Ben Ponders Gender
Summary
TLDRIn this interview, Ben discusses his experiences with sexual diversity and societal attitudes towards it, from his childhood through to his professional life. He reflects on how conversations around homosexuality and transgender issues were taboo in his youth, contrasting with his later experiences in a more accepting study abroad program. Ben also shares his thoughts on the rapid changes in social consciousness, the impact of social media, and the challenges of navigating a professional environment with a zero-tolerance policy for harassment. He hopes that increased awareness and understanding will lead to greater unity and acceptance.
Takeaways
- 🏠 The interviewee's family did not express hate or prejudice towards homosexuality during his upbringing, but the topic was considered taboo.
- 🏫 In high school, the interviewee observed that being gay was not openly discussed and was somewhat ostracized, with few students identifying as such.
- 🌍 During a study abroad program, the interviewee noticed a stark contrast in attitudes towards homosexuality, where it was more accepted and not a topic of concern among peers.
- 🚹 The interviewee recalls a high school friend who was gay and felt the need to date or interact with others from outside his school to avoid social stigma.
- 💼 In the professional realm, the interviewee's company enforces a strict LGBTQ+ policy, emphasizing a zero-tolerance approach to harassment and promoting an inclusive workplace.
- 📢 An incident where a colleague was fired for using a term considered derogatory, even when recounting a personal story, highlighted the strictness of the company's policy and the potential for misunderstandings.
- 📱 The interviewee speculates that the current generation of high school students likely has a different experience with sexuality due to increased access to information and more open conversations at home.
- 🔍 There is a noted shift in social consciousness around sexuality, with the interviewee reflecting on his own past and present views, indicating a personal evolution.
- 🌐 The interviewee hopes that the growing awareness and acceptance of diverse sexualities will contribute to a more unified society, focusing on commonalities rather than differences.
- 🚀 The interview concludes with an optimistic view of the future, where the interviewee envisions a society that has moved past petty differences to achieve great things together.
Q & A
What was the general attitude towards homosexuality during Ben's childhood?
-During Ben's childhood, there was no hateful or spiteful language towards homosexuality. His family did not express negative views about gay people, and the topic was not prevalent in their conversations.
How did Ben's school environment differ from his home in terms of discussing sexual diversity?
-At school, there was a more conservative environment where being gay was not openly discussed, and there was a tendency to not socialize with openly gay students, unlike the more open attitude at home.
What was Ben's experience with sexual diversity during his study abroad program in Oxford?
-Ben found that close to half of the males in his study abroad program were homosexual, and there was no discrimination or judgment from the staff or other students, unlike his high school experience.
How has social media influenced the awareness and acceptance of sexual diversity according to Ben?
-Ben believes that social media has played a significant role in advancing social consciousness and awareness of sexual diversity, both positively and negatively, by providing immediate access to information and a platform for discussion.
What was the company policy regarding LGBTQIA+ issues that Ben encountered in his professional workplace?
-Ben's workplace had a zero-tolerance policy for harassment and any form of discrimination, with mandatory meetings and guest speakers to promote an open and inclusive environment.
Can you describe the incident that led to a colleague's termination due to a violation of the company's LGBTQIA+ policy?
-A colleague was fired for using a derogatory term, 'transformer,' during a casual Zoom conversation, which was overheard and reported, leading to her termination despite her intention not being to offend.
How did the incident of the colleague's termination affect Ben?
-The incident was alarming and terrifying for Ben, making him feel that he could easily offend someone without knowing it and face severe consequences, even in a professional setting.
What is Ben's opinion on the necessity of a more flexible policy regarding LGBTQIA+ issues in the workplace?
-Ben feels that while a zero-tolerance policy is in place for a good reason, there should be some flexibility to handle grievances at a more personal level to avoid misunderstandings and promote reconciliation.
How has Ben's personal perspective on sexuality evolved from his childhood to adulthood?
-Ben's perspective has evolved from a time when he and his friends would avoid certain types of pornography to a more mature and accepting view of different sexual orientations and gender identities.
What does Ben hope for the future in terms of social consciousness and unity?
-Ben hopes that the evolution of social consciousness will lead to greater unity among people, setting aside petty differences, and working together towards common goals such as colonizing Mars or becoming less dependent on fossil fuels.
Outlines
🏠 Family and School Attitudes on Sexual Diversity
The speaker reflects on their upbringing and the attitudes towards sexual diversity and homosexuality during their childhood. They mention that their family did not express hateful language towards the LGBTQ+ community, and while the topic of transsexuality was not prevalent, there was no direct prejudice or hate at home. At school, the speaker attended a small high school in a conservative area where there was a clear social incentive not to socialize with openly gay students, though they personally did not hold any animosity towards them. The speaker also recalls a classmate who was out and guarded, only dating men from other schools to avoid social stigma.
🌍 Study Abroad Experience in Oxford
The speaker discusses their experience in a study abroad program in Oxford, England, where they noticed a stark difference in attitudes towards homosexuality. They observed that close to half of the males in the program identified as homosexual, and there was a general lack of concern or prejudice from both staff and peers. This environment contrasted sharply with their high school experience, where they felt they couldn't openly socialize with gay peers without fear of judgment. The speaker highlights the change in social attitudes and the normalization of diverse sexualities during their time abroad.
💼 Professional Workplace and LGBTQ+ Policies
The speaker transitions to discuss their professional experience with sexual diversity, noting the significant impact of social media on social advancement and the increased awareness and acceptance of different sexualities. They mention their company's LGBTQ+ policy, which is strictly enforced with zero tolerance for harassment. However, they share a concerning incident where a colleague was fired for using a term, unbeknownst to her, that was considered derogatory within the company's policy, despite her intention only being to share a personal story. This incident left the speaker feeling alarmed and cautious about the potential for unintentional policy violations.
🚨 The Impact of a Zero Tolerance Policy
In this paragraph, the speaker delves into the chilling effect the zero tolerance policy had on them and their colleagues, particularly in the context of remote work. They express concern about the potential for easily tripping over unknown boundaries and inadvertently offending someone, which could have severe professional consequences. The speaker also empathizes with the person who was offended, recognizing the complexity of balancing a strict policy with the need for understanding and growth.
🧭 Navigating the Evolving Social Landscape
The speaker ponders how young professionals and those not exposed to a broad spectrum of sexualities in their upbringing can navigate the modern professional world. They acknowledge the rapid evolution of social consciousness and the challenges it presents for individuals who were raised in an earlier 'evolutionary period.' The speaker suggests that while policies like zero tolerance are well-intended, there may be a need for more nuanced approaches that allow for education and reconciliation rather than immediate punitive action.
🔮 Envisioning the Future of Social Consciousness
In the final paragraph, the speaker is invited to speculate on the future direction of social consciousness regarding sexuality. They express a hopeful vision where increased understanding and acceptance of diverse sexualities could contribute to greater unity as a species. The speaker imagines a future where petty differences are set aside, and humanity can focus on collective achievements, such as colonizing Mars or becoming sustainable, reflecting an optimistic outlook on the role of evolving social attitudes in shaping a progressive future.
Mindmap
Keywords
💡Sexual diversity
💡Homosexuality
💡Transsexual
💡Taboo
💡Study abroad
💡Social media
💡LGBTQIA+ policy
💡Zero tolerance
💡Bisexuality
💡Professional space
💡Social consciousness
Highlights
Ben discusses his family's attitudes towards sexual diversity during his upbringing, noting the absence of hateful language.
Ben recalls the taboo nature of transsexuality during his high school years and the lack of conversation on the topic.
In high school, Ben observed social incentives that discouraged interaction with openly gay students.
Ben shares an anecdote about a gay student on the debate team who sought safety through distance by dating outside his school.
During a study abroad program, Ben experienced a more accepting environment where homosexuality was not a concern among peers.
Ben contrasts his high school's social dynamics with the inclusive atmosphere at Oxford, where sexual diversity was openly accepted.
Ben reflects on the rapid changes in societal attitudes towards sexual diversity from his high school days to the present.
Ben acknowledges the role of social media in advancing social consciousness and the challenges of adapting to new social norms.
Ben describes his company's LGBTQIA+ policy and the mandatory training sessions to foster an open and inclusive workplace.
A colleague's firing for using a derogatory term unintentionally highlights the zero-tolerance policy and its implications.
Ben expresses concern over the potential for inadvertently violating social norms due to a lack of awareness.
Ben and the interviewer discuss the importance of navigating social changes and the need for policies that allow for learning and adaptation.
Ben shares a personal story from his adolescence that reflects the evolving attitudes towards sexuality.
The conversation turns to the potential differences in experiences for current high school students compared to Ben's generation.
Ben speculates on the future of social consciousness and expresses hope for unity and overcoming differences.
The interview concludes with Ben's hopeful vision for a future where society moves towards greater unity and acceptance.
Transcripts
[Music]
ben thanks very much for coming to
talking with me today about all things
sex and gender and and maybe a place for
us to start is to talk about you know
when you were being raised in your
family what were the prevailing
attitudes about sexual diversity about
homosexuality for example right um
i mean you know it's you know i had to
think back um
you know was raised um it wasn't there
was never really any like hateful or
like spiteful language you know i you
know my my mother and did get divorced
twice between uh fifth grade and uh
tenth grade so there was you know that
element of um
i guess you could call it or i guess you
know a marriage right or the decaying of
one or two but there was never any like
you know gay people or homosexualities
bad or this and that
to be honest
as a child and even really into high
school the transsexual
that was not really
a prevalent conversation okay at least
in my world okay um and i you know i was
i liked you know i considered myself
quite studious in high school
so i mean you would hear this and that
but it was not like a national
conversation okay so i never would be
like you know hey mom what about bruce
jenner that wasn't a conversation sure
that i ever had with my mom um boy if
things changed
of course i mean i you know i mean
especially you know having kids now i
can understand that being but
homosexuality
certainly was okay um
i you know i'm just thinking back now on
like you know a dinner conversation here
and there you know my mom is not a
hateful spiteful woman toward the
homosexual community
um but it was a very i just recall it
being taboo i said
like you know you knew there might have
been like the one or two
gay not to use that offensively but the
gay kid in high school okay and i didn't
you know i did not avoid them or
anything like that um but there really
wasn't a whole lot of
conversation in the home about what this
is
and you know what it there really wasn't
always a sense that it was taboo
territory yes but no direct stereotypes
or prejudice or hate
at home and then how about at school um
at school that was actually kind of
interesting um
you know it would be
there was obviously like the water you
know and i went to a relatively small
high school
um i'd say there were about 300 students
per grade 10th 11th and 12th so about a
thousand students give or take
um in a more conservative part of the
country um
you know there was always like the one
or two
like you know out of the closet who were
gay and i mean i didn't think that they
were like any less human
but it was almost like you would you
know i you you would you were
incentivized almost
amongst peers
to
not socialize with them i see
because what what's the because they
you know liked boys i see okay so there
was like the third rail you just started
right away and um and just i guess not
to go not to kind of veer off target but
lesbian you know lesbians and lesbianism
wasn't really even
on our radar right and not so visible
probably i mean the gay bull probably
more clearly exactly and it was actually
kind of interesting i actually now that
you mentioned it i do recall
that um
he'll go unnamed but he was actually on
the debate team he was a year older than
me
um
he was you know out of the closet as we
would say and you know i mean i would
engage with him we were on the debate
team but he felt so
almost
i don't even know the right word but so
guarded that he would only interact
sexually or date men from other schools
even though there was like another gay
student or two at our high school
they it was like you know they didn't
want to intensify
that
social positioning if that makes sense
so you sought safety through distance
exactly so he would be like oh there's a
height you know i know this guy at this
high school or
older men i remember him and i talked
one night at a hotel in a debate
tournament
but um
so yeah that was pretty much my only
exposure to any sort of alternate
sexuality
than heterosexuality but now you you
also had an experience where you did an
overseas thing and you immersed in a
different educational environment um in
what way was that similar to or
different from well it was quite
different um you know this was so this
was essentially a study abroad program
for high school students
um and it would be like a few from
different high schools higher performing
students
and we did a trip it was to oxford
england after university okay it was
great you know got to see where
you know hillary and
bill met christ church college and they
were rhodes scholars and did some
studying there but
and i would say close to half of the
males that were on this study abroad
program were homosexual
no one cared
the the staff
us
and i'm not you know i'm not trying to
be demeaning or insinuate that you know
people who are of a certain social group
in high school are less accepting than
others but that was kind of the case
interesting and so like i was actually
you know like i didn't feel weird like
eating lunch with them or walking to
class
just because it was just you know being
me but it must have felt weird to not
feel weird because you'd been steeped in
this
culture in which
you did right really couldn't be the one
who would eat lunch with where i'd be in
high school and i'd see like him you
know i'd see a friend eating alone
because he was gay
and then i you know i i mean i'm not a
perfect soul but i would kind of be like
man i kind of want to go sit with him
like i know him but then like you know i
would be judged by my peers
now you know i was a 15 16 year old kid
sure nowadays i would have told them all
to go [ __ ] themselves right right but
at that time you know i didn't have that
luxury you look back on it you see that
you were the sudden right but then i was
you know finished up a class at oxford
and went and had lunch with two
homosexual guys and we just laughed and
joked and played frisbee in a field it
was just fine
so this so this is really interesting
because um this is this is not like it
was in the 1950s right so i mean this
this is in the like i can't imagine
this would this would have been
late to i mean 2010
2009 okay so and now look at the change
between then
and now
where
you know what man their rights and
privileges were not protected at that
time in fact they were almost in an out
group if you were expressing sexual
diversity
i think in our group's a great way to
put it it was just like they were i
don't think they were being like rounded
up and like you know ostracized but
they weren't out group but there was
certainly like a
let's almost just ignore it kind of
thing
and so we fast forward now and you find
yourself
long out of high school and but now
you're in a professional space
and and in this professional space do
you see um differences in the way in
which
sexual diversity is treated or regarded
in your professional workplace
absolutely um i mean
just
to sort of preface it i feel like social
media alone
has
infected
and for positive and negative are
advancement
as a species socially
like
you know i mean and sure there were so
you know i had you know there were cell
phones when i was in high school but not
the access to information the immediacy
of social media was not anything like it
yeah and so
nowadays absolutely and i think it's a
wonderful thing for people i mean i
can't imagine you know feeling different
and being you know
force in a closet
for lack of a better phrase for how you
feel and having to hide that so i do
think it's a wonderful thing
um but it just it all happened so fast
to go from like where i was like from
the few anecdotes i shared in high
school to now
where i almost feel and rightfully so
that a lot of these different
sexualities and
um life choices etc
are almost put on a pedestal i see okay
and i'm not insinuating at all they're
like more or less but i do think that
after having been deprived rights and
you know dignity for so long we do need
to raise awareness of it and i just
think the advancement of social media
propagated that
so in the workplace at your fingertips
you have access to the world right oh
gosh and and i i i honestly feel like a
collective sense of empathy came with
that
which i think is a wonderful thing
interesting i mean i can't imagine
feeling like a transsexual person feels
50 years ago right like
my god right like what do you do right i
mean that's i mean i couldn't even
imagine that deep undercover and so to
go to your question
in a professional workplace i work for a
wonderful company
they um have you know fully enforced and
um
[Music]
i guess enforces the right word but and
put into place a uh lgbtqia plus policy
there were mandatory zoo meetings
and um you know guest speakers and it
was made very clear that it would be a
zero tolerance workplace for any form of
harassment any insinuation
of
just any anything that would make anyone
feel uncomfortable i see okay they
wanted to be a completely open
work workplace which i mean there's
nothing wrong with it right
um
but i did have an experience uh about
six months ago so we were remote working
which has
as we all know has provided its own
benefits and challenges
and um
you know you there's group zooms that
you can join where like you know you
you'll be working and there's people
doing this and that and they'll drop
down
kind of to imitate the social structure
of like the water cooler right quote
unquote sure um
and very good friend of mine you know we
were peers
i kind of stayed in my lane and you know
i would just you know i would join zoom
meetings that i had to perform my tasks
and um her and i would zoom together
especially if we were working later
nights in operations
and
she was bisexual uh she owned her own
home she had a daughter from a
previous relationship
and you know we just kind of got to know
each other through zoom and
she sent me a text one day saying that
she'd been fired and i was like wow
i was like oh my gosh i was like what
you know what happened like
you know and
um it was explained to me that she was
fired
by
violating this company's lgbtqia plus
policy and what led
um
again i did not have access to the
direct hr
what exactly occurred but she
i trust her and she told me she called
me crying
and she told me the story essentially um
she was in one of these general zooms
and you know it was
it was late at night
and um you know she was telling a story
to several of the people in the zoo
about how
um her sister's ex-boyfriend
used to mock her for being bisexual
and she had never gone considered going
through uh physiological change or
hormone treatment
but he used to call her the he called
her the transformer transformer that's
the word that he and so she was
recanting this not recanting him that's
the wrong word but she was
you know
we're calling this story
and apparently
um
somebody had joined this general zoo
she said
she she says i remember the four or five
people that i was telling the story to
and
this she used a derogatory term which i
did not even know
was a derogatory term transformer like i
mean i even like i mean i i even like i
almost cracked the joke i was like you
mean optimus prime like you know like
the
from the michael bay movies like
i mean and i was just like oh my gosh
and she says that's why and she wrote a
letter to the company
in an email format just saying
look i'm a bisexual woman like i was
this is what happened they just it was a
zero tolerance policy and they said that
we you know they we apologize we
understand things may have been taken
out of context
but
somebody heard this term
and they were offended wow even though
she wasn't applying it as a stereotype
towards somebody i mean she she
literally said she goes why in the hell
she had a really thick country accent
why in the hell would i ever call
anybody that right she said i was
telling a story about my piece of [ __ ]
sister's ex-boyfriend and
she was fired my goodness
and it was alarming now that must have
sent a chilling effect through
the office or the company in some way
shape or form um i will say
it is a relatively large company yeah
close to 14 1500 employees but
um
the work from home format i really think
dilutes
and weakens that ripple effect because
you're really just a little screen and a
zoom sure and you're just a number on
our performance chart but you knew her
and you interact oh gosh i mean what
impact did it have on you
terrifying
and not even to be dramatic it was just
terrifying as i mean
i was just like wow like i didn't even
know
for
just just to get base one
for you without even getting into like
the political and social ramifications i
did not even know
that that was a derogatory term yeah
so that makes you feel like you could
hit a tripwire pretty easily and without
even knowing it
yeah i mean it i mean it was i mean you
know just i i literally made me i was
just like wow i did not even know that
was i mean and i'll equate it to this
it would be like going through life
without knowing that the n-word was
derogatory to african-americans and
people of african descent
[Music]
that's that's literally made me feel
that stupid almost right and aloof right
and so i was just like wow
and
kind of you know
that being said though like you know is
the zero tolerance policy obviously is
in place for a good reason right
but
i just it just kind of was just like man
to put something in place and i
understand that sexuality is complex
and i can't even begin to understand
you know the pain and you know what
people go through to really feel
comfortable who they are
but
it needs to be able to bend i almost
feel
and i mean you know being a you know
white heterosexual male
i you know i don't know if i'm in a
place to create or dictate policy on
that but to make something so rigid
i just i don't know it was just kind of
scary well i can understand that i get
sick it introduces an element of being
vulnerable and vulnerability right
like uh you mean even to the point where
i'm just like do i even want like want
to go back to the office like what if i
somehow offended someone and didn't even
know i offended them and then my career
or this and that
um and so yeah that's that was kind of a
a little bit of an alarming story yeah
yeah and i feel also i feel bad for the
person who got the feeling sir yeah i
hope that it was not you know a
malicious uh d but they clearly were
offended by it and
i hate that that occurred but
i i mean i would like you know i'd like
to ask you a question like what do you
think about how can young professionals
or people that we're not necessarily
raised in this broad spectrum of
sexualities how can we navigate the
professional world
well it's confident it's interesting
hasn't it been because
that's really that's really a very
kind of astute you know observation that
we
there's a grinding there there's the
evolution of social consciousness that
you alluded to
and yet you have people that were born
in a sense in earlier evolutionary
periods which may have only been 5 or 10
or 15 or 20 years ago so there's the
inevitable grinding of the gears
as you as we all experience this shift
and what you're calling attention to is
the fact that there are very there's
very real pain and very real costs
associated with that transition of
course it doesn't just come full blown
given to us we kind of you know work our
way through
the the muck as we as we kind of feel
our way through it across time right
and that's i i i can see how that would
introduce tremendous you almost would
like to have
some alternative
you know hr policy where the grievance
could be
handled at the level of
you know a meeting and interaction
coming to terms a reconciliation in some
way shape or form because these are
things you're going to be bumping into
in life
for the foreseeable future yeah um no i
mean i completely agree and it's um
you know sometimes you have to run
before you can walk i guess yeah um but
it's uh it's a very interesting thing
but it's just like
i mean i'm you know i'm 28 years old and
when i was being raised like the idea of
like a
woman transitioning to a man or vice
versa or any of these plethora
of
you know tendencies and livelihoods and
whatever
that was never even like it was never
even like a remote idea right in my
brain as a child i have no problem with
it right
absolutely not live your life love who
you want to love don't hurt anybody
but at the same time i just feel
handicapped yeah well you had no
experience right really and now you're
thrust into a
diverse world lacking the kind of
experience and yet experience experience
any kind of [ __ ] and a colleague of mine
was fired
for using a term
which i now understand is not okay to
use sure
but i had no idea
that it was even
and then you have to wonder how many
more of those are out there i know what
if i don't if i say the wrong word in a
zoom call and i offend
a certain collection of people
anyone i know
anyone
and in some ways you may be even more
ripe for it because you say you're a
cisgendered white male
i mean she was a bisexual woman
the source doesn't matter if somebody is
uncomfortable with
then the policy gets applied absolutely
well very interesting and so you started
off by talking about the relative
homogeneity
uh in when you were in high school
not that long ago
so and then the evolution of social
consciousness so let's imagine the
thought experiment that we're dipping
back into that high school today okay
you know 10 or 15 years later
what
what
i actually you know i didn't interrupt
you but actually something just popped
in my head i actually think i might be
able to give you a little bit of an
interesting insight okay um
i mean you know just not to be too
graphic but i remember like when i first
began masturbating uh is that okay to
talk about sure absolutely um you know
it was like i had a friend's house i was
like in fifth or sixth grade we only
watched lesbian porn and if we didn't do
it together we would like go in a
separate room oh really because like
having can we talk about this is that
okay sure absolutely but i'll remember
this because like you know you didn't
want to see the penis that was gay oh
and so we would watch like you know like
lesbian porn
and then i i've never forgotten that
interesting and it was not like no one
told us to do that right right right no
one said this it was just like
and so we were like you know young you
know
you know sixth seventh graders and we
would just be like we would just watch
lesbian porn and now we would never
really do it together
but like we would like to have a
conversation like oh man did you see
this video right right right and it was
always lesbian porn
no penis is allowed it wasn't like i
mean there wasn't like a rule like we
didn't have like a charter but i'll
never forget that it was just like it
was like a almost
i can't use the word taboo but yeah
i think it's doesn't it feel looking
back on it now like a little oh now if i
watch a porno i don't care if it's
penises
that might be preferable
so i guess i've grown up a little bit
but no i actually did remember that like
the first it was always like lesbian
porn
because seeing the penis was like a
weakness or it was like a sign of
homosexuality i'll never forget that's
like homophobia in a way
but like not i mean homophobia but like
not purposeful right like almost like
this like
not i mean like transcendent like it was
just like oh like you can't
liking a penis is bad sort of thing
right right uh anyway i know that would
kind of went off that was then this is
now right
so that's a great example of kind of the
the evolution of social consciousness
and it's a direct relationship to you
right and do you think that do you think
the kids in in um in high school now
have a different kind of experience or
do you feel like they they pretty much
preserved and encapsulated the kind of
experience that you had
wouldn't that be interesting to know i
don't know i mean i
i can't imagine
with i mean
i remember cell phones
i i i'm not i'm not changing subjects
but i'm getting somewhere with this but
cell phones being like an issue when i
was in high school sure and especially
being a child of divorce i had a cell
phone since i was in like fourth grade i
was like one of the first kids
um
and like i just remember like you know
like the texting and like it was like an
issue and so now
i don't know i don't i'm not friends
with any high schoolers particularly
you know i don't like hang out with high
school students i think
no um but i actually have been reading
some things like you'll see every now
and then like a high school teacher
maybe saying something inappropriate or
doing this and that and like students
filming it
and i've also read where like some high
school teachers have a no cell phone
policy and so they'll have this they'll
have like a cubby of like like like 30
of the little cubbies outside of the
high school door
you have to put your phone in there so
to get back to your question
our high school students are our sixth
graders only
masturbating to lesbian porn i don't
know but i will say i do think that
they have a lot more access to
information sure i think that parents
are having a lot more
conversations yeah
with their children earlier more open
yet i mean there's a big the the world
while the world gets bigger it gets
smaller that's an interesting point say
say that again while the world gets
bigger it gets smaller
so and i just feel like you know maybe
at this if i was a 16 or 17 year old i
might have talked to my parents about
alternate sexuality sure you know maybe
some
kids might not feel the need
to
hide who they are who they are right um
but
i don't know i i really think it would
be interesting
to
maybe interview or you know get involved
with um guidance counselors and kind of
gauge
where
you know the 16 year olds are now yeah
and no doubt anybody who's been just
like anybody who's been in a teaching
career for 20 or 30 or 40 years has seen
tremendous change i couldn't imagine
being a teacher
like from then to now it's hard to
imagine um so let me ask you ben where
is this heading
where is he saying if we fast forward
another 10 years or 20 years
what if you know this is
the opportunity for you to play
nostradamus
with this evolution of social
consciousness is leading us in what
direction to what destination do you
think
it's an interesting question doc um
i hope
well
i hope it helps us unite as a
species um
i you know um
i
don't think home a lot
i just feel that there's just so many
things throughout history and
you know short and long term have
divided us land wealth
race gender
all these things we have used to
perpetuate this illusion that we're
different
and a lot of those boundaries i feel
have been conquered
not all
some have just been weakened some still
stand calm
um
but i do hope that
this greater thinking for how you
phrased it this greater consciousness of
a society
i hope that it can propagate us to unite
and maybe put aside some petty
differences and you know accomplish
wonders whether whether that's colonize
mars
um you know maybe
become uh
you know no longer dependent on fossil
fuels or you know i know i'm getting
kind of caught off guard but i hope that
these issues of sexuality and in
realizing that we're all intrinsic
and that we all are different
and we have to be okay with that i would
hope that maybe we could do something
good with it
ben it's a very affirming and hopeful
kind of image of the future and i
appreciate you sharing that and i share
with you the hope that
we move toward greater unity as we move
across time and i appreciate your
courage and candor in coming and talking
with me today about all things sex and
gender absolutely
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