Understanding neurodiversity and supporting consumers in a technologically advancing world
Summary
TLDRIn this informative webcast, Charlene, Head of People at the Chartered Banker Institute, hosts Andrew Whitehouse, a neurodiversity specialist, to discuss the challenges and strategies for supporting neurodiverse individuals in a technologically advancing world. Andrew, who has personal experience as a parent of neurodivergent children and having severe ADHD himself, emphasizes the importance of clear, explicit communication, visual aids, and understanding sensory sensitivities. He shares insights on how banks can better serve neurodiverse customers through tailored digital experiences and staff training, highlighting the need for empathy and practical adjustments to create an inclusive environment.
Takeaways
- 🌟 Neurodiversity is a significant aspect of human diversity, with approximately 15-20% of the world's population living with a neurodiverse condition like Autism or ADHD.
- 💻 The digital divide impacts up to 20% of consumers who struggle with existing online banking solutions, highlighting the need for inclusive digital services.
- 🏦 Financial institutions are increasingly being chosen based on the quality of their digital banking experience, emphasizing the importance of accessible technology.
- 🗣️ Clear and explicit communication is crucial for neurodivergent individuals, who often prefer visual communication and struggle with implicit or overly complex instructions.
- 👥 Recognizing and accommodating single attention span in neurodivergent individuals can lead to better interactions and service in customer-facing roles.
- 🔍 Banks and other businesses should consider sensory factors in their environments, as certain sounds, colors, and smells can be distracting or uncomfortable for neurodivergent customers.
- 🛠️ Routine and predictability are important for neurodivergent individuals, and changes to routines can cause significant stress and anxiety.
- 🤝 Employers and service providers can benefit from creating 'go-to' person systems to provide consistent points of contact for neurodivergent individuals.
- 🤖 The use of AI and chatbots in banking needs improvement to ensure they can provide clear, helpful responses and not exacerbate anxiety or confusion.
- 🌐 Online banking platforms should be tested for ease of use and clarity, especially from the perspective of neurodivergent users who may have unique challenges with digital interfaces.
- 📚 Continuous learning and adaptation are key for organizations to better serve neurodivergent customers, including staying updated on appropriate terminology and understanding the community's needs.
Q & A
What is the estimated percentage of the world's population living with a neurodiverse condition according to the National Library of Medicine?
-Approximately 15 to 20% of the world's population lives with some form of a neurodiverse condition.
What challenges do individuals with neurodiverse conditions face in the context of online banking solutions?
-Up to 20% of consumers have been unable to fully use existing online banking solutions due to digital limitations, which can leave some members feeling forgotten and marginalized.
Who is Andrew Whitehouse and what is his expertise?
-Andrew Whitehouse is a neurological diversity specialist who has spoken at TEDx events and published books on neurodiversity. He provides interventions for professionals, parents, and young people with Autism, ADHD, dyslexia, and other related conditions.
What is the Extreme Male Brain theory and how is it relevant to neurodiverse individuals?
-The Extreme Male Brain theory, developed by Professor Simon Baron Cohen, suggests that autistic and ADHD individuals have 'male brains,' which are systematic and excel in explicit communication, preferring visual communication and single attention focus.
Why is explicit communication important when interacting with neurodiverse individuals?
-Explicit communication is important because neurodiverse individuals, such as those with autism or ADHD, need to be told exactly what is wanted or needed without implicitness. They often prefer visual communication and have difficulty with divided attention.
How can financial institutions improve their support for neurodiverse customers?
-Financial institutions can improve support by offering clear, explicit communication, avoiding unnecessary small talk, and providing visual aids and instructions. They should also be mindful of sensory issues and strive to create a calm environment.
What impact can anxiety have on neurodiverse individuals when interacting with banking services?
-Anxiety can lead to perceived aggression or rudeness in neurodiverse individuals. It is important for banking staff to recognize and address anxiety, possibly by providing a calming environment or a go-to person for support.
Why is routine important for autistic individuals and how can changes in routine affect them?
-Routine is important for autistic individuals because they have an insistence on sameness and inflexible thinking. Changes in routine can cause depression, anxiety, and uncertainty, making it difficult for them to adapt.
What are some strategies that can be implemented in a bank to support neurodiverse customers?
-Strategies include providing clear visual labeling, breaking down tasks into smaller sessions, having go-to staff members who are adept at handling diverse needs, and ensuring the environment is calm and free from distractions.
How can banks improve their digital assistants to better serve neurodiverse customers?
-Banks can improve their digital assistants by ensuring they provide clear, focused, and direct responses to customer inquiries. The AI should be able to understand and respond appropriately to specific questions without generalizing or providing irrelevant information.
What is the significance of sensory considerations in a banking environment for neurodiverse individuals?
-Sensory considerations are significant because neurodiverse individuals, especially those with autism, can be highly sensitive to background sounds, colors, and smells. A calm and sensory-friendly environment can greatly improve their experience.
Can you provide an example of how a bank has successfully implemented strategies to support neurodiverse consumers?
-One example is a chain of coffee shops that implemented clear visual labeling without using written words, which improved productivity. Another example is a company that provided driving tests, breaking down the test into smaller sessions to accommodate ADHD individuals.
How can individuals without neurodiverse experiences become better allies and advocates for neurodiversity?
-Individuals can become better allies by reading the signs and adjusting their behavior accordingly. They should respect the preferences and communication styles of neurodiverse individuals and seek to understand their needs.
What is the correct terminology when referring to individuals with neurodiverse conditions?
-The correct terminology is to refer to individuals as 'neurodivergent' or 'autistic people' rather than 'people with autism'. It's important to avoid terms like 'sufferers' or 'symptoms' and instead focus on person-first language.
Outlines
🎤 Introduction to Neurodiversity Webcast
Charlene, head of people at the Chartered Banker Institute, introduces a webcast focused on understanding neurodiversity and supporting consumers in a technologically advancing world. The event is being recorded for later viewing on their website and YouTube channel. Charlene invites questions for guest speaker Andrew Whitehouse, a neurodiversity specialist who has spoken at TEDx and published books on the topic. Andrew's work includes interventions for professionals, parents, and young people with conditions like Autism, ADHD, dyslexia, and more. He emphasizes his practical experience over academic research and mentions his personal connection to neurodiversity as a parent and someone with severe ADHD.
🗣️ Communication Strategies for Neurodiversity
Andrew discusses the importance of explicit communication for neurodiverse individuals, referencing Professor Simon Baron Cohen's Extreme Male Brain Theory, which suggests that autistic and ADHD brains function systematically. He explains that such individuals prefer clear, direct communication and visual cues rather than implicit or verbal communication. Andrew advises against engaging in small talk and emphasizes the need for concise instructions. He also touches on the challenges neurodiverse individuals face with single attention and the importance of avoiding unnecessary distractions during communication.
🏦 Supporting Anxious Customers in Banking
Andrew addresses the challenges faced by neurodiverse individuals when visiting banks, often due to anxiety stemming from issues such as missing money. He suggests that banks should have 'go-to' people who are adept at handling anxious customers, potentially by taking them aside and offering a calming environment to discuss their problems. Andrew also discusses the impact of perceived aggression or rudeness, which can be a result of anxiety, and the importance of recognizing and addressing the root cause of a customer's distress.
🧩 Routine and Social Challenges for Neurodiverse Individuals
The discussion moves to the difficulties neurodiverse individuals face with social situations, rigid thinking, and changes in routine. Andrew highlights the importance of clear procedures and communication to help these individuals navigate banks and other services. He also talks about sensory differences, which can be exacerbated by background sounds or certain environments, and the need for calm, distraction-free spaces to support neurodiverse customers and staff.
🌈 Creating Autism-Friendly Environments
Andrew delves into the sensory sensitivities of autistic individuals, discussing the impact of colors, sounds, and smells in an environment. He advocates for the use of pastel colors and the reduction of distracting noises and strong scents. The conversation also covers the importance of understanding that neurodiverse individuals may struggle with social interactions and the need for patience and clear, direct communication in such situations.
🔊 ADHD and Its Impact on Customer Behavior
The presentation shifts focus to ADHD, with Andrew explaining the different types and the commonality of impulsivity among them. He uses personal anecdotes to illustrate the challenges ADHD individuals face in banks, such as difficulty waiting in queues or dealing with unexpected issues. Andrew emphasizes the importance of bank staff being able to recognize and respond appropriately to signs of anxiety or agitation in customers.
🤝 Adapting Communication for Positive Interactions
Andrew stresses the importance of adapting communication styles to better support neurodiverse individuals, both as customers and colleagues. He suggests using social media for updates and preparing for changes in routine, recognizing anxiety, and modifying communication approaches. Andrew also highlights the need to avoid blame and instead focus on understanding and accommodating the unique needs of neurodiverse individuals.
🛡️ The Importance of Responding Over Reacting
In this segment, Andrew discusses the difference between reacting and responding, particularly in customer service interactions. He shares his experience with a digital assistant named Sandy that failed to provide helpful responses to his banking inquiries. Andrew suggests that banks should focus on improving their online communication tools to better serve neurodiverse customers and ensure that they are genuinely responsive to individual needs.
🏆 Success Stories in Neurodiversity Support
Andrew shares examples of organizations that have successfully implemented strategies to support neurodiverse consumers. He mentions a coffee shop chain that improved productivity by introducing clear visual labeling and a company that provided driving tests in shorter sessions to accommodate ADHD individuals. These examples highlight the positive impact of understanding and accommodating neurodiversity in the workplace.
🤔 Becoming Allies for Neurodiversity
The conversation turns to how individuals without neurodiverse experiences can support neurodiversity. Andrew encourages people to read signs, observe behavior, and adjust their communication styles accordingly. He emphasizes the importance of treating everyone with respect and understanding, regardless of their neurodiversity status.
📚 Navigating Terminology in Neurodiversity Discussions
Andrew addresses concerns about using the correct terminology when discussing neurodiversity. He provides guidance on the appropriate language, such as using 'autistic people' instead of 'people with Autism' and avoiding terms like 'suffering from' or 'symptoms.' He also recommends the National Autistic Society's website for a list of acceptable and unacceptable terms.
Mindmap
Keywords
💡Neurodiversity
💡Online banking solutions
💡Digital self-service options
💡Neurological diversity specialist
💡Extreme male brain theory
💡Explicit communication
💡Autism
💡ADHD
💡Chatbots
💡Sensory differences
💡Social stories
Highlights
Approximately 15 to 20% of the world's population lives with a neurodiverse condition.
20% of consumers have been unable to fully use existing online banking solutions due to digital limitations.
Digital self-service options are increasingly important for choosing financial institution partners.
Andrew Whitehouse, a neurodiversity specialist, has experience with autism, ADHD, and other related conditions.
Neurodiverse individuals require explicit communication and prefer visual communication over verbal.
Single attention focus is a characteristic of neurodiverse individuals, making multitasking challenging.
Clear and concise communication is essential when interacting with neurodiverse individuals.
Avoid unnecessary pleasantries that can detract from the main message in communication.
Autistic and ADHD individuals often have difficulties with social situations and understanding social cues.
Anxiety can manifest as perceived aggression or rudeness in neurodiverse individuals.
Banks should have clear procedures and 'go-to' people to support anxious or struggling customers.
Neurodiverse individuals have an insistence on sameness and find changes in routines challenging.
Sensory differences, such as background noise or strong smells, can be distracting for neurodiverse individuals.
Explicit communication is crucial, telling people what to do rather than what not to do.
ADHD is characterized by inattention, impulsivity, and hyperactivity.
Strategies like social stories can help communicate changes in routine to neurodiverse individuals.
AI chatbots in banks need to be more focused and capable of understanding specific customer inquiries.
Individuals can become better allies by observing and responding to the needs of neurodiverse people.
Use of appropriate terminology is essential when discussing neurodiversity; refer to the National Autistic Society for guidance.
Transcripts
hello everyone and welcome to today's
webcast
um understanding neurodiversity and
supporting consumers in a
technologically advancing world my
name's Charlene and I'm head of um
people at the chartered Banker Institute
and I'm going to be your chair for
today's event so please note that we're
we're recording today's webcast and it
will be available to watch On Demand on
our website and our YouTube channel
afterwards if you've got any questions
at all throughout the session that you
would like to ask Andrew and please use
the Q a box on your screen
so I'll just start off with a bit of
background on our topic today
um according to the National Library of
Medicine approximately 15 to 20 of the
world's population lives with some form
of a neurodiverse condition
while the Work World continues to move
online it started up to 20 of consumers
have been unable to fully use existing
online banking Solutions
such digital limitations can leave some
members feeling forgotten and
marginalized and with the need for a
digital self-service options on the rise
many consumers are selecting financial
institution Partners based on the
digital banking experience that they
offer
so today we are pleased to welcome our
guest speaker Andrew Whitehouse
thank you for being with us today
Andrew's a neurological diversity
specialist he's he's taken to the tedx
stage and has published books on
neurodiversity he also provides
interventions for Professionals for
parents young people with Autism ADHD
dyslexia and other related conditions
so it's our pleasure to to welcome
Andrew and we look forward to hearing
your presentation today thank you very
very much Charlene hello everyone it's a
pleasure to be with you I'm just going
to bring up um my presentation it's it
looks a lot but um it's it's not in in
as much as
um
uh in as much as I I just need the
slides to remember where I am so um if
you want to be my friend I used to be
all over social media and now I only do
Instagram it's Andrew wsen so please do
feel free to join me on Instagram I'm
rubbish at it
um I do do a range of I provide a range
of services uh I am a specialist in
neurological disorders and ADHD autism
pathological demand avoidance syndrome
dyslexia dyspraxia dysch computer
um fetal alcohol Spectrum Disorder so I
really do look at a lot of things and I
work in schools colleges uh corporate
settings
the care sector so I really do get get
around a lot
um I'm very much a boots on the ground
person so from a qualification point of
view I should be
um I should be in a university somewhere
researching but that's not my way I'm
very very much a practitioner and
therefore a lot of the work that we're
looking at today is going to be based in
experience and practice and things that
I've seen and done so hopefully you'll
find that interesting not only am I a
specialist in this I'm also a parent of
neurodivergent children three of my
children are on the Spectrum and I'm
also diagnosed with severe ADHD myself
which is kind of interesting I'll have a
few words to say about that so I'm well
and truly immersed in the whole thing
so we've only got 40 minutes I've got I
could keep you here all day and night
but I'm not allowed to so we're really
going to crack in straight away uh what
I'm going to be talking about is
I'm going to be talking about
uh neurodiver good neurodiverse practice
with not just our customers but also the
people we work with so
um we're going to talk a lot about that
and then at the end we're going to do a
little bit just about
um chat Bots which should be fun so
let's look at communication
um there is quite an old Theory now but
I use it a lot called Extreme male brain
theory that was brought about in the
research of Professor Simon Baron Cohen
from the University of Cambridge who
incidentally is Sasha Bowen Cohen's
uncle and isn't funny
um but he's a specialist in autism and
he developed a theory called Extreme
male brain Theory that is to say that he
is saying there are two types of brain
this is not to do with gender or
sexuality at all in fact uh what what he
called male brain and what um
and female brain we now we now call
explicit and empathic brain but I'm
going to use the old terminology just
because it's easier to understand but
what Simon Baron Cohen has said is that
all autistic and ADHD people are male
brains so this is going to be really
important for what we're looking at
today so what those what that uh
systematic brain or what that autistic
ADHD net brain needs is explicit
communication they need to be told
exactly what what we need to be told
exactly what you want we don't do
implicit we prefer visual communication
we don't like to talk and listen and we
have single attention as opposed to
divided attention when we focus on one
thing so it's really important to know
that I mean straight away this has a
massive impact on
you know how we treat our colleagues how
we treat our clients you know how
um you know we don't want to talk about
the weather we you know if you can show
something to somebody rather than talk
about it that would be really helpful
and don't try and communicate when that
person is working on something if you've
got someone sitting there working on
something highly unlikely they will talk
back to you or process what you're
saying so we really have to sort of get
a system up and would you mind stopping
thank you but let me tell you about it
when we're communicating with people we
have to check the clarity and sense and
I'm going to talk a little bit about
this when we get to
to the AI side of things in the chat box
but certainly you know uh we we don't we
don't want that verbal communication
when you're emailing a colleague or if
you're talking to a customer you know I
try to avoid saying things like I like
your scarf or you know or when you're
emailing them how are the children or
things like that these unnecessary
Thrills are going to just detract and
when we apply that to the single
attention you can see you know
um
you can see that focusing on one thing
I'm focusing on going into the bank I
don't want to talk about how pretty my
scarf is or how shiny my shoes are or
what have you or you know how cute my
children are you know these are
unnecessary feels and we need to be
really really focused so when you've got
people coming into the bank you know you
probably won't know you probably won't
know that these that somebody's autistic
but you you know if you've been working
with someone a little while you you
probably will or you'll certainly find
out about communicating in different
ways and so we're looking for clarity
we're looking for clarity we're looking
for that
um
you know I like phrases like Malcolm can
you send me that document please well
Malcolm send me that document please we
don't have to be impolite and we
certainly don't want to overuse words do
you remember what I said about visuals
being more powerful easier to process so
you know not using too many words there
is a saying in autism after 20 words you
just said I heard the first three or I
could sometimes hear a few words at the
beginning the rest became a blur so
short burst instructions you know at the
counter in the bank sign here please
try not to rephrase things if you
rephrase something then
what tends to happen is that your client
or your colleague is going to think that
you're asking them to do something else
so Mal can sit down Malcolm is not sat
down Malcolm put your bottle on the
chair as a separate instruction so again
using visuals uh pictures images
you know if you've got a day where you
have a timetable that's absolutely
brilliant
if you have you know even if you even if
something like in the canteen if you're
in the canteen uh you know a a draw
which says Cutlery and a picture of some
Cutlery is really really helpful because
that's the sort of thing and most
neurodivergent people will appreciate
you know those kinds of instructions but
then the communications coming back to
us
say what you see
um it's it's it is I'm very much an
Autism Advocate on this and I am very
much
the person that really feels that you
know when you're working in my field
with autistic people with ADHD people
that you teach them things like you know
what is not appropriate to say and to
people but not every not everybody
shares that opinion with me and you know
um
you may find yourself in a situation
where a customer comes in and says
something inappropriate
you have to stop and think about that
and stop and think and say
is this something is this something that
I need to deal with or is this just a
person communicating in the way that
they communicate best and it's very much
a case of picking your balance because
it's highly unlikely to be personal and
so you know it really is uh something
something to um
to consider now when you go into a bank
I thought about this a lot when you go
into a Banks particularly in the 21st
century 2023
um
we usually go into the bank because
there's something wrong
now I've used chat Bots a couple of days
ago I had a little Clovis and chatbots
and they didn't really solve my problems
you know it can often be easy to get
through to banks on the telephone so
sometimes you need to just go in and
talk about it but as I say it's usually
when something's wrong so you know the
first first thing that you're going to
get is anxiety
and from anxiety can come of the
perceived aggression or perceived
rudeness you know and so
um you know I have had a situation which
I may touch on a little bit later in a
bank where mind your divergency caused
me extreme problems in a bank very
extreme problems
and
um you know and where I was perceived as
lunar aggressive but actually it is
anxiety
now at the bank end you know we we need
to be focusing on how how do we support
people who come in who are anxious how
do we support people have we got go-to
people
have you got a person that is absolutely
brilliant with people have you got that
person if somebody comes in shouting or
you know if somebody comes in in that
way have you got the person that's
capable to take them one to side and
saying that let's make a cup of tea and
let's talk about this and I want to fix
this for you
um we see a lot of signs which I 100
agree with in all sort of manner places
our staff will not tolerate this that
the other and I completely agree with
that but we also have to remember that
anxiety can you know the root of the
problem is often anxiety
and so
um with autism we're looking at
communication difficulties social
emotional understanding rigid thinking
widget thinking is that everything needs
to be the same
and those sensory differences which I'm
gonna really run through with you today
social situations are often difficult
for an autistic person whereas everybody
else it seems knows how to do things so
we tend to have expectations now again
you're not likely to know that this is
an autistic person
um
coming through your door walking up to
you to talk to you and you're highly
unlikely to know that but what you are
likely to know is that they're
struggling
and when you find that person struggling
don't try and enforce an issue try just
step back okay this person just wants to
do their business and leave yeah that's
fine I mean sometimes we become
embarrassed and we feel like oh okay you
know uh I'll I'll make a little joke
well you know it's just not going to
help we really about getting down to
business which is kind of the opposite
to what we're sort of told in life about
communicating with people but we really
we really need to to do this to step
away
trying to understand how to behave can
be really difficult for autistic people
and so
you know try to make that in the bank
situation as Swift as possible possible
on the phone as Swift as possible how
are you this lovely day you know uh can
I just transfer this money to that I can
um yeah sure are you enjoying the
sunshine that that person's just made it
clear to you that they don't wanna they
don't want to have that conversation you
know and some will some won't
come to win loss and when Lawson's a um
autistic adult and
um he says other people are often my
biggest problem and I think when we come
to autism
other people can be it isn't it is it is
essentially a social condition and it is
a condition there's a saying you know uh
autistic people just don't want to be
your friend that's not 100 sure but it's
not it's not far off and finding these
social skills difficult
um
you know uh can be absolutely bewildered
and exhausting and then you've learned
something and then the context may
change so uh I've been into the bank
three times and I know how to operate in
this bank but in actual fact what I've
got a problem with now is I'm dealing
with a different person
or they painted the place
well they've changed the opening times
and what we've learned is then not
applicable to what we're having to do so
this can be very very difficult
I'm going to move on from that one
um
do you generalize do you over generalize
um so you know
um I I was looking on online at I looked
at one particular chain of Banks and I
tried to sort of you know uh get an idea
of where they were situated and you know
although we call the High Street bench
they're not always on the High Street
for example
straight away
you know that's a massive generalization
it's it's not going to work you know
have you got clear procedures in place
for people with clear responses looking
at the AI again I'm not convinced by the
bank that I looked at
autistic people have an insistence on
sameness and an inflexible appearance to
routines this is a problem as well
because
um well this can be a problem because
things really really do change we all
for many of the old adage of you know
the supermarkets always moving stuff
about but yeah you know
um again have we a facility that I need
to speak to Tim because Tim is the
banker I always work with can we do that
go-to people we talked about that that
would really seriously help his routines
wouldn't it
um uh this is uh
uh absolutely huge autism and routine is
absolutely huge and and you know it can
be the smallest thing
yeah can make things really really
difficult they may have planned in their
mind I'm going to about I'm going to
speak with Tim Tim's going to sort it
out because Tim always sorts it out for
me I've arrived at about no Tim's not
here today he's been moved to I've lost
about
and so um
you know this can be very difficult and
then we looked at systems and we said
well if we've got those systems yeah if
we've got those systems then we want to
make our neurodivergent indeed all of
our clients aware that those systems are
in place yes you can come in uh well
maybe you can't come here on Wednesday
and speak to Tim but Tim will be in on
Thursday or can you wait till next week
he's on a holiday
so this routine yeah uh honestly you
know it's such a big deal
depression anxiety uncertainty go along
with breaks in these routines and the
lack of go along with absolutely being
able to have these
um
seed the these are just moving past that
last one
um the these routines and then we have a
sensory situation
background sounds now I've worked in
venue in places where the background
sounds are the big deal you know outside
um outside your bank is there is there
road Works going on yeah when you are on
on the telephone telephone banking you
know again the bank I bank with
has telephone banking and you know we're
often given the disclaimer
um uh apologize if there's any noise in
the background uh I'm working from home
today which is fine you know home is a
difficult place to work from but you
know uh these sounds for an autistic
person can be massively distracting not
only massively distracting but
um
but it can be physically difficult for
an autistic person not only that when we
looked at it we talked about the
beginning which was single attention
only being able to concentrate on one
thing
then that one thing
yeah
might not be the thing you want to
concentrate on you might be wanting to
concentrate on the banking but actually
you're
distracted and focusing on the Busker
outside
I want to talk about colors
um autism friendly safe space we have
um we have banks that are color-coded
so
for example and I'm not picking on
anyone in particular I just happen to
sort of know this you know I would never
have my banking colors as red
because actually
um in autism you know we we have lots of
color coding systems for anxiety red is
always bad
and when we generalize in autism we will
see red things as as bad
you know so there are wristbands that
are red on one side green on the other
and the autistic people can flip them
over to red when they're anxious or in
crisis we have systems called zones of
Regulation where the red zone is the bad
Zone you know and and so colors you know
can be a massive massive big deal
um
so we want a calm space we want a really
calm space we want pastel colors I know
you can't do that but you know it's
important to know uh what your hot spots
are is it a calm environment just a room
smell do you smell
um if you you know I don't mean uh bo
but it might be I suppose but what I am
talking about is things like perfume and
aftershave and things like that again
can be very distracting you know so the
autistic friendly
um
lack of spout if you like you know can
also be very very distracting and this
is also with your colleagues it's also
with the people you work with and you
know are you distracting that person are
you making it difficult for them are you
making it
um hard to function in that environment
environment
you know and so therefore you know we
have other things to ask about those
sensory issues uh are you
know is your environment is it noisy
well it should be I mean I'm I'm you
know I actually my bedroom can you
believe who knew we were going to start
working for my bedrooms but I am and um
and and this should be running on silent
but when I start and I close my eyes and
I listen
I can hear the pet tortoise scraping
about his cage he's gonna want that in
there in a little while
I can hear traffic on the road I can
hear some uh
I think it's a television humming Etc
what can you hear can you do
a sensory audit and can any of those
noises be stopped
because you know are you disturbing your
clients are you disturbing each other
are you disturbing each other with
noises
um
so we're talking about that divided
attention it's very very difficult for
autistic people single attention one
thing which means inability to separate
the senses you know so um
you see somebody having trouble with the
cash machine
and they're focusing on the cash machine
kind of help you and ignore you
better to say excuse me
may I speak
stop them yeah and if they won't stop
let them carry on wait until there's a
suitable Gap and then speak can I help
you with this piece of equipment yeah
um we don't
um
we also when we talk about explicit
communication which was the first slide
we looked at
um explicit communication is basically
telling people what to do not what not
to do
now um
again I had a Wanderer now Lincoln
looking for this and I didn't find
anything this is brownie points for
every bank I found in Lincoln
you know there were no signs that said
don't do this don't do that don't do
this it was great yeah
um there were lots of signs that said
please take an envelope please use this
please you know please please help
yourself to a pen all this kind of stuff
there's loads and loads of that which
was great because actually in autism if
we say don't do something that means you
don't know what to do I'll give you an
example
uh this is my coffee cup
down there means I don't know
where's my coffee cup so tell me what to
do not want not to do
right moving on to my favorite which is
ADHD Attention Deficit Hyperactive
impulsive disorder I've added impulsive
and this is because there are three
kinds of ADHD there's the combined type
which is the type that I have in
attention hyperactivity impulsivity
and then there's add in attention
impulsivity and then there's hyperactive
impulsive
all three of these have the word
impulsive in them
but the word impulsive is not in
ADHD is it so uh actually we really need
to sort of put that in so I do put that
in to help you because it's impulsive
behaviors that cause difficulties no
hyperactivity High productivity is
something that happens to us
often when we are stressed whether we be
ADHD autistic whatever
hyperactivity is something when we are
stressed and we've already I personally
believe that when we go into a bank it's
usually because we have to if
something's happening so money is
missing from my account
okay so money's missing from my account
and
[Music]
um
and so I've gone into sort of that sort
it so I may be pacing I might be walking
up and down I may be struggling to queue
and my you know find it really really
difficult to wait my turn
combined with impulsivity
I might push in I might walk past
somebody you know not particularly
necessarily on purpose but we're just
with no idea
that there were other people there and
that I've got this massive issue going
on and I'm going to go straight to the
phone
um you know and it would be very very
easy for um you know for for this to be
um uh uh sort of escalated I suppose
would be the right word for it very easy
for this to be escalated you know again
this is a time when somebody's done this
if you don't know I think you're a
divergent or what you really just don't
have
step up and say can I help you can I
help you at this point that ADHD person
or anyone really
can get agitated and maybe you're
starting to get a little bit verbal and
again you you have to be the one to
bring it down yeah you have to be the
one to bring that situation down and
again it's the cup of tea in a Biscuit
so you listen to it so you know and
again that would happen in the workplace
as well in in the situation the setting
of the workplace
um yeah uh you know person gets home
from work that night checks the wages
have gone in they've not gone in they
may struggle to sleep on that they may
get agitated overnight they might hyper
fixate on that thing come until the next
day maybe be a bit shouty you know and
you'd be that person to say well sorry
you know whoever it may be let's talk
about it let's fix this for you because
these things are you know
um
these things are important
social media can be very helpful I've
got a few nuggets here you know uh
inform and prepare for any changes in
routine if you are having an unexpected
meeting on next Wednesday let them know
get in touch with people use your
Twitter use your Instagram these are the
places you know uh Branch Instagram gosh
I couldn't find one for my paint
but in actual fact
um
but the bank I'm currently using most is
a is a totally online bank but but
um you know
have that up there I would absolutely
have Twitter alerts or Instagram alerts
for my local bank just to find out
what's going on you know when people are
there whether they be staff whether they
be visitors to the bank consumers
customers what you know uh it you know
remain supportive even though these
emotions might be too much you know
learn to recognize anxiety presentations
building up yeah to you know if you see
someone starting to get anxious starting
to get agitated you know
um that's the time that's the time to to
intervene you know and if you you will I
guarantee you will all have colleague
customer who you know is going to be
perceived as difficult I'm saying
perceived they're not probably not
intending to be individual learn from
that and you know and modify modify the
way you communicate you know
um I don't Einstein gets accused of all
sorts of saying this that and the other
but I don't I don't know about this but
um
uh I don't know about this but he's
apparently said you know the definition
of insanity is doing the same thing over
and again and expecting different
results yeah look at that that difficult
client comes in go up to them and say Hi
how are you
can I help today okay before
that that they they they have you know
you know they they escalate
um so you know hugely important and
again for your staff you know if you've
got that person who really doesn't want
to speak to them don't speak to them
it's okay it's what they want
um we have the key to human behaviors
this is fascinating to me
uh this is autism and ADHD the first
four social emotional communication
rigidity of thought and sensory art
autism the second three are attentional
issues impulsivity hyperactivity and I
just want to take a couple of those and
just have a little play with them when
was the last time you didn't understand
the request from your line manager and
normally I would sort of talk to this
talk about this in in in in a sort of
communicative way work workshop but you
know uh people say oh yeah you know how
did you feel I felt stupid I felt like I
should know I felt I felt after you know
uh I felt felt unintelligent yeah well
if somebody communicates with you in a
way that you don't understand
you're not stupid and communicative or
that it's really you you should be able
to expect better communication
so you know thinking about that thinking
about that when you are someone's line
manager
yeah really think hard about how you how
you send that message how you
communicate verbally or in a written
form
um you know and if you know and if if if
if if that person doesn't understand
allow them time to ask you about it
remember your last last hyperact what
caused this absolutely anxiety we use
the example of the um
we used use the example of the money
missing family account or your wages not
being bad this will make you high
quality and it will most definitely
definitely make the ADHD person
hyperactive put them in a stressful
situation they will become hyperactive
autistic people may start to stem and
tap their fingers or fiddling with
things or or stuff like that so
um you know what what what what what
uh you know what we we talk we talked
about sort of anxiety but also you know
relationships there are people that will
come into your bank and we'll you know
find it easier to speak to a male or
female or any other gender
yeah and um
and and you know again
if we can accommodate that that's
you know that's hugely useful changes to
routines there's a
um there's a
there's a strategy called social stories
which I've worked on and adapted and I
talk about sometimes other people I know
this is and basically explaining things
like changes between themes is that
sometimes other people I will this is
um what's happening how it affects you
and other people what you need to do
about it and why and this is great
autism ADHD communication they may be in
because they have absolutely no interest
you know and therefore being disc
communicative it may be something's gone
at home or they just don't want to be
there and so we have to with triggers in
autism we call autism
um when when autistic people have what's
best described as an anxiety attack we
call it a meltdown well ADHD people have
meltdowns as well and with these
meltdowns
it could be something triggered two days
ago so you know it's probably best with
your customers certainly to
um
to to rather than try and concentrate
what's going on and what's caused this
because you probably won't work it out
uh it's probably best to just try to
make a situation as comfortable as
possible
with colleagues it's maybe better to
sort of have some kind of coaching
communication with that person to find
out what may be bothering them it's a
different scenario isn't it
excuse me Niles but I have news for you
Copernicus called and you are not the
center of the universe yeah absolutely
um you know it's not about you and we
really don't we we don't want to sort of
you know be pushing towards that sort of
blame culture we just have to deal with
this stuff so it's probably not about
you but hang on maybe it is about you
maybe you need to
um
maybe you need to alter your approach
maybe you need to alter your approach to
uh you know to certain to certain
colleagues or certain clients and
communicate in a way you know
um I've I've just been I've just
finished working with somebody
who I didn't understand a word they said
you know and this person was responsible
for directing uh clients my way and so I
would get these clients
um and but the brief to me was you know
unintelligible gibberish
well as far as I'm concerned other
people can communicate so it might be
you it might not be you
respond react respond to react we have a
lot of fun with this because I often ask
people what's the best thing to do in a
situation to react and respond and they
always say respond but actually you know
um that's not always the case is it
because actually you know sometimes you
need to react if someone's about to get
hurt or something like that but usually
in a customer facing industry we have to
respond rather than we need to think
about it we need to be mindful of the
situation within and we need to think
about how we're going to communicate
with that person yeah would you like to
sit down for five minutes can I take you
somewhere quiet you know that kind of
thing also though don't forget there may
be people that really don't want to go
somewhere quiet
they would feel threatened by a small
environment so it's very much would you
like what can I do how can I help you
right
so I got online
and um
I had a chat with Sandy
so I shamefully have to admit that a
bank account that I no longer use one of
my accounts uh turns out to be over jaw
and I've not been paying enough
attention to it and it's about five
pound overdrawn
so I thought well let's let's have a
chat with Sandy here
hello why is account zero eight nine
three
overdrawn nice simple question and I was
expecting an answer because your road
tax has come out or you know or this has
been paid or that's been paid the
response from Sandy was this
thinking about changing your account
take a look at our business current
accounts pages to see what we offer
I was really concerned by this because I
thought I'd put in a really clear
question I thought Sandy the digital
assistant would be looking at my account
whilst I spoke in order to try and help
me
so we moved on we took this further
yeah
um did I answer the question
well I didn't click on that one I
thought I've got further questions how
do I freeze the account zero eight nine
three so I don't want anything else
coming out of that account
where the answer came what would you
like to apply for current account
application same sort of thing really
but there's nothing in there that's
given that impression so
I took it further again I thought I'll
go into the local branch
what are the opening times of your
Lincoln branch
take a look at our Branch ATM locator on
this page you can book an appointment
check our opening hours and search for
your nearest
Branch so I clicked on the branch and
ATM locator
and it turns out that my local branch is
in the ocean
so
um
we talk about anxiety and we talk about
how this you know how these things
happen
and
you know
in general autistic people need
well to respond better to online things
where they don't have to communicate
but it's got to work hasn't it it's got
to be able to work now I'm not
particularly picking on this bank
because that just happens to be the bank
that I focused on I don't know I'd be
willing to guess quite a few of them are
like that it'd be good for you to take
those same questions wouldn't it and go
away and check check your own bank an
ADHD person like me
we tend not to like this online stuff we
like a conversation
and so if we're offering something like
this we need a telephone call we need
you know so we need to know this isn't
had a massive knock-on effect to the
communication and the telephone and and
the need to telephone somebody or indeed
to walk into a bank into a branch
so
we're going to be watching this again I
hope share it with your friends show you
show your pals have a look through
there's been a lot of stuff in there I
really have filled it up you know I was
fighting to get eight hours I got 40
minutes
um but you know have a little look at
this five things you're going to change
yeah don't try and do everything because
it'll overwork yourself but five things
you're gonna change based on what we've
talked about today and stay in touch
Andrew w s e n I would very very much
like to hear from you so I think we're
going to go into some q a now if that's
what you'd like
and uh let's let's um
see if we can get some questions uh
please
Andrew thank you so much for that
presentation it was so interesting thank
you our audience a lot to think about
and so feel free to to add some
questions to the to the chat box but
just in the meantime
um we have had one question and that is
regarding the AI that banks are able to
use to support those with a neurodiverse
condition and how can AI support those
who who need that additional support and
how limited Are banks to be able to do
this well you saw one you saw my example
and I genuinely genuinely was not trying
to catch it out I really I thought they
were very clear questions I thought of
course I don't work in banking but it
would be unacceptable to say to me
you're doing it wrong
because I genuinely you know I I was
playing the game I didn't go into the
branch I didn't phone anybody up I
engaged with the um with the technology
and I think I think I think the first
thing is is way way too General
in fact it wasn't even vaguely focused
on on the answers and there has to be
and I again there has to be a some kind
of system whereby these things are being
monitored
where someone steps in but I'm also
aware you know in those circumstances
the the technology was clearly not
capable of dealing with those
three simple questions and so uh but I'm
also aware that's defeating the object
it's completely defeating the object I
have a person monitoring the AI my only
my only thought is that you know to
totally restructure that so that it's
it's really genuinely reading what
what's being typed up uh you know it's
to me not fit the purpose from an Autism
point of view
um autistic as we said autistic people
struggle with generalization skills
they they but the you know uh I'd
sometimes do an activity where I show
three types of dog
you know and and say to people how do we
know when something's a dog
and nobody knows
but the autistic person can because
they'll say well they've all got dog
noses
you know uh and because they're looking
for that common denominator and within
there there were no common denominators
now I do also use a completely online
bank
and uh one of the more modern online
banks uh and I've never had uh an issue
to to use of online chat but it does
seem to work extremely well you know not
the online chat but the you know the way
the bank works so there's clearly
facility in there to be able to
meet those needs it's it's whether
whether I'm gonna say it's whether the
banks I was going to say engaging but
not engaging because I wouldn't be here
otherwise it's whether the banks are
aware of how difficult those things are
I I would say to every Bank every person
that works in banking go and ask them
some similar go on your own bank account
you know I mean and that was I mean it's
not a serious situation it's a that
particular bank account within uh is a
bank account I don't use anymore you
know but sometimes most of the time when
your bank is overdrawn that's a serious
serious thing
you know that one's a bit of a joke to
me but it can be a very serious thing
yeah and I think it leads on to the next
question that we've we've had Andrew
about can you share any success stories
or examples of organizations that have
successfully implemented strategies and
to support neurodiverse consumers
absolutely 100 yeah uh
multiple multiple situations I did some
work for a chain of coffee shops you
know and um
they uh one of the first things they
took on what one of the first first
things they worked out was a lot of
their staff
were um were dyslexic and therefore
um they they were finding they were
getting people who were very physically
drawn towards that kind of work yeah
along with dyslexia you often have
traits of ADHD as well but of course
there were issues with communication
so they put in uh um they put in a
system of really clear visual labeling
that didn't use written word
and you know I don't get statistics of
how that's improved
productivity but the feedback was this
is really improved productivity you know
we don't hear that
um I also worked
I I did some uh work for a company that
provided
driving tests taxi driving tests you
know and again uh the clientele there
was a lot of ADHD cleontel who were you
know like to be out and about driving a
car meeting 20 30 new people in a day
it's couldn't be more ADHD you know and
but the problem was getting them through
those tests and what they did is they
broke those tests
down into I think it was a two-hour test
into into six 20-minute sessions
throughout a day
to allow those people to regather their
concentration skills and to be able to
you know
to access that test uh on 11 a Level
Playing Field it's funny because I was
going to talk a little bit about the
equality act and how you know that's
that's a legal requirement but I think
in in the workplace
uh such as yours it's very much a matter
of if it were me I'd want to come in and
have a look I'd want to come in and see
and say well we could do this we could
do that we could do the other
um I think
yeah I think uh I was approached I have
worked in the last couple of years for
one of one after the High Street Banks
and and they very very much took on
board the advice that I gave at the time
and I think it's very much about working
with
neurodivergent professionals
okay
and another question we've had which I
found quite interesting how can
individuals without neurodiverse
experiences become better allies and
advocates for neurodiversity how can how
can they support more
use your eyes usually is unusual
initiative you know I mean I did a lot
of stuff there which I was talking about
you know that person looks like they
don't want to have a joke don't have a
joke with them you know of course what I
didn't say was if the adhdp people you
know I mean all stand-up comics I've got
ADHD that's that's a fact the ADHD
people want to chat with you chat back
you know uh if if if if they're not you
know if they don't want to communicate
yeah then
don't you know don't have that
communication it's not personal you know
we had that pitch didn't we it's not you
it is you yeah and of the two pictures
and I I think it's about reading the
sides it's about reading the signs and
you know what what's really fascinating
is that that last 40 minutes had nothing
to do with neurodiversity really it was
about Humanity because we all got our
funny ways you know that thing about
being anxious yeah we all get anxious
you know
um Mrs Whitehouse starts pacing about
and bothered and you know I'm the one
with ADHD she's not you know but when
some things she can't you know she has
to focus on on this thing and it might
cause it to be hyperactive read the
signs look at what's right in front of
you because you know uh if you
especially in a customer facing industry
such as yours and the same behind the
scenes to your colleagues absolutely
same behind you know someone comes in
Grumpy every morning not play the game
of let's see who can make him speak
you know let that person come in in that
way you know and and be be easy going
with it
yeah and that's interesting
I think um the next question
is is something that a lot of people
worry about and this this is I'll read
out the question here
um I'm worried that I may be using the
wrong terminology when talking with
colleagues about neurodiversity how do I
know what the right thing to say is I
don't want to offend anyone right let's
start with neurodiversity then shall we
so um I've used the word neurodiversity
incorrectly probably 50 times in this
last hour everybody every human being is
more diverse
the correct terminology straight away is
neurodivergence
okay
um we don't have people with Autism we
have autistic people okay now the
trouble with that is yeah
nobody sends you an email to say dear
Andrew as of Monday we're going to call
autistic people autistic people not
people with Autism anymore nobody will
send that out to you
um autistic people that don't speak when
I started working in the industry they
were called uh non-verbal
then it was chooses not to speak but now
it's pre-verbal and there were probably
ones in between that I missed uh we
don't have symptoms we don't have suffer
from I had a person yesterday who
claimed to be an ADHD out of advocate
talked about suffers from symptoms and
person with ADHD in one paragraph and
yeah and and it is difficult I did some
work for the British Academy of
audiology
and although I I'm a hearing aid user
and I
you know I have hearing loss I my first
question was to the president with the
baa that's all well and good Claire but
what do I call them
yeah what do I call the what what
people who can't hear like to be called
and she said hearing loss ask that
question what do you like to be referred
to but I've also got a little helpful
thing for you on the national autistic
Society
website there is a page of acceptable
and unacceptable terminology
well that's that's helpful yeah and it's
a really good it's there's a lot of it
there's a heck of a lot of it but it's
very very good
so yeah
thank you
um
so Andrew thank you so much for today
it's been such an interesting discussion
and really relevant as well we're so
grateful for for you taking the time to
to do this
if our audience who are watching would
like to watch any of us back at any time
or share it amongst colleagues of
friends
um that will be available on our website
and our YouTube channel very very
shortly after this and if you would like
Andrew's details for your own
organization or you'd just like to learn
more about any of this and we will
include Andrew's details in the email to
your afterwards
so thank you all again for joining today
and thank you once again to Andrew for
for your Insight and have a lovely rest
of day everyone
thank you thank you very much thank you
bye
5.0 / 5 (0 votes)