Temple Grandin Interview - Part 1
Summary
TLDRTemple Grandin, a professor of animal science at Colorado State University, shares her journey of living with autism and how it shaped her career. She discusses her work in designing cattle facilities, her experiences with bullying, and how her interests in drawing, science, and horses helped her succeed. Temple emphasizes the importance of nurturing children's strengths and using teachable moments to build social skills. She also addresses misconceptions about autism and the need for a tailored approach in education, advocating for individualized support based on children's abilities and challenges.
Takeaways
- 😀 Temple Grandin is a professor of animal science at Colorado State University and has worked extensively on designing cattle facilities.
- 🐄 She has designed equipment for major meat companies and is also a prominent advocate for autism awareness, sharing her own experiences as someone with autism.
- 🎨 Her mother encouraged her ability to draw, which played a significant role in her success; she emphasizes nurturing strengths in children.
- 🤖 Grandin recalls that in the 1950s, social skills were taught systematically, helping socially awkward kids succeed. This systematic teaching was a big part of her upbringing.
- 🐴 As a child, she was heavily involved in the 4-H horse program, where she found friendships through shared interests like horses, electronics, and model rockets.
- 🤝 She stresses that friendships can be built around shared interests, such as clubs or activities, helping socially awkward individuals connect.
- 🥊 Grandin faced bullying in school, which led to her being kicked out. However, she found a supportive environment at a special boarding school for gifted kids with emotional problems.
- 🧠 Grandin's book 'The Autistic Brain' explores different ways of thinking, highlighting visual thinkers, pattern thinkers, and verbal thinkers working together.
- 📱 She uses the example of Steve Jobs to explain how different kinds of minds, such as artists and engineers, collaborate to create products like the iPhone.
- 📏 Grandin critiques the current autism diagnosis spectrum, saying it lumps together highly capable individuals and those with severe disabilities under the same label, which can lead to mismatched educational support.
Q & A
How does Temple Grandin describe herself?
-Temple Grandin describes herself as a professor of animal science at Colorado State University. She has worked for years designing cattle facilities and giving talks on autism, which she experienced firsthand.
What key advice does Temple give to help children with autism develop their strengths?
-Temple emphasizes building on what a child is good at. She believes in encouraging a child's natural abilities and talents, as her own skill in drawing was nurtured and became the basis for her career in designing facilities.
How does Temple explain the way children were raised in the 1950s compared to now?
-Temple explains that children in the 1950s were systematically taught social skills like table manners and saying 'please' and 'thank you.' This structured approach helped children who would now be labeled on the autism spectrum to succeed socially.
How did Temple's interest in science develop?
-Temple's interest in science was sparked by a great science teacher who gave her interesting projects. This motivated her to study, and she eventually became fascinated with experimental psychology, specifically optical illusions.
What does Temple mean by 'teachable moments' when it comes to social skills?
-Temple defines 'teachable moments' as situations where a child makes a mistake in social behavior, such as using their fingers instead of a fork, and the mistake is calmly corrected. She believes social skills are best learned through real-world interactions rather than separate social skills classes.
What are the different kinds of thinking that Temple Grandin describes in her book 'The Autistic Brain'?
-Temple describes three types of thinking: visual thinking, where people think in photorealistic pictures (her own type), verbal thinking, where people think in words, and pattern thinking, which is more mathematical and logical.
What misconceptions does Temple say people have about autism?
-Temple argues that people overgeneralize autism, thinking of it as a single condition when it’s really a wide spectrum. She notes that people with autism can range from being highly talented, like those in Silicon Valley, to being severely impaired.
How does Temple suggest helping socially awkward children make friends?
-Temple suggests that children make friends through shared interests, whether in activities like horses, electronics, or clubs. She stresses that finding others with common hobbies or passions is key to forming friendships.
What advice does Temple offer to teachers about working with children on the autism spectrum?
-Temple advises teachers to encourage the child’s strengths. If a child is advanced in subjects like math, teachers should allow them to pursue higher-level work rather than holding them back to match their grade level.
What does Temple believe about the current state of diagnosing autism?
-Temple believes that autism diagnoses have become overly broad and inconsistent, with the spectrum ranging from highly gifted individuals to those with severe disabilities. She feels that the focus should be less on labels and more on what each individual can do.
Outlines
😊 Introduction to Temple Grandin and Her Work
Temple Grandin introduces herself as a professor of animal science at Colorado State University. She shares her experience working on designing cattle facilities for major meat companies and her contributions to autism advocacy. Diagnosed with full-blown autism as a child, Grandin credits her artistic abilities for driving her success. Her mother and the structured societal rules of the 1950s played crucial roles in her development, encouraging manners, creativity, and teaching essential social skills systematically.
🐴 Temple Grandin’s Childhood Interests and Socialization
Grandin shares her childhood experiences, particularly her involvement in 4-H horse programs, model rockets, and electronics clubs, which helped her find friends through shared interests. She stresses that friendships are often built around common activities, such as school plays or clubs. Despite being bullied in ninth grade, leading to her expulsion and transfer to a special boarding school, she learned work skills by caring for horses and benefited from a supportive science teacher who sparked her passion for experimental psychology.
📚 Learning Social Skills Through Practical Activities
Grandin emphasizes that social skills are best learned through teachable moments embedded in everyday activities rather than formal classes. Reflecting on her own upbringing in the 1950s, she explains how table manners and social behavior were corrected in real-time, without judgment, much like coaching an actor. She draws a parallel between learning social skills and learning to behave in a foreign culture, highlighting the importance of explaining and modeling the appropriate behavior.
🎨 Different Kinds of Minds and How They Work Together
Grandin elaborates on the different ways people think, emphasizing the importance of visual thinking, pattern thinking, and verbal thinking. She highlights how these different types of minds can complement each other, such as in the development of the iPhone, where the artistic vision of Steve Jobs worked in tandem with engineers. She notes that a small degree of autism can foster exceptional talents, while a more severe manifestation of the trait can lead to significant challenges.
🧠 Misconceptions About Autism and Diagnostic Challenges
Grandin discusses the evolving understanding and diagnosis of autism. She explains that the diagnostic labels for autism have changed over the years, often driven by debates in conference rooms rather than clear scientific criteria. She expresses concern about the broad spectrum of autism, which now includes both highly gifted individuals and those with severe disabilities, all under the same label. Grandin criticizes the over-reliance on labels and stresses the importance of focusing on a child's abilities and potential rather than their diagnosis.
🧮 The Importance of Encouraging Strengths in Autistic Children
Grandin advises parents and teachers to focus on the strengths of autistic children, especially in areas where they excel. She gives an example of a child who excels in math but struggles with reading, emphasizing the importance of nurturing their strengths rather than holding them back. Grandin also criticizes educational systems that screen out talented students because of challenges in unrelated subjects, like algebra, advocating for more flexibility in allowing children to pursue their interests and excel in areas like industrial design or mechanics.
Mindmap
Keywords
💡Autism
💡Visual Thinking
💡Teachable Moments
💡Cattle Facilities
💡Shared Interests
💡Pattern Thinking
💡Bullying
💡Work Skills
💡Strength-based Education
💡Algebra Barrier
Highlights
Temple Grandin describes herself as a professor of animal science at Colorado State University, with years of experience designing cattle facilities and equipment for major meat companies.
Temple shares that she had full-blown autism as a child, and her drawing ability was always encouraged, showing the importance of nurturing a child's strengths.
In the 1950s, Temple notes that social rules were systematically taught to children, contributing to their ability to function socially, even if they were labeled as 'Geeks and nerds.'
Temple emphasizes the value of clubs and shared interests, such as 4-H and model rockets, in helping socially awkward individuals make friends.
She was bullied in high school, leading to fights and her expulsion, which resulted in her attending a boarding school for gifted kids with emotional problems.
At her boarding school, Temple learned important work skills by taking care of the horse barn and developed an interest in science through engaging science projects.
Temple advocates for teaching social skills through 'teachable moments' embedded in everyday activities rather than in a formal classroom setting.
She explains the different types of thinkers: visual thinkers (like herself), word-based thinkers, and pattern thinkers, highlighting how these different types can work together.
Temple uses the example of the iPhone's design to demonstrate how different minds—visual thinkers like Steve Jobs and engineers—collaborate successfully.
She discusses the misconceptions surrounding autism, noting that the diagnostic labels for autism have changed over time and often lump very different individuals together under the same spectrum.
Temple is concerned that gifted autistic individuals are sometimes placed in inappropriate special education settings, which limits their potential.
Temple repeatedly emphasizes the importance of focusing on what a child with autism is good at, encouraging their strengths instead of fixating on weaknesses.
She notes that visual thinkers, like herself, often struggle with algebra but excel in geometry, and she advocates for educational flexibility to accommodate these strengths.
Temple warns against holding back talented children in subjects they excel at, such as math, due to the fear that they will 'run out' of things to do in high school.
Her advice to teachers and parents is to always encourage the child’s area of strength, allowing them to advance at their own pace in subjects where they excel, while supporting areas where they may struggle.
Transcripts
Temple Dr Brandon is a such a pleasure
to have you here at with with University
so one of the questions that we would
like to ask is if you meet people and
you try to describe who you are how
would you describe yourself I describe
myself now as professor of animal
science at Colorado State University
I've worked for years on designing
cattle facil ities um major meat
companies have equipment I've
designed I also um do a lot of talks on
autism because I was a little kid I had
full-blown autism and and my ability in
drawing was always always
encouraged take the thing that the
kids's good at and build on it how did
your mom support that Temple well I was
brought up in the 50s and all kids in
the 50s were taught table manners they
were taught saying please and thank you
in a much more systematic sort of way
now I went to college with a lot of kids
that today would be labeled on the
autism spectrum and in the ' 50s they
were just called Geeks and nerds and
they all managed to get jobs because the
social rules were pounded in in a very
systematic way into every child MH
that's just the way it was done in the
50s but there was plenty of time for
creativity plenty of time to do pictures
fly my kites do my Aviation experiments
with bird kites behind my strike lots of
time for creativity were you um um were
you a member of any kind of clubs when
you were little like 4
or what kind of clubs did you belong to
as a kid when I was in high school I was
a member of 4 4 horse program my life
revolved around horses and showing
horses and where I had friends was
through horses electronics and model
rockets and our school had a model
rocket club I get asked all the time
especially you know socially awkward how
do you have friends you get friends who
shared interests it could be the school
play it could be band it could be choir
it could be a computer Club a Star Trek
Club some sort of shared interest we
bring that friendship about how about
bullying did you were you recipient bu I
was bullied and teased horribly in ninth
grade and I retaliated by getting in
fights I got kicked out of high school
for that ended up going to a special
boarding school for uh gifted kids with
emotional problems because you got to
remember this is early 60s so everything
was emotional problems and I didn't do
very much studying but boy I learn how
to work and I basically took care of the
horse barn cleaned eight stalls every
day and I think Mr py realized that I
was learning working sko skills I'm
seeing a lot of kids today that are not
learning work skills then I had a great
science teacher who got me interested in
science by giving me interesting science
projects and then that gave me a
motivation to study because now I wanted
to be an experimental psychologist
working on optical illusions and I got
interested in that because I saw it in a
science movie at breakfast this morning
you mentioned um a better way to help
young people with their social skills is
to embed those skills within a project
or some kind of activity where uh it's
not separated from having a skills class
little kids in the 50s um if I made a
mistake in tail table maners it was
corrected I mean if I took my finger and
put my finger in the mashed potatoes my
mother would say use the fork you just
use those teachable moments wasn't in a
social skills class it was just part of
other activities if youve got to say
thank you that was queued and that's
what's meant by a teachable moment
that's what I mean by a teachable moment
teachable moment is when the kid makes a
mistake on manners or social skill you
correct it you explain to them calmly
it's like coaching an actor in a play
it's like coaching somebody on how to
behave in a foreign country like for
example this country would Point like
this but in China that's rude you point
like this I have no way of knowing that
unless somebody shows me and you just
got to look at all those different
things it's like teaching them how to
behave in a foreign culture you know
you've written your book The autistic
brain about different kinds of minds and
how they work together in different
kinds of ways could you elaborate on
that
I'm a visual thinker I think in
photorealistic pictures and when I was
really young I thought everybody thought
in photorealistic pictures then I found
in interviewing people about how they
think and some people think more in
words others think more in pictures but
then there's a third gr group where they
think in patterns and when I worked on
the on my book The autistic brain I was
very very happy to find out that there
were scientific journal articles that
supported object visual thinking being
different from pattern mathematical
thinking there actually are two types of
visual spatial thinking and these two
types of thinking can work well together
you take for example something like the
iPhone for example the interface was
made by an artist Steve Jobs was an
artist he was not a programmer then the
engineers had to figure out how to make
the phones insides work so that's an
example of the different kinds of Minds
there working together and I discussed
that in detail in my book uh the
autistic brain and when it gets to
autism little bit of autism gives you a
brilliant artist or a programmer too
much of the trait and you get a very
very severe
handicap okay so what are the
misconceptions that people have about
autism Temple well the problem you got
with autism now and doctors keep
changing the diagnostic label autistic
diagnosis and other kinds of Behavioral
diagnosis these are behavioral profiles
they're half based in science and half
based on squabbles in conference rooms
now nobody sits around a conference room
squabbling over how to diagnose
tuberculosis that it's got very specific
laboratory tests that you do so over the
years they kept changing it it used to
be that in order to be labeled autistic
the kid had to have speech delay obvious
speech delay and be socially awkward and
not want not very good socially MH then
in the early 90s they added aspers no
speech delay but a kid socially awkward
now today and they put them both
together so now you have this huge
Spectrum going from guys that ought to
be working in Silicon Valley that gifted
students the kids that can't dress
themselves and it all has the same name
and I'm seeing bad situations where I
see a smart kid that maybe ought to be
in a gifted class ended up put in a
special ed classroom with non-verbal
kids that that aren't potty trained well
that's not going to help that kid go
places people get too hung up on the
labels and not enough hung up on what
the kid can do I noticed a lot in the
questions today you always went back
continuously what is he good at what is
she good
at I also find in talking to parents and
teachers people overgeneralize they'll
say something like what do I do about
autistic behavior in the classroom well
I don't know if a child's three and not
talking I can give you a standard answer
there but once I get older I got to know
a lot more about the kid what kind of
problem is he having in a classroom
there's a tendency when you think in
words to very much
oversimplify and kids that have learning
to differes that are successful are
often good at one thing and really bad
at something else I was good at drawing
and that was always encouraged that
became the basis of my design career I
couldn't do algebra and the mistake that
was made in my education is I wasn't
jump to Geometry because I'm seeing a
pattern over and over again case they
can't do Algebra can do geometry well
then let him do geometry let them do
trig even sometimes calculus I'm seeing
two many visual thinkers getting held
back by the algebra barrier so how did I
manag to get through college well in 67
educational fat at the time was finite
math which is probabilities Matrix and
statistics and with tutoring I got
decent grades in that but I'm seeing
smart kids ought to go into something
like industrial design or maybe auto
mechanics or something like that being
screened out because they haven't passed
algebra you do not need algebra for
those subjects yeah that's a good point
do you have advice for parents of
children on the autism spectrum or
teachers and who they work with those
children what would be your advice to
them
it's a pretty general question that's
pretty general question what would you
what would you hope that those teachers
would understand all right let's just
start with Elementary School teachers
always encourage the area of strength
you know one thing I do not like seeing
is you got a third grader that's really
smart in math and you make him do little
baby math and now he's support his
behavior problem now that kid may need
some tutoring and reading but if that
kid can do sixth grade math or even high
school math let him do it and I got into
an argument one time with with a
principal that says well if we let him
do that he'll have nothing to do in high
school oh let him do college classes
online in high school then why are you
holding them back so go work on the
strength work on the work on the
strengths and so you might have a kid
and this is another profile that happens
quite often a pattern thinker um in
third or fourth grade that maybe ought
to be doing high school maybe high
school math but he may have trouble with
reading and he may need help with
reading
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