Chris Kirkwood of the Meat Puppets Interview December 6. 2016 at Premier Studios in Phoenix, Az.

Summary

In this transcript, Chris Kirkwood, bass player of the Meat Puppets, shares his musical journey, starting from his early life in Arizona to his current involvement in the local music scene. He discusses the formation of the band, their influences, and the evolution of their music over the years. Kirkwood also reflects on the impact of their collaboration with Nirvana and their place in the Arizona music legacy, highlighting the significance of home and the enduring love for music that drives him.

Takeaways

• 🎶 Chris Kirkwood, a bass player from the Meat Puppets, shares his musical journey starting in Arizona.
• 🏠 Born in Texas, Chris moved to Arizona at a young age and grew up in Phoenix, influenced by his family's involvement in horse racing.
• 🎵 Chris's early musical interests included the banjo, inspired by the film 'Deliverance', and he took lessons at McLarty's Music.
• 🎹 Despite having lessons in guitar and piano, Chris found his true passion in the banjo and later the bass guitar.
• 🌟 The Meat Puppets' formation was a natural progression from Chris and his brother Kurt's shared musical interests and their meeting with Derek Bostrom.
• 🎤 The band's name, Meat Puppets, originated from a song written by Chris's brother, Kurt, and its open-ended nature resonated with them.
• 📈 The Meat Puppets' musical style evolved over time, influenced by various genres including punk rock, bluegrass, and indigenous musics.
• 🔥 The band gained national attention after being invited to perform with Nirvana on MTV Unplugged, which significantly boosted their popularity.
• 🎷 Chris reflects on the Meat Puppets' longevity and how their music has matured while still chasing the same passion for expression.
• 🏙️ Despite touring and traveling, Chris feels a strong connection to Arizona, considering it home and an integral part of the band's identity.
• 🎖️ The Meat Puppets' induction into the Arizona Hall of Fame is a testament to their contributions to the local music scene and their ongoing influence.

Q & A

What is Chris Kirkwood's role in the Meat Puppets?

Chris Kirkwood is the bass player of the Meat Puppets.

Where was Chris Kirkwood born and when did he move to Arizona?

Chris Kirkwood was born in Texas and moved to Arizona around 1965 when he was pretty young.

What was Chris Kirkwood's family's connection to the Thoroughbred circuit in the Southwest?

Chris Kirkwood's mother's second husband was a furrier by trade and a horseshoeer, and they were on the Thoroughbred circuit in the Southwest, which led them to settle in Arizona near Turf Paradise.

Which school did Chris Kirkwood and his brother Kurt attend from first through eighth grade?

Chris Kirkwood and his brother Kurt attended Royal Palm school from first through eighth grade.

What high school did Chris Kirkwood start attending in 1974?

Chris Kirkwood started attending Brophy College Prep in 1974.

What musical instrument caught Chris Kirkwood's interest after watching the film 'Deliverance'?

After watching the film 'Deliverance', the banjo caught Chris Kirkwood's interest.

How did Chris Kirkwood's early experiences with music lessons influence his approach to learning music?

Chris Kirkwood's early experiences with music lessons, including guitar and piano lessons, were not very engaging for him. However, these experiences influenced his approach to learning music by making him realize the importance of self-teaching and practice, as he eventually became interested in the banjo and taught himself to play it.

What was the significance of the moment Chris Kirkwood had while practicing the banjo?

The moment Chris Kirkwood had while practicing the banjo was significant because it was a breakthrough for him in understanding the mechanics of music and realizing his ability to teach himself. It was an eye-opening experience that made him appreciate the creation of music and the instruments used to produce it.

How did the Meat Puppets band start?

The Meat Puppets band started when Chris Kirkwood, his brother Kurt, and their friend Derek Bostrom began playing music together. They found a unique connection and intoxicating energy when they played as a trio, which marked the beginning of their band.

What was the impact of Nirvana's MTV Unplugged performance on the Meat Puppets' popularity?

Nirvana's MTV Unplugged performance had a significant impact on the Meat Puppets' popularity. Kurt Cobain invited Chris and Kurt Kirkwood to perform with Nirvana on the show, which led to increased exposure for the Meat Puppets. After Kurt Cobain's death, the Unplugged performance was released as an album, further propelling the Meat Puppets into the spotlight.

What does Chris Kirkwood enjoy most about playing music?

Chris Kirkwood enjoys the feel of playing music and the experience of letting the music play through him. He loves the sense of discovery and the joy that comes from playing and connecting with music, which has kept him passionate about his craft throughout his career.

Outlines

00:00

🎶 Early Life and Musical Beginnings

Chris Kirkwood, bass player of the Meat Puppets, shares his early life experiences and the journey into his musical career. Born in Texas, Chris moved to Arizona at a young age and grew up in Phoenix. His family's involvement in horse racing led them to settle in the area. Chris attended local schools and was introduced to various musical instruments as a child, including the banjo, which sparked his interest in music. He reminisces about his first banjo and the influence of the film 'A Clockwork Orange' and 'Deliverance' on his musical preferences.

05:02

🎸 Transition from Banjo to Bass

Chris discusses his transition from playing the banjo to the bass. Despite initial challenges, he persisted and eventually mastered the instrument, influenced by the bluegrass music he enjoyed. His interest in the bass was sparked by its simpler design compared to the banjo. At the age of 15 or 16, he financed a Fender Jazz Bass through a music store and began taking lessons as part of the agreement. These lessons provided a foundational understanding of the instrument, which he built upon independently.

10:05

🎤 Forming the Meat Puppets and Early Influences

The formation of the Meat Puppets band is described, along with the early influences on Chris and his brother Kurt. Through a mutual friend, they met Derek Bostrom, who played drums in a unique style. The trio began playing together, and their chemistry was evident, leading to the official start of the band around late 1979. Chris also talks about his diverse musical tastes, ranging from bluegrass to indigenous music, and how these influenced his approach to playing and the band's sound.

15:07

🌟 Encounters with Nirvana and the MTV Unplugged Session

Chris recounts the Meat Puppets' interactions with Kurt Cobain of Nirvana, including their touring experiences and the iconic MTV Unplugged session. He describes how Cobain wanted to perform Meat Puppets' songs during the session, leading to Chris and Kurt joining Nirvana on stage. This collaboration had a significant impact on the band's visibility and popularity. Chris also reflects on the aftermath of Cobain's death and the release of the Unplugged performance as an album.

20:08

🎵 The Evolution of a Song: 'Lake of Fire'

Chris discusses the evolution of the song 'Lake of Fire,' from its initial conception by his brother Kurt to its widespread popularity after being covered by Nirvana. He shares his experiences of hearing the song for the first time, recording it, and performing it live. The song's impact is highlighted by the numerous covers and adaptations by fans worldwide, showcasing its enduring legacy in music culture.

25:10

🎶 The Origin of the Name 'Meat Puppets' and Early Performances

The story behind the band's name, 'Meat Puppets,' is shared, originating from a song written by Chris's brother Kurt. The name's open-ended nature appealed to them. Chris also talks about the band's early performances, which were mostly at house parties before they played at actual venues. The punk rock scene in Phoenix and Los Angeles played a significant role in the band's early success, with connections made through Derek's networking leading to opportunities in LA.

30:13

🎸 Personal Growth and Current Involvements

Chris reflects on his personal growth as a musician and the changes in the Meat Puppets' music over the years. He discusses the band's ability to play a diverse range of songs from their extensive discography and the physical changes that come with age. Chris also talks about his current involvement in the local music scene, including producing for young bands and working with Tom Lopez's label, Slope Records. His commitment to supporting the next generation of musicians is evident, as is his love for his home in Arizona.

35:14

🏆 Arizona Hall of Fame Induction and Love for Phoenix

Chris expresses his gratitude for the Meat Puppets' induction into the Arizona Hall of Fame, acknowledging the support of the Phoenix arts community. He shares his deep connection to Arizona and Phoenix, emphasizing the band's identity as an Arizona-based group. Despite the changes the city has undergone, Chris remains rooted in his home, appreciating the local culture and landscape. He also mentions his brother Kurt's longing for Arizona, highlighting the importance of home for both band members.

Keywords

💡Meat Puppets

The Meat Puppets is an American rock band formed in Phoenix, Arizona, consisting of brothers Curt and Cris Kirkwood, along with drummer Derrick Bostrom. The band is known for blending country and punk rock with surreal lyrics and has released numerous albums since their inception. In the transcript, Chris Kirkwood (also known as Curt) talks about the formation of the band and their journey through the music industry, including their influence and experiences.

💡Arizona

Arizona is the state where Chris Kirkwood and his family moved to when he was young, and it's where the Meat Puppets band was formed. It serves as a significant geographical and cultural backdrop to the band's story, influencing their music and personal experiences.

💡Bass Player

A bass player is a musician who plays the bass guitar, which is a crucial instrument in most modern musical ensembles, providing the low-frequency sound and rhythmic foundation. In the context of the transcript, Chris Kirkwood is the bass player for the Meat Puppets, and his role is central to the band's sound and success.

💡Musical Influences

Musical influences refer to the artists, genres, or styles that have an impact on a musician's or band's sound, songwriting, and overall artistic direction. In the transcript, Chris Kirkwood discusses various musical influences that shaped his personal style and the Meat Puppets' music, including punk rock, bluegrass, and indigenous musics.

💡Punk Rock

Punk rock is a genre of rock music characterized by its fast-paced tempos, short songs, and often rebellious or anti-establishment lyrics and themes. In the transcript, Chris Kirkwood mentions punk rock as a significant influence on the Meat Puppets' early sound and their entry into the music scene.

💡Banjo

The banjo is a stringed musical instrument with a membrane covering the body, known for its distinctive twang and popular in American folk and country music. In the transcript, Chris's interest in the banjo began after watching the movie 'Deliverance', which led him to purchase one and take lessons, sparking his journey into music.

💡Self-Taught

Being self-taught refers to learning or acquiring skills without formal instruction or training, often through personal projects, practice, or self-directed study. In the transcript, Chris emphasizes the importance of self-teaching in his musical development, particularly when he learned to play the banjo and bass by ear and through personal practice.

💡Indigenous Musics

Indigenous musics refer to the traditional music of native or indigenous peoples, which often reflects their cultural heritage, history, and social structures. In the transcript, Chris talks about exploring indigenous musics after his initial interest in bluegrass, which led him to a deeper understanding of the roots of music and its cultural significance.

💡MTV Unplugged

MTV Unplugged is a television series on MTV that features acoustic performances by popular musical artists, often resulting in a stripped-down, more intimate sound. In the transcript, Chris recounts the Meat Puppets' involvement in Nirvana's MTV Unplugged session, which was a significant moment in their career and helped to broaden their audience.

💡Kurt Cobain

Kurt Cobain was the lead singer and guitarist of the American rock band Nirvana. He is a significant figure in the music industry, known for his influential songwriting and the impact of Nirvana on the grunge movement. In the transcript, Chris mentions Cobain's interest in the Meat Puppets and their collaboration on MTV Unplugged.

💡SST Records

SST Records is an American independent record label founded in 1978, known for releasing albums by influential punk rock, hardcore, and alternative bands. In the transcript, Chris mentions SST Records as the label that released many of the Meat Puppets' early albums, highlighting the band's association with the independent music scene.

Highlights

Chris Kirkwood, bass player of the Meat Puppets, shares his musical journey.

Kirkwood's family moved to Arizona when he was young, influenced by his mother's second husband's trade and the Thoroughbred circuit.

He attended various schools in Phoenix, including Rancho Solano kindergarten and Royal Palm grade school.

Kirkwood and his brother Kurt, the guitarist of the Meat Puppets, both went to Brophy College Prep.

The brothers' musical interests were shaped by their experiences, such as watching 'A Clockwork Orange' and 'Deliverance'.

Kirkwood's initial musical interest was the banjo, inspired by a scene from 'Deliverance'.

He took banjo lessons and eventually developed a strong interest in the instrument.

Kirkwood transitioned from the banjo to the bass, finding it a natural progression.

He bought a Fender Jazz Bass, which became a significant part of his musical identity.

Kirkwood's early influences included bluegrass, indigenous musics, and jazz.

The Meat Puppets were formed in the late 1970s, with Kirkwood, Kurt, and Derek Bostrom.

The band's name, Meat Puppets, came from a song Kirk wrote.

Kirkwood reflects on the evolution of the band's music and their place in the punk rock scene.

The Meat Puppets' music was influenced by a variety of genres, including punk rock and the Grateful Dead.

Kirkwood discusses the band's relationship with Nirvana and their performance on MTV Unplugged.

He shares his thoughts on the importance of music education and the joy of playing music.

Kirkwood expresses his love for Arizona and its influence on the Meat Puppets' music.

He talks about his involvement in the local music scene and his excitement for upcoming bands.

Transcripts

all right uh hello my name is Chris

Kirkwood I'm a bass player of the Meat

Puppets

and uh I'm from Arizona

um

not really from Arizona officially I

wasn't born here I was born in Texas but

wound up in Arizona I think about 65 I

was pretty young when we got here

and we wound up in Phoenix because my

mother Vera's second husband

was uh a furrier by trade a horseshoeer

and

we were on the on the Thoroughbred

circuit in the Southwest

and wound up here pretty much because of

Turf Paradise

in a way and then eventually wound up

with our own thoroughbreds wind up with

a

uh

our own

stalls down there you know had our own

Paddock whatever it's called down there

our own batch of stalls and everything

down at Turf Paradise

and we wound up moving to

Sunnyslope grew up right on the corner

then on the uh

northeast corner of 15th Avenue and

Butler so

so that meant that let's see by the time

I got here I was young enough I actually

went to

Rancho Solano kindergarten up on Dunlap

and then I started grade school and I

went from first through eighth grade to

Royal Palm

on 19th and Butler

and uh

and so did my brother go to Royal Palm

as well my brother Kurt who's the guitar

player in the Meat Puppets and

let's see then

I started High School

in 74 and I would have because of where

I lived gone to Sunnyslope but mom

thought

she would prefer us to go to Brophy so

Kurt and I both went to

Brophy College Prep on Central and both

of us graduated from there

and uh I want to before I actually

started Brophy Kurt at an assignment

to read Clockwork Orange by Anthony

Burgess and right around that time the

film had come out the Stanley Kubrick

film the same name and the uh

the folks at Brophy when it was one of

his teachers his English teacher I would

assume it had

suggested that if everybody wanted to

they could go see

uh the new new clock recordings the film

so Mom took Kurt and I to see A

Clockwork Orange and it was back when

they had double features in the uh the

other film playing along with it was

Deliverance

so

at the time I was about 12 I think at

that point and uh

they had that scene in there in

Deliverance you know speaking of Music

they had the scene in there where the

kid comes out you know the

the the the hillbilly kid you know and

plays little banjo there with Ronnie Cox

you know remember that sequence and and

I was just Smitten by the banjo at that

point you know and I said about getting

a banjo got one

up at uh McLarty music

in Sunnyslope so and I still have that

banjo oddly enough considering you know

how

easy it is to

lose things and I still have that that

same banjo and I wrote on it as a kid

close your mouth because they should sit

there practicing with my tongue hanging

out you know

just kind of charming considering still

have it

um and before that

I'd uh I had guitar lessons as a kid

and the guy would actually come to the

house her instructor and I just didn't

like it it didn't take

you know I wasn't that interested in it

and uh then I took piano lessons and

that was up at mclarty's as well and I

kind of like that a little bit more but

I wasn't you know that dedicated to it

definitely and I liked the instructor

there he was an older gentleman

and uh he would uh

he would kind of get tired during our

lessons you know it actually nod off you

know because he was kind of elderly so

I'd sit there and I'd be playing and I'd

notice it was nodding off so I could

play a little quieter and then I'd stop

you know as you sat there and then you

kind of come to and I'd be like ding

ding you know because I didn't really

practice that that much so that I didn't

take either but the banjo actually

caught my my interest you know I was

taking some lessons up at McLarty and my

instructor whose name I can't remember

unfortunately uh would record

the lessons on cassette and I would take

them home and it was a Bluegrass banjo

that I was playing

you know where you use a thumb pick and

then two two finger picks and there's a

lot of in bluegrass bands there's a lot

of pull-ons or pull-offs and roll-ons

and stuff you know

and the hammer ons that kind of thing

and and then there's also that Grace

note it's five-string banjo you know and

playing it practicing

it was a little difficult you know to

get it to I mean it was just tough but I

I stuck at it

and

you know I listen to his versions of how

the song's supposed to go and then sit

there and do it but plucking along at

first it didn't sound like anything it

was kind of disjointed in a way you know

where you're like I mean I mean it

wasn't quite making sense and then just

one day and I mean I clearly really

clearly remember this moment

because it was just I turned out to be

so influential in my whole life

um where I was sitting there and I'd

been practicing it for a while I've been

playing it for quite a while I mean you

know six months at least or something

and just all of a sudden it went mainly

me you know and the combination of like

the hammer on and the pull-off and the

gray snow and everything went you know

instead of musical and I suddenly

realized okay this is how this works and

it just blew my head open in a way you

know like at that moment it was just

like wow you know it made me realize

so much like about myself you know the

ability to teach yourself things other

you know how your mind works in a way

and about other people you know people's

desire to play music they're

having created these types of musics you

know how musics come out of certain

regions and people needed to make noise

a certain kind of you know certain Noise

music and and actually create these

instruments to do it with and and it was

just a real eye-opener you know really

really kind of knocked my socks off

and

I kept doing that for a while played the

banjo and I still do

for a few more years there

and then at a point

I started thinking that bases look neat

so

um

I said about getting a base I decided

you know that it just seemed like you

know having played the banjo using my

fingers like that that would be kind of

a natural progression to go over the

base playing it like that like a lot of

players do and

and they were only four strings on it

which is a plus

and they were thicker and farther apart

you know just it just seemed like I

would be able to kind of you know pick

it up relatively easily and I just I

just thought they were neat looking I

just thought they were cool looking

you know just kind of taken by that and

uh

wound up getting a base out at Arizona

Music Center on Glendale

and uh

part of the

uh what was it the finance agreement I

financed the thing I was probably about

then I was about 15 I think 15 maybe

close to 16. uh part of the you know

when I finance the guitar through the

through the shop

uh and

it was uh it was a jazz base that I

wound up with I was actually kind of

taken with the music man that had come

out at that point you know Leo Fender's

company that he just gotten off the

ground at that point and I thought those

bases were real neat and I had my eye on

this one Sunburst cool looking guitar

and when I went in to get it the

salesman and you know told me well this

other one's gonna have more resale value

you know and I didn't even click at all

I was like whatever you know like kind

of got bamboos a little bit

guy wanted to unload this jazz bass so I

wound up getting a Fender Jazz Bass

instead

um you know and realize that it waits

resale I mean like I'll stop doing this

and then I can sell it later and it'll

have more you know be worth more but

it you know and that influenced like the

way I play and everything who knows what

would happen if I got in that other

music man instead of that one at that

point I eventually wound up getting one

few years later but so I got this Jazz

base and part of the uh

the uh

finance agreement was that uh I would

take lessons

from an instructor there at the shop

so I did I had and and he still teaches

in town Royal Tapia and uh I think he

still gives lessons over at Ziggy's I

saw him just a few years ago still

around

and it was real real helpful that was

actually really really helpful and it

was kind of like supposedly like jazz

improv lessons or something but I mean

it didn't get that far I didn't you know

to the point that I could improvise on

Jazz other than like you know saying

that I could and but uh

he taught me like the neck you know I

learned all the notes you know learned

like one four five kind of stuff you

know some real simple stuff

that just kind of was foundational

and uh I took that as for that was

probably about I think like maybe three

months that I took lessons and then I

just kind of struck out on my own with

the instrument

and uh

all through all that my brother Kurt had

kind of been playing the guitar

so and we weren't all that close like we

didn't you know I mean we did stuff

together definitely we were close we

shared our bedroom you know but I mean

it was for sure my big brother usually

going to big brother that would like

unscrew the light bulb and then reach

out from under the bed and grab me by

the ankle you know I was just like

horrifying you know kind of a uh big

brother he's 22 months older than me

so we did stuff but we weren't you know

tight and there was never any like you

know we want to be in a band you know we

want to you know let's form a band

together we there was never anything

like that but he'd been playing guitar

kind of all along you know he took a

like Bebop lessons up at mclarty's music

you know and I think uh show McLarty I

think it was well Mr McLarty uh had been

a contemporary of like Barney Kessel and

guys like that you know so Kirk got a

little bit of a background and

and Bebop guitar and stuff and then just

kind of kept playing it and

and uh at a point you know he was going

through what he was going through and

gotten more serious about the guitar in

a way or just you know just grew it was

at that point where he got to a you know

kind of a place with it and through a

mutual friend we met Derek Bostrom

uh

and Kurt and Derek started playing

together and Derek was a real

interesting guy and very influential on

Kurt and I

um and we were influential back on him

you know we're more

musiciany in a way and he was more of a

conceptualist you know an artist even

you know and had set about to become

the world's worst drummer you know when

we met him

he had a kick drum with a cymbal screwed

in the top a rickety hi-hat and he

taught himself to play open-handed you

know rather than you know a lot of most

drummers crossed you know like that and

he taught himself like that you know and

it was just really really simplistic and

it wasn't about like you know being a a

drummer you know and there was a lot of

that back in the 70s with guys like Bill

bruford you know and Billy Cobham you

know guys that are really really

technically accomplished but Derek had

been

you know he was aware of and into the

punk scene that you know from its

Inception really so he turned Kurt and I

onto a lot of stuff that

I hadn't really been exposed to I mean

because the seven inch thing that

happened with the punk rock thing you

know so and after those guys have been

playing for a little while they they

decided to ask me if I'd like to come

over and play a little bit of bass with

them

and a lot of us played you know at that

point you know this is getting into our

late teens you know so we're

experimenting with not experimenting I

mean we're avidly using you know pot and

psychedelics and whatnot you know and uh

so a lot of us played and you know there

were these little

groups that would get together it's just

you know depending on who's there and

playing and whatnot but when the three

of us played

there was just something about it

that was very intoxicating and uh

and that was the start of the band and

that would have been about

sometime in the fall early winter of 79.

and Kurt and I

had different tastes than Derek did so I

mean at that point you know my biggest

influence was my brother and Derek

definitely but having you know come up

as a player

having been from Phoenix you know uh

having been you know I got into it as as

much as anything as a fan of music you

know so I was really into Bluegrass you

know as a kid

and that led me into like indigenous

musics in a way you know kind of figure

out where the Bluegrass come from how

did this happen you know and how the

Bluegrass has

it's like in a like a like an American

instrument one of the few instruments

actually you know

driving out of the states and and part

of that is the the drum you know which

is like the African talking drum kind of

a thing you know has the drum head on

there but then with like European

chromaticism and stuff you know so I

kind of started to dig around into

indigenous musics a little bit and just

realized oh there's a whole world of

music you know just you know I was

pretty young you know just starting to

discover this stuff so I started getting

into like jazz then you know started

getting that out Jazz and kind of

further out stuff and there was a

was his name Charles Byrd there was a

guy

that used to put on shows you know Jazz

stuff and brought neat stuff to town you

know down at like neeb Hall at ASU and

so I got a chance to see

some pretty neat stuff like sun raw you

know all sorts of stuff

like that as a kid you know in curtain

over young we were you know when we're

real young you know I clearly remember

being small enough to be walking between

my grandmother and my mom

holding each of their hands and singing

I Want to Hold Your Hand so I mean the

Beatles were the first you know thing

like there were for so many people you

know

um

and then uh you know

as I got a little bit older and started

to discover stuff some of the rock stuff

that was happening I wasn't that into it

it you know stuff that I eventually came

back to once I got a little more

comfortable with myself but when I was

younger it just seemed you know I just

wasn't that cool you know like you know

to where it's like the rock thing that

was happening at that point in the 70s

so

um but I came to rock and roll through

like uh

through like the Grateful Dead

you know Zappa I think I was kind of a

you know I think I used music

snobbishness as a shield you know kind

of as like you know

to

kind of you know my Identity or whatever

you know I like oh I like this you know

if you like graphic and roll that's you

know I'm in you know loftier things or

whatever you know it's just

uh for whatever

is that uh Kurt Cobain came and saw us

like in the early 80s you know when uh

on one of the tours or several of the

tours

that maybe one of the ones that we were

with Black Flag we toured those guys a

lot because we were on SST their label

uh through a lot of the 80s and we

toured those guys a bunch and we toured

a lot when we were younger you know so

uh just from what I've heard you know

apparently it came to some of those

shows and was into all that stuff you

know the SST stuff just in American

Underground that was happening at that

point but I didn't know him at all you

know then

um I became aware of them when they

started to

you know when they were around as a band

and then saw you know when they

got signed and stuff like that because

friends of mine were really into them

like Sonic Youth was really into them

and

you know be starting to become aware of

Seattle as it started to develop a

pretty vibrant scene and a lot of those

people

we end up playing with I remember Mother

Love Bone open first one time

the precursor to uh Pearl Jam you know

those guys or precursor whatever the

predecessors of or the some of the band

members

of that band went on to start Pearl Jam

uh sound garden opened for us back then

um you know but we never played with

Nirvana before they

got as popular as they did before that

never mind blew up but once that

happened

um we started hearing you know

I'm saying nice things about us and you

know a lot of the guys that we'd come up

with and stuff so and then they just

asked us if we'd like to go out and play

some shows with them so that happened

and we did a couple of different tours

with them

and by then they were you know they were

like the biggest band in the world

pretty much by that point you know so it

was all Arena shows and stuff like that

you know sold out you know just big

timey rock kind of stuff

and uh got to know him then you know got

to know the guys in the band then

and uh I'm one of those one of those

nights somewhere

Toronto somewhere we were just hanging

out after the show and

they were getting ready to do their

uh unplugged MTV Unplugged sessions and

Kirk brought up Cobain brought up the

idea that he wanted to uh

play some of our old stuff on there

uh some stuff offered me puppets too

and you know we were amenable to the

idea you know I was like no go ahead you

know they're pretty easy it's like you

know

so uh

then that led to just he just decided

rather than bother

you know figuring out the guitar you

know it's kind of like well you know

kirkenship my Kurt Arc or whatever can

show you know there Kurt how to do the

guitar stuff and

whatnot and then he just decided

that he would take Kurt and I on there

with him do it like that you know so and

we're happy to do it you know definitely

you know because it was it was Poke

Rocky you know it was cool I mean it's

like rock and roll you know it's like

not that uptight you know it's like you

know music in general you know it's like

supposed to be for you know it's fun

it's like I got into this on purpose you

know I went to Brophy you know it could

have been a dentist

you know so uh you know it it

it was like you know resonated with that

kind of yeah that's cool you know what a

neat idea you know take us on there just

as far as like musically you know

playing with other people is kind of a

cool idea and then

to use you know his Newfound

uh you know popularity

to

you know shove the Meat Puppets down

people's throats pretty cool idea too

you know and and oddly enough the uh the

not oddly enough but you know the the

MTV people weren't into it they didn't

they like tried to have him you know

make him not bring us on TV with him and

he was

you know powerful enough you know

popular enough to force them to less you

know go on there and do it which is very

cool and and that was only supposed to

be um

that was just going to be the uh it was

just going to be the unplugged it wasn't

going to be an album you know at that

point but unfortunately you know Kurt

you know took his life so uh they

decided then after that to release it

you know and uh and then it's incredible

the life that it has it was incredible

Hub you know how far reaching it's

gotten you know I did a thing a couple

of years ago we went to Australia

and they asked me to pick some videos

like pick five videos and talk about

them right and it's like uh you know I

didn't I didn't know what you know it's

promo stuff right

so I decided Well

just talk about me you know talk about

us so I decided to do a little thing is

like the the evolution of a song and uh

talked about the song Lake of Fire which

is one of the ones we played on there

with Nirvana and I said you know like I

think I was probably like the second guy

to hear the song after my brother who

wrote it right heard it first in his

head or whatever and then he wrote the

thing and I remember clearly you know I

got a new song you know him playing it

for me and it's like that's really neat

and then I showed a video uh no I uh

yeah

and I said then we recorded it and put

them you know and I played that played

that video right where they just show

the album cover and the song plays the

album version then I said then we played

it a lot as kids found a video of us

young playing it and then they said you

know the Nirvana wanted to cover it we

went on TV and played that and then I

put that that was the third video

and then because of that the song you

know just went out to the world and all

the you know all the more

and uh I got online and I there's like

like a hundred thousand versions of it

or something or some ridiculous amount

of like people covering the song right

so found a video of these kids and like

you know Lithuania or somewhere you know

those the 12 year old's kid doing kids

doing it you know it said you know now

it's you know it's gone out to the

degree that it's like a Year's worth of

the song on Mt you know on YouTube that

you can you know so many versions of it

and played out as the the fourth reading

and then I said you know we're still

doing the song and played an older

version of it you know so

you know looking back now

uh punk rock definitely allowed

me to

be in a band you know to play live music

you know I think punk you know like in a

broader sense that's what Punk was a

rationed that big time rock you know

which is like I just couldn't envision

myself up there you know like that

um so you know scale it down a little

bit doesn't matter how good you can play

whatever you know punk rock's just like

it's just the doing of it you know it's

like oh and have an outlet for that you

know and so

uh that you know gave me that ability

gave us that ability but then we brought

all this other musicality to it as well

you know so

uh I think

we were kind of especially once we got

out of town sort of get down to the punk

rock scene we started having a little

bit more of a you know a presence or

national you know kind of a thing or

whatever getting out in different scenes

Los Angeles in particular you know

I think we were kind of the guys that

you know made it okay in the punk rock

scene to say that you like the Grateful

Dead kind of you know that kind of a

thing and definitely uh musically we're

affected by it

uh by you know where we'd come from on

our first

album

we

you know we did most of the songs are

our own

um

but we also included on their cover of

uh

the sons of the pioneers

uh

um

tumbling tumbleweeds you know a song

that we've gotten off our mom it's

driving along singing she encourt used

to drive along we'd Drive Long tape road

trips and her mom would sing

and then we also did a walking boss

which we've got enough of Doc Watson you

know and then our second album

me puppets two

definitely heavily influenced by you

know like Neil Young stuff like that you

know and then it was a bit of a musical

departure

from the first album

uh stylistically but it was the next

logical progression for us definitely

and us you know breaking out of that

like you know we're going to be the band

that we want to be you know we're not

going to let anybody else you know

constrict us or Define us and the punk

scene by that point it got to the point

where it was it was getting you know

formulaic or rigid you know there's

these rules you know you had to look a

certain ways sound a certain way and we

weren't interested in letting that you

know dictate our our

our Direction at all so yeah what was

the uh what was the Genesis of the of

the name Meat Puppets

uh that was actually a song originally

that Kirk wrote my brother wrote

um and uh you know we were trying to

figure out what to call ourselves

I uh I wanted to callers I thought the

Mustangs would be a good name because it

was like uh you know

let's see where that came from

um but uh you know we're trying to

figure out what to call ourselves

Derek had come up with the bastions of

immaturity you know and uh

I mean Kurt wrote that song Mead puppets

it's on me puppets one it's on our first

album and it was a

it was a very open-ended song The me the

lyrics are they go Meat Puppets dot dot

dot right you know and so basically we

we would say whatever you know I

remember one of the lines was me puppets

eat hydrogenated animal fat something

you know

um you know you put in whatever there

as far as the lyrics on that particular

song were concerned but it just it's

just kind of seemed to fit you know it

was kind of a cool

you know the idea behind the song what

the what the name means as much as

anything uh it gets back to that like

you know that John Lennon thing what

what are beetles

what does the name Beatles mean means us

we're The Beatles you know same thing

with us the Meat Puppets although at one

point a few years into the band somebody

came up and asked me you know does a

meat puppet mean your dick and I was

like

hey I hadn't thought of that you know

it's like you know you play with it with

your hand and it's made out of meat um

but uh it was that's where it came from

Kirk came up with it where were you guys

playing around town uh at that point

not a whole lot of places really you

know I remember like some of the first

stuff we did were just parties

uh

you know friends parties parents who go

out of town go over and play at a party

um and we did that before we even had a

name I remember we played at a friend of

mine's house from grade school Quinn

the Quarry was his name and uh he lived

up in Sunny Slope we went over and

played with him and at the time we're

doing a lot of punk rock covers because

you're asking like one of our influences

how did that affected one of the things

you found we could learn these punk rock

songs pretty easily and play them pretty

easily so uh and Derek was singing most

of them at that time

and our friend Quinn announces he said

ladies and gentlemen the rash this is a

pretty good name you know it's like not

bad so but so we weren't really doing a

whole lot of gigs

um in town you know uh at that point

there's a

you know parties and I can't quite

recall what the first actual like bar

gig or something like that was you know

I could Kerr would remember Kurt would

definitely remember in people to tell

you but I can't quite recall but it

started off definitely more like kind of

a Punker thing you know there was a punk

rock thing happening in town at the time

you listen to in your life uh there was

the feeders you know definitely the

feeders and before that the the and

Derek was aware of all this stuff you

know what an interesting story kind of

the way we got out of town got connected

with Los Angeles which is where all of

our records came out of you know from

the first seven-ish all the way up until

we got signed to a major label and those

guys were in New York uh in like 1990

but before that all Americans came out

of Los Angeles there was a band called

the consumers here in town

and

they were one of the very first punk

rock bands and then there was the

exterminators you know short-lived punk

rock band as well the Liars crazy

homicide there's just a handful of

things this is going all the way back to

like 76 77.

and uh the consumers had played and

Derek

yeah this is even before you know the

band and everything he you know was up

on what was going on but

uh too young to get into a bar so it was

actually Bart ball who had written

something I think in the new times about

the show and if you weren't there you

weren't cool or something and Derek

struck

uh you know uh communication with him

writing him letters and stuff and said

well what if you're too young you know

and somehow that

that led BART to get Derek in touch with

David Wiley who was the singer of the

consumers and all those guys had moved

out to Los Angeles at a point you know

pretty early on after having played some

shows here they all decided to take off

for LA and uh Derek kept up his his

communication with David and then once

we started playing

uh Derek was sending him cassettes of us

and that led to us going out to Los

Angeles and you know playing out there

and meeting all the folks out you know a

bunch of different excuse me bands that

that uh

David knew and you know kind of getting

into the scene out there including

monitor the band monitor

and it was our relationship with them

that led to our first seven inch so but

but before that uh the first Punk show I

went to in town here was troutarama

it was a thing you know that the bunkers

did and it was up at the hall in

Sunnyslope actually

and

uh

the uh bands that played that night you

know the feeders I think play you know

it was just the the local scene that was

happening you know and it was a real eye

opener the brains played as well there's

another punk rock band and that's kind

of why I wanted to go see it because I'd

heard about this kid Buzzy murder was

the guitar player and and a guy gone to

grade school with knew him

man I was just intrigued by you know

these guys having their own bands being

that young and stuff you know so I went

to the troutarama and you know it was

odd this this happened this was kind of

you know kind of I got a kick out of

this just slightly

um

you know we were in the punk at that

point and suddenly there's a punk show

that we could go to in town

and we've all danced like goofballs you

know and it was before it's kind of like

pogoing you know before like the Slam

Dancing and everything but it was still

physical and fun I was young you know uh

you know and uh

the next week's issue of the new times

came out and you know they had a review

of this or they mentioned that the show

had happened they'd taken a picture like

tell it was like taken from stage or

something and I realized hey look at

there it's me Derek and a bunch of our

you know all of us we're kind of like

squished up against each other in the

midst of all this little dancing thing

you know it's like some of our first

press you know like hey you know

and uh so that was the first show that I

went and saw was the troutarama and then

they had um exorama it was another one

of the same folks that were putting them

on and it was the folks that you know

were in a punk you know you do it

yourself kind of a thing you know find a

hall

and put on a show

you know so if if you could Define the

music you play today in three or four

words

what would it be

um

not too shabby you know that's

you know or

quite shabby it's

somewhere in between shabby and not too

shabby is it much different than when

you started well it's definitely

different in that you know we're a lot

older you know uh so just playing wise

you know the amount of time we've had in

the air instruments uh the change you

know physically

[Music]

um

you know one of the we don't play we can

play stuff from all of the albums you

know I have quite a few albums you know

we can touch on any of them pretty much

except we don't really play anything off

of me puppets one or seven inch so

except the covers will occasionally do

walking boss or something like that you

know but the original is off of those

things we those things don't really get

addressed you know and I think that's

you know

one of the things that's uh you know

that time has rot and we're so young

and uh like when we made me puppets one

we dropped three days in a row you know

we'd wake up

dose and you know we did it three days

in a row so we thought that's what you

know you're supposed to do that's all

the cool guy you know that's what our

heroes do so those songs you know they

were just so visceral you know we were

so young just screaming our asses off

and and I think there's you know

definitely hints of the direction that

we're headed in in that they're not just

straightforward like punk rock it's way

more just you know us expressing

ourselves but just as young as we were

and as

you know physicals who were in a way I

think that's you know a change that's

taking place but conceptually you know

we're still after the same thing it's

that same thing as when I hit that thing

in the banjo you know it's just like

damn that's bitching I want to chase

that you know I want to feel that again

I want to chase that thing I want to you

know and we're still just chasing

something you know where you're trying

to you know

let the music you know play through you

and get off on it you know it's

something I feel really fortunate uh

that you know

I still love the feel of a guitar in my

hands you know I just I just love it you

know as far as doing it professionally I

mean you know four drone paths you know

have fun doing it definitely it's you

know it's tough you know obviously it's

not easy I certainly never thought that

you know

I'll get to the point that I've gotten

to with it although I you know we did

sit around and purposely

you know aim ourselves at being able to

do it for a long time

and we were careful about that you know

careful that the content of the songs

not preparing ourselves into any

particular corner you know so

but to get to the point that we've

gotten to you know like you know it's

kind of

you know it's pretty surprising so

uh you know what will be will be but

definitely music's a blast you know and

I you know

you can't encourage anybody enough to

you know not to pick up a guitar pick up

whatever you know and have that

definitely what did you do right what

did you do wrong I did uh mostly

everything wrong and I did I did write

by sinking my claws deep into my

brother's Cape so that I would be drug

Aloft as he soared Skyward

you know and speaking of new music I

mean that's the cool thing right now

that's going on in the studio here you

know I'm getting ready to work with some

young bands here in town

and you know through uh the new label

that Tom Lopez has started slope records

it's so cool that this circle has come

back you know that that's something

that's happening right now I'm going to

be producing a band called The Line

Cutters in here next week it's pretty

neat so most of your musical Focus local

these days uh I mean this stuff that

he's doing it's his label so you know

he's he's purposely promoting the local

scene definitely you know he and he's

the guy that released that exterminators

record that I did you know uh that those

guys asked me to play bass on because

the original bass players passed away

but Tom was the one that afforded them

the opportunity to do that because they

never made an album back then and you

kind of wanted to document the old

Phoenix punk rock scene his he was a kid

on the punk scene uh it's a little

younger than I am so but he was you know

right there shortly after you know and

grew up into the music and stuff and now

he's a has the ability

uh to uh you know he's gotten himself to

the point where he can start a record

label and he's you know and purposely

named it slope you know after Sunny

Slope and and

documenting the stuff that's come before

you know uh and then now his we're

focusing on

uh you know new bands in town and he's

asked me to help out which I'm happy to

do and it's just cool you know that the

circle will come all the way back around

you know to where I'm in the position to

be able to you know lend a little bit of

my experience my enthusiasm my good

looks you know to these kids you know uh

and uh you know and just to to bolster

the Next Generation you know because

because of the the weird circles I mean

the first live show I ever saw oddly

enough the first one that I took myself

to you know I was like old enough to you

know to I don't know if I was legally

able to drive but I was old enough to

know where mom kept her car keys and you

know it was Alice Cooper so you know

it's just like you know it's a phoenix

thing

so what keeps you in Arizona

poverty

uh you know uh we started touring so

young

and uh

you know part of it we're just so

involved with the band you know we're

really hell-bent definitely you know on

just we just love doing it and we played

all the time

and we're

uh you know so caught up in it when we

were younger and then we started touring

and I started to see a lot of the

country that I'd never seen before I've

never been back to the east coast you

know uh fairly well traveled as a kid

just because Mom like to go

road tripping but you know

got to see a lot more of the country

than I had before and then in the world

you know get out to places I hadn't been

before and

and just realized you know I'm fine here

basically you know I know all the

streets I can make it home practically

in any condition you know uh and uh and

I like it here you know I like it I mean

it's changed a lot Phoenix has

definitely changed it certainly has

grown a lot since when I was a kid

you know

um I mean when I was a kid I was 10

minutes from raw desert you know and

that's the middle of town now you know

so you know that that that's a little

shocking how how much it's grown but but

it makes sense because it's a Trippy

cool place you know and definitely this

place is in my guts it's in my bones you

know me puppets are so much of an

Arizona band so much a phoenix band you

know so much of the Sonoran Desert you

know and of Phoenix you know of Wallace

and ladmo you know of the Coliseum you

know just stuff

the desert and you know the Royal Palm

and the Valley of the Sun you know

you know so I'm just just you know where

I'm at you know and my brother hasn't

lived here for a long time you know he's

lives in Austin his daughter's out there

but he Pines for for Phoenix you know

for Arizona I know he does in a way and

you know just because it's it's just

it's home

thank you guys for you know

inviting us into the Hall of Fame the

Arizona Hall of Fame I learned look Mom

we made it yeah I learned a lot it was

it was fun good good so so did I uh well

had fun I had fun definitely and uh you

know it's neat I'm glad that you know

guys are doing this you know because uh

and it's kind of a one of the things

about Phoenix it's kind of and

supportive of some of the Arts in a way

you know but it's nice to see that you

know you guys are doing this you know

tell Hans I appreciate it as well you

know he says hello good we're looking

forward to seeing you at your induction

cool yeah it'll be fun