Why God Is a Person and Not an Idea | Jonathan Pageau & Fr. Stephen Freeman
Summary
TLDRThe speaker discusses the intellectual awakening in one's 20s and the tendency to view God as an abstract concept rather than a personal experience. They argue that our encounters with the divine are deeply personal and particular, as seen in Christ's interactions with individuals. The speaker emphasizes the importance of particularity in understanding the transcendentals of goodness, truth, and beauty, and how Christianity revolutionized the concept of personhood, giving infinite value to the individual. They also touch on the modern disconnect from these values and the resulting ethical confusion.
Takeaways
- đ The concept of God as an abstract force is contrasted with the personal, experiential understanding of the divine through human consciousness.
- đ Personal encounters with others are highlighted as the richest and most transformative aspects of human experience, suggesting that the divine is encountered in these interactions.
- đ The idea of the divine mind or God is best represented through the image of Christ, emphasizing the importance of the particular over the abstract in understanding the divine.
- đ The distinction between the general and the particular is crucial; truth is only encountered in the particular, as seen in the Orthodox teaching about icons.
- đš Modern art's drive towards abstraction can lead to cognitive dissonance, as it often fails to capture the generalized essence in a way that resonates with viewers.
- đ± The term 'transcendent particular' is introduced to describe God as the ultimate particular, being unique and beyond generalization.
- đ€ Communion and unity are found in the particular, not the abstract, as seen in the personal interactions of Christ with individuals, recognizing their unique identities.
- đ„ The reduction of people to abstractions can lead to dehumanization and violence, whereas love and forgiveness are found in recognizing the particularity of individuals.
- đ The importance of names in signifying personal identity is underscored, as seen in the biblical accounts of Jesus calling individuals by name, revealing their unique value.
- đ The Incarnation is presented as the key to understanding the Christian revolution, where the infinite becomes particular, and the particular is revealed to have infinite value.
- đĄ The ethical implications of recognizing the infinite value of the particular are discussed, emphasizing the importance of individual worth and the Christian ethic of love and sacrifice.
Q & A
What is the speaker's view on the concept of God as an abstract force?
-The speaker finds it strange to consider God as merely an abstract force, arguing that our experience of reality is through our human consciousness, and the highest and richest encounters we have are with other people, suggesting a more personal and transformative understanding of God.
Why does the speaker believe that the image of the infinite should be connected to our personal experience?
-The speaker argues that since our world view is shaped by our human consciousness, the concept of the infinite, including God, should resonate with our personal experiences, which are inherently connected to our consciousness and interactions with others.
What is the significance of Christ in the speaker's perspective on the divine?
-Christ represents the best image of God for the speaker because He embodies the divine in a human form, making the concept of God relatable and understandable within the context of human experience and personal encounters.
What is the importance of the distinction between the general and the particular in the speaker's discussion?
-The speaker emphasizes that truth and understanding can only be encountered in the particular, not in the general. This is highlighted in the discussion about icons in religious teachings and the modern art's attempt to capture the generalized, which often leads to cognitive dissonance.
Why does the speaker criticize modern art's drive towards abstraction?
-The speaker criticizes modern art's abstraction because it often results in works that are so generalized that they lack clear meaning, leading viewers to question whether they are indeed art and failing to convey a particular truth or experience.
What is the term the speaker uses to describe God's particularity and transcendence?
-The speaker uses the term 'transcendent particular' to describe God, indicating that God is the ultimate particular entity because there is only one of Him, yet He transcends all particularity.
How does the speaker relate the concept of particularity to our interactions with others?
-The speaker suggests that we find love, forgiveness, and communion in the particularity of our interactions with others, as it is through these personal encounters that we truly understand and connect with one another.
What is the significance of knowing someone's name in the speaker's discussion of personal encounters?
-Knowing someone's name signifies a personal encounter and recognition of their individuality. The speaker uses examples from the Bible, such as Jesus calling out Zacchaeus by name, to illustrate the importance of personal recognition in forming meaningful connections.
How does the speaker connect the concept of particularity to the Christian understanding of ethics?
-The speaker connects particularity to Christian ethics by stating that each human life is a unique and unrepeatable particular entity with infinite value, which should be respected, loved, and potentially sacrificed for, reflecting the incarnation's impact on ethical thinking.
What does the speaker suggest about the loss of Christian tradition in modern secular ethics?
-The speaker suggests that when the Christian tradition is removed from the modern secular context, the grounding in particularity and the understanding of the infinite value of the individual are lost, leading to a rise in collectivism and a devaluation of human life.
How does the speaker view the role of the Incarnation in shaping our ethical understanding?
-The speaker views the Incarnation as a pivotal moment that gave infinite value to the particular, transforming our ethical understanding to recognize the unique and infinite worth of each individual, and shaping our approach to love, sacrifice, and the value of human life.
Outlines
đ The Personal Experience of the Divine
This paragraph discusses the personal nature of our encounter with the divine, challenging the notion that God can be reduced to an abstract concept. The speaker emphasizes that our consciousness is inherently human, and thus our understanding of the divine is grounded in our interactions with other people, who are the most transformative aspect of our reality. The paragraph also touches on the idea that the image of the infinite, or God, is best represented through the personal experience of Christ, rather than an abstract notion. The speaker argues for the importance of recognizing the particular over the general in our search for truth, using the example of religious icons to illustrate that we can only represent the divine in a personal, human form.
đ The Value of the Particular in Spirituality and Art
The second paragraph delves into the significance of the particular in both spirituality and art. It contrasts the abstract with the concrete, suggesting that true communion and understanding come from engaging with the particular, such as individual people and personal encounters with the divine. The speaker uses the example of Jesus' interactions with specific individuals, like Zacchaeus and Simon the Pharisee, to highlight the importance of personal connection. The paragraph also touches on modern art's struggle with abstraction and the cognitive dissonance it can create, advocating for the representation of the particular as a means of expressing the divine and the human experience. The concept of the 'transcendent particular' is introduced, suggesting that God is both utterly unique and the ultimate particular, known to us through Jesus Christ.
đïž The Ethical Implications of Valuing the Particular
In this paragraph, the discussion shifts to the ethical implications of valuing the particular, drawing a connection between the Christian understanding of the incarnation and the inherent value of every individual. The speaker argues that the recognition of each person's unique worth has its roots in Christian thought, where the incarnation of God in Jesus Christ elevated the status of the individual. This has led to a shift in ethical thinking, where the particular is seen as having infinite value, which is a cornerstone of Christian ethics. The paragraph also addresses the modern tendency to revert to collectivism and devalue the individual, suggesting that this leads to a loss of ethical grounding and a rise in ideologies that treat people as mere numbers or tools. The speaker warns of the dangers of losing the connection to traditional Christian virtues and the importance of maintaining a focus on the value of the particular in ethical considerations.
Mindmap
Keywords
đĄIntellectual Awakening
đĄAbstract Force
đĄHuman Consciousness
đĄOntological Aspect
đĄDivine Mind
đĄTranscendent Particular
đĄParticularity
đĄIncarnation
đĄCollectivism
đĄParticularity in Ethics
đĄRevelation
Highlights
The concept that an intellectual awakening in one's 20s often involves encountering people who view God as an abstract force rather than a personal experience.
The idea that our consciousness and human experience limit our understanding of reality to the world we perceive through it.
The transformative power of human interaction and its role in making us more human, as opposed to abstract concepts.
The ontological argument that the image of the infinite should be connected to our personal experiences and consciousness.
The notion of the divine mind and God being best represented by Christ, making sense in the context of personal experience.
The importance of distinguishing between general truths and particular encounters, as we only know anything in its particular form.
The Orthodox teaching about icons, emphasizing that only particular beings like Christ can be depicted, not abstract divine nature.
Modern art's drive towards abstraction and the cognitive dissonance it can create when people cannot recognize or understand it as art.
The argument that communion and transformation occur through the particular, not the abstract.
The term 'transcendent particular' used to describe God as the ultimate particular entity, being unique and beyond generalization.
The observation that love, forgiveness, and union are found in the particular, not the abstract, using interpersonal relationships as examples.
The critique of reducing people to abstractions as a precursor to violence and the importance of recognizing particularity to prevent it.
Christ's personal interactions with individuals, such as Zacchaeus, as examples of recognizing and valuing the particular.
The idea that knowing someone's name represents a deep personal recognition, as seen in the Revelation's promise of a new name.
St. Maximus the Confessor's view on the harmony between spiritual essence and particularity in the context of incarnation.
The Christian revolution in understanding the transcendentals (goodness, truth, beauty) as being encountered in the particular.
The concept that the word 'person' as we understand it today is a Christian invention, emphasizing the value of the individual.
The ethical implications of incarnation, suggesting that every human life is a unique particularity with infinite value.
The modern challenge of maintaining the value of the particular in a secular context where Christian tradition has been sidelined.
G.K. Chesterton's observation that when tradition is abandoned, virtues can become distorted and lead to chaos.
Transcripts
you know when you when you start to have
a kind of let's say intellectual
awakening in your 20s often you meet all
these kinds of people who even if they
can believe in God they have this idea
okay I believe in God but I I believe
God is more like an abstract force is
more like like something that's like you
said something that's abstract something
that's an idea
but that is just not our experience of
of reality because we are we view the
world through our own consciousness our
own human consciousness we don't know of
any other world besides the one that we
can view through this human
consciousness and we encounter you know
the highest thing we encounter is always
other people you know the more the
richest thing the most the thing that
can transform us the most they can make
us like you said more human are always
other people and so I always find it
strange when people think that the
highest aspect would say the highest
ontological aspect that you know that
the image of the infinite would be
something that's abstract like no the
image of the infinite has to be
connected to our experience of the world
which is a personal experience which is
a experience that is through
consciousness so the the idea all that
when you start to see it that way the
notion of the divine mind or that that
God is you know the best the best image
of God is Christ then it makes it makes
so much sense in it you know it doesn't
it doesn't seem so strange at all
anymore well something I think that's
important is the distinction between the
general and the particular of the truth
is is you can't ever ever ever know
anything in general we only encounter
anything in a particular and so for
instance in the father's in teaching
about icons they said you cannot paint
an icon of say the divine nature right
what would that look like then it's like
we why can we paint an icon of Christ
because he became a man not man because
you can't just sort of paint man you
have to paint
a man a woman you know a particular
thing and and there's actually been a
drive in certain aspects of modern art
to in fact try when we talk about
abstraction to somehow another capture
or express the generalized and in a way
the more we do that the people begin to
have this sort of cognitive dissonance
in which they're all standing at staring
at something that no one knows what it
is and they're thinking even to
themselves is that art and well it can
be things about it I mean my youngest
daughter is an artist you know I
appreciate that you can have you know I
mean of course on the other hand I mean
you know Picasso can draw a line and it
just has genius about it and you'd have
to look at it and figure out why that is
so his lines are better than my lines
but on the other hand you finally
abstraction just fades away into nothing
it is the strange act of communion is
that we discover in the particular
something that unites us with that which
is but beyond it I I like a term that
I've used in referring to God as calling
him the transcendent particular I mean
he's he's he's actually the ultimate
particular because there's only one of
him there's there's not two that there
can't be general God because there's
only hey God one God and so he's utterly
but if he's so utterly in transcendently
particular you know and so he makes
himself known to us in the god man Jesus
Christ and in a way that's also a
revelation in me I am NOT humanity I'm
just Stephen and you know and this is
how we encounter each other and I'm you
know there's the old saying I love
humanity it's people I can't stand
exactly no you meet that oh you
encounter that all the times like I love
the poor yeah well I hear this I mean
people are gonna attack some group that
are gonna attack blacks are going to
attack
old privileged white men whatever like
that I'm thinking well which one of them
I mean when we reduce each other to two
abstractions that's actually first off
you have to generalize anybody in order
to kill them we might get very difficult
to kill particular people because
particular people are always not quite
what you imagine I have to actually sort
of stigmatize you and paint you as
something broader that I can just paste
my hate on make you stand as a fault
symbol for all that's wrong with your
you know your ID your race your nation
or whatever that way this is always a
ticket to violence we find love in the
particular we find forgiveness in the
particular we find Union and communion
with the particular the other but you
think about Christ and his interactions
there were you know in some ways Israel
at the time was a highly politicized
thing you had your groups your new
Pharisees and Sadducees and other groups
and then you had the you know those who
were religious and those who were
considered the unrighteous you know
prostitutes and tax collectors and
things that way and he he not only you
know they talk about him meeting and
eating with prostitutes and tax
collectors and these other near the
wells but more amazing that than that I
think about it we know some of their
names I mean for instance there's a
short little man in the town of Jericho
named Zacchaeus who is a tax collector
and hated by everybody in town
the amazing thing is I mean how obscure
is that 2,000 years ago some dude named
Zacchaeus and we know his name why
because Jesus called his name out and
said I'm gonna go home and eat with you
today
he didn't just sort of say you know some
general invitation to all local tax
collectors come and we'll have a meal he
goes Zacchaeus and it's interesting
Jesus is walking along sees this guy in
a tree and he knows his name and he says
Zacchaeus come down not you and the tree
come down but that kiyose you come down
and we have this consistently the
encounters that are highly personal and
which he sees the person not for their
sin not for their brokenness
not even for their their larger
commitments like Pharisee or whatever
else he just sees them we know the name
of a Pharisee Simon whose house he ate
in and a woman watched Jesus feet we
know the name of the Pharisee a
Nicodemus and of others we know them by
name
because this was personal encounters in
the book of Revelation talk about art in
the book of Revelation one of the
sweetest things in it of the vision of
heaven is I will write a new name on you
or like I will reveal to you the you
know the truth of who you really are
I will tell you your name and it's sort
of like and when you hear it I think
that the sense would be of at last that
the complete revelation of the truth of
your being would be made known in the
name God speaks to you that is you know
utterly who you are and and I mean a
name is is in that sense uniquely
personal you you walk into the room you
say Steven you have my attention and so
there's this this particular but the
particular isn't to reduce things it's
just it's actually the only way we ever
have communion with anything yeah you
know it has to be yes I think you see it
like I mean one of my favorite let's say
minute paraphrase but one of my favorite
quotes from from st. Maximus the
Confessor is when he talks about you
know he says you know as the person you
know even a person who is discovering
let's say the spiritual essences of
something and he sees these spiritual
essences that they separate from the
particulars he sees that no there's no
contradiction they're not opposed to
each other they're actually they're
actually made to be together like that's
the whole that's the whole key of the
Incarnation is that we're not called to
this kind of you know this abstract
world but we're call
to encounter the world as a embodied
reality and so yes and I think I mean
it's very it's very mysterious it's very
mysterious when you think of it in terms
of the totality you know we think we
talked about Revelation we think of it
in terms of this kind of final
revelation when everything is ring comes
together it's it's difficult to fathom
how this particularity is all going to
come together but but we can you know in
our experience like we've been talking
about in weeks
in our experience that's how we
experience it that's how we experience
the world maybe you can say that to
degree the great revolution
intellectually I can say it that way in
Christianity was I mean already in Plato
there is a discussion of the
transcendentals that is goodness truth
and beauty and there's a recognition
that this is important this is what we
should be talking about what happens in
Christianity is that language gets taken
up but there is a recognition that the
transcendentals are in fact to be
encountered in the particular and that
becomes the revolution in which I mean
for instance the word person as we know
it today is a Christian invention you
were just as you had a thing you were a
helot you were a slave you were a
something and suddenly but you become a
name of every person of equal value B we
couldn't say that all people who
admitted created equal
without that revolution having occurred
it gave infinite value to the particular
whereas prior to that there was only
infinite value to the infinite and in a
way you can't you can't get it in your
hands
and in the Incarnation and and what that
sets in motion in the life of
understanding is a drive towards I mean
when God becomes man the infinite
interest the particular and the
particular you know is revealed to have
infinite value and that's a complete
change but nothing is just dispensable
everything has infinite value and that's
you know that's really the drive of
Christian ethics is understanding that a
human life is a uniquely particular
thing unrepeatable with infinite value
and worth sacrificing loving I mean it
sacrificing for loving doing all all
that and that is only you know that
without that I'm only speaking vague
generalities it's only in the particular
that we encounter goodness truth and
beauty so that's that's really the root
of incarnation for us yeah right and I
think that it's almost as if we haven't
completely we haven't completely
understood the ramifications of that
until today you know we haven't it seems
when you think about it it just creates
such a there's it creates such a jam in
your mind you know to think about it
that way but it also intuitively there's
also something very deeply intuitive
that makes us that makes it that it has
become the core of our ethical thinking
I mean like we talk about this all the
time that even now the the secular
ethics they are based in this
incarnation of thinking even almost
without without knowing at this notion
of this the value in the particular and
this and the value of the of the
individual is something which has come
through the incarnation but now you know
in the modern project we've seen also
how it has slipped aside when
Christianity is completely not out of
the of the arena then all of a sudden
that has to go to and then this collect
this crazy collectivism just just
appears and just takes over and then
human beings become numbers they become
just you know fodder for whatever
ideology you you're you have a GK
Chesterton said that when the the
tradition gets jettisoned like the
Christian tradition the the consensus of
earlier times its jettisoned he said
it's not that virtue disappears from the
world he said but what you get is the
virtues gone mad
and so you know most of the people out
there
are actually basing whatever they're
thinking on some version of the
traditional Christian virtues but
they've lost their connection you know
to to one another and their grounding in
the particular and in these things of
life and they just you know they run
wild yeah and I'm gonna drive us crazy
and so you have competing virtues you
have you know the love of the love of
tribe versus you know other kinds of
things and and it makes us crazy
[Music]
[Applause]
you
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