Piers Morgan's Debate On Suspended 'Jihad Doctor': "STOP Using Your Skin Colour!"
Summary
TLDRThe transcript covers the suspension of UK doctor and Islamist movement leader Dr. Abdul Wahed from the NHS after his controversial TV appearance supporting Hamas. His group glorified Hamas attacks and he wouldn't condemn the October 7th terrorist attack. His Islamist movement Hisb Tera has now been designated a terrorist organization in the UK. There is debate around whether his radical views impact his medical duties. As the head of a banned terror group, his NHS position seems untenable unless he distances himself from terrorists. The discussion also covers free speech issues and double standards in calling out extremist groups.
Takeaways
- 😠 An Islamist doctor in the UK glorified Hamas attacks and called for 'Jihad on the streets'. He has now been suspended by the NHS.
- 😡 The doctor is a public leader of a controversial Islamist movement prescribed as a terrorist group in the UK and banned in many countries.
- 🤨 The doctor appeared on a TV show under a different name and would not condemn Hamas' brutal October 7th attacks that killed over 1200 people.
- 😐 There is debate whether his radical views affect his ability to practice medicine, as he has a right to offensive opinions.
- 😠 As head of a banned terror group, it's untenable for him to remain in the NHS without denouncing terrorism.
- 😕 Many young people at pro-Palestinian marches seem ignorant of the 'river to sea' slogan, which implies eliminating Israel.
- 🤨 Constantine's filming shows many marchers pretend the October 7 attacks didn't happen or were staged.
- 😡 A marcher called Morgan's reporting 'lies' for asking guests to condemn the horrific October 7 attacks.
- 😯 Social media distorts Morgan's anti-terrorism stance into anti-Muslim views, ignoring his context.
- ⚠️ Guest argues using post-9/11 tactics against Muslims in the UK could increase divisions and extremism on all sides.
Q & A
What controversial group does Dr. Abdul Wahed lead in the UK?
-Dr. Abdul Wahed is the public face and British leader of Hizb ut-Tahrir, an Islamist movement that has glorified Hamas attacks and chanted for jihad on the streets of London.
Why was Dr. Wahed suspended from the NHS?
-Dr. Wahed was suspended after his controversial appearance on the TV show Uncensored and due to newspaper reports about him. The NHS said they take professional conduct issues seriously and need to ensure individuals are fit to work there.
What countries have banned Hizb ut-Tahrir?
-Hizb ut-Tahrir is banned in many Muslim countries including Indonesia, Pakistan, Bangladesh, and most Arab states. It is also banned in countries like Germany and Egypt.
What controversial statements did Dr. Wahed make about the October 7 attacks?
-Dr. Wahed cast doubt on whether the October 7 attacks even took place and did not consider Hamas to be terrorists. He dismissed civilian deaths as "collateral" and called the attacks a "welcome punch on the nose" for the enemy.
When did the British Parliament designate Hizb ut-Tahrir as a terrorist organization?
-The British Parliament officially designated Hizb ut-Tahrir as a terrorist organization in the past two weeks (relative to the article date of February 3, 2024).
What penalty is associated with membership or support of Hizb ut-Tahrir in the UK?
-Membership or support of Hizb ut-Tahrir now carries a prison sentence of up to 14 years in the UK.
What arguments are made for and against Dr. Wahed's ability to practice medicine?
-Arguments made in favor cite radical opinions not necessarily impacting medical ability and his right to offensive opinions. Arguments against cite his terror group leadership and unsuitability for an intimate, patient-facing NHS role.
What controversial statements were made at a Hizb ut-Tahrir rally in London?
-At the rally, Dr. Wahed said "victory is coming" and everyone must "choose a side." A senior member also asked what is the solution to liberate Palestine, with the crowd chanting back "jihad".
How does the columnist Vaj Ali respond to calls to deport those with radical views?
-Vaj Ali warns against post-9/11 overreactions that harm community relations, arguing Western societies should tolerate dissident speech and that deportations can fuel extremism on both sides.
What concerning lack of understanding was found among some pro-Palestine youth protesters?
-Video interviews found some youth protesters were completely ignorant on basics like the "river to sea" slogan, admitting they just held the signs they were handed at the protest.
Outlines
😠 Various groups and individuals condemn Dr. Abdul Wahed's controversial comments as NHS suspends him.
Paragraph 1 discusses how various groups and individuals reacted with shock to Dr. Abdul Wahed's comments glorifying Hamas attacks. The NHS has suspended Dr. Wahed from his role as a GP in light of his controversial appearance on a TV show and being the public face of the now banned Islamist movement Hizb ut-Tahrir in the UK.
😡 Dr. Wahed shockingly refers to October 7 attacks as a 'welcome punch on the nose'.
Paragraph 2 highlights how Dr. Wahed shockingly described the brutal October 7 attacks, which killed 1200 people, as a 'welcome punch on the nose', revealing his terrorist sympathies. This makes his position as an NHS doctor paid by taxpayers untenable.
😕 Guest argues Dr. Wahed should not be banned despite concerning views to avoid quagmire like post 9/11 America.
Paragraph 3 has guest Vaj Ali arguing that despite Dr. Wahed's concerning views, he should not be banned or deported to avoid the civil liberties violations that occurred in post 9/11 America. Ali warns against using a broad brush against Muslims which can fuel extremism on both sides.
😠 Guest rebuts - laws exist to remove foreign terrorists, race irrelevant.
Paragraph 4 has the host rebutting and educating the guest that race is irrelevant, and laws allow removing foreign terrorists. Being an immigrant himself, the host supports deporting terrorists regardless of background.
😏 Guest claims double standard - white nationalist terrorism not treated as seriously.
Paragraph 5 has the guest claiming there is a double standard where rising white nationalist terrorism is not treated as seriously as Islamist terrorism. The host denies condoning any terrorism regardless of source.
😕 Ignorant protestors deny October 7 attacks occurred or spread lies about host.
Paragraph 6 shows footage of ignorant protestors at a pro-Palestinian march denying the October 7 attacks occurred or spreading lies about the host's reporting on it. This highlights how social media spreads misinformation.
😌 Guest argues Western policies based on fear and anger lead to extremism and mistakes like post 9/11 America.
Paragraph 7 has the guest warning that Western policies based on fear and anger lead to extremism and past mistakes like post 9/11 America. He advocates learning from these mistakes to avoid divisions.
Mindmap
Keywords
💡terrorism
💡free speech
💡Hamas
💡jihad
💡antisemitism
💡Islamophobia
💡national security
💡hate speech
💡incitement
💡censorship
Highlights
Dr. Abdul Wahed has been suspended from the NHS for his controversial views and leadership role in a now banned Islamist movement.
Wahed referred to the October 7 attacks as 'a very welcome punch on the nose', despite over 1,200 civilian deaths.
Wahed's group hisb ut-Tahrir has been officially designated as a terrorist organization in the UK.
Constantine argues almost every Muslim country has banned hisb ut-Tahrir, questioning why the UK government allowed them to operate so long.
Vaj Ali warns of overreacting and harming community relations, but agrees terrorist group members should face prosecution.
Morgan stresses respecting free speech doesn't mean having to respect all opinions yourself.
Vaj Ali argues Western democracies apply double standards in labeling groups as terrorists based on race and religion.
Constantine shows footage of Pro-Palestinian protestors who seem ignorant of basic facts and deny October 7 attacks.
Vaj Ali says most youth increasingly support Palestinians and ending occupation, enabled by platforms like TikTok.
Constantine found many protestors pretend October 7 didn't happen to justify calling for unilateral ceasefire.
Morgan clarifies his past comments referred to oppression promoted by Wahed's group, not Muslims/Islam in general.
Vaj Ali explains the double standard where Muslims are expected to condemn terrorists they've never met.
Extreme members of a community shouldn't define the whole group, as happens unfairly to Muslims says Vaj Ali.
Vaj Ali warns against overreacting with fear and anger, fueling extremism as happened with US war on terror.
Constantine's film shows range of views at London protests, though many seem ill-informed on key facts.
Transcripts
good evening from London welcome to Pi
Morgan on sensor Dr Abdul wahed is the
public face and British leader of a
controversial islamist movement which
glorified the Hamas attacks and chanted
for Jihad on the Streets of London he's
also a longtime NHS GP doctor at least
for now today the NHS in London
confirmed his suspended Dr wahed after
his controversial appearance on this
show and the newspaper reports about him
referring to a doctor by legal name a
spokesman told us this morning we take
any issues relating to professional
conduct seriously and have procedures in
place to make sure the individuals are
fit to work in the NHS we can confirm
that Dr wahed shaa Shada has been
suspended from NHS Primary Care
performance list well last month uh Dr
wahed under his other name was brave
enough to appear on uncensored Brave you
can judge for yourself how it went 1,200
people were Massacre I think 12,00
people were killed were they massacred
yeah they were killed by terrorists they
were killed by people who were resisting
an occupation and they're terrorists
yeah well that's your view it is my view
one man's terrorist is non man's Freedom
Fighter have you never heard that well
many people who saw that interview was
shocked by someone who cast doubt
whether the October 7th attacks had even
taken place let alone not considering
Hamas to be terrorists after it
dismissing any civilian deaths as
collateral and act of resistance could
remain working in the National Health
Service with a salary paid by the
British taxpayer at the same time it was
reasonable to debate whether radical
opinions have any real bearing on
someone's ability to practice medicine
after all people have opinion have every
right to opinions that others find
offensive that is why he was invited on
to the show in the first place but Dr
wahed is now effectively the head of a
prescribed terror group and it's
prescribed as terror group not just here
in the UK now but in numerous other
countries too and there is no defense
for that hisb teria is a global islamist
movement which advocates for an Islamic
caliphate under Sharia law in this
country they made headlines for
denouncing LGBT filth as they put it
they're calling for an end to the
Western World Order it's outlawed in
plenty of other countries like Germany
Egypt several Arab states last week the
British Parliament officially designated
it as a terrorist organization that
means membership or support for hisb but
terer is now illegal carrying a prison
sentence of up to 14 years now to be
clear I've not called for Dr wahi to be
suspended fired or cancelled but I did
question whether his views made him fit
to serve patients many of whom by his
own admission don't even know about his
double life because he uses two separate
names now he is the head of an
officially prescribed terrorist
organization and the whole argument
becomes a lot simpler it is frankly
untenable for him to be working in the
NHS and if he wants any hope of
continuing those duties he needs to
start doing something he repeatedly
failed to do on Mich show last time
distanced himself publicly from
terrorists and
terrorism well joining me now is the
author podcast host comedian Constantine
kissy Constantine great to see you um
what do you make of this story quite
extraordinary that for decades this guy
had been operating in North London as a
GP and yet in his other uh vocation he
was leading the UK arm of a group that
was already uh considered a terror group
by many other countries and is now uh
also considered that way in this
country right and you should put some we
should put some meat on the bones of
that because you mentioned the group is
banned in Egypt Germany and a few other
countries actually appear as you
probably know the group is banned in
almost every Muslim country in the world
Indonesia the most populous Muslim
country in the world has banned hisb
Tera Pakistan Bangladesh almost every
Arab country in the Middle East has
banned hisb Tera so the question I think
we really ought to be asking is why did
the British government allow these
islamists to operate in Britain for as
long as they did now coming to your
point about whether he should be
suspended from the NHS as you know I
think both you and I are very wary of
people being uh banned or uh censored in
some way for for the opinions that they
express but I think most British people
would draw the line at being a member or
indeed the head of a now prescribed
terrorist organization and of course we
also got to remember there is a
difference between a guy stacking
shelves in the supermarket and someone
who is a GP who would be seeing patients
no intimate details about them know
their ethnicity religion and have the
power of in some situations life and
death other people so I think it's a
very different case and I've got
absolutely no problem with terrorist
sympathizers being prevented from
working in the National Health Service
right and to to be you know to be clear
about what his views were post October
7th he gave a talk on YouTube uh and he
said
this they gave the enemy a punch on the
nose all right and and it's a very
welcome punch on the
nose welcome punch on the nose which is
1,200 people including at least 800
innocent civilians including many
children women being brutally murdered
raped and some cases beheaded that was
apparently a very welcome punch on the L
says an NHS doctor whose salary is paid
by the British taxpayer I mean I think
for that
alone unless he renounces what he said
there very clearly and firmly there
could be no way back for
him well quite and I think you know if
he were to renounce it I think we'd all
question how legitimate and how sincere
that renunciation would be given his uh
body of work let's say on on this issue
I think there are some people who've
been tolerated for far too long in our
country and uh members of his bir terer
which is now thankfully prescribed uh if
they're not citizens of this country I
think the British people will be asking
why are they still here yeah because we
had uh in October at the same uh wahed
addressing a rally outside the Egyptian
and Turkish embassies in London during
which he told the crowd victory has
coming everyone has to choose a side
another senior member mazia Khan of the
same now terror group said what is the
solution to liberate people in the
concentration camp called Palestine and
they chanted back Jihad jih had G we got
a clip of this what is the solution to
liberate people in the concentration
camp from Palestine what is the solution
I mean you know we there's been lots of
debate about the pro Palestinian marches
I'm going to come to some fascinating
footage that you've done for a film
about those um and you know many people
are there legitimately Marching for
peace I completely get that but when you
have people on the Streets of London
chanting Jihad Jihad Jihad that is
unacceptable and you will remember peers
that the the Met police shamefully uh
instead of dealing with those people
under the law of this country instead
what they did is they said well Jihad
has many meanings and essentially
pretended not to understand what those
people were calling for um but as you
say people have a right to protest
people should speak freely and express
themselves and by the way uh I think
actually you know you and I both take a
lot of flaque for so-called platforming
people with the wrong opinions I
actually think this is a very good
example of a situation in which allowing
people to speak freely and express their
horrific opinions in public is a a a
thing a method that allows them to
express those opinions and then for the
public frankly to take a position on
whether those people should be serving
them in the Public Health Service should
be in our country if they're not
citizens of this country and I actually
think you've done a very good job pece
of bringing these people into the light
and letting them hang themselves with
their own rope yeah I mean people said
you exposed him uh and you've got him
suspended no he exposed himself by
expressing very firmly his own views
which were support supportive of Hamas
which is a prescribed terror group in
this country so that was in itself
illegal actually what he was doing and
now he is the head of an organization
that's just been designated as a terror
group and that is also illegal so
there's a lot of crime being committed
here by this NHS doctor never mind
anything else uh I didn't expose that he
was doing it himself I want to bring in
now the columnist in commentate to vaj
Ali V thank you very much indeed for
joining me um what do you make of a
story I mean me this this guy is an NHS
doctor for many decades I'm sure
there'll be plenty of his patients who'd
say he's a perfectly good doctor what's
he got to do with that that he has these
views but now the UK government has
prescribed the organization that he runs
in the UK as a terrorist organization is
his position as a doctor here
untenable well listen the show is called
uncensored and I think all of us agree
that in a free Society we should have
something what we have in America the
First Amendment freedom of worship free
speech freedom of assembly and
unfortunately there are elements
extremist elements within our society
that we tolerate that doesn't mean that
we agree with them that doesn't mean
that we support them that doesn't mean
we endorse them like I'll give you an
example his myor has been an annoyance
an annoyance in my life they're here in
America they're all around they have
these aspirational dreams of a caliphate
that will never happen and some of them
have very hateful views right they do
not like me at all in this particular
situation though you have to realize
that several British governments have
tried to commit uh hism as a terror
organization this is not the first right
but they haven't found any actionable
threats in this particular climate in
the past three months as you know you
had your former Home Secretary uh Suella
Braverman not really uh a fan uh of I
would say Muslim or Muslim immigrants
who during these protests where a bunch
of these nuts uh sparsely populated
protests yelled the word Jihad and
apparently praised Hamad she wanted to
expose them right she said look into it
and then now in the past two weeks you
finally have exposed them as a terror
group quotequote terror group but there
are zero actionable Terror threats so
what happens in this situation it
reminds me Pierce as an American of a
post 911 climate where he had 19 foreign
Muslim hijackers who brought down the
two towers and the country lost its mind
and use that as a giant net to go after
a bunch of Muslims we did a registry
program we uh deported 13,000 immigrants
we literally had the NYPD peers in this
country surveil Muslim mosques Muslim
students Muslim grocery stores right
anyone who said the wrong word people
were kicked off of planes for saying
Arabic words so I'm sitting here and I'm
I'm listening to your conversation and I
think you did the right thing these nuts
Who exist right you expose them you
marginalize them you bring them on and
then they go into the fringes of society
in America we have the KKK in America if
you look at this there's a capital right
behind me there are people who did a
violent Insurrection against the United
States in that Capital we have elected
officials in America who call those
people
political prisoners and martyrs they're
elected uh people who incited violence
against our law enforcement so I think
the the what you what I hope you're not
doing and I I feel like you're doing is
this giant net this giant hammer to
crush them I think it will not make
things better in in Great Britain and in
Europe and I think it will give Fuel and
fod to extremists on both sides the
right-wing uh militant nationalists the
white nationalist who attacked the
police after Home Secretary braverman's
article you remember that
and also these Fringe elements I think
it will further radicalize them I don't
think this is what you do in a free
Society but that's just me speaking on
your show called un well you know what
it's an unsensored show and you rais
some very interesting and valid points
constant what's your reaction to What
bad said there well my re my reaction is
I I encourage all our viewers to go and
uh watch an interview with the UAE
foreign minister given in 2017 in which
he warned Western governments that their
obsession with uh political correctness
his words not mine and being unwilling
to deal with Islamic extremism in the
way that it should be dealt with uh will
lead to more terrorism and more violent
crime in their countries and that uh
interview has gone super viral on the
internet precisely because of how
prophetic it was uh if as I said earlier
almost every Muslim country in the world
considers these people to be Islamic
extremists who are to be banned I think
we should be learning from them uh on
how to deal with these people instead of
thinking that we in our liberal Society
are able to integrate all these people
these people do not belong in this
country and their views do not belong in
this country and as I say if they're not
citizens of this country they should not
be here yeah you know it's interesting I
when I walk around now because there's
been loads of memes about me because of
all the big interviews we've done and it
always has me dressed up as some
reporter saying do you condemn Hamas to
inappropriate people all the time and I
get asked in my street and do you
condemn Hass like it's a joke and I said
you know I always reply to people you
know know you have to start with that
question do you condemn what Hamas did
on October the 7th and do you accept
it's a terrorist attack because if you
can't accept that badad to me if you
can't accept that basic fact uh which we
saw not because people invented those uh
those monstrosities they committed but
because they openly brazenly broadcast
them to the world through their own
technology to because they were proud of
what they were committing I don't think
if if you don't start from a position
that you condemn what Hamas did I don't
really have much time for
you then why are you in a democracy why
do you claim to be an enlightened
government why are you any different
from authoritarian Muslim countries that
crack down on any group any group they
don't like there's a reason why we have
the First Amendment there's a reason why
you have a freedom uh of assembly of
Association of a free speech because
like volter said I don't agree with what
you said while defend to the death your
right to say it that doesn't mean you
like them I'll give you an example the
United States we have the KKK an actual
terrorist group that committed terrorism
against black and white Americans they
still exist they have the right to
assembly they do their stupid marches
like cowards they put on their masks I
don't know if you saw that viral video
it went viral that a bunch of them
wearing white masks in New York got
stuck at a Turn Style because they
didn't know how to use uh the New York
subway station just exquis it it was
like a melbrook scene but they exist we
had literally people saying the Jews
will not replace us and Donald Trump
said they're very fine people we
literally have people like I said going
against this Capital right here
committing a violent Insurrection but
for some strange reason when the number
one domestic Terror threat in America
and also increasingly in Europe and the
UK is white terrorists white nationalist
terrorists white ex extremists I never
hear anyone say you know what we should
ban them we should Deport them oh what I
instead hear is they have economic
anxiety the double standard here at play
has to be exposed right and I want
people to really think about what
they're really advocating if someone
doesn't like your speech you know what
you're not just going to be uh not
tolerated you're going to be deported
especially if you're a person of color
how does that make a multi-racial
society that is both the UK and America
safer and better especially and I'm
speaking now as an American and you know
in the UK the rising domestic Terror
threat is not Islamic extremism which by
the way exists it is white nationalist
extremism not a single word about that
but I hear all these Free Speech
Advocates all these people are all about
Western Civilization all all of a sudden
turn to censorship and all of a sudden
become authoritarian when it comes to
Muslims and people of hang why is that
hang let me educate your guest a little
bit about his own
country please educate
me I I'm about to be quiet and I will
now first of all nobody's calling for
people to be deported because of their
views we have laws in this country
against organizations that are
prescribed as terrorists and I have no
problem with terrorist being removed
from this country under the laws of this
country secondly Donald Trump never said
that the people calling uh for the
eradication of Jews will find people if
you go and look at his quotes he
actually condemned them and they said
they should be condemned absolutely but
the people who were there protesting
about the statues they were the ones
that would fine people now you should
educate yourself about those things and
thirdly you should educate about the
fact that regrettably I would quite like
to have a First Amendment here in the UK
we do not have a First Amendment and I
would have a lot more sympathy with your
argument if we hadn't spent the last 10
years watching people be sacked from
their jobs for saying women are women
and men are men yeah and I would also
add that when you say that I'm not
respecting Free Speech vat when I say I
don't respect people who won't condemn a
mass they're I didn't say you no no but
they can say it they can say it I just
don't have to respect it it's a bit like
when I block people on Twitter course
you don't have to respect it but when I
when I block people on on X for example
formerly Twitter and people say well
you're suppressing their free speech no
I'm not they can still tweet what the
hell they like I just don't have to read
it I don't have to hear it you know that
this that actually is what free speech
is and the First Amendment which is one
of the most powerful Protectors of free
speech in the world it doesn't cover
many things from child pornography to
defamation to all sorts of stuff is is
not protected by the First Amendment and
nobody I don't think who looks at this
sensibly would say that a terror group
that espouses not just hatred but
violent hatred and the mass killing of
people that is never protected by free
speech is it and should it be uh it it
shouldn't be but listen this is
interesting uh speaking about education
allow me to retort and educate and I'll
give you an example about the double
standards and I want you guys to really
respond to this speaking about terrorism
and violence on the platform you
mentioned X also known as Twitter one of
the wealthiest men Elon Musk has
repeatedly promoted the replacement
Theory an anti-semitic Terror uh anti
anti-semitic conspiracy that blames Jews
for trying to weaken and replace Western
Civilization with Muslims and immigrants
and lgbtq communities right that
conspiracy theory has radicalized
individuals to commit violence against
Jews against Muslims against black
people against Latinos that conspiracy
has been retweeted and platformed and
mainstreamed by the Republican party
people like Elise stonic and Donald
Trump who by the way dined with Nick
Fuentes the leading white nationalist
leader in America you guys are fine with
that when it comes to any other group
that who said we're fine wait a minute
who said we're okay I wrot a whole
column condemning it what are you
talking about good but you're not going
to deport them right are you going to
deport them are you going to are you
going to call them out for
uhp people who are citizens who are not
citizens of the country should be
deported if they're members of a
terrorist group why don't you understand
the distinction member of a terrorist
group and saying something wrong should
us and UK should us and UK government
and National Security go after the these
groups and these elected officials and
these organizations that have literally
repeated and mainstreamed a conspiracy
that has motivated terrorists to commit
terrorism anyone who is a member of a
terrorist group should be prosecuted
under the law of the country in which
they are a terrorist group a terrorist
group that's not what I asked well but
that's what I said so you were
challenging me about something I'm and
I'm very
curious curious why you are not
concerned about this
I didn't say I wasn't concerned about it
I said you can't Deport citizens of the
country in which they live A and B I
keep pointing out to you that the person
we're talking about in this case this
NHS GP he is a member of a terrorist
group we're not talking about him having
the wrong opinions people are allowed to
have the wrong opinions both in this
country and in your country it's
something that we all celebrate as part
of the heritage of Western civilization
and we would all I hope defend the issue
here is we have la in this country about
being a member of a terrorist group and
people who are members of a terrorist
group I hope you would agree with me
should be prosecuted to the full extent
of the law and if they are prosecuted to
the extent of the law and they are
foreign citizens should be deported will
we agree on
that we will agree that and I'll also
say this uh for those who are watching
especially the youth uh there's a great
meme a family guy meme where there's a
chart of who gets to be labeled a
terrorist and who doesn't uh the front
part of the chart is when you have
lights skin you're not a terrorist when
it gets dark and people like you always
bring race into it it's got nothing to
do with race and everything to do with
people who kill
people yes people like you race ba like
heard yes and I've not heard you really
Express this much outrage against the
number one domestic Terror threat
against all our communities in America
and the UK which is rising white
National I a darkn first generation
immigrant to the UK I don't play your
racial games stop using your skin color
as a way to shut other people up and
let's talk about the issue the issue
here is should we tolerate foreign
terrorist should we remove them and my
opinion is we should remove people who
are not conducive to this country and if
someone like me first generation
immigrant comes here and wants to be a
terrorist it is first generation
immigrants like me that at the front of
the queue to get them out okay it's been
a fascinating debate
are not conducive to the it's been a f I
actually think who are terrorists yes I
actually think V to be fair to you I do
think that the white nationalism uh
related terrorist acts that we see
increasingly is never played up as much
actually as islamist Terror was
particularly in the Heyday of al-Qaeda
and Isis I think it's a perfectly valid
point to make for what is worth I think
I've made that point actually before um
Before I Let You Go Constantine you've
done a lot of filming with the pro
Palestinian marches in London what did
you
find well I actually went over the last
few month P we went to the protest
against anti-Semitism we went to two pro
Palestine protests we went to an
Extinction rebellious Rebellion protest
which was very very funny I encourage
people to go and watch that but at the
latest Pro Palestine protest in
particular there was some fascinating
scenes and you know we really tried to
talk to people with an open mind I don't
have actually contrary to the discussion
we've just had particularly strong
position on I'm interested really in
getting people's views and one of the
things that came through very strongly
is uh young people in particular of whom
there are many the way I would kind of
describe the demographics are it's a
mixture of sort of beards and head
scarves on the one hand and septum
piercings and colored hair on the other
um the young people who are there in
particular when you ask some very very
basic questions you know from which
river to let's take a look at a clip
actually we've got a we've got a clip
with some of this let's watch it here so
I just noticed the signs you got from
The River To The Sea Palestine will be
free what does that mean well it's quite
self exan how would that come about what
would happen to the isra
ETC I
don't I'm trying to think of how to word
it isn't it just as self-explanatory as
the area of land it's palestine's land
what's a socialist in if I'm being
honest with you I just got this at the
stand over there okay I don't actually
know the definition of the word
inap I mean it's kind of laughable I
don't think for a moment that a lot of
people on that March are that ignorant
about it a lot of them clearly are well
informed and absolutely marching because
they want peace and they want to see far
and Gaza I completely understand that
but vaj when you hear that there are a
lot of young people joining up in these
marches who are completely clueless and
I actually blame Tik Tok more than
anything which is the number one news
source now for kids under 25 and spews
just Relentless nonsense into their
heads and that's where they get their
news uh this is where I'm going to stand
up for the Youth if you look at the
youth it's been a stunning change where
most youth people uh youth here and
abroad are actually if you will Pro
Palestinian and want the occupation to
end and the flip side to that pierce I
would say is the following for those who
are watching we're the same when it
comes to Facebook we're the same when it
comes to X and we're the same when it
comes to mainstream media you are a
breath of fresh because you allow
multiple opinions to come on uh you know
talk about Palestinian side and Israeli
side in America you know that this
wasn't the case and so for those people
who are terrified by the Tik Tok just
think about what limited viewpoints that
you got for 30 40 years and now for
better and for worse this young
generation is exposed to multiple
narratives and they see for themselves
what's happening which is why you see
the shift in which a lot of people
especially in Israel and here are
horrified by the N Yahoo government want
an end to the occupation want to seize
fire hate Hamas hat hate extremists in
the nyaho government and believe that
Palestinians have a right to Freedom
yeah well they certainly do in my
estimation but there is one clip uh
Constantine which really got to me it
was about me let's take a look so I I
see you've got a sign that a journalism
that get paid for selling lies and I'm
guessing that's Pierce Morgan right why
do you say that this is journalism
that's selling
lies um it's very obvious what is going
on all the lies about what happened on
the October 7th the justification for
the genocide they're all based on Lies
when you say lies about October 7th what
do you mean all those allegations that
we never saw any footages of of
decapitated children that Pi Morgan
always asked about and all those women
that get got uh gang raped I mean it was
quite extraordinary Constantine because
one of the problems with platforming
everybody actually for the last three
months is you end up with the extremes
on both sides hating you with equal
Vengeance and often being completely ill
informed actually about what I've
actually said um but it was enlightening
to see that because I see that all day
long on social media that kind of view
which is really based on a lack of
reality well there was a lot of that
going on in the protest and
interestingly I mean you say most people
there are well informed uh we released
in that half an hour documentary that
people can go to trigonometry our
YouTube channel and watch we released
every single interview that we did uh so
we haven't cherry-picked these moments
to make people look bad or anything like
that it contains they're shortened down
but they are basically the content of
what people said to us okay and I have
to say most of the people we spoke to a
didn't really seem that actually that
well informed most of them and secondly
I would say that was an awful lot of the
sort of thing you just heard where
people have some kind of way of
pretending October 7th didn't happen in
fact the first person you see in the
video talks about how it's a false flag
operation there seems to be a lot of
that going on too where where people are
sort of they they sort of wish away the
terrorist attack on October 7th and it
makes sense because if you're calling
for a ceasefire uh and you're calling on
Israel to unilaterally essentially
engage in ceasefire you have to pretend
October 7th didn't happen because
otherwise you'd be calling on Hamas to
hand over the hostages and the
terrorists who took them because that's
how you get a ceasefire yeah I mean one
of the the biggest blowups I had vat was
after that interview with that doctor
actually uh in which I'd already read
out some quotes from another member of
his group uh talking about LGBT filth
feminist filth really horrible
homophobic misogynist stuff which this
guy had been caught saying uh and and
the doctor is the leader of the UK arms
as one of his one of his people and then
he talked about people who want now to
women in particular who want now to
become Muslim and I said what to live
under oppression and what I meant was
the oppression that had been spouted by
this guy you know I'm not remotely
anti-muslim I'm not remotely anti-islam
I led the media campaign in this country
against the Iraq War for example I led
the defense of Qatar for its right to
have the World Cup and Expos a lot of
Western hypocrisy about the Chris there
and so on so I really am not remotely
anti-muslim I was talking about the kind
of inter a of Islam and Muslim world
that members of that group ESP spous
which is vile against women so if you
want them to come into that world it is
oppressive um but it was interesting to
me to watch the Ferocious explosion on
social media which B no relation to the
context of why I said what I
said if if I may uh I've been in this
for a long time I was 21 years old when
911 happened I Muslim American a college
student and let me just if I may explain
to your viewers the double standard that
the rest of us feel just very quickly
Muslims are asked for the past 20 years
to condemn violent acts done by vient
people we've never met when I came on
your show last time you remember that it
was a Nutty guest who accused me of
being Hamas simply because I'm Muslim
and I had to condemn every single
violent extremist organization that's a
double standard that never happens to
any other group and I hope it doesn't
happen to any other group the second
thing is the most extreme violent
members of our quot unquote Community
are used to define us the most extreme
violent repr reprehensible people are
used to define the religion of 1.8
billion people that does not happen to
other other groups right imagine if I
said all white people are defined by the
KKK or Donald Trump and each and every
single time you're on TV I'm asking you
what do you say about these white
nationalist groups what do you say about
Donald Trump aren't you ashamed have you
condemned them you're like why are you
asking me and most of my friends are
like this and finally the warning the
warning I want to give the warning I
want to give here is you and I pierce
had the foresight to see the devastation
of the the war on terror you and I were
the ones 20 years ago who were against
it for those who are watching especially
in the UK learn from the America's
mistakes when you use fear and anger and
rage to create domestic foreign policies
it leads to extremism it leads to
divisions we had a war against Iraq and
Afghanistan we had a quagmire we had
people being deported we had a chilling
effect we had a trust deficit between
law enforcement and American Muslim
communities we had to rise in hate
crimes learn from our mistakes and don't
let the worst of you and your worst
fears contaminate what you have in in UK
which is a multi-racial society you
still have hope vck thank you very much
indeed for joining me especially at late
notice as it was today and we appreciate
it Constantine always great to have you
on I I commend that film you've made
it's very enlightening people can go see
it on the trigonometry uh website which
is well worth half an hour of your time
thank
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