Stanford Seminar - Modernizing the Shipping Industry

Summary

The speaker shares his entrepreneurial journey, highlighting the outdated and inefficient practices in global trade, like physical paper titles for goods. He discusses founding Flexport to revolutionize the industry with an internet-based platform, emphasizing the importance of solving real-world problems and leveraging technology, infrastructure, and expertise. The talk also covers the challenges of being a lean startup, the necessity of entrepreneurial sales, and the value of learning from every experience.

Takeaways

• 🌐 The speaker emphasizes the outdated and inefficient nature of traditional shipping and trade, with a focus on the physical movement of paper titles across oceans.
• 📄 The concept of 'shlep blindness' is introduced, where overwhelming problems are ignored due to their complexity, leading to missed opportunities for innovation.
• 🚢 The founder of Flexport shares his journey from working with his brother on motorcycle sales to realizing the potential for improving global trade through technology.
• 💡 The idea of using the internet for its original purpose of facilitating global commerce is highlighted, with the current system being ripe for digital transformation.
• 🔍 The importance of addressing the core problems of supply and demand in business is underscored, with the speaker's belief that solving these equates to a successful business.
• 🛑 The speaker discusses the frustrations faced by entrepreneurs in global trade, including complicated compliance, customs, and the lack of trust in freight forwarders and customs brokers.
• 🚀 The story of Flexport's beginnings, starting as a marketing site with the aim to test the waters for a service that could streamline customs clearance for businesses.
• 🤝 The significance of sales in entrepreneurship is highlighted, with the speaker advocating for a customer-obsessed approach and the value of 'entrepreneurial sales'.
• 💼 The necessity of combining technology with real-world infrastructure and expertise is discussed, as Flexport aims to create a seamless platform for global trade.
• 🌟 The potential for Flexport to grow rapidly in a two trillion-dollar market is mentioned, with the company's mission to make trade easy for everyone through technology.
• 🛂 The legal and regulatory hurdles faced by Flexport in becoming a licensed and compliant player in the heavily regulated freight forwarding industry are outlined.

Q & A

What problem does Flexport aim to solve in global trade?

Flexport aims to solve the inefficiencies and complexities in global trade by making it easier, more transparent, and data-driven, allowing companies to use the internet for seamless commerce.

Why does the speaker consider it madness to use paper for shipping documents?

The speaker considers it madness because it is inefficient and outdated to fly pieces of paper across the ocean to serve as titles to goods in an age where the internet can facilitate digital transactions.

What initial challenges did the speaker face in the global trade industry?

The speaker faced challenges such as complicated compliance, customs issues, and mistrust in freight forwarders and customs brokers who could charge arbitrary fees and delay shipments.

How did the speaker's early experiences in China influence their perspective on trade?

The speaker's experiences in China, where they worked on importing and selling motorcycles, highlighted the broken nature of global trade and inspired them to think about creating solutions to make trade easier.

What is 'shlep blindness' according to Paul Graham, and how did it affect the speaker?

Shlep blindness is when a problem seems so overwhelming that people ignore it. The speaker experienced this by recognizing the inefficiencies in trade but initially doing nothing to solve them until later founding Flexport.

How did Flexport test the market demand for its services before fully launching?

Flexport tested market demand by creating a marketing website offering customs clearance services. Over a year, they gathered 300 company sign-ups, including large firms like Foxconn and Cargill, which validated the need for their services.

What is the significance of the metaphor involving seashells, limestone, and marble in the speaker's message?

The metaphor illustrates how pressure and challenges can transform and strengthen a team or company, much like how seashells become limestone and then marble under immense pressure.

What is Flexport's approach to integrating technology with traditional freight forwarding?

Flexport integrates technology by developing platforms and mobile apps to connect all parties in the supply chain, structuring data, and automating processes to reduce reliance on manual, paper-based methods.

Why does the speaker emphasize the importance of entrepreneurial sales over regular sales?

The speaker emphasizes entrepreneurial sales because it involves creative problem-solving and never accepting a 'no.' This approach is crucial for startups to understand customer needs and build solutions that can attract customers and investors.

How does Flexport measure the impact and value it provides to its customers?

Flexport measures impact through metrics like reducing the number of emails in a supply chain, speeding up transit times, and allowing customers to operate with fewer supply chain personnel, thus saving time and money.

Outlines

00:00

🌐 The Inefficiency of Paperwork in Global Trade

The speaker begins by highlighting the absurdity of using physical papers as titles for goods in the digital age of global trade. Despite the prevalence of container ships and the constant change of ownership across oceans, the industry still relies on flying papers around the world. The speaker reflects on his journey starting with an interest in global trade and economics post-graduation during the dot-com boom, leading to his first job involving the import and sale of motorcycles via the internet and live auctions. This experience underscored the complexities and frustrations of global trade, especially for entrepreneurs, including issues with supply chain, manufacturing, and fulfilling demand.

05:00

🚢 Overcoming Industry Challenges with Technology

The speaker discusses the challenges faced while running a supply chain in China, including the frustrations with paperwork and the lack of transparency and control in the industry. He emphasizes the importance of addressing these issues and the transformative potential of using the internet for commerce. He shares his personal journey of discovering the brokenness of trade during his time in China and the realization that data visibility and control over the supply chain were necessary improvements. The speaker admits to initially not acting on this realization, attributing this inaction to 'shlep blindness,' a term coined by Paul Graham, which refers to the mental block that occurs when a problem seems too overwhelming to solve.

10:01

📈 From Public Records to a Business Insight

The speaker transitions to discussing his discovery that the documents flown across oceans for trade are public records in the United States. He capitalized on this by collecting, digitizing, and selling access to these records, which provided valuable data on imports. This business, while valuable, had its challenges due to the public nature of the data, which could potentially become free or be made more accessible by the government. The speaker reflects on the importance of defensibility in business and the need to constantly innovate to maintain a competitive edge.

15:02

🛍️ The Human Side of Global Trade and Commerce

The speaker delves into the human aspect of trade, emphasizing its historical significance and its role in defining humanity. He discusses the power of trade as a force for good, highlighting its potential to lift people out of poverty and foster peace. The speaker shares his belief in the importance of making trade easier and more accessible, and how his company, Flexport, aims to use technology to address the inefficiencies in the industry. He also touches on the importance of sales and the role of customer obsession in building a successful business.

20:03

📱 The Evolution of Customer Expectations and Supply Chain Management

The speaker discusses the significant shift in customer expectations and supply chain management due to technological advancements. He contrasts the old model of centralized inventory and slow delivery with the new reality of on-demand delivery and the need for small, distributed inventory caches. The speaker explains how Flexport is positioning itself to manage these small inventory pockets efficiently through a dashboard and AI, emphasizing the importance of real-time data and predictive capabilities in modern commerce.

25:04

💡 The Power of Entrepreneurial Sales and Customer-Led Growth

The speaker shares insights on the importance of sales in business growth, particularly entrepreneurial sales, which focuses on creatively solving customer problems. He discusses the process of building trust and delivering on promises to acquire customers like Foxconn and Saudi Aramco, even before having the infrastructure in place. The speaker emphasizes the value of iterative learning and experimentation, highlighting Flexport's rapid growth and its mission to make trade easy for everyone through technology and customer obsession.

30:04

🌟 The Importance of Cross-Disciplinary Approach in Business

The speaker underscores the significance of combining technology, human expertise, and real-world infrastructure in creating value for customers. He describes Flexport's strategy as akin to a decathlon, where the company does not excel in any single area but combines multiple disciplines effectively. The speaker also discusses the evolution of consumer behavior and the impact of the internet on global trade, suggesting that the distinction between consumers and businesses is blurring due to the ease of starting a company and participating in trade.

35:05

🛑 Navigating Legal Barriers in a Heavily Regulated Industry

The speaker talks about the various legal challenges and the process of obtaining licenses from entities like the Department of Homeland Security and the Federal Maritime Commission. He highlights the importance of compliance in a heavily regulated industry and the need to understand and adhere to the laws governing global trade. The speaker shares his experience with the legal process, emphasizing the necessity of patience and thoroughness when dealing with regulatory bodies.

40:05

📈 Measuring Customer Impact and Value Creation

The speaker provides examples of how Flexport measures the impact of its services on customers, such as reducing the number of emails in a supply chain team and speeding up transit times. He discusses the tangible benefits of their platform, like saving customers time and money, and how these benefits translate into increased value for the customers. The speaker also shares anecdotes of creative problem-solving in sales, emphasizing the importance of listening to customer needs and finding innovative solutions.

45:08

💼 Insights on Entrepreneurship and Building a Successful Company

The speaker concludes with advice for aspiring entrepreneurs, emphasizing the importance of focusing on solving problems and creating value rather than solely on making money. He discusses the learning opportunities that come with entrepreneurship and the importance of being customer-obsessed. The speaker also shares thoughts on the challenges of finding and retaining talent, the process of acquiring customers, and the creative strategies employed by Flexport to understand and meet customer needs.

Keywords

💡Global Trade

Global trade refers to the exchange of goods and services between countries. In the video, it is emphasized as a fundamental aspect of the speaker's career and the broader economic landscape, highlighting its complexity and the challenges associated with shipping goods across borders.

💡Supply Chain

A supply chain is a network between a company and its suppliers to produce and distribute a specific product. The speaker discusses the broken nature of supply chains and how difficult it is for entrepreneurs to navigate the logistics of moving goods from production to the consumer, emphasizing the need for innovation in this area.

💡Flexport

Flexport is a technology company focused on improving global trade by making it easier and more transparent. The speaker describes the company's mission to solve the logistical challenges of shipping goods and how it integrates technology, infrastructure, and expertise to streamline the process.

💡Entrepreneurship

Entrepreneurship involves starting and running a new business, often characterized by innovation and risk-taking. The speaker shares personal experiences of entrepreneurial endeavors, highlighting the importance of solving real-world problems and being persistent in the face of challenges.

💡Freight Forwarding

Freight forwarding is the process of organizing shipments for individuals or companies to get goods from the manufacturer to a market or final point of distribution. The video explains the intricacies and difficulties of freight forwarding, including compliance and trust issues with freight companies.

💡Lean Startup

The Lean Startup methodology advocates for developing businesses and products in a more efficient way by prioritizing customer feedback and iterative design. The speaker mentions how Flexport applied lean startup principles to test market demand and build their platform.

💡Supply and Demand

Supply and demand is an economic model of price determination in a market. The speaker discusses the importance of balancing supply and demand in business, noting how solving problems related to these concepts is crucial for success.

💡Technological Innovation

Technological innovation refers to the introduction of new technologies or methods to improve processes. The speaker emphasizes the role of technology in transforming global trade and logistics, from digitizing documents to creating platforms that connect various stakeholders in the supply chain.

💡Compliance

Compliance in business refers to adhering to laws, regulations, and standards. The speaker highlights the challenges of compliance in the freight forwarding industry, including dealing with customs regulations and ensuring that all documentation is accurate and timely.

💡Market Validation

Market validation is the process of determining whether a product idea is viable by testing it with potential customers. The speaker describes how Flexport used market validation techniques, such as setting up a fake website to gauge interest before fully developing their service.

Highlights

The inefficiency of using paper documents for shipping containers across oceans and the need for a digital solution.

The speaker's journey from Cal Berkeley to working in global trade and the realization of the broken trade system.

The challenges faced by entrepreneurs in global trade, particularly in supply and demand aspects.

The difficulties in manufacturing a differentiated product and the importance of standing out in a competitive market.

The frustrations with the traditional freight forwarding industry, including trust issues and price collusion.

The concept of 'shlep blindness' and how it can prevent entrepreneurs from addressing large, complex problems.

The importance of getting angry about problems and using that anger as motivation to find solutions.

The speaker's experience in China and the realization of the need for a transparent and easy-to-use supply chain platform.

The founding of Flexport and its mission to make global trade easier, more transparent, and data-driven.

The role of technology in connecting various parties in the supply chain and making the process more efficient.

The necessity of combining technology with real-world infrastructure and human expertise in the freight forwarding business.

The importance of sales in entrepreneurship and how it is a misunderstood and underappreciated art.

The challenges of being a 'lean startup' and the strategies used by Flexport to validate their business idea.

The impact of Flexport on reducing supply chain complexities and improving transit times for customers.

The future of supply chains with small caches of inventory everywhere and real-time, on-demand control.

The importance of focusing on creating value for others as a means to achieve personal and business success.

Transcripts

thank y'all for us mate um did you all

know that every single time you see

these big ocean containers container

ships out here in the in the bay and did

you know that every single time you ship

a container there's a piece of paper

that's actually flown across the ocean

to serve as title to the goods is think

about this for a moment it's madness

that there's actually because every time

you ship a container there's a new owner

on the other end of the ocean and we're

actually flying pieces of paper around

the world to serve as title still

thankfully we're starting to change some

of that at Flex port others in the

industry we're making it possible to use

the internet for what it was made for is

to do commerce across the world and

fulfilling the original purpose of the

Internet I first discovered that when I

was a when I graduated from Cal go bears

we I couldn't find a job it was 2002 I

didn't really know what a job or a

company was at that time although it was

the middle of this dot-com boom that my

interests were much more around global

trade and economics and why some

countries are poor and some countries

are rich some people are poor and some

people are rich and that there's not a

lot of jobs in that space there should

be more but there not a lot at that time

at least and so I got a job working for

my older brother actually my first job

at at school was my older brother ran

this business buying motorcycles in

China and selling them on the Internet

as well as through live car auctions in

the United States and I moved to China

spent two years working for him and

working with sort of joining the company

doing everything as an entrepreneur does

we we didn't sell that's a Honda bike my

marketing team made that we we didn't

sell Honda's we sold a chili which G Lee

bought Volvo a few years ago she leads

the chinese car dealer a chinese car

company that bought volvo at this time

this was in 2005 when I was living in

China Julie made motorcycles and they

were they were not great motorcycles I

still have some guilt on my conscience

from selling these crappy bikes without

enough spare parts except one of the

things I learned however

was that trade is just broken that it is

so hard to ship something and you have a

really hard problem if you're

entrepreneur you have very hard any

business actually as really hard

problems I call them if you could

categorize them simply as supply and

demand in supply you have to make a

great product at scale if it's a

physical good this likely means

manufacturing in a lower-cost

country more and more it means making a

differentiated product which is almost

impossible look how many smart people

are in this room and if you want to

stand out how are you gonna do that

around they'll and think about all the

people in the world to stand out it's so

hard to make a good product so that's

the supply side of the equation

demand you have to find customers you

you've got to make in more and more that

means building a following having a

brand a community all of these things so

you've got supply and demand my

fundamental belief is that if you solve

those two problems you should have a

good business and we found over and over

again even when we hadn't solved those

problems even when something wasn't

going right with our supplier we didn't

have a great brand we would still get

hung up on the part in between how do I

get these products from the supply to

the demand it was super hard

we had complicated compliance customs

like what documents do you need it's

very confusing you need to you need to

trust your freight forwarder your

customs broker these freight companies

and they're not the most trustworthy

gang let's say there have been even

since I started Flex port numerous

criminal arrests for price conspiracy or

what do you call it that price collusion

fixing prices it seems every couple of

years the industry can't help themselves

they all collude and make the fuel

surcharge the same for you see it on

your airline ticket sometime so you

couldn't really trust the people once

they have your merchandise it's in their

possession and you can't get it back so

they can then charge you whatever they

want it was a very frustrating

experience as an entrepreneur because

I'm Here I am I didn't have any money

what we would do is actually buy the

container of goods and

we did you could you can in global trade

you can basically place a down payment

you can pay 30 percent down and then

they'll just sip the stuff to you and

your the seventy percent once it's on

the boat but the boats already moving so

really you don't know the seventy

percent until it arrives so you've got

like a three or four week window to sell

as many of those things as you can get

cash and then pay your factory and so we

were very bootstrapped and lean in

entrepreneurial running these cycles

always a hair away from bankruptcy and

so then when the great forwarder would

hold your merchandise and not release it

over some document that was flown across

the country or across the ocean and the

wrong you didn't get the right people to

sign the document you need to send it

back it was a real nightmare

and I this was in 2005 and six is when I

was living in China running the supply

chain for this company and realized at

that time that it was broken

now I didn't start flex port to solve

that problem for exports designed to

solve this problem four companies make

it easier more transparent give people

data visibility control over their

supply chain I didn't start flex port

until 2013 as I only mentioned at that

in that window in between there was like

an eight year period and that's a period

I would like to talk about for a minute

because it there's I had that I had seen

the problem I had experienced the

problem firsthand it made me mad and I

didn't do anything about it and that's I

think that's a pretty common experience

and one that might be a void a bowl if

we just let ourselves to get a little

bit more pissed off sometimes that it's

not you know when something is not right

and it it's broken you should let

yourself get angry you should be like

hey this is this is shouldn't work like

this this should be easier I was a I was

guilty of what Paul Graham the founder

of Y Combinator my first investor my

friend what he calls he has a great

essay called shlep blindness it's a

great Paul Graham essay you should you

should read it if you haven't already a

shlep is a Yiddish word for an arduous

journey

and slept blindness is when a problem

seems so big and overwhelming that your

brain your conscious brain just shuts

down is like there's no possible way I

could solve this and you don't even

think about it

in the essay his example is stripe where

anyone who ever sold anything on the

internet who sold something on the

internet before so if you would see for

the Digi stripe were to use some

platform if you had run a website before

stripe you had to set up what's called

merchant processing and these were done

by banks usually like Wells Fargo was my

merchant processor you had to apply and

some three months later they would give

you permission to charge people of

credit card fees to charge people money

with a credit card you had to get

permission you had to apply please let

me sell something um and if what's

interesting about this is that every

internet entrepreneur in the world went

through that process like by definition

if you sold something on the internet

you had to go through this process so

all of us saw that process all how

painful it was and then went on about

our business and sold cookbooks or in my

case dirt bikes or whatever else you

sold on the Internet

you saw the problem it stared you in the

face this is way too hard to accept

credit cards and it's now I read today a

twenty billion dollar market cap company

so there was this idea that just stared

everyone in the face with twenty billion

dollars and we also had every single

entrepreneur on the planet saw it and

didn't seize that moment and and and

Paul's new favorite example at least in

private in an email that he sent me is

Plex port which is anyone who ever

imported anything which look around

every almost everything got imported

from another country and every single

one of these businesses and

entrepreneurs saw this experience this

it's way too hard to ship stuff and just

went about their way selling stuff

instead of saying hmm like maybe I could

be the one to fix this and I I think

that that's a very important lesson

whether you're starting a company or

working for a company that you take that

and say there's your brain is gonna shut

down when it sees a problem being too

big doesn't have to be in a company by

the way you see it every day if you live

in San Francisco what are we going to do

about homelessness or other causes other

problems that we

in society let them get you should get

pissed off about this stuff and and and

know that like if you're not gonna solve

it who is there's not someone else

that's going to come and solve our

problems in general so I I was guilty of

this as well I learned about the problem

of how hard it was to ship stuff in 2006

and I didn't start flex port until

really made it my full time job in 2013

and in between I I wasn't I didn't do

nothing I discovered that that same

document that's being flown across the

ocean is turns out it's a public record

in the United States and no one had done

a good job collecting all of these

making it searchable and accessible and

they're full of valuable data you can

see every single product that's imported

into the country who made it who sold it

where is it where's it coming from and

going to

so I between sort of 27 2007 and 2013 I

built this business where we collected

now four hundred million of those

documents digitize them and sell

subscriptions to the database now that

business has is it's a good business

actually it's a very valuable product

but it has a bit of a problem and that

the data is maybe you can identify it

for me we sell subscriptions to a

database of public records there's a

keyword in that sentence that's this

challenging which is public and that

means someday it will either be free or

someone else government will make it

actually searchable or it'll just go

away and and it's not very defensible

let's say so if you're talking about

that those core problems of supply and

demand on the supply side of that

business you're you differentiated maybe

not is it defensible and if you don't

have a defensible business you're likely

not to have a business at all in the

future so I lived with some degree of

paranoia for a number of years about I

remember when Obama launched data.gov

that I almost had a heart attack that

day before I realized that they had not

put these public records on dated iCub

yet and so I started working on what are

the other problems in this space I

really love this space or the internet

meets trade for me it seems like the

the original core purpose of the

internet the commercial internet the

dot-com portion of the internet was to

allow commerce they allow the idea of a

seamless web of Commerce that any two

people on planet earth could trade with

each other and global trade often gets a

bad name

because it's usually done by big

anonymous faceless institutions and we

all know you make kind of most stupid

decisions are made in big groups and and

and yet if you were to have one person

say a basket weaver in Guatemala selling

her baskets to someone in Iowa like who

would look at that and go this is

horrible and and so when you when you

bring humanity to the problem I think

it's much more you realize much more how

powerful trade is as a vehicle for

Entrepreneurship or opportunity we can

look at the stats in Asia over the last

thirty four years especially in Asia but

around the world we've looked at almost

a billion people out of poverty with

free-market economics yeah and allowing

people to participate in a global

economy and so I look at that and I

learned about that at Cal and afterwards

you look at that on the one hand yours

appears a force for good one of the

greatest forces for good I would say the

two greatest forces for good or trade

and in the internet and and we've got on

the one hand this incredible powerful

thing and I've witnessed firsthand how

hard it is and why couldn't we make

software to make this easier so I I came

to realize that I could spend a lot of

time though that it would be a very

meaningful way to spend time and if

there would be a great business for it

and I'll walk you through a little bit

of the story but I wanna talk a little

bit more about trade and how important

it is to humanity we we know there's

evidence of trade that goes back at

least 40,000 years older than the

evidence for art for language for more

or less all it is the thing that defines

humanity to a large degree is that we

trade where the animal kingdom does not

trade Adam Smith has a great quote about

this that no no man ever saw a dog trade

a bone with another dog that we and so

and yet here's this thing that's the

essence of humanity that's extremely

powerful that that brain

we know that no two countries I still

believe this is still true with the

McDonald's have ever gone to war with

each other

so commerce global like the ability to

connect the global ecosystem is good for

peace anytime that you have two

countries that are engaged in a dispute

with each other a conflict you can be

certain that the trading communities

those who are involved in business and

doing trade with each other will be

passionate advocates for peace between

those two countries is it's not good for

business

when you have conflict my there's a

famous paper called eyepencil it's an

academic paper from the 60s I am where a

I presume an economist showed how there

is no human who knows how to make a

pencil that it to make a pencil you have

to know first off how to make wood how

do you make wood you need to be able to

chop down trees how do you chop down

trees you need to have steel so now all

of a sudden you need metallurgy how do

you do that that's that's a very

complicated thing I couldn't begin to

tell you how to do I think I know how to

make a pencil I don't that's just for

the wood you haven't mentioned the

graphite we have to go underground and

mine it the rubber you have to know how

to grow trees create rubber maybe a

synthetic these days but how do you

there's no human there's a one human

that could make something as simple as a

pencil and so trade is how this all

comes together is that we exchange not

just the object but the ideas that go

into that object every time you engage

in trade so here's something this cord

of humanity and it's just pretty broken

I've lived it firsthand ask you ask you

any family members who have been

involved in trade trying to ship

something they will they will regale you

with stories about what a nightmare it

is so I started thinking about this when

when my last business was causing me a

degree of paranoia and wanted to

experiment I to see if in fact other

people would would if companies would

buy if I built this service would

anybody buy there's a entrepreneurs or

there's a there's an idea that

entrepreneurs are risk takers and that's

not because it shouldn't be true and I'm

not I don't see myself as a risk taker

we in fact I

I want to make sure that people before I

take any risk that someone's gonna that

it's going to work I want to have a very

high probability of success so I built

in I once it was in 2010

well before I truly founded flex board I

built a company I built a website just a

marketing site offering an online

service to help people clear customs to

help companies clear customs so allow

you to file the paperwork needed to get

a product into the country I let that

website run for a year I was still

running my other company but I built

this on the weekends and during one year

of this website operating I got 300

companies to sign up including Foxconn

which is the maker of the iPhone Cargill

big AG company and then one day Saudi

Aramco signed up for my website which is

the largest company in the world the

Saudi national oil company signed up for

my fake website it was just a marketing

site I didn't know how to ship anything

I just wanted to see if this existed

would someone buy and that was in 2010

or so and so it took me the better part

of three years to get learn how to ship

stuff how to do customs get licensed

heavily regulated industry we had to

learn a whole lot of things and and I

think this was even I don't remember

when that book the Lean Startup came out

but we're there Plex port is that the

ultimate lean startup that we have been

from the start and I think we're now the

world's largest lean startup that we are

constantly experimenting would someone

buy this if it worked if we could do

this would you buy and that's beyond the

art of sales the in sales is very

underappreciated as an art as a science

as it as the core driver of business the

ability to sell something the ability

convince someone that and and

entrepreneurial sales means that you

never get a no ever you get a yes if and

then you know it might it may end up

being no because the if is impossible

but you always get it yes if yes I would

buy from you if you could clear these

cantankerous which I couldn't do but I

at least I got a yes if from from Saudi

Aramco

and this is really underappreciated

there are currently only three

universities in the United States that

offer a major in sales it's probably 20%

of all the jobs in this country and an

important part of every job even if

you're a scientist you need to be able

to persuade people of your ideas and we

only have three universities Florida

State Baylor and Weber State in Utah are

the only three universities offer a

major in sales I guarantee you graduates

of that program going to make a lot of

money and go on to be very successful

because it is something you can study

and learn and so those of you who are

engineers here in this program don't

discount the role of sales you have to

get out there and talk to users and find

out what is it what is your problem

sales is get a bad word right we think

of like the used car dealer that's like

the image that you have as you think of

a salesperson and I it's just wrong a

sales persons job is to understand

customers problems and figure out can I

solve that problem and if you can solve

it in a way that allows you to make

money you've succeeded

there's purest problem-solving so III

don't know if I'm a great salesperson

but I value sales very much I'm flex

board has always been Sales Lead always

will be sales lead because that means

we're customer led we're customer

obsessed going out to find customers and

help them with this important problem of

shipping things and making it easier for

them so it's a massive industry freight

forwarding is what we call it the art of

shipping Freight across the world to

ship one container across the world I

mentioned that piece of paper but to

move a container across the world you're

gonna have as many as 15 companies

involved in this chain it's basically a

relay race of unstructured data being

handed off from node to node by human

information brokers people are going to

look at it and it should be called

Freight email forwarding you take you

then you say okay what do I do next and

then forward it to the next person in

the chain in a relay race and what we've

just what we've said is if what we what

we are doing is building a platform to

structure all of that data make it

reusable connect all of those companies

together to a single platform and allow

them to do business together bring

everybody together and make it seamless

from end to end in the process we make

crate cheaper to ship while giving a

better user experience and if you can be

cheaper and better in a two trillion

dollar market you can grow quite fast

and I'll show you some of our I do have

a revenue graph in here somewhere but

our mission as a company is to make

trade easy for everyone I've mentioned

already why I think this mission is

really important and the way we do this

technology so we've got a platform that

connects all the parties this is much

harder than I thought the bank lad

didn't understand how hard it was I just

when I originally started the company I

was just thinking about my own problem

it's too hard to ship stuff and I didn't

know why that was true I could tell they

weren't using tax because there were

pieces of paper being flown around but I

didn't really understand that there's

these fifteen different companies in a

chain all depending at any problem

upstream results in all these problems

downstream I've learned that once we got

started and so what our technology

platform looks like is interfaces

whether it's a a web interface mobile

apps now for truck drivers a lot of it

is api's and an older standards of inner

data interchange technologies to connect

all these companies together let them do

business the mobile app is probably one

of the more interesting aspects of our

tag where we now over four thousand

trucks that we connect the a mobile app

to allow these trucks to to us to

dispatch the trucker so we don't have to

call every time a container arrives in

the port we can just dispatch a trucker

we didn't have that when we started we

started with a nice little clean UI when

we were talking it was I hear I can a

little bit of a one-man band but I can

build an application that helps you as

it as an importer as a brand manage your

Freight and all the stuff on the back

end we were doing manually and we've

been going step by step building the

apps for the for the different parties

so tech helps a lot but tech is not

enough at least in this business because

there's a huge amount of infrastructure

required we're talking about real

infrastructure warehouses trucks planes

ocean carriers ocean you know ships

trains we ship up by all modes of

transport

and how do you connect that in some of

it we own release we now have four

warehouses and one 747 that we as flex

force logo on the side is pretty cool

and it we have but a lot of it we don't

least a lot of this is business

development it's going out and finding

the owners of those assets of that

infrastructure and understanding their

needs and treating them as a customer

and saying okay what how do you make

money you make money when your ship is

full you make money when and how do you

fill your ship having predictable

customers who will show up with the

freight that they booked and so we've

had to go out and and make those

partnerships I think this is a something

that a lot of technologists are afraid

to do it was part of why this

opportunity was still available is still

available because technologists think

that you can sit in a room and build

technology and change the world a lot of

the real world a lot of the world's

problems you can't deduce from first

principles at a whiteboard in a room

yeah actually I have to go out there and

talk to people and learn how it works

there because it's not built on logic

it's not logical that you fly a piece of

paper across the world that's just how

it is

and you won't you could get geniuses in

your room and they wouldn't be able to

solve this because you've got to go out

in in my case and drink whiskey and Hong

Kong until 4:00 a.m. until you convince

them to give you some space on their

container ship and so it's not just tech

it's also infrastructure and business

relationships that go into that and it's

also expertise clearing clearing goods

through customs is something that

technology just won't do it until we

have real AG I you're not going to be

able to classify a product by customs

code it's it is very difficult for a it

requires a lot of judgment because this

is the law and the law is built on human

judgment it's not built on algorithms

yet so it is the combination of these

three things that makes flex ports

special that you're actually like

pulling from multiple disciplines being

cross-disciplinary

is super important that you have to go

out and pull the best ideas use tech but

combine it with human expertise and

combine it with real real world

infrastructure and I like to sometimes

say that flex Porter

a bit of a decathlete in that sense that

we're not the probably the best

technology company in the world were not

the best at infrastructure and I don't

think we have the most expertise but in

the unique ways that we combine that we

can create a lot of value for customers

and what our customers trying to do

they're trying to ship Freight they're

trying to have visibility over their

products when I was a kid

set that long ago I graduated from Cal

in 2002 there was no Wi-Fi I did which

meant there was a point of having a

laptop I used to go to library to use

computers because what was the point of

a laptop if it can't connect to the

internet

I would there were no cell phones like

this is weird it's not that long ago I

don't feel that old and and yet the

world has changed dramatically since

then and one of the big changes that

customers are now in charge consumers

are in charge if you're when when there

was only three television channels when

I was a kid

brands could get away with three week

the Sears catalog mail order it took

three weeks to get your stuff maybe six

if you offer that today nobody will buy

your products it's to day and more and

more its two-hour delivery is the

expectation when there was only three

channels there were only two brands

energizer and Duracell and you had to

choose you want the Energizer Bunny or

the copper top there weren't infinite

proliferation of SKUs Amazon now you've

got 80 million SKUs I think on Amazon

you got the customer has so many choices

and real-time on-demand what does that

mean for a supply chains how is that

relevant to this time well in the old

world if you have three-week delivery

time you can get away with one warehouse

in the middle of the country and serve

the entire population from that one site

in the new world that we're heading into

and that we are now living right in the

midst of you've got if you want to our

delivery what is that you need little

small caches of inventory everywhere

you're gonna see brands there's probably

an Amazon Fulfillment Center within 20

minutes of here how else could they do

to our delivery because they're out

there not like leaving the warehouse for

either running milk runs so if you're

gonna have small tiny pockets of

inventory everywhere you can manage that

the old way with emails and pieces of

paper you your you'll go crazy

you're just not physically possible

so that's what we're positioning

ourselves for is like the world where

you have small little bits of inventory

everywhere and you have a dashboard to

control it all and you have AI deciding

when to buy things where to buy them

where to position them to be ready for

the future

so like if I if I was to flip this light

switch this I'm taking a risk here I

don't know if it'll come back on did I

get it uh try you can imagine how do I

turned off the lights there we go when I

did that in real time I just activated a

power plant it just got a little bit

hotter in real time on demand your act

there's an incredible most interesting

thing I learned last year I did I don't

know much about physics but you flip the

light switch you are controlling a

massive machine you personally it's

responding to your demand and that's the

way that's not the way it works in

commerce and commerce you place an order

on a website and there's a bunch of

people making phone calls and duct tape

and wires sending shuffling paper and

three hours later you get some

electricity and think about how much

poorer we would all be in that world how

much less power you would use and that's

the way our commercial infrastructure

works right now is you place an order on

a website it does that the factory does

not receive any signal about that order

like ever

there's many months later somebody with

an Excel spreadsheet is deciding how

much good how many goods to order the

next quarter and so what we're trying to

do is say okay let's build this network

we we on board all the world's brands

and every time we get a brand right now

we got four factories on average so we

this is where the ten thousand number

comes from we've got about ten thousand

factories in China on the network and

when when a customer gives an order it's

sending a signal back to that factory to

queue up production for the next for the

next cut and decide when to when to ship

it how to ship it and where to position

it to be ready for future demand and

start being predictive about this is a

great application for machine

intelligence by the way you should not

be humans should not be making these

decisions it's too hard too many too

many variables

and so it is that combination when and

what's very interesting about this this

is our biggest rival in the United

States called Expeditors Expeditors calm

they were the flex board of the 80s and

we you can see our growth we did five

hundred million dollars in revenue last

year and our first revenue ever was in

2014 we did two million dollars in

revenue so we've had just the last four

years we've been crazy at flex port and

we we why is that how are we able to

just like grow so fast it's because

people are already used to buying

Freight if you build a brand new piece

of software and you have to sell

software you've got to convince someone

to that they need something new in their

life and as hard it's hard to get people

to change and want something new that

they've never done before but if you're

a company you already have a budget to

but to ship right you ship Freight every

day

spend trillions of dollars worldwide on

Freight so if you're just a little bit

better you should get the whole market I

think we're a lot better but you should

get the whole market just by being a

little bit better and so by taking that

combination of adding technology to this

infrastructure and expertise problem you

can you can grow super fast and I would

I would look very much my working

framework for how to find good problems

to solve it and not everybody has

experienced firsthand these problems

like where should you go look of course

in your own life look for the problems

and get pissed off about them but but

one good framework is just take that

global GDP pie chart and look at the

segments of it and I would actually just

take the GDP pie chart and divide each

section by the number of hours of

computer programming that have been

applied to it and you have a pretty

decent framework for like where do the

opportunities still remain I think

there's going to be huge opportunities

and parts of the world the Internet

hasn't quite turned upside down yet

because you got to expect that software

and the internet and these technologies

are gonna touch every single aspect of

our lives it's quite interesting to even

look around we're in a pretty tech

enabled place I see a lot of devices

that are tech like connected in some way

electronic but if you actually just like

did a mental calculation of everything

in my field of view right now not

counting all of you people what

what things are connected to the

internet what are the objects that are

connected right now it's not that many

like this carpets not connected that

ceilings not really connected and you

should expect that with the tech in the

future every single thing is going to be

connected all the time and and so that

that's the world that we're heading into

and there's gonna be tons and tons of

opportunities to find problems and when

you when you find an area where people

are already doing something but software

can make it a little bit better you just

create huge opportunities so this is a

this is a something I shared with my

team they didn't make this slide that

just the way I wanted them to I should

make my own slides but the on the left

you have seashells

okay and and the next column over is

limestone so seashells when they are

buried into the bottom of the ocean and

they get pressurized and crushed by the

by the weight of that ocean they become

limestone there's also some

microorganisms in there in calcium

carbonate but it becomes limestone when

that sea bed when that sea bed floor is

submerged by plate tectonics if it's at

the intersection of two plates like we

are here one of them gets abducted and

in the pressure of that it bakes it into

marble and that marble can be built into

something beautiful and so I use this a

lot at my company to talk about how much

pressure we're under you if you go and

start a company you're gonna it's going

to be ridiculously challenging it caused

a lot of anxiety and your gut like it is

not easy to get something going from

nothing and you have to make sure as

your team that if you're working with a

team you can get ripped apart by this

pressure you can get in fights and and

and really rip each other apart so I I

try to bring this to my team and say

look we have to use that pressure we're

it's so hard we have a thousand

employees right now at Flex work and

we're five years old can you imagine

like uh-huh five years ago is me in a

garage and now I have a thousand

employees looking to me for guidance and

I try to use this metaphor and say okay

it's gonna be really hard and we have to

use that to make ourselves stronger as a

team and bring ourselves together so

those are just a few of my remarks we

they asked me to leave

for Q&A so I would love to be available

to you to think about how many people

here get planning to start a company

raise your hand if you want to start a

company when you write when you graduate

few of you and how many what are there

what are some of the reasons why people

would want to start a company who's who

raise their hand right there what was

the reason why you want to start a

company to have independence and build

your own things yeah any others like

what are some good reasons why people

would want to start a company childhood

dreams a dreams of what being the boss

fame and fortune others to solve a

problem yeah that's where I would focus

completely all my energy even if it is

fame and fortune that you seek nothing

wrong with that

fortunes probably better than fame but

and there's nothing wrong with that

money is awesome and I trust me I used

to have no money and now that I have a

little money it's so much better

but there are some things in life where

the more you want it the less likely you

are to get it and and if you focus on

the money nobody nobody wants to give

money to people like that

you know you're like greedy and

self-centered and not not you you're

cool but yeah it's not the best way like

it's not who you give money to people

who solve your problem right and so even

if what you're after is to solve money

to be independent you have to focus on

what's the problem

how do I create value for someone else

is if you're creating value for someone

else you'll get money it's one of the

greats I've always been enthralled by

this paradox because I also want money

less the fame but more the fortune and

I've wanted money but I realized like

the more you focus on the money less

likely you are to get it there are some

things in life that are like that and

those are the really interesting things

love is probably one of those things

like the more you want it like start

being creepy and stuff and nobody's so

your focus instead I'm like whoa what

how could I make someone love me maybe I

should hit the gym or like learn be more

interesting work on my cheeks and so

that would be that would be my biggest

piece of advice for those of you who are

in this entrepreneurial mindset it's

awesome there's no better way to learn

about the world and solve problems than

in solving and starting a company that

you'll entrepreneurship you learn about

every aspect of the human experience in

starting a company it's not the best way

to make money frankly like go try and

get a job at Google you'll make more

money but well on a risk-adjusted basis

but you probably won't learn as much

because if you're an entrepreneur you're

every day having learned something new

you've got to learn about leadership and

persuasion and sales and accounting and

finance and marketing and technology and

all its like the amount of things that

you're gonna learn in entrepreneurship

far outweigh any other field they might

at least in my experience um and so I

would focus on that as like how could I

learn the most that's true for any job

even if you want to start a company you

might not be ready yet because I

couldn't have done this if I didn't know

about how hard it was to import stuff

and I couldn't

deduced that without going out there and

getting a job and doing things and

learning about the world so it's even if

you want to start a company and you're

not yet there that's cool go and focus

on how do you learn the maximum amount

of stuff so that because you never know

where you're gonna find out that and

then let yourself get pissed off when

you learn something that's just like

wrong so that would be my big advice for

y'all my big parting words but I would

love to take some questions from the

audience who has a question yeah I think

in the back recent Packer news interview

with Vinod and he has this concept of

building a zero billion dollar company

over a zero multi-million dollar company

basically give like 15% of your equity

to your first three founders even if you

hired them after I was wondering to hear

your thoughts on weight again so it's

building a zero billion dollar company

so the talent is like that high of a

caliber and you carve out most of your

equity versus a zero million dollar

company basically the engineers you can

find to help you build it hmm is the

idea to give more equity to better found

I'm not sure I understand stay fit the

whole rapid growth that you're

anticipate hiring talent is like in

credits for a question hiring talent is

incredibly hard especially when you're

nobody yeah and getting convincing

people to come on board I I highly

recommend that you not musics as an

excuse that you can't find a co-founder

and that you just get started and do it

yourself it the same is true like if you

need investment money and you can't to

get your business off the ground you

need an investor maybe you should maybe

there's a different business that

doesn't need an investor because there's

a lot of problems in the world and

they're not all and and you can do I did

flex for my third business that's worth

talking about the third one that that

generates profits and what doesn't

generate profit yet but third one that

generates some real revenue didn't use

any VC for the first two I had

co-founders for the first two and flex

board I found it by myself solo founder

in part because it's so much easier like

number one reason that startups fail is

that founders getting a fight so I you

know if I'm gonna fight with myself that

we have a different problem and so I but

then what I did I basically have

co-founders at Plex sport

I got ping off the ground got some

traction even raised some money got some

customers and then i attracted talent a

co-founder level talent but it was four

years out I didn't they didn't get the

title co-founder because it was four

years later just the first four years

was me in a basement and so but but I

was very generous with equity for them

and I think that that you yes you

shouldn't owning a small a big piece of

something that's not worth very much

isn't isn't that valuable so I would

recommend getting started getting some

traction

nobody's gonna join you if you're just

talking and you have a PowerPoint like

they'll join you when you've got

customers and the customers are like

showing it saying that good things about

you then you'll get much better people

for Less equity that if I my co-founder

one of them was a partner at Boston

Consulting Group

my co-founder my CEO oh he was he

partners at Boston Consulting Group make

a lot of money and he walked away from

that because I had a lot of traction we

had a lot of trust amongst each other

but I had gotten somewhere if I tried to

recruit him in the beginning he wasn't

gonna quit that job to join the guy with

the PowerPoint so I don't know if that

answered your question exactly but all

right

yeah so the question was how long did it

take me to get real money from customers

with the company I think we got our

first revenue about six months after I

made it my full-time job and we there

was that period where I was signing up

people but it was just a marketing

website it wasn't a real company yet

once we got licensed by Department of

Homeland Security and actually started a

business before that it was just a

website it didn't really exist it wasn't

even a business entity once we were off

the ground six months to build an MVP of

the product and then what I figured out

was that on Google AdWords I could

acquire a customer for $40 and there

were several thousand dollars in my

estimate at that time this is even the

smallest one so Google AdWords and we

just increased our AdWords spend

exponentially whenever we needed to

raise money

so the question was over the past

hundred years been mostly businesses

doing trade and I you see consumers

starting to participate in trade and

well I think the difference between a

consumer and a business is blurring and

you shouldn't import something as a

consumer you should set up an LLC it'll

cost you like a couple you know not much

money and a boom now you're a business

so what it's on some level that

distinction isn't that real the real

thing is wow it's so easy to start a

company and participate and the

Internet's made it so participatory in

the United States the top one percent of

companies import eight as of 2006 the

last time I've seen this data last night

the last date I have the top one percent

of companies import 80 percent of all

the merchandise instead of 80 20 it's 81

1% imports 80 percent that was in 2006 I

would love to see a refresh on this data

The Economist who did it

it was a paper from 2006 and I got to

Commission him maybe to make it to

update it but my hypothesis is that now

that long tail because of Amazon because

of EJ because of the internet more

broadly it's now possible for anybody to

participate in in trade my own story is

that like when we were importing goods

from China we found all of our suppliers

on the Internet

we're going Holly Baba and other web

sites and identified suppliers and we

found all of our customers on the

Internet you couldn't have done that

business without the internet so yeah

we're the Internet's bringing us closer

together it's so amazing that almost

every human whether what's our mobile

phone number now it's like 4 billion or

5 billion people have mobile phones

which is crazy if you knew the number

you could call almost everybody on

planet earth you could just have a

conversation with them right now and

what is that going to do for us and the

idea that everybody in the world has

Wikipedia and all the knowledge there so

I yeah I think it's there's gonna be

more and more trade we want it we want

to make it possible because those big

companies have the resources and the

knowledge and the know-how of how would

it trade and the the individuals

shouldn't have to think about it they

should focus on making a great product

and finding customers and then like all

the operational stuff in between

make it easy so it was the question was

around much for being a lean startup and

how we went from doing customer

discovery getting out there and talking

to customers and convincing them to try

us out

we um I call it entrepreneurial sales

there's two kinds of sales there's

regular sales and there's

entrepreneurial sales regular sales your

goal is to get to know as fast as you

can because then you can move on to

somebody else who will say yes

entrepreneurial sells you can never get

a no you got to get that yes if yes I

would buy from you if you could do this

and what you would actually do is go on

site we convince people to take a call

take a meeting get on site with them and

add a whiteboard we the the best example

was the world's largest watchmaker we

got their head of supply chain he

responded to a cold email like a spam

email basically spam hi there right and

and so we would get him we got him to

agree to take a meeting and we put it at

a whiteboard and put him at a whiteboard

with a what with a with a with a marker

and said draw for us

your ideal supply chain dashboard what

would you like it to look like and he

drew it like okay I want I want to see

on a map every dot all the icons for all

my products that are in motion and if

it's and if any of them it's gonna be

late it should turn red it's gonna be

more than 24 hours late having read and

I forget what else he asked for um and

we came back a month later and we had

built that that you know and he was like

whoa I've got a ship some freight with

you guys turned me into a computer

program I didn't know I could do that

and they said okay I will ship Freight

with you if you can hit this price and

the price that he asked for was half of

what we were buying Freight for so like

I you know almost there we then took but

we got his commitment that if we could

get that price

then he would ship great so we took that

to the ocean carrier and said hey I'll

bring you the world's largest watchmaker

if you can give me it wasn't a crazy

price it was just way lower than our

prices we were nobodies but the ocean

carrier was happy to have their business

gave us that price and so it's like

going back and forth and we it's a

chicken and a lot of chicken and egg

problems that need to be solved with

creative thinking and getting the yes

from one side and then yes if from one

side and then see if you can solve that

if and recognizing that you should not

try to solve every year people ask for

crazy stuff right and so didn't but

bring that back your art so it's a bit

dangerous for a startup just to hire our

sales person because regular sales

people are used to trying to just turn

through the lead and get to the one

that's gonna say yes and and ignore all

the ones who say no this is what's very

special about salespeople is that they

can handle rejection in a way that would

like be brutal for the rest of us but

it's sales persons like I don't care

they're very happy they're very

self-confident and and and that's a

little bit dangerous what you need is an

entrepreneurial salesperson someone

who's really creative thinking on their

feet and this your job is it boundaries

to be that person most of the time it's

going to be you and be able to get in

front of the customer and really listen

to their needs and understand it and

then be able to bring it back to your

team explain it and say could we solve

this problem or not most of the time

it'll be not yeah a couple more I won't

have time to get to everybody how about

you right there yeah so the question was

whether we how do we measure I think how

do we measure the impact that we can

have in the value that we create for our

customers lots of different ways to

measure it our biggest customer is one

of the world's largest paper makers and

we eliminated 60,000 emails from their

supply chain team in their first year

with us so that's and we did that

because they they sell raw paper

materials to their customers and we were

we actually this is again a very

entrepreneurial salesperson at Flex port

her name is Julie and she convinced the

she hacked our system basically

and on-boarded 75 customer service reps

we're not customer service software but

she realized that if their problem was

companies were their customers were

calling them asking where's our

containers and they were having to email

their supply chain team who would then

email a freight forwarder and then like

it was taking them four days to get a

response to tell the customer where's

their stuff and Juli realized she's not

a vice-president flex four because she

realized if you could onboard all these

customer service reps they could just

answer that question in real time and so

it's like being super creative like whoa

the platform actually does things it

wasn't designed to do it's always a good

sign

when people start abusing your platform

to do different things that's one really

good example another one one of our

customers sold Amazon last year for over

a billion dollars at the time they sold

they were doing hundreds and hundreds of

million in revenue I don't know the

exact figure and with only one one

person in their supply chain team and a

comparable company would have had seven

or eight people we know because we meet

comparable companies with similar

revenue they would have had seven or

eight people there it's not like this

company didn't hire faster they've we

didn't displace these jobs these people

are working in other parts of their

company but they're not doing bs they're

creating value finding customers or

making a product better and so there's a

bit of an AWS analogy there where in the

old days you had to run your

infrastructure you had to run your own

servers DevOps and all this stuff and

now it's like I just don't worry about

that part there's lots and lots of

metrics on transit time is another one

so when Freight flies on our own 747

there we go two days a week from Hong

Kong to LAX and one day week Hong Kong

to Chicago when when it's on our plane

we do it in two point two days

door-to-door and if it goes through

someone else's plane and someone else's

warehouse and all the confusion in that

process it takes five days doesn't seem

like much but let's say you're a giant

phone maker and you your phones are

worth what does this thing what did I

pay for this thing I like $1500 and so

if a 747 hold a couple of hundred

thousand phones so think about three

days worth of 100,000 phones times

$1,000

a lot of money sitting there and it's so

it's real money and if you can speed up

a supply chain you can you sell those

products faster and put cash back on

their balance sheet so it's another way

to measure the impact that you can have

it's just like giving them back money

and people love you when you do that

when you're keeping time for me so I

don't than to part I'm very happy to say

it talk but make sure get cool over here

yes what what sort of legal barriers did

I did we encounter and how did I

overcome them lots we are licensed by

the Department of Homeland Security

Customs and Border Protection

specifically so the first one was

getting that license that took two and a

half years including an FBI background

check which I passed we we've we've got

a license by the Federal Maritime

Commission to sell ocean freight can't

sell ocean freight without a license

we've got were licensed by IATA for

selling air freight a now licensed by

the Chinese Ministry of calm or get the

name of it but licenses all over the

place that are required to do this

business heavily regulated for good

reason because this is on some level

where the front lines against all kinds

of stuff drugs terrorism counterfeit

goods like you you have a an obligation

to report things to the government and

they want to make sure that there's no

bad actors in this in this very

sensitive part of the world economy and

we're not like you know there are other

startups that are I call them test cases

like uber and airbnb and these startups

that there's sort of operating in this

gray area of the law to test case should

you be allowed to sell the backseat of

your car to somebody else and I believe

you should but the law is not on it is

that it's a little ambiguity there in

the law that's not us if like sport are

the law is very clear about what you can

and can't do sometimes hard to

understand but it's not black it's not

gray it's black and white and you have

to learn it

and so we've we have to take compliance

super services probably our biggest risk

as a company and we in our industry the

tech industry doesn't have a great

reputation on compliant

so that's something that we have to

overcome okay I'm gonna do just one more

question how about you right there yeah

I didn't sign up and then nothing ever

happened which is okay you know um we're

in business

so I went to business school I have an

MBA and I remember in a marketing class

in business school the professor was

asking how would you know how do you

know how to price your product and and

and everybody they had all these

complicated matrices and survey

methodologies and you could do different

you know algorithms to test what someone

I was like what if you just listed it

for sale at a different at two different

price points and then see which one

sells more or see which one generates

more revenue or what if you listed a

fake product and see if they would buy

it before it exists and it was literally

laughed out of the room as though it was

a joke like this was like they laughed

at me they said this is the dumbest idea

ever to list a fake product to find out

what price you should sell it at and

then turned out that's what we did and

it and it works so there's you know the

Internet's a beautiful thing because it

there's no cost to creating a page if

you were to do that in a retail store

you couldn't how would you do it you'd

have to have the prototype but Photoshop

is a beautiful beautiful piece of

software okay with that thank you very

much safer

[Applause]