Alex Gorsky on Leadership Challenges at Johnson & Johnson
Summary
TLDRIn this insightful conversation, Alex Gorsky, CEO and Chairman of Johnson & Johnson, discusses the complexities of leadership, particularly the challenging decisions that impact employees and families. Gorsky emphasizes the importance of assembling the right team, fostering open debate, and considering diverse perspectives to ensure well-thought-out decisions. He also highlights the evolution of his leadership style, moving from working through others to understanding the global implications of decisions. Furthermore, Gorsky stresses the significance of developing future leaders and the enduring values of Johnson & Johnson's Credo in guiding the company's ethical and cultural compass.
Takeaways
- 😀 Alex Gorsky, CEO of Johnson & Johnson, emphasizes the importance of making tough decisions with care, empathy, and a well-thought-out process.
- 🤔 Gorsky highlights the significance of having the right team to support decision-making and fostering an environment for debate and challenge within the company.
- 🔄 He discusses the evolution of his leadership style, moving from individual contribution to working through others, considering global impacts, and predicting strategic implications.
- 🌐 Gorsky underscores the global impact of decisions, noting that every decision can affect various locations from Mumbai to Miami.
- 💡 He shares an example of challenging the status quo by asking a law firm to argue the opposite point of view to ensure thorough consideration of all implications.
- 🛡 The CEO talks about his experience with the U.S. Military Academy at West Point and how it influenced his leadership approach, especially in terms of service to stakeholders.
- 🌟 Gorsky expresses pride in developing leaders and the importance he places on a leader's track record in nurturing future talent.
- 🤝 He stresses the importance of a leader's commitment to high performance, development of future leaders, and alignment with the company's credo.
- 👥 Gorsky advises new leaders to be authentic, embrace humility, and understand that making mistakes is part of the growth process.
- 📜 He addresses the importance of the Johnson & Johnson Credo, which has guided the company for over 70 years and continues to be a moral compass for decision-making.
- 🔄 Gorsky discusses the process of keeping the Credo relevant, including Credo challenge sessions to ensure its principles remain integral to the company's culture and operations.
Q & A
What is the primary challenge Alex Gorsky has faced in his role as CEO of Johnson & Johnson?
-The primary challenge Alex Gorsky has faced is making significant organizational and people changes within the company, especially those that can impact employees and their families.
How does Alex Gorsky approach decision-making in a large company like Johnson & Johnson?
-Alex Gorsky approaches decision-making by ensuring he has the right team around him, fostering an atmosphere of debate and challenge, and encouraging diversity of opinion, even to the point of having people argue the opposite of the proposed direction.
Can you provide an example of how Alex Gorsky stimulated diverse opinions during a decision-making process?
-Alex Gorsky once asked the chief counsel to have a law firm argue the opposite point of view on a product recommendation, ensuring that all implications were thoroughly considered before making a decision.
How has Alex Gorsky's leadership style evolved over his career at Johnson & Johnson?
-Alex Gorsky's leadership style has evolved to focus more on working through others, understanding the global impact of decisions, and predicting strategic implications for the long-term sustainability of the company.
What is the most significant myth about leadership that Alex Gorsky believes people often get wrong?
-The most significant myth is the belief that the top leader is there to just make decisions, rather than being in service to those who will be impacted by those decisions.
What advice does Alex Gorsky have for new leaders stepping into significant leadership roles?
-Alex Gorsky advises new leaders to be themselves, approach their roles with humility, understand that they will make mistakes, and learn to care for the people working with them.
What is the importance of the Credo at Johnson & Johnson, and how does it guide the company's decisions?
-The Credo serves as a moral compass and a guide for the company's decisions, outlining responsibilities to various stakeholders and emphasizing service to customers, employees, communities, and shareholders.
How does Johnson & Johnson ensure that the Credo remains relevant and alive within the organization?
-Johnson & Johnson ensures the Credo's relevance through town hall meetings, outreach programs, and Credo challenge sessions, where the document is reviewed line by line to maintain its significance in decision-making.
What is Alex Gorsky's view on the role of a leader in developing other leaders within an organization?
-Alex Gorsky believes that a leader's ability to develop other leaders is a key indicator of their effectiveness, and he focuses on their track record of performance, people development, and alignment with the company's Credo.
How does Alex Gorsky define success or accomplishment in his career at Johnson & Johnson?
-Alex Gorsky defines success as the ability to develop great leaders who have taken on significant responsibilities within and outside Johnson & Johnson, and who have made a positive impact on patients and consumers.
Outlines
😇 Leadership and Decision-Making at Johnson & Johnson
In this segment, Alex Gorsky, CEO and Chairman of Johnson & Johnson, discusses the challenges of making tough decisions, especially those affecting employees and their families. He emphasizes the importance of having the right team, fostering an environment of debate and challenge, and ensuring a diversity of opinions. Gorsky shares an example of seeking an opposing legal opinion to strengthen their decision-making process. He also talks about the evolution of his leadership style, moving from an individual contributor to leading a large organization, and the importance of considering the global impact of decisions.
🌐 Evolving Leadership and Global Impact
Alex Gorsky reflects on his leadership journey, highlighting the shift from individual contributions to working through others. He stresses the need for managers to learn how to lead effectively by leveraging the skills of their team members. Gorsky also discusses the evolution of his leadership approach, particularly the growing awareness of the global impact of decisions made at Johnson & Johnson. He talks about the importance of considering the long-term strategic implications of decisions, not just the immediate effects, and the responsibility to future generations, given the company's long history.
🛠 Developing Leaders and the Importance of the Credo
Gorsky shares his insights on identifying and developing future leaders, focusing on their performance, their track record in developing other leaders, and their alignment with Johnson & Johnson's Credo. He explains how he assesses potential leaders by their ability to develop talent and their commitment to the company's values. The conversation also touches on common misconceptions about leadership, with Gorsky emphasizing the service-oriented nature of his role and the importance of decisions being in service to various stakeholders. He discusses his pride in the leaders he has helped develop and the satisfaction derived from knowing the company's products and services contribute to healthier lives.
👋 Advice for New Leaders and the Enduring Credo
Alex Gorsky offers advice for new leaders, encouraging them to be authentic, embrace humility, and understand that they will make mistakes. He stresses the importance of learning and caring for the people they work with. Gorsky also addresses the significance of Johnson & Johnson's Credo, which has guided the company for over 70 years. He talks about the importance of keeping the Credo relevant and alive within the organization, ensuring it serves as a moral compass and unifying force. The conversation concludes with Gorsky's commitment to upholding the values and culture of Johnson & Johnson.
Mindmap
Keywords
💡Leadership
💡Decision-making
💡Organizational Change
💡Stakeholders
💡Empathy
💡Diversity of Opinion
💡Credo
💡Global Impact
💡Strategic Implications
💡Leadership Development
💡Humility
Highlights
Alex Gorsky discusses the challenge of making significant organizational and people changes, emphasizing the need for thought, care, and empathy in such decisions.
Gorsky highlights the importance of having the right team and encouraging a diversity of opinion to reach well-rounded decisions.
He shares an example of bringing in external counsel to argue the opposite viewpoint on a major product decision, enhancing confidence in their final choice.
Gorsky reflects on his leadership evolution, from leading no one to managing a large organization, and the importance of working through others to achieve goals.
He emphasizes the global impact of decisions made at the top, considering the implications for a wide range of stakeholders across the world.
Gorsky discusses the need to predict the strategic implications of decisions, looking beyond immediate impacts to long-term consequences.
He values leaders with a track record of developing other leaders, viewing it as a key indicator of leadership quality.
Gorsky talks about the misconception that top leaders simply make decisions, instead of serving those impacted by their decisions.
He expresses pride in the leaders he has helped develop, noting their positive impact within Johnson & Johnson and beyond.
For new leaders, Gorsky advises being authentic, embracing humility, and being willing to learn from mistakes.
He stresses the importance of maintaining high ethical standards and values, as outlined in Johnson & Johnson's credo.
Gorsky mentions Johnson & Johnson's credo challenge sessions, where the relevance of the credo is regularly assessed and reinforced.
He explains that the credo serves as a moral compass and unifying force for the organization, guiding decision-making.
Gorsky underscores the significance of sustaining a strong company culture and values, particularly in a global context.
He concludes by emphasizing the role of leaders in upholding company values and leading with a service-oriented mindset.
Transcripts
this is my q-see mime with my colleague
Adam grant and today we're going to talk
with Alex Gorsky chief executive and
chair of the board of Johnson & Johnson
a company with about a hundred and
thirty thousand employees it's part of
the Dow Jones Industrial Average annual
revenue somewhere north of seventy
billion dollars in two hundred and fifty
companies around the world Alex welcome
and today I'm going to just jump right
in with a question about some of the
tougher decisions you've made in fact
let me make it the toughest decision
that you made in the last year so if you
could just describe the decision what
were the conflicting concerns and then
how did you work that one through given
the fact that you lead a rather large
company well you might Adam thank you
first of all very much for having me
here and on behalf of all the employees
of Johnson and Johnson I'm really proud
to be here to be able to talk to you
about some of the issues and thank you
for all the things that you're doing
here at Wharton you Mike fortunately or
unfortunately during my career I've had
a chance to be part of some pretty
significant decisions along the way be
it strategic business operational but
I've got to say I think some of the most
challenging and probably the most
challenging has been as it relates to
very significant organizational and
people changes within our company and
particularly when you know that this is
something that can impact employees
future that can affect families those
are things that you always want to do
with a lot of thought with a lot of care
and a lot of empathy and so though those
types of decisions for me personally
have always been some of the most
challenging and there's a few things
that we try to do obviously the first is
make sure that you've got the right team
around you you know somebody the
decisions that ultimately and they're
what line their way to me have by and
large been decided by a great group of
leaders who have a tremendous amount of
responsibility in terms of their
businesses and the organizations that
they represent - it's to make sure that
as you're going through and making those
decisions that you provide an atmosphere
where you can really have debate where
you can really have challenge where
there's not just a preordained recommend
a
and frankly we're one plus one can equal
four or five in the whole
decision-making process and I've always
found that encouraging a diversity of
opinion by different members sometimes
even challenging people to come in and
argue the opposite of the direction that
we're heading to really make sure that
you've thought through the implications
and then last but not least it's once
you've made that decision recognizing
that there's going to be different
points of view of getting full alignment
around your leadership team said that
you had you're speaking then in one
voice and in a common direction and you
know that's what I've seen be some of
the one of the biggest challenges but
that's the way that we tried to deal
with it to make sure that you know we're
ultimately making the best decisions for
the company and all of our stakeholders
great thank you Alex Alex is there an
example that stands out particularly
when it comes to challenging people to
bring different opinions or maybe even
argue for the opposite of what they
believe where you're able to stimulate
that and it had a positive effect yeah
you know there's I've had a number along
the way but I think you know one in
particular is that for me you know
related to you know one of our products
where we were making a specific
recommendation about it on the market
and there's a lot of pressure tied to
the issue and right before we actually
made that decision I remember calling
our chief counsel that night and I said
you know I'd like you to talk to a law
firm and actually have them argue the
opposite point of view so we actually
want X outside the company you know and
had them and what I found through that
process was we we ended up staying in
the right decision but it made sure that
I think we had much more confidence and
conviction in the particular position
that we took by taking that pause you
know I think that as a senior executive
yes you want to be decisive but you also
got to realize the impact that your
decisions can have and so I think taking
that extra moment having that extra
challenge is good practice Alex you came
out of the US Military Academy at West
Point took a job pretty much at the
ground level in a unit at Johnson &
Johnson and in your first job as I
recall you led nobody you were pretty
much on your own but you moved up 3303
thousand and now 130,000 question about
how you've had to change your leadership
style going from nobody to a few than a
lot and now over a hundred thousand how
was your thinking about leadership
evolved what's different now from the
way you would have led save ten years
ago and the way you operate sure Mike
well your leadership does need to evolve
as you move through an organization and
I think there's a lot of lessons you
learn some that I've learned along the
way is number one is learning the
importance of it's not really what I do
but it's about what the people who you
work with do and working through others
I think that's one of the biggest
challenges facing managers learning that
skill where you're no longer the
individual contributor but you're
contributing by bringing together a
group of people who have different
skills different capabilities and
working through them to accomplish a
particular task and I see that as you
know being a significant challenge
facing many leaders as they move through
an organization that was certainly one
for me the second one is really
understanding the global impact of your
decision when you're starting in one
particular area and you have a rather
local impact to today where every
decision you have can have an impact
globally you know from Mumbai to
Minneapolis from Warsaw you know to
Miami and always considering what that
true global impact of a particular
decision can be and I would say last but
not least it's about you know always
trying to predict what the strategic
implications are so what are the second
or third order consequences of a
particular decision versus the immediate
impact you know Johnson & Johnson for
Singh is a company that's been around
for over 126 years and I'm always trying
to think about what is it over the next
ten years not the next just one year or
two years and certainly there's always
an issue de jour that we're working on
but I'm trying to think about what it
were the decisions that we can make what
are the directions we can go that is
going to continue our track record of
sustainability for the next decade for
the for the next hundred years right
Alex you're known not only at some
cares a lot about developing leaders but
also about your leaders developing
leaders below them how do you figure out
one who those people are that are likely
to be good at leadership development and
and two what do you actually teach them
yeah that's a great question and I do
believe that one of the best indicators
of leadership is a leaders track record
in developing leaders and I will
frequently focus on three areas when I'm
interviewing or what I'm talking to
people and one is certainly on
performance because you always want to
have leaders who are committed to high
performance and good markets bad markets
diverse global markets handling a wide
range of different scenarios secondly I
always focus on what's their track
record of developing future leaders and
one of my favorite questions is to ask
people and name the three or four
leaders that if I went out and asked you
know them who had the biggest impact on
their career and how they do that who
are those four people that you would
name in at a senior level if they can't
name three or four fairly senior level
people then immediately I question their
wherewithal in people development and
last I'll ask how do they move their
businesses how do they develop talent
with our credo in mind and so for me it
gives me an indication of how committed
they are to developing individuals to
developing teams you know and frankly
figuring out how to work through others
to get their jobs done
you know Alex's people look at a high
office whether community the mayor
company chief executive the country the
president people are looking in and
sometimes their perceptions are on the
money and sometimes they're wrong being
inside that room at Johnson & Johnson
what do you think is the perception of
leadership in general maybe leadership
in particular in your own experience
that turns out to be most incorrect
where do people looking at leaders often
not see what's really there the way they
ought to well I think that one of the
one of the most significant myths about
leadership is that you know the top
leader is there then to just make the
decision versus taking much more of a
service-oriented protein
you're in service to many of those who
in fact are going to be impacted by your
decision and you know I can tell you
right now that I i definitely approach
the job from the latter and always
trying to understand the consequences
the implications that your decisions are
going to have on your different
stakeholders ranging from customers the
communities that you work in your
shareholders your employees all the
people that you know that might be
touched and and learning at the end of
the day we're really in service to them
and that the jobs that we do the roles
that we whole have got to be ultimately
to helping all of those stakeholders
realize their objectives and and I think
you know frequently it's it's not about
that the quote boss making a certain
decision is about the decisions we make
in service of those stakeholders that's
really important so it's building on
that what is the success or
accomplishment of your career that
you're most proud of you know I think
the the thing that I'm most proud of are
the great leaders that I've had a chance
to work with along the way who have gone
on to take great positions of
responsibility and frankly make a
difference within J&J and of course in
other areas as well you know I've had
the opportunity to work with a broad
number of people through my you know
several decades now and frankly starting
with my time in the military
starting with my time as a coach with my
son's teams to my time Johnson & Johnson
some time at Novartis as well there's
nothing that gives me greater
satisfaction than knowing that people
have been able to go on and frankly do a
lot of good things for patients for
consumers along the way that's a great
deal of satisfaction and of course most
importantly just knowing that the
products and the services that we're
offering every day hopefully are helping
people live longer healthier and happier
lives that that's a great sense of
satisfaction Alex a question for people
who are just coming into leadership
responsibilities so think about the
first job when you had a response
for others I think maybe even later on
but especially for those who are first
taking on a significant leadership role
from your own experience what are the
one or two lines of advice that you like
to pass on to them so they can get to
where they want to get to and taking on
that leadership obligation
look I didn't a couple of things one I
would say is it's really important for
early leaders is to be themselves you
know so often leaders get into a role
and they maybe have some idea of what it
is to be a leader that they try to be
and I think the most important thing
that a new leader can have stepping into
a role is humility is understanding that
they're going to learn that they're
going to make mistakes and to you know
approach the scenarios something where
they're going to have to grow into and
and I think having that kind of a
mindset will immediately endear the
people who are working with you and
around you they're not looking for a
perfect leader they want a leader that
cares about them is going to help them
try to be better and I think as a new
leader if you remember that that they
expect you to be human that you're going
to make mistakes and that as long as you
learn and care for the people who are
working with you I think that's the most
important thing that you can do quick
final add-on question on that as you
come to lead more and more people
high-touch becomes more difficult
you've got people all over the world and
thus the tone you set at the top the
culture the ethics the values become
critical Johnson & Johnson has a very
famous crate o 300 and a few words that
say we're here on earth to serve people
that need our products great community
great employment setting and then we
work for shareholders as well when I was
in your headquarters a couple years ago
I noticed that that crate o is carved in
stone on the main floor of headquarters
what happens if you want to change the
crate oh well look Mike as you know that
the the crate o is our aspiration of
Johnson & Johnson written over 70 years
ago by General Robert Wood Johnson
himself it's been a great source of
inspiration
and it does outline our responsibilities
to our different stakeholders all that
you mentioned customers employees
communities as well as you know
shareholders ultimately and and in
through the years there been a few times
when it has been updated but the core
principles are something that we don't
think should change and you know as I
stepped into this role just as my
predecessors I think one of the first
things we've always tried to do Israel's
embodied in that document now I think as
as we what's more important for me as in
the organization is how we bring that
cradle to life and how do you make sure
that every day when decisions are made
in many different areas around the world
and different business organizations
that the cradle remains kind of our
moral compass the glue that holds us
together and that's something that we
constantly reinforce through town hall
meetings through outreach programs in
fact just this year is the 70th
anniversary of our credo we're having a
credo challenge sessions where every
board the 250 companies that you
mentioned earlier is challenging the
relevance of our credo and going through
it line by line and I think it's through
that is you keep that alive in the
organization again which we think is
incredibly important to make sure that
we do the right thing it's all about
leading people it's all about leading
values and it's all about sustaining
their cultures so Alex thank you for
joining us today we really appreciate it
thanks very much thank you Mike thank
you Anna thanks Alex
you
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