Interview with Rebecca Grappo International & TCK Kids

Summary

In this insightful webinar, Rebecca Grappo, an expert in advising Third Culture Kids (TCKs) and international students, shares her experiences and discusses the unique challenges these students face when applying to colleges. She emphasizes the importance of understanding cultural authenticity, the complexities of fitting into a new educational environment, and the significance of a compelling college essay that reflects their diverse backgrounds and global perspectives.

Takeaways

• 🌐 Rebecca Grappo is a specialist in working with Third Culture Kids (TCKs) and international students, drawing from her own international experiences and work with the State Department.
• 🏫 Rebecca's background includes living in 10 different countries and working in American international schools, which has naturally influenced her career path in educational consulting.
• 🌍 TCKs are individuals who have spent significant developmental years living in a culture outside of their parents' home culture, often feeling a sense of belonging with other TCKs rather than a single culture.
• 🏛️ Rebecca emphasizes the importance of understanding that TCKs and international students may not automatically feel at home on a U.S. college campus, even if they hold an American passport.
• 🏫 When advising TCK students, Rebecca suggests looking for campuses that are outward-focused, international, and have a sizable number of international students.
• 🏙️ The concept of 'cultural authenticity' is discussed, highlighting that TCKs and international students bring a diversity of thought and perspective to a college environment.
• 📚 Rebecca advises that TCKs and international students need to find common ground with their peers on campus, focusing on shared interests and activities rather than solely their unique backgrounds.
• 📝 In terms of college essays, Rebecca recommends that students tell a story that exemplifies their global understanding and cultural experiences, rather than simply listing them.
• ✍️ For international students, Rebecca warns against over-editing essays, as it should reflect the student's actual level of English proficiency to maintain authenticity.
• 🔍 Rebecca encourages counselors to continue learning and networking with other professionals to better serve international students and TCKs, acknowledging the complexity and evolving nature of global education.

Q & A

What is the purpose of the webinar series?

The purpose of the webinar series is to talk to professionals in college counseling as part of a UCLA class, focusing on discussing the experiences and insights of guests like Rebecca Grappo, who specializes in working with TCKs and international students.

Who is Rebecca Grappo and what is her area of expertise?

Rebecca Grappo is a specialist and expert in working with Third Culture Kids (TCKs) and international students. She has had an international life, lived in 10 different countries, and worked in American international schools and for the State Department as an education and youth officer.

What is the significance of Rebecca's background in her current work?

Rebecca's international background and experience working with foreign service families and expat Americans naturally led her to establish a private practice focused on guiding international students and TCKs with college applications, boarding schools, and specialty schools.

What is a TCK and how is it different from an international student?

A TCK is a person who has spent significant developmental years living in a culture outside of their parents' home culture, often feeling a sense of belonging to multiple cultures but without true ownership in any. An international student might also be a TCK, but not all TCKs are international students, as the term TCK refers specifically to their cross-cultural upbringing.

Why is it important for college counselors to understand the background of TCKs and international students?

Understanding the background of TCKs and international students is crucial because it helps counselors to better advise them on college applications and campus life, taking into account their unique experiences, cultural identities, and the challenges they may face in adjusting to a new educational environment.

What are some characteristics that TCK students might look for in a college campus?

TCK students often seek campuses that are outward-focused and have a sizable number of international students, as they may feel more at home in an environment that reflects the diversity and international nature they are accustomed to.

How can TCK students portray their cultural authenticity in their college essays?

TCK students can portray their cultural authenticity by sharing personal stories that exemplify their experiences and perspectives, showcasing their unique viewpoints and understanding of diversity without listing or flaunting their background.

What challenges might TCK students face when adjusting to college in the United States?

TCK students may face challenges such as feeling out of place despite holding an American passport, adjusting to a new country and culture that may not feel comfortable, and finding a sense of belonging among their peers.

Why is it important for counselors to find common ground with students from diverse backgrounds?

Finding common ground is important because it helps students feel connected and accepted, allowing them to share their unique stories and experiences without feeling like they are trying to stand out in an inauthentic way.

What advice does Rebecca give to counselors who are new to working with international students?

Rebecca advises new counselors to seek professional development opportunities, join networking groups, and refer cases to specialists when necessary to ensure they are providing the best guidance and not making mistakes that could affect students' futures.

What is the significance of the name change to IACAC and what does it reflect about the field of college counseling?

The name change to IACAC (International Association of College Admissions Counselors) reflects the growing global nature of college counseling, indicating that the field is no longer just about American college consulting but includes consultants working globally and counselors from international schools sending students worldwide.

How can counselors ensure that the essays of international students are authentic and not over-edited?

Counselors should be careful not to over-edit essays to maintain consistency with the students' language proficiency levels, as demonstrated by their standardized test scores and letters of recommendation. The goal is to present an authentic piece of writing that represents the student's own voice and abilities.

What role can storytelling play in the college essays of international and TCK students?

Storytelling can play a crucial role in making the essays of international and TCK students memorable and impactful. By sharing a story that illustrates their experiences and viewpoints, students can convey their message more effectively and leave a lasting impression on the admissions officers.

Outlines

00:00

🌏 Introduction to TCKs and International Students

The speaker, Rebecca Grappo, is introduced as an expert in college counseling for TCKs (Third Culture Kids) and international students. She shares her background, having lived in 10 different countries and worked in American international schools and the State Department. Rebecca emphasizes her unique approach to advising students on college applications, boarding schools, and specialty schools, focusing on their global nomadic lifestyle and the challenges they face in transitioning to new environments.

05:01

🏫 Understanding TCKs and International Students' Challenges

Rebecca explains the difference between TCKs and international students, highlighting that an international student may also be a TCK. TCKs are individuals who have spent significant developmental years in a culture outside their parents' home culture, often feeling a sense of belonging to multiple cultures but lacking true ownership in any. The discussion includes the complexities of advising TCKs on college choices, emphasizing the importance of finding campuses with an international focus and a sizable number of international students to foster a sense of belonging.

10:01

🌐 Cultural Authenticity and the Role of Counselors

The conversation delves into the concept of cultural authenticity, particularly in the context of TCKs and international students. Rebecca discusses the importance of expanding the definition of diversity to include diverse thought and perspectives that TCKs bring to educational settings. She also touches on the challenges students face in defining their own identity and the need for counselors to guide them in portraying their cultural authenticity authentically, without appearing to flaunt their background.

15:02

📚 Navigating the Application Process for TCKs

Rebecca addresses the complexities of the college application process for TCKs, especially for those whose first language is not English. She advises against over-editing essays to maintain consistency with students' language proficiency levels. The focus is on helping students find and tell a story that exemplifies their global understanding and cultural experiences, making their applications memorable and unique. Rebecca also stresses the importance of counselors continuing their education to better serve the needs of international students.

✍️ Crafting Essays with Authenticity and Impact

In the final paragraph, Rebecca provides advice on writing college essays for TCKs and international students. She emphasizes the importance of storytelling, where students should illustrate their points through memorable experiences rather than listing them. Rebecca also cautions against submitting essays that are too polished, which might not align with the students' demonstrated language proficiency. The goal is to present an authentic and personal narrative that stands out to admissions officers.

Keywords

💡Webinar

A webinar is an interactive online seminar that allows participants to learn or discuss a specific topic. In the context of this video, the webinar serves as a platform for interviewing professionals in college counseling, showcasing the importance of understanding the nuances of international students' experiences.

💡TCK (Third Culture Kid)

A TCK refers to an individual who has spent a significant part of their developmental years in a culture other than that of their parents. This term is central to the video's theme, as the interviewee, Rebecca Grappo, discusses her expertise in working with TCKs and international students, emphasizing their unique challenges and experiences.

💡International Student

An international student is someone who leaves their home country to study abroad. The video highlights the differences between TCKs and international students, noting that an international student might also be a TCK but not all TCKs are international students, as they may have different cultural affiliations and experiences.

💡Cultural Authenticity

Cultural authenticity refers to the genuine representation of one's cultural identity. The video discusses how TCKs and international students navigate their cultural identities, especially when they have connections to multiple cultures, and how they can authentically portray this in their college applications and essays.

💡Transition

Transition in the video refers to the process of moving from one cultural context to another, which is a common experience for TCKs and international students. The discussion of transition is crucial as it relates to the challenges these students face when adjusting to new environments, such as college campuses.

💡Resiliency

Resiliency is the ability to adapt well in the face of adversity or change. The video touches on the importance of resiliency for TCKs and international students as they navigate the complexities of moving between cultures and the pressures of college life.

💡College Counseling

College counseling involves providing guidance and support to students in their pursuit of higher education. In the script, Rebecca Grappo shares her experience in college counseling, particularly for TCKs and international students, highlighting the specialized knowledge and approach required for this demographic.

💡Expat

An expat, short for expatriate, is someone living outside their native country. The video mentions expat Americans, emphasizing the unique perspective and needs of students who have grown up in different cultural contexts due to their parents' work abroad.

💡Educational Consulting

Educational consulting involves providing expert advice and services related to education. Rebecca Grappo's work in educational consulting is highlighted in the video, where she discusses her practice's focus on helping TCKs and international students with college applications, boarding schools, and specialty schools.

💡Cultural Diversity

Cultural diversity refers to the variety of cultural identities and experiences within a group or community. The video discusses the importance of recognizing and valifying cultural diversity, especially in the context of TCKs and international students, and how they contribute to the diversity of thought on college campuses.

💡Admissions Essay

An admissions essay is a written piece that college applicants submit as part of their application. The video emphasizes the importance of a compelling and authentic admissions essay for TCKs and international students, as it allows them to share their unique stories and perspectives with admissions officers.

Highlights

Rebecca Grappo is a specialist in working with TCKs (Third Culture Kids) and international students.

Rebecca has lived in 10 different countries and worked in American international schools, influencing her work with TCKs.

She worked for the State Department as an Education and Youth Officer, further exposing her to global nomadic lifestyles.

Rebecca's private practice focuses on educational consulting for expat Americans and international students.

TCKs are individuals who have spent significant developmental years in a culture outside their parents' home culture.

TCKs often feel a sense of belonging with other people who have had similar international backgrounds.

International students might also be TCKs, but they are not necessarily immigrants.

TCKs may feel a connection to multiple cultures but often struggle with a sense of true ownership or belonging.

Rebecca advises TCK students to seek campuses that are outward-focused and have a sizable number of international students.

TCKs face the challenge of adjusting to a new country and culture, in addition to the typical college transition.

Cultural authenticity is a complex concept for TCKs, involving a diversity of thought and perspectives.

Rebecca emphasizes the importance of expanding the definition of diversity to include TCKs and international students.

TCKs often grapple with forming their own identity and connecting with others in a new environment.

Rebecca advises students to find commonalities with peers on campus, rather than relying solely on their TCK background.

TCKs need to be aware that their global experiences may not be as unique in the admissions process as they think.

Counselors should be cautious and refer cases they are not familiar with to professionals with more experience in international education.

Professional organizations and conferences offer valuable resources for counselors to improve their skills in working with international students.

Rebecca recommends that students tell a story in their essays to illustrate their points and stand out to admissions officers.

Essays should be consistent with a student's language proficiency and academic achievements to avoid suspicion of over-editing.

Rebecca emphasizes the importance of students having a unique story to tell in their applications.

Transcripts

all right

hello everyone and welcome to

our series of webinars or actually

interviews that

i'm doing as part of our ucla class to

talk to professionals in

college counseling with me today i have

rebecca grappo

she is a specialist and an expert in

working with

tck their culture kids and international

students

and becky thank you for being here today

um if you could thank you for inviting

me cindy

i know many of our students are very

interested in knowing

different people's backgrounds and how

they got into the work they do

so if you could share a little bit about

who you are and why you do what you do

that would be

very beneficial okay

well i've had a very international life

myself

having lived overseas many times in 10

different countries

and i've also worked in american

international schools so

because of all the international

background that i have it's natural that

i've been able to bring this into

the work that i do i also worked for the

state department for

several years where i was the education

and youth officer and i worked with

foreign service families moving around

the world so that gave me even more

exposure to

kids coming and going from around the

world

so when i started my private practice i

was still

living that globally nomadic lifestyle

myself my husband was her diplomat

and i established my practice thinking

there must be a lot of expat americans

and international students who could use

some guidance

not only with college applications but

also with boarding schools and specialty

schools

we do all kinds of educational

consulting in our practice

so that's how i got started and in

addition to doing college advising

we i do a lot of public speaking and

writing about the issues

of transition and resiliency and moving

kids around the world

so that ties right into what we're doing

here as we talk about

their culture kids and international

students

that's and that brings up a really good

point about

transition and how do we prepare and

what our role is as counselors and

that's one of the things that

we're talking about in this class so can

you explain what a tck

student is and what the difference is

between being a tck

and an international student

well first of all an international

student might also be a tck

so a tck is a is a person who has spent

a significant amount of their

developmental years living in a country

or a culture outside of their parents

home culture

they have ownership in many of the

cultures in which they live

or they have a sense of belonging to

many people in many of the cultures in

which they live but true

ownership and none and they find their

sense of belonging usually in connection

with other people who have had a similar

background

so that's a paraphrase on the official

definition

so let's take that into an example so

let's say that we're

working with ex-pat americans where

they've raised their children

overseas for a significant amount of

time well that could be one year

five years ten years it just depends on

what's significant for a particular

student and they're living outside of

their country

and then eventually but they don't have

ownership they're not

immigrants so let's say an american for

example might have been living in

amsterdam

they will have absorbed many of the

characteristics of dutch culture if

they've gone to an international school

they've absorbed many of the

characteristics of all the other

nationalities

of students who are in that school they

feel most connected when they're in that

international type of environment

and that's when they're going to find

that's where they're going to find their

sense of belonging

so when we think about advising that

kind of student

when that student comes to the united

states it's assumed that their american

passport holder we cannot assume

that they are automatically going to

feel at home on

any college campus around the u.s or

just because they're in the united

states doesn't make them

feel internally like they're at home

so when we come up with the list for

that kind of student

usually they're asking for a campus to

be more

outward focused more international to

have as a

sizable number of international students

on campus

i get the question all the time where

are the best schools for tcks and the

answer is

it really depends there's a certain

go-to list

that a lot of kids tend to want to apply

to from international schools overseas

but that doesn't make them the only

schools that are good for tcks

and there's a lot more that can be

discussed about that particular topic

in a nutshell now if we also talk about

international students so for example i

work with a lot of kids

coming out of the middle east because we

spent many years there

and especially let's say dubai or abu

dhabi it could be that it's a

lebanese student for example that has

grown up in dubai

where the parents are lebanese but

they've never actually lived there so

their tck is living in dubai

and they're going to come to the us as

an international student

so again all these complexities about

answering the question where do you fit

in where do you belong where is home

where are you going to be comfortable

what kind of environment are you going

to be comfortable in

and fitting in with the with the culture

on an american campus so what i hear

from a lot of tcks

is that going to college can be a really

big challenge for them

so it's the first time away from home

just like all the other kids getting

used to college just like all the other

kids

but they also in many cases are

adjusting to a country and a culture

that might appear to be

their own but it's not and it doesn't

feel comfortable like that

so there are other issues to helping

them to feel like they're at home and

adjusting

on their college campus

one of the things one of the articles

that i had students read is about

um was a definition of diversity

and the author roxanne says

coins the fraser uses the phrase um

authentic

or cultural authenticity so as you think

about that

for the students that you work with how

do they

portray or communicate their cultural

authenticity

if they're identifying with all with

very many different cultures

wow that's a great question and i wish

we could talk about that for an

hour

i think that's a really great question

um

lots of different ways that i could

answer it i think that

um authenticity i think a lot of these

students are

searching and questioning to answer that

question for themselves

during this experience um

i think that

there's a diversity of thought just like

there can be diversity of race and

ethnic backgrounds religious backgrounds

etc

and one of the things that i really

think is important

is that we expand our definition of

diversity especially when we're talking

about diversifying a campus

and that what a tck or an international

student can bring

to the classroom and to the dorm into

the activities and everything else is

just a different perspective

a different view of life and i think

that's really important that's diversity

of thought

even if on the outside they look like

everybody else

i also think that in coming up with

their own identity

and again this could be a really long

involved topic but in coming up with

their own identity

a lot of students that i'm working with

are thinking about these things deeply

maybe the first time they really think

about this is in their college essay

which

we should talk about quickly um but also

just

you know what does this experience mean

and how are they going to connect with

other people

how are they going to share their

stories which have a different setting

and be accepted by their peers without

it look like they're trying to show off

or

be fancy and so we see a lot of students

who don't want to talk about their

background

or flaunt their background um but it's

all about

you know finding that connection with

other students on campus

i often advise my students you're going

to have to find other things that you

have in common with the students that

you meet on a new campus

like maybe you all are going to be

involved in the same community service

project with the same

um political action group or the

international club but you're going to

have to find new things that you have in

common

because it's not going to be so

prevalent to find

other people who are going to be just

like you and maybe in a way that's the

point

so the other point that i'd like to make

about this is that when

kids talk about fit and finding a place

where they belong i get it

i understand why they want that but i

also warn them if you want to be special

if you want to use your background in a

way that's really going to stand out and

make you very attractive

in the admissions process if you apply

to the same schools

where everybody else is applying they've

already seen it

and read it before and it's not very

impressive you know it's impressive but

it's not something that's unique and

different

so if you really want to stand out and

be

in a place where people are going to

maybe offer you a special incentive to

enroll

you have to accept the fact that you're

going to be in the minority

flip side of that is that you're going

to be in the minority and maybe you're

not going to find as many people that

you can relate to

you can identify with but just to give

an example tests read 700

applications a year from tcks so if you

write that i'm now a citizen of the

world because i've lived around the

world

they've read that essay before thousands

of times

and that's not going to be enough just

because you

were raised overseas is not going to be

enough to get across that admissions

threshold

so that kind of we went a couple

different directions with that answer

but

you know it's all important it is and it

and that

points out to the fact that it's not

just it's not cut and dried

and every student situation is going to

be different and that's where

what our role as counselors and that's

one of the things we covered last week

is is varies and we're building that

knowledge and expertise so that

we know and and can help our students

and the families

but when do you you know at some point

it's going to go beyond

what i as a regular counselor work with

um and so at one point would you

recommend

that counselors especially if you're at

a

high school or even if you're at an

international school all your students

are

falling into one of these

characteristics so what do you do when

you

don't know the answers

well first that's a complicated question

too so i think that

you know on the one hand we want to

learn if there's something we don't know

we want to learn

but on the other hand if you're not used

to working with international students

there are

all kinds of twists and turns that can

take place

i was teaching the course at uc irvine

american college consulting for the

international student

i'm the course is still being offered

i'm no longer teaching it um there are

two other great instructors for that now

but one of the chapters that i did with

my

adult students was land mines in the

application process

and so just trying to point out what

some of those landmines

are as you're working with an

international student that are

going to be very different from working

with

their let's say i'm going to use north

american now because we're just talking

about american college con

uh colleges at the moment

i if i could say one thing is this is

getting bigger and bigger and bigger all

the time

this is getting more and more global all

the time and getting more complicated

all the time so

just for this conversation and keep it

focused on american

so when we're talking about american

college admissions there are all kinds

of landmines that could

come into play and so i would really

advise somebody if you're

new to this and you don't really know

that much about it

you should refer this out within

our professional organizations we're

working very very

hard to raise the professional standards

of people who are doing work

internationally

to recognize this as a specialty that

takes years of experience to acquire and

even those of us

who have many years of experience have

our own small

little networking groups that we meet

together over skype and in email groups

and we

balance cases off of each other because

even after years of experience there are

lots of things that

are perplexing to us and

we need each other in order to make sure

that we don't drop the ball

and have it affect a student so

yes learn if you happen to be a member

by eca the

global consulting committee has been

working very hard on an international

roadmap

that gives a lot of professional

development opportunities

laid out for counselors

consultants to become even better at

what they do when working with

international students

the sessions that are offered either at

iacac

or the you know the international ac or

if the heca or ieca conferences that are

devoted to international students

nakak etc these are places where you can

go to learn

more about working with international

students

as well as tcks so we want to be really

careful we've got a child's life in our

hands so we have to be careful

absolutely and thanks for mentioning all

those different organizations

we've i've posted a document that has

links but

i'll need to add the oacac because

that's a key one especially for the

international perspective well actually

just this month and

in january the name was changed to iacac

and voted on by the membership to become

the international

association of college admissions

counselors there's a new logo

new website new name and the reason they

did that was to reflect the fact that

this is changing that this is not

just about american college consulting

anymore

or american college counseling but we've

got

consultants who are working globally

that we've got

international school counselors who are

sending kids around the world

and that it's not just the united states

or even north america anymore

and that's what i was referring to

earlier in our conversation this whole

thing is getting bigger and bigger and

bigger

it definitely definitely well thank you

for that because we'll um

we'll definitely have people look that

up and you mentioned something about the

essay so in closing

let's go ahead and have you cover a

little bit about

what your recommendations are in terms

of essays for

students a couple of things number one

is that

depending on what kind of education the

student has had they may or may not be

used to writing an essay so i find that

often i'm

taking on the role of a writing teacher

in addition to just helping them

brainstorm essay topics so

really helping them to develop that

essay into something that is going to be

an example of good writing

the second thing is that if you're

working with international students and

english is not their first language you

don't want to over edit

because they're also going to be

presenting theoretically

a standardized test score or a toefl

score

the um you know english is a foreign

language

or an eyelets and the writing

has to be consistent and the letters of

recommendation from their english

teacher it all has to be consistent with

their level of writing

so if we as as consultants

counselors over edit an essay and it's

too polished

and it doesn't match the level of

achievement that they've had in their

academic life

then that's going to be suspect so we

don't want it to be too perfect

and yet we're there to help them so you

know this

is something again we would spend a

whole week talking about this whole

topic

the other thing is that i really really

encourage

students to look for a story that

exemplifies the point that they're

trying to make

so for example if somebody wants to show

their global understanding

about a particular you know that i've

grown up around the world and

therefore i'm very attuned to different

cultures and peoples around the world

and i really love diversity

instead of writing i've grown up around

the world and i really love diversity in

cultures and people because i've had all

these great opportunities

instead if they could tell a story of

one thing that happened

and the story illustrates all those

things without them having to

state them and list them and the story

will be memorable

and some of the stories that my

international students in tc case have

have told have been so incredible that i

can still remember

that student that year and the story

that they told in their essay

and where they ended up going to school

um you know stories are memorable

and that's what we want to happen you

know i tell them

don't forget you know that whoever is

reading your admission your

admissions file i had one admissions um

officer answer my email at 10 o'clock at

night it was midnight on her timezone

i'm like what are you doing answering my

email just like i'm reading files at

home

so that just goes to show you that if

you

if you're going to be presenting your

file to an admissions officer remember

it might be midnight

they might be really tired and you do

the same old sleeper essay that they've

read a thousand times it's not going to

make an impression

right oh great great sage words of

advice and i think that

um is something that working with all

our students is helping them to sell

their stories but

for our as you say the international tck

students they've never had to do that

before at

the same level and keep preserving it

goes back to that cultural authenticity

you know just their own authenticity and

and preserving their second language

perspective and just their their

perspective

is what brings and makes their

applications authentic

and personal and um and helping them to

understand

that they do have a story to tell that's

so key

and that's what makes it so fun

absolutely absolutely

thank you so much um for your time if

people have questions or anything what

should i have them do

um they can certainly send me an email

rebecca

rng international dot com

okay great thank you very much have a

great day all right thanks for the

invitation sydney

you're very welcome cindy thank you

all right okay all right thanks bye