The Mark on the Wall by Virginia Woolf - Short Story Summary, Analysis, Review

Summary

In this video, the hosts delve into Virginia Woolf's 'Mark on the Wall,' a stream-of-consciousness narrative reflecting the author's introspective style. They discuss the story's open-ended nature, which challenges readers to interpret Woolf's themes of feminism, societal roles, and the struggle for individual identity. The conversation explores the story's philosophical depth, comparing it to poetry and pondering its place within Woolf's broader body of work. Despite initial struggles with the narrative's disjointedness, the hosts express a desire to further engage with Woolf's writing to better understand her literary philosophy.

Takeaways

• 📖 'The Mark on the Wall' by Virginia Woolf is a story that showcases introspective thinking, reflecting the author's own thought processes and the act of jumping from one subject to another.
• 💭 Woolf's narrative style in this story is characterized by a stream-of-consciousness technique, which can be challenging for students due to its non-linear and fragmented nature.
• 🤔 The story invites readers to analyze the character's thought process, questioning why certain topics are considered and what prompts the character to change subjects abruptly.
• 📚 Woolf's work was self-published during World War I, reflecting the challenges and independence of women writers during that era.
• 👀 The story's protagonist is constantly distracted by a mark on the wall, which serves as a central motif around which the character's thoughts revolve.
• 🌼 The mention of chrysanthemums blooming in November, despite the story being set in January, hints at the theme of legacy and the passage of time.
• 🎭 Woolf's writing touches on societal expectations and the struggle for identity, especially for women, as they navigate traditional gender roles and the desire for personal expression.
• 💡 The story's open-ended nature allows for multiple interpretations, emphasizing the reader's role in constructing meaning from the text.
• 🌳 The tree outside the window symbolizes slow growth and change, potentially reflecting the gradual progress towards gender equality and societal transformation.
• 🔨 The final revelation of the mark being a snail carries a metaphorical weight, suggesting the slow and circular motion of societal change and the struggle for women's recognition.
• 🌐 The story's themes resonate with broader philosophical and feminist discussions, inviting readers to consider the impact of societal structures on individual identity and the potential for personal and collective growth.

Q & A

What is the main theme of the video script discussing?

The main theme of the video script is the analysis of Virginia Woolf's short story 'The Mark on the Wall,' focusing on its stream-of-consciousness style and themes of introspection, feminism, and societal roles.

What year was 'The Mark on the Wall' written, and what is its significance?

'The Mark on the Wall' was written in 1917 during World War One. Its significance lies in its exploration of introspective thinking and its representation of the internal monologue, which was a unique narrative technique at the time.

Why was 'The Mark on the Wall' printed by Woolf and her husband themselves?

Woolf and her husband founded their own printing press and printed more than a thousand copies of 'The Mark on the Wall' themselves, showcasing their independence and control over their work in a time when women had limited opportunities in publishing.

What is the narrator's main activity in 'The Mark on the Wall'?

The narrator's main activity in 'The Mark on the Wall' is sitting in a chair and staring at a mark on the wall, which serves as a focal point for her stream of consciousness.

How does the video script describe the narrator's thought process in 'The Mark on the Wall'?

The video script describes the narrator's thought process as sporadic and non-linear, jumping from one idea to another, which can be frustrating for readers but also thought-provoking.

What is the significance of the chrysanthemums mentioned in the script?

The chrysanthemums mentioned in the script are significant because they bloom in November, which is not their typical blooming time, possibly symbolizing the unconventional nature of the narrator's thoughts or the idea of breaking societal norms.

What does the video script suggest about Shakespeare's role in the narrator's thoughts?

The video script suggests that Shakespeare represents a pinnacle of literary achievement in the narrator's thoughts, and his mention could reflect the struggle of the narrator to find her own voice and place in literature.

What is the 'Whitaker's Table of Precedency' mentioned in the script, and its relevance to the story?

The 'Whitaker's Table of Precedency' is a real British Almanac that dictates social hierarchy, often favoring men. Its relevance to the story lies in its representation of the societal structures that the narrator feels are imposed upon her, reflecting themes of feminism and the struggle for recognition of women's roles.

How does the video script interpret the ending of 'The Mark on the Wall'?

The video script interprets the ending, where the mark is revealed to be a snail, as a representation of slow, circular motion and change, possibly symbolizing the gradual societal shift towards recognizing women's roles and contributions.

What is the video script's perspective on the importance of understanding Virginia Woolf's philosophy?

The video script emphasizes the importance of understanding Woolf's philosophy by suggesting that a deeper exploration of her works is necessary to fully grasp the nuances of 'The Mark on the Wall' and appreciate her unique narrative style.

Outlines

00:00

📚 Introduction to 'Mark on the Wall' and Stream of Consciousness

The video script begins with an introduction to Virginia Woolf's 'Mark on the Wall,' a story that showcases introspective thinking and stream of consciousness. The narrator discusses the story's structure, which is primarily internal dialogue, and how it can be challenging for students to follow due to its non-linear nature. The script also mentions Woolf's own printing press and the story's publication history. The narrator's personal experience with introspective thinking is shared, along with a fun fact about people who lack an internal monologue. The segment ends with a discussion of Woolf's essay 'A Room of One's Own,' where she praises women writers for their skill despite societal challenges.

05:01

🤔 Exploring Themes of Legacy and Feminism in 'Mark on the Wall'

The second paragraph delves into the themes of legacy and feminism within the story. The narrator's focus on a mark on the wall serves as a metaphor for the distractions and shifting thoughts that define human legacy. The discussion includes the significance of chrysanthemums blooming out of season, the idea of self-image versus societal image, and the pressure women face to conform to masculine ideals. The paragraph also touches on the historical context of women's roles and the struggle for recognition in a male-dominated society, as reflected in Woolf's own experiences and writings.

10:02

🌿 Symbolism of Nature and the Role of Women in Society

In this paragraph, the conversation turns to the symbolism of nature, particularly the tree, as a representation of slow growth and change. The narrator's contemplation of the mark on the wall and the subsequent realization of its insignificance parallels the broader societal struggle for women's recognition. The discussion includes references to Whitaker's table of precedence, which highlights the historical dominance of men and the societal structures that women must challenge. The paragraph concludes with a reflection on the slow and organic growth of change, as symbolized by the tree and the eventual recognition of women's rights.

15:02

🔍 Close Reading of 'Mark on the Wall' and its Philosophical Depth

The fourth paragraph presents a close reading of the story, focusing on the philosophical depth and the open-ended nature of Woolf's narrative. The narrator's fixation on the mark and the subsequent revelation of it being a snail symbolize the slow, circular motion of societal change. The discussion explores the idea of stream of consciousness as a writing style, comparing Woolf's approach to that of other authors like Faulkner and Joyce. The paragraph concludes with a reflection on the difficulty of analyzing a story that feels more like a poem, with its fragmented thoughts and lack of a clear narrative direction.

20:04

📉 Subjective and Analytical Ratings of 'Mark on the Wall'

The final paragraph discusses the subjective and analytical ratings given to 'Mark on the Wall' by the narrator. The analytical rating reflects the narrator's struggle to understand Woolf's writing style and philosophy, while the subjective rating is based on personal enjoyment of the story. The narrator acknowledges the need for further exploration of Woolf's work to gain a deeper understanding of her themes and writing techniques. The paragraph ends with a call to action for viewers to subscribe for more literature discussions and a commitment to delve deeper into Woolf's writings in future videos.

Keywords

💡Introspective Thinking

Introspective thinking refers to the process of examining one's own thoughts, feelings, and mental processes. In the context of the video, it is the primary narrative technique used in Virginia Woolf's 'Mark on the Wall,' where the story is driven by the internal monologue of the protagonist, reflecting on various topics without a clear, linear progression. The script discusses how this technique can be challenging for students to follow but also stimulates deeper analysis of the character's thought process.

💡Stream of Consciousness

Stream of consciousness is a narrative style that attempts to depict the continuous flow of thoughts, feelings, and perceptions in the mind of a character. The video script describes this technique as central to 'Mark on the Wall,' illustrating the protagonist's mind as it jumps from one idea to another, reflecting the natural, unstructured nature of human thought. The script also mentions that this style can be difficult for readers to navigate due to its non-linear and fragmented nature.

💡Feminism

Feminism is a social and political movement advocating for equal rights and opportunities for women. The script suggests that 'Mark on the Wall' can be interpreted through a feminist lens, with references to Virginia Woolf's own experiences and the societal expectations placed on women during her time. The discussion points to the idea of breaking free from traditional gender roles and the potential frustration expressed in the narrative as a reflection of the constraints faced by women.

💡Legacy

Legacy, in the context of the video, refers to the lasting impact or inheritance left by an individual or a generation. The script mentions the idea of legacy in relation to the protagonist's thoughts on what is left behind by mankind, such as wealth, power, or cultural contributions. It is used to explore themes of permanence and the desire to be remembered, contrasting with the ephemeral nature of the thoughts in the story.

💡Chrysanthemums

Chrysanthemums are flowers that symbolize various meanings across different cultures, often associated with honor and respect. In the script, the mention of chrysanthemums blooming in November, despite it being January in the story, adds a layer of mystery and potential symbolism. The video discusses the possible cultural significance of this discrepancy but acknowledges the ambiguity and open interpretation of its meaning.

💡Whitaker's Table of Precedency

Whitaker's Table of Precedency is a real historical reference to a British almanac that outlines the order of importance among the peerage. In the video, it is used metaphorically to represent the societal hierarchy and the dominance of men over women. The script suggests that the protagonist's realization of the irrelevance of the mark on the wall parallels the recognition of the need to challenge and dismantle such established social structures.

💡Lewis Carroll

Lewis Carroll is an English writer known for his fantastical works such as 'Alice's Adventures in Wonderland.' The script references Carroll's work in the context of the protagonist's desire to 'smash the looking glass,' which can be interpreted as a desire to break free from societal norms and expectations, particularly those related to gender roles and identity.

💡Slow Change

Slow change in the video is symbolized by the growth of a tree and the circular motion of a snail, representing the gradual evolution of societal attitudes and the struggle for gender equality. The script suggests that Virginia Woolf may be implying that progress towards recognizing women's rights and roles will be a slow and steady process, reflecting the broader social changes that were beginning to take place during her lifetime.

💡Poetic Philosophy

Poetic philosophy refers to a style of writing that combines the lyrical, expressive qualities of poetry with the exploration of philosophical ideas. The script suggests that 'Mark on the Wall' has a poetic quality, with its open-ended and reflective nature, which may contribute to the difficulty in analyzing the story. This style challenges traditional narrative structures and invites readers to engage more deeply with the text's themes and implications.

💡Analytical Rating

Analytical rating in the context of the video refers to the process of evaluating a literary work based on its themes, narrative techniques, and the depth of its philosophical content. The script discusses the challenges faced by the hosts in providing an analytical rating for 'Mark on the Wall' due to its unconventional narrative style and the need for a deeper understanding of Virginia Woolf's work to fully appreciate its significance.

Highlights

Introduction to the video discussing Virginia Woolf's 'Mark on the Wall'.

The story was self-published by Woolf and her husband during World War One.

Discussion on the story's frequent assignment in educational settings for its introspective nature.

Analysis of the story's narrative style, which mimics the process of thinking and jumping between subjects.

Mention of the phenomenon where some individuals lack an internal monologue.

Virginia Woolf's essay 'A Room of One's Own' and its themes are connected to the story.

Reflection on the societal expectations and challenges faced by women writers in the 1800s.

The story's open-ended nature and its impact on readers' interpretations.

The narrator's focus on a mark on the wall as a symbol of distraction and deeper meaning.

Analysis of the chrysanthemums' mention and its potential literary significance.

The concept of legacy and its importance to mankind, contrasted with the story's trivial events.

The narrator's contemplation on Shakespeare's legacy and its comparison to personal identity.

Feminine imagery and the breaking of societal tropes in the story.

The idea of smashing the looking glass as a metaphor for self-discovery and independence.

The significance of the nail being painted over as a symbol of societal structures overshadowing individuality.

The tree outside the window as a metaphor for slow change and growth in societal views on gender.

The revelation of the mark on the wall being a snail and its implications for the story's themes.

Final thoughts on the story's structure and its poetic, philosophical nature.

The decision to engage more with Virginia Woolf's works to better understand her writing style and philosophy.

Transcripts

all right in this video let's sit down

and talk what you you've already said a

lot more than whatever happens in this

story let's just sit alright welcome to

the coated scampi know where I am

Oona and I'm sitting cryptic you can

read the story for free we will put a

link in the description box below for

you to check the story out mark in the

wall was written in 1917 during World

War one

Virginia Woolf and her husband founded

their own printing press and printed

more than a 1000 copies themselves and

the labor it was riri published in 1921

as part of it collection and titled

Monday or Tuesday that was kind of a fun

little narrator voice he put on there

that was my radio voice good now for

today's students this is a story that is

still frequently assigned because it

shows good introspective thinking right

like that's all the story is is just

internal logical this is what I'm

thinking and it's not uncommon that when

you're thinking you're thinking of

something you cut that thread and jump

to something else right and you may not

come back to that thread and that's kind

of what this story does is we're going

to be thinking about something jump to

something else move on and that can be

incredibly frustrating for a lot of

students but it gets you thinking and

analyzing from the perspective of what's

important to this lady what makes her

jump subjects and why is she thinking

about maybe some topics that are

relevant to her what what makes the

philosophy of this character this

character and I think the story is good

from that perspective fun fact

after reading this story I was

researching some things and it popped up

on one of my news feeds and I read an

article saying that some people actually

don't have introspective thinking they

don't have an internal monologue and so

it may be if you are in school and you

struggle with this maybe you don't have

an internal voice of your own I cannot

get my internal voice to shut the hell

up

Prozac that's what you need I'm spacing

out off on some other thread and oh my

god were you talking for 10 minutes

because

don't tell your wife that well I think

it's interesting because I actually have

a quote from Virginia Woolf where she

addresses some themes in her essay a

Room of One's Own and she lauded women

writers for their skilled prose despite

their many setbacks

she wrote of the circumstances of women

writers in the 1800's they had to write

in the sitting room with near constant

interruptions and a need to hide their

work from people not their immediate

families because of the situation it's a

wonderful Woolf that most works by women

in her time were novels which i think is

interesting and says something about how

women writers were still expected to be

a role of servitude a role of raising

children a role of cooking cleaning all

the stuff while trying to create

professional or personal creative

outlets at the time and I feel some of

that frustration maybe not intentionally

and as she describes here but I feel

that that jumping and that the

distraction element in this story I

think is a fair way to put this yeah

it's kind of initial reaction that's one

thing that I struggled with this story

was how it does bounce or jump as you

said from one flow of consciousness to

the next and I think that that does a

good job of representing what maybe it's

like to write when you aren't totally

given the freedom to just sit down and

let your voice be your voice stream of

conscious writing right the idea that

I'm trying to have my writing a mimic

the thought process that we have

internally where most writing is you sit

down it's edited it's composed it's

crafted stream-of-consciousness this is

also that but it's meant to be in a way

that kind of mimics the way your brain

wheeze and flows and jumps between

subjects yeah yeah all right so let's

jump into plot and then we'll do our

analysis because the plots gonna take me

forever all right you ready I'm ready

the narrator sits in a chair okay and

that's it that's the plot the narrator

sits in a chair we're gonna get raked

over the coals for that one that if the

plot is the narrator sits in a chair and

she stares at a splot splot she stares

at a spot on the wall

all and shion-san place life let's give

it a little bit sentence and a half okay

you beef it up okay now I want to give a

quick disclaimer okay because I think

that when we talk about literary

interpretations the best way I describe

it is it's looking at the clouds right

this story may mean something totally

different to me than it does to others a

lot of people just talk about the

reactions we like to talk about maybe

some of the interpretations and

extrapolations that we get from this

this is a story that I feel like can go

a lot of different ways because there's

so many like philosophical nuggets just

sprinkled throughout the story that it's

like you might latch on to this in a

totally different way and I think that's

cool and I don't want you to feel upset

you know I don't talk about your ABI

because I know that as I was reading

through this I latched on to a couple of

specifics and I wanted to know more what

does she mean here or is that something

that's real historical is there more

information that there's a meaning

behind this and I think that as a result

I missed a lot of what the story's

purpose was well the story's purposes

whatever you make it right this is more

on the readers responsibility side than

the authorial I feel like aside you read

a lot of stories where I think the

author does a good job of leading you

certain ways to think specific ways and

end up and at the end result Virginia

Woolf's writing here from what I can

tell is very open-ended and you might

end up at totally different spots case

in point for me I actually had one one

main theme that I kind of focused on

through this there's other elements and

I kind of chopped them out because I

wanted to really focus on this one theme

for how I want to talk about this story

today and I want to talk about the idea

of Minh ISM yeah that was kind of the

one thing that I took away from it as

well I think that maybe we latched on to

a couple of different ideas but the same

scenes so the narrator starts off in

this room with a man okay she's not

alone right we had that quote about we

and I think that's fairly obvious but

she is constantly being distracted by

this mark on the wall my first question

for you is there's mentioned of

chrysanthemums being in bloom in

November but well it's in January in the

story books anthem

bloom in November have you had any

thoughts about that did that hit you at

all no no get a glossed right over that

there's a lot of different meanings for

chrysanthemums in literature in terms of

what culture you're from in terms of

honor and respect but but all the things

that I saw I could not figure out how to

make sense or why she chose to make

chrysanthemums part of the opening line

and whether in bloom in January when

they shouldn't be in bloom but there's

probably something there but I couldn't

figure out what it was but she gets up

and things about how things are lost

over time right in a lot of times I

would say that mankind is defined by

what we leave behind our legacy is very

important to us in terms of what we

leave behind whether it be money stature

power name brand things in terms of what

you've built and are able to pass on to

your children legacy is something that

is genetically something that we even

try to pass on generation to generation

yeah I try to tell my students this all

the time that you know in a hundred

years nobody will remember me but if

you're in this book you're gonna get

remembered you know Pythagorean lived

thousands of years ago but his name his

legacy still exists to this day right

and to your point the reference here is

she compares dust on the mantle to the

dust that Barry Troy write a story told

generation to generation passed down in

textbooks like what you're describing

yeah and then next she thinks of

Shakespeare she says Shakespeare well he

will do as well as another which is a

really interesting quote because this is

one of the most important men in history

right almost all literature in terms of

longevity is compared to Shakespeare and

what is Shakespeare he's one of the

first men in literature yeah he's

probably the most famous author of all

time right I can't think of another so

when she walks into a room they're

talking about botany and she's talking

about flowers now this might be a bit of

a stretch but again we have this quote

all the time I'm dressing up the figure

of myself in my own mind so she uses a

feminine description of a flower as

opposed to more of the scientific or I

feel like more masculine version of but

yes

here when I was thinking about this this

was one of the few things that I kind of

latched on to I thought it was unique

because I think that a lot of times we

see flowers as feminine what is one of

the gifts that we give women flowers

right and I took this as kind of her

trying to break a trope of that idea of

that one thing can only be feminine or

maybe only one thing can be masculine

but I also tried to think of it as

another way that it's our idea of self

image versus societal image of a person

I like that I think that's leading me

down the path that I took too because we

have women dressing up a lot to meet

men's archetype right we had to be the

next Shakespeare to be the next you know

in terms of scientific discovery women

probably feel like a lot of times

they're forced into the role of

following men being the next to conquer

Troy because of Helen of Troy right or

in today's standards you know you want

to be the next Stephen King or you want

to be the next this and or is that not

what women want maybe what they want to

become is not to be the next Shakespeare

but to be the next Virginia Woolf or the

first Virginia Woolf to the point here

from a feminist perspective right I

don't need to fill Shakespeare's shoes I

need to surpass Shakespeare's shoes

perhaps with the perspective that he

doesn't have yeah and one that we're

probably gonna miss to write well in

this next point is what kind of brings a

Holmes to me where she talks about

smashing the looking glass which is to

me a direct reference to Lewis Carroll

another man who wrote the through the

looking-glass Alice in Wonderland

stories right yeah but it's the idea of

destroying the romantic vision the

feminine vision of yourself to become

your own person

she says the quote that writers were one

day we become more abstract less

concrete which was just prophetic to me

because that is exactly what has

happened yeah this is one of the other

two of three things that I latched on to

so maybe we did a pretty good job better

than we thought here with this but here

I kind of took this as uncertainty

versus

ah city because with the Lewis Carroll

reference I was thinking of she seems so

curious about this spot on the wall and

I'm thinking okay the curious cat but

she's uncertain if she wants to know

what the spot is and I feel like here

that maybe Woolf is saying that you know

women are unsure of their role in the

future and that they're curious what it

will be but maybe there's a little bit

of fear there because they don't know

what they're there the role could end up

being cuz it could be works they know

what it is right now do you need to

smash the current structure to create

your own structure of what you could be

to your point we have the quote yeah men

perhaps should you be a woman the

masculine point of view which governs

our lives which sets the standard which

establishes Whitaker's table of

precedency which has become I suppose

since the war half a phantom too many

men and women which soon one may hope

will be laughed into the dustbin where

the phantoms go

that was probably yeah my favorite quote

of the the story yeah for sure I think

you can argue that that is the most

important quote of the story that kind

of maybe sums up what we're trying to

say here is that this is a push against

the the this is a push against the

domination of men over women throughout

the ages do you know much about

Whitaker's table of precedency I looked

it up really quick and it is real and

it's basically this idea of the British

Almanac and saying that men are supposed

to rule over women or something like

that I didn't I didn't memorize it but

it would say be something like that is

it is real though well it's a succession

of power right and if the succession of

power is designed to always be passed

down to other men where does that leave

women okay then this is a servant role

so now we come to the nail always being

painted over what did you take from that

one I'm I missed this one

well maybe it's subtle and maybe it's

not there for everyone but for me this

was the idea that this structure that

men have placed into this world

is the paint on the wall right and we're

painting over perhaps some of the the

ideas of the nail so if we take the idea

of the nail to represents femininity and

it being painted over are men with their

Whitaker's table of precedency with

being compared to Shakespeare as the

end-all-be-all with the looking-glass

with Lewis Carroll are we painting over

the masculine version of the world onto

everyone and thus covering up women

covering up the nail covering up the

femininity to not allow them to have

excess pretty deep therefore for just

the nail great job and the points to you

sir well right after this is where we

have the Colonel's explore the role of

aunty curries seeking evidence of past

generations to determine whether they

belonged to the camps or tools yeah and

this is where she realizes recognizing

the mark is irrelevant yeah right

whether she realizes that this is

feminism or not on her wall her role is

stuck in that Whitaker's table of

precedency right matters not whether the

mark is there or not right she she has

been painted this color by men yeah

she's been told this is what you're

going to do and she can't break from

that right so what does she do now she

focuses on the tree outside which what

does a tree represent usually it's its

nature right but it's also typically

slow growth or slow change so is

Virginia Woolf saying that the change

that is needed for the recognition of

femininity and the equal status that

they deserve is something that will come

with slow growth over time she was a

little bit wrong though I mean women get

the right to vote in just a couple years

after this and they when it's

republished women I've already gained

the right to vote why I don't think I

don't think it stops just a vote right

like there's a lot more what inequality

know about me that's the first big

change I mean that's monumental change

of women getting a true voice in the

political decisions of our country and

of course we're not there yet don't

don't get me wrong I think that we have

a long way to go for equality between

everybody but yeah I think that

I think that sometimes it can happen at

an inner spark so it ends up the mark ah

that's a snail in passing the man who

was in the room the whole time yeah

that's funny right well it defines what

the mark is by the man right

that's us no what did you think about

that this kind of broke my heart a

little bit that one it was something

that was so mundane I know that it's

supposed to kind of represent I think

that slow change again maybe because the

snails traditionally they have like a

little circle you know their little

shell or whatever is circular and then

women are just kind of going in this

circular motion throughout their lives

but I felt like I felt like I didn't

want to know I felt like it broke the

story by learning what it was you know

how sometimes open-ended is good on

stories or movies or whatever yeah and

there is a point in sometimes in a story

when you explain too much meta chlorines

for example and I think that I think

that Wolfe has done this here you should

have closed out the story without

knowing what the snail is so for you you

you didn't want to know the mark was a

snail grande

correct no I personally liked that the

snail was representative of a slow

circular motion that they're stuck in

kind of symbolic of the slow organic

growth of a tree

okay I also liked that this represented

to the main narrator's thought process

in terms of being moving on to subjects

and subject and subject and subject

going around in a circle this is our

thought process to where we get lost in

our own thoughts in this own internal

thought a spiral if you will but I feel

like it's more a spider web than a

spiral for my brain and I think that's

one thing that maybe makes it very

compelling is that for me I'm not a

woman it's different for us and that's

okay but I don't think I think like that

and so I didn't recognize it as being an

important or significant because my

brain why scatters and jumps all over

the place is more web

could be fair though - there's there's

an argument to be made that every time

she gets to a negative of perhaps maybe

women's role in society perhaps to the

war there's a lot of war references in

this - in terms of the smoke and the

fire but I don't think that was my

strongest takeaway she always came back

to the marker yeah back back to the idea

of women being painted over by societal

or men structure put on top of them that

I thought that it was interesting to to

compare it to the idea that no matter

what happens whatever a thought process

that you go down to we're gonna get back

to that this is a man's run world yeah I

like that I guess that comes back the

idea at the very end it's a man who

discovers it and he's very nonchalant

about it and yeah I guess I just that

broke it for me but that makes sense now

in terms of stream of consciousness we

are no noobs when it comes to Faulkner

we've done a lot of walk around this

channel and we've done a lot of James

Joyce here recently too in terms of our

experience with this now Virginia Woolf

style when it comes to the stream of

consciousness I noticed she will snap

back to that mark like we talked about

but but I felt like it never really kind

of complete completed the thoughts like

a lot of these thoughts that were having

here I had to really dig for and I felt

like it just it wasn't as n400

thoroughly intended perhaps as I saw in

some of the other authors that we've

seen that have used stream of

consciousness so I imagine for a lot of

writers they could frustrate them a lot

of the open-ended trails that are just

snipped off to come back to the main

story with this mark yeah that's a good

point I feel like my problem was

struggling with Wolfe is I don't know

enough about her this is my very first

piece of reading of hers so I feel very

ignorant in a lot of ways but I think I

have figured out one thing of why I

struggled and that was this story as I

reflect back on it felt like a poem

right mmm and I think as a result I

struggled with it because very difficult

for me to analyze and I think that this

story is very much a poem style story

well let me ask you a question

I like what you said there would you say

this is more of a poetic philosophy and

the two things that I suck at oh so no

wonder I struggle with this story yeah

no I can see I can definitely see this

as a new literary category as poetic

philosophy right yeah no I think this is

definitely different and let me latch on

to something that you said there - we

are not extremely experienced with

Virginia Woolf I'm not turned off by

this this is something that we need to I

think do more Virginia Woolf of because

if I just three you in as your first

story for for example don't likely be

said Faulkner I just threw you into the

sound and the fury I think that's

probably one of the worst places to

start with him because I think it is

difficult to start there to really

understand William Faulkner's

philosophies I wonder is this story a

bad place to have started Virginia Woolf

I don't know but I will say that I need

to learn more about Virginia Woolf we

are going to do more of her to get that

experience and maybe that will unlock

some of the things that maybe seem like

mysteries to us right now agreed so in

terms of subjective ratings we typically

do a inspectional just pure enjoyment

what do we take from it and then also

analytical what do you think the

analysis can bring out and kind of show

us in terms of what it means to us as

people in a society's standards what are

your ratings gonna be so these two are

gonna be very different this time

usually most my ratings are pretty close

together but from an analytical

standpoint because I'm kind of grading

myself here as you said I think that

because we're ignorant of this and we're

learning the same is kind of when we

started off with Tolstoy and we

struggled and if you go back and watch

our videos we gave some of his early

stuff very low ratings but we've been

consistently going up as we've been

delving into our Tolstoy triggered a

shameless plug intended and as a result

I think that we've become better at it

so here for the mark on the wall for an

analytical standpoint I would give it a

6 because we're learning definitely I

think it'd be hired through a second

pass through for a joint and I'm gonna

give it a three because

just didn't enjoy the sporadic

subconscious brain barf that was taking

place I just I struggled with the

enjoyment of it so I'm gonna give that a

three

I think form a pure inspectional

enjoying perspective I'm probably at

like a 3.5 I really did not enjoy a lot

of the writing here there's a lot of

work to go through and in terms of

analytical rating I'm actually even

lower than you where I'm probably at

like a 5 where my takeaways from this

the felt very subjective branded in hey

analyzing the cause is always subjective

but I feel like I usually feel a lot of

authorial guide to lead me to certain

points this felt so open-ended around

like am I supposed to go towards the

world war 1 on these because there was

fire there was flame there was looking

through that and then there was eased to

write commentaries about feminism it was

all over the place so for me to hone in

and feel comfortable analytically I

didn't I'd ever read I never reached it

so for me it was a 5 analytically which

i think is harsh but to your point

earlier i think we need to get into more

wolf to maybe explore that and really

understand more of what her ethos is

what her standards are what her

philosophy is we need to learn more

about her to feel more comfortable in

this area I think as you said many times

before it is an author's responsibility

to their readers to give them some

directions or a map into these stories

and I just feel like maybe it's this

story or it's us or something did not do

a good job of providing some GPS

coordinates here yeah no I agree and and

maybe we would do more wolf and we'll

come back and see does that cement or

maybe help orient us yeah okay so all

right guys we do literature breakdowns

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discussions una out peace