Christian Butchers Christianity Every Time He Speaks | Sheikh Uthman Ibn Farooq | Hashim

Summary

This thought-provoking theological discussion centers on the question of why Jesus, as both fully God and fully human, was 'forsaken' by God during his crucifixion. The conversation explores the concept of Jesus bearing the sins of the world, despite God being holy and unable to commune with sin. The participants delve into the doctrine of the Trinity, the atonement, and the relationship between God the Father and God the Son, raising important questions about the nature of Jesus' sacrifice and the apparent contradiction of his abandonment by God. The discussion invites reflection on the mystery of divine salvation and the complexities of Christian theology.

Takeaways

• 😀 The core question raised is why Jesus, who is fully God and fully man, felt abandoned by God on the cross, despite fulfilling God's plan of sacrifice.
• 😀 The person asking the question struggles with the theological idea that God cannot have communion with sin, yet Jesus, who is God, takes on the sins of the world.
• 😀 The question of whether God the Father and God the Son operate under different rules regarding sin and abandonment is a central point of confusion.
• 😀 The reference to Psalm 37:27-29 in the conversation is used to argue that righteous people, including Jesus, should not be abandoned by God.
• 😀 In response, the speaker refers to Isaiah 53:6 to explain that Jesus, as the sin-bearer, was fulfilling God's plan by taking on humanity's sin.
• 😀 The speaker cites 2 Corinthians 5:21, which states that Jesus became sin for humanity, leading to the idea that the Father 'forsook' Him because of sin being placed on Jesus.
• 😀 The emotional and relational distance between God the Father and Jesus on the cross is explained as part of Jesus' experience of suffering, not a permanent abandonment.
• 😀 The person asking questions emphasizes the paradox of Jesus being God and taking on sin, yet experiencing abandonment, which leads to confusion about the integrity of the Trinity.
• 😀 Philippians 2:6-8 is referenced to clarify the distinction between God the Father and God the Son, explaining that Jesus, though fully divine, voluntarily took on human form.
• 😀 The conversation touches upon the Quranic verse (Surah An-Nur 45:5) about Allah promising to never abandon the righteous, drawing a parallel to the Christian belief about God’s faithfulness, yet presenting Jesus' cry as an anomaly.
• 😀 The discussion concludes with a suggestion to continue exploring these theological complexities through further study and personal reflection, highlighting the difficulty of reconciling these concepts without a deeper understanding.

Q & A

Why does the speaker ask why God forsook Jesus on the cross?

The speaker is questioning the apparent contradiction in Christian doctrine that while Jesus is considered God, He was abandoned by God on the cross. This is seen as confusing, given that the Bible states that God will never forsake the righteous, yet Jesus, who is righteous, feels abandoned.

How does the speaker reconcile Jesus' abandonment with the Old Testament's promise of God not forsaking the righteous?

The speaker refers to the idea in the Old Testament that God will not forsake the righteous, but Jesus, despite being righteous, cries out feeling forsaken. The speaker is questioning how this aligns with the belief that Jesus, as God, should not experience abandonment.

What is the Christian explanation for Jesus' cry of abandonment, according to the conversation?

The Christian explanation, according to the speaker, is that Jesus took on the sins of humanity, and God, being holy, cannot associate with sin. At that moment, God the Father 'forsook' Jesus as a consequence of bearing the sins of the world.

What does the speaker mean by 'God has no communion with sin'?

The phrase 'God has no communion with sin' refers to the Christian belief that God, in His holiness, cannot be in the presence of sin. This is used to explain why God, the Father, 'forsook' Jesus on the cross after He bore the sins of humanity.

What confusion does the speaker express regarding the relationship between God the Father and God the Son?

The speaker is confused about the claim that Jesus is God, yet He could bear the sins of humanity, which would require God to disassociate from Him due to sin. This creates a paradox, as the speaker believes it suggests a contradiction between the nature of God the Father and God the Son.

How does the Christian speaker respond when asked if Jesus is God?

The Christian speaker affirms that Jesus is indeed God, but distinguishes between God the Father and God the Son. While they are both fully God, they are distinct persons within the Trinity.

What Bible verse does the speaker refer to in discussing Jesus bearing the sins of humanity?

The speaker refers to Isaiah 53:6, which states, 'All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned everyone to his own way, and the Lord has laid on Him the iniquity of us all.' This verse is used to explain that Jesus bore the sins of humanity on the cross.

What does the speaker say about the nature of Jesus during His time on Earth?

The speaker asserts that Jesus, during His time on Earth, was both fully God and fully man. He emphasizes that Jesus is the Son of God and is distinct from God the Father, but shares in the same divine nature.

Why does the speaker reference Philippians 2 in this discussion?

The speaker refers to Philippians 2 to illustrate the concept of Jesus being both fully divine and fully human. Philippians 2 speaks about Jesus humbling Himself and taking on the form of a servant, which the speaker uses to explain how Jesus, though divine, became human and bore the sins of the world.

What is the ultimate recommendation the speaker gives in response to the questions?

The speaker suggests that the person asking these questions read the Quran and continue the discussion offline, outside of a public debate setting, in order to have a more private and thoughtful conversation about these theological issues.