Plato's Symposium: The Dialectic of Reason, Love, and Wisdom

Summary

The script explores Plato's 'Symposium,' a philosophical dialogue discussing love, reality, and virtue. It sets the stage with a drinking party, where Athenian aristocrats, including Socrates, share speeches on love's nature. The narrative unfolds with various perspectives on love, from heroic inspiration to physical desire, leading to Socrates' profound assertion that love is a spiritual yearning for eternal beauty and wisdom. The dialogue concludes with Alcibiades' interruption, symbolizing the allure of physical beauty over soulful virtue, highlighting the importance of philosophical love over base desires.

Takeaways

• 📚 The script is a detailed discussion on Plato's 'Symposium', highlighting its philosophical depth and poetic beauty.
• 🎭 'Symposium' is a dialogue that combines elements of comedy and high philosophy, exploring themes like love, reality, knowledge, virtue, and the soul.
• 🍷 The setting of 'Symposium' is a drinking party, where Greek intellectuals gather to discuss the nature of love, creating a juxtaposition of drunkenness and intellectual discourse.
• 💭 The dialogue features various speeches by different characters, each offering a unique perspective on love, leading to Socrates' speech which is considered the climax.
• 👥 Key characters include Socrates, Agathon, Phaedrus, Pausanias, Aristophanes, and Alcibiades, each representing different aspects of Athenian culture and thought.
• 🗣️ Socrates' speech, influenced by the teachings of Diotima, presents love as a spiritual force that mediates between the mortal and divine, aiming for beauty and wisdom.
• 🏋️‍♂️ Socrates contrasts the physical, lustful love described by Aristophanes with a love that seeks eternal values and the perfection of the soul.
• 🧐 Alcibiades' interruption of the symposium with his drunken praise of Socrates reveals the tension between physical beauty and the beauty of the soul.
• 🤔 The dialogue raises questions about the nature of true happiness and the role of philosophy in guiding human emotions and morality.
• 🏛️ The script suggests that the proper organization of one's soul and the cultivation of philosophical thinking are essential for personal and societal well-being.
• 🎭 The 'Symposium' is portrayed as a profound literary achievement that blends tragedy, comedy, art, and philosophy, leaving a lasting impact on the reader.

Q & A

What is the main theme of Plato's Symposium?

The main theme of Plato's Symposium is the exploration of the concept of love, discussing what love is, how it works, and why it is important in our lives.

Why is Symposium considered one of Plato's most profound and beautiful dialogues?

Symposium is considered profound and beautiful due to its poetic nature and the way it treats important Platonic themes such as reality, knowledge, virtue, the soul, freedom, slavery, good, and evil, all within the context of a philosophical discussion on love.

Who narrates the events of the Symposium?

The events of the Symposium are narrated by Apollodorus, who heard about the dinner party from someone who was actually there and decided to commit the account to memory due to its significance.

What is the setting of the Symposium?

The Symposium is set at a drinking party hosted by Agathon, an Athenian tragic poet, to celebrate his recent victory in a tragedy competition.

Who are some of the key participants in the Symposium's discussion on love?

Key participants in the Symposium's discussion on love include Agathon, Phaedrus, Pausanias, Aristophanes, Eryximachus, and Socrates, among others.

What is the significance of the order in which the participants give their speeches on love?

The order of speeches is significant as it builds a conceptual tension, with each speech either raising or decreasing the understanding of love, leading up to Socrates' speech, which is considered the high point of the dialogue.

What does Socrates claim about love in his speech?

Socrates, drawing from his conversation with Diotima, claims that love is a spirit that mediates between gods and men, yearning for beauty, perfection, and eternity, and is essential for the pursuit of wisdom and virtue.

How does Aristophanes' speech on love differ from the others?

Aristophanes' speech differs as it presents a mythological account of love, focusing on physical desire and the search for one's other half to regain wholeness, rather than on the spiritual or philosophical aspects of love.

What is the role of Alcibiades in the Symposium?

Alcibiades, although not giving a speech on love, interrupts the gathering while drunk and provides a commentary on Socrates, revealing his own unrequited love for Socrates and highlighting Socrates' focus on the beauty of the soul over physical appearance.

What is the final outcome of the Symposium?

The Symposium ends with a mix of comedy and tragedy as the participants, influenced by Alcibiades, abandon their philosophical discussion for excessive drinking and revelry, leaving Socrates to contemplate the nature of art and literature with Agathon and Aristophanes.

Outlines

00:00

🎭 Introduction to Plato's Symposium

The video script begins with an introduction to Plato's 'Symposium,' highlighting its significance as a profound and poetic dialogue that explores themes such as reality, knowledge, virtue, the soul, freedom, slavery, good, and evil. The speaker aims to discuss the symposium's nature, the context, the participants, their conversations, and the factors contributing to its status as a classic work of art and philosophy. The 'Symposium' is narrated by Apollodorus, who learned of the event from an attendee and committed the speeches to memory, suggesting the event's importance. The dialogue takes place at a drinking party hosted by the tragic poet Agathon to celebrate his victory in a tragedy competition, attended by influential Athenian gentlemen, including Socrates.

05:00

🏛️ Participants and Setting of the Symposium

The script continues to describe the participants of the symposium and the setting. Attendees include Agathon, the host and a celebrated tragic poet; Phaedrus, a handsome and intelligent young man favored by Socrates for his philosophical nature; Pausanias, an aristocratic figure known for his charm and wit; Aristophanes, a renowned comic genius representing both the artistic prowess and the moral failings of Greece; and several other notable individuals. The symposium is characterized as a philosophical drunk, combining elements of low comedy, such as drunkenness, with high philosophy. The attendees recline on couches, a traditional Greek dining setup, and are served large quantities of wine, setting the stage for an evening of intellectual and artistic exploration on the theme of love.

10:02

🎭 The Comic and Philosophical Interplay

The script delves into the roles of the participants, particularly Aristophanes, who is portrayed as the anti-Socrates, a hedonistic character who represents the physical and lustful aspects of human nature. His presence adds a layer of irony and comedy to the symposium, as he is both a respected artist and a figure of moral critique. The script also mentions other guests, such as Eryximachus, a doctor who represents the medical metaphor prevalent in Platonic thought, and Alcibiades, a charismatic but morally flawed politician. The symposium's speeches on love are meant to reveal the inner workings of the participants' souls, transitioning from bodily pleasures to the pursuit of higher virtues.

15:02

🍷 The Resolve to Stay Sober and Discuss Love

The script describes the participants' initial decision to have a sober evening, intending to engage in a philosophical discussion about love. They agree to give encomia, or speeches in praise of love, to understand its nature and significance in human life. This decision reflects an attempt to prioritize the soul's welfare over bodily pleasures. However, the script also foreshadows the eventual lack of willpower and philosophical understanding that leads them to become intoxicated, highlighting the struggle between the pursuit of virtue and the allure of hedonism.

20:03

🏅 Phaedrus' Encomium on Love as a Motivator of Heroic Virtues

The first speech on love is delivered by Phaedrus, who presents love as a divine force that inspires individuals to perform virtuous, famous, and glorious deeds. He cites examples from Homer's works, suggesting that love motivated Achilles and other Homeric heroes to achieve immortal fame and glory through acts of valor in war. Phaedrus' speech positions love as a catalyst for heroic actions, reflecting a 'silver-souled' interpretation that elevates love above common lust while stopping short of the Platonic ideal of love.

25:04

💖 Possanias' Enhancement on Love's Role in Soul Harmony

Possanias follows Phaedrus with an improved speech, emphasizing that love is a god-like entity that reconciles discordant elements within our emotional lives, promoting harmony in the soul akin to the harmony found in a healthy body. He also connects love with freedom, autonomy, and virtue, specifically the virtue of the soul rather than the body. Possanias' speech transitions the discussion from the impact of love on actions to its effect on the inner self, moving the dialogue further towards the Platonic conception of love.

30:06

🤡 Aristophanes' Comic Struggle and Physical Perspective on Love

Aristophanes takes his turn to speak on love but is initially hampered by hiccups, a comic element that underscores his physicality and lack of control. After receiving a physical remedy from the doctor Eryximachus, Aristophanes presents a myth that explains love as a desire for physical connection, rooted in the search for one's other half after being split by the gods. His speech reflects a purely physical understanding of love, devoid of any mention of the soul, aligning with his character as a devotee of Dionysus and Aphrodite.

35:06

🏥 Eryximachus' Speech on Love as the Origin of Medical Art

Eryximachus, the doctor, uses his medical expertise to discuss love's role in creating harmony from discordance, both physically and in the soul. He posits that love is the origin of the medical art, as it demonstrates how to reconcile disharmonious elements in our bodies to achieve health. By extension, love also helps in unifying the dissonant elements of the soul, leading to a harmonious and complete self that is blessed, virtuous, and wise. Eryximachus' speech is a brief but impactful contribution that sets the stage for Aristophanes' return.

40:08

🎨 Agathon's Eulogy to Love as the Source of Virtues

Agathon, the host of the symposium, delivers a eulogy to love as a god that embodies wisdom, courage, moderation, and justice—the four cardinal Platonic virtues. His speech, praised for its youthful eloquence, aligns love with virtue and positions it as a divine force. However, Socrates later critiques Agathon's speech as being reminiscent of the sophist Gorgias, implying that despite its appeal, it may lack substance.

45:08

🔍 Socrates' Insight on Love as a Mediator Between Gods and Mortals

Socrates presents his understanding of love, learned from the woman Diotima, as a powerful spirit rather than a god, since love is characterized by yearning for perfection and beauty, which gods, being perfect, do not experience. Love, according to Socrates, mediates between the divine and the mortal, connecting the physical with the metaphysical and unifying the discordant elements within our souls. It is a force that drives us towards philosophy, virtue, and the eternal pursuit of beauty and wisdom.

🎭 Alcibiades' Tribute and the Downfall of the Symposium

Alcibiades interrupts the symposium, arriving drunk and inciting the guests to indulge in wine and hedonistic pleasures. His presence symbolizes the Athenian people's preference for physical beauty and charisma over philosophical depth and virtue. Alcibiades' attempt to seduce Socrates is rejected, highlighting Socrates' commitment to the beauty of the soul over the body. The symposium devolves into a drunken revelry, with Socrates remaining the only clear-headed participant, reflecting the broader cultural decline and the triumph of superficiality over wisdom.

📚 The Closing: Socrates' Philosophy Amidst the Debauchery

The symposium concludes with Socrates engaging in a discussion about the nature of art and literature with Alcibiades and Agathon, demonstrating that tragic and comic poets share similar souls and are potentially dangerous due to their verbal gifts. Despite the debauchery, Socrates maintains his composure, covering the intoxicated poets and leaving the symposium to continue his day. The dialogue ends on a somber note, reflecting on the importance of organizing one's soul, respecting philosophy, and pursuing pure and excellent emotions over undisciplined lust.

Keywords

💡Symposium

A symposium in ancient Greece was a convivial gathering, often centered around drinking, where participants engaged in intellectual discussions. In the context of the video, Plato's 'Symposium' is a philosophical text that explores various themes, including the nature of love and reality, through the conversations held at such a gathering. The script describes it as a 'philosophical drunk' where high art and philosophy are combined with low comedy like drunkenness.

💡Plato

Plato was an ancient Greek philosopher and the founder of the Academy in Athens. He is renowned for his dialogues, of which the 'Symposium' is one, that explore profound philosophical concepts through the words of Socrates and other characters. The video script refers to Plato as a consummate genius who created a work of art and philosophy simultaneously, highlighting his importance in the philosophical canon.

💡Love

Love is a central theme in the 'Symposium' and is discussed in various forms throughout the dialogue. The script mentions that the participants at the symposium give speeches on love, each offering a different perspective on what love is and why it is important. The concept of love ranges from physical desire to a divine force that leads to virtue and wisdom.

💡Socrates

Socrates is a key figure in the 'Symposium' and is known for his dialectical method of questioning to elicit truth. The script describes Socrates as not being overly concerned with food or drink, focusing instead on the care of his soul. His speech on love, learned from Diotima, presents love as an ascent towards the eternal and divine, emphasizing the philosophical importance of love.

💡Diotima

Diotima is a mysterious figure who, according to the script, taught Socrates about love. She is presented as a wise woman who imparts profound knowledge about love as a spiritual force that mediates between the divine and the human, and as a means to achieve virtue and wisdom. Her teachings form the basis of Socrates' speech on love.

💡Agathon

Agathon is a tragic poet whose victory celebration provides the setting for the 'Symposium'. The script describes him as feeling proud of his achievements and wishing to share his joy with friends. His speech on love characterizes it as a god embodying virtues like wisdom, courage, moderation, and justice.

💡Aristophanes

Aristophanes is a renowned comic playwright known for his satirical and humorous plays. In the script, he is depicted as a hedonistic character who provides comic relief with his speech on love, which includes a myth about the origins of human desire for physical connection.

💡Alcibiades

Alcibiades is a historical figure and a prominent Athenian statesman and general. The script portrays him as someone who is admired for his charm and attractiveness but is also described as having an ugly soul. His drunken interruption of the symposium signifies a shift from philosophy to hedonism and highlights the contrast between physical beauty and inner virtue.

💡Philosophy

Philosophy is a key theme in the 'Symposium' and is represented through the intellectual discussions on love and the human condition. The script emphasizes the importance of philosophy in cultivating a well-ordered soul and political order, contrasting it with the undisciplined and lustful behaviors of the non-philosophical characters.

💡Virtue

Virtue is a central concept in the 'Symposium', closely tied to the concept of love. The script discusses how love can lead to virtue, particularly in Socrates' speech where love is presented as a ladder to higher forms of beauty and ultimately to virtue and wisdom. Virtue is also associated with the harmony of the soul and the pursuit of knowledge.

Highlights

Plato's Symposium is a profound and beautiful dialogue that explores themes of reality, knowledge, virtue, the soul, freedom, slavery, good, and evil.

The dialogue is narrated by Apollodorus, who heard about the dinner party from someone who was actually present.

The Symposium is a philosophical drunk, combining elements of low comedy and high philosophy around the theme of love.

Agathon, a tragic poet, hosts the Symposium, celebrating his victory in a tragedy competition, and invites influential Athenian gentlemen.

The guests recline on couches, engaging in a relaxed and luxurious activity that involves drinking wine and discussing love.

Fidris, a young man representing Athenian culture, is a favorite of Socrates for his philosophical nature and dialectical skills.

Aristophanes, the greatest of the Greek comedians, represents the anti-Socratic view and is known for his hedonistic lifestyle.

Eryximachus, a doctor, speaks on love as the origin of the medical art, uniting disharmonious elements in the body and soul.

Socrates' speech, based on lessons from Diotima, presents love as a spirit that mediates between the gods and men, yearning for beauty and perfection.

Alcibiades, a democratic politician, interrupts the Symposium drunk and praises Socrates, revealing his unrequited love and Socrates' focus on inner beauty.

The dialogue ends with a discussion on the nature of art and literature, with Socrates engaging with Agathon and Aristophanes.

The Symposium highlights the importance of organizing one's soul and the significance of philosophy in a political order.

The dialogue contrasts the undisciplined, lustful emotions of the 'bronze men' with the pure and excellent emotions that should guide morality.

Socrates' ability to maintain his sobriety despite heavy drinking demonstrates his well-organized soul and philosophical intellect.

The Symposium is a universal literary achievement, blending tragedy, comedy, high art, and low humor while exploring profound philosophical teachings.

The dialogue suggests that the true attractiveness and loveliness lie in the qualities of the soul rather than the body.

Transcripts

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plato's symposium is one of the most

profound and beautiful of the platonic

dialogues

of all the dialogues in the platonic

corpus it's the one that is probably the

most poetic

and at the same time it contains within

it

a treatment of reality knowledge virtue

the soul freedom slavery good evil a

remarkable

concordance

of important platonic themes come

together in the symposium

and what i'd like to do first

is talk about what a symposium is and

what the context of this dialogue is

and i'd like to talk about the people

who participate in it specifically the

people who spend their time

talking to socrates

and after that i'd like to talk about

what it is they say in specific

and then finally i'd like to talk about

what makes this a truly classic a truly

great work of art and philosophy at the

same time

possibly the hardest thing in the world

to do

is to write a great work of art or a

great work of philosophy but to write to

create a great work of art and a great

work of philosophy at the same time

requires a consummate genius and that's

why this is one of plato's most

important dialogues

it's perhaps second only to the republic

in terms of philosophical depth and it's

second to none in terms of poetic beauty

in the first case

the symposium was not narrated by

someone that was actually there it's

narrated by a guy named apollodorus

and he heard about this

wonderful dinner party

from someone that was actually there

and he got a good record of the speeches

that people gave

and he decided that the account that he

heard of this dinner party was so

sublime so perfect so important that he

committed it to memory

and for that reason alone it suggested

something important unusual was

happening at this dinner party this

philosophical meeting of great greek

intellects

what happens is something like this

the symposium and symposium is not just

a dinner party it's a drinking party

it's a party in which people intend to

go to get intoxicated something on the

order of a bachelor party nowadays it's

the kind of party where you go and drink

intentionally drinking beyond social

drinking drinking excessively that's

part of the entertainment so the

symposium is a kind of philosophical

drunk

all right and there's a tremendous comic

element in combining low comedy

such as drunkenness and hysteria and the

kind of crazy activities that you get

when people become intoxicated

and high philosophy high art

and the theme is perhaps the most

sublime and important in the platonic

corpus the theme is love

what love is how love works

what sort of approach we should take

towards love and why it is important in

our lives and in all lives

a remarkable

intellectual and artistic achievement

is what we're going to encounter today

a number of gentlemen athenian

aristocrats essentially the best

influential wealthy

well-established gentleman get together

at the house

of a man named agathon now agathon is a

tragic poet

the symposium that he's holding at his

house is a kind of celebration for the

fact

that he has just won a prize for

producing the best tragedy in the

competition that they hold for tragedies

each year in athens so he's become a

famous kind of best-selling author and

he's gotten the applause of all the

citizens of athens some 30 000 people

went to see this

series of plays he wrote and apparently

the tragedies were so fine that he

carried off first prize

so it's at a poet's house it's among

literary men

and agathon himself is feeling very good

very proud of himself proud of his

achievements and he wants to share his

joy with his friends so he invites a

bunch of them over and we get to meet

some of the great literary and

philosophical intellects of greece or

athens at the time

and agathon is certainly none

not second to none as far as these go

in addition to agathon the host of the

evening there are

probably 10 or 15 others at this party

and you have to remember what the

kind of the geography of the greek

dining room is like before you realize

what's going on here they don't sit at a

big table the way do we do a

thanksgiving dinner they don't sit down

and use knives and forks they recline on

couches so it's a very relaxed luxurious

kind of a of an activity and if you're

going to get drunk it's already it's

nice to be horizontal when you start out

because that way if you're going to be

drinking to excess you don't have any

place to fall to

so they're all going to sit around the

table and slaves are going to wait on

them and they're going to be brought

large quantities of wine and they're

going to drink

to toast the success of agathon in the

theater

so

these gentlemen get together we get

agathon in addition there are a number

of people who don't talk but among the

speakers there are some excellent

creatures excellent examples of the

greek literary mind there's a young man

named fidris

fiedris is the interlocutor is the

respondent in one of the great platonic

dialogues he is a clever intelligent

handsome well-spoken young man

he represents the best in athenian

culture

and he is a particular favorite of

socrates because he has a philosophical

nature he is dialectical he is a good

thinker he's a good talker and he's just

the sort of guy we'd want to invite in

to get his views on love

if you ever get a chance to read the

corpus of the platonic dialogues and

you're looking at the symposium and i

hope that you do after hearing this

lecture you should certainly turn to the

theodorus as well the theorist is also

concerned with the topic of love and

it's not accidental that fidris is going

to be here and he's going to be able to

give a speech on the topic of love

in addition to fidris

and agathon we also have paul sannias

paulsanius is an important and

quasi-aristocratic figure he

participates in greek intellectual and

philosophical discussion and he too is

represents the best in athenian society

handsome charming literate well-spoken

witty just the sort of man we want into

a platonic dialogue

in addition to these two we have

aristophanes the greatest of the greek

comedians any of you read aristophanes

if you have he represents

the comic genius of greece

the dramatic artistic genius of greece

and in plato's eyes he also represents

all that's wrong with greece

he represents the man who is entirely

given up to bronze pleasures there's a

wonderful line when our esophagus is

first introduced in the dialogue someone

suggested says that aristophanes is a

very pious man on account of the fact

that he spent his whole life

worshiping dionysus and aphrodite

which means that he's a chronic drunk

and a woman chaser

which shows you just how pious he is

all right so we've made not only

divinities of our vices but we've also

decided to create art which will justify

them and perhaps give these vices to

other people aristophanes is the bad

poet of the republic who must be

censored because his poetry drives

people from ignorance to worst ignorance

from mere ignorance to outright vice so

aristophanes

is going to

play a very important part in the

symposium he is in some respects the

anti-socrates

he is a man who is not only a bronze man

but he knows what he's doing and he

likes it

all right he's

hedonistic and he's got an attitude

about it he's just had to tell everyone

else that this is the only way worth

living the satisfaction of vehement

desires one after another as much as

conceivably possible is what it means to

be a human being

now in the republic socrates had a

name for people like this

and when you collect them together in a

big bunch they form a city and this is

the city of swine

and aristophanes is pig number one

he's the greatest of pigs he's an

articulate pig he's a poetic pig he's a

gifted pig which is what makes him a

dangerous pig

yes aristophanes is going to get his not

only aristotle he's a dangerous man and

not only is he a pig but he's also had

the temerity the nerve to write a play

about socrates it's called the clouds

has any if you're going to read the

clouds what it is is a kind of lampoon

of greek philosophy in particular

socrates is in that play and socrates is

mocked scorned made to seem a foolish

man who's been inquiring into things

that no man could possibly understand or

have any good use for no aristophanes

has lampooned socrates and now in this

dialogue plato is going to

go for payback now aristophanes gets his

so since aristophanes isn't writing this

he's going to have to say whatever plato

wants him to say and he's going to say

kind of grunting swinish things all

through this and people are going to

find him very interesting and intriguing

but he's going to pay one after another

all the qualities which are attributed

to aristophanes here are the qualities

which we are going to associate with the

bronze man the tyrannical man the evil

man

and what makes him worse is that not

only is he bronze evil and tyrannical

he's also the sort of man that

talks very well as well all right so not

only is he articulate

but he's also articulate in an evil way

so taken together that's the worst

possible combination of human

characteristics the anti-socrates makes

his appearance

also

irony is a constant literary trophy in

this as in all the platonic dialogues

and one of the great ironies of this

piece of work is that the comedian is

going to provide us with comic relief

the comedian turns out to be the clown

and we're going to make fun of him all

through this this is going to be

at the same time

hilarious comedy and also high art and

also among the greatest works of greek

philosophy an amazing intellectual

achievement

now let's go to our other guests we have

a couple of other important ones

we have one named eric simakis eric

simicus is a doctor and as soon as you

hear the word doctor in any of the

platonic dialogues always freeze right

because doctoring and medicine are big

metaphors in the republic and they're

essential metaphors in all of platonic

thinking as soon as you hear the word

doctor you should think is he a doctor

of the body or a doctor of the soul well

it turns out in this case eric simakis

is a regular old doctor he's a doctor of

the body when you get hurt when your arm

gets broken he fixes you if you get a

disease he cures you he takes care of

bodies

if you remember from the republic

socrates is the doctor of souls

socrates is the man who diagnoses soul

sickness prescribes remedies for the

sicknesses of the soul

well the tension the conflict and the

resolution of such conflicts between

body and soul is in some respect the

main theme of the symposium and we are

going to find a transition from the man

who is merely a doctor of bodies to a

man who is a doctor of souls from a

concern with the welfare of the body to

concern with the welfare of the soul

from a concern with pleasures of this

world to pleasures of the higher

superior world

from concerns about the cave and its

shadows to concerns about ultimate

reality

an amazing intellectual achievement

beyond eric simicus and aristophanes and

agathon we are also going to have

a number of other interlocutors most of

whom are given the chance to give a

speech

and all these speeches lead up to

socrates socrates speech is going to be

in some respects the high point of this

dialogue and his praise of love will be

the true praise of love which will show

all these earlier attempts at rhetoric

to be inferior to be not based upon true

knowledge and true understanding

and although that would seem like a

logical way of concluding this dialogue

it doesn't end there because we're going

to go for a complete comic resolution of

all these tensions at the end of the

dialogue alcibiades perhaps the greatest

of the bad greeks

makes an appearance and he's stone drunk

he's howling drunk when he arrives and

he introduces his typical decorum to the

party

as a result we move from

sobriety to intoxication we move from

philosophy to

hedonism

we move

down the divided line so that socrates

has been so laborious trying to bring us

up

so alcibiades will come in at the end of

it and if you know through these

peloponnesian wars alcibiades is one of

the most important of the democratic

greek politicians

alcibiades has everything in the world

going for him he is rich

he is handsome he is intelligent he is

articulate the only drawback is that he

is bad he is very very bad he is a lover

of pleasure he is a lover of honors he

is a lover of anything except the things

that socrates thinks he ought to love

which is knowledge wisdom and virtue he

is a particular friend of socrates

and

he has a great deal to say about

socrates he is going to be the only one

who does not give a speech about the

nature of love he will give us a speech

about the nature of socrates

and his speech and praise of socrates

will resolve and connect many of the

philosophical themes that are proposed

in the republic and are continued in the

symposium

parenthetically before i go on to the

actual plot of the discipline or plot of

the dialogue

all of the platonic dialogues fit

together they mesh together like parts

of a jigsaw puzzle they do not exist by

themselves the way a particular piece of

music from say beethoven will all of

these connect to each other the

metaphors that are established in the

republic like the myth of the cave or

the gold silver and bronze in your soul

will be recapitulated and reviewed in

great dialogues like the symposium and

all of them presuppose each other they

form a kind of circle a kind of ring in

which one idea is connected to the other

and together they form an entire

comprehension an entire assessment of

the human condition so make no mistake

when i come and do this symposium i'm

really doing platonic ideas just in this

particular instantiation and they're

really going to have everything to do

with what you heard last time when we

reviewed the republic

so let's think about

the actual plot they're all getting

together at agathon's house and socrates

has been going there but all of a sudden

on the way

he falls into a bit of abstraction he

starts to think and the problem with

soccer is he thinks a little too much

it's not normal it's not healthy

and he's just sitting there in wrapped

attention

like this

his friend decides to go on without him

it's very hard to drag socrates in like

this

as a consequence he's late for the party

when the other

members of the party arrive at the

symposium

one of them says well what kind of a

party are we going to have tonight

judgment or what last night's party was

like and most of them say no

right because they've been drinking

excessively at that point so none of

them remember what last night's party is

like and one of them says are you sure

you want to drink heavily tonight i'm

really still hungover from yesterday

and all them say you know i also am

hungover from yesterday and i'll tell

you i just can't keep the pace up that

we're living we're drinking heavily we

really are having a very good time we're

pursuing pleasure with a kind of

frenzied abandoned because we know no

other good so they decide

not because they're drawn to the good

not because they're drawn to moderation

but because it's just too hard on the

body and mind or the body and the mental

faculties that they're going to have a

sober evening

now the irony here of course is that

later on in the evening they're all

going to get drunk

because they haven't got the willpower

they haven't got the philosophical

knowledge they haven't got the

healthiness of the soul which allows

them to achieve the platonic virtues but

they're trying their best they say at

least while our bodies won't put up with

it we'll try and stay sober for a while

in particular eric simicus our doctor

he says gentlemen

i'd like to point out to you now that

we've decided to have a sober evening

that overindulgence indulgence in

alcohol is a very bad thing for the

human body note the emphasis on the

human body it's a very bad thing for the

human body and he says furthermore that

i can never be part of any intent to

consume excessive amounts of alcohol

particularly when i'm still hungover

from last night

right constant juxtaposition of low

comedy and high philosophical thought is

what makes us one of the great works of

art in the western tradition

well they sit down and socrates

eventually arrives after the dinner has

already been served the symbolic import

being the socrates is not terribly

concerned with food or drink he's

concerned with taking care of his soul

which is why he stayed where he was

thinking about things until he

continued and completed the thought that

he had socrates soul comes first all the

rest of these guys they get together and

body comes first they eat they drink

they sit down and they decide that

they're going to have a sober evening

because they have no choice their bodies

won't hold up to it as soon as they

decide to have a sober evening they also

decide to get rid of the flute girl the

flute girl is a hired prostitute but

since their sex lives are as scandalous

as their you know as their consumption

of alcohol they've decided that look

they have to moderate themselves a

little bit out of physical necessity

rather than out of philosophical

obligation

we're going to get rid of alcohol for

the time being we're going to get rid of

sex for the time being and we're going

to move into the realm of pure

discussion

and what they decide to do is hold a

discussion on love

what they propose to do is all sitting

around this table drinking a little bit

of wine for the sake of refreshment not

of course to get drunk

they're going to discuss love and

they're going to try and discern what

love is how you find out about love what

properties love has and why we ought to

be concerned with love why is love an

important element in human life

and so they agree that they're all going

to give encomia on love

an encomium is a speech in praise of

someone right and they're in comey on

love

are going to try and capture what makes

love important why love should be of

concern to either the philosophical

person or the one that just wants to dry

out for the evening

and in either case

their statements about love will tell us

a great deal about the workings of their

inner psyche about what sort of men they

are you can almost say that you can find

out about a person by the sort of things

that they love and the sort of love that

they have and that that tells you all

you need to know about the inner

workings of the soul and of course this

transition from their body to their soul

to find out what the real marrow of them

is is the essence of platonism and what

the platonic dialogues are all about

they're all concerned with soul rather

than body

there are seven speeches

socrates that's cleanup he comes in

sixth

and then at the end we'll get alcibiades

the first speech is by fiedris now

friedrichs is a handsome intelligent

articulate young man

and he gives a very what we might call a

silver souled interpretation of love

love peter says is a god a god that

inspires us to do virtuous famous

glorious things and he gives some

examples of the kind of virtuous famous

glorious things that love inspires us to

do and he quotes from homer saying that

achilles motivated by love would never

do anything dishonorable and won himself

immortal fame and glory among all human

beings because he was motivated by love

love motivates in other words the heroic

man to the homeric virtues the virtues

of achilles the virtues of the homeric

heroes the men who were valorous in war

never were afraid were completely

courageous maybe not especially smart

not terribly philosophical but it

allowed them at least to do glorious

things in other words love allows us to

move from bronze concerns in life to

silver concerns

it takes us halfway up because his

conception of love is a halfway house

between

common lust and the platonic conception

of love which we will get at the end so

we're moving halfway up the divided line

here

love in feeders is you it's an

incomplete but still noble-minded view

is that which motivates us which prods

us and stimulates us to do heroic

actions

now fidris gives a lovely speech it's

moving and thank god it's short he runs

right through it tells us that love

makes us do wonderful things and

everyone's very pleased with the young

man he's acquitted himself quite well

obviously talking with socrates as he

does

in the other dialogue called the

theaters has done him some good he may

not know everything but at least he can

talk all right

fidris finishes his speech

and the next speech is by a another man

named possanias and posanius gives a

very fine speech which improves on the

speech of fidris it's worth noting here

that each one of these speeches improves

or falls back from the earlier speech

you can think of the symposium as being

organized the way a piece of classical

music is organized there is a kind of

conceptual tension between the speeches

and you are either raising that tension

by increasing the volume and tempo of

the ideas or you are decreasing the temp

the tempo decreasing the connection by

sliding off into some absurd kind of

speech which will happen when we do with

the next speech but let's come back to

possanias possanius tells us something

very important

possanias tells us

that love is a god which is a very

important idea that it's not it's

something divine it's not merely human

and in addition not only is love of god

but love somehow helps us reconcile

the different elements in our emotional

life

and love in some respect

allows us to unify the dissonant

elements in our psyche it allows us to

create a harmony of the soul

analogous to the harmony that we might

get in a healthy body

in addition to that he says that love is

somehow connected with freedom and

autonomy and virtue which is very

important because the kind of virtue

we're talking about here is the virtue

of the soul it is not the homeric virtue

of the body it doesn't mean turning

yourself into arnold schwarzenegger

return means turning yourself into

someone that is good of soul not of body

that's what's important about paul

stannis's speech he improves on the

speech of fidris

by moving the discussion from the

effects of

love on one's actions to the effective

one of love on one's soul on one's inner

self

possanias allows us to move on up the

divided line away from body towards soul

and that's what's important about him

now falseness gives a very nice speech

he quits himself quite well and now it's

aristophane's turn aristophanes the

great comedian is now to become the

great clown

aristophanes is about to give a

wonderful speech about love and

doubtless he knows a great deal about

love because he's constantly worshiping

dionysus and aphrodite

right he's a drunken woman chaser so he

knows all about it doubtless

and

he would like to but he's been

overeating and over drinking so he gets

the hiccups and he's constantly doing

this and he's hiccuping he can't talk

hiccupping in this case is symbolic it's

not just funny and it is funny because

the idea of a guy trying to give a

lovely eloquent speech and having the

hiccups because he's a drunk all right

undercuts the seriousness and the

gravity of the theme we're discussing in

addition to that it turns out that he

doesn't know what to do he has to ask

eric simakus you're the doctor

help me out i'm choking i have i need

some help i can't give the speech please

what can i do eric simakis the doctor of

bodies prescribes go gargle with water

and if you can't gargle with water go

tickle your nostrils with a feather so

you'll sneeze sneezing another kind of

reaction another kind of spasm alcibiade

or not alcibiades but aristophanes here

is made to be seen as the man that is

nothing but physical he is a set of

responses

to physical stimuli he hiccups he laughs

he sneezes he pops around the room

constantly pray to physical stimuli he

almost is a man without a soul he's the

ultimate swine and he's happy like that

too he doesn't know what it would be

like to miss

having a soul he's a pig

so naturally our pig

needs a physical cure and he's going to

get that from the doctor eric simakus so

he goes in and tickles his nostril with

a feather and while he's in there

performing this glorious operation eric

simkus decides to take his place

in the speeches and eric simakus our

doctor of souls or our doctor of bodies

says

in continuing the argument that had been

put together by possanias he says that

not only

does love reconcile discordant elements

in the body it also reconciles

discordant elements in the soul

since eric simacus is a doctor he says

that love is actually the origin of the

medical art because it shows us how to

reconcile

disharmonious elements in our physical

structure to create the thing we call

health of the body

in addition to that by a kind of

extrapolation

love also allows us to glue together the

opposite and dissonant elements of the

soul to form a harmonious complete whole

which makes us both blessed and virtuous

and wise

so for eric simicus love is a god love

is a god which allows us to create

harmony out of dissonance

which allows us to create unity out of

plurality

which allows us to create

human being out of the comings and

goings out of the out of human becoming

it allows us to create something

permanent

and eternal

it asks us to perfect ourselves and to

protect those that we love

so eric simeka's speech is very moving

it's a very beautiful speech and

it's rather brief

and it just serves to fill in until

aristophanes can be brought out and

lampooned he's back now erickson

michaels is just about finished with his

speech and we bring in aristophanes the

low comedian

and he points out immediately that

eriksen because you're a wonderful

doctor i was in there sneezing and

having these various spasms hiccuping

and now i'm back and i'm ready to talk

one of the most important ironies here

is that aristophanes speech will be

another series of verbal hiccups

it will be a series of spasms that he

doesn't cannot control and does not

understand and nobody else understands

them either

he is going to make up a series of myths

which he believes accounts for love but

it only accounts for aristophanes kind

of love it accounts for the physical the

animal the brutal sort of love it

accounts for bronze love love in the

sense of lust love in the sense of the

copulation of animals rather than the

union of human beings

it is physical love

and aristophanes gives us a wonderful

myth and it's just like poets when they

don't know what they're talking about to

think of some myth that's dangerous to

themselves and dangerous to others that

it indicates their complete lack of

understanding of the nature of

philosophy and virtue and goodness

funny issues turn out to be aristophanes

the man who doesn't like socrates

works out very nicely

well

what our stephanie says is this

way back many many years ago at the very

beginning of time people didn't look

like they do now no

they were smacked together

so that they had in fact two heads

four arms

four legs and they all used to get

around by doing cartwheels you know the

way clowns do at the circus right well

lots of people used to look promote

themselves way back when when we were

smack together and there were three

kinds of sex back then there were

combinations of two men

there were combinations of two women

and there were combinations of man and

woman

and these creatures

are actually our ancestors they are what

we are descended from

and that is the perfect human being in

other words as we are now we are not as

we were at one time

and we are somehow limited partial

incomplete

and this has everything to do with

mythology and love

according to aristophanes the myth goes

something like this

back in the beginning of time when we

all had two legs four arms four heads or

two legs four arms and four

legs

back then

we tried to usurp the position of the

gods we were all sublimely happy because

in this connection of bodies that we

have where the arms and the legs form

one big hole and we all go cartwheeling

around it's analogous or very similar to

a situation which we are constantly

joined in sexual connection in other

words back in the in the good old days

people had sex all the time constantly

and as a matter of that they couldn't

help but have sex because they were

physically literally joined together it

wasn't possible to stop having sex

aristotle thinks that's great he can't

wait to go back to that he'd love it

it really pleases him to death and of

course it's low comedy no doubt

but because we were so sublimely happy

we decided to use serve for our position

and try and climb mount olympus and take

away the position of the gods to force

the gods out and to make gods of

ourselves

this made zeus very upset

and zeus was so upset he sent down

thunderbolts and decided to split human

beings into two parts into parts that

you and i are now only one head per

person only two arms per person only two

legs

split the human

being into two

and thereafter

to teach them a lesson

move the heads around so they're looking

in the opposite direction move the

genitals up

and then allow them to locomote on two

legs

instead of cartwheeling around the way

they used to

and as a consequence of this

the human condition is one of

incompletion we are not complete we are

not finished we constantly go about

looking for our other half

and this for aristophanes is what love

is it is not a god the way it was in the

earlier speeches it is a desire it is a

desire to have physical bodily

connection with something else that is

the object of your desire and it is

because you are not complete as you are

aristophanes discussion is exclusively

related to bodies it has no mention of

souls whatever because aristophanes is a

pig and doesn't know that he has a soul

mate hell he may not have a soul

so aristophanes is concerned with the

union of bodies and with legitimizing

and accounting for why we have such a

tremendous lust to connect in a physical

way or maybe he's trying to say that's

why he has such

a lust to connect in a purely physical

way since he's been such a devotee of

dionysus and aphrodite

perhaps what aristophanes is doing here

is trying to create a myth which

legitimizes the uncontrolled lust

and the crazy lunatic passion the frenzy

of physical desire that characterizes

aristophanes whole life

the neglect of the philosophical

development of one's soul

in preference to continuous vehement

gratification of desire

so in other words aristophanes here is

creating a lying myth which tells us why

he is the way he is and which takes his

behavior his constant pursuit of

pleasure both in the cup and in the bed

as being not only normal but desirable

given the way the gods constructed the

world a very convenient myth if you

think about it

now at the end of his

myth it's a very entertaining idea but

he says that now all the people in the

world are either heterosexual

or there are women who are homosexual

and there are men who are homosexual and

he accounts for heterosexuality

homosexuality and women and

homosexuality in men by referring back

to what they were originally

whoever you were originally separated

from when the god split you off well of

course you're looking to connect up with

that once again and once you find that

you can't imagine anything would make

you happier than doing that

now aristophanes has some important

things to tell us about the gods here

this is an important religious myth

if we don't give appropriate sacrifices

to the gods and if we show them any kind

of disrespect

zeus may well take it in his head one

day to drop a thunderbolt on us as we

are split us right down the middle and

then we'll just be one leg hopping

around and we'll have to find three

people to have sex with

and that'll be a very inconvenient thing

so instead of doing that what we're

going to end up doing is trying to get

beyond that and the only way that we're

going to be able to do that

is by saying

yes we love the gods we think they're

wonderful and we hope that if we're

really good to them and if we give them

the right kind of sacrifices the gods

will be thoughtful enough to rejoin us

we can constantly have sex all the time

that's what hope is for if you are

really hopeful and you're really good to

the gods the gods will do you a big

favor and allow you to have sex

constantly that's

aristophanes idea of human felicity of

human happiness he's a pig

now let's get beyond aristophanes the

next one who replies to him and it's

funny that aristotle says i don't want

to be making jokes about my speech

although he likes to laugh at everyone

else he's very vain and doesn't like

people to laugh at him and of course

there's so many ironies written into him

if you stop and think about it have a

look at the symposium sometimes he's far

and away the most common character

the next speech comes from

a gentleman named agathon he's the guy

who leads who owns the house and he's

having the party he gives a lovely

speech

and what's lovely about the speech is

that it says that

love is a god so we're going to move

away from the from the devaluation of

love that we get with aristophanes again

we're moving up the ladder the next

speech we get with agathon says that

love is a god

that it is the source of wisdom courage

moderation and justice which just

happened to be the four cardinal

platonic virtues that were sketched out

in the republic it didn't get into the

symposium by accident in fact it got

there because this the platonic corpus

forms one whole set of ideas an entire

approach to the human condition

so we find out that love is full of

virtue and that love is a god and such

like things and then he closes up his

love little speech and people clap for

him because they thought that his

youthful eloquence had been very moving

and he acquitted himself very well now

socrates comes up and in his own ironic

way says

agathon i think that was a wonderful

speech a wonderful speech it reminds me

of a guy named gorgeous gorgeous is one

of the great sophists one of the great

liars one of the great professional

pleaders in greece and when socrates

says that's a wonderful speech it

reminds me of gorgeous right what he's

really saying is that's a dreadful

speech but i haven't got quite time to

straighten all the points out he has a

quick question and answer with him and

it almost immediately proves that

agathon doesn't know what he's talking

about and it's all gibberish

but at the end of his second he says

well even if it is gibberish don't worry

about that it was a wonderful speech

well we move right into socrates speech

what socrates says is that he learned

what he knows about love from a woman

named diotma and a dyathma taught him

that love is not a god because gods are

perfect and love still has yearning in

it he yearns for perfection it yearns

for beauty it yearns for completion and

the gods yearn for nothing because they

are whole and perfect so love is not a

god and yet love is not pure animal lust

the way it is for aristophanes love is a

spirit a very powerful spirit it is a

spirit which connects heaven and earth

it is a spirit which connects the

profane and the sacred

it is a spirit which connects the

physical and the metaphysical it is a

spirit which unifies the dissonant

elements in our soul

and in the discipline and it unifies the

dissonant elements in our relations to

other people

love then is something that mediates

between the gods and men

now what's interesting about this is

that most of these earlier speeches

about love had been at least implicitly

homosexual

socrates speech indicates that he

learned about love from a woman named

diatna

which is a move away from that

homosexuality but it's not a move

towards heterosexuality don't get this

wrong socratic love

has almost nothing to do with sex in

other words it has a physical component

to it but only the most attenuated

element of physical connection

socratic love is a union of souls

socratic love is an attempt to create

something permanent amidst the change of

human life

socratic love is an attempt to connect

at the level of souls and because the

soul has no gender the connection of

souls is neither heterosexual nor

homosexual it is only in a very

attenuated and metaphorical way sexual

at all it is the communion of two souls

in an attempt to create something

eternal and perfect and divine it is an

attempt to create perfection in your own

soul and in the soul of your beloved

there is the wonderful passage in which

socrates says that he learned from

that love is the yearning for eternity

it's the longing for immortality and

that's a beautiful poetic line it's one

of the greatest lines in the history of

philosophy

love is the yearning for eternity it

explains a lot of things you ever seen a

a schoolboy

carve a

heart into a tree and say john and jane

forever

it's easy enough to see how john and

jane got there but you always wonder

about the forever and why that should

occur to a school boy and every school

boy

it's because when we fall in love

there's something in us that learns that

this should go on forever

and that amidst the comings and goings

the construction and the destruction

the development and the retrogression of

human life and human things it offers us

a glimpse at something permanent and

eternal and perfect

and in fact when we fall in love with

someone else

we are not falling in love with their

body we are not falling in love with the

meat that's there we are falling in love

with their soul

and we are falling in love with their

soul only insofar as that soul gestures

as something permanent and eternal and

perfect and universal and that is the

form of the beautiful if you remember

the last lecture where professor ricci

explained to you the platonic theory of

forms the divided line we move up the

ladder out of the cave to the realm of

light well one of the things that is up

in that realm of forms is the perfectly

attractive thing the perfectly lovely

thing the perfectly excellent thing and

that is the form of the beautiful a

perfect eternal transcendent beauty

that all people recognize and cannot

help but wish to possess forever

their lover anytime you fall in love

you'll notice

that nobody else sees why your lover is

as beautiful as you think they are

the reason why is that they're looking

at the body and you're looking at the

soul you see something or at least

what's hinted here is that something

that goes on forever and that only your

mind your soul can apprehend bodies have

nothing to do with it or next to nothing

to do with it it gives you a stimulus

towards thinking about the loveliness of

an individual soul from the loveliness

of an individual soul

you extrapolate and move up to the

loveliness in many souls and then from

the loveliness in many souls to the

loveliness in the human soul in general

and from the loveliness in the human

soul the loveliness to knowledge to

eternal things you are moving up

the

cave moving out of the realm of shadows

and appearances towards reality

in teaching him this doctrine called

pursuit of beauty

this this loving desire to create

something permanent and eternal

calls it the ladder of beauty the ladder

of beauty

is a kind of

intrinsically attractive force that

perfect love

generates in us it forces up us up out

of the cave

out of the world of shadows to the realm

of final appearances

consider the following case

go back to your grandparents

your grandparents when they're married

were probably 20 years old and they're

probably both beautiful perfectly to

adolescence

if they were still in love at 70 it's

not because they were still beautiful

what they fell in love with was each

other's souls

and the soul goes on forever and even if

they are not beautiful any longer they

still see a kind of beauty there it

hints it to them as something that goes

on forever and that's why it's possible

to love someone that isn't physically

around anymore

because love real love refers to the

soul and not the body and whether the

body is there is more or less irrelevant

once you've found the truth beauty and

the true love the true wisdom

love drives us on

towards

philosophy towards virtue towards

perfection

that's the message of socrates learned

from diatoma it is very clear that

socrates is still in love with dharma

and that in fact the interaction that

they had between their souls and

learning about the true nature of love

is a perfect instantiation of what

platonic love is

the re-interaction in words between

socrates and diagna

that is to discourse

what sex is to bodies in other words

bodily sex generates physical

immortality by creating progeny

soul sex

creates immortality by the construction

of perfect beauty perfect knowledge

perfect virtue perfect human excellence

diatoma

and

her teachings have made socrates able to

understand

that the path

to knowledge and virtue and wisdom

is paved with love and that we will not

have the possibility of moving up

the divided line out of the cave into

philosophical clarity until and unless

we manage to

love in the way that plato suggests that

human beings are capable in a way that's

that aristophanes could not even imagine

now at the end of socrates speech and

it's a wonderful speech because it

implicitly criticizes aristophanes it

offers us one of the most profound and

moving accounts of love in the western

tradition

the next thing and the last speech that

we're going to get

is that of alcibiades alcibiades the man

who helped destroy his culture

alcibiades the democratic politician

everyone thinks he's attractive charming

wonderful interesting and lovely the

only difficulty is is that he is not a

philosopher and he's a very very bad man

alcibiades is also in love with socrates

and he wants to have sex with socrates

it's actually spurns him because he has

a beautiful body and an ugly soul

and that drives our st that drives

alcibiades wild the vanity overtakes him

and he flies into a rage he cannot

control himself whenever he deals with

socrates he bursts into the party at the

end of socrates speech drunk

howling drunk and again this is the man

that everyone admires the man who can't

control himself whatever he comes in and

says gentlemen i can't believe you're

all sober let's get good and drunk and

here this is the critical turning point

in the dialogue socrates with his speech

has been trying to bring these gentlemen

these men up from the realm of

appearance to the realm of reality and

now they have to make a choice will they

go for the man with the beautiful soul

or will they go for the man with the

beautiful body they go body immediately

and they all start drinking

and what socrates to think what's the

point of talking to these people

i mean they're sober now what's the

point of talking once they get drunk

one of the funny lines in this one of

the most ironic lines in this

piece of work is that socrates drinks

heavier than anyone because they insist

that he do so but he never gets drunk

ever

which tells you something about the man

with a well-organized soul about the

truly philosophical intellect

well

drinking begins

and then our

alcibiades is persuaded

to give an encomium on socrates and

talks about his relations with socrates

and it turns out that alcibiades thinks

very highly of himself that he wishes to

have socrates as a lover and he's tried

to seduce socrates several times the

only difficulty is that socrates laughs

at him which is something that someone

like alcibiades cannot cope with he's

very vain he's handsome he's witty he's

articulate he looks like robert redford

and socrates turns him down

and that crushes him instead socrates

says well to tell you the truth i'm

looking for beautiful souls and you have

a beautiful body and your soul is really

ugly on the other hand socrates is known

for his physical ugliness he looks like

a seder he's short he's fat he's balding

he's got a flat nose he's an ugly guy

why is it that everyone seems to fall in

love with him it goes to show you that a

philosophical soul will out and that in

fact the true loveliness and the true

attractiveness is to be found in

qualities of soul not body

so ours so also by this gives a a long

and comey about socrates says that he's

like a seder marxist

it's like a statue of the gods salinas

and inside the statue when you take the

top off what you find out is actually

little replicas of the gods inside this

is a recapitulation of the difference

between body and soul when you take

socrates body away and you look at the

soul you see that inside that ugly body

is a beauty of soul that nothing else in

the room nothing else in the world can

match

and he says that's how you bewitch

people socrates

when you start talking to them you give

them the best speeches in the world and

there's something attractive about that

that no one can argue with not even me

and i'm beautiful

that's very hard for him to deal with

the consequence

of his interaction with socrates is that

he feels ashamed of himself that he says

that maybe i shouldn't be engaged in

democratic politics maybe i should

perfect my soul now the subtext here is

this

this is being written after the

peloponnesian wars

one of the key figures in the

peloponnesian wars the wars between

sparta and athens is alcibiades at a

critical junction in the war he goes up

in front of the people and makes a

wonderful speech

persuading them that the only thing to

do is to attack syracuse which is an

important city that's in sicily and this

expedition is a complete disaster and

this expedition loses the war and as a

consequence of the advice of alcibiades

his entire culture is destroyed

so it seems that a man who is passionate

and yet who has no

concern with developing his soul and

with learning and with learning true

knowledge is going to be bad for himself

and bad for his culture he will harm

himself he will harm the people that

care for him

socrates is trying to persuade him to

give up politics

socrates is trying to make a good man of

him and he'll have none of it

and

the bad influence that he exerts when he

comes in

makes all the other people who've been

listening to him stop drinking start

drinking

makes all the other people who've been

listening to him say my aren't you

lovely aren't you beautiful we'd like to

talk to you and listen to you

and at the end of it all the quorum

breaks up

at the end of alpha valley's speech a

whole flood of revelers comes in these

represent the athenian people the deimos

and they're all drunk and they're all

rowdy and they're all sliding on in and

there's a lot of messing around there's

a terrific amount of noise all decorum

is lost serious intellectual discussion

is lost and it turns into a big drunk

now of course

socrates sitting there having no choice

but to drink with these gentlemen does

with very great misgivings and he thinks

he's got to be thinking to himself

alcibiades wins the day everyone's

really like aristophanes i'm trying to

teach these people things but they won't

even stay sober even when they're sober

they're half drunk in the soul because

you can't talk reason to these people

much as socrates would like to help them

out of love philosophical love concern

that they should become better and not

worse

he does his best to

remind them of their obligations to

themselves and other people

of their capacity for perfection and

it's all undone

by the pernicious influence of

alcibiades

aristophanes

and the athenian people

and the only possible man who man who

could possibly save them as socrates by

introducing them to philosophy and they

won't listen to him so the revelers the

people are drinking on the night before

their death because the man that they're

lionizing and that they think so highly

of is in fact the man that's going to

lead them to doom and destruction

there's a horrible irony in that that is

not comic that is terribly terribly

serious

the last scene as it dissolves into a

kind of haze an alcoholic inebriated

haze

is

socrates alcibiades and agathon

having a discussion about the nature of

art and literature

on one side is alcibiades is agathon the

tragic poet on the other side is

aristophanes the comic poet and in

between his socrates and at the end of

socrates is proving to them that the

tragic poet is really the man that can

write comedy and the comic poet is

really the man that can write tragedy

the implicit message of that closing

scene is that the tragic poet and the

comic poet have very similar kinds of

souls they're all essentially bronze men

and the fact that they are verbally

gifted makes them that much more

dangerous to themselves and to others

the two interlocutors that socrates is

talking to have had so much to drink

they they pass out fall head first on

the table socrates throws a cloak over

them so they don't get cold he gets up

and then goes back home and goes about

his business for the rest of the day

it ends on a note of

almost tragedy

and

it's in that respect

a sort of universal literary achievement

it has elements of tragedy elements of

comedy

elements of high art as well as well low

jokes

in addition to that

it brings into a profound relief the

most important of the platonic teachings

about the importance of organizing one's

soul

about the significance of having

a political order in which philosophy is

respected and cultivated

and about the importance of love about

the importance of pure

excellent emotion

as opposed to the undisciplined lusty

emotions that are characteristic of

bronze men

the symposium isn't really over right

it's a dinner party that's still going

on and there's still a

a seed at it for you

because all of you are going to have to

think about the themes

that were introduced here about how love

fits into your life

about what sort of love is profitable

and unprofitable and how your emotions

relate to your morality and how morality

and emotion form the good song