Why Layne Norton Changed His Mind on Fasting and 4 Other Topics

Summary

In this informative discussion, Dr. Lane Norton shares his evolving perspectives on health and fitness topics over the past five to seven years. From reconsidering the benefits of branched-chain amino acids (BCAAs) for muscle synthesis to reevaluating the role of LDL cholesterol in heart disease, Norton candidly discusses his changed viewpoints. He also addresses the impact of fasting on muscle growth, the effectiveness of different types of cardio, and the nuances of training periodization. Sponsored by Element, Norton highlights the importance of electrolyte balance and the role of supplementation in his nutritional journey.

Takeaways

• 🧠 Dr. Lane Norton has changed his stance on several topics over the years, showing his adaptability to new research and evidence.
• 💊 Initially a proponent of BCAA supplementation, Norton now believes that for most people with adequate protein intake, BCAAs do not offer additional benefits in muscle protein synthesis.
• 🥤 Sponsored by Element, Norton discusses the benefits of their electrolyte products, highlighting the importance of the right balance of sodium, potassium, and magnesium for hydration and muscle function.
• 🍽 Norton emphasizes the importance of protein timing and quality, especially for those who fast, suggesting that essential amino acids can be beneficial post-fasting to reduce catabolism.
• 🕊️ Discussing EAAs, Norton points out their utility for specific populations like plant-based dieters and fasters, enhancing meal quality and aiding in recovery from fasting.
• 🚫 Norton has revised his opinion on fasting, acknowledging that it does not negatively impact muscle growth when combined with adequate protein and calorie intake.
• 🏋️‍♂️ Norton's perspective on the timing of workouts relative to meals has evolved, suggesting that personal preference and comfort are as important as metabolic state for performance.
• 🔄 He also addresses the LDL cholesterol debate, now convinced that lower LDL levels are associated with reduced heart disease risk, contrary to his previous views.
• 🍳 Norton discusses the impact of diet on cholesterol levels, advocating for mindfulness in saturated fat consumption due to its influence on LDL levels.
• 🏃‍♂️ The role of exercise in fat loss is also covered, with Norton noting that while exercise can increase hunger and calorie intake, it still contributes to a calorie deficit when not compensated for by overeating.

Q & A

What is the main topic of discussion in the video script?

The main topic of discussion in the video script is the changes in Dr. Lane Norton's perspectives on various health and fitness topics over the years, including branched-chain amino acids (BCAAs), fasting, LDL cholesterol, and exercise practices.

What is Dr. Lane Norton's current stance on BCAA supplementation?

Dr. Lane Norton now believes that BCAA supplementation may not be necessary for most people, especially when they are already consuming adequate protein. He used to advocate for BCAAs but has since changed his view based on more recent research findings.

What are the specific situations where Dr. Norton thinks EAAs or BCAAs might still be beneficial?

Dr. Norton suggests that EAAs or BCAAs might be beneficial for plant-based dieters who struggle to get enough essential amino acids or those who fast and want to prevent catabolism after an overnight fast, particularly if they train in the morning or dislike having a full stomach.

How has Dr. Norton's view on fasting evolved over time?

Dr. Norton initially believed that fasting was not a good idea for those looking to build muscle due to its potential to depress muscle protein synthesis. However, recent studies have shown no significant difference in muscle mass between those who practice intermittent fasting and those who do not, as long as protein intake is adequate.

What is the significance of the Mendelian randomization trials mentioned in the script?

Mendelian randomization trials use genetic polymorphisms to assess the causal relationship between LDL cholesterol levels and heart disease risk. These trials have shown a clear correlation between higher lifetime exposure to LDL and increased risk of heart disease, influencing Dr. Norton's views on LDL's role in heart health.

What dietary changes has Dr. Norton made in light of his new understanding of LDL cholesterol?

Dr. Norton now advises keeping saturated fat intake below 10% of total calories and has started taking a statin medication to manage his naturally higher LDL levels, despite making lifestyle changes.

What is the relationship between HDL cholesterol and heart disease risk according to the script?

While higher HDL cholesterol is generally associated with better metabolic health, Mendelian randomization trials have shown that naturally higher or lower levels of HDL do not significantly modify heart disease risk.

How does Dr. Norton approach the topic of exercise and its impact on appetite and energy expenditure?

Dr. Norton acknowledges that while exercise can increase appetite and energy expenditure, on average, it has an anorectic effect and results in a net calorie deficit when not rigorously tracking calorie intake. However, individual responses may vary, and some people may need to adjust their exercise routines based on their personal experiences.

What is the role of Auto regulation in Dr. Norton's current training approach?

Auto regulation allows Dr. Norton to adjust his training intensity and volume based on his body's feedback, such as how he feels on a particular day or how weights are moving during warm-up sets, leading to a more flexible and sustainable training approach.

What is Dr. Norton's perspective on periodization in training?

Dr. Norton believes that periodization can be useful for optimizing recovery and managing training volume over time. However, he does not see it as inherently superior to consistent, hard training without strict periodization.

How does Dr. Norton's experience with a parasite infection relate to the broader discussion on weight loss and health?

Dr. Norton's experience with a parasite infection, which led to rapid weight loss, serves as a reminder that while quick fixes can be effective, they are not sustainable or enjoyable. It reinforces the importance of consistency and hard work in achieving long-term health and fitness goals.

Outlines

00:00

🤔 Personal Evolution and Nutritional Sponsorship

Dr. Lane Norton discusses his personal changes in beliefs over the years and introduces the video's sponsorship by Element, praising their Citrus salt for its refreshing taste and electrolyte balance. He explains his usage of the product, particularly the sodium, potassium, and magnesium content, and how it caters to his specific needs depending on whether he is fasted or not. The conversation also touches on the importance of tracking nutritional intake to manage appetite and the role of electrolytes in performance and health.

05:00

💊 Reconsidering BCAA and EAA Supplementation

The speaker reflects on his previous stance on branched-chain amino acids (BCAA) and essential amino acids (EAA) supplementation, acknowledging that while he once advocated for their use, he has since revised his opinion. He explains that research indicates BCAA and EAA supplementation does not significantly enhance lean muscle mass when adequate protein is already consumed. He also discusses the potential benefits of EAA for specific populations, such as plant-based dieters and fasters, and how these supplements can support muscle protein synthesis and reduce catabolism.

10:01

🕉 Changing Perspectives on Fasting and Muscle Building

The paragraph delves into the evolving understanding of fasting's impact on muscle building. Initially, the speaker was against fasting for those looking to build muscle due to its suppressive effect on muscle protein synthesis. However, recent studies have shown no significant difference in lean tissue accrual between those who practice intermittent fasting and those who do not, provided they consume adequate protein and calories. The speaker emphasizes the importance of individual body composition and personal experience when considering fasting for muscle growth.

15:03

🏋️‍♂️ The Impact of Fasting on Training and Performance

The discussion continues with the effects of fasting on workout performance and muscle catabolism. The speaker shares personal anecdotes and scientific insights, suggesting that while fasting may not be optimal for all, it can be a useful tool for appetite control and calorie management. He also addresses the psychological aspects of fasting, such as feeling sluggish after a big meal before training, and the importance of individual preferences and experiences in crafting a training regimen.

20:03

🧬 LDL Cholesterol Revisited: A Shift in Understanding

The speaker recounts his change in perspective regarding LDL cholesterol. He used to believe that LDL was a significant causative factor in heart disease, but recent studies, particularly Mendelian randomization trials, have led him to reconsider this view. He explains that while LDL can penetrate the endothelium, the overall cholesterol deposition is similar regardless of particle size. The speaker also addresses the role of HDL cholesterol and the potential for reverse causality in studies involving elderly or cancer patients.

25:04

🍳 The Role of Saturated Fat in Diet and Health

This paragraph explores the relationship between saturated fat intake and health outcomes, particularly LDL cholesterol levels. The speaker discusses the impact of saturated fat on insulin resistance and liver fat, citing studies that suggest saturated fat may be a stronger contributor to these issues than sugar. He also touches on the emotional aspects of dietary choices and the difficulty of changing established dietary habits, emphasizing the importance of a balanced and nuanced approach to nutrition.

30:04

🚴‍♀️ The Debate Over Fasted Cardio for Fat Loss

The speaker examines the common belief that fasted cardio is more effective for fat loss due to increased fat burning during exercise. However, he points out that studies show no significant difference in fat loss between fasted and fed cardio when total daily calorie expenditure and intake are equated. The speaker also shares his personal experience, moving from a strict fasted cardio routine to a more flexible approach based on individual preference and the importance of not losing muscle mass during cardio sessions.

35:06

🏋️‍♂️ Periodization Training: Effectiveness and Adaptation

The paragraph discusses the concept of periodization training and its effectiveness in bodybuilding and strength training. The speaker used to be a strong proponent of periodization but has since found the research on its benefits to be lacking. He now favors a flexible approach to periodization that includes auto-regulation, allowing for adjustments based on how the body feels and performs on any given day. The speaker emphasizes the importance of consistency and hard work over trying to optimize training programs.

40:08

🤝 Conclusion on Consistency and Personalized Approach

In the concluding paragraph, the speaker reflects on the importance of consistency in achieving long-term goals, whether in diet or exercise. He shares his journey of losing a significant amount of weight and emphasizes that it was not about finding easy hacks but about doing the hard work consistently. The speaker also discusses the value of personalized approaches to training and diet, using tools like bar velocity devices for objective feedback and adjusting training intensity based on recovery and performance.

45:09

📲 Outward Nutrition and Carbon Diet Coach App

The final paragraph shifts focus to the speaker's professional endeavors, including his Instagram presence, the Outward Nutrition website, and the Carbon Diet Coach app. The speaker highlights the app's ability to automate personalized nutrition coaching, offering various diet options and adjusting recommendations based on user progress. He also addresses misconceptions about his stance on low-carb diets and emphasizes the importance of offering diverse dietary options through his app.

Keywords

💡Branched-Chain Amino Acids (BCAAs)

Branched-Chain Amino Acids (BCAAs) refer to three essential amino acids: leucine, isoleucine, and valine. They are crucial for muscle protein synthesis, particularly leucine which is known to stimulate this process. In the script, Dr. Lane Norton discusses changing his perspective on BCAA supplementation, noting that while he once advocated for their use, more recent research suggests they may not provide additional benefits for muscle growth when adequate protein is already consumed in the diet.

💡Essential Amino Acids (EAAs)

Essential Amino Acids (EAAs) are a subset of amino acids that the human body cannot synthesize on its own and must be obtained through diet. EAAs are vital for various bodily functions, including muscle repair and growth. The script mentions EAAs in the context of supplementation for specific populations, such as plant-based dieters or those who fast, to ensure they receive adequate amounts of these nutrients.

💡Fasting

Fasting is the abstention from food for a certain period, which can have various health and physiological effects. Dr. Norton discusses his evolving view on fasting, particularly in relation to muscle building and maintenance. He mentions that while fasting can suppress muscle protein synthesis, studies have shown no significant difference in muscle gain between those who fast intermittently and those who do not, provided they consume adequate protein and calories.

💡 LDL Cholesterol

LDL Cholesterol, often referred to as 'bad cholesterol,' is a type of lipoprotein that can contribute to plaque buildup in the arteries, potentially leading to cardiovascular disease. The script discusses how Dr. Norton's view on LDL has changed, moving from skepticism about its role as a causative factor in heart disease to acceptance based on evidence from mendelian randomization trials and other research.

💡Saturated Fat

Saturated Fat is a type of fat found primarily in animal products and some plant-based oils, like coconut oil. It has been linked to increased LDL cholesterol levels. In the script, Dr. Norton talks about his shift in perspective on saturated fat, acknowledging that while it was once considered harmless, current research suggests it may contribute to heart disease and should be consumed mindfully.

💡Statins

Statins are a class of drugs used to lower blood cholesterol levels, particularly LDL cholesterol, and are often prescribed to prevent cardiovascular disease. Dr. Norton mentions taking a statin himself due to naturally high LDL levels, despite lifestyle modifications, indicating a personal acceptance of their use based on individual health considerations.

💡Periodization

Periodization is a training method used to organize workout routines over time to maximize performance and recovery. It often involves varying intensity, volume, or type of training. Dr. Norton discusses his change in perspective on periodization, suggesting that while it can be useful for recovery, it may not be inherently superior to consistent, hard training without strict periodization.

💡Autoregulation

Autoregulation in training refers to the practice of adjusting workout intensity or volume based on individual feelings and readiness on a given day, rather than strictly following a predetermined plan. The script highlights the importance of autoregulation in training to avoid overtraining and injury, aligning with the theme of adapting to one's body's needs for optimal performance and recovery.

💡Constrained Energy Expenditure

Constrained Energy Expenditure is a model suggesting that the body maintains a relatively stable energy expenditure regardless of changes in physical activity levels. The script touches on this concept when discussing the idea that increased exercise might not lead to significant fat loss if it results in reduced spontaneous physical activity or increased food intake.

💡Cardio

Cardio, short for cardiovascular exercise, refers to physical activities that raise heart rate and improve heart and lung function. The script discusses the debate between fasted and fed cardio, concluding that there is no significant difference in fat loss outcomes when total daily calorie intake and expenditure are considered.

💡Protein Synthesis

Protein Synthesis is the process by which the body creates new proteins, which is crucial for muscle growth and repair. The script uses the concept of protein synthesis to illustrate the balance between muscle building and breakdown, emphasizing that both processes occur simultaneously, and that the net result depends on the relative rates of each process.

Highlights

Sponsorship by Element, a brand offering various flavors of electrolytes with a focus on the perfect ratio of sodium, potassium, and magnesium.

Dr. Lane Norton's change of perspective on Branched Chain Amino Acid (BCAA) supplementation, recognizing its limited effectiveness without adequate protein intake.

The importance of BCAAs for specific populations such as plant-based dieters and those who fast, and their role in overcoming the refractory phenomenon of muscle protein synthesis.

Shift in opinion regarding fasting and its impact on muscle building, with new research suggesting no significant difference in muscle gain between fasting and continuous feeding.

Discussion on the role of Essential Amino Acids (EAAs) in plant-based diets and their potential to enhance meal quality.

The potential benefits of EAAs for individuals who fast and the physiological comparison between high protein diets and fasting.

Personal experience and the realization that personal mileage may vary with dietary and training practices, emphasizing the importance of individual responses.

The evolving understanding of LDL cholesterol's role in heart disease and the influence of genetic factors on LDL levels.

The impact of saturated fat on LDL cholesterol levels and the reconsideration of dietary guidelines regarding fat intake.

The use of statins by Dr. Norton to manage his naturally high LDL levels despite lifestyle modifications.

The nuanced view on the relationship between diet, LDL levels, and heart disease risk, including the role of dietary cholesterol versus LDL cholesterol.

The myth-busting around the necessity of consuming high amounts of saturated fat and the potential for overconsumption to contribute to insulin resistance.

The reevaluation of periodization training and its actual impact on muscle mass and strength gains.

The introduction of auto-regulation in training as a flexible approach to periodization, allowing for better recovery and adaptation.

The emphasis on the importance of consistency and hard work in achieving long-term health and fitness goals.

Outward Nutrition and Carbon Diet Coach app, tools created by Dr. Norton to help individuals with their nutrition and fitness journey.

Transcripts

right Dr Lane Norton you and I both

changed our minds on a lot of things but

you were steadfast in your ways for

quite some time on a number of different

topics I want to kind of put you on the

spot and say like what are five things

that you've changed your mind on over

the last five six seven years where

people might say holy crap I never would

have thought that from today's video is

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you're going to have to help me keep

track

so I think you know number one something

that I was known for and that I had in

my previous supplement line was Branch

amino acid

supplementation now I still think

there's there's some cases where BCA or

EAS may make sense for very specific

populations but you know probably 15 10

even like up to 5 years ago I would kind

of say you know I think there is value

in supplementing branchy amino acids and

for my reasoning was well you know we

know that Lucine is the amino acid that

stimulates muscle protein synthesis it's

one of the BCAAs typically in BCA

formulas it is provided in a 2:1:1 ratio

to loose to one isoline one veiling

reason for that is that tends to be

that's how they are metabolized in that

ratio they've actually shown that if you

have you know if you have too much

Lucine you'll actually kind of deplete

levels of isol Lucine and veiling so

anyways I was big on supplementation

because I'm like okay you know per on a

per calorie anabolic Buck you're you

know getting a pretty strong Bang there

um and one of the things I said also was

I recommended taking you know a b a

supplement between

meals because in my research and some

other

labs without getting you know too far

into the weeds we showed this kind of

like refractory phenomenon of muscle

protein synthesis which essentially is

just that um if you give a dose of

protein we show that protein synthesis

goes up and comes back down and it comes

back down even in the face of elevated

levels of blood amino acids uh elevated

mour signaling

um and pretty much like all anabolic

signaling apparatus is still turned on

in the

cell um and essentially we showed that

we could kind of overcome that we could

extend out muscle protein synthesis by

giving

bcas but when you look at the the

research where they have adequate

protein and they give bcas on top of it

you just don't see any differences in

lean mass and I mean they've done this

in lab animals too where they're

controlling like so much

of the animals diet because

humans I'm for human studies over animal

studies but I always tell people if you

want like human studies with high

subject number and high level of control

it's going to be really short duration

if you want uh High control and long

duration it's going to be very few

subjects and if you want long duration

High subject number it's going to be

very low control and if you want High

subject number High control long dur a

it's going to be Lab Rats it's going to

be animals like you just can't do it in

humans

um and so unless you've got you know

Millions upon millions of dollars to

really put down on a study and even then

I mean good luck finding the and even

then I mean like how long you know when

people complain about this stuff I'm

like well are you going to sign up to

have somebody to tell you what to do for

two years and what to eat like no you're

not going to do that put you in a

metabolic Ward for five years yeah

exactly food jail right so

when we even the animal trials where

they're giving supplemental BCAA and

they're having these animals resistance

train and yes you can get Lab Rats to

resistance train

um and you know they just don't see it

it just doesn't seem to make a

difference if you have enough protein so

my first supplement line uh that was a

collaboration between myself and

bodybuilding.com you know like 7 eight

years ago we included BCA a in our

recovery

product and now in my recovery product

without work nutrition I don't have them

because I just said well I can't justify

this you know like um even though for a

long time I was beating that drum I had

to say Hey listen I was wrong about that

you know um and then another thing would

actually be uh fasting so backy it's a

perfect bridge for that because I

actually have a question on the BCA like

first of all like any Merit to eaas at

all or is it in the same boat

okay so actually this is a good segue so

I think two particular situations first

one is um if you're dealing with um you

know plant-based folks who have

difficulty getting in

enough um essential amino acids through

their diet and for whatever reason don't

want to supplement with a protein powder

I mean there are some decent plant

protein powders out there isolated plant

protein powders um but but if you add

EAS to meals um I mean you're

essentially enhancing the quality of

that meal right so that's a that's a

quick and easy way if somebody didn't

want to like do a lot of like math and

combinations of proteins and all that

kind of stuff they could just kind of

eat their normal you know vegan diet and

then add you know 10 grams of essential

amino acids on top of it each

meal um next subgroup would be people

who fast um you know if they want to

kind of bring themselves out of

catabolism after you know an overnight

fast or whatnot and they're going to

train in the mornings May or maybe

people even who just don't like feeling

like they've got a lot of you know food

on their stomach uh

EAS very you know I mean they're

basically pre-digested you don't have

your body pretty much can just absorb

them into the small intestine don't have

to do anything with them and so I I

think for those folks it can be helpful

and I what I would say is like you know

you could just drink a way Shake I mean

people worry about fasting and what I

tell people is like you know high

protein diets and fasting in terms of

metabolic signals are not really that

far apart like if you're talking about a

protein like just a high protein meal I

mean the one thing you could argue is

well they stimulate insulin you know

that sort of thing but it kind of boils

back to like all right why are we

fasting right like I think the research

pretty clearly shows now fasting is a

great tool for a lot of people or time

restriction to you know narrow down

their eating window and reduce their

calorie consumption but in terms of like

physiologically when you're equating

calories between diets on a weekly

basis no difference in fat loss and the

claims about autophagy and whatnot are

pretty tenuous because we do know that

again normal caloric restriction will

increase autophagy exercise increases

autophagy fasting increases

autophagy we don't know if it does more

than you know these other things so what

I'll say is like Hey listen like really

to me if you're doing it to control your

appetite what's wrong with having a way

shake or just an isolated protein Source

before you go train if you're you know

if if building muscle is something

that's important to you um and so then

you know whether whey or essential amino

acids you know those are have utility

for people who may want to time restrict

their food intake so they can control

their calories are still concerned with

like trying to maximize their muscle

mass so so fasting or fasting or not is

their benefit to having locing whether

it's eaa's way or even Branch chain

amino acids in that case is there any

Merit to having it pre-training whether

you're training fast it or not I think

if you're training fasted I mean there

could be Merit to it but not necessarily

more Merit than you would have just

having a regular protein Source but

above staying fasted perhaps yeah I mean

if you if that's important if you want

to you know stay fast although you can

argue that all right you're you're

ingesting amino acid so you're

technically not fasted right um but

again it's like I I boil back to it's

like well why are why are we doing

fasting right it's kind of like

um when I guess kind of a weird

comparison would be like okay if you're

doing a ketogenic diet but then you're

buying like these ketogenic ice creams

that have more calories than the normal

ice cream it's like okay we're kind of

missing the point of ketosis here right

like the point is to control your

appetite and reduce your calorie take at

least if you're you know unless you're

using it for treatment of something like

epilepsy or something like that um you

know the point should be to you know use

it as an appetite control

tool so I did change my mind about

fasting as well from the perspective of

you know 10 years ago if you asked me

about fasting I'd say well you know I

don't think it's a good idea for people

who want to build muscle because you

know we've shown that even an an

overnight fast will depress muscle

protein synthesis and so now if you're

extending that out further

you know I don't know if you're going to

be able to make up for

this there's been a couple studies now

at a grant Tinsley's lab um where I

think he's at Texas A&M where they've

done you know I think it's 8 to 12 week

resistance training studies where people

either do kind of your traditional 168

intermittent fasting uh with resistance

training or they do continuous feeding

and they've shown no differences in the

acrel of lean tissue so a couple caveats

to

that

8 to 12 weeks not a super long time not

saying it's a bad study it's not a bad

study at all but you know differences in

muscle mass are slow so if you we kind

of talking about this earlier if you

inject me with true serum and ask me do

I think that you know any form of

fasting is optimal if you want to be the

most muscular person you possibly can be

no but that's not most people either

right if you're just worried about

growing muscle and you know staying lean

and you find it intermittent fast

fasting is a useful tool for that you

can absolutely still build muscle

intermittent fasting especially if

you're getting enough protein getting

enough total

calories and the one thing I will say

about this study was they made sure they

had them train during their feeding

window and they did advise them to get

like three good servings of protein in

Peter AA makes a really good point about

intermittent fasting which you know on a

practical level he said you know I have

seen people kind of start to lose lean

mass intermittent fasting but it's since

we're compressing their feeding window

they tend to just eat less protein they

tend to eat kind of like a similar diet

they normally would just less and so you

know if lean mass is a is a

consideration you know if you're

narrowing your feeding window you do

want to make sure you're getting you

know a couple of you know high quality

protein doses in if again lean mass as a

consideration but I have changed my tune

that okay 168 inm fasting

doesn't seem to be significantly

different from kind of regular feeding

if you're getting enough

protein and I would like to see a study

where you know they have people trained

fasted outside their feeding wind

outside the feeding window compared to

continuous feeding that would be

interesting I don't know if it'll be

different um I think a lot matters on

like the body composition of the person

as well right like I mean it's for me

I'm I'm lean now and I'm very skeptical

about doing longer 75 990 minute

workouts without fuel now right because

now I mean I don't even have a base

layer to really pull from as much and

I'm not trying to sound like a a cocky

jerk saying that I'm just saying like

it's there's when I was you know 50 60

pounds overweight it was just less of a

concern that allowed repository for fuel

yeah so it's like for me it's like okay

now yeah I've kind of changed my tune a

little bit too like on my heavier

resistance training days that might be

longer higher volume I am going to eat

first you know I am going to have maybe

some cream of rice or some honey or some

fruit or something along with a way

Shake right I will have something to

buffer that and it's uh I can't say it's

made a huge difference in my performance

but I feel like it's at least making it

so that I'm not catabolizing quite as

much because there was a stage there

where I was like yeah I was pushing

these like metcons like really starting

to go kind of heavy into that world and

I was doing all fast in like 90 minutes

I'm starting to think okay strength is

dropping body composition is great but

strength is dropping all these like buy

signs are indicating that okay this is

not working I need to like throw a

wrench in here a little bit so I think

there's I think the state that

somebody's in might make a difference as

well yeah I think it's important to

point out to like the the concept of

your mileage may vary right so when when

I when I talk about studies or when

people report studies what we're

reporting is averages right so I think a

lot of people take their personal

experience they hear what a study says

they go oh that's BS because I you know

I experien something different no you

there's outliers you could experience

something different right so for example

on average if you look at feeding before

exercise versus fasting the research is

pretty clear you perform better when

you're when you're fueled now that

doesn't mean that everyone performs

better um some people and I think it's

it's probably more so psychological they

just don't like the feeling of you know

being heavy or having food on their

stomach anecdotally I noticed a lot of

women tend to kind of gravitate towards

that they don't want big meals before

they go in and train and so but if you

know that then that's fine and this is

the the disconnect I think sometimes

between evidence-based stuff Bro Science

and where the two need to meet which is

I'll say okay if I've got a new

person I'm probably going to start them

you know at the averages because on

average that's most likely to work best

for them but if they're telling me yeah

I feel like crap I feel sluggish um you

know but I feel better if I don't have

as much food or no food I'm not going to

like doggedly make them stick with that

you know it's like okay cool well then

we'll do that right because to me

adherence in them feeling good during a

workout maybe it is psychological but

who cares it's still that's working for

them so I think that's where those two

worlds really clash and especially when

some people hear what I

say or they they they listen to how do I

want to say this words come out of my

mouth but their interpretation of those

words is quite different right and I

think we all want our personal

experience validated you know and

um I think that's what I've tried to do

a better job of is saying hey here's

what the data says but like if this

works for you by all means do it if if

you whatever fasting ketogenic

diet if if you have found that to be

your experience that that works better

for you by all means do it where we're

going to have problems if is if you take

your personal experiences to why

everyone should be doing this and why

it's better that's when we're going to

have issues so that's one thing I

changed my mind about another thing I

changed my mind about was uh LDL

cholesterol so I people don't really

know this because I spend so much time

kind of like fighting against the the

crazier end of the low carbon carnivore

Community but the lab I came out of was

like not ketogenic but lower carish I

mean Don Layman was know a big proponent

of higher protein um controlling

carbohydrate intake but you know he

would say like Lane for somebody like

you I've seen you train you train like

two three Don used to go to the same gym

as me which was fun um he's like you

train for two or three hours like a

madman yeah of course you can you know

consume a higher amount of carbohydrate

and calories without having negative

effects you know and I think that's what

some people don't always understand but

one thing I will say is like well I can

trade that way because I'm fueled that

way as well you know like these these

things are not necessarily

disconnected

but one of the things that was being

discussed and talked about when I went

into the lab there was you know it seems

that it's not necessarily the LDL

cholesterol it's the HDL to LDL ratio

also like LDL oxidation you know oxidize

particles of LDL can more easily

penetrate the

endothelium and now you know we have so

much data that's come out especially the

melan random randomization trials that I

I changed my tune where I do feel like

LDL or I I don't feel I do feel

confident that the LDL is a causitive

factor for heart disease and let me

explain that

um so we know that LDL cholesterol can

penetrate the endothelium whether it's

oxidized or not now people will say well

oxidize LL penetrates the endothelium

it's more about the oxidized level of

LDL yes small oxidized particles of LDL

can penetrate the endothelium more

easily but they carry less overall

cholesterol large particles don't

penetrate as easy but they carry more

cholesterol what you end up with in

terms of net cholesterol deposition in

the endothelium is pretty similar

amounts um if you and and the mandilon

randomized trials we're talking about

are it's actually kind of brilliant the

way this

works one of the big problems with

looking at LDL cholesterol and heart

disease in general is you're you're not

talking about something you can really

do a randomized control trial on and

here's why what's the longest you can do

a randomized control trial maybe a year

two years heart disease is a lifetime

exposure issue you know um if you have

high LDL versus low LDL it's not the

difference between dying at 30 and dying

at 70 it's the difference between dying

at you know 67 and 75 you know it's it's

kind of like uh investing so uh I use

this example if you have one person who

invests in a mutual fund and it gets

8% you have another person invest in

mutual fund it gets 10% and you check

how much money they have have after 2

years it's going to be kind of similar

but if you check after 40 years it's

going to be a massive difference well

the problem is you can't do a 40-year

randomized control trial now mandelian

randomization uses the fact that people

based on genetic

polymorphisms can naturally secrete

higher or lower levels of

LDL and so they've done studies where

they've kind of looked at all right what

is the person's lifetime exposure to LDL

and how does that correlate with the

risk of heart disease and I mean you can

pretty much draw like a straight line

through the levels of LDL cholesterol

and their risk of heart

disease now some people will say well

it's not really LDL it's apol

lipoprotein B yes but apob and LDL tend

to they go together um you can't really

disconnect them

so the other the other thing that would

be kind of that was kind of convincing

for me was if you look at because some

people will say well that's not

accounting for inflammation it's not

accounting for HDL

okay we have drugs that increase HDL we

also have mandilon randomized trials on

people who secrete more or less

HDL it doesn't modify heart disease risk

now what HDL is is an indicator of

metabolic health so all things being

equal you're absolutely better off

having higher HDL not because HDL itself

is protective but because in order to

have high HDL you probably have good

insulin sensitivity markers of metabolic

Health you're just healthier

overall so in the I think they did a

subsection of the firmingham data where

they looked at okay low inflammation

High

inflammation low LDL high LDL at at both

high and low levels of

inflammation in each subcategory people

who had low LDL still had lower rate

so if you were high inflammation you're

you're going to have a higher

risk but of those if you the those that

had low LDL versus high LDL had a lower

risk in that subcategory then if you're

low inflammation still the same thing

then if we look at same thing with HDL

High HDL versus low HDL in each

subcategory people who had low LDL still

had lower risk so to me if you're

kind of controlling some of these other

variables and you're still seeing this

show up pretty consistently to me that

was very convincing and again I was

somebody who for years I mean I even I

even went through some of my old slides

of talks I gave 10 years ago where I

said you know saturated fat I'm not

worried about it doesn't matter now I'm

kind of like H I don't want to say like

completely avoid saturated fat um but I

I do tell people hey it does increase

LDL so just be mindful of it like try to

keep it below 10% that sort of thing um

10% total calories or 10% of fat

calories 10% total calories um and then

if you're somebody like me so I have I

kind of secrete higher LDL naturally so

my LDL hangs out around 150 um and

that's even with eating you know 60 70

grams of dietary fiber a day um with

being a pretty lean person uh

exercising and then um and then keeping

calories my saturated fat is usually

probably around 8% of total

calories um and so that's that's

actually why and this is really going to

get me in trouble I started actually

taking a looto Statin um because of this

this information and now again I was

somebody who was like look at the side

effects on statins you know um some

people do get Sarco um not sarcopenia

but muscle pain from statins uh I

haven't had really any side effects uh

and it's um fortunately I've been on

Prav stattin and as a timi I think it's

called um and my H my LDL has gone down

by like 40% so um you know for again I'm

not saying people should be on statins

but you know for me personally even with

modifying everything I could through

lifestyle I was still pretty high and it

what's really interesting about some of

these medilan randomization studies they

even show you know going from like

lowish LDL say 90 or 100 to like even

lower 30 or 50 you still get a reduction

in

Risk so I don't like making like real

strong statements but it does appear

that like the lower you can kind of get

your LDL the the better in terms of

heart disease now I'll I'll do the

Devil's Advocate argument as well which

is well if you look at uh elderly people

or people who have cancer people with

high LDL live

longer what you're looking at is kind of

a malnutrition issue usually um people

who are malnourished from cancer CIA

have lower levels of LDL because of that

and also tend to die earlier because

cancer kexi is actually one of the

biggest mortality risk for

cancer um so yeah I you know those tend

to be like reverse causality sorts of

things and then people say well you know

cholesterol does these good things in

your body yes cholesterol does do good

things in your body but your body with

pretty much zero intake of saturated fat

or cholesterol can make all the

cholesterol it needs so you're not going

to be deficient in cholesterol can you

can you uh is there evidence that you

can offset some of that by being in a

more severe deficit or not oh yeah like

if you if you lose body fat your blood

numbers will improve so even if you're I

mean this is purely hypothetical right

if someone were to consume a higher

saturated fat diet but they were eating

at a pretty severe deficit is there

arguably a lesser impact so this is

where you really get into the Nuance

which I like right

so you have to kind of compare apples to

apples which is okay person eating High

saturated fat diet in a severe deficit

versus person eating a highs saturated

fat diet in a maintenance or Surplus

absolutely you can expect this person to

have lower LDL who's eating a deficit

but we do see people who go from kind of

like a more mixed diet or I mean you've

seen you see this in like some of the

the carnivore like message

boards they say wow I've lost 50 PBS but

my LDL is 400 you know now you're this

is where I really try to tell people I'm

like hey like you can hold two opposing

things in your hand which is you may be

overall healthier right now from losing

that 50 lbs doing a carnivore diet that

may be

true you also have raised your risk of

heart disease your

or you also have a higher risk of heart

disease having this really high LDL than

you would if you lost that same 50 lbs

but also had low LDL right so I think a

lot of people have trouble disconnecting

these two things and then the other

problem is PE you don't feel it like you

can be totally normal and be 90% blocked

somewhere I mean you see this all but

athletes athletes who have you know

whatever a family history or genetic

condition who are performing great and

all of a sudden heart attack right so

people will say well I started this diet

my LDL is high but I've never felt

better that's not how LDL works right um

yeah it's not sludge running through

your veins right right right so you know

overall you know I I I I know that this

is very unpopular in the spere and in

the um you know the the carnivore

Community but even if you talk to

somebody like Dominic deino yeah I mean

Dom he's he used to be like well put

butter in your coffee and now he's kind

of like H yep you know putting olive oil

or you know olive oil um you know like

eggs are fine Dom eats tons of eggs like

you open up his fridge Dom has like a

thousand eggs you know eggs and his

chicken livers which they're just

disgusting oh but the point there too is

like interesting disconnection which is

LDL and dietary cholesterol not the same

thing right so eggs for example I I'm

not concerned about the dietary

cholesterol intake really really not and

actually like people love to make fun of

the food guidelines but they do change

with the science which like it used to

be hey avoid eggs limit eggs because

they have too much cholesterol and now

the dietary guidelines are like

basically we can't say the dietary

cholesterol is a concern saturated fat

appears to be a concern because it can

modify

LDL but dietary cholesterol one it

doesn't appear to be really that

bioavailable two it may modify blood

levels of total cholesterol but it

appears to be really really small so

anyways my point being like somebody

even Dom who's in the ketos sphere you

know has kind of walked back his

position on

that and I'm like hey that these why do

these two things have to be entangled

like why do we have to Def and I think a

lot of it's just kind of people who want

the excuse

that it's almost like you get so

entrenched where it's like carbs are bad

Fat's good and it doesn't matter the

type of fat but it does yeah it's like

you can have the same argument kind of

coming like the opposite direction from

like a flexible dieting crowd that would

just be like sometimes they resign to

the fact

that sometimes it's as simple as wanting

to eat certain foods right like it's

just the emotional response we have

because we like our certain foods and

like coming out of the low car world I

can tell you straight up that like when

you get rid of sugar you kind of start

looking for something else right so it's

like the higher saturated fat stuff is

appealing because and you're like I mean

probably in a deep like fundamental

tribal level you're like don't take that

away from me too you know right like I

know as a former fat guy right like you

got rid of the sugar that was cool that

was fine okay but Le I can have 20

pieces of bacon exactly right so I

understand that right and the other side

is like okay sure well you know whatever

you do like yeah you know don't take

away my Pixie sticks or whatever I I

don't think anyone's ever said that but

uh yeah so I mean it's like it's

understandable from an emotional side

how you just want to defend that and you

know there's a lot of evidence too

suggesting that the high amounts of

saturated fat are also an equally strong

contributor if not unfortunately even a

stronger contributor to insulin

resistance than excess sugar right

that's what people don't want to talk

about like when you know it's like when

these people freak out about fructose

and and liver fat I'm like okay but we

have studies comparing straight up like

fructose

overfeeding uh saturated fat overfeeding

I think fructose overfeeding increased

liver fat by like I don't know like 20%

or something like that which by the way

wasn't really different from overfeeding

any other source of carbohydrate

saturated fat increased like

78% and if you compare straight up they

actually did a study where they um

overfed polyunsaturated fats versus

saturated fats and they saw um like that

that's where I pulled that number from

78% greater I think it was 78 I want to

say it was a 78% greater increase in

liver fat compared to polyunsaturated

fats it could be an absolute increase of

7 % but either way it was greater than

the increase from polyunsaturated fat so

I apologize if I butchered the study a

little bit but then when people go the

big you know what the big um thing

people always get hung up on that study

when I when I talk about it they're like

oh well they cooked them in muffins as

part of muffins you're really going to

tell me that this study with muffins is

I'm

like so these are highly processed stuff

that you guys freak out about and

they're with poly saturated fats and

they heated it which is like this is

like the trifecta of everything that you

guys say that sea dolls are bad for

right um so yeah when you look at you

know kind of I know we're kind of

tanging here but um I did a a kind of a

post on seed oils recently which I was

always I was like man I know that this

is going to like I saw that one the

title like the video you guys are going

to hate the most hated video I think it

was like over a thousand comments or

something like that

um and I was like listen if you if you

overfeed polyunsaturated fats or Omega

sixes yeah you see you see problems but

you see that when you overfeed pretty

much anything anything yeah what happens

when you replace it one to one saturated

fat versus polyunsaturated fats Omega

sixes

specifically and I mean it's pretty

consistent you either see a neutral or

positive effect on metabolic IC Health

like liver fat insulin

sensitivity um even like gut microbiome

stuff um the the you tend I think you

tend to use more bile or the bile in

products with saturated fat apparently

are somewhat toxic to some of the good

bugs in the

microbiome so again I'm not saying that

people should completely avoid saturated

fat I don't think they need to do that

I'm just saying hey when you look

straight up

saturated fat appears to be somewhat

problematic especially if you're

overeating it right maybe don't just go

willingly at it just for the sake of

maybe we shouldn't be dumping butter in

our coffee you know all right so that's

three so let's move on number four okay

number four um see I can't

count uh

cardio um so fasted versus fed all right

so this is a case where I have I was on

this extreme went to this extreme and

then eventually came back to Center

which is um at first when I first

started um in bodybuilding like age 19

early 2000s I was like fasted cardio low

intensity you burn more fat empty

stomach you're going to you're going to

burn more

fat and you do you do burn more calories

from fat doing that way as a

percentage but when they do as I like to

say human randomized control trials

where they have one group doing fasted

cardio one group doing fed cardio but

equating calories throughout the day and

equating the work with the cardio they

don't see differences in Fat Loss how

could this be they're burning more fat

well fat burning and fat loss are not

the same things fat burning is part of

what is needed in order for you to lose

fat but it is also the balance between

the amount of fat you burn versus the

amount of fat you store CU both

processes are always happening at the

same time people don't realize this they

think metabolism is kind of like on and

off switches what I tell people is it's

kind of like opposing dimmer switches

right like you're just changing the the

relative rates of each uh I mean great

example of that is protein synthesis

versus degradation neither one like

shuts down it's just when you're losing

muscle mass your rates of degradation

are higher than your rates of synthesis

when you're gaining muscle mass your

rates of synthesis are higher than

degradation over period of

time so when they look at okay if you do

fasted versus fed cardio what tends to

happen is since you burn well one your

feeding window is shorter right because

if you did fasted cardio I mean it's an

hour or two extra that you're waiting to

eat right and now during your feeding

window you're consuming more

calories when you're doing fed cardio

you've kind of spread out your feeding

window a little bit and so since you

burn more fat during

exercise when you're not exercising

you're eating more calories you burn

less fat the rest of the day when you're

fed you burn less calories from fat but

the rest of the day you're eating less

you burn more calories from fat so it

ends up not really being a difference in

fat loss I mean we've seen it time after

time in randomized control

trials now I went too far to the Other

Extreme which was okay you're going to

lose muscle if you're doing fasted

cardio you know why would you do that

you know you need to have some some food

before you go out like I used to you

know I used to be so dogmatic about this

if I had cardio in the morning I would

go and eat my full breakfast before I

went for a walk you know and now again

there's been enough studies where I'm

like okay it's it's not going to make

you lose muscle so you know what I tell

people is hey if you like just getting

up and getting it

done it's fine

right if you want to eat beforehand also

fine you know do what you prefer um so

that's another thing I've changed my

mind on intensity would matter there too

though right I me because like one thing

that I found

is well where do you draw the line right

where if I'm going to need a lot of

brute strength I'm going to like

performance is of concern right I'm

saying okay well so I'm going to eat and

I exert X more calories during my

workout because I'm fueled or I'm sure

there are those kinds of situations but

it's probably in that cohort you're

looking more at the athlete crowd right

someone that's actually because I think

people like you and I both know that

resistance training doesn't burn that

many calories like people think they go

in there and they're burning a ton but

you know if someone is I'm going to use

an example of Crossfit because it's the

only thing I can think of that's just

like a just a probably the most

monstrous amount of calories if you were

to actually combine you know in that

particular case like sure like maybe

being fueled is the difference between

them burning 600 versus 500 but then at

the end of the

day do we have sort of a self-governing

mechanism in the brain that sort of

wants to find homeostasis with our

calories no matter what because that's

what I know it's only Road model stuff

that I've seen with that but they've

seen it even with fasting right where

they deprive rodents for a couple of

days and then like three weeks later

somehow they've all ended up the same

right the rats that didn't eat they were

fast and maybe their body composition

changed in the short term but then over

time everyone balanced back out

um yeah that's kind of

like the constrained energy expenditure

model which which basically

says you know the amount of calories you

burn per day isn't really going to

change a ton even if you exercise

because if you exercise what tends to

happen is your BMR and your spontaneous

physical activity goes down right so

there is some truth to that there is a a

compensation uh but it's it's not

as rigid as the constrained energy

expenditure model would have you believe

so um for example uh Herman poner

published a study he's a Duke and um

basically showed that for every 100

calories you burn from physical activity

um your BMR compensates like 28 calories

or something like that so you don't you

if you think you burned 100 calories

from exercise

your take-home at the end of the day

probably isn't that but it's still

probably better than you would have

had by not exercising it's like paying

taxes yeah you I said 30% the side you

know um yeah exactly so you know I

think now some people again this is

where your mileage may vary right some

people say man if I increase my exercise

I just get so hungry that I end up

eating more right part of me is like H I

think that you think you're hungrier

because you're exercising more but may

maybe it is maybe it is if we look at

the average across

studies

exercise on the whole has actually an

anorectic effect now not that you

consume less calories than you normally

would it's again if you burn 100

calories from exercise you compensate by

consuming more Cal like if you just let

people eat freely but the compensation

isn't complete it's you consume a few

more calories but you still burned more

than you end up consuming again on

average right but when you combine the

the compensation in your energy

expenditure with the compensation in

what you're eating if you're not like

kind of tracking your calories

rigidly you know the effect is less than

what you predict which is why it's LED

some people who are kind of dogmatic to

say well see exercise doesn't cause fat

loss it's not good for fat loss

no it it is um but again if you're

someone who you know that if you go and

you train hard for an hour or two hours

or whatever it is and now you're so

wiped out that you just sit on the couch

the rest of the day and you're so hungry

that you just end up eating more than

you would have well then maybe a little

bit less

exercise you know might be better for

you again this is where we have like

scientific studies that are kind of a

guide that can give us guidelines but

you know if you know you as an

individual fall outside that then do

what you know works for you but just

don't assume that everybody else is like

that right exactly man all right um so

we got four got four what's the big one

to round it out so I used to be um very

big on periodization training in terms

of you know it's going to produce more

muscle mass be

stronger uh the research on

periodization

for um bodybuilding and

strength is pretty disappointing in

terms of like actually producing more

lean mass and more strength um the

research pretty much shows that the

studies that show that like forms of

periodization produce more muscle mass

are confounded by the fact that those

people did more volume um now I think

here's the caveat I think periodization

can be useful to allow you to do more

volume over time because if you're

periodize if if you're periodizing

appropriately um it's kind of building

in these times where you're doing a

little bit less allowing yourself to

recover you know if you're just jimro it

and going in and going hard every single

session I mean you may not be recovering

appropriately and you might end up

having acute injuries um your

performance May decrease you know what I

really like is kind of like a flexible

model of

periodization that also has components

of Auto regulation with it which is

essentially something like the following

which is

um if I normally squat on Monday right

and I go in and I'm warming up and I'm

really sore and it just feels like crap

you know everybody's had those days

where you're like warming up and you're

like man I don't have it today then I'm

just going to move that session to

another day

like I'll just I'll I'll do that on

another day or if like like yesterday I

was on a plane for 5 hours I'm not going

to get off the plane and go squat you

know like I've had that experience

before it's not it's not a great idea

been there um so really what the

research shows is that it matters way

less and it may not matter at

all how you structure your weekly

workouts what matters is just getting

the work in during the week

so I'll throw things all around like I

have my kind of outline of how I want to

do things but like I said if I have a

heavy gym session on tap for squats and

I go in and I know I just don't have it

that

day okay maybe I'll wait another day or

two days and go in and do it later when

I feel better then I can do more weight

uh put the muscle under more tension and

over time maybe that leads to more gains

right and then uh just Auto regulation

in terms of you know you're just going

to go through times where stuff doesn't

move as well especially when it comes to

like powerlifting you know it's I saw a

meme yesterday from there's an account

called subpar powerlifting memes and

they they're actually pretty funny and

it has like a toggle of three buttons

squat bench press deadlift and which are

going well and you can only have two

green at the same time right

like like when you're a beginner yes all

of them are going to improve but as you

get more advanced this has been my

experience very much it's very rare that

all three lifts are feeling good at the

same time for me you know it's usually

like uh squats and bench are going well

and deadlifts feel like ass you know or

deadlift and squat is going well and

bench press is not going well you know

it's just it's hard to get consistent

improvements on all of them so I think

when I was younger I would really get

hung up on trying to force myself to hit

weights that I had in my mind and it got

me in a lot of trouble and now go and

it's actually easier cuz I use a a bar

velocity device called a rep one

strength pretty cool yeah so I people in

every video are like what is that you

know um basically by measuring bar

velocity I know what certain weights

should move at on average for me and so

when I'm warming up if I hit up my you

know my heavy my heaviest warm-up set

and I'm like my velocity is down by 20%

I'm like and it and also it doesn't feel

good I'm like okay I just don't have it

today I'm I don't doggedly stick to that

like today I was doing bench press and I

did my last heavy warmup which was

315 and it was about 15% slower than

usual but I misg groved it I didn't get

in the right spot on the bench like I

just felt like it didn't feel heavy but

it was slower so I'm like okay I'm G to

I'm not going to go with a big increase

but I'm going to go ahead and go for a

weight that I know should be there

because I I don't think that it's

necessarily a problem but having um that

to just give a little bit more objective

feedback has really helped me and so

again like I'll just Auto regulate my

sessions where it's like okay if I've if

I'm hitting them if it feels good the

numbers are moving fast it's like okay

I'm going to be more aggressive today

right I'm obviously recovering well um

for whatever reason I'm in a good spot

at this

session and you don't need a bar

velocity unit to do that you can video

your your lifts I mean just even your

subjective feedback is important um and

so just learning to kind of take what's

there especially as you get more

advanced is really important because so

many of my injuries have occurred or

aggravation of those injuries have

occurred when I was trying to force

myself to hit weights that I probably

had no business trying to hit on those

particular days so bringing it back to

periodization I think period is still a

useful tool from the perspective that it

can help you set up your training in

such a way that you can optimize your

recovery better but I don't think

there's anything inherently present in

it that makes it Superior to just going

in and training hard and the the one

thing I love this from Mike isra I saw

this a couple years ago which

was you can try to optimize your program

as much as you want 9 5% of it is going

in and training hard you can't out

science hard training like you have to

you have to go hard like that and

there's I see that with so many people

whether it's diet whether it's training

it's like how do I get the stuff I want

without doing hard things and it's like

good luck you know maybe you have some

small success but for the most part I

mean when you how much weight did you

lose overall getting sick with the

parasite from your I just recently had a

parasite talking about that so I lost 17

lbs with the parasite but it's a great

way to lose that actually is an easy way

it's just not

fun no I lost about 100 pounds yeah yeah

H and my guess is like looking back the

bulk of it was it's just you

consistently doing stuff every day and

building habits that changed your life

right it was all consistency right

exactly so I think that you know we love

to get hung up on hacks and tricks and

mechanisms and stuff and all that

stuff's cool and there are some things

out there they that might have a small

effect but really the the blunt force to

change things is just you being willing

to get uncomfortable and do hard stuff

over time definitely man well on that

note man that's a uh where can everyone

find outwork nutrition where can

everyone find you and uh yeah man yeah

so um you know Instagram is kind of my

digital business card uh just biolane on

Instagram and then outward nutrition is

just outward nutrition.com um and then I

also have helped create a nutrition app

called carbon diet coach uh which

basically takes like the coaching I do

and kind of automates it into an app and

um that's been extremely successful

we've had tons of people use it I mean

they won't let me say the actual number

but it's a lot um and it's got great

reviews in the App Store super easy to

use and um the cool thing about it is

yeah you track your food and all that

kind of stuff but the app not only gives

you you recommendations to hit but then

it modifies those recommendations based

on how you progress which makes it

different from things like my fitness

pal which will give you one time

calculation but it's not going to modify

based on how you progress so um that's

been cool to see how many people that

can help um because it it really like I

love like our coaching team where we we

have one-on-one coaching and that's

nothing will ever replace like having

another human being as support but for

people who can't afford that level um

you know having something at 10 bucks a

month which is what carbon is I mean

that's a you know great option no

definitely and it's got keto application

stuff that I've used it a time pretty

awesome we have a keto option we have a

low carb option we have a low fat option

we have balanced we have plant-based

it's so funny one of the things I tell

people it's like how can you say that

I'm anti- low carb when literally the

only VAR diet variation that has two

options on my app is low

carb you have a fiary obligation to not

be low exactly as always man thanks

brother absolutely