Monetary Reset: Frank Giustra Warns Of U.S. Dollar ‘Crisis’
Summary
TLDRIn a thought-provoking interview, Canadian businessman and philanthropist Frank Giustra discusses the impending crisis facing the US dollar due to predicted massive federal debt increases and geopolitical tensions. Giustra, a prominent figure in mining and philanthropy, predicts a gradual decline in the US dollar's status as the global reserve currency, driven by efforts from BRICS countries and a push towards alternative trading mechanisms and currencies. He also touches on the potential for a monetary system reset, the role of gold in central banking, and the future of digital currencies. Additionally, Giustra shares insights into his mining ventures and perspectives on media and information trustworthiness.
Takeaways
- 💰 The Congressional Budget Office predicts a $20 trillion increase in federal debt over the next 10 years, raising concerns about the sustainability of the U.S. dollar.
- 🌍 Rising geopolitical tensions and conflicts are highlighted as potential threats to global safety and economic stability.
- 📉 The potential loss of the U.S. dollar's status as the global reserve currency is discussed, with implications for the U.S. economy and global power dynamics.
- 🏦 Central banks globally are diversifying away from U.S. dollar reserves, increasingly investing in gold and exploring alternative trade mechanisms.
- 🔗 BRICS countries (Brazil, Russia, India, China, South Africa) are leading efforts to establish a new global monetary system, moving away from U.S. dollar reliance.
- 🌐 The introduction of blockchain and Central Bank Digital Currencies (CBDCs) as tools for international trade and payment systems is explored.
- 🛢️ The discussion includes the possibility of oil trade moving away from U.S. dollar denominations, which could undermine the petrodollar system.
- 🥇 The steady accumulation of gold by central banks and its potential role in a future monetary reset are emphasized.
- 📈 Gold and Bitcoin markets are analyzed in the context of recent economic trends and their implications for investors.
- 🌟 Frank Giustra's business philosophy and successful mining ventures are discussed, highlighting a strategic approach to building mining companies.
Q & A
What does Frank Giustra believe is the future of the US dollar as the global reserve currency?
-Frank Giustra believes that the US dollar is gradually losing its status as the global reserve currency, a change that may happen either gradually over time or through a sudden event. He points to actions by the BRICS countries, led by China, to reset the global monetary system and move away from the US dollar.
Why is there a push for a monetary system reset according to Frank Giustra?
-According to Frank Giustra, the push for a monetary system reset stems from the desire for a fairer system, especially from the perspective of the global South. Issues with the current system include importing American inflation, high costs due to an overvalued dollar, and fears of US sanctions affecting countries' dollar reserves.
What is the BRICS' role in moving away from the US dollar?
-The BRICS, led by China and Russia, are actively seeking alternatives to the US dollar by creating independent payment systems, such as a blockchain-based system, and discussing Central Bank Digital Currencies (CBDCs) for trade settlements, aiming to conduct trade outside of the US dollar system.
How do central banks fit into the changing global monetary landscape?
-Central banks around the world are reducing their US dollar reserves and increasingly buying gold. This trend signifies a shift away from reliance on the US dollar and indicates that gold might play a crucial role in the new monetary system being envisaged by countries looking for alternatives.
What are some of the geopolitical risks affecting the global economy and currencies?
-Geopolitical risks include ongoing wars and potential conflicts in places like Gaza, Ukraine, and Taiwan. These situations could lead to a global war and are part of the uncertain geopolitical landscape that might influence the global economy and currency stability.
Why is there a significant disconnect between the price of gold and gold mining equities?
-Frank Giustra notes a disconnect between rising gold prices and stagnant gold mining stocks, attributing it to investors being distracted by speculative investments in technology and cryptocurrencies. He finds this disconnect bizarre and unprecedented in his career.
What is Frank Giustra's stance on the current state of media and information?
-Frank Giustra expresses concern over the mistrust in both mainstream and social media, emphasizing the problems of misinformation, lack of regulation, and the potential dangers of artificial intelligence in spreading false information. He advocates for responsible media practices to address these challenges.
What is Giustra's personal approach to retirement and staying active?
-Frank Giustra believes that retiring is akin to a death sentence and emphasizes the importance of staying mentally and physically active by continuing to work, especially in areas he is passionate about, such as the mining industry and philanthropy.
How does Frank Giustra view the future of gold as an investment?
-Giustra sees gold as a crucial asset for wealth protection against economic and geopolitical uncertainties. He criticizes mainstream financial media for discouraging investment in gold and argues that gold's performance over time, especially against currencies and inflation, underscores its value.
What is Giustra's take on the future role of China in the global economy?
-Giustra views China as a rising global power that is leading the charge against the current US-dominated monetary system. He believes that China's Belt and Road Initiative and its approach to offering development in exchange for oil, as opposed to the US's military-based strategy, will gain more global support.
Outlines
💸 The Looming US Dollar Crisis and Global Economic Shifts
The discussion opens with a concern about the growing US federal debt, predicted to increase significantly over the coming years, leading to a potential dollar crisis. Frank Giustra, a renowned Canadian businessman, is introduced as the guest to explore this topic further. The dialogue delves into the potential decline of the US dollar as the world's reserve currency, emphasizing the geopolitical shifts, including the rise of the BRICS nations and their efforts to move away from dollar-centric trade. The conversation touches on the consequences of the US losing its reserve currency status, affecting its economy, standard of living, and global financial influence.
🌍 The Necessity of a Global Monetary Reset
This paragraph delves into the concept of a 'monetary reset' as discussed by Frank Giustra, explaining the unfair advantages the US dollar system poses for low-income countries. The dialogue highlights the global call for a new monetary system, driven by countries in the global south and the BRICS nations, as they seek alternatives to mitigate the economic disadvantages of the current dollar-centric system. Giustra criticizes the US's lack of response to global pleas for a more equitable monetary system, pointing to the growing trend of countries using local currencies and investing in gold as steps toward a monetary reset.
🌐 Central Bank Digital Currencies and Global Trade Evolution
This segment explores the rise of Central Bank Digital Currencies (CBDCs) as an alternative to the US dollar in international trade. Frank Giustra discusses various global projects testing CBDCs for cross-border transactions, which could lead to a more efficient and US dollar-independent trade system. He speculates about the future role of gold and digital currencies in reshaping global commerce, suggesting that significant changes are underway as nations seek more autonomy in their financial transactions.
🛢️ The Future of the Petrodollar and Global Energy Trade
The conversation shifts to the petrodollar system, with Giustra predicting its decline as countries like Saudi Arabia consider trading oil in currencies other than the US dollar. The discussion addresses the geopolitical implications of such a shift, including the potential for increased global conflicts and the strategic moves by China to promote development in exchange for oil, contrasting with the US's historical approach of offering military support for oil. This part underscores the changing dynamics in global energy trade and the potential consequences for US influence.
💹 The Disparity Between Gold Prices and Mining Equities
Giustra addresses the puzzling lack of correlation between rising gold prices and the stagnating valuations of gold mining equities. He shares insights into his own investments in the mining sector, highlighting the undervaluation of gold mining companies despite the bullion's price surge. Giustra's critique extends to the media's portrayal of gold as an investment, countering mainstream narratives that discourage gold investment and emphasizing the metal's enduring value and performance compared to other asset classes.
📈 Gold's Unexplained Rally and Geopolitical Undercurrents
This section delves into the recent unexplained surge in gold prices, which Giustra finds atypical and indicative of behind-the-scenes geopolitical maneuvering. He speculates that central banks might be driving this rally, noting the absence of investor-driven demand in gold ETFs. Giustra hints at possible deeper geopolitical or economic reasons for this rally, distinct from the usual market drivers, suggesting a significant yet undisclosed shift affecting the gold market.
🏦 Frank Giustra's Continued Passion for Mining and Business
Frank Giustra discusses his ongoing involvement in the mining industry and his reasons for not retiring, emphasizing the importance of staying active and engaged. He details his involvement with AIS Gold and West Red Lake Gold, outlining his strategy for building successful mining companies through a 'buy and build' approach. Giustra explains how he selects projects and his vision for creating value in the mining sector, contrasting with riskier greenfield investments.
📺 Frank Giustra's Perspective on Media Evolution and Misinformation
Giustra shares his views on the future of media, expressing concern over the increasing mistrust in both mainstream and social media due to misinformation and the lack of effective regulation. He recounts his own experience with misinformation on Twitter and emphasizes the importance of media responsibility in a world where false narratives can have real-world consequences. Giustra's comments reflect a broader concern about the direction of media and the challenge of maintaining public trust in an era of rapid technological change.
Mindmap
Keywords
💡US dollar crisis
💡Global Reserve Currency
💡BRICS
💡Monetary Reset
💡Central Bank Digital Currencies (CBDCs)
💡Petrodollar
💡Gold
💡Inflation Export
💡Sanctions
💡Blockchain
Highlights
Frank Giustra discusses the potential loss of the US dollar's status as the world's reserve currency due to unsustainable debt and geopolitical shifts.
Giustra highlights the BRICS nations' efforts to establish a new global monetary system, moving away from US dollar dependency.
The conversation addresses the creation of a blockchain-based payment system by Russia and China as a step towards de-dollarization.
Central banks globally are diversifying reserves away from the US dollar and increasingly accumulating gold.
Giustra argues that the current global monetary system disadvantages the Global South, prompting a demand for a monetary reset.
The interview explores the concept of a 'monetary reset' and why it's considered necessary by many countries.
Discussion on the potential implications of the US dollar losing its reserve currency status, including increased geopolitical tensions and challenges to US hegemony.
Giustra criticizes mainstream financial media's negative stance on gold investments compared to their promotion of cryptocurrencies and tech stocks.
Exploration of the growing trend towards trading oil and other commodities outside of the US dollar, particularly among BRICS nations.
Insights into Giustra's mining ventures and his strategy for selecting and developing mining projects.
Giustra discusses his philanthropic work and the importance of staying active and engaged in business and social issues.
The interview touches on the evolving landscape of media and information, highlighting the challenges posed by misinformation and trust issues.
Giustra emphasizes the strategic role of gold in the new geopolitical and monetary landscapes, suggesting central banks are driving its recent price rally.
A look into Giustra's criticism of current trends in media and social platforms, including his legal action against Twitter over misinformation.
Giustra shares his perspective on retirement, the value of continuous work, and the joy he finds in building successful mining companies.
Transcripts
the CBO which is nonpartisan um
Congressional budget uh office has
predicted that in the next 10 years
we're going to get an additional 20
trillion added to the $34 trillion of
federal debt right now and there's a 100
trillion
dollar dollars of Baseline deficits it
going up to 2050 that at 5% interest
rates think about it that is absolutely
insane it cannot be serviced it's
unsustainable and it's going
to it's going to eventually create a US
dollar crisis is the US dollar about to
see a crisis never before witnessed is
the world seeing a rising tide of
geopolitical tensions that may damage
not just our portfolios but perhaps
challenge our safety and prosperity as
more Wars take front and center in
global headlines let's discuss these
themes along with what's happening
recently with Bitcoin gold and the stock
markets with our next guest Canadian
businessman and philanthropist Frank
justra Frank is the CEO of the fury
group the founder of Alliance gate
entertainment and the co-chair of the
international crisis group uh he is the
founder of former director of weat and
River uh later gold Corb and he's had a
storyed career building a number of
successful mining companies uh a few of
which we'll be talking about later on in
the interview he's also the recipient of
Canada's highest civilian honor the
Order of Canada in 2019 Frank welcome to
the show an honor to host you thanks for
being here hey David it's great great to
be on again Frank this idea that the US
Dollars days as the so Reserve currency
are numbered is an idea that's been
passed around for quite some time but
the implications of this idea are what's
most important for uh people like uh me
uh and investors like yourself we want
to know what this means for the world
because if the US dollar is no longer
the global Reserve currency could that
also mean that the US dollar is no
longer the sole super power could that
mean there's going to be a rising uh
superpower to challenge the us could
there be more conflicts could there be
more Wars that's what we're here to
discuss today so Frank let's start with
the US dollar do you think that it's
losing its status as a reserve currency
and a global hedgman yeah they are it's
just a function or a question of how
long it will take and it may happen very
gradually over a period of time or it
may happen with some event that creates
a more sudden uh switch to some other
mechanism but it's happening and it's
happening right in front of our eyes in
many different ways um the bricks are
driving this China is leading the bricks
in this quest for uh reset of the global
monetary system they have been for quite
a while and since the Russia invasion of
Ukraine has gathered a lot of steam as a
result of the West sanctions on Russian
reserves and elimination from the Swift
Swift
uh settlement system so um the
mechanisms are many and there are lots
of other mechanisms that are being
discussed but in essence what is
happening is that the World At
Large LED Again by China by uh Russia to
some extent are are finding different
mechanisms in which to conduct trade
that is outside the US dollar system and
like I said there there are many we can
go through a laundry list of the
the the the mechanisms that are being
discussed but what is actually being
used at the moment while we're waiting
for some new monetary system reset which
is would be something like what happened
uh with the uh Breton Woods system when
it changed after World War II we're
heading towards a reset but that may
take time in the
meantime most countries around the world
are finding ways to trade using local
currencies and and again the laundry
list is long and growing every day um
and it's mostly within the bricks
countries in the global South that these
mechanisms are being put into place so
that takes away from the demand of US
Dollars and this is happening at the
same time as central banks around the
world are dollariz selling their US
dollar reserves and in many cases buying
gold you know gold has been accumulated
on a very steady basis for the last 14
years and and now at an accelerating
Pace central banks around the world are
dollariz and buying gold and so all of
these things will
eventually become problematic for the
United States because if the US loses
its US
dollar all Supreme Reserve status which
it has it has a lot of repercussions on
the US the economy in terms of standard
of living interest rates inflation all
these things will impact be impacted
negatively and um so it's just a
question of whether it happens gradually
or suddenly and you know but it's
happening okay Frank I want to come back
to some of those points but first you
mentioned monetary reset several times
I've heard that term before first of all
what does that word exactly mean to you
and second why do we need a monetary
reset what's wrong with the current
Global monetary system today
well it's when you look at it from the
perspective of the global South for
instance okay the US dollar system is
basically unfair to countries that have
to
import American inflation so the US
exports its inflation to lowincome
countries with an overvalued dollar and
commodities as you know are mostly
priced in US dollars so as commodity as
the dollars
overpriced commodity cost for low-income
countries becomes excess
um most sovereign debt around the world
especially in the global C is priced in
US Dollars and they have to service that
debt so when you get an overpriced US
dollar it becomes very expensive and
that's why the UN was begging the FED to
lower interest rates last year and the
FED has stubbornly refused to do so up
until the UN was begging the the UN was
begging the FED I didn't oh yeah no the
the UN was begging the FED on behalf of
low-income countries to lower interest
rates this is last year and you know uh
the US is doing what's good for the US
and doesn't really think much about the
rest of the world so so that sovereign
debt has to be serviced in very
expensive US Dollars and then there's
the fear of sanctions you know because
when the US the West led by the US
sanctioned Russia and froze its dollar
reserves eliminated it from the Swift
settlement system many countries around
the world you know they don't have to be
unfriendly to the US but they're
thinking who's going to be next on the
naughty list if the US deems you like
they've deemed Venezuela or Iran or
Russia uh North Korea to be the enemy
they will sanction you and they could
easily free if you have US dollars in
your Central Bank Reserves they can
freeze those dollars because they're in
the form of treasury bills and so that
fear and then additionally the US fiscal
system is in really serious trouble you
know you got $2 trillion deficits every
year as far as as far as the I can see
the CBO which is nonpartisan um
Congressional budget uh office has
predicted that in the next 10 years
we're going to get an additional 20
trillion added to the $34 trillion of
federal debt right now and there's a
hundred trillion
dollar dollars of Baseline death
deficits it going up to 2050 that at 5%
interest rates think about it that is
absolutely insane it cannot be serviced
it's unsustainable and it's G
to it's going to eventually create a US
dollar crisis so for all of those
reasons the world wants a different
system different monetary system and
again China which is an adversary to the
US has led this charge but it's catching
on you know now you've got the
with 11 members and 20 more applicants
standing in line uh and they're going to
control most of the world's GDP at some
point or a very large chunk of it and
they want a different system they're all
begging for it they've talked about a
bricks currency which I think will take
is no it's not going to happen overnight
and it's going to take a bunch of years
but in the meantime you're going to get
a mish mash of weekly dominant
currencies basically competing with the
US dollar and that's what's happening
okay well let's talk about the uh bricks
currency in just a bit but first
speaking of the bricks they've recently
announced this is an article from Fox
Business dated March 3rd uh March 5th
rather they recently announced a new
payment system away from the US dollar
I'll just read you the headline and the
first two paragraphs Russia China team
up against the US dollar with planned
blockchain payment system it says here
the bricks block of countries led by
China and Russia are moving ahead with
their efforts to move away from the US
dollar with an announcement that they're
planning to create a payment system
blate based on block blockchain the five
Nation bricks group um uh told an
Russian agency T late Monday we believe
that creating an independent bricks
payment system is an important goal for
the future which could be based on
state-of-the-art tools such as digital
Technologies and blockchain so first
evaluate why they're doing this uh and
talk about what whether or not you think
blockchain is a solution to what they're
trying to achieve here well what they're
referring to is Central Bank digital
currencies as a means of settlements on
trades between countries okay and um
that is a reality there's probably 130
countries around the world that are
testing Central Bank digital currencies
and I don't know if you've heard of the
mbridge project between China Thailand
and the UAE which has been in effect for
the last couple of years which is
testing crossb settlements using Central
Bank to Central Bank ledgers and
completely outside the US dollar system
so this is what they're referring to and
it's more efficient it's going to be
less expensive and it
removes the you know a large part of the
world from the uh what they perceive to
be a problematic US dollar system so yes
that's absolutely happening and it makes
sense if you're if you're one of these
countries if you're Saudi Arabia if
you're turkey if you're Egypt if you're
Nigeria uh Venezuela it makes sense to
have a system that's more efficient and
less costly and is not going to be in
Jeopardy of being attacked by the US
government right but if they do this
Frank uh if they go ahead with not just
a cbdc but a common bricks currency an
idea that's been talked about a lot what
does that look like well I we don't know
yet and and again I think the the idea
of a bricks currency like a Euro for
instance is a long ways down the road
because you know you've got a number of
countries that uh within the bricks
group that are adversaries India and
China being the prime example um and so
I don't know whether they're going to
you know I think think it'll happen
eventually I think it'll take time uh
and in the meantime you're getting these
bilateral Arrangements between countries
to trade in their local currencies and
that's going to and that can move to a
digital world quite easily and that's
what's going to happen I think first and
then I think that gold is going to play
some role in whatever this new system is
going to look like and uh that will you
will we'll wait and see how that plays
out but there's a very good reason why
all the central banks around the world
have been absolutely piling up their
gold reserves I mean it's it's again
they broke a record u in 2022 2023 was
almost equal to 2022 and there's still
if you look at the January and February
numbers of 2024 central banks led by
China again are really buying up all the
physical gold gold is moving from the
West physical Golds moving from the West
to the East and it's happening right in
front of our eyes and hardly anybody in
America is paying attention are central
banks price sensitive in other words
will they typically buy gold when they
believe it's at a fair
value well David you know think about it
they've been steadily buying gold for 14
years since
2010 they haven't wavered and the price
has gone from what you know from since
2010 it's had a low of 1100 and a high
of today it just hit 2200 today okay
they they keep buying so so thus far
they haven't been sensitive to the price
but so you don't think this is an
indicator of higher prices just because
central banks are moving in investors
shouldn't look at it that way well I
think investors need to pay attention to
what central banks are doing they're
they're in the node they know what's
going on they're seeing what's happening
around the world I think investors in
North America are are not paying
attention they're too focused on you
know Bitcoin and crypto currencies and
they're not paying attention what's
happening in the real monetary world and
so I think that it it it it makes a lot
of sense to pay very close attention to
what central banks are doing let's talk
about the petrol dollar now the idea
that uh somewhere down the line uh oil
will no longer be denominated in US
dollars or at least there might be a
bifurcation in our Global uh system
whereby we have your oil priced in
dollars and oil priced in something else
is that what's going to happen next
Frank yeah it's already it's already
starting to happen and I think you know
Saudi Arabia is the key player in this
in this game of uh maintaining the Petro
dollar status and even Saudi Saudi
Arabia has toyed with the idea and I
said it publicly that they would
consider consider selling oil and Yuan
uh many other countries including the
UAE is trading oil in other currencies
outside the US dollar they're already
doing it with Indian durhams um these
oil trades are happening um in other
currencies Ghana has said they will sell
they will use gold to buy oil instead of
US Dollars um so it is
happening the the the tricky part I
think and and again Saudi Arabia is the
key player in OPAC and I think from
their perspective they have to walk a
very delicate balance between their
relationship with China on one hand and
the US on the other you know they have
security arrangements with the United
States but they see China as the future
in terms of where their trade is going
to come from and they have an
arrangement with China to to uh to sell
oil and and and China will invest in
Saudi Arabia in other things so I think
that the days of the Petr dollar are
numbered but again you know countries
are have to be very careful not
to upset the United States by completely
abandoning the P dollar because that
would be a national security issue for
the United States and they would react
very violently in my opinion if that
were to happen so what's happening in
the world and the way you have to look
at it is that China is promoting the
idea for many years the US promoted the
idea to the world um we will
uh buy your oil and sell you arms okay
that was the arrangement basically with
L we'll keep you safe the world you know
we have the largest Navy in the world
we'll keep the waterways safe uh we'll
sell you arms and you sell us your oil
and you do it in US Dollars okay uh you
have to use the US dollar that was
always the case China has a different
sales pitch they say we'll give you
Prosperity we'll buy oil and invest in
your country and your development it's
oil for development instead of oil for
arms and that is selling very well with
a large part of the world because China
as you know with its belt and Road
initiative is invest has invested very
heavily around the world uh in
development uh in and in many cases in
order to secure energy and mineral needs
um and so you know when you think about
it from the perspective of of a lot of
the world the bricks the global South
you know oil for Prosperity makes makes
a lot more sense than oil forarms and so
this is this is going to be the battle
going you know as we move forward is the
US selling one idea and China selling
another here here's the thing a lot of
people agree with you Frank that there's
going to be a bifurcation of global
strength and power and monetary systems
and whatnot but are are we ready for
another superpower to take over let's
just take up talk about the global Bel
and Road the Chinese belt and Road
initiative by the way which has been
criticized as a lone shark Chinese loone
shark problem a lot of the African
countries that China is building in
can't even pay back the loans that China
is giving them and so they're paying
them back in other ways by basically
being imperialized right that's one
criticism you know and that is a bogus
claim when you think about it know
listen China is doing what's good for
China as every other country in the
world does the same but the idea that uh
this is uh uh debt
diplomacy by China to U basically
enslave countries through this unpayable
debt is bogus and you have to there was
a Bloomberg article on this last year
that you should look up which is
basically said you know it it and and if
you look at it what what take Africa for
instance Africa where where China is
very heavily invested it has strategic
Partnerships with 44 countries in Africa
including n space programs with nine
countries in Africa it's invested 1.3
trillion dollars in various in about
20,000 projects and when you look at it
and it's and these are government to
government deals which many countries on
around the world prefer rather than
dealing with corporations and if you
look at it from the African Count's
perspective they they're not complaining
they're not the ones that are
complaining it's the West that is
labeling um these loans as unpayable and
unfair and whatever when when you look
at what the IMF has done to a lot of
these countries over the years you know
it's you know it's really a bit of the
kettle calling the pop black you know
and but it's it's a competition you have
to understand this is a global
competition for Global
Supremacy China is going to is onest way
become the number one economy in the
world all already isn't and the US
doesn't like it and the US is reacting
and it's no different than what's
happened throughout history and the
patterns are all the same so I think
that the idea that China's loans and
arrangements with countries around the
world I've been labeled as totally
unfair is completely wrong it's bogus I
mean you got to just get real about
what's what's going on and compete the
US has to compete instead of
complain explain devil's advocate here
the the the antithesis to what you've
been what we've been talking about the
last 20 minutes is that there's no
there's no dollarization Trend franking
mean look at the dxy it's it's been on
an uptrend for the last couple of years
relative to other currencies it's
relatively strong and now on the on the
subject of the bricks taking over the US
China has its own economic problems is
that's got a housing bubble that's
already collapsing um we don't even know
if it's going to become the world's
largest economy and sustain that level
Russia's got problems of its own that
you know are obvious the US is doing
quite well relative to the other peers
right that's that's that's the
counterargument here we don't need to
worry if we're in the
west okay you want me to respond to that
yeah please go ahead okay well listen
first of all when you compare currencies
with other currencies it's an
abstraction you know it's it's an
illusion you can't that's not the way to
measure the value of a currency So when
you say that the USR strength has been
consistent for the last few years yeah
because us jacked up its interest rates
to 5% uh and has led the world in terms
of interest rate hikes and that attracts
investment like treasury bills
Investments and that's all fine but you
have to measure the only true measure
of currencies is a currency against
measured against gold okay and that's
what you have to keep an eye on and up
until recently you know that wasn't yeah
really evident but now starting to
become evident now and when you say that
the US is doing well
really I said relative to its peers
right I mean it's got everyone's got
problems yeah yeah yes it's its economy
has been stronger than some of the rest
but at what cost at what cost how how
can you say that the economy is strong
when it's fueled by government debt to
the tune of2 trillion do a year deficits
that's not strength that's an illusion
and one day is going to come back and
bite it and so you have to look at the
reality of what's going on in the world
as opposed to what is being promoted as
economic strength and so I I don't
believe that the US economy is as strong
as they would like to to have you
believe and you can't you just got to
look at their fiscal situation it's an
it's very problematic those are very
very big numbers you mentioned gold may
be the solution to these problems you
actually tweeted about this recently you
criticized the CNBC article you said
when CNBC misleads its Audience by
cautioning them against buying gold it's
time to actually pay attention I'll just
cite a few uh quotes from this
particular article here it says uh first
of all uh don't be enticed by the gold
rally investors buy gold and hope it
doesn't go go up uh one helpful way to
think about the recent gold rally it's a
case of shot and fla the yellow metal
does well when other assets in the world
are in trouble and then it goes on to
list a few reasons why gold has not been
a good investment over time despite
brief rall the average return annual
return for gold uh far legs stocks and
bonds according to experts so it's
really just a safety play that doesn't
really last is what this article is
saying yeah so David and they used their
measure and again you can play all sorts
of silly games with Statistics okay so
well from
2014 uh the S&P outperform gold to the
Hey listen I'll give you two other
statistics since the turn of the century
since 2001 gold has outperformed stocks
and bonds since 1971
to the present gold has
outperformed uh gold has gone up 5700
per the Dow Jones Dow Jones has gone up
4,00% the cnbc's of the world are really
shs for Wall Street you listen
I CNBC will never promote gold they
never have and they never will because
it's is it's a counter argument to the
The Narrative that they're putting to
the public that everything's fine you
have to invest in stocks and in bonds
and cryptocurrency anything that
generates fees for Wall Street and
creates wealth for Wall Street is what
cnbc's of the world like to promote and
the fact that gold has outperformed
everything else over time they don't
they don't like to admit that because
they would be admitting that gold has a
true role in protecting wealth um and so
I don't don't buy any of this stuff and
in the meantime the same day they came
up with that article David yeah yeah
they put out another article that
Bitcoin could possibly go to $98,000 a
coin you know when it's trading at 60
something so they promote Things That
Wall Street makes money off of right and
they they po go so I don't I don't trust
the
NBC I they're I I think that're you know
Jim Kramer oh my God the guy's never
right and I don't even know why he has a
following it just it's it's all
entertainment it's a show and none of it
makes any sense to me listen to this
sentence from the same article should
investors take part in the Doomsday
holding okay it's calling gold a literal
doomsday holding can you evaluate that
uh that term is it is it correct it's
it's true gold is sort of a hedge
against almost every other stupidity in
the world it always has been and so uh
the the question of whether you should
be um what what that sentence is
insinuating is should should you be
rooting for a doomsday and again I'm
going to say to you it doesn't matter
what you're rooting for the question is
should you be putting your money to
something that will protect you in the
event of an unraveling that's you know
that's that's the question and so it's
not about what you're rooting for it's
about being realistic well here's the
thing uh Frank gold currently as we're
speaking today on Friday
2185 right already pass alltime highs
Bitcoin briefly surpassed alltime highs
very very briefly the S&P Dow Jones
already broke alltime highs weeks ago I
think all these assets are probably
responding to another four something
else that's going up because you've got
risk assets and gold which is a safety
plate all going up at the same time
right what's going on well that's
probably the best question you've asked
today because the answer is I don't know
and I'm telling you and don't listen to
all the Talking Heads that are trying to
explain this recent gold rally this
recent gold rally that's happen this
past week is very different there's
something going on and we're not going
to
learn the reason for this rally because
it seems to be
uninterrupted the
manipulators that are usually in the
market have stepped out of the way
there's something going on that will be
explained later because who whatever the
powers that are driving this gold pricer
up to they don't they're not going to
let you know that until they've
accomplished what they need to
accomplish this is a very different gold
rally it it's happening without any
explanation and and and it's not about
what Paul said the other day or about
interest rates about it's not about the
dollar there's something going on that's
very profound and I don't have the
answer I I can speculate and there could
be a whole bunch of reasons but this
rally is Extreme ly different and I've
been watching gold my entire adult life
and what's happened this last week is
unexplainable it's not it's very
different than every other rally that
I've ever seen and it's happening almost
at an uninterrupted Pace marching its
way forward a couple hundred bucks an
ounce and no one can explain it and I my
guesses will find out down the road what
happened but it it I'm I'm certain it
involves geopolitical players okay so
it's not we we'll finish off here and
then I want it's certainly I'll tell you
what it's not it's not investors this is
not a gold rally that's been driven by
because if you see what's happening with
the gold ETFs we're actually getting
outflows of ETF money in the gold ETFs
during a spike in Gold so it's investors
and certainly not in North America
they're not the ones that are doing this
my guess is that there are central banks
involved in this rally that's all I can
guess this is not an investor driven
rally this is a geo this is a
geopolitical player rally and it's most
likely central banks
somewhere one or a number of them acting
in concert who knows well we we know
what gold reacts to geopolitical risks
the dollar the dollar has not been you
know going down or exploding it's just
been flat the dxy so it's not really
reacting to the dollar inflation hasn't
been you know inflation hasn't been
skyrocketing gold Hedges against
inflation so that's not that uh we
talked about the fed the FED has
announced that it's going to lower rates
at some point but you said it's on an
interest rate thing so the only variable
left that I mentioned is geopolitical
risks right do you see a War or conflict
breaking out is that what's the gold
market is pricing in yeah I think that's
part of it but I don't think that's the
reason for the re recent rally what
we've seen the last week I think that
there's part of yeah yeah the world is
very fragile
you've got two major Wars going on each
of which could trigger the involvement
of global Powers into a direct conflict
both of those Wars Gaza and
Ukraine have the and then there's Taiwan
and China um all of these conflicts and
Brewing conflicts have the potential of
creating a global
war and so that's but that's been that's
that risk has been there for a couple of
years years already uh that's not the
reason this rally happened okay I think
there's something else going on okay
we'll find out what it is we'll follow
up perhaps you write an article in the
Toronto Sun or somewhere else and uh we
read about it there uh Frank Frank let's
talk about some of your recent Holdings
but before that why aren't you
retired why why what why why aren't you
retired why why are you still working so
hard what are you trying to achieve now
yeah people people die when they retire
okay I will never retire I think that's
that's a death sentence and I and I mean
that I think that you have to keep your
brain active you have to be involved in
things doing things you will live longer
and have a healthier lifespan if you do
that as opposed to retiring so I will
never retire I got way too much on my
plate as you know most of my world is my
philanthropic work I 80% of my time is
on my foundations and working with
crisis group as co-chair there um but um
I like the mining business I I grew up
with it I've made all my wealth from it
uh and I still enjoy it I enjoy I've
staffed up my office with you know a
couple of dozen of geologists and
engineers and corporate finance people
because I see a market coming not only
in Gold but in the battery Metals which
I think we're going to see a huge
deficit of Supply over the next 15 20
years and that's going to mean much
higher prices for for the metals um so
my my my my expertise in business is in
mining and I love it I absolutely love
it I love creating companies I've
created many many mining companies
throughout my career and I will continue
to do so I enjoy it uh the two projects
I want to bring up that you're involved
with AIS Gold West Red Lake gold right
what have you selected to parting with
these projects here Aris is is is is a a
gold producer in Colombia mostly in
Colombia uh we have two producing mines
down there uh we just came out with our
numbers yesterday um and very impressed
Rive you got 250,000 ounces a year of
gold production going to 500,000 ounces
by
2026 um just on our currently fully
financed and permitted projects plus we
have another massive project Soto Norte
which uh is going through the permitting
phase uh and our ambition is to be a
million ounce a year producer and we'll
get there you know I think we have a
pathway to get there um now here's the
disconnect and it's not just AOS by the
way although AOS is at the extreme in
terms of valuations I've in my 45 year
career seen such a disconnect between
the price of gold and the price of the
gold mining equities that mine the Gold
it's like Gold's going up
dramatically but the gold mining stocks
are barely moving and so you've got ays
with the numbers I just gave you they
they had $156 million us eida 150 156
million Us in eida it's got a $450
million Market again and you know in in
my career I've never seen anything like
that and there I've got other gold
mining positions that are equally
undervalue and I think that that's going
to as gold now maintains its uh alltime
high and goes higher I think that
sentiment will change but I'm surprised
it hasn't changed yet I gotta be honest
with you I think this is it's it's a
weird bizarre Universe we're living in
right now where this disconnect exists
but so that's ays and so ays you know
is I this my fifth gold mining company
I've created in the last 20 years and uh
you know we as always we have a three to
sevene time Horizon where we try and
create a million ounce year producer
we've done it before and it will create
wealth uh for its shareholders over over
time and it's incredibly undervalued
I've never seen anything like it the
numbers speak for themselves not not
promoting it just is but again we're not
alone you know I have friends that have
other mining companies that are that are
suffering the same could could I just
suggest a theory as to why there's this
disconnect well it just it's from this
it's from the tech sector right I mean
the speculative money has flowed into
this new hot trend of AI and everything
with
it that's true Tech sector so you know
the mag magnificent 7 cryp Bitcoin with
all of these Bitcoin ETFs that's
stealing a lot of the Thunder from and
again these are North American investors
okay the physical Gold's being bought
all in the East and so that's happening
but but certainly investors here are
distracted by you know this easy money
that's being made in tech stocks and and
and and
cryptocurrencies you're you're you're a
major shareholder of West red leg gold
so AIS is producing West red leg is not
what's your thesis behind holding first
of all before we talk about the project
itself what's your reason for holding a
a junior mining project that isn't isn't
produced producing right now it's a
great opportunity and so we bought I
know how much you know about West Red
Lake but it was we bought it out of
bankruptcy it was a fully built mine
fully permitted with a couple million
ounces in the ground that the previous
management messed up you being quite
honest they just messed it up too much
debt too much in a rush made too many
mistakes and it went into bankrupts and
we bought it for a very low price um uh
last year and our job is now to do what
previous manag should should have done
which is to put it into production in a
in a responsible manner it will go back
in the production in the next sort of 12
18 months and so the upside when you
know it's got a current market cap of
say $130
million um and I've already raised uh
close to $70 million in the last year to
do the work that was necessary to put it
back into production in a way that it
will produce gold very profitably yeah
um if we achieve the goal of putting it
back in production as I expect we will
the upside is tremendous this company
that owned it before had a $1.2 billion
market cap at some point based on this
mind okay so I look at it as a risk
reward and we put together an an
exceptional mining team that knows what
they're doing with underground mining
and knows they can put it back in
production those were the mistakes were
made and there were mistakes that
shouldn't been made they were like you
know
just basic mistakes they were in a rush
to put it into production they wanted to
sell the company and they messed it up
it's as simple as simple as that well
why why well I mean why yeah but that's
that's a difference of strategy right I
mean why why would you want why would
you as a shareholder want to go into
production as opposed to just selling it
off and not dealing with the cap Capal
cost because like with everything else
I've created I have a plan you know my
all the mining companies I've created
since gold Corp Endeavor
mining uh Lea gold ays and now west
redle have a plan the plan is very
simple it's called a buy and build
strategy so you start with one mind all
these companies started with one mind
and then through a series of efforts
including m&a including buying projects
and putting them in production you build
a gold mining company with multiple
mines and that's where the wealth is
created and I've proven it in the past
it's has worked very well it's a formula
that works very well so West redley much
like AIS the plan my plan is Canadian
okay so it's a Canadian mine we'll put
it back into production but there will
be other things attach to it either
through m&a or through putting other
projects into production my objective to
build a Canadian gold mining company
that will
produce many hundreds of thousands of
ounces a year and that's
how I do it and like I said done it
before there's no guarantee of success
but it's what we do
best do you have a last question on
money we'll end it here do do you have
an approach to picking projects I mean
West R Lake for example is a it's a
Brownfield exploration project okay it's
long history behind that particular
deposit do you that is that something
you go for something that already has
had a history of mining where do you
where is there better value you think in
picking something that's
Greenfield uh green fields are tough
okay and you know I've i' I've invested
a bit in Green Fields it's a very very
Risky Business um I've made money I lost
money doing it but it's it doesn't fit
the formula of what I just
described to have to to achieve what I
achieve and have achieved in all my
mining companies you start with
something that is either already in
production and can be improved upon or
something that's ready to go into
production and needs capital and and
management expertise to get there okay
Green Field stuff that's a different
game that's a completely different game
you can make a lot of money on that and
lose a lot of money on that what I do
has a lot less
risk okay perfect final question I want
to give your take on the future of media
you also founded Lions Gate
entertainment uh love the work that's
that company has done by the way um
you've you've had back and forth between
uh Twitter uh you know you've criticized
for what they've done now what is the
future of how people consume media is it
social media is it online is there still
room for cable TV are you still
venturing in the media space what's the
future here I'm not um you know that's
that that was my past um but the way I
see it is that uh we live in a world of
information where information is is the
most important commodity and the problem
we have today is a m trust in
information okay mistrust with
mainstream
media uh mistrust with social
media uh social media is largely
unregulated so you can you know now with
the uh introduction of artificial
intelligence it's getting really scary
because who's going to determine and how
do you determine what information is
true and what is false what is
misleading what is meant to lead you um
and that's a very scary world to live in
and I don't know how it's all going to
play
out but I see nothing but problems with
the way that the media works today and
the lack of trust in media
people are believing things that they
are told because they live in Echo
chamers both with respect to the
mainstream media so you got Fox you got
CNN or Fox and SMBC two separate
universes there yeah giving different
information to their viewers and then
you got social media that does the same
thing you know you've got all sorts
of uh narratives
being promoted on social media and much
of it is complete misinformation and
disinformation well you've been the
subject of some of these attacks right
on on social media on Twitter yeah
that's why I see Twitter I see Twitter
several years ago it was a you know bit
of a bold move but I sued them for and I
sued them for a dollar I didn't sue them
to make money I sued them to make a
point and the point was that I was
getting death threats on lies that were
being told by the qanon crowd through
Twitter and I complained and I you know
I you know wrote letters to Jack dorsy
and I said you know and got zero
response so I thought okay I'll get
their attention so I Su and now I can't
talk about the settlement because we
signed an NDA but um you know I I was I
was making a point saying change your
ways you you can't tackle this
misinformation you can't tackle when
these Bots are manipulating information
can tackle death threats you know they
weren't doing it before now you know
they CH El musk is doing the exact
opposite he's actually fired a majority
of the team that's responsible for
censoring quote what he calls it
censoring content you just call it
moderation he calls it censoring so uh
that's not that's that's not really the
future that the current owner is wanting
to take I don't think he agrees with you
there Frank he doesn't and and that's
fine you know that's his take on it I
have to make a point about what was
happening before and death threats are
unacceptable sure you know just unaccept
because we live in a crazy world and
some people believe these crazy stories
about pizzagate and you know Hollywood
people drinking the blood of children I
mean there are people that believe this
stuff and they want to do something
about it and there's already been cases
where people that are not quite stable
go out with guns and try and and and and
and and be the Vigilantes that fix this
problem you know it's it's a crazy world
out there so you know the media has a
responsibility and a lot of times the
media does not take on that
responsibility of not firing up you know
a a population with lies that makes them
react Frank where do we learn more about
you and the uh Fury group and what are
you're working on with these days what
do you mean where do we learn more is
there is there someplace we can follow
you uh oh TW listen Twitter's my my you
know even though I sue Twitter I'm still
on
it no again I was making a point I made
the point that's behind us now um but
Twitter is where I Express My Views
about everything from geopolitics from
conflicts to macroeconomics to the
dollar to go any anything that I feel
where the world where there's an
injustice taking place and I comment on
so many things I write about lots and
lots of stuff including you just just go
there you'll find everything I've
written gets posted there all my
opinions and dayto day I will see an
article on something and I'll aine on
and say you know this is where I believe
it's right or wrong and uh and I point
out things that a lot of people don't
pay attention to and I enjoy it and it's
my it's my platform okay you haven't
considered final question I'll let you
go you haven't considered launching your
own social media platform taking the
Donald Trump
route why would I do that what kind of
an audience would I have seriously I
don't know yeah no I'm happy to use
somebody else's platform okay perfect
thank you very much for your time today
Frank we've learned a
David always my pleasure thank you for
watching don't forget to like And
subscribe
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