FrUn L&L- Oliver Osborne
Summary
TLDROliver, a market research consultant based in Toronto, discusses the importance of market research in businesses. He shares his experience in hospitality and emphasizes the need for a holistic approach to marketing. Oliver highlights the significance of understanding customer segments, reducing operational friction, and aligning marketing strategies with customer needs. He advocates for the use of surveys and interviews to gather insights and stresses the value of market orientation in achieving business success.
Takeaways
- π Market research is crucial for businesses to understand their target audience and make informed strategic decisions.
- π Oliver's consulting practice focuses on assisting businesses with market research and marketing strategy, especially in organizations lacking senior marketing leadership or familiarity with research processes.
- π’ Oliver's background in hospitality and experience in change management has shaped his holistic approach to business and marketing.
- π The importance of conducting sufficient research is highlighted by the common strategic mistake of not doing enough research, which can lead to ineffective marketing efforts.
- π Market orientation should extend beyond the marketing department and be ingrained in the company culture, affecting all aspects of the business from the customer's perspective.
- π The three phases of marketing (research, strategy, and execution) are all important and should be properly balanced to achieve maximum impact.
- π Proper research can lead to more effective targeting, reducing wasted resources and improving operational efficiency within the organization.
- π― Market research helps in aligning marketing and sales, leading to a clearer positioning and more resonating messaging.
- π Understanding the necessary impact from a revenue perspective allows for more confident decisions on marketing channels and budget allocation.
- π‘ Jeff Bezos' strategy of market orientation and customer-centricity at Amazon is cited as a successful example of the effectiveness of this approach.
Q & A
What is the primary focus of Oliver's consulting practice?
-Oliver's consulting practice primarily focuses on helping businesses with market research and the strategic aspects of the marketing process.
How did Oliver's experience in hospitality influence his career in marketing?
-Oliver's experience in hospitality, specifically turning a private members club from a loss to profitability, set the stage for his career emphasizing scaling and change management, which are crucial in marketing.
What is the significance of the 98% statistic mentioned by Oliver in relation to marketing conversations?
-The 98% statistic highlights that a vast majority of marketing conversations focus on branding, advertisements, and communication strategies, often overlooking the importance of research and other aspects that contribute to effective marketing.
What does Oliver suggest as the minimum viable market research for a new company?
-Oliver suggests that the minimum viable market research for a new company should be loyalist interviews, where the company reaches out to its existing customers to understand their experiences and feedback.
How does Oliver propose aligning marketing objectives with the overall business strategy?
-Oliver proposes aligning marketing objectives with the overall business strategy by ensuring that the objectives are strategic, measurable, and have clear revenue implications, allowing for a cohesive approach and effective decision-making.
What is the importance of understanding the customer's language according to Oliver?
-Understanding the customer's language is crucial because it allows for more accurate communication and messaging that resonates with the target market, avoiding the pitfalls of internal jargon and assumptions about customer needs and preferences.
How does Oliver recommend addressing the issue of non-representative samples in online surveys?
-Oliver recommends building audiences to specifications, which involves actively seeking out the relevant respondents rather than relying on passive participation from a pre-existing database, to ensure a more representative sample.
What is the role of market segmentation in developing a marketing strategy?
-Market segmentation helps identify homogeneous groups based on behavioral patterns, allowing businesses to understand and target specific segments more effectively, and to identify underserved areas or segments that are not well-served by competitors.
How does Oliver suggest using survey data to inform marketing decisions?
-Oliver suggests using survey data to understand decision-making criteria, pain points, and perceived value among the market. This information should then be translated into clear messaging and aligned with the overall marketing strategy to ensure it resonates with the target audience.
What is the significance of having clear strategic objectives in marketing?
-Clear strategic objectives provide a solid foundation for marketing efforts, allowing for focused targeting and positioning. They also help in saying 'no' to most options and confidently pursuing the most effective strategies, leading to better alignment and buy-in from different parts of the organization.
How can a company ensure that its marketing budget is effectively allocated?
-A company can ensure effective allocation of its marketing budget by linking it to clear, strategic objectives that have been informed by robust research. This approach helps in justifying the budget needs andι’ζ outcomes, making it more likely to gain approval from finance and other decision-makers.
Outlines
π Introduction to Market Research and Personal Experience
The speaker, Oliver, introduces himself and sets the stage for a discussion on market research. Based in Toronto, he specializes in assisting businesses with market research aspects of marketing. Oliver shares his background in Hospitality, highlighting his success in turning around a struggling private members club. He emphasizes the importance of scaling and change management in his career, which has spanned work with multinationals, startups, and nonprofits. Oliver's approach to business is holistic, and he stresses the need for effective communication of marketing ideas within organizations, drawing parallels with political strategizing. He also mentions the importance of research in avoiding common strategic pitfalls.
π The Importance of Research in Marketing Strategy
Oliver delves into the significance of research in formulating effective marketing strategies. He argues that a lack of research often leads to ineffective marketing. Using Peter Drucker's famous quote, Oliver emphasizes that what gets measured gets managed, advocating for a market-oriented approach that extends beyond the marketing department. He discusses the benefits of research, such as targeted marketing, reduced operational friction, and aligned messaging between marketing and sales. Oliver also shares the story of Jeff Bezos and Amazon's early days, highlighting the power of customer-centricity and the insights gained from simple market research techniques like emailing customers.
π Understanding Your Funnels and Deploying Marketing Resources
The speaker explains the concept of marketing funnels and how understanding them can guide the deployment of marketing resources. He discusses the misalignment between departments, such as marketing and finance, and the importance of harmonious reporting frameworks. Oliver suggests that a clear understanding of funnel functions can lead to effective resource allocation. He also touches on the importance of surveys to gauge top-line awareness and understand brand perception, decision-making criteria, and purchase intent. He advocates for using customer language in surveys to ensure that marketing messages resonate with the target audience.
π¬ Conducting Loyalist Interviews and Surveys
Oliver talks about the practical application of market research, starting with 'loyalist interviews' where businesses engage with their existing customers to understand their experiences. He suggests using these interviews to inform customer surveys, ensuring that the language used in surveys resonates with the target audience. Oliver emphasizes the value of surveys in reducing operational friction and aligning marketing and sales efforts. He also discusses the importance of understanding purchasing criteria and using this data to inform marketing messaging. The speaker encourages market segmentation to identify underserved segments and tailor marketing efforts accordingly.
π― Developing a Strategic Marketing Plan
In this section, Oliver outlines how to develop a strategic marketing plan informed by market research. He advises on choosing the best target segments, aligning the organization around a single goal, and using data to support marketing decisions. Oliver stresses the importance of clear, data-backed objectives that can be understood and supported by all stakeholders, including finance departments. He provides an example of setting specific awareness and revenue goals, and how these objectives can guide marketing efforts and budget allocation. Oliver also discusses the importance of delivering on these objectives and the benefits of having a clear, data-driven strategy.
π‘ Addressing Common Concerns in Market Research
Oliver addresses a common concern about the representativeness of online survey data, suggesting that research companies can build specific audiences to ensure more accurate results. He also discusses the importance of comparing survey demographics with census data for data cleanliness. Oliver talks about different methods for measuring brand awareness, such as omnibus surveys, and provides cost-effective recommendations for small businesses. He emphasizes the importance of starting with loyalist interviews to understand what drives customers to engage with a service or product.
π Productizing Services and Aligning Marketing with Branding
The speaker discusses the challenge of productizing services and aligning marketing efforts with branding, especially when offering different types of fractional services. Oliver suggests finding a higher-order deliverable that applies to both services and using that as a unifying concept in marketing. He recommends understanding what previous clients value most and using that insight to craft a collective message. Oliver advises testing this messaging through conversations with clients and using that feedback to refine the marketing strategy.
π Conclusion and Offering of Additional Resources
Oliver concludes the presentation by offering additional resources to the audience. He mentions that the slides used during the presentation are part of a yearly budget and strategy guide that he shares with his network. He invites the audience to reach out on the fractionals Slack channel to access the recording and slides, promising that they will be made available soon. Oliver thanks the audience for their time and participation in the discussion on market research and strategic marketing.
Mindmap
Keywords
π‘Market Research
π‘Scaling
π‘Change Management
π‘Strategic Level
π‘Market Orientation
π‘Customer Centric
π‘Funnel Analysis
π‘Positioning
π‘Revenue Objectives
π‘Qualitative Research
Highlights
The presenter, Oliver, is a market research consultant based in Toronto, focusing on helping businesses with market research and strategy.
Oliver's career began in hospitality, where he turned a loss-making private members club into a profitable business within four months.
Oliver emphasizes the importance of scaling and change management in his work with businesses of various sizes and types, including multinationals, startups, and nonprofits.
The presenter highlights that strategic marketing mistakes often stem from not conducting enough research, leading to the current focus on market research.
Oliver references Kim Scott's book and the concept of 'Radical Candor', suggesting that marketing communication should be approached with generosity and a coaching mindset.
Marketing is viewed as a holistic business function, not just branding and advertising, with a focus on the strategic level where people tend to make the same mistakes.
The importance of market orientation is discussed, emphasizing that it should extend beyond the marketing department and be part of the company culture.
Oliver mentions Peter Drucker's famous quote about the importance of measuring and managing, and how marketing should be viewed from the customer's perspective.
The benefits of conducting research are outlined, such as reducing wasted time and resources, easing decision-making processes, and aligning marketing and sales efforts.
Jeff Bezos's approach to market orientation and customer-centricity at Amazon is cited as an example of the effectiveness of this strategy.
The presenter introduces the concept of understanding marketing funnels and how they can be measured to optimize the deployment of marketing resources.
The importance of aligning different departments, such as marketing, sales, and finance, for a cohesive understanding and reporting of customer segments and revenue is discussed.
Loyalist interviews are recommended as a form of qualitative research for understanding customer decision-making criteria, pain points, and perceived value.
Surveys can be used to gauge top-line awareness and understanding of how a brand is viewed, and to test ideas or the scale of responses with the market.
The presenter suggests using customer surveys to inform market segmentation, identifying homogeneous groups based on behavior and potential value to the company.
Strategic objectives should be clear, trackable, and aligned with market research findings, allowing for informed decision-making and resource allocation.
Transcripts
over to you
Oliver hello everyone thank you for
making time on
um this gorgeous Tuesday to chat about
market research um so I thought I'll
just quickly nutshell who I am and um
and what I'm up to I'm currently based
in Toronto and my Consulting practice
focuses on uh helping businesses with
the market research and Str stry ends of
the marketing process um whether this is
in the instance where there is no senior
leadership within the organization or
whether there is senior leadership
marketing leadership that is um but
where um there might not be um as much
familiarity with the research
processes so let's jump in so I didn't
actually start in marketing I started in
Hospitality um and I had my first ership
role over 21 years ago running a private
members Club where I took it from losing
the equivalent of about 8,000 Canadian
dollars a week into profitability over
the course of about four
months and um and really this is this
kind of set the scene for the rest of uh
my career everything I've done um has
been has had a heavy emphasis on scaling
on change management um and and you know
while these days I specialize in in
marketing um I cannot help but view the
business um holistically uh and I think
that this is this has enabled me to uh
join dots that perhaps other marketers
might not join um I've worked with
multinationals I've worked with Scrappy
startups I've worked with public private
companies and nonprofits and my big
takeaway from this varied experience is
that at a strategic level people tend to
screw up the same things which is
typically um not doing enough research
hence where we've got to today um so
here's just a few of the brands I've
worked with over the years
um so you might be wondering why I have
this up on the screen for those of you
who've read Kim Scott's Book You'll Be
familiar with this um now I can't be
sure exactly of the people on the call
who are who are marketers um and and who
aren't but one what I'm going to attempt
to do as we talk about market research
is to view this through the lens of what
actually needs to be done in your
workplaces at a let's say political
level in order to um in order to to be
effective with your ideas and be
effective with the courses of action
that you're going to be proposing so you
know we we're we're we're here to to to
learn today um and and I can assume that
if if you are the person within your
business who is looking at this that
you're probably farther ahead than
anyone else in your business as far as
your marketing literacy and your
understanding of the discipline so I
think it's really important to keep
front of mind
that expert within our organizations we
need to approach how we communicate
ideas uh in a very generous way if you
will um and very much through the lens
of coaching um we we are here to uh to
to coach the other um individuals or
departments within our organization on
what needs to be done from a marketing
standpoint um it is I think it was Rory
Southerland um the vice chairman of
ogelby once said that you know marketing
to a lot of people is like astrology two
marketers can talk and get on perfectly
well and understand what what they're
saying anyone from outside the
discipline has no idea what they're
talking about so um I think we need to
be very patient and we need to really
you know talk talk people through the
steps of what it is we're doing so um
one of the things that I I I realized a
long while ago is that and this has only
become more prevalent is that about 98%
of the conversation around marketing
focuses on branding adverts tonality
production video short video long video
very long video very short video
platforms out of home you know media
channels events activations prospecting
and all of that stuff um however
marketing is considerably bigger than
that um and and while that while you
know Communications is kind of the
membrane that most people uh see um
there's a hell of a lot that goes on
before these things happen if you expect
to be able to to be as effective as you
can um with your Communications
activities now Mark riton that many of
you will be aware of he um goes as far
as to say that these three phases are
equally important which is not to say
that you need to spend exactly the same
amount of time on each face I think
that's that's you know clearly absurd
but more that doing each one of them
properly um together have a
multiplicative effect so to to to to
miss one entirely um will have a
significant result on the ultimate
impact of your
marketing and put um arguably a little
bit combatively if your strategy is not
based on proper research it could well
do more harm than good like Running a
Restaurant just bringing people food
without taking an order or checking
dietary
requirements okay into diagnosis so um
I'm sure that um most people in
leadership roles will be familiar with
the name Peter drer um he came up the
the the famous um what gets measured
gets managed line but what he also said
was something pretty spoton about
marketing and that it's not a
specialized activity at all it is the
whole business scen from the point of
view of it's final result that is from
the customer point of view and really
Market orientation is goes beyond the
marketing department um and and should
be something that um is imbued in
company culture across the board and
this is where I always encourage
marketing leaders to get very very cozy
with the people and culture leaders
within their organization because there
is a lot of ground um you know to be
shared here um and a lot of in a lot of
instances untapped opportunity for those
two business functions um to to to to
have a really positive synergistic
effect um Market orientation can't just
be something that the marketers talk
about um
so quickly you know if it is not
entirely clear um here are some of the
the benefits of actually getting getting
research done so as far as targeting is
concerned you know reducing you know by
by being very clear through research who
you're going after you will reduce the
amount of time and resources wasted
going over inappropriate clients um and
then to look at how this helps you know
lubricate the wheels of the organization
uh I'm sure that um there are a few
people on this call who have plumbed
inordinate amounts of time into
retiga at every uh you know monthly or
quarterly sales and marketing meeting
who you're going after um when this can
be deduced through um through robust
research you take a lot of that second
guessing out of the mix and it really
eases the uh eases the process and
reduces that operational friction around
what you're do um similarly when it
comes to um
positioning uh getting that alignment
between marketing and sales um you can
kind of take ego and you know the risk
of loss to loss of political Capital out
of the mix by looking at the data um you
know ideally one gets to a point where
one can say that um we have researched
our addressable market and we can know
definitively because we have a sample
size of a sufficient amount in order to
be representative of the total
population that everyone in our target
market decides upon which product or
Serv to use based on these two things
and 68% of them are motivated by at
least one of those two things therefore
we can Peg all of our messaging on those
two things and have the highest chance
of it resonating with the
market and then finally if you can get
to get to the point where you can be
very clear on um the necessary impact um
the marketing needs to have the
necessary outputs from a revenue
standpoint you can start to feel very
very comfortable very very confident in
your choice of channels and budget um
because there's a there's a there's a
root there's a root to that information
so believe it or not Jeff is a big
advocate of Market orientation um the
some of you may have heard the Thousand
email story but back in
1997 when they when Amazon was selling
CDs books and Records
Jeff wanted to add another category or
two what he did was sent out a thousand
emails to a thousand random customers
asking them what they would happily buy
from Amazon now to his surprise what
came back was such a myriad of responses
um
that realized from this that Amazon
could sell
anything um now fast forward to um 1999
so about a year and a half later and
he's announcing uh at the AGM to his
shareholders that Amazon will become the
most customer Centric business on the
planet um and I think it's pretty safe
to say that the the the subsequent 25
years have have underscored the
effectiveness of taking that approach
within your
organization um if you look back and
find any interviews of him at the end of
the 90s he T he bangs on about being
customer Centric a lot there's a Charlie
Rose interview um where he goes into it
um highly
recommended so let's get a little bit
more granular now what this what this
schematic hopes to um hopes to outline
is um how having this understanding of
your funnels uh how it could be
measured um and how it can help us get
to the bottom of where to deploy
our where to deploy our marketing
resources so for example um and listen
bear in mind um there can be a lot of
hygiene work that needs to be done to
even get to the point where you can
effectively understand your funnels um
one of the big um misalignments I see is
where marketing and sales well let's
assume marketing and sales teams in this
hypothetical scenario agree on customer
segments um but then the finance
department aren't reporting on Revenue
in the same way so there's not really a
harmonious uh framework um from which to
pull the information um so often when
when I'm working with businesses often
you know first six months just getting
their text St and Reporting protocols in
chap um but if you can have a a clear
understanding of how your fun funnel
functions um and where the opportunities
are this means that you can deploy
resources
as effectively as possible only deploy
them on on the source B so to speak so
um the top of funnel awareness um there
are I mean this will this will differ if
your business is below a certain size
and profile um then awareness can be
hard to track but if it's not um you can
very cost effectively run surveys um in
order to um in order to gauge Topline
awareness
um and um and if you're smart sov as
well um you can use um surveys and
whether these are programmed by other
people or whether you are doing them
within your own uh business you can
start to get a get an understanding of
how your brand is viewed and down into
consideration purchase making criteria
purchase
intent and Beyond um because what we
want to be able to do is is understand
okay if we if we increase uh with with
with everything the fuddle being the
precipitating factors that leads to
revenue right so you can look at your
funnel and you
can at the end of the process come out
with objectives that are very clear not
only on the Strategic result you want to
see um but the revenue implication of
making that change within your
business fine okay lovely okay so let's
get into some let's get into some
nitty-gritty you know the uh the real
practical application of this uh for me
the minimum viable market research is uh
is loyalist interviews um now if you are
a relatively new company and you only
have a dozen customers then you're in
the fortunate position of being able to
you know reach out to 100% of your
customers and and and ask them what's
going on um so with loyalist interviews
this is of course qualitative research
um you know you can and and this again
to talk about kind of how to get this
done as much as what to do um feel free
to play to people's egos here right in
order to get whatever it is half an hour
of their time
um you know that as a valued customer um
we are looking to um move our business
forward and your Insight being valuable
in helping us make the kind of decisions
that will benefit you
um you know as a treasured customer um
um and and improv the value of our
services
forever so understanding decision-making
criteria understanding pain points where
they see your
value understanding what were
appropriate the the um boarding process
was like how they feel about support the
sales process was like um and with all
of these things um obviously some will
apply to some business bus and lot of
others but with all of these things what
you're trying to do here um is extract
the key points um and this uh not only
the key points but the language people
use to describe these points it is very
easy within an organization when you
don't speak to customers or don't speak
to them very often is to end up with a
kind of communication short hand around
the pain points and around the benefits
and values that doesn't actually reflect
the language that the market uses um
because they're not employees of your
company they are customers um with uh
you know better things to do than find
really snazzy shorthand phrases for for
what it is you do what it is you care
about so um when you have the
opportunity to take these insights and
take that language from loyalist
interviews and and then turn them into
customer surveys um the survey itself
has come from a much better place um
right because you'll be able to use
language they've used test idea or test
the uh the actual scale of their
responses with the market itself um
now my experience uh is that that a lot
of marketers have have
actually a lot of marketers have never
produced uh and and um deployed a survey
um but this can be done in a number of
ways there are fantastic companies here
in here in Canada um one is Le um who is
who is my assessment the kind of market
leader really for this very very clean
data fantastic service um or you can do
it within your own business so for
example if you are a service business
Hospitality FNB maybe you are a
retailer the foot form you have through
your premises each day puts you in a
great position to um to get a high
volume um of of respons from
people and again you want to be testing
decision- making criteria um what what
they see are their their big pain points
um it's again that back to reduction of
of operational friction
um I'm sure we've all have those you
know long sessions where we're trying to
work on our personas and work out their
pain points and all of this stuff um and
you you know you spend four hours in a
boardroom and you walk out of it very
few concrete conclusions this will just
cut that all out because it'll just be
there in the data um and if you can get
to
385 um this is kind of my my threshold
for for it being really solid as far as
um really solid as far
as oh yeah there we are yeah leer still
one so yeah 385 so so for you
statisticians out there confidence level
is um 95 to 95 you run this survey 100
times you get the same result 95 times
and then confidence interval is kind of
margin for error so 5% margin for error
on your results um but but you know for
your average restaurant or um you know
single unit bricks and morar store get
385 people through the door um you could
get a really solid um you could get a
really solid survey done in in a matter
of
weeks and if you want to boil it down to
just the the real critical stuff
purchasing criteria and then paying
points right why did they choose you
over your competitors this is especially
good if they've come back someone coming
back to your restaurant coming back to
your store um why have they come back
what what are you doing for them that
they're not getting elsewhere
um and can you turn that into output
messaging
okay so if you want to get you know and
this this is something I I recommend um
if you can get the the representative
data is to work towards a market
segmentation now I think where where a
lot of people um come AC Cropper here is
they attempt to do it over under or
sorry along demographic lines and I'm
sure many of us would have seen the
Prince Charles Aussie Osborne um uh meme
about
demographics um where you know they're
they're both whatever they are in their
70s they're both British they both live
in a castle um whereas no one's
expecting Al go born and Prince Charles
to I suppose King Charles now terrible
at me as Brit um King Charles to um to
behave in the same way so what your what
Your surveys should attempt to do is
uh slice and dice the addressable Market
along behavioral
lines so what what you would hope to get
to the bottom of is um how the market
can be segmented into homogeneous groups
along Behavior
Alliance how many people or businesses
if you're a B2B business are in that
segment um what the value would be to
the company if 100% of them purchased
from you and were appropriate what is
your current market share of that kind
of
customer um this this can be just in the
same way that looking at your funnel and
getting to the bottom of where the most
tender loving care needs to be
applied looking at this you know
finished segmentation of the market um
will often help you
identify areas or segments where you
can have a good play to them that you
can service them but they're currently
underserved by you or um or maybe
there's a segment that um isn't served
by anyone you know you have a you might
have a relatively respectable share of
it but actually your biggest competitor
uh can't really service them so maybe
your decision is to to go all in on um
all in on that
segment
okay and so so quickly I'm just going to
spend another like five minutes drawing
those dots into into strategy um and how
how marketing should be informing um how
we make those
decisions so firstly it it makes it
really easy for us at an organizational
level to say you know what we could go
after this person this person this
person but actually this one we can see
uh is the best choice for us and so you
know
it what it really does is help you say
no to most options um and feel very good
about saying yes to to one of them and
this is not only from a targeting point
but also from a positioning standpoint
um you know as I mentioned above you
should be able to get a representative
idea of decision-making criteria of pain
points of perceived value across your
market and then obviously with the help
of a decent copywriter word Smith that
um into into your
message and feel confident enough to
stick to it I think that this is you
know again one of the the massive uh
benefits that come from come from this
Clarity and this the alignment um that
that this will help you get within your
organization is that it makes it easier
to stay the courts because it's not your
opinion against my opinion it's not the
owner's opinion against the VP or
sales's opinion the market has shown us
that this would be the best way to get
in front of it and the best way to uh
best way to grow the
business and finally objectives and I
think this is where this is where um I
see a lot of businesses fall down is
that objectives are there but not
strategic okay
so often objectives will look like
increased BR love which is nebulous
can't be tracked
um well it can be tracked but not
phrased like that um achieve 200 social
mentions this is a tactical goal right
this is squarely in in Communications if
you remember that you know anatomy of
marketing slide squarely squarely in
Communications and sell two million
t-shirts that's a business aspiration
okay with the appropriate research you
should be able to get to a position
where you can say stuff like our goal is
to increase awareness in the Ontario
population from 37% to 53% by December
31st 2024 and with all other factors
remaining the same this will yield $1.3
million in incremental Revenue increased
transaction average in $38 to
$64 2.85 million incremental roow okay
so these are kinds of strategic
objectives that that even a CFO can get
on board with um and I'm sure uh most of
the marketers on this call at some point
have had to uh lock horns with a a CFO
um or Finance director in order to uh to
get their plans over the line when you
can really get to the bottom of the um
the kind of results that they can put in
a spreadsheet to put it really really
bluntly they love spreadsheets um if you
can do this
uh then you have a much better chance of
having your PL signed off also because
you can work from this okay all right
right what what what am I happy to spend
what is the company happy to spend in
order to generate $2.85 million is it a
million dollars is it $2 million and you
okay are you're okay with that you know
um cost of acquisition um or you can
work at another way and you can say all
right well well now given our historical
results what is it going to take us to
increase awareness and then you can
build a comm's plan off that okay um and
then you have you you have all the
information at hand in order to go to
bat for that plan now listen you need to
deliver on it hopefully at the end of
the day if you've asked for a whole ton
more money than the year before um but
if you can reach this point if you can
reach this point then um you have the
best possible chance of not just being
lumbered with another kind of kga based
um you know kga based budget um that's
come from the finance department I mean
it's it's a it's it's kind of a it's a
crying shame that that Finance teams
still often win the battle about how
much the sales and marketing efforts
need for the year right whilst not being
marketers
um so uh I am getting to the 20 25
minute Mark um and um and so I think
probably now's probably the time for us
to open up the floor for
questions let me if anyone has any
questions just raise your hand I think
we saw a I think we saw a few in the
yeah yes there was like at least one or
two um Adam has a question Adam go
ahead
hi Oliver um great presentation I really
like that um than you I have found in my
working with online surveys in
particular that you get a really serious
skewing of the data because people who
take online surveys are people who take
online surveys and if your Market is not
necessarily always online that data may
not really be representative of the of
your real market and I'm just wondering
how you account for that in your work
and is there a path that
um that uh U supplier that you were
talking about who does uh these surveys
is there a way that they have either uh
qualitatively or quantitatively to
account for that uh okay so not really
account for it but build um build
audiences to spec um that is to say that
they will go out and seek the relevant
people rather than um it being them
being passively of their database um
that so that's that's one way that you
can you can aim to um be a bit more
detailed and and hopefully more balanced
um it's a lot more expensive um but you
know it it's it's more expensive to the
point where getting a you know so I I
had to do a piece of research on
electricians in Ontario um and there's
only like 46,000 of them in the first
place uh you know so they're like there
no chance of them being on a you know a
enough of them being on a panel survey
board in order to um in order to um to
get a you know proper kind of
Representative result um but partnering
if you partner with Distributors um and
you get a corner of their uh space
retail space in person you can capture
those people for probably about about
the same price if not cheaper so um yeah
it's it's less about account counting
for those SKS I mean I tell you what one
thing that it is worth doing when you
have those big data sets is look at the
typically you'll get like the kind of
there's a set standard demographic info
you're going to get with those survey
results um those survey results so if
you've surveyed a thousand people that
thousand people should be representative
of of your population if there's if
there if you look at your and so just go
to your census data and if they've got a
whole load of people between 35 and 20
and your sensus data is not showing that
big spike then they've not given you a
representative sample of a population so
that's something you can look out for as
far as data
cleanliness
so in the tldr answer is it really
depends on how you're doing the
recruiting and how you gather the people
that you're actually measuring yeah you
know some of this is about expectation
setting with um expectation setting with
um with the agency that's actually
deploying it um if you if are going to a
third party but yeah you should you know
if you're getting a samp of thousand
people that should be that should be
demographically representative of
broader population else you're not you
know not really getting a fair result
and so if you don't mind just a quick
second question sure one of the things
that you talked about
was um being able to measure things like
you know uh brand awareness and given
population yeah um do you do that mainly
through the kinds of questions that you
ask is there another tool that you use
to do that so um the the some research
companies will offer a kind of Omnibus
so they they basically send out a a
monthly um survey that has like one or
two questions from a dozen
different uh clients so you can
literally ask are you know have you
heard of this brand yes enough to have
an opinion yes but not enough to have an
opinion or no um and I think last time I
did that it cost about, 1500 bucks um to
get to get you know 500 answers on that
just get that Top Line awareness um very
easily um highly recommend it because
you know awareness is table Stakes for
anyone doing business with you right um
absolutely so you know especially when
it comes to service businesses
Hospitality um retail um those um those
benefit have you know in a big way from
understanding that Topline awareness of
their brands because sometimes sometimes
that's the answer they're trying to be
all clever and you know
price you know aggressive price
discounting here or let's could generate
loads of you know really fun content to
hope to go viral sometimes the answer is
create one advert and just hammer it
until your awareness levels go up
because that'll just funnel you know
inevitably funnel more people into your
business and then just one last question
um for smaller companies like I work
with a bunch of climate startups yeah um
they just don't have that level of
recognition yet right you know not
everyone does one out of 10 maybe have
heard of them if if that any
recommendations for that kind of
scenario um I mean look the starting
point is always loyalist interviews um
get understand because you know there's
that solid historical data it's not
people hypothesizing about whether they
would engage your services they've
already spent good money on you so let's
start with start with what actually got
them over the line um again whether it's
sales process whether it is um the pain
points that are alleviated whether it's
the potential value that they see in it
um um and and what what forward from
there yeah all right thank you very much
and again for the
presentation my
pleasure any other questions and yeah
there was um Cynthia in chat asked for
the name of the Canadian survey company
uh Le l e g
r and Adam I assume you asked the
question again cuz I saw you chat
it awesome any other
questions all right I must have covered
it that comprehensively that um that um
we're all
good
awesome all right well I had a qu
question um since I found this my name
is Stephen I'm a CTO and I am um never
thought I coders don't think of
themselves as a product and the
fractional people are actually selling
outcomes or products and I'm wondering
how you
might do some of these steps if the
thing you're trying to discover is the
is is how to actually do that
productization of a service have you run
well do you know what the step the steps
of the actually I
um there's a model I use which
essentially has the research at the
center of it and then it spirals out
left and right and left goes into
product development and right goes into
strategy like marketing strategy um and
so I think that the ven diagram has a
high degree of overlap when you're
talking to people um as far as the
questions that will give you insights
into potential for product development
um and and products being you know kind
of symbiotically connected with
onboarding supports and all of those
kinds of things um so high degree High
degree of overlap but it really comes
down to to to what you're trying to uh
get to the bottom of um you know with
with products especially digital
products there's a whole other layer of
of information that um that you can
easily gather which is around actual
product usage like the SAS world you
know that once once you start looking at
actual product usage a lot especially
startups realizing that 80% of the
functionality that they've been spending
the last two years using isn't actually
being used was hardly being used or it's
being used for something a completely
different purpose you know those kind of
Pinterest is a great example of this
right Pinterest in its current form that
was an off book usage you know an off
label quote unquote off label usage of
its original product um but they
realized that that's what most people
were doing and so they kind of pivoted
into pivoted into that right so um but
yeah a lot of the same processes apply
it's just about being very clear on the
questions that you want to answer um
without hopefully being too leading with
your uh questions in order to kind of
box people's answers in
um yeah but I think the same thing
loyalist interviews could be really good
if someone's been using your product for
two years they might be using it in ways
that you've never thought of you know as
even as the the kind of lead great word
loyalist I think of them as friendly
interviews okay yeah yeah you know
really really great and except for this
I probably should have mentioned in the
call loyalist the the freemium version
of otter AI gives you 30 minutes you can
extract usually about 2,000 words 30
minutes if they're uh you know even
without them being big big talkers you
can then drop that into uh drop drop
that into GPT or similar to extract the
kind of key points as well as obviously
just tonally being able to look out for
what they really stress um and what's
like oh well I think kind of you know
what I mean um but that that Switcheroo
between that qual into let me let me ask
400 people of all of these eight
adjectives that they've used to describe
the brand let me ask 400 people whether
they you know how strongly they feel
about those five adjectives and then you
can start to pull like perceptual maps
and and get very um very detailed about
understanding how people feel about
you you can also run surveys along
functionality lines right like you know
I use the X function
often false sometimes true or however
you decide to you know frame that answer
thank you my
pleasure any more for
anym I'm looking to see
um somebody asked if it was like uh
Leisure
360.com uh yep that's right
yeah yeah they they're great you know if
you've got um if you've got people who
can crunch the numbers in house which
you know something that
is uh already something we can do with
AI but if you've got the kind of data
analysis capabilities inhouse they can
just run the survey give it to you Raw
uh if you want um help both building it
and then with the analysis portion they
can also Supply that as
well Jill you had a
question yeah um thank you for the
presentation I was wondering my husband
is in the technical space of fractional
and I'm on the operation side so I'm
kind of having an issue bringing
together our marketing and branding with
services and uh Target because I don't
want to convolute people on thinking
it's one thing um and under the same
name so I didn't know if you had any
tips on how to go about that give me
sorry just just uh paint that picture
for me again so my husband's in the
technical side as CTO operations with
custom software development for um like
Access Control Systems and he is
fractional work there I'm in the
operation side with project management
data analytics and that sort of thing
and the hardest part I'm having is
bringing together my marketing campaign
because the target market of what he
goes after versus what I go after are
two different things so when it comes to
like our LinkedIn pages I have the
corporate page but how do I bring
together right without confusing people
right so is this you fractional
Solutions yep yeah okay so what you're
saying is that that you're offering two
different kinds of fractional Services
under one um Under One Roof um well okay
so there's a couple of ways you can go
about this um one is obviously to create
separate Brands but there's a there's a
there's a whole load of work that will
um need to be done in order to kind of
support separate Brands but another way
you can go about it is about kind of
going up the
conceptual um all going from the literal
to the conceptual when it comes to the
promises you make so you would have seen
at the the the top of my presentation
Clarity and control Clarity on what the
market thinks and feels and control over
your results okay
so um if you can find that kind of
higher order deliverable um that
essentially is um appropriate to apply
to both of the services you provide um
then that can be a way of of of tidying
that up um again you can you can test
for this um is in you can chat to people
who have engaged either your services or
have engaged fractional services in the
past and try to get to the bottom of
what it is that they um
that they really like and often it's one
or two things you know for me I find
that people are often just lack the
confidence to deploy the kind of
resources that will get them results
from a marketing standpoint because
there's no one Senor experienced enough
within the organization to really get to
the bottom of it okay so one of the
things people love is that they they
feel confident spending spending money
they feel confident allocating money on
budgets right and so you know um that's
typically where I you know I bring that
language in a lot um when I when I
position to people and then I explain
what it is that I do because it's not a
marketing result at the end of the day
I'm making a human feel a certain way
about their business um so yeah and you
know start with what you intuitively
believe would be um the best way to kind
of conceptualize the the the impact you
know at a non-technical level right you
can apply it to both um and then um you
know I'd highly recommend you you chat
to previous clients chat to existing
clients chat to you know other people
you know through you know it might not
just be about the kind of fractional
work you specifically do but anyone
who's kind of plugged in fractional
consultant you know that kind of persona
and then what the what the human impact
has been um that should give you some
quite fertile ground as far as your your
Collective
messaging thank you so much I appreciate
my
pleasure
any other
questions going once going
twice okay well I guess I'm giving
everyone back uh 15 minutes of their
time I have um I have so the slides that
we looked through are part of a uh a
yearly budget and strategy guides that
that I share with my uh that I share
with my network work um so if anyone
would like that um feel free to to reach
out on the the fractionals slack Channel
um slack
instance actually we're gonna make the
recording and slides available either
later today or tomorrow so there this
that I've got a director's cut of the of
the slides that um that that that are
more kind of absorb without presentation
you know absorb without voice over kind
of uh
design awesome all right well I'm going
to stop
recording
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