'Attack On Individual Liberty' | Keir Starmer To Potentially Ban Outdoor Smoking
Summary
TLDRIn a heated discussion, the transcript captures the outrage over a potential smoking ban in public places, including pub gardens, as proposed by the new government. The conversation highlights concerns about the impact on hospitality and the perceived authoritarianism of the policy, which was not outlined in the election manifesto. The debate also touches on the broader implications for personal freedoms, the role of civil servants in policy-making, and the government's handling of other pressing issues such as fuel duty hikes and immigration.
Takeaways
- 📰 Jack Elom, the author of the article, believes his recent piece could have significant implications for freedom and the pub industry in the UK.
- 🔒 There is a public outrage over the government's plan to release prisoners early and the potential for increased control over citizens' lives, including restrictions on smoking.
- 🚭 The government is reportedly planning to ban smoking in public places, including pub gardens, which could severely impact the hospitality industry.
- 🗣️ Critics argue that such policies were not part of the election manifesto and question the government's mandate to implement them.
- 🚭🏠 There is a suggestion that pub landlords could make their gardens private parts of their homes to circumvent the smoking ban, although this might require a license.
- 💔 Some listeners express concern that the government's actions are eroding personal freedoms and choice, comparing the restrictions to authoritarian measures.
- 🚬 The debate also touches on the potential for driving tobacco sales into the black market and the unintended consequences of overregulation.
- 🌐 The discussion highlights the government's challenge in balancing public health concerns with individual liberties and the potential backlash from such policies.
- 💡 There is a call for education rather than outright bans as a means to address societal issues like smoking and obesity.
- 📉 The script mentions other policy issues, such as a potential fuel duty hike and the handling of the NHS, which could affect public perception of the government.
- 🤔 There is speculation about the government's strategy and whether the rapid implementation of unpopular policies is a sign of confidence or an attempt to get them 'out of the way' early in the term.
Q & A
What is the main topic of the article written by Jack Elom?
-The main topic of the article is the potential ban on smoking in public places, including pub gardens, and its implications on freedom and the hospitality industry.
What is the significance of the article according to Jack Elom?
-Jack Elom considers the article significant as it discusses seismic consequences for freedom in the country and the beloved Pub industry, which could be severely impacted by the proposed smoking ban.
What is the government's calculation regarding public support for the smoking ban according to the article?
-The government believes that the public will be on their side, as they calculate that only 6 million people in the country smoke, which is about 10%, and therefore 87% of the population does not smoke.
Why was the smoking ban not included in the election manifesto or the King's Speech?
-The article suggests that the smoking ban was not included in the manifesto or the King's Speech, raising questions about the government's mandate for such a policy and its transparency.
What is the potential impact of the smoking ban on hospitality industries?
-The potential impact on hospitality industries could be catastrophic, as they have invested a lot of money in outdoor facilities for smokers, which would become redundant with the ban.
What is the argument against the government's approach to policy-making as discussed in the article?
-The argument against the government's approach is that they are implementing policies that were not part of their election manifesto, which could be seen as underhanded and lacking public mandate.
What is the connection between the smoking ban and the government's stance on other issues like knife crime?
-The connection suggested is that while the government is taking a hard stance on smoking, it appears to be less proactive in dealing with issues like the knife crime epidemic, which raises questions about their priorities and control measures.
What is the potential consequence of driving tobacco into the hands of illegal drug dealers?
-The potential consequence is that overregulation and prohibition of a legal substance could lead to an increase in illegal activities, including firebombings of shops and homes related to tobacco gangs.
What is the alternative approach to dealing with issues like smoking and drinking in society?
-The alternative approach suggested is education and allowing people to make their own decisions, rather than heavy-handed government control and regulation.
What is the criticism of the government's handling of the NHS and public sector pay rises?
-The criticism is that the government appears to be giving in to union demands for large pay rises without a clear plan for how to equitably distribute these increases and manage the budget deficit.
What is the potential impact of a fuel duty hike on the public?
-A fuel duty hike could lead to public discontent, as it goes against the government's pre-election promises not to raise taxes and could disproportionately affect those who rely on cars for transportation.
Outlines
📰 Controversial Government Policy on Smoking and Pub Industry
The first paragraph discusses the impact of a new government policy restricting smoking, which the author, Jack Elom, believes could have significant consequences for personal freedom and the pub industry. The policy is criticized for not being included in the election manifesto, leading to accusations of a lack of public mandate. There's also a debate on the potential negative effects on hospitality businesses and the government's calculation that only 6 million smokers in the country will be affected, versus the 87% who do not smoke. The discussion touches on themes of socialism, control, and personal liberties, with references to potential backlash and the government's strategy for managing public opinion.
🚭 Smoking Ban: Overreach or Public Health Measure?
This paragraph delves into the broader implications of the smoking ban, with the speaker expressing concern over government overreach and the potential for driving tobacco into the black market. The conversation covers the unintended consequences of such policies, including the risk of increased crime and the impact on children. The speakers argue for education over regulation and express skepticism about the government's commitment to reducing smoking as a public health measure, suggesting that it may be more about control than health. The discussion also includes criticism of the government's handling of other issues, such as knife crime and illegal immigration.
🛑 Civil Service Influence and the Role of Government
The third paragraph focuses on the role of civil servants and their influence on government policy. There's a debate about whether ministers are adequately asserting their authority over the civil service, with the suggestion that some policies may be driven more by the civil service than by elected officials. The discussion raises questions about the balance of power and the potential for the civil service to overstep its advisory role, with the speaker advocating for strong leadership from ministers to ensure that political direction is not undermined by unelected officials.
🚬 Public Reaction to Smoking Ban and Government's Approach
In the final paragraph, the conversation shifts to public opinion on the smoking ban and the government's approach to policy-making. There's a range of views expressed, from those who see the ban as an infringement on personal freedoms to others who support it for health reasons. The speakers also discuss the government's handling of other issues, such as fuel duty and union negotiations, suggesting that there may be a disconnect between the government's rhetoric and its actions. The paragraph concludes with a critical assessment of the government's leadership and its ability to manage the challenges it faces.
Mindmap
Keywords
💡Freedom
💡Smoking Ban
💡Hospitality Industry
💡Manifesto
💡Socialism
💡Overregulation
💡Personal Choice
💡Underhanded
💡Civil Service
💡Fuel Duty
💡Strikes
Highlights
Jack Elom discusses the potential seismic consequences of the government's new policies on freedom and the pub industry.
Outrage over the early release of prisoners and the potential for severe punishment for a Facebook comment.
Concerns about the implications of labor policies, including inflation-busting rises for certain professions shortly after taking power.
Debate on personal choice and the government's role in regulating smoking, especially in outdoor public spaces.
Criticism of the government's approach to tackling obesity and the NHS, suggesting a focus on education rather than regulation.
Jack Elom reveals he received government documents exposing a plan that has been in the works for some time.
The government's calculation that only 6 million people in the country smoke, suggesting a belief that the public will side with them.
Potential catastrophic effects on the hospitality industry due to new regulations on smoking areas.
Criticism that the smoking ban was not part of the election manifesto, questioning the government's mandate for such policies.
Suggestion that the government is using the smoking ban to generate revenue by driving smokers to illegal tobacco products.
Concerns about the potential for increased crime and violence in the black market due to over-regulation of tobacco.
Argument that education, not prohibition, is the key to addressing societal issues like smoking and drinking.
Speculation about the government's motives for implementing unpopular policies early in their term.
Discussion on the role of civil servants in shaping government policy and the need for ministers to assert their authority.
Concerns about the impact of a potential fuel duty hike on the general public, especially considering pre-election promises.
Criticism of the government's handling of illegal immigration and the effectiveness of their proposed solutions.
Debate on whether the government's actions are driven by a plan or by a need to appease various factions within the party.
Listeners' opinions on the smoking ban, reflecting a range of views on personal freedom and government regulation.
Transcripts
this is drive time we get the man who
wrote the article Jack elom good
afternoon afternoon Jeremy this only
came about my friends because Jack
texted me last night and said don't
speak to me now I'm drunk but I've
written this article front page I'll
come on tomorrow and here I am you know
good man you look a bit worse for w
watch this response is this your first
ever front
page K SM I've been on various of your
shows before talking about my front
pages this is this is wi in a long line
but I think actually you know what it
could be um the most important way have
ever written because it does have
seismic consequences not just for
freedom in the country but also for our
beloved Pub industry if you've heard
anything today its Hospitality bosses
saying this is going to absolutely
[ __ ] us so you maybe we can get into
some of that but yeah it's it's very big
news today it's really interesting um we
we I mean we haven't spoken for a while
um absolute outrage not just about this
but over the last few weeks and I was
going to ask this from a political
standpoint because so many people saying
so let me get this right they're going
to release prisoners early let me get
this right you can be given 15 months in
prison for a Facebook comment let me get
this absolutely right you can be a
doctor or I don't know a train driver
and get a inflation busting rise within
weeks of labor being in power yes we're
all really surprised I'm not surprised
this what socialism is about they will
next tax middle England but this is to
me an even bigger attempt at not our
Liberty but but but too much control
listen everybody knows have the
occasional cigarette I absolutely know
I'm that old that even I can remember I
mean how bad is this smoking on planes I
I don't believe there's a place for
smoking in that instance anymore I think
it's great it's not inside pubs and in
restaurants and rooms where people don't
like it but if you are telling average
people that they can't go outside to a a
Hut that's made for a cigarette personal
choice right seriously and and if you
want to take me on about the NHS secure
starma I'll tell you what do something
about fat Britain because that obesity
which is an epidemic we were talking
about it yesterday on the show is also
relevant but of course all the do
gooders will jump up down and say
smoking's appalling so yes it probably
is but we're also surely not at a point
where we're not able to choose anything
anymore under this government no the um
the government documents which um which
I received and have written about did
you get how did you get this story I you
know it passed passed to me by a source
but I can't I can't I don't know the
stor but it was passed to you it's a
very important story yeah yeah yeah um
you know I've got I have seen um lot of
uh government documents um which um
expose this plan uh in full um something
which the government seems to be working
on for some time um it's completely uh
almost certainly uh fleshed out in this
plan uh it makes clear that the
government believes that the public will
be on their side when they announce this
um they are making the calculation that
only 6 million people in this country
smoke so that's about 133% and therefore
87% do not smoke the problem I think a
lot of people having today one is the
catastrophic potentially effect on
hospitality industries which have
invested a lot of money and have spent
money on making all these outdo but also
the fact that I think people will ask if
you were so confident in this public
position then why on Earth one wasn't in
your election Manifesto and why wasn't
it in The King's Speech when this bill
came forward only a few weeks ago
because what they've done with this bill
is they presented it in Parliament not
too long ago and now very quickly they
have massively ramped it up without
anybody knowing about it until we
revealed it on the front page of the sun
today it's really interesting to me
because um you know if we get away from
I'm I'm shocked that people couldn't see
through the Socialist angle of this
government we're talking about Liberty
here right we're talking we're talking
about I mean here's a really good
message here from Christen Newbery J of
smokers could hit back at starmer as
early as tomorrow stop smoking and deny
the treasury billions it's not even that
for me I'm talking about free Choice are
you telling me that you want to live in
a country where you are not allowed to
do I I honestly it begs the question how
much more Jack was not in the in the
manifesto that's going to be foed upon
this country in a in a really underhand
W and I can't believe this is only two
months in and that's the point a lot of
critics are making today is the fact
that if this wasn't in the manifesto
then you don't really have a mandate for
it now often governments do things you
know which they you know don't believe
they Manifesto but it's usually much
further along in the parliament well
somebody said to me yesterday is he
doing it now because there's a massive
bounce because he's going to get the
unpopular things out the way I'll tell
you what I'd like to watch and listen to
uh Nigel farage have a listen this was
his
response it's not n statism it's
authoritarianism it is you know I know
what is best for you and you will damn
well do it and what I'm going to do is
I'm going to take your legal activity
and make it illegal I mean that's really
what they're saying here a smoke free
Britain by 2030 really will it be drugs
free by 2030 will it be obesity free
will it be alcoholism free I mean look
you know this is a massive overreach by
government I I I lo these people and
their very instincts if you
overregulation
prescribe and over tax the product you
basically Drive something that is legal
into the hands of those that deal in
illegal drugs there have been 97
firebombings of shops and homes in
Melbourne in the last two years alone
between Waring tobacco gangs it's just
astonishing so I think there's a you
know a real danger here that you
effectively Drive tobacco into the arms
of a drug dealers you make it a
prohibited substance uh sunak was on the
same course as well and you finish up
with a law of unintended consequences
also do we want our kids to smoke no ex
do we want our kids to drink too much no
we don't want any of these things youve
got to do it by education let people
make their own decision I love it the
only person ever that has managed to do
an hour a minute and a half on this
station and not let Julia heartley
Brewer n but he's right over regulation
control of Our Lives I I think that that
what amazes me from a political point of
view is that that starma must be very
sure of his position to be bringing in
these sorts of things so quickly because
this is going to go down in a in a
particularly bad way in my humble
opinion yeah he is massive majority no
one in his back bench is going to kick
up a fuss about it thing is that he
stood in the steps of Downing Street in
his first speech as prime minister and
one of the things that stood out because
it seemed to like differentiate him from
like previous labor Prime Ministers and
what you expect labor Prime Ministers to
say is he said I'm going to lead a
government which Treads more lightly on
your lives I.E I'm not going to encroach
and and and infringe on you you know
we're going to go back to small statism
and people thought people sat up when he
said that because that's not a thing you
often hear labor people saying now that
he's come and done this today it seems
that this flies in the face of what he
said uh only a few months ago when he
won that election and it's either one of
two things it's either like you said he
is getting decisions which he believes
in but are inevitably unpopular out of
the way early or is this the thin end of
the wedge as ndel farage believes and
we're going to get down a slippery slope
of just Banning Banning Banning more
things I'm not sure that he has a plan I
think this is I I think a bit like the
doctors and the pay rise to aslef it's
all part of I said it to you before the
tent is so large to to have got him
elected in the first place I think he's
paying off whether it's the unions with
a pay rise or the left who want to
control everything we do I think this
will be a seminal moment and people will
laugh at me and go come on he's around
for 5 years by God if you listening Ryan
she's good this Jody got a voice now
already uh Deb's on the Smoky Bango hey
Jeremy is this not going to kill the
hospitality industry even more this is
just mad where are we supposed to
socialize if we the generation that are
still allowed to smoke where are we
supposed to meet and socialize with each
other it's just barking it's it's I mean
she's nailed it hasn't she yeah and I
think that the problem with a big impact
on hospitality is that yes you can make
the argument that only minority people
now smoke but if you have one smoker B
wers tell me the minorities are
important unless you know somebody said
something to me the other day about
starma and about prisons they only they
don't like prison they don't think it's
good enough we should rehabilitate
prisons but they're happy to people they
don't like to prison this is exactly the
same they'll stick up for every minority
but if you choose to smoke or you choose
to have a drink let me tell you
something else why is he not out there
dealing with a knife epidemic he had his
militia on the streets quick enough for
the riots and quite right too but
nothing happened in Notting Hill let's
not go there again but there's a knife
epidemic and his answer is to say I'll
give you a tener for a zombie knife this
is control in its most direct sense
isn't it yeah um you know people are
going to be incredibly angry about this
today uh you know it's a it I think it's
what a lot of people expected them to do
not not terms of the policy itself
absolutely no way there was not even
sort of squeak of that in the manifesto
or during the campaign and that's lying
essentially isn't it well you know it's
um yeah it's probably it's probably you
know not being honest at best and and
deceitful at worst because you know I
don't think anyone believes that they've
just conjured this up in the past uh few
weeks or so they might be something
they've been planning for a while what I
think actually do know I think the
various administrations have been under
pressure by uh elements of the Civil
Service to implement similar policies
hold a second hold a second the Civil
Service want this I think that has been
sort of recommended to
by you see like like the last government
uh decided on Rwanda not my idea of a
good plan and civil servants who
taxpayers pay to do their jobs decided
that they didn't like Rwanda so they
used our money to take the Democratic
elected government to to to court you're
telling me that you think I mean here's
a question surely you're you're a
political correspondent is it not true
in this country now that civil servants
have too much power should a government
not take them on and try and change or
is that never going to change well
listen like you know it's the always the
old adage isn't it um advisor advise and
ministers decide so the buck does stop
with ministers it's whether or not you
have ministers who are um competent
enough and bold enough to stamp their
Authority on White Hall itself like I
think that there are many hardworking
civil servants who make the Machinery of
government sing and uh you know we we we
do need them but when you have when you
come in there with a political Direction
as a government you need you need to be
the one as the minister who is you know
having having a firm hand on the tiller
because otherwise you might have civil
servants maybe over overreaching a bit
um it's an amazing article no cigarettes
and alcohol ban on smoking in Pub
Gardens and public places they are
ladies and gentlemen that's Kier starm
let's talk more about him drivers
prepared and warned uh to get ready for
a fuel Duty hike in painful budget
that's a surprise we will not raise
taxes no income tax no vat no money back
no whatever but we are going to screw
what is it 30,000 motorist 7 I don't
know how many 30,000 million 30 million
voters in this country again I think the
argument is perfectly feasible I mean we
all could see through it but how many of
the electorate believed the BS that came
out of his mouth and within two short
months bit of a problem that's going to
be that's going to be a problem for
everybody isn't it I think if he puts up
fuel Duty in any way at the budget then
people are going to be incredibly
grieved because we've we've got the
receipts from the election campaign
where people like me were interviewing
senior Labor uh figures and they all but
confirmed they wouldn't explicitly
confirm but all but wink wink nudge
nudge you know this is not going to
happen we are going to keep fueld duty
Frozen wreting told me that our campaign
the sun's long running campaign to keep
fuel Duty down will be pushing out an
Open Door under the labor government and
now and also remember the fact that they
said they wouldn't raise taxes on
working people now they've sort of now
pigeon ho that into vat income tax
National Insurance millions of workers
use cars to get to their office every
single day and you know the RAC had a
really interesting report yesterday
showing that we are still not getting
value for money at the petrol pumps you
know we have greedy for for courts and
retailers who are still not bringing
down and passing on price Falls um from
wholesale costs and so I think if you if
if you you sting drivers even more then
it's going to be uh it's going to be
incred fin can't smoke you can commit a
crime and if you say sorry released
right you you I mean what's this other
thing woeful budgeting behind 7.6
billion Asylum overspend that's not his
government that's the past government
and governments but that that's another
thing about stama I know how to stop the
boats do you how you can do that I'm
going to attack The Gangs I'm going to
create a bordar two months in no borders
are uh two months in 7,000 people have
crossed the channel he hasn't got any
more answers than the last lot has he I
mean I think the honey and I'm not just
saying it I think the honeymoon period
is well and truly over for saki stama
yeah I mean that's that's a very good
argument he has probably had one of the
shortest Hyman periods of a long time um
he's obviously I do I do think that he
has inherited a mess with a lot of with
a lot of things like especially when it
comes to Illegal immigration right you
know for for we are currently tracking
above any other year in terms of Boat
Crossings you and that happened under
the Tories they made a bit of progress
last year sticking up for the Tes bit of
progress last year but in the past six
months it's been awful M I'm not
sticking up for them at all but if you
get voted in by saying
I'm going to sort this and you don't and
you also get voted in without saying
some of the things that you're going to
slip under the counter I think it's a
recipe for disaster back to your amazing
story Colin Meister Pub landlords could
make their Gardens private part of their
home and then invite people into the
domestic Gardens as friends I mean you
probably need to get a license for it
but says I bloody well warn people not
to vote for labor or reform at this
election as this would allow these
socialists to gain power my God what a
mistake what's going to happen next I
think people are genuinely waking up and
saying what this you've created Madness
Gary voice note go hi Jeremy it's quite
clear labor want us out of pubs we can
talk too much and get our own ideas in
there they want us in front of the TV
where they can TV program us wow Jack
yeah I mean I think I think Kia starm is
actually known to like a point in his
local pub I think so but he's not a smok
he didn't get done for that did he like
Boris Johnson did got away with that in
Durham because he was working although
he was in somebody's house do you
believe just one thing before you skid
Adel and we're so grateful for you being
on what when he stood in the garden the
other day he talked about medicine and
it's going to be hard and all that um do
you believe he's got a plan or do you
think that he's so busy being dictated
to the different factions inside his
party and doing stuff that will
alleviate any pressure and Curry favor
for one of a better phrase do you think
he's got a plan do you think he's that
sort of leader like Thatcher or Blair
who says this is what's needed this is
what I'm going to do think he a
conviction politician it's interesting
isn't it because a lot of people thought
when he was in opposition that he would
almost say anything to get elected I
agree and therefore you know he didn't
really star rism in a sense didn't
really exist I think there is sort of
more of a uh philosophy underlying it he
clearly talks about public service a lot
um but I do also appreciate I think he's
had the Inay from hell when he came in
here you know he had a lot of strikes he
had uh you awful NHS waiting list he he
had boats all well I'm talking about a
plan is if you talk about a 22 million
pound black hole on day one if you give
22% to doctors having nurses only got 5%
last year and 15% to asle you are saying
to your union pay masters line up roll
up I'll give you whatever and how do you
managed to equate that to the British
people we 22 billion no I'm not saying
he's handled it perfectly by by any
means and you one of the questions I
asked him at that press conference uh on
on Tuesday was having you basically
opened yourself up now especially with
the unions to playing throughout the
rest of your presip because what did he
say he said I don't think so because I'm
going to be tough with the unions you
know I didn't give them everything they
wanted well some people might say that
yeah you didn't give them the 35% the
Jor doctors they wanted but you gave
them 22% you didn't give aslef the the
uh you know the sort of the millions
they wanted but you still gave them the
Hefty sum and then a few days later said
they were going to strike again so you
know that seems to a backfire quite
spectacularly um I think going forward
now I think he needs to sort of really
show and demonstrate to people that he's
not just going to especially with that
side of thing the unions roll over and
Cave he can speak as he can call himself
tough as much as he wants but you know
we know that went Fred Miller Band you
know you have to actually show your
tough by your actions not by your words
and I think that that's what people are
going to be looking for real response to
this Pete Jolly I've never smoked and I
find it a really antisocial habit but
it's a legal product and telling people
where and when they're allowed to do a
legal thing is tantamount to Communism
adults should be free to indulge in any
Vice they like if it's legal Paula mayy
from Brighton the smoking ban just might
be the only thing thus far that I agree
with this government I have extreme
sensitivity to cigarette smoke and have
to deal with people smoking underneath
my window all day every single time
despite the no smoking signs I'm fly
five floors up but it still seeps into
my flat interesting interesting people
will have their opinions I don't
disagree with Paula but I do think
you're in trouble I do think you're in
trouble if you start to say to the
British people you can't say that you
can't write this you can't have that
cigarette you can't have more than one
Pine because the one thing about this
country is we're supposed to be it's
Freedom Liberty democracy all those
sorts of things great article what what
you know really really like if you
haven't bought it today Jack El from the
front no cigarettes and alcohol by the
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