How I Built A $4B Startup Called WebflowㅣWebflow, Vlad Magdalin

Summary

Влад Магдалин, генеральный директор и сооснователь Webflow, делится своей увлекательной историей о том, как он преследовал свою страстную идею создать визуальную платформу для разработки веб-сайтов, несмотря на многократные неудачи и сомнения других. Его непоколебимая убежденность в необходимости решения этой проблемы и стремление воплотить в жизнь свое видение вдохновляют. Магдалин подчеркивает важность преследования идей, которые действительно имеют для вас значение, а также сочетания предпринимательства с семейной жизнью. Его история демонстрирует силу решимости и преданности делу перед лицом трудностей.

Takeaways

• 😃 Решимость и уверенность в своей идее имеют решающее значение для успеха стартапа, даже когда другие сомневаются.
• 🤖 Вдохновение WebFlow черпалось из сферы 3D-анимации и желания создать похожий визуальный инструмент для веб-разработки.
• 🔁 Вебфлоу потребовалось несколько попыток, чтобы воплотить идею в жизнь из-за различных проблем на ранних стадиях.
• 💡 Видение потребности в лучшем решении и упорство в ее реализации были ключевыми движущими силами предпринимателя.
• 🤝 Поддержка первых клиентов и понимание их потребностей помогли WebFlow начать развиваться.
• 📈 Несмотря на скромные ожидания, WebFlow превратился в крупную компанию, обслуживающую более 200 000 клиентов.
• 👪 Совмещение стартапа и семейной жизни было сложным, но WebFlow культивировал рабочую среду, дружественную к сотрудникам с детьми.
• 🎯 Сфокусированность на справедливой миссии, людях и финансовой устойчивости - ключ к успеху компании.
• 🌍 Предприниматель был вдохновлен улучшить жизнь людей и принести пользу миру благодаря своей идее.
• 💼 Несмотря на трудности, предприниматель никогда не ставил финансовый успех выше реализации своего видения продукта.

Q & A

Какова была первоначальная идея Влада для Webflow?

Первоначальная идея Влада заключалась в создании инструмента для веб-дизайна, похожего на инструменты для 3D-анимации, где креативщики могут напрямую манипулировать сложными интерфейсами и нажатием кнопки превращать свои творения в живой экран.

Как Влад относился к сомнениям других людей относительно жизнеспособности его идеи?

Влад был на 100% уверен в успехе своей идеи, несмотря на сомнения инвесторов и других людей. Он игнорировал критику, считая, что они просто не понимают потенциал его идеи.

Сколько попыток предпринял Влад, прежде чем Webflow стал успешным?

Влад предпринял четыре отдельные попытки, прежде чем Webflow стал успешным проектом.

Что побудило Влада в конечном итоге запустить Webflow?

После просмотра видео «Inventing on Principle» Бретта Виктора в начале 2012 года Влад был вдохновлен его идеями и решил оставить свою работу, чтобы полностью сосредоточиться на Webflow.

Какую роль сыграл Hacker News в ранних этапах развития Webflow?

Когда Влад разместил демо-версию Webflow на Hacker News в марте 2013 года, продукт получил неожиданно большой отклик от разработчиков, которые увидели потенциал в том, чтобы помочь дизайнерам создавать веб-сайты без их участия.

Как опыт Влада в качестве родителя повлиял на культуру компании Webflow?

Поскольку у Влада уже были дети, когда он основал Webflow, это побудило его создать устойчивую рабочую среду с хорошими льготами, что привлекло в компанию много других сотрудников с семьями.

Какую ключевую роль сыграли клиенты в развитии Webflow?

Webflow уделял большое внимание потребностям клиентов и стремился решать их проблемы ценным для них образом. Это клиентоориентированный подход был краеугольным камнем роста компании.

Какую философию использовал Влад для принятия решений в компании?

Влад придерживался философии, изложенной в книге «The Infinite Game» Саймона Синека, которая подчеркивает важность продвижения справедливой миссии, приоритета людей в бизнес-решениях и получения дохода для продолжения этой работы.

Какой был изначальный масштаб видения Влада для Webflow?

Изначально Влад думал, что Webflow будет небольшим продуктом, над которым работает команда из трех или четырех человек. Он не ожидал, что компания вырастет до нынешних масштабов.

Каков был главный мотивирующий фактор Влада при запуске Webflow?

Главным мотивирующим фактором для Влада было желание воплотить в жизнь свою идею о визуальной разработке веб-сайтов, а не стремление к финансовому успеху.

Outlines

00:00

🚀 Истоки идеи и решимость создать Webflow

В этом абзаце рассказывается о том, как Влад Магдалин пришел к идее создать Webflow, визуальную платформу для создания веб-сайтов. Несмотря на сомнения окружающих и неудачи предыдущих попыток, он был полностью убежден в необходимости такого инструмента и ее жизнеспособности. Его опыт работы с 3D-анимацией вдохновил его на создание аналогичного инструмента для веб-разработки. Абзац описывает его настойчивость и непоколебимую уверенность в реализации этой идеи.

05:00

🔄 Преодоление неудач и вдохновение

В этом абзаце описываются несколько неудачных попыток запустить Webflow. Первые три попытки потерпели неудачу по разным причинам, таким как проблемы с товарным знаком, потеря сотрудников и финансирование конкурентов. Тем не менее, четвертая попытка оказалась успешной благодаря вдохновляющему видео «Inventing on Principle» и получению прав на товарный знак Webflow. Этот абзац подчеркивает настойчивость Влада в преследовании своей цели, несмотря на множественные препятствия и неудачи.

10:01

🏗️ Построение продукта и привлечение первых клиентов

Этот абзац описывает процесс создания первоначальной версии продукта Webflow и привлечения первых клиентов. После запуска на Hacker News продукт получил большой отклик от разработчиков, которые оценили его способность помогать дизайнерам создавать веб-сайты без участия разработчиков. Хотя из 30 000 заинтересованных людей лишь 40-50 стали платящими клиентами, команда Webflow сосредоточилась на удовлетворении потребностей этих первых клиентов, что постепенно привело к росту базы клиентов.

15:02

☸️ Философия ведения бизнеса и развития команды

В этом абзаце излагается философия Влада по ведению бизнеса и развитию команды. Его подход основан на книге «Бесконечная игра» Саймона Синека и включает три ключевых ответственности: продвижение справедливой миссии, приоритет людей в бизнес-решениях и получение дохода для поддержки первых двух целей. Влад подчеркивает важность клиентоориентированного подхода, найма и наделения сотрудников полномочиями для решения проблем клиентов.

20:03

👪 Сочетание создания стартапа и семейной жизни

В этом заключительном абзаце Влад дает совет о совмещении создания стартапа и семейной жизни. Он считает, что не существует идеального времени для начала стартапа или рождения детей, и призывает найти баланс между обоими. Опыт Влада как отца помог сформировать корпоративную культуру Webflow, ориентированную на устойчивость и благополучие сотрудников с семьями. Он рекомендует не выбирать между стартапом и детьми, а идти за своими истинными желаниями и потребностями в жизни.

Keywords

💡Идея

Идея - это основная мысль или концепция, лежащая в основе какого-либо проекта или начинания. В видеотранскрипте идея создания «Webflow», визуальной платформы для разработки веб-сайтов, была движущей силой и вдохновением для Владислава. Он был убежден, что существующий способ веб-разработки сломан и нуждается в изменениях, и идея создать аналог 3D-анимационных инструментов для веб-дизайна была настолько очевидной для него, что он был на 1000% уверен в ее необходимости и потенциале.

💡Убежденность

Убежденность - это твердая уверенность в чем-либо, непоколебимая вера в правильность своего взгляда или подхода. Владислав был настолько убежден в своей идее Webflow, что не сдавался даже после нескольких неудач и сомнений со стороны инвесторов. Его убежденность в том, что текущий способ веб-разработки не работает и нуждается в улучшении, была столь сильна, что он не сомневался в успехе своей идеи, несмотря на критику и неудачи.

💡Неудача

Неудача - это отсутствие успеха в достижении поставленной цели или желаемого результата. Владислав упомянул несколько раз, что столкнулся с неудачами в своих предыдущих попытках реализовать идею Webflow. Однако эти неудачи не сломили его убежденность, а скорее послужили уроками и стимулом двигаться дальше. Он не воспринимал их как окончательный провал, а рассматривал как часть процесса и возможность для совершенствования своего подхода.

💡Упорство

Упорство - это настойчивость и целеустремленность в преследовании своей цели, несмотря на препятствия и трудности. Владислав продемонстрировал выдающееся упорство, предпринимая несколько попыток создать Webflow и не сдаваясь даже после нескольких неудач. Его упорство и убежденность в идее в конечном итоге привели к успеху, когда он наконец получил поддержку и ресурсы для ее реализации.

💡Миссия

Миссия - это основная цель или назначение, которому посвящены усилия организации или личности. Для Владислава миссией было создать Webflow, инструмент, который упростит и улучшит процесс веб-разработки. Он видел свою миссию в том, чтобы предоставить больше возможностей и расширить доступ к веб-разработке для большего числа людей, вооружив их визуальными инструментами, подобными тем, которые используются в индустрии 3D-анимации.

💡Клиентоориентированность

Клиентоориентированность - это философия ведения бизнеса, при которой главным приоритетом является удовлетворение потребностей и решение проблем клиентов. Владислав подчеркнул, что ключевым фактором успеха Webflow была их клиентоориентированность и внимание к обратной связи от пользователей. Они стремились постоянно совершенствовать продукт, решая проблемы клиентов и обеспечивая ценность для них, что и привело к росту базы довольных пользователей.

💡Команда

Команда - это группа людей, объединенных общей целью и работающих вместе для ее достижения. Владислав признал, что создание сильной команды, разделяющей их миссию и видение, было одним из ключевых факторов успеха Webflow. Он уделял пристальное внимание найму и развитию талантливых сотрудников, которые были вдохновлены идеей расширения возможностей веб-разработки для большего количества людей и были вовлечены в решение проблем клиентов.

💡Видение

Видение - это четкое представление о желаемом будущем состоянии или результате. Владислав обладал ярким видением о том, как Webflow может изменить мир веб-разработки, предоставив визуальные инструменты, подобные тем, что используются в индустрии 3D-анимации. Его видение заключалось в том, чтобы сделать веб-разработку более доступной и эффективной для дизайнеров, агентств и компаний, позволяя им создавать профессиональные веб-сайты без необходимости глубокого программирования.

💡Страсть

Страсть - это сильная энергия, вдохновение и увлеченность, которые побуждают человека неустанно трудиться над чем-либо. Владислав демонстрировал страстное отношение к своей идее создания Webflow. Его страсть к решению проблемы, которую он видел в текущем состоянии веб-разработки, была движущей силой, побуждавшей его преодолевать трудности и неудачи на пути к реализации своего видения.

💡Ценность

Ценность - это польза, выгода или важность чего-либо. В контексте транскрипта Владислав стремился создать Webflow как продукт, который обеспечивает значительную ценность для пользователей, предоставляя им возможность создавать продвинутые веб-сайты с помощью визуальных инструментов. Он верил, что Webflow принесет десятикратно большую ценность пользователям по сравнению с выгодой, которую получит его компания, что отражает его ориентацию на предоставление максимальной пользы клиентам.

Highlights

Vlad was convinced he needed to build a visual web development platform like the tools used for 3D animation, despite facing doubt and failures from others, because he saw the current way of building websites as fundamentally broken.

The idea for a visual web development tool came to Vlad while he was in college, inspired by the sophisticated 3D animation tools at Pixar that allowed direct visual manipulation.

After multiple failed attempts spanning years, Vlad finally got approval to use the trademark 'Webflow' in late 2011, reigniting his determination to bring the idea to life.

Vlad's breakthrough moment came when Webflow's demo launch on Hacker News in 2013 resonated strongly with developers who saw its potential to streamline the design-to-code process.

Gaining traction and validation after the Hacker News launch was overwhelming for Vlad, who had nearly given up hope after running out of money on previous attempts.

Vlad approached building Webflow with a customer-centric mindset, continuously listening to users' needs and aiming to deliver valuable solutions, rather than following a rigid framework.

Vlad's primary motivation was to bring his idea into reality, not to make as much money as possible, because he already felt grateful for the opportunities his family found after immigrating to the US as refugees.

Vlad initially thought Webflow would be a small product built by a few people, but it grew much larger than anticipated as they focused on putting the idea into more people's hands.

Having kids early on shaped Webflow's culture towards sustainability, work-life balance, and attracting experienced professionals with families.

Vlad's advice is that there's never a perfect time to start a company or have kids, but you can find a way to balance both pursuits if they are truly important to you.

Webflow became like a 'third kid' for Vlad during the startup's early years, but he believes it's possible and rewarding to pursue both entrepreneurship and parenthood simultaneously.

Vlad encourages aspiring entrepreneurs not to let having kids become a mental block, as there's never a perfectly stable time – if you want both, go for it.

The key responsibilities for a business, according to Vlad, are: 1) Advancing a just mission that creates far more value for the world than for itself, 2) Prioritizing people inside and impacted by the business, and 3) Generating revenue to sustain the first two responsibilities.

Vlad was inspired by the video 'Inventing on Principle' in early 2012, which sparked his fourth and successful attempt at starting Webflow by posing questions about finding deep purpose in one's work.

Despite initial low conversion rates from Webflow's waitlist after launch, the team persisted by closely serving the needs of their first customers, slowly building their user base.

Transcripts

a lot of people assumed that it just

couldn't be created right because

somebody else tried especially one of

the biggest players in the space like

Adobe and macromedia they failed so

something must not be possible but in my

mind I was like 100% sure even when I

got a lot of Doubt from other people

like you talk to investors like oh this

will never work out I walked away from

that almost like just discounting it I

was like oh they don't know anything

like it's it's obviously going to work

to me it was just so obvious that it's

the current way that things work is

broken and it needs to be thick that I

was just 1,000% convinced that I need to

build that thing that specific

hi I'm Vlad magdalin I am the CEO and

one of the co-founders of webflow and we

create web platform to allow people to

create really professional websites

webflow is Visual Web development

platform that allows companies

Freelancers agencies to create really

really sophisticated websites we have

over 200,000 customers and the last

thing I think we shared publicly is were

over $100 million in Revenue kind of up

there in terms of important platforms

but we're still compared to things like

WordPress and larger platforms still

getting

started I sort of stumbled into it by

accident so I came to the United States

as a refugee with my parents and I

didn't really see myself becoming like a

designer or visual artist but my dad was

trying to make some of these like trying

to create some businesses on the side

and that kind of require he asked me

convert some cataloges from English to

Russian uh and that required learning

graphic design and that led to me

getting a job at this place called

Russian ameran media which is like

running this Russian Yellow Pages where

I was making ads business business cards

different things that was just like

rapping design for customers or for

clients that sort of snowball then led

to me wanting to learn 3D animation it

sort of Blossom the story was a little

bit complicated cuz first I was doing

graphic design and then when I first

started going to college I made the

decision to go study computer science

because that's what my brother was doing

that's sort of what I heard was like

lucrative career to follow so I started

doing that I did that for a year and I

had such a hard time doing that I like

really didn't enjoy it that I dropped

out and then moved up here to San

Francisco to go to the Academy of Art to

study 3D animation thing that that

really inspired me to do that was seeing

what Pixar was doing so this was 2001

2002 where Pixar was like blowing up

like they were making all these

Incredible movies and I was downloading

all these tutorials from the web

learning how to do 3D modeling 3D

effects and it just gave me this feeling

of like empowerment whatever story you

can imagine you can kind of like create

these scenes and translate them into 3D

space and then make a movie from that I

don't think I ever got like really far

to creating My Own Story end to end like

some people could like where they were

you know animating from the time that

they were a kid but what really spoke to

me was like this technical aspect of

like really sophisticated 3D animation

tools that were being used at 3D and

movie industry and trying to learn them

through all of these tutorials and sort

of like I felt like I was getting

superpowered I actually didn't finish I

dropped out of art school cuz I you know

was too expensive it I decided to go

back to study engineering to the school

I was going to before then I got a job

at a web design agency to sort of start

the payback student loan in that job I

was working with a design team creating

essentially web design in Photoshop and

I was like intern that was translating

those designs into HTML CSS basically

the web that's when you know one time I

had this flash of an idea that why can't

the way that 3D animation work where

creatives are doing all of the work in

the sophisticated software they pressing

a button it's going to live screen

without a translation layer why can't

something like that exist for web so

that was the initial inspiration for

like web flow has to be a thing like I

want to create something like 3D

animation tools for web design and I

think that that's was the even though

after that I got another job and started

working and into it it already like that

idea had already sparked in me that I

wanted to try to start this on the side

whether I was like Moonlighting or

working nights and weekends or trying to

find co-founders on the side like it was

that moment when I was still in college

before my first real job that I had this

inspiration like I have to build a

company around this or I have to build a

product that is kind of like 3D

animation tools but for and effectively

web Flow came it just took four

different attempts to make it happen

honestly I didn't know anything about

business didn't even think much about

how we were going to monetize it how I

was going to make money I just just saw

that something was clearly broken or

something that could be better and I

just had this very intense confidence

that if you were to if I was to build it

somebody would be willing to pay just

like the 3D animation software I was

using some of it I was paying for even

as a student I saw that like hey this

provides me enough value that going if

it was like a student Edition like it's

so valuable that I'm willing to pay for

it so I sort of had this thought that

I'll figure out how to monetize it later

but the most important thing was like

how do you actually create the tool that

solves the problem in a way that I was

imagining and I always thought that that

was like the first thing to focus on and

a lot of entrepreneurs have this if you

build it they will come mentality and

that's exactly what I had I was like

I'll figure out those details later I

just got to build this thing prove to

myself that it's possible and then we'll

try to prove to others that and I

honestly thought at that time that it

was going to be a company of one like I

thought I was just going to create it

and like maybe sell it to some folks to

use I never thought I was going to

become like a company with multiple

employees let alone hundreds so I was

very maybe naive about it like I didn't

know all the details that go into

building a company but the first thing

was like I need to solve this problem

for myself and I can see that it's kind

of broken and I wanted to create a

better

solution first time we wound things down

it sort of felt like not really a big

failure it felt more like hey I'm

getting married we're talking about

having a kid I have to get a real job I

will keep working on it nights and

weekends so it didn't really feel like a

failure at the time it ended up like

petering out so I just kind of forgot

about it for a year but then the second

time it was a combination of finding

another co-founder working on at nights

and weekends and then that sort of

petered out but I also didn't feel like

it was a big failure the third time

definitely felt uh there was a lot of

ups and downs where we got some funding

we actually got Incorporated we had two

other co-founders then the biggest thing

that happened like everything was on

track we had applied for a trademark

kind of towards the end after we had

pitch put together we applied for a

trademark that's sort of kind of what

you do to get permission to make sure

that you have all your duts in a row U

but then we got a response from the

government saying like there's already a

company that has this trademark and then

we got a notice from that company saying

like better not use it so we got really

discouraged but not discouraged enough

to like totally we started working on

rebranding the company so it was going

to be not webo but something called

marked up like HML markup but with some

missing vowels so we had sergy who ended

up being my co-founder created a new

logo and we're about to go live but then

that's when kind of Life took over and

it was like a slow trickle of like one

co-founder being uh demotivated and

leaving another co-founder sort of

saying like maybe this is I wouldn't be

willing to like Risk Everything to start

a company around this and a competitor

came out weely at the time I got like

$20 million in funding and I was like

crap it's over they already won like how

can you possibly catch up when we have

zero uh we're out of money and they you

know just got $20 million so it was like

maybe like giving up then but you know

maybe a year later the idea started to

come back around seeing how the

competitor was going in a different

direction and not building quite the

same thing that we would have built and

gaining more confidence in myself as an

engineer KN that I could like build

something independently started sort of

like thinking about bringing the idea

back again it was sort of a fluke think

an accident or something it's just like

great timing or or luck that it was 4

years later at the end of 2011 I had

already moved from Mountain View in this

in the Bay Area to Sacramento which at

that point had that second kid a

trademark certificate arrived to my

house that said congratulations you own

the trademark for web flow cuz I guess

something happened with that other

company where they let it expire or they

went out of business or whatever by that

time I was already working sort of still

working at my day job but working with

my brother Sergey who ended up being one

of my co-founders to build more websites

on the side and sort of like starting to

develop web flow that was like the

perfect sign of like okay maybe it's

meant to be uh now you can use the name

web flow again that's like started the

ball rolling again on like starting to

plan how we would like leave our jobs

get enough funding to start it again in

2012 it was 1,000% idea based and it's

not just 3D animation it's like game

design video editing film uh production

and compositing all of these industries

have a way to visually directly

manipulate very sophisticated like all

of these ways to do like hair simulation

and and rigid body simulation so it's

not basic sketching like in Photoshop

you're creating like entire systems that

are really sophisticated to do like

visual effects when I looked at web

design it was like it's so obvious that

something like that needs to exist and

some companies tried like Dream Weaver

and like Adobe tried many years ago but

I think because they failed early they

were just too early in the market a lot

of people assumed that it just couldn't

be created right cuz somebody else tried

especially one of the biggest players in

the space like Adobe and macromedia they

failed so something must not be possible

but in my mind coming from that 3D

background it was just obvious this

needs to exist so I was like 100% sure

even when I got a lot of Doubt from

other people like you talk to investors

like oh this will never work out I

walked away from that almost like just

discounting it I was like oh they don't

know anything like it's it's obviously

going to work sometimes that's bad cuz I

was wasn't looking at critical input and

it would have been helpful for me to be

more critical of like what might not

work but to me it was just so obvious

that it's the current way that things

work is broken and it needs to be thick

that I was just 1,000% convinced that I

need to build that thing that's specific

idea and I even told my wife and I

honestly thought this that if it wasn't

for this idea I'd have no interest in

starting a startup like it was

specifically to make this idea happen if

I didn't have that conviction I'd be

perfectly happy like working for Google

or Microsoft whoever but it was that

specific idea around upload that I I

just knew had to become a

reality unlike the previous session I

don't have any prizes to give out ideas

are very important to me I think that

bringing ideas into the world is one of

the most important things that people do

and I think that great ideas these

things take on lives of their own which

give meaning to our lives as people I

think a lot about how people create

ideas and how ideas grow what sorts of

tools create a healthy environment for

ideas to

grow this was late 2011 that I got this

approval to use a trademark and that got

my brain spinning around like okay

should I start this again the thing that

actually Sparks the fourth attempt where

I was like I'm 100% sure I saw this

video called inventing on principle

which I think every single founder

should see it's by this person named

Brett Victor and I saw that in early

2012 and when I saw that video and it

has to do with kind of the intersection

of art design and programming but

another part of it also like half of the

talk is about why do you do the work

that you do like what is the purpose

behind your professional Endeavors the

combination of both of those things like

something that he was talking about

being very similar to webo the visual

development visual manipulation land

asking this question of like are you

really fulfilled and do you a deep sense

of purpose from the work that you're

doing that after watching that video

literally the next morning I called my

boss and said I'm going to be starting a

company then started building kind of a

demo we didn't really have a product so

the first thing we thought of like okay

we only have really 3 months of Runway

of savings to fund our kind of family

expenses Etc so we're going to make a

Kickstarter video so we went all in kind

of got Incorporated started making a

Kickstarter video and started designing

the product what it would look like how

we would show it in the kickstarter

video so that other people could see

what it's going to become so they can

pledge and like give us some financial

support so that we can actually build

the product Etc uh it turned out that we

had completely miscalculated and by the

time we were almost done with the video

we found out that Kickstarter doesn't

allow hosted software so like the entire

thing we were building was not not

compatible with their terms of service

so we kind of had to start from scratch

that was basically money wasted started

building a demo and started applying to

YC once we had the first version of a

demo without any customers we applied

didn't get in that was like a really

discouraging very surprising I thought

we were like for sure going to at least

get an interview but but it was a kind

of a rude awakening to be like hey

you're too early like all you have is

sort of a demo you don't really have a

product yet or any users you just kept

building and kind of decided cuz the the

window to apply again is 6 months later

but by that point we were already like

running out of money so we just decided

all right we're going to go like super

lean save as much money as we can and

just keep it like try to build a product

that we can actually put into in front

of people so they can see exactly what

it looks like and get it closer to or

like would people be willing to pay for

it so those next 6 months were like

really really tough but also really fun

like we were trying to extend every

possible like credit card uh loan that

we could arrange borrowing money from

Friends selling cards converting them to

leases but it was also one of the most

motivational time as a company because

we were like do or that uh we were day

and night working on the design coding

like and building the actual application

by the time March 2013 came around we

had a demo to show all these designer

fors like Reddit dig at the time there

was like designer news and it didn't get

much traction but then we put on Hacker

News which is more of like in developer

community and we thought developers

would probably not care about this

because the entire tool kind of talks

about maybe replacing developer but it

really took off it's funny they actually

a lot of developers that saw us launch

on Hacker News really resonated with the

product because they saw how much it

could help the people they partner with

like the designers to get a bunch more

done without including them it's

actually one of the things that you know

I was a developer before where I would

take Photoshop files from a designer and

translate them to you know a CMS or

something like that it was some of the

most kind of tedious Med and boring work

a lot of developers are pulled into you

might have like an entire development

team working on product right and and

then the engineering team is pulled into

marketing projects to say like hey we

have this new landing page for a new

marketing campaign can a developer come

in and using this figma prototype build

the marketing page and code that's some

of the most kind of tedious work to do

that translation work cuz what

developers really want to be doing is

the more sophisticated thing right and

there's so much demand for those

developers on their time that they'd

rather be doing that so I think that's

why uh webflow resonated so well with

developers not only that they see that

the tool helped designers create by

themselves but also the way that they

created by themselves generated really

clean code CTIC code that was performant

and didn't have the types of issues that

other website Builders did that's when

we started getting our first Le in like

track and that you know with that we

applied to YC with that we got into that

program and then like that kind of gave

us a Lifeline to keep working on it and

the rest is kind of history from there

for a while I was really happy when we

initially launched the idea and started

collecting like a list of folks cuz

before we could actually sign people up

and it was just really overwhelming to

go from failed multiple times and then

we are definitely out of money and at

our last attempt in like the last draw

cuz if if that didn't work out like

there's probably no way that it would

have taken another 10 years for me to

feel confident again to try again for my

wife to feel comfortable taking another

Financial Risk Etc so it felt really

awesome to see that traction and that

validation when we actually launched for

real and convert try to convert that

list of I think it was like 30,000

people in our weight list to customers I

think only like 40 or 50 signed up so

out of like 30,000 40 or 50 we were like

shocked we thought that maybe we' built

something wrong or something how could

we go from tens of thousands of people

interested to only a handful only tens

actually paying for it that didn't feel

great but like over time we started to

like really pay attention to those folks

and get closer to them and serve their

needs and that's like slowly started to

build a base of more and more customers

being honest it wasn't a deep framework

it was customer centricity like how do

we keep delivering on our mission like

how do we keep listening to customers

and keep solving their problems in a way

that feels valuable to them how do we

build our team that can help us do that

there was a a little bit more of a

formal framework called I read this book

called The Infinite game by Simon Sy and

it had this structure of like the

responsibilities of each business are to

First Advance a just Mission so

something that or just cause something

that brings 10 times more value to the

world than it does to you for us that

was like always been the case for every

like $10 we make through our software

one of our users probably making like

$1,000 because using it to like sell

Advanced websites builds to clients Etc

and the second responsibility is to

prioritize people in your business

decisions so like how do you build up

your team how do you create an

environment of bringing in amazing

people that are empowered to solve these

problems for customers but not just

people in your company but also what uh

effect do your business decisions have

on people outside of the company how do

our decisions around how we structure

our business impact our users pack the

communities that we live in pack the

environment like really think through

that and only the only third the respons

posibility is to generate Revenue but

importantly not just make money but in

order to do the first two things for as

long as possible so to keep funding and

advancing your your mission that you

believe is like a good thing for the

world and to make sure that you like

factoring in how people along the way

and I've sort of thought about it like

that since the early days of like how do

we what decisions do we need to make to

keep advancing our mission to keep

bringing the power of web development to

more and more people honestly always

come down to finding people who like

really care about doing this like

bringing more more power into other

people's hands spending a lot of time

like trying to hire them and bringing

them in and empowering them to be

successful within the company Etc I

think the two biggest fact like really

thinking about customers and really

thinking about the team that is going to

get you there everything else is like

details there's a lot of like learning

and scale and things that we've had to

figure out a lot of mistakes that we

made but ultimately it's those two

things that are always at the center our

customers and the people who we build

bills for who our entire mission is

meant to serve and our team like how we

behave together like who comes together

to solve this problem for

customers well I think the thing that

motivated me the most was I wanted to

this idea to exist and the other thing

is because my family came here 9 years

old when we came here as a refugee

family we had we were on welfare for

like 3 years my dad was trying to like

make ends meet that experience showed me

that even like a more modest job was way

more than the kind of life that I would

have had Back in the USSR so I already

felt like I made it I didn't have like a

normal entry level for engineering job

but into it I didn't feel like I was

like trying to make a ton of money I was

just like trying to find ways to make

this idea that I have happen I think

that was the main motivating factor I

wasn't really trying to figure out which

path gets me the most sort of monetary

or financial outcome cuz I already felt

like my life is already so much better

than it would have been that was just

never a goal and I was always I think

after the idea came to me just chasing

how do I make it happen and not thinking

of that as a business vehicle I was just

thinking of like what do I need to do to

bring this to reality not to make as

much money as possible like I I

literally thought when we were starting

web flow even this fourth time that it

was going to be the three or four of us

building a small product and having more

and more customers but having this small

agency where it's we're all sitting

around one table and building this

product but it turned out to be much

bigger than we ever imagined um but that

wasn't by design it was just because we

were trying to make this idea and bring

it to life and then putting it into the

hands of more people and I just required

more and more

people the best advice is there's never

a great time to start a startup or have

kids but the other part of that advice

is like you always figure it out assumed

when we were getting started that I had

to hide the fact that I had kids from

like investors advisers like the general

assumption was that you can't do both

you can't be a parent and start a

startup I think it's fundamentally not

true and I'm glad to see that it's

becoming more of a trend where people

are just like not afraid to be doing

both at the same time you can totally

figure it out I would say it was

probably know the biggest factor in US

shaping our company culture the fact

that I already had kids to make sure

that we were working in a sustainable

way that we were creating like great

benefits we attracted a lot of other

people with families who were generally

tended to be more experienced kind of

fresh grads Etc it was definitely hard

but I think so many great companies have

been created by parents um and so many

great Founders have had kids along the

way and it just worked out the important

thing there is to make sure that you're

not choosing one over the other you like

then you find a way to balance both your

family and and your life's work it was

definitely my wife and I talked about

having a third kid after the startup

already happened and it felt for a while

that web flow was that third kid and

then by the time kids got a little older

we just decided not to have more kids

but there was a in the thick of it it

was like really hard to decide to have

more kids which I think was the right

decision but in a world where I had to

choose between having kids or starting a

startup definitely pick both uh because

both can be like so rewarding and so

fulfilling in many different ways I

think a lot of people have like this

mental block around if I already have

kids then it's not possible or if I

start a startup then I should never have

kids or until it's like stable it's

never going to be stable you know

there's never a a great time when

everything is figured out so go for what

you truly want and need in your life and

a lot of times that's both of

those