#73: Why we can’t stop following the herd
Summary
TLDRThis podcast episode explores the power of group dynamics and how they influence our behavior and decisions. Host Phil Agnew discusses the story of a plane crash caused by panic due to a loose crocodile, highlighting the instinct to follow others in groups. The conversation with Laura Osborne and Alex Chesterfield delves into polarization, identity fusion, and the impact of group memberships on various aspects of life, including politics, hiring, and social interactions. The episode also touches on the fluidity of group identity and the implications for marketing, emphasizing the importance of targeting specific groups for effective positioning.
Takeaways
- 📌 The script narrates a tragic plane crash in Africa, where the sole survivor revealed that panic caused by a loose crocodile led to the disaster, illustrating the powerful influence of group behavior.
- 🔍 The episode 'Poles Apart' discusses the science behind why people turn against each other and how group memberships can deeply affect our attitudes and actions.
- 🌐 The podcast features a conversation with Laura Osborne and Alex Chesterfield, who explore the dynamics of group polarization and its effects on various aspects of life, including personal relationships and professional decisions.
- 📉 The discussion highlights that polarization is not just about political divisions but also extends to social and personal life, influencing who we hire, marry, and befriend.
- 💡 The power of groups is rooted in our ancient capacity to form groups for survival benefits, which has evolved into a psychological need for belonging and identity.
- 🧠 The brain reacts to social exclusion similarly to physical pain, indicating the deep-seated need to belong to a group and avoid the discomfort of being left out.
- 👥 Group identity can be fluid and change based on context, as demonstrated by studies showing how quickly allegiances and behaviors can shift in different situations.
- 🤔 The script challenges the idea of sitting on the fence, suggesting that ambiguity in group allegiance can be met with hostility, as seen in historical and social experiments.
- 🛑 The example of the French Revolution seats illustrates how quickly group identities can form and how they can influence behavior and reactions to others.
- 💼 The episode connects group dynamics to marketing, emphasizing the importance of targeting specific groups rather than trying to appeal to everyone, as people feel strong allegiances to their groups.
- 🚀 The story of Bank of America's growth from a small bank for Sicilian immigrants to a nationwide brand demonstrates the power of starting with a well-defined group and expanding based on success.
Q & A
What was the cause of the plane crash in Africa in 2010?
-The plane crash was caused by a sudden panic among passengers when a young crocodile, which had escaped its cage, caused chaos on board. Passengers and crew moved to the front of the plane, throwing off its weight balance and leading to the crash.
What is the concept of 'identity fusion' as mentioned in the script?
-Identity fusion is a strong, visceral sense of oneness with a group. It is an extreme form of group loyalty where individuals may prioritize the group's interests over their own self-preservation.
How does group identity influence our behavior and decision-making?
-Group identity can significantly influence our behavior and decisions by making us feel a strong allegiance to the group, which can lead to favoring the group's views, outlooks, and even altering our actions based on the group's norms and expectations.
What is the impact of polarization on various aspects of our lives?
-Polarization affects not just political views but also spills over into other areas of our lives, including who we hire, who we marry, and the friends we have. It can lead to division and a lack of willingness to engage with those who hold opposing views.
How does being part of a group influence our feelings and actions?
-Being part of a group can make us feel good by providing a sense of belonging and community, which in turn can influence our actions to align with the group's norms and behaviors.
What is the psychological effect of being excluded from a group?
-Being excluded from a group can cause psychological pain, akin to physical pain. Studies have shown that the brain activity in response to social exclusion is similar to that experienced during physical pain.
How does the study involving Manchester United fans illustrate the 'us versus them' mentality?
-The study showed that Manchester United fans were significantly more likely to help an injured person wearing a Manchester United shirt compared to a Liverpool shirt, demonstrating a clear bias towards in-group members.
What is the significance of the term 'FOMO' in the context of group identity?
-FOMO, or 'Fear of Missing Out', is significant in the context of group identity as it represents the pain of being left out or excluded from a group, which can drive individuals to conform to group norms to avoid this discomfort.
How can the fluidity of group identity impact our behavior in different contexts?
-The fluidity of group identity means that our allegiance to a group can change based on the context or situation we are in, which in turn can lead to different behaviors in different settings.
Can you provide an example from the script that demonstrates how quickly group allegiances can change?
-The script mentions an example of a study where participants' attitudes towards a person named Jane changed based on whether they were told she would join their team or a rival team, showing how quickly group allegiances can influence opinions.
What marketing insights can be drawn from the understanding of group identity and polarization?
-Understanding group identity and polarization can inform marketing strategies by highlighting the importance of targeting specific groups with well-defined needs and preferences. It also suggests that creating a strong brand identity can help capture the interest and loyalty of a particular group.
Outlines
📡 The Mysterious Plane Crash and the Power of Human Instinct
In 2010, a plane crash in Africa that killed all but one passenger remains unexplained until the survivor's account. The crash occurred without mechanical failure or pilot error. Instead, panic ensued when a young crocodile escaped its cage onboard, causing passengers to move to the front of the plane, upsetting its balance and leading to the crash. This incident underscores the powerful influence of group behavior and human instinct, which can lead to unintended consequences. The episode introduces the topic of group dynamics with Phil Agnew, host of the 'Nudge: The Science of Marketing' podcast, discussing the power of groups with Laura Osborne and Alex Chesterfield, authors of 'Poles Apart', who explore polarization and group behavior.
🔍 Polarization and the Consequences of Group Identity
The discussion delves into the concept of polarization, noting that while it fluctuates over time, its manifestations have expanded into various aspects of life, including employment, marriage, and social circles. The authors of 'Poles Apart' highlight the impact of group memberships and partisan labels on individual feelings and behaviors. They cite a statistic showing increased disapproval among parents if their child marries someone from an opposing political party, illustrating the growing divide. The conversation emphasizes the importance of understanding the effects of group identity on personal biases and decision-making.
🧠 The Psychological Benefits and Drawbacks of Group Belonging
The script explores the deep-seated human capacity to form groups, which provides both physical and psychological benefits, such as self-esteem and a sense of belonging. It discusses the phenomenon of identity fusion, where group loyalty can supersede self-preservation, as illustrated by a World War II bomber crew's tragic decision. The authors emphasize that group identity can influence life and death decisions, as well as everyday choices, from vaccination to hiring practices, and even attractiveness based on political alignment.
🤕 The Pain of Exclusion and Its Impact on Brain Activity
Studies reveal that exclusion from a group can trigger physical pain, as brain activity in areas associated with physical pain increases when individuals feel left out. This neural response underscores the deep human need to belong and the discomfort of not being part of a group. The script highlights the automatic and often unconscious nature of categorizing people into groups and the tendency to favor in-group members over out-group members.
🏅 The Dichotomy of Group Loyalty: Manchester United Fans and Helping Behavior
A study involving Manchester United fans demonstrates how group identity can influence behavior, showing that fans were more likely to help an injured person wearing a Manchester United shirt than a rival team's shirt. This study, along with others, indicates that group allegiance can significantly affect how we treat others, with in-group members receiving more assistance and empathy than out-group members.
🎭 The Fluidity of Group Identity and Its Impact on Behavior
The script discusses the fluid nature of group identity, which can change based on context and situation. It uses examples of political canvassing and the shifting allegiances of a couple to illustrate how quickly group identity can change and influence behavior. The discussion also touches on the historical origins of political 'left' and 'right' groupings and the hostility faced by those who refuse to take a side.
🏦 The Evolution of Group Targeting: From Sicilian Fishermen to Bank of America
The episode concludes with a discussion on the application of group dynamics in marketing. It uses the story of Amadeo Giannini, who founded the Bank of Italy and later Bank of America, to illustrate the power of targeting a specific group and then expanding the offering as the brand grows. The narrative highlights the importance of positioning and how creating products for well-defined groups can lead to success, as seen in the examples of Costa Coffee and the Bank of America's initial targeting of Sicilian immigrants.
Mindmap
Keywords
💡Polarization
💡Group Identity
💡Behavioral Science
💡Cognitive Bias
💡Social Influence
💡Identity Fusion
💡Out-group
💡In-group Bias
💡Exclusion
💡Marketing Positioning
💡Group Allegiance
Highlights
The 2010 plane crash in Africa was caused by passengers panicking due to a loose crocodile on the plane, demonstrating the powerful influence of group behavior.
The power of groups was explored with guests Laura Osborne and Alex Chesterfield, who discussed the science behind why people conform to group norms.
Polarization today extends beyond politics into various aspects of life, including who we hire and marry, indicating its pervasive impact on society.
An increase in parental concern about their children marrying someone from a different political background reflects growing societal divisions.
Our ancient capacity to form groups has psychological benefits, such as self-esteem and a sense of belonging, which are crucial for our well-being.
Identity fusion, a strong sense of oneness with a group, can lead to extreme behaviors, including sacrificing self-preservation for group loyalty.
Group identity can influence various decisions, from medical treatment to hiring practices, highlighting its broad implications.
Studies show that political stances can alter perceptions and decisions in non-political contexts, such as child vaccination and job candidate evaluation.
The pain of being excluded from a group can be physically felt, with brain activity in areas associated with physical pain observed during social exclusion.
Group identity can change quickly based on context, as demonstrated by the behavior of football fans towards an injured person wearing different team colors.
Allegiance to a group can make individuals less flexible in thought, as shown by the correlation between party allegiance and inflexibility of thought.
Group identity is fluid and can shift based on the most salient identity in a given context, affecting behavior and attitudes.
The historical example of the French Revolution illustrates the origins of political tribalism and the hostility faced by those who do not conform to group allegiances.
Positioning is crucial in marketing; products targeted at specific groups are more likely to succeed than those trying to appeal to everyone.
Case studies of Costa Coffee and Bank of America demonstrate the success of targeted marketing strategies based on group identity and needs.
The evolution of Bank of America and Visa shows how successful brands can expand from serving a specific group to a broader audience while maintaining their appeal.
Transcripts
in 2010 a plane crashed in africa
flying from kinshesher the capital of
the democratic republic of congo to
bandundu a town in the east
as the plane came into land it crashed
killing all but one on board
no one could figure out what caused the
crash onlookers said they saw the plane
drop out of the sky without reason the
engine didn't seem to halt the weather
was perfect
both of the pilots were fully qualified
to fly
there wasn't an obvious reason why the
plane crashed the crash investigators
were at a dead end
they couldn't figure out the cause
that was until they interviewed the one
survivor
see the survivor was able to explain the
whole incident there wasn't a mechanical
failure or a mistake from the pilot
no
instead it was human instinct
one kilometer away from landing a young
crocodile which was taken on board the
plane and stored on board the plane
got loose from its cage the steward upon
seeing the crocodile ran to the front of
the plane to tell the pilot
now imagine you're in the plane you see
a crocodile you see a steward running
from the front of the plane to the back
what are you gonna do
probably you're gonna panic
then imagine all 16 other passengers on
board start panicking as well some start
getting out of their seats a couple
start running to the front to get away
from the crocodile chances are you're
gonna follow their actions and according
to one survivor that's what everyone did
they saw the crocodile they saw the
steward running and saw everyone else
getting up and just like that everyone
on the plane got out of their seats and
moved to the front of the plane that
threw the weight off at a crucial point
as the engines were powering down it
tipped the plane forward and caused it
to crash and it's a deadly reminder of
the power of groups
see we follow the actions of others
whether that's looking into a shop
window
or when running away from danger hello
folks i'm phil agnew host of nudge the
science of marketing podcast in this
episode we'll explore the power of
groups and how we can't help but follow
the crowd to explore the topic i'm
joined by laura osborne a professional
communicator spokesperson and podcaster
with a background in public affairs and
government communication laura is
currently corporate affairs director at
london first joining laura is alex
chesterfield alex is a behavioural
scientist with a master's degree in
cognitive and decision science she
currently works in financial services
leading a team of behavioral scientists
to help get better outcomes for
employees and customers for four years
she was elected a councillor in guilford
for the conservative party alex laura
and their co-author alison goldsworthy
recently published their book polls
apart the book looks at the science
behind why people turn against each
other and proven tactics for bringing
folks together in today's episode we
look at how being part of a group
influences us why being left out hurts
and how we can't stop following others
but to kick off i ask the authors of
poles apart if we've become more
polarized over time well thanks very
much phil
it's it is a question we've spent a lot
of time thinking about polarization it
ebbs and flows over time so it's very
tricky to say obviously not having a
comparative data set for all history
that we are definitely more polarized
now than we've ever been before but what
we can definitely see from the research
that we've done is that the way our
polarization manifests
is a bit different today it spills out
into more areas of our lives which um
you know includes
who we hire who we marry you know and
increasingly the friends that we have so
it it does have these sort of um
these spillover effects that aren't
limited to the political world which is
often where we think about polarization
and i think one of the things that you
know we've been quite pains to say is
it's not just how divided we are on
individual issues it's that effective
side of polarization which is how do our
group memberships and the partisan
labels we attach just make us feel you
know and how do we then behave
as a result so there's a slightly
terrifying stat actually it says if you
go back somewhere like 30 years only
five percent of americans cared whether
their child married someone of a
difficult different political persuasion
but today nearly half of republicans and
about a third of democrats say they'd be
displeased if their child married a
member of the opposing party and so you
know when you see those sorts of
consequences and you know the way that
we divide over all kinds of um big and
small things along those group lines
that the alarm bells that ring for us
are you know what does this mean in
business what does this mean except for
who we're hired how aware we are of our
biases and you know those consequences
really are quite significant
polarization does seem to be getting
worse today half of all republicans
would be displeased if their child
married a democrat
thirty years ago only five percent would
have been displeased
it's also clear that the groups we
identify with change our own views
whether that's your view on a job
candidate or your views on your
daughter's boyfriend but why do groups
change the way we think and why do we
regularly form into groups i think the
first thing the first point that we
should start off with and remind
listeners is that we we do have this
ancient capacity to form groups
and although polarization often sounds
very negative negative i think it's
roots at least psychologically you've
got to remember that being part of a
group and obviously the earliest groups
often are families brings many um
physical benefits so getting food
finding a partner and building things so
many many physical benefits but also
psychological benefits so feeling like
we belong to a group or to a community
makes us feel really good
individually it gives us a lot of
self-esteem and it generally feels nice
so we have this that's the first point
to remember is that we have this ancient
capacitance to form groups so in many
ways our brains have evolved to think
as part of small groups so we want to
fit in um and we want to fill up we
belong and as i said earlier this feels
really good so we talk about in the book
um i'm sure many listeners will remember
uh the film clueless i know laura and i
are big fans growing up in the 90s we're
going to give away our age now but think
about tai
and how she she changed um quite
considerably to fit in with the group
and i think one of the key things that
we found was that once we're part of the
group we don't just take on its views
and outlook we become emotionally tied
to it
and we came across one one group and one
example sorry of where loyalty to the
group may
even overtake our our very human desires
for uh to live
kind of self self preservation so
this example was in sebastian junga's
war um an example he described where
four members of a b-17
bomber crew
formed a pact that they would never ever
abandon one another and no matter how
awful the situation was and how bad
things got in battle anyway not long
afterwards making this pact their their
plane was shelled um and went into a
kind of free fall
um so the pilot ordered immediately
everyone to parachute to safety
but as the the crew you know were
putting on their parachutes getting
everything you know ready to drop out
the plane they discovered that one of
their team
um
it's one of the people that made the
pact was trapped and there wasn't any
time to release him given the plane was
hurtling out of the sky
so remembering this these three members
of the pact
they all aborted their plans to
parachute to safety and they remained on
the plane and they all all died
and what academics describe what
happened here because you might be
sitting there you know cold i guess cold
listens like you're thinking why would
anyone ever do that and academics have
described this phenomena is almost this
very strong like visceral sense of
oneness with a group for something
called identity fusion and this is
obviously quite an extreme example the
one that sebastian describes from world
war ii but you see it also in like
violent gangs terrorist groups and even
even for example groups of traders where
they're artificially distorting
stock prices and what all those groups
have in common is where group membership
is not so much a means to an end so for
example to feel good but group
membership is the end in itself but the
power of groups doesn't just affect us
in life and death decisions like the b17
bomber example in fact the effects of
groupishness as laura and alex call the
bias in the book tends to impact people
in all sorts of ways
laura and alex cite studies that have
identified that our political stance can
change our decisions on all sorts of
topics
for example you are more likely to
vaccinate your child
if the presidential candidate you voted
for is elected
if you're a doctor the course of
treatment you recommend to a patient can
be influenced by your own politics and
perception of the patient's likely
political leanings if you're a manager
the same consideration will shape your
hiring decisions we're also more likely
to listen to those with the same
political views we pick media platforms
based on whether they align with our
political views and we're even more
likely to find people who support the
same political party as us
more attractive than the average person
now there are plenty of reasons why we
form groups laura and alex detail that
in the book but ultimately it is to
satisfy a deep need to belong this need
is amplified by the pain we feel when
we're not in a group
being left out isn't nice fomo is
painful but not just in a metaphorical
sense no missing out can physically hurt
at least according to some studies
you can see again the same effect when
researchers look at our brain activity
this was this was one study i wanted to
highlight was done by a bunch of
researchers at the university of
california in la
and they use something called a
functional magnetic resource imaging
scanners an fmri scanner which looks at
measures brain activity to track neural
responses to exclusions so when people
are excluded or shut out from a group
what happens
and what they found was that when people
are shy out of a group um the brain they
saw heightened brain activity in two
specific areas of the brain that are
normally associated with the experience
of physical pain
so how they interpreted this finding was
that it literally hurts
not
not to belong so you can see in many
ways it makes it makes perfect sense
that we um that we the way that we
change the way we think
um because of the groups that we
identify with
we change the way we think because of
the groups we identify with
not being part of groups can cause us to
feel pain akin to real physical pain
but does being part of our group
actually explain our actions not just
the way we think but our actual actions
does it change the way we behave
here's a fascinating study that looked
into just that one of the things i think
we were surprised at when researching
the book was just how differently we
treat each other not always not always
fully consciously when they're not part
of our group
and also the automaticity that makes
sense as in the fastness or how we
automatically categorize people into
groups and i think one of the
one of the the key insights from decades
of social science research is that once
an us and them distinction has been made
we will always favor us and by the same
token disfavor then i think one of the
the best studies that illustrates this
is
a study done on football fans by
professor mark levine and his colleagues
who were then at the time of doing the
study at lancaster university
so they they recruited a bunch of
manchester united fans and they invited
the fans to complete
two questionnaires um and the aim of the
of the surveys was to try and um
increase their sense of allegiance that
they felt to the team obviously the the
participants didn't know that was the
purpose of the survey so they were asked
questions like why did they support
manchester united how long have they
supported manchester united four et
cetera anyway so once they filled in the
survey the football fan manchester
united fans were then asked to walk to
another building to watch a short film
on football
and as they left
you know building one they happened to
see a jogger
slip and fall down you know yelling
crying grabbing his ankle etc and
shouting out in pain and this is where
again unbeknown to the football fans the
participants the experiment actually
started
so in some conditions or in some uh
let's just say in some instances the
jogger who was
a kind of confederate so what that means
he was he was in on the experiment he
was working for the professors
in some instances that that fake
jogger the fake jogger wore a manchester
united shirt
and in doing so signaled himself as a
member of the manchester united in group
you know one of one of us
but sometimes in other conditions that
jogger the fake jogger would be wearing
a liverpool shirt so again mocking
himself as an out group member so one of
them
and sometimes in the third condition
the fake jogger appeared in a plane
unbranded in a sports shirt
now the football fans uh the
participants were you know that had been
very prime to the questionnaires they
had to feel so that identity was very
salient very top of mind as they walk
from one building to the other
and the key question that professor
levine was trying to answer was what
proportion of times would
the fans stop and help a fellow human uh
on the floor after tripping up with the
shirt that they were wearing make any
difference well to put it bluntly is to
say the results were unequivocal so when
when the person
was wearing a manchester united shirt
92 percent of participants stopped to
help them but when it was a liverpool
fan and again for any any people who
want me to football that is a rival team
only about 30 stepped in so that's a
huge a huge uh difference between the 90
when they were wearing a manchester
united fan now i'm just going to pause
here to reiterate that stat
92 of fans stopped when the injured
jogger was part of their group and yet
only 30
stopped when the jogger was part of a
rival group
it seems we simply become nastier and
less helpful with those who aren't part
of our group
and before you go and blame that all on
manchester united fans for being
unhelpful and rude consider this other
study cited in polls apart now in this
study over 700 u.s citizens were
questioned about their political views
the task asks participants to indicate
their relative feeling of attachment to
republicans and democrats by clicking
and dragging images of themselves and
the two parties closer together or
further apart now the results showed a
clear correlation between inflexibility
of thought and intensity of party
allegiance in other words participants
on both the extreme left and the extreme
right well they both displayed this
reduced flexibility of thought it
doesn't matter if you're liberal or
conservative if you show a stronger
allegiance to your group you'll have
less flexibility in your thoughts
so it is obviously unlikely that only
man united fans would fail to help
joggers it realistically will be anyone
who has a strong group identity who
comes across someone from outside that
group
but how rigid is group identity can we
only belong to one group at a single
time
laura and alex don't think so they are
fairly certain that our group identity
is far more fluid than we think so
that's one of the main i guess main
points is that our identity about how we
think about who we are is very flexible
whatever identity is most salient and by
that i mean you know most top of mind
depends on the context of the situation
that we are in at any one moment
and so we describe actually in the book
it's just like there's an example of a
couple
sitting in the kitchen
and their kid is ill
and they are arguing about who has to
you know take time off work the next day
to look after their ill child
the father he's he's kind of saying to
the the women well you know mums are
more i meant to just be looking at men
to look up to their children more when
they're sick that's kind of what women
are here to do and then
when when that argument starts they are
referring to themselves as part of a
larger group i.e men and women and that
causes tension and conflict and
hostility between them naturally as it
would
and then we describe where they're
having the argument the kitchen table
then they get a knock at the door and
it's a political canvasser
and it's someone from an opposing party
and in that moment the context has
changed the situation has changed and
actually rather than being members of
opposing groups are you male and female
with all the kind of stereotypes and the
beliefs that are involved with thinking
about ourselves through that gender lens
is they then actually become one of the
same identity which is their political
kind of book whether they're labeled
conservative let's just say they're
their labor and they identify as part of
the same group and then they're united
and then the them you know the other is
the canvasser on the on the doorstep and
that hostility intention dissolves
between them and instead transfers
to the doorstep
[Music]
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[Music]
it's clear that our allegiances to
groups can change quickly even during
the time it takes to just have a
conversation
see it's the context we're in and the
groups we associate with in that context
that ultimately change our behavior
former british prime minister gordon
brown knows this all too well
in a face-to-face meeting with one of
his party's supporters back in 2010
he was filmed having a candid
conversation debating about the economy
the tv cameras were on him he was in a
public setting and he was having a
discussion with this supporter so he
acted in a certain way
however a few minutes later that context
changed he got in his car away from the
cameras away from that supporter and
suddenly his behavior changed as well
his microphone unbeknown to him was
still on and he was recorded saying that
was a disaster they should have never
put me with that woman whose idea was
that ridiculous she's just a bigoted
woman
it shows how quickly groups can change
behavior
in one setting you might act a certain
way whilst in another you might act
completely different there are some more
studies in poles apart that showed this
and really surprised me
one study about group allegiances shows
how our behaviors change dramatically
even with groups that we might have the
slightest allegiance to in what has now
become regarded as something of a
classic study the israeli social
psychologist ziva kunder told volunteers
that they would be playing a history
trivia game to get the hang of it they
were told that they would observe
someone else let's call this person jane
play the game before they began now half
the group was told that jane would join
their team and the other half were told
that jane would join the rival team
now jane was in fact astute she was
set up to play the game perfectly and
answer every question correctly
what the researchers found was that
attitudes towards jane changed
based on group allegiances those who
were told that jane would be joining
their team praised her skills her
quality her intelligence those who
thought they would be competing against
jane were far more dismissive when
questioned about her they tended to
attribute her accuracy to luck
both groups saw the exact same
performance
yet individuals in the group came to
opposite conclusions
clearly we are very quick to take sites
quick to change our opinions based on
the group but what happens when we sit
on the fence
alex explain to me how that too can be
met with hostility
just to add to that it's a really
interesting historical example
this wasn't a scientific study
but again as part of the book of the
co-author ali uh was researching where
the terms left and right come from you
know which are very rooted in the kind
of political tribalism and it was from
the french revolution
i guess it's france said on the brink of
revolution back in
late 1700s
imagine you had the clergy the nobility
and other people gathered
around and they were
either they either sat on the left or
the right of the royal tennis courts
where they met according to whether they
supported the king
or not did they support the king they
sat on the right or if they wanted
reform they sat on the left
and that's where the left right metaphor
came from seems to have persisted ever
since but there was one guy in this mix
again a member of an ability called i'm
going to get my french pronunciation
wrong the baron d goville
um but he was present at this meeting
he's very sympathetic to the king
but he kept on changing his mind and he
sat in numerous parts of the room to
demonstrate that actually he was a
master of his own opinions and didn't
want to take side but in these
historical records it's noted that he
was condemned to boos from the gallery
so i think the point to take from that
is uh yes it can
it can really pay in many cases to take
to take aside
before we finish i wanted to chat about
how all of this applies to marketing do
these findings tell us anything about
our work
well i think the findings show how
important positioning is
creating a product that tries to appeal
to everyone is just really unlikely to
capture any interest but if you create a
product that is targeted towards a
specific group i.e a product that takes
a side that doesn't sit on the fence
it's far more likely to attract
attention pulsar parts show that we feel
strong allegiances to groups how we copy
the behavior of others in that group so
if you can build something that solves a
problem for a specific group then you're
probably on to a winner now this is
essentially what april dumford taught us
about positioning in episode 48 of nudge
she says that effective positioning is
describing how your product is great at
providing value for something that a
well-defined set of customers cares a
lot about essentially targeting your
offering at a well-defined audience at a
well-defined group is a must for most
marketing campaigns
now two examples of this spring to mind
a few years back costa coffee ran a
campaign that highlighted how seven out
of ten coffee lovers preferred costa to
rival brands like starbucks
the campaign specifically targeted
coffee lovers people who defined
themselves as essentially coffee nerds
that targeting seemed to work sales
increased by 5.5 percent after their
campaign was run according to the
guardian
the other example i wanted to share is
from dave trott's book one plus one
equals three he shares the story of
amadeo gianini a sicilian who emigrated
to san fran in 1904. now giannini knew
that his group which was sicilian
immigrants they needed a bank existing
banks offered really poor deals for
immigrants and sicilians needed a
solution
so he built something for the group a
bank where sicilians would feel welcome
he didn't know anything about
positioning but he knew the name of the
bank should be something that they
specifically trusted that that specific
group would trust so he opened a little
shop front with a big sign outside
saying bank of italy fishermen this is
your bank you couldn't be more specific
with that targeting and by specifically
targeting his group he was showing that
his bank was not just for rich white
people and the sicilian fishermen they
came in their hundreds depositing their
savings
the bank of italy became a success
but the bank of italy kept growing it
was loved so dearly by sicilians that
other immigrants wanted in and soon
americans did too the bank of italy grew
and grew until it became the only
statewide bank across california now it
was time to stop being a bank for just
sicilian fishermen no the bank needed to
be a brand that all u.s citizens could
feel was their bank
the founder needed to reposition so in
1930 he changed the name to bank of
america
now it felt like it had stature it felt
like it had history and tradition
and bank of america grew because of this
positioning it grew so fast that in a
few decades it would become the second
largest bank in the entire usa
and then in 1958 they launched the
world's first credit card it was called
the bank america it essentially created
the credit card market and around the
entire world and that meant that the
card wasn't just for americans so it
needed to rebrand again so bank
americard renamed itself to visa and
today visa has 38 of the world's credit
card market it handles 62 billion
transactions a year amounting to 4.4
trillion dollars now giannini didn't try
to build something for the world he
started with a very well-defined group
and built something specifically for
them
when he realized it could help more
people he expanded the offering giannini
understood the power of groups and used
this to his advantage
[Music]
that is all for today folks i hope you
have enjoyed today's episode laura and
alex will be back again soon with
another episode on nudge and in that
episode we tackle a topic that i can't
wait to talk about in that episode we'll
discuss how to change someone's mind now
they don't share bs tactics that you
might expect from a run-of-the-mill
linkedin guru no they share the real
science behind changing someone's mind
it is a must listen so make sure you're
subscribed to nudge wherever you listen
too much anyway here's a question for
you do you like this show do you tune in
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if so would you like more would you like
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of course if you want a copy of laura
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thank you again for listening to this
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have any feedback and i'll see you again
in two weeks cheers
[Music]
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