From TikTok to the American Communist Party: Why Young Influencers Embrace Marxism
Summary
TLDRIn this thought-provoking discussion, Carlos Gitto, a Cuban American philosophy professor and Secretary of Education of the new American Communist Party, joins the Kim Iverson Show to explore the resurgence of communism among the youth. Addressing misconceptions, Gitto explains the ideological differences between socialism and communism, emphasizing communism's alignment with American ideals of democracy and people's governance. He challenges the notion of socialism as 'handouts' and argues for a society that serves the people, not capital accumulation, critiquing the parasitic practices of Wall Street and big corporations.
Takeaways
- 📈 The script discusses the rising popularity of communism among the youth, with social media influencers like Jackson Hinkle promoting it.
- 🗣️ Carlos Gitto, a Cuban American philosophy professor and Secretary of Education of the new American Communist Party, is introduced as a guest to provide insight into communism.
- 🏛️ Gitto argues that communism is misunderstood and often demonized in the media, especially on platforms like Fox News, where it is used as a slur.
- 🤔 The conversation aims to explore what communism aims to solve and how it believes it can solve societal problems, despite the host's skepticism.
- 🔄 Gitto explains the difference between socialism and communism, stating that socialism is a transitionary phase towards a communist society, with the latter being more aligned with the ideals of Marx and Engels.
- 🌐 The script touches on the global impact of American foreign policy, particularly its 'hybrid warfare' against nations that challenge its imperialist influence.
- 🏭 Gitto emphasizes the need for a strong state in socialism to defend against external threats and to develop the economy for the benefit of the people.
- 💡 The idea that socialism is a logical extension of American ideals, promoting a government that is truly of, by, and for the people, is presented.
- 👥 The script criticizes the control of big money interests over the U.S. government, suggesting that politicians are more responsive to donors than to citizens.
- 💰 It points out the disparity between the wealth accumulation by a small elite and the struggles of the working class, describing the former as a parasitic culture.
- 🏴 Gitto connects his patriotism to his support for communism, arguing that it is the most faithful way to realize American ideals and create a society that serves all its members.
Q & A
What is the main argument Carlos Gito presents about communism and its relation to American ideals?
-Carlos Gito argues that communism is not a break from American ideals but rather a fulfillment of them. He believes that socialism and communism align with the progressive traditions of America, which emphasize a government of, by, and for the people.
How does Carlos Gito differentiate between socialism and communism?
-Carlos Gito sees socialism as a transitionary period towards communism. While socialism still involves a state and the concept of 'from each according to their ability, to each according to their work,' communism is the end goal where the state withers away as it becomes unnecessary, and society operates on the principle of 'from each according to their ability, to each according to their needs.'
What does Carlos Gito believe is the role of the state in a socialist society?
-In a socialist society, according to Carlos Gito, the state is qualitatively different and serves the interests of the working class and the people. It's a period where the people have control over the state, its institutions, culture, education, and economy to overcome capitalist obstacles and promote development.
Why does Carlos Gito think that socialism is misunderstood and demonized in the United States?
-Carlos Gito suggests that socialism is misunderstood and demonized because of the vested interests of the capitalist class who control the narrative through media, education, and politics. They have an interest in maintaining the current system and perpetuating myths about socialism to prevent a shift towards a society that serves the people rather than capital accumulation.
How does Carlos Gito respond to the criticism that communism leads to poverty?
-Carlos Gito counters the criticism by pointing to historical examples of rapid development and improved living standards in socialist countries. He cites the USSR's industrialization, the increase in life expectancy in China, and China's economic growth as evidence that socialism can lead to prosperity.
What does Carlos Gito say about the role of investment and lending in a socialist or communist society?
-Carlos Gito believes that lending and investment can still exist in a socialist or communist society, but they should be directed towards productive ends that serve society, such as developing industry, housing, and businesses, rather than for speculative purposes or to enrich a few individuals.
How does Carlos Gito view the current financial industry's practices of making money from money?
-Carlos Gito is critical of the financial industry's practices of making money from money, which he equates to usury. He sees this as a parasitic practice that does not contribute to the productive economy and is against the principles of socialism and communism.
What is Carlos Gito's stance on private property within a socialist or communist framework?
-Carlos Gito does not advocate for the complete abolition of private property but rather the restructuring of society so that private property and capital serve the interests of society as a whole, rather than society serving the interests of capital accumulation.
How does Carlos Gito connect the ideals of the American founding fathers to socialism and communism?
-Carlos Gito connects the ideals of the American founding fathers to socialism and communism by emphasizing the principles of democracy, equality, and the pursuit of happiness for all. He argues that these ideals are best realized in a socialist or communist society where the government and economy work for the benefit of all people.
What does Carlos Gito think about the portrayal of communism in American media and education?
-Carlos Gito criticizes the portrayal of communism in American media and education as misleading and biased. He suggests that this portrayal is part of a larger effort to maintain the status quo and prevent the American people from considering alternative systems that could better serve their interests.
Outlines
📚 The Resurgence of Communism Amongst Youth
The video script begins by addressing the growing popularity of communism among the youth, particularly with social media influencers like Jackson Hinkle endorsing it and announcing the formation of the American Communist Party. The speaker expresses skepticism towards communism but is open to learning more. The guest, Carlos, a Cuban American philosophy professor and Secretary of Education for the new American Communist Party, is introduced. Carlos discusses the misunderstanding and demonization of communism and clarifies the difference between socialism and communism, emphasizing that he identifies as a communist because it aligns with the principles of Marx and Engels and supports the projects of 20th-century socialism.
🏛️ The Distinction Between Socialism and Communism
Carlos explains that while some people in the U.S. self-identify as socialists, often referring to themselves as democratic socialists, they tend to reject the traditions of 20th-century communism. He asserts that he identifies as a communist because it is the most faithful tradition to Marx and Engels' thought and supports the socialist projects of the 20th century, such as those in the Soviet Union, China, and Cuba. Carlos also discusses the transitional nature of socialism as a step towards a communist society, where the working class controls the state and its institutions to overcome capitalist obstacles and promote development.
🛡️ The Role of the State in Socialism and Communism
Carlos addresses the misconception that socialism and communism are about handouts, emphasizing that the principle is 'from each according to their ability, to each according to their work.' He argues against the parasitic nature of the current economic system, where a small group accumulates wealth without contributing to society. Carlos highlights the need for a strong state in socialism to defend the gains of the people's revolution and to battle against external forces that threaten the progress made towards a more equitable society.
🏳️🦱 The Intersection of American Ideals and Socialism
Carlos argues that socialism is not a break from American ideals but rather an extension of them, citing the slogan 'communism is 20th-century Americanism.' He suggests that true democracy and government 'of the people, by the people, for the people' as envisioned by the founding fathers is only achievable through socialism. Carlos criticizes the current U.S. government for being controlled by big corporations and financial interests, which he believes is antithetical to American values.
🤔 Challenging the Myths About Socialism and Communism
Carlos encourages a critical examination of the narratives surrounding socialism and communism, suggesting that many of the negative perceptions are propagated by those with vested interests in maintaining the status quo. He points out that the American people's ideals are more aligned with socialism than any other nation, and that the rapid development periods in human history have occurred under socialist governments, such as the USSR, China, and Cuba, debunking the myth that socialism leads to poverty.
💼 The Parasitic Culture of Capitalism
The discussion turns to the 'parasitic culture' within capitalism, where individuals and groups, such as Wall Street bankers and investors, profit immensely without contributing to society's productive forces. Carlos criticizes the focus on stock buybacks and the accumulation of capital for the benefit of a few, rather than investing in the development of the economy and infrastructure. He calls for a systemic change to prioritize the interests of the nation, traditional values, families, and the working class.
💡 The Purpose of Investment in a Socialist System
Carlos explains that in a socialist system, lending and investment would still exist but would be focused on productive activities that serve society, rather than speculative practices that only benefit a select few. He emphasizes the importance of using resources for the development of the real economy and supporting small businesses, aligning with the interests of the people and the nation's well-being.
Mindmap
Keywords
💡Communism
💡Socialism
💡Democratic socialism
💡Capitalism
💡State
💡American Communist Party
💡Marxism
💡De-industrialization
💡Hybrid Warfare
💡Parasitism
💡Usury
Highlights
Communism is gaining popularity among the youth, with social media influencers like Jackson Hinkle promoting it.
The American Communist Party was announced, aiming to address misunderstandings and negative perceptions of communism.
Carlos Gito, a Cuban American philosophy professor, discusses the goals and methods of communism as part of the new American Communist Party.
Gito argues that socialism is a transitional stage towards a communist society, differing from Democratic socialism in its acceptance of 20th-century communist practices.
Communists view socialism as a period where the working class controls the state to overcome capitalist production obstacles.
Gito emphasizes the need for a strong state in socialism to defend against foreign policy attacks and promote economic development.
The discussion explores the breakdown of democracy in the U.S., with big money interests controlling the government instead of representing the people.
Gito claims that socialism aligns with American ideals, promoting a government that is truly of, by, and for the people.
The conversation challenges the notion that socialism equates to handouts, emphasizing the importance of work and contribution to society.
Gito discusses the historical achievements of socialist countries, such as rapid development and increased life expectancy, countering the idea that socialism leads to poverty.
The interview addresses the parasitic nature of certain financial practices, such as stock buybacks, that do not contribute to economic development.
Gito argues for a reevaluation of socialism and communism, suggesting that common criticisms are based on misinformation propagated by vested interests.
The discussion highlights the potential for a socialist system to promote small businesses and support economic growth that benefits society as a whole.
Gito envisions a socialist society where individuals have more property, wealth, and free time to pursue creative and fulfilling activities.
The conversation concludes by emphasizing the need for critical examination of both historical and contemporary portrayals of socialism and communism.
Transcripts
communism amongst the youth in
particular seems to be gaining in
popularity we're seeing some popular
social media influencers like Jackson
Hinkle embracing communism and even
announcing the beginning of the American
Communist party now when you talk to
Communists they always tell you that
it's misunderstood and demonized which
we watch that on Fox news they kind of
label everything Marxism this Marxism
that they use it as a slur so tonight
we're going to dive into it a bit and
we're going to find out what problems
communism aims to solve
how they believe they can solve them um
I personally am highly skeptical of
Communism and I don't believe it works
but I'm willing to hear them out and I'm
always willing to learn so we're going
to be joined tonight by Carlos gito
Carlos is an a Cuban American philosophy
Professor he's the director of the
midwestern marks Institute and the
Secretary of Education of the new
American Communist party which was
announced like I mentioned by Jackson
Hinkle um he has authored many books
including last year's the Purity fetish
and the crisis of Western Marxism and
most recently why we need American
Marxism which is what we're going to be
talking about tonight so very interested
in that conversation he's written for
dozens of scholarly and popular
Publications around the world he runs a
weekly live broadcast for the midwestern
marks Institute on YouTube he's got a
substack very knowledgeable on the
subject matter tonight so we're going to
dive in Carlos welcome to the show thank
you so much for being here than thank
you so much for inviting me Kim it's a
pleasure to be here okay so uh you are a
communist is that fair to say yes yes
okay because sometimes I'll say are I'll
ask somebody if they're a communist they
say no no I'm a socialist can you first
explain the difference between socialism
and
communism um well you're absolutely
right uh it's a label I I wear on my
sleeve I think a lot of the people that
call themselves socialist specifically
within the context of the US uh they're
what they self-proclaim as Democratic
socialists which for me it's a
Superfluous qualifier for socialism I
consider social socialism to be itself a
society far more democratic than the one
that we are used to living in uh the
Socialists therefore usually call
themselves that because they reject the
tradition of 20th century communism and
often the tradition of 21st century
socialism I call myself a communist
because I think that it's the
uh the most U faithful and tradition
that inherits uh the thought of Mars and
Engles and I support the uh projects of
20th century socialism like Soviet Union
China Cuba Vietnam
Etc okay so would you say because some
people would think that socialism is
just the precursor to Communism it's
communism light it's just the pathway
and you say that no the social people
that call themselves socialists actually
reject communism they're not their
intention is not not to it's not a
stepping
stone well for us Communists socialism
is a transitionary period uh towards a
communist Society um but for the people
that call themselves socialists uh the
main distinction that's at play is
whether they accept or condemn uh the
reality of 20th century
communism okay so what is it that what
is so then give me why is socialism the
intermediary what from your perspective
what is it what's the step from where
we're at right now with capitalism to
socialism and then what would be the
steps from socialism to
Communism well um I think primarily we
have to understand that the only place
where marks and Engles ever sit down and
say communism is is when they say that
communism is the real movement of
history that abolishes the present state
of things so um for us socialism is this
intermediate step where you still have
uh the reality of a state it's not the
same state you have before in the US
when socialism is invoked people's mind
goes to more State less State and it's
not a quantitative question it's a
qualitative one um socialism is a period
where the working classes the popular
the the people basically are the ones
that have over have control over the
state it's uh institutions its cultural
apparatus education the economy Etc that
use it in order to overcome the feds or
the obstacles that the capitalist
relations of production place on
development I mean today we're seeing a
capitalist economies all over the world
spiral into de-industrialization
promoting specifically degrowth and the
wef agenda socialism comes in as a stage
that unleashes uh the forces of
production our productive capacities
that brings about Innovation and that is
cognizant of the fact that because it's
still in process they are going to be
lingering contradictions of the past
specifically in Social States the
necessity to have to battle against the
hybrid Warfare that American foreign
policy has waged on anyone who dares to
escape their imperialist uh grip and
this requires a strong State you know we
have an ideal of uh you know the state
itself withering away when it becomes
Superfluous uh but that's uh very very
far down the line and the focus now has
to be on developing the economy and
developing an efficient uh not very
bureaucratic strong state that can
defend the people's gains and the
people's Revolution from attacks from
foreign forces that do not have of
course the interest of those people at
heart but the interest of a select few
of uh of of the capitalist class who
hold as Supreme the accumulation of
capital or of Bankers who uh only want
to see those little numbers in their
computers go up right okay explain how
that is any different than what the
founding fathers envisioned so um I
understand now how we're in a we you
know we're definitely in a crisis in
this country where we do have the big
money interests that are in control of
the government so that is becoming more
and more obvious to people where the the
politicians you know the political class
the people in government they're not
actually working on behalf of the
American people anymore they don't care
about what we think they just do what
Their donors tell them to do and we're
seeing this infiltration in our
government uh well it's been there for a
while but it's becoming more obvious I
think people are pointing it out more
like the influence of Israel and the
Israel Lobby on the United States
government how they're just doing
anything and everything for this foreign
Middle Eastern country rather than
what's best for the American people
we've got crumbling infrastructure we've
got homelessness we have an opioid
crisis we've got all of these terrible
things happening people riddled in debt
uh people living paycheck to paycheck
we've got all these problems uh and our
you and our political leaders they just
care about creating more war you've got
Lindsey Graham you know on Fox News
every day U war war it's a beautiful
sight to see I love war basically is
what he's proclaiming Nick Haley signing
bombs you've got all so there's
definitely now this breakdown though a
lot of people will point to the
breakdown and they'll say this happened
with the creation of the FED in 1910
1917 around that in the 1910s they'll
say then
that uh it furthered with like citizens
united where we allowed the the flooding
of money into the political system that
taking us off the gold standard was
another one and allowing the banks to
just print endless amounts money that
there were these things that happened in
the 20th century where you know a series
of events throughout those hundred years
that have led us to where we are today
but prior to that point people would say
that America was was maybe run more by
the people that it was you know we've
seen this co-opting happen but prior to
that you know when you look at the
founding fathers and their vision for
America now obviously things were not
perfect because we still had slavery and
three fifths of people and you know
whatever but taking but with all of that
then being reversed people being the you
know a democratic people and a federal
republic that the idea is that the
people and the states would then run
they were the people would be the ones
making the decisions not the people
necessarily on a federal level because
we are a federal republic so the States
run the feds the federal government but
on a state level on a local level the
idea is the individuals the citizens
would vote and have control over their
representatives if we don't like the
representatives we vote them out we
replace them we could vote on
referendums we can you know make
decisions and that would be the people
controlling the government and not the
government being controlled by these big
money interests so how would you say
socialism as an ideology as you've
explained it how that's any different
than the idea of democracy from the
founding father's perspective
while you've hit the nail on the head
Kim the way that we refer to it is that
socialism communism is americanism in
our current uh conjuncture and that was
a slogan that the Communist Party the
old one when it was actually communist
put forth in the 20th century they said
communism is 20th century americanism
and one of the things that I paused in
the new book and that has been Central
for the line of Marxism leninism that we
uphold is that if you're faithful to the
ideals of
1776 if you're faithful to the ideals
uttered by uh Abraham Lincoln in the
Gettysburg Address of government of buy
and for the people you cannot be in
favor of what we have right now which is
government of buy and for big
corporations investment firms like Black
Rock and State Street and big Banks uh
if you want actual government of buy and
for the people and I think this isn't a
very radical idea it's something that
most Americans accept as common sense
and they identify with what it means to
be American I'm sorry but our position
is that it's only really socialism that
can accomplish that that can make it
real that could give it some form of
actuality for us therefore socialism is
not a break with the traditions of the
American ideals on the contrary it's uh
the making explicit of something that
has always been implicit in the ideals
upon which this country was founded and
in that sense we break completely with
the entity that calls itself the left in
the US which is deeply anti-American
they look at the the evil parts of
America slavery you know the treatment
of the uh Native populations the
imperialist wars of the 20th century and
they get that one component of this
larger hole they reduce the larger hole
to this one component and that is
fundamentally for us a form of thinking
that is anti-marxist marxists are are
able to think uh of the world in the
processes in which it existed and if the
world has contradictions we have to T
with those we have to engage with those
and the reality is that America like
every other nation is shaped by these
struggles by these opposite polls polls
that do very good things like fight
against slavery fight against
imperialism fight for workers rights and
polls that do the complete opposite and
this tension this Dynamic this dialectic
is Central to what it means uh to be
America and I think that the progressive
poll is the one that defines America
more so than the poll that is uh being
left behind for me for instance uh
someone like Martin Luther King Jr is
far more American than the apide system
that he helped with the Civil Rights
Movement overthrow so you're absolutely
right for us these ideas are simply the
logical and practical conclusion of
having a faithful commitment to the
American
ideals okay but when people think of
socialism they think of
handouts so where does that come into
play is that something that's actually
in the theory of Socialism or is
socialism just the people choose the
people control the people decide and if
the people decide to do that and to
create systems of you know so socialized
systems or handout systems let's say I
don't know what term we want to use uh
then so be it but if they if the people
get together and they don't choose that
then they don't so be that too I mean
which is
it well it's definitely not handouts I
mean you can look at most of the leaders
of the 20th century communist movement
and quite explicitly you can find quotes
that if you don't work you don't eat now
of course there's people that for
reasons of being retired or disabled uh
there needs to be some sort of social
safety net there to help them out but if
you're a capable individual you have to
work and the motto in the stage of
socialism is from each according uh to
their capacity to each according to
their work you get what you work for and
I think that's a very American idea what
I am uh fully against is uh the
parasitism that we see in our current
conjuncture where a small group of
people who literally do no work who
produce nothing uh valuable for society
take all the loot and keep us all
immiserated in debt slavery with debts
will'll never be able to pay off that is
not only unamerican but in a very common
sense uh form it's it's the downfall of
civilization itself all throughout
civilization when debts that weren't
able to be paid back were accured they
simply just weren't paid back and the
situation that we're in is H one that I
think the vast majority of Americans
agree is uh is not on the right track
and it's breaking with the ideals that
they they consider to be common sense uh
look we have to realize that the same
class the same people whose interest it
was to lie to us about covid to lie to
us about the proxy war against Russia to
lie to us about Israel and about the
current situation in Palestine it's
these same people who control not only
the uh news media but who control the
education that were fed who control
what's told to us in history books who
control the Ed uh entertainment industry
and it's this same class of individual
ual who have a vested interest in making
the American people whose ideals are
more aligned with socialism than any
nation in the history of the planet and
this is not just me saying it lennin
himself admitted that the ideals of the
American Republic are the easiest to
transition into socialism because
socialism is already implicit in it but
it's this class that has completely
turned the world upside down uh uh lied
to you about everything and if we're the
sorts of individuals that can see how
they lie to us about Co Ukraine
Palestine Etc why wouldn't we extend
that critical lens if we know they have
a vested interest in line with us let's
examine examine critically what they
tell us about the history of Communism
let's examine critically what they tell
us about socialism and I think that what
we would find if we go to the theory
itself or if we go to the reality is
that the vast majority of things that
were told about communism and socialism
are myths are myths by people who have a
vested interest in US believing these
lies in order to continue buying into a
system that not only doesn't represent
the people but is fundamentally anti-am
American while using quotes from
previous American presidents and a sort
of super patriotism that is fully tongue
and cheek if you're a real Patriot if
you're someone who actually loves the
American people who identifies with the
progressive traditions of America I find
it very difficult for you not to be some
form of socialist or communist I myself
come to the position of being a
communist because I was a patriot
because I didn't like uh the sort of uh
wretched presence of affluence and and
despair and and and and poverty that was
available to me to see at a very young
age in South Florida it's that absurdity
that irrationality that uh develops a
strong patriotic sentiment in me from a
very young age and that naturally gets
translated into the idea that it's
really only communism a society that
serves Society itself where it's
actually Society of by and for the
people that aligns with my values as an
American that aligns with values that
uphold you know creating the conditions
so that every human being as individuals
can flourish in a harmonious
relationship with our nation with our
communities so it's we're lied to about
socialism because it's in the vested
interest of the same people that lie to
us about everything else to lie to us
about that they tell us socialism means
poverty well the three major advances in
the history of humanity have all been
from socialist countries it was the
period of collectivization in the USSR
uh that brought about at that moment the
fastest uh growth any country in human
history had ever seen and then uh you
have the period of the founding of the
People's Republic of China from 1949 to
78 in just 29 years life expectancy went
up 32 years so that means that every
single year the life expectancy of the
people went up by more than one year
human history had never seen anything
like that and then after that period in
the period of Reform and opening up from
17 1978 towards now we've seen the
largest and quickest development of uh
of the productive forces of of of
economic development in China that we've
ever seen in history so the three
quickest periods of development in human
history have come from communist
countries countries led by a Communist
Party how are you going to tell me that
socialism means poverty why because
small Cuba that's 90 miles away under
the nose of the US that has been
strangled by sanctions and a horrendous
uh blockade that has had all forms of
hybrid Warfare waged against it with
chemical warfare
waged against it with assassination
attempts on presidents uh with uh the
funding of through the color Revolution
doctrine of groups internally that can
descent against the government why
because Cuba's poor and it's a small
country that's blocked off by the whole
uh from the whole world by the US in a
way that the whole world condemns it now
we hold that socialism means poverty
absolutely not uh the countries that
have grown the most in human history
have been socialists and everything that
we're the major lies that we're told
about uh socialism are easily disproven
by both looking at what the leaders of
uh of of of Marxism Marx angles Lennon
Stalin mauo have said but also by
looking at the reality of 20th and 21st
century socialism yeah okay um I mean I
certainly have my my thoughts but I want
to I want to go back to something you
just said before we get more into the
ideology and breaking that down let's
get into the parasites that you're
talking about that are causing the issue
here in the United States So when you
say that there's this sort of parasitic
culture that is causing you know there's
the working class and then there's this
this other group what jobs in particular
how are these people you know what when
you're saying this who specifically are
you talking about are you talking about
like the Wall Street guys the bankers
the investors like which group of people
are making a lot of money off of not
doing
anything uh yeah Wall Street guys the
investors uh people in some people in
Silicon Valley like the sort of people
well Michael Hudson for instance in a in
a recent paper he mentioned that 92% of
the profits made by Fortune 500
companies a lot of which are American uh
are reinvested in stock BuyBacks right
this is not money that's being made and
used to develop the economy to fix our
crumbling infrastructure to build new
cities as China has done to fix our
crumbling cities this is money being
used to make money without producing
anything in between and uh this is the
sort of interest that controls
everything and the what little bit of
productive industry we have they also
own it they're shareholders and so it's
investment groups like Black Rock
Vanguard State Street and all the other
ones that the American people it doesn't
matter whether they consider themselves
to be on the right or left know about
now these are the people that control
our country its trajectory they decide
when we go to war who we go to war with
they decide if we export all productive
jobs over in order to pay workers abroad
Pennies on the dollar of what American
workers make they decide if our families
have to be burdened by debt because
someone dared to get an education or
because someone got sick and didn't have
insurance or because someone dared to
have something so crazy as a home for
their family then they have the audacity
often to speak about family values what
family values they push ideology in
schools that are fundamentally
individualistic and anti family and
anti-k kids often and then on the other
side they do economic everything
possible to destroy the material
Foundation upon which the uh security
and comfort of families would be
premised so it's it's it's a group of
people that is fundamentally
anti-American and as to the question you
mentioned period previously yes there's
these different uh periods where it
intensifies the creation of the FED uh
the moving away from the gold standard
uh citizens united those are all moments
in a larger trajectory and our point is
that we have to look at the larger
system right if you have a situation
like you have today
where you look at Congress and you
realize that every politician is bought
out you can then sit there and say wow
how was it that we had the bad luck to
have uh you know uh every single
Congress person be a corrupt individual
you have to think a little bit more
critically and say well maybe there's
something systemic at play here and
that's what we're doing all of these
moments it's not a coincidence that that
they exist you know they don't just pop
up arbitrarily they're part of this
larger system that puts as the most
Supreme value the most important thing
in society the accumul
of capital over and above the interests
of the nation Traditional Values
families and workingclass people upon
whose work that creation of wealth is
premised okay but if you were to
eradicate it entirely when are you
talking about so we're specifically the
capitalist system a person and investors
is able to go and or a group can go and
invest and build you know invest in
something basically just give money then
that person can be productive now I
understand that we've then created a
system on top of that like you're saying
stock BuyBacks and there's other things
that are no longer really an investment
in production it's one thing to lend
somebody money to build a business right
they're building something productive
the idea though is that you would give
them that money not so that they could
just become productive and you don't
benefit I mean certainly I would want to
benefit if I'm gonna if you come to me
Carlos and you say I want to start a
business Kim I need so much money and I
give you that money my expect a as I get
a cut back my that's going to be my and
I think that's a reasonable expectation
do you not agree with that oh absolutely
and the thing is here again if you go
back to the theory people get passages
from marks and Engles where they talk
about communism as the abolition of
private property they divorce it from
the context in which it's being uttered
you can't understand something if you
don't understand the factors that gave
rise to the fact itself you wouldn't
trust a boxing judge that showed up to
the 12th round to judge the whole fight
so why do we take statements and divorce
it from the context the context that
produces statements such as the
communism is the abolition of private
property are rooted in a specific
understanding of private property as
capital specifically as big Capital that
creates a society in which the whole
purpose of society is accumulating
Capital we're not even against uh
personal property we're not against
private property we're against a system
that upholds that interest of capital
accumulation to the level of Supremacy
so yes you can have uh small businesses
medium-sized businesses big businesses
as China has as the Soviet Union had in
the period of the new economic program
as yugos socialist Yugoslavia had you
can have those businesses but if Society
is structured such that those interests
are made to serve society and not
Society serve the interests of the
accumulation of a few small group of
people then you have socialism that's
all we're saying not that we want to
abolish uh the the the property of the
capitalist class what we're saying is if
you're actually interested in a
government of by and for the people the
economy our politics everything should
not be governed by these interests and
as soon as you switch towards governing
Society on the basis of serving Society
itself and the people you have a
socialist system even if you have
capitalism or Capital within it okay I
guess what I'm specifically asking is
are you talking about abolishing the
system of lending and
investing not necessarily it depends on
what's for instance the what are the
conditionalities of lending like China
has with the Shanghai cooperation
organization uh and breaks now with the
new development bank there's still
lending right but the conditionality of
lending is that that lending cannot be
done for the sake of paying back other
debts uh and uh it also has to be used
for the development of productive
industry so of course you can continue
uh lending but that lending has to be
premised on the development of the real
economy because that serves
Society okay so the lending has to be
productive lending so you can't do this
sort of um like we recently saw the
crash in Japan for example and a lot of
that was because you had a lot of
international people or entities taking
cheap Chinese yen uh they were borrowing
that money at a really low rate they
were taking that money and instead of
making it productive for Japan for
example they weren't investing it in
Japan they were taking those the cheap
Yen and they were then taking it they
were investing even more with that it to
get even they were actually using it to
get even more money so it wasn't you
know it was like and then of course it
all collapsed and that's what that's
kind of what we saw just recently so it
wasn't so you're and this is actually
something that um Economist Richard
Werner who's been on the show a couple
of times is a fantastic Economist his
and he's actually the Creator the father
of quantitative easing but his complaint
about quantitative easing which has a
very you know people demonize it a lot
now because it's like the printing of
money C says well they did it wrong
because what they did it for like for
example when they printed a lot of money
and gave it to the American people
during the covid crisis it was for
consumption it wasn't for production and
his point was you should only do
quantitative easing for production
you've got to you've got to give money
for production not for consumption or
not for investment like what they were
you know like what we see the investment
class doing so you're saying in a
socialist or even a communist society
that the there would still be lending
and there would still be investment it
would just be for production something
productive towards Society so it would
be for a family to buy a home it would
be for people to buy cars it would be
for people to start
businesses those types of things but it
couldn't be money the the system The
Current financial industry which they
make extremely complicated and
unobtainable to the average person that
you're saying that system would be
gone absolutely and that phrase that you
used making money from money it has a
name it's called usury and it's uh
absolutely condemned by most major uh
religions and somehow people that are
participating in these practices
continue to have the audacity to call
themselves uh Christians um no
absolutely I mean we we can look at
China like uh if if we were having this
conversation in the turn of the 20th
century it would be a little bit more
hypothetical but now it's not really
that hypothetical we can look at China
and China does have its National Bank
that lends out for the sake of
developing the economy you know not
necessarily for the sake of just making
more and more and more money no it's for
the sake of developing the economy and
as a party one of our Central
initiatives that might seem quite
heterodox is promoting small businesses
helping small businesses get bigger and
bigger we have party businesses we
encourage our clubs to start businesses
we're not uh this this this uh
caricature that has been created by the
uh by by the American media and the
American Elite in order to confuse the
American people that Communists are out
for your toothbrush for your car for
your house no it's completely the
opposite in the sort of society that we
would like to create the average
American is going to have more property
they're going to be wealthier they're
going to have more abundance so that
they can live the sorts of lives that
allow them to flourish so that they have
more socially available free time to do
creative things and do whatever they
feel like doing makes them uh whatever
they feel like makes them feel like a
genuine you know real human being while
doing it not slavishly working at a job
for 8 to 10 hours to pay bills to to to
people who fundamentally do nothing um
and make a whole lot of money from doing
that nothing hey guys this was just a
clip of a longer show catch the full
show by going to Kim Iverson show.com it
is free it airs Monday through Friday
5:00 pm Pacific 8:00 p.m. Eastern you
could go back now and watch this full
interview I highly recommend it again go
to Kim Iverson show.com thank you so
much for watching
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