Patriarchy Hurts All Of Us — Including Men | Hear Me Out

Summary

In this episode of 'Hear Me Out,' host Celeste Headley discusses the complexities of gender identity and politics with Robin Dembroff, a Yale philosophy professor. They challenge the traditional view of patriarchy, arguing that it's not a simple 'men vs. women' dynamic but a pervasive system affecting everyone, including men. The conversation explores how societal expectations of gender perpetuate inequality and harm across various groups, emphasizing the need for a nuanced understanding of gender as a fluid and socially constructed process.

Takeaways

• 🗣️ The podcast 'Hear Me Out' with host Celeste Headley discusses the complexities of gender identity and politics, especially during Pride Month, where there's been backlash against brands for supporting fluid gender identities.
• 🏳️‍🌈 Gender fluidity is not a new concept and has historical roots going back to the Iron Age and Copper Age, challenging the binary view of gender as simply a tug of war between two sexes.
• 💬 The guest, Robin Dembroff, argues that gender is not a noun but a verb, emphasizing that it is a process of constant social regulation and classification rather than a fixed identity.
• 👥 Dembroff posits that patriarchy is not just about men having power over women but is a system that oppresses everyone, including men, by enforcing rigid and harmful gender standards.
• 🚷 The podcast highlights that gender inequality and harm are systemic issues that affect various groups differently, and should not be oversimplified to a binary men vs. women issue.
• 👮‍♂️ Dembroff discusses how the concept of 'real men' is used to uphold a small group of elite men in power, often at the expense of others who do not fit these narrow definitions.
• 🤔 The conversation challenges the traditional understanding of patriarchy, suggesting it is not a system that benefits all men but rather a complex structure that perpetuates inequality.
• 🔍 The discussion emphasizes the importance of critically examining the ideas of manhood and womanhood that are internalized and how they affect behavior and societal expectations.
• 👗 The script touches on the backlash faced by public figures like Harry Styles for challenging gender norms, reflecting society's struggle with gender nonconformity.
• 💔 Dembroff shares personal anecdotes to illustrate the fluid and context-dependent nature of gender perception, arguing against the fixed categorization of gender.
• 🌐 The podcast concludes by encouraging listeners to be aware of the gender dynamics at play in everyday life and to question the impact of these dynamics on individuals and society.

Q & A

What is the main argument presented by Robin Dembroff in the podcast 'Hear Me Out'?

Robin Dembroff argues that the concept of patriarchy is more complex than simply a system that benefits men over women. Instead, they propose that patriarchy is a system designed to keep the most elite and wealthy men in power over everyone else, affecting all genders and social groups differently.

How does Robin Dembroff's perspective on gender differ from traditional views?

Robin Dembroff suggests that gender is not a noun but a verb, meaning it's an ongoing process of classifying and holding people accountable to certain standards, which can differ across contexts and individuals, rather than a fixed identity assigned at birth.

What is the term 'gendering' as used by Robin Dembroff?

'Gendering' refers to the process of classifying individuals as either a man or a woman and then holding them to certain societal standards based on those classifications, which are internalized and can vary among different people and contexts.

How does Dembroff explain the impact of gender on men of color and those with disabilities?

Dembroff explains that historically, ideas of manhood have been weaponized, particularly against men of color and those with disabilities, to push down the majority of men and to justify various forms of discrimination and inequality.

What does Robin Dembroff mean by 'real men'?

'Real men,' according to Dembroff, refers to a small group of institutional elites who most closely approximate society's most powerful ideas of what men are and should be, and this group is often used to justify and reinforce economic and social inequality.

How does the podcast episode address the issue of sexual harassment in the workplace?

The episode suggests that sexual harassment and discrimination in the workplace are more complex issues than a simple binary of men versus women, affecting different groups of people in various ways and highlighting the need to look beyond aggregate statistics to understand individual experiences.

What is the historical context of the term 'patriarchy' as discussed in the podcast?

The term 'patriarchy' originally referred to household power dynamics where the male head of the household held power over women and children. However, in the 1960s, radical feminists expanded the term to describe systemic gender inequality and harm throughout all aspects of society.

How does Robin Dembroff respond to the argument that testosterone makes men more prone to violence?

Dembroff recommends the book 'Testosterone: An Unauthorized Autobiography' by Rebecca Jordan-Young and Katrina Karkazis, which debunks the idea that testosterone inherently makes men more violent, suggesting that such beliefs are not scientifically supported.

What is the role of gender in the economic struggles faced by white working-class men, as discussed in the podcast?

The podcast suggests that during times of economic crisis, white working-class men may double down on traditional ideas of manhood to shore up their sense of self, which can lead to discriminatory attitudes and policies against other groups, as a way to cope with feelings of economic emasculation.

How does the podcast address the issue of chivalry and traditional gender roles in modern society?

The podcast encourages listeners to question the blueprints for manhood and womanhood they have internalized, suggesting that awareness of the impact of these roles on social interactions is essential before addressing larger questions of change.

What is the significance of the listener email shared at the end of the podcast?

The listener email serves as an example of the diverse opinions and perspectives on the topics discussed in the podcast, illustrating the complexity of issues like reparations and the importance of considering various viewpoints in these conversations.