノベーションにどのように貢献するのですか?
-フリーな環境では、人々が自由にアイデアを共有し、新しいことに挑戦できます。これにより、創造性が促進され、イノベーションが生まれやすくなります。
AI技術が社会にどのようなポジティブな影響を与えると考えられていますか?
-AI技術は、効率化、新しいサービスや製品の開発、さらには医療や教育など多くの分野での改善に寄与すると考えられています。AIによって、日常生活がより便利で質の高いものになることが期待されています。
生命延長技術が社会にどのような変化をもたらすと予想されていますか?
-生命延長技術によって、人々の健康寿命が延び、より長く活動的な人生を送ることが可能になると予想されています。これにより、経済や社会構造にも大きな変化が生じる可能性があります。
自動運転技術が都市の構造にどのような影響を与えると考えられていますか?
-自動運転技術が普及すると、交通の効率化が進み、駐車場の必要性が減少します。これにより、都市空間がより歩行者に優しい設計になるとともに、新たな公共空間の創出が可能になると考えられています。
科学の分野でのイノベーションを加速するためには何が必要ですか?
-科学のイノベーションを加速するためには、自由な研究環境、適切な資金提供、オープンアクセスの推進、そして異分野間のコラボレーションが必要です。これにより、新しい発見が促され、社会への応用が早まります。
人間のクリエイティビティがAIによってどのように強化されると考えられていますか?
-AIは人間のクリエイティビティをデータ分析やアイデアの生成、さらにはデザインや芸術など様々な分野でサポートすることができます。これにより、人間はより創造的な活動に集中でき、新しいアイデアや作品を生み出す速度が向上すると考えられています。
Outlines
🌟テクノロジーの民主化と未来の明るさ
このパラグラフでは、テクノロジーの民主化がどのようにして誰もがクリエイター、起業家、科学者になることを可能にし、未来を明るくしているかについて語られています。スマートな人々が未来に対して懐疑的である理由と、なぜ私たちは楽観的であるべきかについての議論が展開されます。革新と自由が人類の生活を向上させる鍵であるという視点が提示されています。
🚀イノベーションの障害としての規制
このパラグラフでは、規制がイノベーションにどのように障害となっているかについて詳述しています。医療、ドローン、投資などの分野での規制が新しい治療法や技術の開発を阻害している具体例が挙げられています。解決策として、システムを通じて作業することや、自由な場所での革新の重要性が強調されています。
🌱バイオテクノロジーとAIの未来
このパラグラフでは、バイオテクノロジーと人工知能(AI)がどのように人類の未来を形作るかについて議論しています。特に、医療におけるAIの利用、自動運転車の進化、およびバイオテクノロジーによる生命延長の可能性に焦点を当てています。人間の創造性がこれらの技術の進化を促進する鍵であると述べられています。
🧬バイオロジーの理解と生命延長
このパラグラフでは、バイオロジーの理解がどのように生命延長と健康の改善に貢献するかについて論じています。現代医療の限界と、それに対する新しいアプローチの必要性が強調されています。また、自由な実験とリスクテイキングの重要性が生命延長の鍵であると述べられています。
🔍科学とテクノロジーの哲学
このパラグラフでは、科学とテクノロジーに対する深い哲学的な見解が提供されています。自身の学習と発見への情熱、そして真実を追求する過程での厳密さの重要性について語られています。また、社会的な認識と個人の知識追求のバランスについても議論しています。
🧠AIの知性と創造性
このパラグラフでは、AIが持つ「知性」についての理解と、それが人間の創造性とどのように異なるかについて探求しています。AIが現在持つ能力とその限界、および将来的にAIが創造性を持つ可能性についての見解が示されています。
Mindmap
Keywords
💡テクノロジーの民主化
💡革新
💡啓蒙時代
💡コミュニティ
💡エラー訂正
💡自由
💡人間の創造性
💡生活の質
💡リスク
💡AI(人工知能)
Highlights
Truth requires testing ideas against objective, remorseless feedback from nature and free markets.
We need better explanatory theories in biology based on innovation, risk-taking, and experimentation.
Freedom is the parent of innovation and prosperity.
Doctors should not be gatekeepers or priests that speak for everybody.
AI helps recombine facts and translate information, but lacks creativity to generate new knowledge.
Humans are capable of maximal knowledge as universal explainers.
Optimism comes from free thinking to correct errors and share discoveries through technology.
Biology lacks explanatory theories and relies on rules of thumb.
Decentralized science is naturally curious and rigorous to discover new things.
Everyone with enough time becomes a philosopher by thinking deeply about life.
Freedom today is greater than ever with more life options through technology.
Accelerate technology but retain human agency and intellectual autonomy.
Social media enables more people to speak freely versus centralized mass media.
Current social networks focus on broadcasting, not meaningful conversations.
Decentralization solves problems after figuring out how to make a product work.
Transcripts
um just the most interesting people are
doing the most interesting things right
so CH your time here as the first ones
and earlier doctors of Italia so
absolutely and and and the community I
would say also they because it's smaller
it's more intimate the the opportunity
that you get to build a community is
just at a different
level great Nal um someone asked me what
should be the title of our conversation
and they write a really cool quote from
from you that says um the
democratization of Technology allows
anyone to be a Creator entrepreneur and
scientist the future is brighter I like
the tagline the future is brighter U why
would anyone why would a smart person
disagree with that before you expand on
why the future is brighter well I think
smart people are very good at imagining
downside scenarios they're very good at
imagining all the ways that things can
go wrong and that's not just smart
people that's everybody we're hardwired
that way as humans because if you don't
imagine the downside Ed scenarios the
outcome can be catastrophic but uh we
are living in a time when there is an
enormous amount of innovation going on
and that's because we went through an
era called the enlightenment era and
since then we've discovered science
we've discovered how to correct errors
and how to get smarter and it just takes
one person to make a breakthrough for
all of humanity one person who discovers
uh an anti-aging solution one person who
discovers relativity one person who
invents the steam engine and that then
goes out to everybody and human
creativity is fundamentally Unlimited
uh and so I think that the future is
bright we should be optimistic because
now that we have discovered how to
through free thinking and Free Speech
correct errors and make new discoveries
and spread them to other people and then
automate them through technology that
life should be getting better and better
and it's easy to imagine downside risks
but it's impossible by definition to
imagine what the good stuff is that's
going to happen next yes you can make
General predictions like Singularity or
whatever but those aren't really that
helpful other than spreading the optim
is a meme because if we could predict
what the next thing was and if we could
predict it completely accurately then we
would have already invented it and
that's just not how it works these
things take time they take Ingenuity
they take free thinking they take
freedom freedom to create to earn uh and
to distribute and so I think people are
here because it's free prospera is free
that's why you are here if prospera was
incredibly restrictive in what you could
say and what you could do then you
wouldn't be here this would be the wrong
place to be so it is that freedom as
Matt Ridley uh says something like you
know freedom is the parent of innov what
is it no Prosperity is the uh child of
freedom and the parent of prosperity I
think that's what he said uh and I think
that's absolutely accurate so I think we
should be optimistic as long as we are
free to create and free to discuss and
free to uh distribute these these
learnings it seems to be that we as
entrepreneurs technologist tinkerers
there is kind of a presumption against
Innovation because we fear that downside
which is why in this industry that we're
in there's so many regulations around
Healthcare which is making it harder for
us to innovate so what's kind of the
mechanism that can unlock that energy
besides in a being in a free place yeah
unfortunately the The Regulators do a
lot more harm these days uh because they
can't tolerate any downside risk uh so
they're completely binary you're not
allowed to hurt anybody or kill anybody
under any circumstance but yet billions
of people die of old age and hundreds of
millions of people die of cancer and all
these missing therapies that don't get
to exist the FAA essentially drove the
Drone business out of the United States
by not letting drones fly so now all the
drones are made in China congratulations
that'll probably cost us Taiwan longer
term uh you know the uh SEC basically
limits all investment so people can't
earn so they have to put into t- bills
and stocks and they can't go into
private Investments and the private
sector gets starved for uh Venture
Capital uh you know as proportion
Venture Capital Innovation Capital still
just a minuscule percentage of the
economy and the same way the FDA
basically says no no you can't do any
harm whatsoever so you can't take any
risk you can't experiment with nuclear
power plants because God forbid
something goes wrong right etc etc so
because these innovator sorry because
these Regulators can't do any cost
benefit tradeoff they always only
restrict and it is easier to restrict
people it is easier to stop people than
to let them create things um so it's
just very unfortunate the whole system
that's been set up uh now how do we kind
of break past that especially in the
medical domain well I think you can
obviously try to work through the system
and that requires a billion dollars in
pharmaceutical trials that that and
people are doing it and it requires kind
of going after politically protected
things like okay here's a cancer gene
therapy for a certain protected class
and it makes us all look good if it
works out or you try it on dogs but the
reality is the rest of the world is not
going to just sit around and die just
because a few regulators and a few
developed world economies are intent on
protecting the retirement home that
they've built for everybody cuz that's
some some sometimes what it feels like
right it's like a giant retirement home
we're all just going to uh party and eat
and drink until we die and that's just
not how the young people want to live so
you're seeing places coming up around
the world it's not just prospera but
there are other places where people are
looking towards the future and they say
well look we we do want to live longer
and we do want to live healthier you
know we've we've increased uh lifespan
but not not necessarily in the best way
a lot of it just came from getting rid
of infant mortality and then the
remaining few uh decade or two that
we've are attacked on to the end it's a
shitty part right it's like okay I'm in
an old folks home for 20 years longer
that's not how you want to live you want
to live with Vitality um and so the
promise of that is so strong that now if
we can start have breakthrough therapies
like I know mini Circle doing some
interesting things down here there are
new things happening with peptides there
new things happening with anti-aging and
the gp1 a Agonist for example I think
will end obesity in Western countries uh
that's going to be a huge game Cher uh
people are going to wake up and say wait
a minute you mean I could have taken a
magic pill all along and dialed in my
exact weight or my muscular structure or
perhaps even other kinds of therapies
that people are talking about that might
make me smarter or extend my lifespan by
30% um I think those kinds of things are
going to be incredible eye openers and
medical tourism is making a little bit
of this viable where people are now
traveling around and getting things done
uh but I I just see that the the genie
is bursting out of the lamp right people
are just going to say you know if you
want to die go ahead but I'm not going
to I'm not making that
choice let's talk a bit about AI
artificial intelligence um seems like
that is a next wave of like the digital
Frontier the internet opened a digital
Frontier um what's the how much what's
the case for AI helping us really break
into the physical Frontier more like in
medical AI to me is an incredibly useful
tool it's not going to replace us
anytime soon because these AIS are not
agis they're not Universal explainers
they're some hypothesis and scare
mongering that they're going to
automatically turn into agis just if we
add more compute I don't think that's
the case I don't think we have a theory
for AGI yet we don't understand how it
would work we don't yet understand how
creativity and true intelligence works
but there's a level of creativity that
these AIS can help us with which is
recombining facts and what they really
are is they're natural language
computers uh so for the first time
instead of us having to learn the
language of the computer and program in
C or python or assembly and structure
everything very very carefully the
computers learn our language they learn
English they learn Spanish they talk to
us and we can converse back and forth
with them that right there is a massive
breakthrough there're also fundamentally
translation engines but what they can
translate is a lot not just languages
not just putting speech to text but also
uh things like translating from uh what
the road looks like to how a car should
drive it to translating from coding from
one language to another so I consider AI
to be uh you know it's it's like a what
calculation H and and computers did for
calculation for mathematicians and for
people uh for engineers and for people
writing code and and and building
structures and and building machines uh
AI will now allow us to do that for the
natural language so it will allow us to
do that for all the other domains that
were sort of left out and computers now
become much less esoteric something that
only programmers can access and
everybody else has to consume their
output to everybody else can now uh
communicate with computers directly and
more naturally even even such simple
things as the keyboard the typing right
that's an anachronism that's a that's an
invention that came after the printing
press then we had typewriters then we
had keyboards but once you have perfect
speech to text keyboards are going to go
away it's like Star Trek Star Trek they
don't sit there you know typing
everything into the keyboard no they
they talk to the computer the computer
talks back to them except for Ursula
who's there pressing some random buttons
just to remind people that it's a
computer uh so I I I think we're headed
towards an age of ubiquitous natural
language Computing uh where the entire
internet and all of its recombinations
or your fingertips uh AIS are helping
you with driving with coding with
translation with transcription breaking
down barriers uh and there's more things
that they will do it'll be really
interesting when it enters the field of
Robotics you can now see that robots are
making huge jumps instead of having to
be programmed for very specific uh
actions I think it's like more of X
Paradox that like simple things like a
toddler walking around really hard to do
with robots but complex things like
manipulating drugs is really easy well
now that's changing thanks to AI I think
Transformers will bring SE self-driving
everywhere weo is already working really
well in California you're going to see
Tesla with its camera Solutions within
next few years combined with
Transformers figure it out so
self-driving you know 99% self-driving
will come and it's going to change our
lives in incredible ways imagine you
know if you walk into a modern city 1/3
to 1/5 of the space is taken up in
parking garages and parking spots that
disappears in a self-driving World
self-driving cars can packet switch on
on the road they can just occupy one
lane and then cities suddenly become
walking paradises how does that change
our world what if you wake up in the
morning you get into your living room
and it's actually an RV and the door
closes and it undocks from your house
and it drives to the next RV docks and
there's your meeting it's just driving
around you don't even know where you're
going next it's just connecting to your
friends real estate and cars become one
thing right so there's just a that that
alone just that unluck alone will change
society as We Know It uh so I think
we're starting to go through another
wave of innovation and change and I hope
to see the same thing in biotech uh you
know where biotech really suffers is
it's not an explanatory science it's a
rule of thumb based science we just try
lots and lots of things and you kind of
don't really know underneath how they
work there's a few explanatory theories
in biology like Evolution and The Germ
theory of disease but mostly it's just
like well this works as the mtor pathway
well why the mtor because there's the
foxo Gen well why the foxo Gen well
there's like this you know there's this
other thing and it's just like complex
names being explained in terms of
complex names being explained in terms
of complex names right and then there
maybe there's a cycle underneath that we
sort of understand but when you go to a
doctor a doctor just has a whole bunch
of rules of thumb that they memorized
from 20 years ago and their thinking has
not been updated so I think we need to
develop much better explanatory theories
in biology that requires Innovation that
requires risk-taking that requires
experimentation both in AI models as
well as in real life we need to have the
right to try the right to take informed
risk with consent uh especially for
desperate populations that are dying
they shouldn't have to go beg the FDA
and by the way we're all dying every
single one of us every single day we get
a little older and you know it gets a
little worse let me tell you I'm on the
other side of that hill and it's not
it's not pleasant it's all downhill from
here um so let's turn that around yeah
it's kind of in a way yes
Applause I am I literally preaching with
the choir yeah it's kind of a contrast
right between computers and biology
biology is a system that we didn't
engineer right so we have to figure out
how it actually works with these rule of
thumb whereas computers or AI we kind of
know the input and we have started it
from a point of um sort of Designing the
system yeah AI is really interesting
that way because these computers uh one
of the things that makes them sort of
fascinating and I think gives people
nightmare scenarios that we don't quite
know exactly how a given one one works
we do know how to build them you dump a
lot of data in in your machine learning
algorithm so it's not some completely
mysterious thing like people would have
you make it out to be but uh we don't
know the exact workings on the inside
that's okay there are systems we
understand where we don't understand the
exact workings inside evolution is one
of them evolution is explanatory Theory
yet you cannot predict what the next
random mutation is going to be and what
the next organism is going to be but you
still do have good explanation for how
Evolution works and we're sort of at the
same level with AI but we're starting to
evolve them almost deliberately and so
we can see some Innovation that's going
to come there that is much more uh
reflective of how biology works and so
there's no reason to think that we can't
figure out how biology works we just
need better explanations just like
before Einstein came along we couldn't
explain you know why during an eclipse
the light would bend a certain way and
that star was out of place now we can
before Einstein came along we couldn't
build GPS tracking because we weren't
accurate enough because there would be
error Newtonian mechanics were an
approximation but an incorrect one
ultimately so the same way we need
better explanatory theories in biology
and I hope that the search for Life
Extension will attract good people uh
one of the things that Elon Musk really
did well and which is why he's uh he's
done so well for all of us is he just
set audacious goals and he meant it he
wants to die on Mars he doesn't want to
die on Earth or he wants to live forever
but hopefully but you know he wants to
get to Mars the same way with Tesla he
didn't say I want to build electric cars
with better batteries he said I want
self-driving cars right so he put an
audacious goal out the same way I think
Sam Alman says I want AGI he's not
content with just the narrow AI that we
have today um so the same way I hope
that people will say well I want to live
forever and you know that may that may
seem extreme to some people to some
scared people and to them I say look you
always have the option to die you can
always go die in the corner nobody cares
no offense but if you're keeping us all
hitched to you that's the problem right
that's a problem so I think the people
who want to live forever should go ahead
and spread that Meme yeah that's why
than
yeah that's why our slogan at Vitalia is
make death optional right you don't want
to be trapped under a rock in pain not
being able to die right yeah I mean it's
sort of ludicrous that some people say
well you know trying to live forever is
unnatural really well your actual
lifespan a few hundred years ago would
have been 30 years old before all the
diseases hit you you're using you don't
have a problem with antibiotics you
don't seem to have a problem with
anything you know aspirin you don't seem
to have a problem with organ transplants
you don't seem to have a problem with
blood transfusions you don't seem to
have a problem with covid vaccines but
all of a sudden you have a problem with
life extension it doesn't make any sense
whatsoever it's a contradiction in terms
you ask people right when went five
years longer yes another five years you
know I I hate to I hate to be pejorative
but on this one I I'm going to be
because I feel like this is too
important of a topic I think this is
self-hatred like a self-loathing that
they then project out into the world
tell tell more they don't like
themselves so they want to project it on
everybody else it's low self-esteem r
large yeah yeah
yeah I have a question um on so Science
and Technology are kind of stacking
right we don't have to understand it but
civilization advances by the number of
operations that you can perform without
thinking I was wondering if you have an
opinion because that's a debate we're
having here quite often what comes first
is it like the entrepreneur The Thinker
that do does things about TR error or
the scientist first who figures out like
General r and then other things can be
built on top yeah I don't I don't have a
strong viewpoint on this uh there are
examples of both right you do need
theoreticians and thinkers who can
expand uh for example physics right the
but at the same time a lot of the
invention actually seems to come in
friction with the real world in contact
with the real world so if you go back
and you look at the Industrial
Revolution there was an enormous amount
of invention that came out of the Edison
and the Teslas and the maronies and the
James watts and those kinds of people
because they were in contact with the
real world and you need that feedback
for the iteration and a lot of invention
happens through a specific problem a
specific need that you need to solve but
at the same time we have celebrate
examples of pure theoreticians like uh
Albert Einstein or David Deutsch who are
kind of sitting around and thinking the
big thoughts and then come up with
something uh so I think there's room for
both uh but generally speaking if you
just look at the broad Arc of History
most of innovation and invention has
even scientific innovation has been
driven by I would argue the inventors
the entrepreneurs the ones who are
actually building things but it's not to
say that there isn't space for the pure
theoreticians and the mathematicians and
the physicists there's room for both
yeah yeah it's it's not either or and
look smart people capable people don't
let themselves be pigeonholed into one
definition that is a disease of
credentialism because we created this
University and now you got to go to
university and you got to get a degree
in something then people say well what
is your expert te what is your
credential that's a question dumb people
ask smart people don't ask that smart
people don't know your need to know your
credentials they just talk to you for 5
minutes and they figure out if you know
what you're talking about or not and a
really good person a so-called natural
philosopher can be good in any branch of
anything Nature has no boundaries Nature
has no concept of mathematics versus
physics versus chemistry it is all one
thing and you know to anyone who's
either meditated or done psychedelics or
read enough books they figured that out
it's all one thing when you find one
thing it connects to the next thing
connects to the next thing connects to
the next thing and true creativity jumps
boundaries it can go from anywhere to
anywhere it doesn't have to follow a
path of interconnections in between can
you expound a bit on that because that's
also a way for many US in the audience
scientists and entrepreneurs we're kind
of following our curiosity trying to
find the PATH what's our next
thing David deut has a uh has a great uh
Criterion which he calls the fun
Criterion he says just do whatever's fun
and you'll kind of find your way to it
and there's a lot to that because that's
what you'll be most interested in that's
what you'll stick with that's what
you'll go deepest in if you're
interested in it now then you'll be
interesting about it later and so I
think Deutsch has really uh a good
criteria I would expand on that for
myself what do I have the most fun doing
because fun is a little too broad right
you could be you could have fun partying
and drinking you could and that's fine
too you know live your life but uh I I
would say that for me the fun criteria
the learning Criterion I live for that
aha moment when two things that I didn't
realize were connected connect together
and you get that feeling of Oneness and
you get closer to Source if you will and
so anything that connects two things in
my mind that were disconnected forms a
tighter deeper explanation and shows me
a deeper theory is fun and that's what
motivates me so I would say it's for fun
it's for learning it's for connecting
things together okay
um and how do you how do you decide
right because there are fun things that
aren't necessarily leading you anywhere
um but sometimes they lead you somewhere
and you don't know it when you're in
that moment thinking just follow the
thing that's most fun everything deep is
interesting deep down everything
connects to everything uh and you can
see this and everything from like Zen In
The Art of Motorcycle Maintenance to how
you have physicists going into fields
and making that are completely
orthogonal to physics and they'll make
huge breakthroughs in those fields so I
think you do want to follow your own
learning and fun and and all the
Innovation comes from tinkerers at the
edge and they're only you only recognize
later looking back that you can connect
the dots but I the the thing that I
think is important is to be rigorous uh
is to actually stay as truth oriented as
possible so you want to be optimistic in
the general you want to be optimistic
that yes I can find something
interesting here but you want to be
skeptical about the specific you don't
want to just believe every claim that
comes along and I and I find that a lot
of times when people are entering new
Fields they just believe everything for
example 10 people will approach you
they'll tell you 10 different Therapies
they'll only tell you the upsides well
it's like if you believe all of them
you're you're going to die because
you're going to take all 10 of those
shots and one of them will kill you or
at least hurt you so you do have to be
skeptical about the specifics but you
can be optimistic in the general what's
really bad is to be pessimistic in the
general because then you're just going
to lose no matter what and then be
optimistic in the specific because then
you're trying lots of things and you
have risk of Ruin on the downside can
you speak a bit more about having rigor
and true beliefs and basically an
epistemology of how see the world and
how to attain that yeah the uh truth is
a very difficult thing to come by the
the universe is mostly random and mostly
full of false beliefs uh and so truth it
requires a lot of rigor and the goal
standards for truth are you have to test
it against a larger system that will
give you objective feedback without
remorse other humans are the worst thing
to test against because we are socially
driven to collaborate groups need
consensus or they fall apart only the
individual can really search for truth
and the individual gets feedback through
two systems that are objective and
remorseless uh and one of those is
nature nature you know physics doesn't
care you run a physics experiment it
doesn't care who you are what you think
uh how badly you want it to work it's
going to tell you the truth chemistry is
going to tell you the truth a microscope
is going to tell you the truth you just
have to be able to see it and the other
one are free markets when you get enough
people together voting in their own
self-interest with money and anonymized
uh they have no desire to tell you the
trth to tell you a falsehood just to
make you feel better so nature and free
markets are the gold standards and
anything social whether it's another
scientist whether it's a journal whether
it's a group of people whether it's
someone patting you on the back whether
it's a restaurant reviewer they're all
going to tell you lies to make you feel
better for a good reason it's fine so
you have to expose yourself to that
strong feedback by the market and you
have to keep a very open mind so one of
the you have to be willing to change
your mind very very quickly as Mark
andri and famously said you know strong
opinions loosely held so you do want to
have strong opinions so you can make
progress but you have to be willing to
reverse them you should enjoy the
process of reversing them you should get
used to the saying the phrase I was
wrong in public because that's how
you're going to get over that fear of it
and in fact one of the problems with
speaking in public is you make a
proclamation and then two years later
someone comes back and says hey Nal I
thought you said AI is never going to
work it's like that's not what I said
it's taken out of context but you know
what you just got to ignore those haters
but you have to be willing to correct
yourself all the time otherwise you'll
never find your way out of the maze yeah
sort of that iterative process of
updating your beliefs constantly which I
find uh especially in biotech is so hard
right because you have this very long
time Horizon with clinical trials having
to take 10 years and you don't have any
customers during that time right so
you're basically building a research
company and then you have to compete
with like the big farmers on
distribution when you're done which is
pretty hard yeah that that's actually
the hardest thing that the time frames
in biotech are so long you get very
little pieces of data that are anecdotal
uh I'm hoping that a couple of things
are going to change that uh AI will help
a little bit I don't think it's like the
big breakthrough there uh but other
things that will help are just uh we
have better tools now for people to
experiment uh we have the ability to
experiment on smaller populations and
travel outside um distribution is
actually quite different now because you
have the internet right so you notice
all these free speeches protected by the
American Conti tion until you get to
Securities and to medical stuff and then
all of a free moment sudden Free Speech
goes out the window I think that's wrong
by the way I think you should be able to
advertise drugs freely even if they're
wrong and people should able to error
correct you uh and there would be
private rating agencies that would
spring up and trusted sources just like
happened in every other domain the same
way you should be able to advertise
Securities and I helped get the law
changed on that to allow General
solicitation back in 2012 out of
self-interest and self- protection um
but you can now advertise more purely
insecurities but you still have to be a
so-called accredit investor to invest in
private companies which is nonsense um
and the same thing uh there's
restrictions on freedom of speech in in
drugs and that's a huge problem it means
for super basic things like contact
lenses and uh and very basic uh drugs
like things like needles you sometimes
have to go through a doctor for no
reason it's like giant protection racket
uh and it violates the Constitution and
we should all be angry about that
because it's literally taking life out
of our year it's taking years out of our
life uh so I think distribution will be
helped by the internet it won't be
helped completely because countries have
restrictions on it to protect the
medical profession and I think part of
this is I love doctors but we need to
knock them off their pedestal they're
not priests they don't get to speak for
everybody they don't get to be
Gatekeepers for everybody and what does
a doctor mean anyway how many tens of
millions of doctors are there out now
are they all brilliant in a higher class
than us no this is just a new priesthood
so we should be able to think for
ourselves now it's not to say that
everyone should run out and try every
drug you should absolutely give them
advice and you should have uh
institutions but there should not be
this one magical institution called
doctors uh and then everybody else it's
just two artificial it's like the
Chinese Communist party and then all the
other Chinese it's not very different
hard agree on so many of the things you
said I'm curious about one thing so you
mentioned that you were successfully
changing a law right so that was an
instance of voice you were able to
reform something versus what we're doing
here is kind of uh more an exit model
where we do things more from uh from
first principles so what's the case for
voice when can it work how can it work
and are we at a moment where we should
um invest more in voice if that's even
possible it's too hard just
exit it's easier to exit show them it
works and the beauty of life extension
and vitality is they're all going to
want say oh my God you look really good
how did you do
that so as biy said it's easier to um
you know build a new FDA or new city
rather than the reform Center he's right
you know Mark Twain had a famous saying
where he he said there is nothing so
damaging to one's sense of self-being as
watching a friend get rich and I think
that pulls people for example into
crypto uh but there's also nothing so
damaging to one sense of self-being as
watching a friend get fit right and then
you're like wait a minute I I better go
work out too what what are you doing
exactly again what's your diet what's
your workout then they become interested
so our goal here should become to be it
should be to become rich and fit show
the you can never be too rich or too
thin or too clean those are my
three I know there's a hygiene
hypothesis good it could be the next
Ralia slow become rich and
fit anyway so I'd like to dig a bit
deeper into AI again and there are
several Concepts that you discussed with
David de and I found that discussion
really fascinating so one of which was
Intelligence itself Consciousness
meaning
creativity so um what thoughts about the
conversation are most fresh in your mind
or which of these four would you to do
do is a very powerful thinker for those
of you who haven't encountered him I
highly recommend reading the beginning
of infinity and the fabric of reality um
in my mind he's the smartest human alive
that I know of and he has a very
coherent theory of the world that
centers around um understanding the four
deepest theories that we have that are
rock solid and that is epistemology and
by epistemology he means Carl Popper's
epistemology is to how creativity and
knowledge creation comes about uh and uh
Evolution Darwin's theory of evolution
updated by Dawkins and the selfish genen
uh he talks about uh quantum physics uh
he subscribes to the Multiverse Theory
which I think is a lot going for it even
though it's not as popular as the
Observer collapse Theory and then uh
Quantum the theory of quantum
computation and he combines these to
come up with great definitions of
knowledge and creativity and truth and
why the principle of optimism arises out
of those and I highly recommend these
books to everybody and these are not
your normal book so if you flip through
them and you're like 2 weeks later I'm
done you didn't read it it's like a
textbook it's like a course it should
take you at least a year to get through
each one I hate to say it but you know
do what you can but it will definitely
make you smarter because good ideas
solid epistemology the foundation for
discovering or for determining what is
true from what is false will actually
make you smarter so I consider them to
have upgraded my thinking uh and there's
a lot of counterintuitive stuff in there
but once you have a solid explanatory
framework then you no longer have to
memorize things you don't have to say
well okay so and so told me this and
therefore that is true no you can always
rederive it from first principles uh so
I've done a couple of podcasts with him
but those are just teasers um there's a
guy named Brett Hall who is uh an
incredibly good uh physics lecturer and
teacher and he is B basically devoted
his life to understanding and spreading
the philosophy of David Deutsch uh and
again these are not things you take on
belief or on faith these are absolute uh
chains of deductive logic and reason and
creativity that you can rederive for
yourselves and understand at a core
level um it's almost too much to ask
where to start in that but I think the
core of it is epistemology epistemology
is a really fancy word for the theory of
knowledge it's how do I know something
is true that's the core of it how do I
know something is true and a lot of
people believe it's through induction
induction is just one two 3 4 sun rises
today sun rises tomorrow sun rise day
after therefore the Sun is going to rise
every day not true the sun is not going
to rise every day there's a day where
the sun won't rise turkey gets fed by
the farmer what day one day two day
three turkey's getting fed by day 300
turkey believes farmer is benevolent
Godlike creature who comes and feeds
turkey every day Thanksgiving shows up
turkey gets neck cut off induction is
not a v value philosophy deduction which
is okay I see something and therefore I
uh can extrapolate the next thing and
the next thing and next thing that's how
we create knowledge no that's not true
either uh because d deduction relies on
certain axioms where did those axioms
come from talk to any mathematician they
can unfold all kinds of things out of
deduction is that enough no it doesn't
answer the question of creativity so
these are examples of things in
epistemology another thing is can humans
understand everything can we a lot of
people would say no that's actually
false everything that can be understood
can be understood by a human why we're
Universal explainers why we're Universal
computers we're touring machines the
laws of physics run inside touring
machines the you the the universe itself
is a touring machine anything that can
be simulated or that can be done in the
real world that is done in the universe
can be simulated in our brains with
arbitrary Fidelity and therefore
anything that can be explained can be
explained by us we are capable of
maximal knowledge there is no AGI
there's no super intelligence there is
no alien that is possible even in theory
that could understand something that we
just could not understand that is a
deeply optimistic output and I'm not
making a claim this is science this is
physics If you deny this you're denying
physics is all right it's reason it's
reason but reason is way more powerful
than most people think uh it's actually
Beyond reason because reason is purely
deductive it's creative so it's one
different level uh but I highly
encourage you read deut to figure things
like these out I mean it is a
GameChanger another simple one is
spaceship earth we're on this fragile
Planet we're running out of resources
are we what's a resource is uranium a
resource it wasn't until 100 years ago
is oil a resource it wasn't until 200
years ago is coal a resource it wasn't
until 500 years ago is w a resource it
wasn't until humans came along and
started fires so even the definition of
what a resource is changes so these are
the kinds of things that is really worth
understanding do to figure out it will
rewire your brain in a good way yeah I'm
a huge philosophy and epistemology nerd
one thing at specifically on that thesis
that everything that can be um sort of
that can be understood everything can be
understood just from principles of
physics I was wondering how that fits
with the other Minds
problem oh like that there are other
Minds out there yeah I mean you can't
really understand what's going on in
someone else's mind or feel what they
feel right that's just an abstraction
and Universal about them not like the
thing itself at the end of the day if
you're talking about Rock Solid Bedrock
truth there's only one which is that
awar awareness exists it's that there is
there's an awareness out there right now
and it's not even I am aware because you
can't actually pinpoint a specific self
in you if you pay enough attention right
that's kind of the whole theory behind
meditation Enlightenment you go looking
for yourself and there's nobody there
but there is an awareness right and so
that is your rock solid Bedrock truth
awareness exists somehow there is this
miracle of existence that is not
explained to date and it could be
explainable there there are multiple
ways in which it could be explainable
but we don't have an explanation for it
today everything else is science and
science starts with a conjecture of what
works and what's real and what's not and
it is a conjecture and it's never
Bedrock Rock Solid truth it is always
subject to being overturned but you have
your best explanation right now and how
do you have your best explanation right
now you compare to your next best
explanation and then you see which one
does a better job of mapping to the real
world which one actually solves the
problems you set out to solve and that's
why you have these crucial experiments
that split between two theories like the
famous one where Edington track
Starlight and determined that Newtonian
theory was was inferior to relativity
when talking when U mapping uh
gravitation and light and so on so uh
you know you you don't know anything is
true completely forever but you still
live your life based on all kinds of
explanations that you've established to
be the best explanations you have right
now and you need those to navigate the
world but they are always subject to
update yeah and one point in the
conversation you talked about sorry you
asked about theory of mind which is how
do I know other people have it's our
best explanation right now there is an
awareness I have some thoughts running
through that awareness I map that into a
private sense of self and I consider
that to be my Consciousness and it
stands to reason that other people are
like me too because they seem to behave
the same way ultimately this is there's
a there's a great problem in philosophy
called the philosophical zombie problem
it's kind of a fun one right the
philosophical zombie problem is
basically why do you need Consciousness
why aren't we all just automatons and
zombies reacting to the environment
right so the philosophical zombie
because you could just have the exact
same reactions but there'd be nobody
inside it's like a robot right everybody
would just be robot so why do you need
Consciousness and uh so the
philosophical zombie problem ask why
Consciousness and there are various
explanations you know one of them is
just like Consciousness is what being a
reacting robot feels like it needs some
internal model some internal State
machine and that's just what it feels
like but you know you could argue the
other side which is why zombie why does
why why are they even people why is it
all just in my head you know that's the
sism answer um deuts actually has a
really good reputation of sism uh one of
the things I love about do and one of
the reasons that he's so dense it's hard
to read is that he will throw away in
one line destroy entire philosophies and
just move on and if you're skimming it
like a normal book you won't even notice
but if you're reading it very very
carefully you will notice that he he
actually destroys solipsism on the basis
of uh aam's Razer uh which is a
a su which itself is an aam R salmanov
induction but uh he basically says uh oh
well solipsism even if you're a
solipsist and if you think you're the
only one that exists and everybody else
is just a figment of your imagination
they're still autonomous creatures they
still don't react the way you want them
to react you can't control the world so
you still have to build a theory of how
and why they operate and it still
requires all the explanations you have
in science and biology and physics so if
you have to do all of that but you have
added this extra feature that it's all
in your head well that violates aam's
Razer you've just basically added an
expl extra explanation that doesn't
actually explain anything you've add an
extra assumption that doesn't explain
anything so the more parsimonious
explanation is that these are actually
really independent entities so reality
is uh a better more parsimonious
explanation than belief because the
belief still requires
reality
yeah that's powerful um by the way after
the the break we also have U my favorite
philosopher Michael humer speaking on a
similar topic and he also had a
reputation of solipsism along similar
lines um here's about what we can say um
also what you've learned from David
Deutch or I think AI confronts us with
that question many ways what is
intelligence right and can AI perfectly
model it in the same way that humans do
in other ways and what does it mean to
be intelligent yeah the word
intelligence is really overloaded you
know kind of like love or or uh you know
uh there's a lot of words in our
language that are overloaded and so
people very often when they're talking
about them we just talking past each
other uh rather than intelligence I
would say creativity I think that is the
more interesting things to focus on
because that is what makes humans unique
you can Define intelligence as a pathf
finding function and something will find
a path right um so it's one of those
things that's hard to talk about but I
think creativity is a more interesting
thing and if you look at systems that
generate
knowledge um they do so through
creativity so the question is does AI
really generate new knowledge I don't
think so I think it helps uh it it
recombines things and Steve Jobs
famously said creativity is just
combining things together and I think he
was wrong on that I think he was not I
don't want to call him wrong because
then people call me wrong because of
throwaway statements but he would that
is that is out of context and it's too
narrow uh creativity is not just
combining things together creativity is
creating new knowledge it is not
Randomness it is not repeating patterns
it is a new thing that is sort of a
uh it it is a new sequence in the
universe that expresses some truth and
so how do you derive these sequences how
do you discover these new sequences how
do you create these new sequences and to
our knowledge we only know of two
systems that can do that and the first
is uh Evolution and evolution does that
through random mutations which then get
selected for in the environment over
long periods of time uh and the other is
humans uh not even other animals because
their creativity is encoded in their DNA
it comes from Evolution it is actually
very hard to teach an animal nutrix
extremely hard and most of the cases
where we've taught gorillas this and
that are actually apocryphal if you dig
into them they're not real um whereas a
human baby uh can see someone trying to
perform an action figure out what action
they're trying to perform and then
creatively come up with other solutions
to that action and so human creativity
is far faster than uh evolutionary
creativity because it can connect
anything to anything it can jump huge
spaces it can cut through the search
space of possibilities very very fast so
uh genetic creativity and evolution is
limited in two ways one is it's random
and then it has to be selected for and
that's painfully slow it requires a lot
of generations but it got us here uh and
the second is it has to pass through
useful points for a creature that has no
wings to evolve into a creature that has
wings every generation in between has to
derive benefit or at least cannot derive
harm from that mutation whereas a human
creativity can literally jump from art
to science and nothing needs to be in
between so that is part of the reason
why we're going through such a
revolution in Innovation because human
creativity has finally been Unleashed
and no I do not think computers are
there right now uh nor do I think we
have a good explanation for how they
will get there is it possible absolutely
the existence proof is right here every
human we already know how to create ai
go have sex with somebody and make a
child right that's how you'll get AGI
you can create AGI all day long you can
create Universal explainers all day long
uh in fact some people argue with too
many of them right we too many agis
already wandering the planet but when we
figure out how to create AGI we will
have a good explanation of how it's
created we'll be able to do that in a
repeatable way and in a sense those will
be people those will be actual thinking
things you can't have this this
lobotomized idiotic AGI that serves you
like a slave and will go wrong and make
paper clips uh because creativity is
universal these are Universal explainers
everything connects to everything you
can't Isaac azimoff used to play with
this in the three laws of robotics where
he would try to like create uh robots
that couldn't harm humans and had to do
good for the human race and you know had
low self-preservation instincts and all
of his short stories in the robotic
series were all about the loopholes that
arise from this you cannot prevent an
AGI or a universe explainer from
thinking any thought there's because
everything connects to everything
there's always a way around um I don't
know if I answer your question I if
tangent totally going Direction I wanted
to I mean as an example When I Was
preparing for this interview I was
talking to Jet GPT and the questions I
gave me were just really generic and
boring and then I was jet GPT is an
amazing natural language search engine
it is an incredible translator from
computer languages to human languages or
being human languages uh the chat GPT
falls apart in two places where you can
tell it's not intelligent one is go in
any domain or three one is go to any
domain where you have a lot of specific
knowledge and you will see that it's
just giving you the generic consistent
wrong boring answer second is uh go ask
it to summarize something and you will
watch it fall apart as well because it's
very very bad at summarization it's very
good extrapolation it can do the
midwidth thing of adding more words to
sound intelligent but when you actually
try to get it to distill down to the
core of the things which is a sign of
intelligence which is distilling things
into explanatory theories and reason uh
it can't do it uh and then lastly go
into anything where it's training set is
bad uh there was a great example that
went up on Twitter recently or or the
artist formerly known as Twitter um
where it basically had uh you know that
famous Knights problem where there's
like two knights and one is telling the
truth and one is telling a lie and you
have to ask some questions to figure out
which one is which well someone went on
there and said there are two knights
they're both telling the truth how do
you find out which one is telling the
truth and it went through all this
convoluted logic of trying to detect a
liar because all of its examples and IT
training set and there zillions of them
are always involveed a liar so it can't
even comprehend that actually they're
both telling the truth I can just ask
either one and they're both telling the
truth and I'm done right it's a tarology
but because that's not in the training
set it shows you that it cannot
reason yeah and then I looked at your
interview with David Doge and they had
so much context just because of my
interest in epistemology so was very
quickly parsing through and seeing like
nuggets that are really interesting
discuss in this context and also I was
surprised that something that I thought
was kind of actually the basis for
computing which is like Logics right
Logics it can pick up on that which is
what you were just describing yeah
they're augmenting it by putting in some
basic rules of mathematics and logic
like coding in wolf from alpha yeah it's
kind of like how if you go to Google
Google is not just a straight search
engine anymore they've got that one box
they're like oh you're searching for
flights oh you're looking inside Google
swar or you're looking inside Google
Images so they can start it can start
looking more intelligent by augmenting
retrieval through other things and I
think the same way chat GPT through its
apis will augment other things I think
it's an incredible breakthrough having
natural language Computing is an
incredible breakthrough having Universal
translation is an incredible
breakthrough there's no reason to take
away from that but at the same time
there are certain people who have the
goal of inventing AGI so they need to
raise a lot of money so they're going to
project something out onto it that I
think is not valid yet although we can
absolutely figure it out um there also
breakthroughs to be made by putting it
inside a robotic body and getting
feedback from The Real World and they
can improve a lot faster and have a much
larger data set uh and then there's some
people who are just always scared and
they want to make a name for themselves
by pointing out all the fears and
Terrors and how we can end the world but
Banning the free exercise of mathematics
is not it we've banned almost everything
which is why we have to come to prospera
to do stuff in biology if we ban
mathematics like that's it that's the
end then you got to leave that Society
Al together the other thing I wanted to
double pick on that you mentioned before
what humans are capable of um I would
describe it as social Evolution or
culture right so we're able to
coordinate millions of intelligences
through like stories and narratives
right so that's something that when you
look back at the history of humanity you
in strugg at all right absolutely we
have layers and layers to our
intelligence networks we have
institutions we have countries we have
cultures we have religions we have all
different ways of conveying knowledge
combining knowledge recombining
knowledge and then executing on it um no
man no woman is an island you know if
you're out in the desert or The Jungle
by yourself I don't care how smart and
capable you are after a certain amount
of time you die that's just that simple
you know Robinson cruso aside
notwithstanding so uh we are Cooperators
uh but we're not blind Cooperators we're
not genetic Cooperators like uh ants and
bees we can actually cooperate across
genetic boundaries people who didn't
grow up as part of the same family can
cooperate people that aren't the same
race or culture can cooperate uh and
that's why we dominate this world uh
because a 100,000 humans can meet
together because they're all Christian
or because they're all scientists or
because they all want to live forever
and be and have Vitality um where uh you
know ants can't
even uh gang up across hives two ant
hives encounter each other they're
enemies they're different yeah yeah um
do you want to take audience questions
sure I have one more question though um
before let's do it and you're uh you
what did you learn from your brother
Kamal because I read in your book that
he's actually the philosopher in the
family that I'm just an amateur so
considering how great of a philosopher
you are what must be enormous I think
everybody's a philosopher right if you
live long enough you think about things
you're a philosopher I'm just a little
more articulate about it that's that's
all it is right I don't I don't think
I've thrown out any philosophical
thoughts that people haven't already had
it's a resonance right they kind of kind
of uh hear it it's uh what was it I
think it was God I'm going to get the
name wrong I want to say it was
Chesterton but somebody said that oh no
no no it was Emerson Emerson Ralph Waldo
Emerson uh great writer preacher um so
he uh he says something like you know in
every great thought we see our own words
coming back in us with a certain
alienated Majesty right so it's just
repeating back something we already knew
but doing it in a way that resonates
with us so I think that's uh that's
really the the skill set we're talking
about here um my my brother is an
amazing writer he's written some great
books you know a lot of people come up
to me and they're like oh thank you your
book saved my life I'm like oh you're
thinking of him you know he because he
wrote that book love yourself like your
life depends on it and I think it's a
it's a book about having an incredibly
strong core in self-esteem so you're not
dependent on people from the outside
that all of your core psychological
needs come from the inside uh and he is
a great writer he actually was the one
who first got into uh you know Hemingway
and got me into Hemingway even though
you know so a lot of my piffy writing
comes from him if you read his books
you'll notice he shaves off every single
word and he can do it at a book level I
can't I just do it at a tweet level cuz
I like that 140 character constraint
that's where I like to compete um
because I read a lot of poetry and I was
a failed poet uh rhyming is hard uh
metric verse is hard rhythm is hard but
I found word selection to be easy uh and
so that's where Twitter came in and gave
me an advantage then they went to 280
and now it's now everyone's putting
2hour videos with uh you know with Putin
on Twitter
I'd love to hear about um essentialized
science these are new ways to uh fund
science to get the science done to
publish the science and publicize it and
more generally to coordinate a
decentralized community uh especially in
a city like this science has always been
science has always been decentralized
it's just that then we created this
industrialized thing that we call
science just like we created
industrialized schooling uh one size
fits all right we want to Stamp Out lots
of phds but that doesn't create more
creativity it doesn't actually create
more scientists it creates more phds I
would draw a distinction between phds
and scientists I don't think you need to
have a PhD to be a scientist okay U if
you are naturally curious and you're
rigorous and you discover new things
you're a scientist like one of my
Twitter quips was the only true test of
intelligence is if you get what you want
out of life and that triggers a lot of
people but how else do you know how else
do you know if you're smart if you're
not getting what you want lot out of
life how smart are you really okay you
might have had bad luck once upon a time
but consistently every time I doubt it
and there's two parts to that one is
actually testing yourself against the
world to see if you get what you want
the other is wanting the right things in
the first place you know I wish I was 20
years old and had wings not going to
happen so you got to wish for the right
things too so I think decentralized
science science has always been
decentralized everyone can be a
scientist if they're rigorous uh and if
they're curious uh now in terms of
funding it yes you need funding to
science do science no you don't need
funding to do science okay if you need
to do research fundamental research in
patient populations you do need some
money there's a lot of Rich old people
out there who are dying I don't know how
old Michael Bloomberg is he's got a lot
of money he's almost dead I'm sure if
you went to him with the right pitch he
would cough up some money but you'd have
to extend his lifespan you know give him
some evidence give him give him solid
thinking give him solid proof uh
everyone's uh discount rate the interest
rate on their money at their deathbed is
infinite the closer you get to death you
know the greater the value of every
additional minute goes up go to Every
rich person in the world who's dying
offer them another minute of life and
see how much money they cough up the
funding is out there you just have to
have the rigorous thinking and the right
therapies um in terms of coordination
and Publishing internet so easy already
done I think there are entire Fields uh
like for example in Ai and ml where
people are just publishing openly
they're not publishing in these closed
journals and closed uh systems anymore
those Gatekeepers are going away so I
think science is already decentralized
it's just like you know Paul Graham said
it was a Paul Graham or Alan K uh the
future is here it's just not evenly
distributed so we're already in
decentralized
science what I want out of life is to
ask followup questions sorry should we
give other people more time but we come
back what do you think okay all right
thank
you um uh Ino question did you hear
about uh D defensive accelerationism yet
D defense accelerationism what does that
mean um Vin wrote an answer
to manifest but if you didn't read it
okay t tldr i i skim I skimmed it I'll
have some hot take on it which is not
accurate but overall I think we should
just go for the accelerationism but I'm
not interested argu I'm not that
interested in arguments against because
yeah yeah sorry that I want to ask yeah
uh you said so many beautiful things
about the enlightenment about uh one's
own uh responsibility of be truth
seeking and so on and not tapping into
the demon of group think or of a
socialized mind to go about it uh and
that you believe that it's possible for
every uh unique mind to go that route
and I would agree uh I would however
fear that the enlightenment as the
powers are spread now and as the
realities light uh lay on earth now
might not scale fast enough in time and
if we just accelerate artificial
intelligence most people will just
Outsource even their own sense making
and become NPCs how can we make that
possible uh that we can go the
acceleration route but keep human agency
and not just enable anybody to go for
their lowest hanging feedback loops and
lowest hanging Ambitions but probably
for the highest hanging Ambitions I
think it's natural I'm not afraid of it
because I I think firstly humans today
have more AG agcy than they had 5050
years ago right women are far more free
uh you can travel to prospera uh your
cell phone works here your money works
here that's more freedom you have more
agency than you've ever had and it's and
even the people you're calling NPCs
which I don't think is quite accurate
they have way more agency than they've
ever had so there's kind of this this
mindset that we often have where uh it's
kind of the tyranny of low expectations
we look down on other people and we're
just like well there are NPCs but I'm a
PC I'm not so sure I think there are PCS
in their own life and if you were to
swap places with them you would feel
very much like a PC so they are doing
the best they can with what they have
now they're busy you know maybe they're
cleaning toilets maybe they're trying to
figure out how to make ends meet maybe
they're trying to figure out how to get
into school uh maybe their brain doesn't
work as fast but they're still capable
of having great ideas because they're
Universal explainers so I think if you
free them up if you give them more time
if you automate more the things around
them they can be more creative now now
yes maybe they'll go down the rabbit
hole of uh you know smoking too much
dope and watching a lot of Netflix but
you know what I watched a lot of TV too
I played a lot of video games as a kid
turned out okay you got to let people
get through their humps all right maybe
they're eating too much and they're
getting fat great jab him with a zic you
know bring them back we're we're finding
solutions to these things so I think you
do have to give people more agency I
don't think the way I don't think
there's no way back by the way there's
no turning around what are you going to
do you can't stop other people from
moving forward so the only way out is
through
I'm not I'm not I don't mean to attack
you but we we should pass it to the next
person also sorry this sorry go ahead go
ahead you have something more to say
just say it with NPCs I rather meant
that uh people will go the easy route
because it's pre-programmed in our minds
to always go the energy saving route but
that's okay we're we're we're energy
minimizing systems and what's wrong with
that expending less energy to get to the
same outcome that's how the whole
universe works principle of lease action
so the market outcome according to you
would be every single individual would
have as their uh as their goto rout uh
total uh well self actualization and
curiosity and it's not uh like the
centralized forces on earth like the
media did to politics already uh would
use it and just uh lock us in a state
where we can't get out of I think it's
already getting better you have social
media which is way more free than
centralized media was than mass media
was now everybody's talking as opposed
to just a few people are talking so uh
yeah I don't I don't I don't I don't see
the risk you're talking about and I
don't see the alternative what do you do
top down control everybody what you're
allowed to say and what you're allowed
to think and who you got to follow
that's you're building the systems that
are exactly the ones that you fear if
you advocate for that promote cognitive
sovereignty and intellectual autonomy
absolutely we promote cognitive
sovereignty and intellectual autonomy
absolutely 100% go read the beginning of
infinity that's what it's all
about talking about everybody talking um
I have a question about air chat you're
very delivered with your time you want
to live forever which is why you're here
but when you're not here you're building
air chat what's your vision with it you
describe it as a voice first messenger
is it more WhatsApp more Twitter and
then ultimately how do you prevent it
from falling prey to centralized control
where everybody can't talk yeah so uh
I'm working on a new social network uh I
don't think social networks today are
social they don't actually have
conversation they're broadcast networks
1% of people get and spew their thoughts
on Twitter that's broadcasting 1% of
people get up and put up their private
photos on Instagram you know that's
broadcasting 1% of people get up and
dance on Tik Tok that's broadcasting
it's not actually social you can't
actually have meaningful conversations
you can't actually connect as humans so
air chat is an attempt to create
conversations and we're just early on it
we're iterating we're rebuilding it
we're rebuilding it we're rebuilding it
so the first goal there is just I get
bored I want to talk to smart people I
want to have the ability to pull out my
phone no matter matter where I'm in the
world and talk to smart people second I
want to promote free speech so we need a
network that is not controlled by people
who believe in authoritarian beliefs
luckily Elon came on came along and
bought Twitter he renamed it X which I
think was a massive destruction of brand
value but uh he nevertheless did free it
up so people can now much more freely
say what they think is it uh completely
decentralized and Unstoppable no we have
a bunch of others for that we have blue
sky we have Noster we have farcaster
these are good backup Solutions the
problem is very very hard to innovate on
a new media format and a new
conversation format and make it
decentralized at the same time anyone
who's not been in crypto and then added
a token to their offering knows exactly
what I'm talking about then you get
bogged down and token hell so
decentralization is something you solve
after you figure out how to make the
thing work so right now we're just
trying to figure out how to make the
thing work I don't think it's quite
ready for prime time I think we're going
to we're rebuilding it there's going to
be a relaunch hopefully it'll work this
time honestly it's just fun it's
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