The Draghi report – what’s next?

Summary

The discussion revolves around the Draghi report on European competitiveness, which has been highly anticipated and recently published. The report advocates for increased EU borrowing and investment, aligning with French sovereignist views. It addresses the need for strategic autonomy, green transition, and digitalization, proposing significant changes like leveraging private investments through public funding. The conversation also touches on the report's potential impact on policy, including state aid, competition, digitalization, and the Capital Markets Union. The participants express both optimism and skepticism about the report's ability to drive change in the EU's economic strategy.

Takeaways

• 📜 The Draghi report is considered historic due to the anticipation and buzz surrounding its release, but its impact on policy remains uncertain.
• 💡 The report emphasizes the need for increased EU borrowing and a larger EU budget to fund strategic investments, aligning with French sovereignist views.
• 🌐 It calls for a balance between national fiscal consolidation and EU production, strategic autonomy, decarbonization, and digitalization.
• 💼 Draghi's personal credibility and the backing of the European Commission lend weight to the report's proposals, making debate on them inevitable.
• 💡 The report suggests leveraging private investments through public funding mechanisms, such as guarantees or co-financing, to stimulate economic activity.
• 🔄 There's a push for deregulation, especially in the context of climate policy, with Draghi highlighting the EU's over-regulation compared to the US.
• ♻️ Decarbonization is presented as a means to enhance competitiveness, with a notable emphasis on the need for more nuclear energy and funding for related projects.
• 🚫 The report does not delve into specific technologies like blockchain or tokenization, indicating a gap in addressing modern financial technologies.
• 🌐 There's a strategic shift towards smaller, targeted trade agreements rather than large-scale free trade agreements, reflecting a change in EU trade policy.
• 📉 The report criticizes the Carbon Border Adjustment Mechanism (CBAM) for its complexity and potential to undermine European industries' competitiveness.

Q & A

What is the main focus of the Draghi report discussed in the transcript?

The Draghi report focuses on European competitiveness, with a strong emphasis on the need for increased EU borrowing and investment to address issues such as decarbonization, digitalization, and strategic autonomy.

Why was the Draghi report delayed according to the discussion?

The report was delayed likely because it includes a call for more EU borrowing, which could have been a difficult sell for Ursula von der Leyen at the start of her second mandate, as it would require approval from member states.

What is the significance of the 800 billion in additional investment mentioned in the transcript?

The 800 billion in additional investment represents the amount needed annually, which is about 5% of GDP, to address the EU's competitiveness and is deemed impossible to find through private funding alone.

How does the Draghi report suggest leveraging private investments?

The report suggests leveraging private investments by providing guarantees or co-financing from public funds, referencing the Juncker plan as a positive example of such a program.

What is the report's stance on nuclear energy and its role in competitiveness?

The Draghi report highlights the need for more nuclear energy, tackling a political taboo in some member states, and sees it as a vehicle for competitiveness.

How does the Draghi report address the issue of overregulation in the EU?

The report criticizes the EU's overregulation, pointing out the high number of regulations passed compared to the US, and suggests a need for deregulation, particularly in areas like climate policy.

What is the report's perspective on targeted trade agreements versus large-scale free trade agreements?

The Draghi report suggests a shift towards smaller, targeted trade agreements in specific sectors, recognizing the challenges in concluding large-scale free trade agreements.

How does the report envision the use of the EU budget to fund European public goods?

The report sees the EU budget as a vital tool for funding European public goods, advocating for a significantly larger, more efficient, and targeted budget financed through consistent borrowing at the European level.

What are the implications of the Draghi report for state aid and competition policy?

The report suggests significant shifts in state aid policy, such as funding commercially available technologies, and introduces the concept of an 'innovation defense' in merger cases, which could alter the implementation of competition policy.

Why isn't blockchain technology mentioned as part of the technologies to unlock private investments in the report?

The transcript suggests that industry advocacy has not effectively placed blockchain on the EU's political agenda, and the report focuses on more traditional methods of mobilizing investments without delving into newer technologies like blockchain.

Outlines

00:00

📜 Introduction to the Eurostar Announcement and Discussion on the Draghi Report

The video script begins with an introduction to a discussion on the Eurostar announcement and the Draghi report. The speaker, D. Marova, sets the stage for an analysis of the report on European competitiveness, which was published just a few hours prior. Marova invites colleagues Chris and Gerge to provide their initial thoughts on the report's significance. The report is characterized as historic due to the anticipation surrounding it, but its potential for making a lasting impact is still uncertain. The conversation highlights the report's alignment with pro-integrationist and French sovereignist views, as well as its call for increased EU borrowing, which was a contentious issue that likely contributed to the report's delayed release.

05:02

🔄 Historical Document and Its Impact on European Competitiveness

In this segment, the discussion delves into whether the Draghi report is truly historic or merely repetitive. Chris suggests that while the document is historic in the sense that it has generated significant buzz and anticipation, its potential to bring about substantial change is less clear. The report is seen as a collection of long-standing ideas, with a focus on increasing EU borrowing to address issues like national fiscal consolidation, EU production, strategic autonomy, decarbonization, and digitalization. The conversation also touches on the report's emphasis on the need for a larger and more efficient EU budget, which could serve as a tool for funding strategic initiatives and providing a European safe asset for capital markets.

10:02

🚀 Leveraging Public and Private Investment to Boost European Competitiveness

The third paragraph focuses on the report's proposals for leveraging public and private investment to enhance European competitiveness. The discussion centers on the need for an additional 800 billion in annual investment, which is deemed unattainable through private funding alone. The report advocates for increased public investment, referencing the Juncker plan and its variants, which involve using public funds to guarantee or co-finance private investments. The conversation also explores the report's suggestions for rethinking EU spending and the potential for EU borrowing to finance a larger and more strategic EU budget, which could also strengthen the Capital Markets Union.

15:03

⚡ Pushing for Nuclear Energy and Deregulation in the Draghi Report

This section of the script discusses the report's stance on nuclear energy and deregulation as means to bolster competitiveness. The report's advocacy for increased nuclear energy production is highlighted as a significant and politically challenging move, given the taboo nature of this topic in some member states. Additionally, the conversation points out the report's critique of over-regulation by the EU commission and its call for a reduction in regulatory burden, which is seen as a natural pause in the creation of new legislation and a shift towards refining existing rules and guidelines.

20:05

🌐 Trade Strategy and the EU's Competitive Dynamics

The focus of this paragraph is on trade strategy and how the Draghi report envisions the EU's competitive dynamics in the global market. The discussion highlights the report's nuanced approach to trade, suggesting a shift from broad free trade agreements to more targeted sector-specific agreements. This approach is seen as a response to the EU's changing trade landscape, with an emphasis on critical sectors like cloud technology, electric vehicles, and the import of critical minerals. The conversation also touches on the challenges of implementing such targeted agreements and the need for a more strategic approach to trade policy.

25:05

💡 The Role of the Draghi Report in Shaping the EU's Economic Policy Agenda

The final paragraph of the script addresses the potential influence of the Draghi report on the EU's economic policy agenda, particularly in relation to the mission letters that will be issued to Commissioners. The report is expected to feature prominently in these mission letters, as it outlines a comprehensive set of proposals that align with the political guidelines of the new term. The conversation suggests that while some elements of the report, such as common borrowing, may not be immediately adopted, the overall direction it provides will likely shape the EU's approach to economic policy, including areas like digital policy, financial services, and capital markets.

Keywords

💡Draghi Report

The Draghi Report, named after its author Mario Draghi, is a significant document that discusses European competitiveness. It is central to the video's theme as it sets the agenda for economic policy in the EU. The report is described as 'historic' due to the anticipation and impact it carries, with proposals that could reshape the EU's economic strategy.

💡European Competitiveness

European competitiveness refers to the ability of the European economy to compete effectively on the global stage. It is a core theme of the video, with the Draghi Report aiming to enhance this by proposing increased EU borrowing, integration, and strategic autonomy.

💡EU Borrowing

EU borrowing is a concept discussed in the Draghi Report as a means to finance additional investments needed for the EU's economic strategy. It is a critical element in the video's discussion, with the report suggesting that national fiscal consolidation should be accompanied by increased borrowing at the EU level.

💡National Fiscal Consolidation

National fiscal consolidation refers to the process of reducing budget deficits and stabilizing public finances at the national level. It is mentioned in the video as a goal that needs to be balanced with other objectives like increased EU production and strategic autonomy.

💡Green Transition

The green transition, also known as decarbonization, is the shift towards a more sustainable and environmentally friendly economy. It is highlighted in the video as one of the key objectives of the Draghi Report, emphasizing the need for quick action to combat climate change.

💡Digitalization

Digitalization is the process of converting information into digital formats and the integration of digital technologies into various sectors. It is discussed in the video as a critical area where Europe needs to catch up to maintain competitiveness, with the Draghi Report suggesting strategies to boost digital innovation.

💡Capital Markets Union (CMU)

The Capital Markets Union is a plan to create a single market for capital in the EU, aiming to mobilize private investment. It is mentioned in the video as a tool that needs to be improved and leveraged to support the EU's economic goals, with the Draghi Report proposing ways to enhance its effectiveness.

💡State Aid

State aid refers to financial assistance given by governments to support certain industries or companies. In the video, the Draghi Report's impact on state aid policy is discussed, particularly in relation to funding for innovation and commercially available technologies.

💡Public-Private Partnerships

Public-Private Partnerships (PPPs) involve collaborations between government agencies and private companies to finance and operate services and projects. The video discusses how PPPs could be used to stimulate investment and innovation, aligning with the Draghi Report's recommendations.

💡Decarbonization

Decarbonization is the process of reducing the amount of greenhouse gases produced, particularly carbon dioxide, to combat climate change. The video highlights the Draghi Report's emphasis on decarbonization as a means to enhance competitiveness, with specific mentions of nuclear energy and the need for a reevaluation of regulations.

💡Regulation and Deregulation

Regulation refers to the rules and policies set by governments to control business practices, while deregulation is the reduction of these regulations to stimulate economic activity. The video discusses the Draghi Report's critique of over-regulation in the EU and its call for a more balanced approach to foster competitiveness.

Highlights

Introduction to the Eurostar announcement and the Draghi report on European competitiveness.

Discussion on whether the Draghi report is historic or repetitive, with anticipation of its consequences.

Analysis of the report's alignment with French sovereignist lines and the call for more EU borrowing.

Expectations from the report and its potential to drive National fiscal consolidation alongside EU production and strategic autonomy.

Draghi's proposal for significant scaling up of borrowing on the European level and the transformation of the EU budget.

The report's emphasis on the need for additional investment and the role of public investment in stimulating private spending.

Critique of the EU's over-regulation and Draghi's call for a more efficient and targeted EU budget.

Decarbonization as a vehicle for competitiveness and its impact on the political and economic landscape.

The report's stance on nuclear energy and the political challenges it presents for member states.

Discussion on the potential for the report to influence the deregulation agenda and reduce red tape around climate frameworks.

Insights on trade policy, with a focus on targeted agreements and the treatment of sectors where Europe has lost competitive advantage.

The report's implications for competition policy, including potential changes to state aid and merger guidelines.

Digital policy recommendations and their potential to impact Europe's position as a global tech hub.

The report's call for an EU-US partnership on data access and cloud infrastructure as a strategic move.

The influence of the Draghi report on the upcoming mission letters for Commissioners and its role in shaping economic policy.

The absence of blockchain and tokenization in the report's discussion on mobilizing private investments.

The report's critique of the Carbon Border Adjustment Mechanism (CBAM) and its stance on free allowances.

Final thoughts on the report's comprehensive impact and the upcoming discussions with stakeholders across various sectors.

Transcripts

Dear Chris dear G hello hello to

everyone else who's just joining us or

perhaps jumping over from the other uh

client Coes did uh I'm going to do the

Eurostar announcement this is the call

for the dragy report if you do not want

to listen to the drag report then you're

on the wrong please get off uh but

indeed we'll give our audience a minute

more and we'll start with our immediate

takes on Mario drag report on European

in competitiveness which um all of you D

dialing in would know was published just

3 4 hours ago um in uh by the commission

um and I'm joined today by my colleagu

gry pner and Chris Glo for their uh

quick takes on the report uh my name is

d marova i lead our Tech and digital

assets

practice okay I think we have the Quorum

um so I'm going to start from a very

obvious uh Place uh first with Chris and

then with gerge I would just like to

know your very quick takes on the report

is it historic or is it repetitive Chris

starting with

you yeah thank you de um it's definitely

an historic uh document not least

because we will for years remember all

the buzz around the dragy report and

waiting it waiting for it for months and

months to be uh published will it be

historic in its consequences is uh a

much more difficult question to answer

um I think we collectively

expected um a lot of what's in the

report uh it was always going to be a

pro-

integrationist um uh proposal very close

to the French sovereignist lines it was

always going to include a call for more

EU borrowing that's probably the reason

um almost certainly the reason why it

was postponed for so long uh ferine did

not want to start into her mandate

promising new e borrowing um that would

have been a bit difficult sell for her

second mandate uh getting the approval

from member states so it's quite obvious

how much he picked up certain points in

the druggy report but has refrained from

the borrowing question which is really

front and center in the report and in

that sense it is pretty much old news um

it's a a collection of ideas that have

been around for a long time um and dragy

is basically just confronting everyone

with his analysis of the situation

saying that obvious problem that we have

in Europe that on the one hand we want

to see National fiscal consolidation on

the other hand we want to see um more EU

production uh and EU strategic autonomy

and on the third uh the third objective

of uh achieving a quick

decarbonization as he calls it green

transition as the commission typically

calls it and digitalization all of this

can't work at the same time we need to

find uh somehow compromises in between

it and his argument is very

straightforward if there's not enough

investment capacity at the national

level it needs to be sitting on the

European level and we need to

significantly scale up borrowing on the

European level the EU budget needs to

become a much more important tool but

also a more efficient tool and a more

targeted tool that's front and center in

his report it's not an old argument but

him making the argument matters because

of his personal credibility and because

fondon stands behind his proposals so it

will be almost impossible for EU leaders

to avoid a debate on it whether it will

materialize depends a lot on how

economic circumstances change over the

next months years typically if an idea

is around it keeps being brought forward

every time there is a problem to be

tackled so at some point it might

materialize

but it doesn't feel like there's enough

of a crisis narrative at this point that

a report from dry alone would be

sufficient to get any big changes in the

EU

done indeed CH I I'll I'll get back to

you on the on the common borrowing

question in a moment um I'm curious to

hear um G's uh kind of RoR to what you

had to say uh but before I turn to G let

me just remind the audience that as

usual we've got a Q&A function please

copying your questions there I'll keep

an eye on it and I'll feed the questions

to all of us as they come in G what's

your take thank you there let me play

Devil's Advocate to to Chris and to the

general excitement in Brussels I think

there is an element of deja view here uh

which is hard to avoid every few years

there is a crisis in Brussels when the

realization hits how it's being left

behind in competitiveness and then

someone writes a report on what to do

about all this and then that the

situation gets usually a bit worse uh

some of the reports are outright uh

egregious failures like the the Lisbon

strategy was for example some of them go

slightly unnoticed and just fade into

the background now is it different this

time around um Chris mentioned some of

the key elements already I don't

disagree much um dragy has unique

credibility he has the ability to hold

prime minister's feet to the fire that

that others don't he was also willing to

spell out some difficult truths in this

report like the over regulation that the

commission has been doing over the past

years and he has the the carot which is

the joint

that thanks G I would say in some ways

IR right to me like dragy was empowered

to just name the elephant in the room

and say Basta like we can't we can't

keep going back to this conversation

about how we're logging behind without

putting our uh month mouths where our

money is is or our money where our

mouths are um on that Chris how does it

work using public money in order to

Kickstart private spending how does drag

imagine it working and do you think

that's realistic

well he starts by saying we need about

800 billion in additional investment

every year um which is of course a

massive amount uh about 5% of GDP in

additional investment spending every

year very difficult to to find that

amount of money and he says it's

impossible to find it in private funding

alone CMU is nice to have and he has a

number of proposals on how to make CMU

work better banking Union great to have

and he has a number of how to make it

work better but ultimately this in

itself won't be sufficient we need a big

step up in public

investment and when he's looking at

public Investments one of the programs

he's referencing positively is what was

once called the yunker pro the yunker

plan and then has uh taken various names

but the idea of uh leveraging private

Investments by either providing

guarantees out of Public Funding or

co-financing with Public Funding private

Investments that seems to be one of the

main programs that he'd like to see

ramped up and be supported with a lot

more funding from the European level and

interestingly he didn't do what many

people expected and said we need a

defense fund we need defense bonds but

rather he said we need to rethink How We

Do EU spending on the whole um we need

an EU budget that is significantly

larger

that EU budget cannot be financed out of

national contributions because we need

to see National consolidation of fiscal

uh budgets and therefore we need to see

borrowing for the EU Budget on the

European level at a consistent Pace um

and continuously and that will provide

the additional

financing for the EU budget to be

funding some of these programs but that

will also strengthen the capital markets

Union by providing a European safe asset

which can serve as a benchmark for

trading will strengthen

crossb uh trading crossb Investments uh

across Europe so it's a sort of um a

line of argument that he's I think

presented to EU leaders ever since his

time as ECB

president with a slightly slightly

stronger Focus this time on the EU

budget being used for the provision of

European public

goods thank thanks Chris we're having a

lot of questions trickling in around all

parts of the report deregulation green

agenda uh transport deviation um let me

um go to G now and talk about

decarbonization as dragy put said um is

a vehicle for competitiveness what

should we pay attention to around that

agenda what do you think is impactful

and both politically

feasible the most interesting element is

probably on nuclear energy he spells out

the need for more nuclear energy which

is which is logical but is again

tackling one of the difficult political

taboos that that some member states have

been unwilling to look at other than

looking at the the element of nuclear

energy I think all the all the ideas

nuclear energy as well are relatively

well known that are in the report uh

he's his points on ppas the use of ppas

uh his points on on the electricity

Market design his point on grid

development I don't think there is

anything significantly new that we

haven't seen before so if there's one

element to highlight is the political

push behind nuclear energy and the

funding for nuclear

energy and in in a response to an

audience question around this topic do

you think that the he's sufficiently

pushing the deregulation agenda around

the climate file so csle D

csrd um does he give the impetus for the

commission to review uh and and cut the

red tape around some of these

Frameworks it was interesting to see

dragy at the press conference with

felion highlighting that the EU has

passed 13,000 pieces of of of Regulation

I think over the last 10 years uh while

the US has passed 3,000 pieces of

Regulation um essentially highlighting

how the EU has been over regulating and

this is a recurring Topic in the report

as you say

um it comes very unnaturally to the

commission as we saw with the reporting

burden reduction to actually reduce

regulation because the commission thinks

in terms of new legislation just like

everyone in Brussels does so I have have

my doubts whether the draggy report

would make a difference I think in

general we are in this but it this is

relatively well known in this mandate

these next five years is not going to be

about creating new level one legislation

rather is going to be about all the

implementing rules the delegated acts

the implementing acts the guidelines the

questionnaires the FAQs that need to

come um at one count there are 800 that

need to be delivered over the next 5

years so I think the answer to your

question there is there is a natural

stop to new large scale acts uh as as

they happened over the previous mandate

and the focus will turn to to to the

implementing side of things which will

still be legislation just not level one

legislation Fair I think we see the same

for what is worth it do think we see the

same Trend in in other areas like

Financial Services digital Finance

digital um we've I'm going to jump to a

question on trade we have that I had for

you and we have from the audience as

well um my impression on what I found

interesting g go on trade was that dragy

seems to want to give the commission the

permission to be nuanced on trade he

says look it doesn't necessarily need to

be a problem

when we treat areas where the Europe

Europe has lost its competitive

advanture or never had it like cloud and

we treat that differently in terms of

economic trade policy like areas where

we have a nent sector which um foreign

subsidies might jeopardise like EV

vehicles um that stood out to me what

stood out to

you what stood out to me was this

admission some of a dynamic that we've

seen over over the last few years which

is that the big free trade agreements

whether that's with the mercosur whether

that's with Australia um whether that's

with India seem to be failing and

instead the strategy is Shifting towards

small targeted agreements in specific

sectors that seems to be the

implementation of what dragi has put in

his report although he did not spell

this out now it is relatively easy to

see how this will be implemented on the

on the import side the input

side uh Sy of the critical mineral

Partnerships where the EU wants to

create easier trade rules remove

barriers in trade in Inc Commodities

that the EU needs with resource rich

countries what is harder to see how are

these targeted agreements going to

help the EU companies to export to se

countries how are you going to be able

to

convince Brazil to reduce EV tariffs if

you can't offer instead the the carrot

of of you reducing tariffs on Brazilian

beef and Argentinian beef that's what I

struggle to see a

bit thanks G I am uh jumping around I

admit between audience questions and

topics of the report but just because

we're trying to cover 400 pages in in

half an hour so in the spirit of that I

will jump to competition again with you

gar um in we're going to have an idea

about the the new new V stagger um on

Wednesday um dragy will set sets up that

candidate for for a slight slight shift

in competition policy um what what were

your takeaways on that there are very

few there are a few very specific

elements in in the competition policy

space probably more specific than we

sold I think this might be one of the

surprises that one of the the the

questions is is asking um on the on the

state aid side I think it's important if

they change the uh important projects of

common European interest the IPC to be

able to to fund um not groundbreaking

Innovation but commercially available

technologies that would be a significant

resync of state aid policy in in Europe

if that does happen uh on the merger

side the the introduction of an

innovation defense would be significant

the drag is suggesting that companies

could argue that the merger would reduce

competition in Europe but it would lead

to the increase in Innovation uh hence

the merger should be allowed um this

doesn't mean that drag is suggesting to

amend the merger regulation which would

require unanimity but he does suggest

that the guidelines the commission

should change the guidelines around the

implementation of the merger regulation

so some quite significant shifts I think

in the way merger and state aid would be

administered thanks Greg I think

actually state aid specifically to some

extreme degree merger as well is a good

say into a question that we had on

digital um obviously the whole the whole

sort of Mantra of the report is that

Europe is lagging behind on particularly

on Tech particularly behind the US um so

there is there are several chapters that

would impact digital policy um the

question that we have is what do we find

surprising and what do we think of that

if I were to go first on this question

um I think the the set of

recommendations dragy has remind me a

lot of this exercise that many

individual member states and and other

countries around the world have gone

which is you know how are we going to

become a Global Tech Hub how are we

going to turn our country into a Silicon

Valley um I've always found these

strategies incredibly ineffective and

repetitive if you go through an exercise

around the world they kind of say the

same thing and I don't think that dragy

really deviates from that tradition I

think International experience shows

that the best vehicles to drive Tech in

to drive Innovation are either tax or

rather are tax and ease of doing

business anything else public spending

public private Partnerships sandboxes

these are cosmetic changes they're more

part of the marketing of a country or a

region or a union in our case to send

out to say hey we are open to Innovation

rather than things that if you speak to

entrepreneurs really make a difference

and I do think that for the most part

drag recommendations kind of follow in

these footsteps what I thought perhaps

was interesting possibly most effective

is when he

recommends um an EOP EU us partnership

around access to data and access to

Cloud infrastructure I thought that was

helpful uh helpful dep parture to away

from previous political Ambitions about

building European Cloud infrastructure

and to rival um the US providers I think

it is helpful to kind of again address

the elephant in the room and say

actually you know we don't have we don't

stand a chance to competing in this in

this um in this to compete in this in

this leg of the journey therefore

partnership perhaps is explicit

partnership is a better um

strategy um that's how I would answer

this question I don't know if any one of

you wants to add anything on the digital

side okay um I'll move on to

another

um audience question sorry I'm I'm just

jumping around um perhaps around

the perhaps around um actually it's more

a procedural question so uh we mentioned

that the there will be

um vwi CH for Commissioners announced on

Wednesday uh typically alongside that

we're going to see her Mission letters

will the dragy report be part of you

know help formulate these missions

letters Chris that sounds like a

question for

you yes and the answer is um the report

will very heavily feature in these

Mission letters the reason why it's

first been postponed for so long is

precisely because ferine intends to make

this her main economic policy agenda for

the next term um some of the ideas if we

reread now her political guidelines some

of these ideas already feature she

didn't spell out EO borrowing of course

at the time probably EO borrowing will

also not feature very heavily in the

mission letters but all of the other

proposals nearly 200 proposals or so um

are likely to be picked up in one way or

form as part of the mission letters uh

so that the timeline is no coincidence U

publication of the report on Monday so

the mission letters on Wednesday can

refer back uh to these proposals

thanks Chris um I'll pick up another

question which is uh um again speaks to

my bias I suppose about crypto and

blockchain in the report um I guess I'll

take a step so the question is why isn't

why isn't that technology part of the

technologies that are discussed um I

will probably take a step back and talk

firstly talk about well mentioned the

financial services private private

financing element of the report which we

haven't yet talked about right so as

Chris was saying earlier the idea of of

common borrowing is to then work hand

inand with the deepening of the capital

markets Union in order to mobilize

investment into into the EU that means

um unlocking retail Investments through

uh recommendations like deler to

pensions or Better Tax incentives for

Angel

Investments um a common supervision that

would be sort of having an

EUC uh that would be the the political

Hot Potato which digiso will no doubt

take up in their CMU strategy that they

have to write and no doubt a number of

or many member states will be opposed to

that um and then as part of it indeed

there is no mention of anything around

blockchain as technology or tokenization

as an approach um to um to unlocking

private Investments and and putting them

towards either B Bond or Equity markets

um it's not necessarily surprising we

didn't see any one of any any of these

Technologies mentioned in the letter

report either uh frankly I don't think

that industry advocacy has effectively

put those issues on the big political

agenda of the EU and even though within

industry digital assets industry circles

you can very quickly make the argument

between you know putting more funds in

the market or making retail investors

more active through things like

fractional bonds or fractional equities

we don't see neither Lea nor nor dragy

nor V liance cabinet be excited about

that idea so I think that there is still

more work to be done on the industry

part to get uh the new FS commissioner

um and the the com the the units digital

Finance units the capital markets units

kind of uh behind that idea as part of

the broader CMU strategy that would be

my

think let's see what else can we cover

in the five minutes that we

um have left will there be changes to

stock

exchanges Chris did you get to that part

or should iemp to

answer well I don't think he's gone into

that level of detail he's referenced

many of the existing proposals about

Capital markets Union from the common

pension product to um Reviving

securitization to front incenter for him

the common European supervisor but these

are all proposals that have already been

um around that have already been

discussed what I think is quite

interesting that there's been a bit of a

tradeoff between Capital markets Union

progress Capital markets Union

integration or EU borrowing in the

discussions at the European Council when

they discussed the upcoming mandate and

many including us have read the

German

um change of attitude towards CMU as

part of a concession giving in on CMU

integration giving in on more Central

supervision out of Paris an exchange for

not having to see too much grounds on

the question of common borrowing and

common investment and dragy kind of

elegantly does away with that argument

entirely and says CMU is sort of nice to

have but it won't work without common

borrowing um and common borrowing is

vital for any of our processes so it

doesn't necessarily strike me and that's

in some way maybe a surpris because he's

been spending the last 15 years arguing

for Capital markets integration uh it

doesn't strike me as a proposal that is

Reinventing the capital markets agenda

or is coming up with new ideas on

Capital markets um it's basically saying

what's out there is useful let's get it

done uh but it's not the the essential

part that needs to be

solved what I think Chris is that um

kind of drag sacrificed all of these

ideas that he probably has to slightly

bigger bigger Vision so he's basically

saying common Supervision in the EU

common borrowing from their onwards let

esma figure out how to um how to

consolidate the or how to coordinate the

EU IPO process such that is better

suited to high growth companies um let

as he says should have for example a

easier post- trade process a single

single CCP single CSD but but let the

common supervisor figure out the the

frictions that we currently have that we

typically talk around um CMU so I think

I think there's subordination of ideas

there uh rather than a lack of ideas

having quite a few questions around

transport did anybody get to that part

or has any either one of you or has any

quick takes in the remaining minutes

that we have G I think the carbon

element is important cbam and ETS and

it's important that the report

criticizes cbam and comes down on the

side of uh free allowances keeping free

allowances longer um and resyncing cbam

somewhat it says it's too complicated

and it doesn't ensure the

competitiveness of European Industries

now it's important indirectly from a

transport sector as well because if you

think of the joint borrowing one of the

key things the commission needs to do is

needs to find some own revenues and I

think all the focus so far has been on

carbon and Maritime and Aviation and

there's if you talk to the budget people

they think that the the the upside in

carbon revenues in own revenues would

come from Aviation and maritime druggy

criticizing

cbam and to some extent ETS probably is

is helpful from that perspective for for

those sectors who are a bit reluctant uh

to to contribute to

significantly uh to the to the carbon

revenues thank you g we have less than

60 seconds left so I'll will wrap up the

discussion here by saying um we will of

course still be digesting the report

particularly speaking to stakeholders to

understand how it will land in the

various sectors that we've had industry

audience questions on so across our

services we we'll be picking this up and

do please get in touch with the

respective teams for the specific um um

areas and of questioning that you had

hopefully we did we did Justice to a

sort of big new topic in a short amount

of time um and uh we'll be we we'll be

writing further we'll be in touch more

on this thank you Chris thank you g