61. Pigeons | The Economics of Everyday Things

Summary

This transcript explores the relationship between pigeons and humans, particularly focusing on urban environments where pigeons are seen as pests. Dave Champagne, owner of Bird Busters, helps businesses in San Francisco combat pigeon infestations. The transcript delves into the historical significance of pigeons, from their ancient domestication and use in wars to modern pigeon racing and their ability to navigate. Despite their reputation as 'rats of the sky,' pigeons are resilient, intelligent creatures, and companies like Bird Busters aim to humanely manage their presence in cities.

Takeaways

• 🕊️ Pigeons are considered one of the most notorious pests in cities like San Francisco, causing damage with their acidic droppings.
• 🐦 Dave Champagne, owner of Bird Busters, Inc., specializes in humane pigeon removal and prevention, highlighting the smart and tenacious nature of pigeons.
• 🌆 It's estimated that over 8 million pigeons live in North American cities, particularly in urban centers where they roost and gather in large flocks.
• 🏛️ Historically, pigeons were revered and even worshipped, with their domestication dating back 10,000 years to Mesopotamia.
• 📜 Pigeons were used for message delivery due to their homing abilities, playing a crucial role in communication before the telegraph.
• 🏆 Pigeons have been honored for their service in wars, with some receiving the highest military honors for animals, like the Dickin Medal.
• 💰 Pigeon racing is a big business, especially in Asia, where top racing pigeons can sell for millions of dollars.
• 🥇 Pigeons have exceptional athletic abilities, including flying for up to 16 hours straight and reaching speeds of 60 MPH.
• 🌐 Cities around the world spend millions on pigeon control measures due to the structural and health hazards they pose.
• 🔄 Modern pigeon control focuses on humane removal and prevention methods, such as netting, spikes, and bird track systems, rather than killing the birds.

Q & A

Who is Dave Champagne, and what is his business?

Dave Champagne is the owner of Bird Busters, Incorporated, a company that specializes in bird control. His business primarily deals with pigeons, helping cities and businesses remove and prevent pigeon infestations.

Why are pigeons considered a nuisance in urban areas?

Pigeons are considered a nuisance because they gather in large flocks, roost on buildings, and produce acidic droppings that damage structures, car paint, and solar panels. Their poop can also pose health risks due to bacteria and fungi.

What historical significance do pigeons have?

Pigeons have been domesticated for over 10,000 years, used as food, messengers, and even worshipped as fertility goddesses in ancient times. They were also used in wartime communications and were celebrated for their intelligence and homing abilities.

How did pigeons contribute to wartime efforts?

Pigeons played a crucial role in wartime by delivering messages across enemy lines. For instance, during World War I, the U.S. had a dedicated pigeon corps, and pigeons like Cher Ami and G.I. Joe saved many lives by delivering critical messages under dangerous conditions.

Why do pigeons thrive in cities like San Francisco and New York?

Pigeons thrive in cities because they are highly adaptable, find plenty of ledges to roost on, and have access to food discarded by humans. Cities mimic their natural cliff environments, and pigeons can breed year-round, contributing to their large populations.

What methods do companies like Bird Busters use to control pigeon populations?

Bird Busters uses a variety of methods to control pigeons, including netting, spikes, bird wire, and electric tracks that give pigeons a small zap when they land. These methods aim to prevent pigeons from roosting without harming them.

How do pigeons navigate and find their way home?

Pigeons have an extraordinary sense of direction, likely due to tiny bits of magnetite in their brains that help them detect the Earth's magnetic field. This allows them to return home over long distances, sometimes flying up to 1,000 miles without stopping.

What was the role of pigeons in the development of the Reuters news service?

In 1851, Paul Julius Reuter used pigeons to bridge a communication gap between Brussels and Berlin, delivering stock prices over 400 miles. This innovative use of pigeons helped establish Reuters as a leading news service.

Why do some people view pigeons more favorably, despite their nuisance reputation?

Some people view pigeons more favorably because of their historical significance, intelligence, and athleticism. Journalist Andrew Blechman argues that pigeons are gentle creatures that have lived alongside humans for centuries and should be appreciated rather than vilified.

What is pigeon racing, and why is it a lucrative industry?

Pigeon racing involves releasing pigeons from a distant location and timing their return to their home lofts. It is a lucrative industry, especially in China and Taiwan, where prize money can reach millions of dollars. Champion pigeons can be sold for millions and bred for high-priced offspring.

Outlines

00:00

🐦 The Persistent Problem of Pigeons in Urban Areas

Dave Champagne, owner of Bird Busters, specializes in pigeon control in San Francisco. Pigeons, despite being considered unintelligent, are remarkably tenacious. The city faces an infestation of over 8 million pigeons, whose acidic droppings damage buildings, cars, and solar panels. While cities spend millions on controlling these pests, pigeons were once revered and celebrated in various cultures. Pigeons, or 'rock doves,' have a rich history and are highly adaptable, leading to their proliferation in modern urban environments.

05:00

🕊️ Pigeons' Storied History and Wartime Contributions

Pigeons have been used by humans for thousands of years, not just as a food source but for their remarkable homing abilities. From ancient Egypt to the modern era, pigeons have played critical roles in communication. In wartime, pigeons demonstrated immense valor, flying long distances through dangerous conditions to deliver messages. These birds saved countless lives, particularly during World War I and World War II, where they were recognized for their bravery. Some pigeons received military honors, such as the prestigious Dickin Award.

10:02

🏁 Pigeon Racing: From Belgian Roots to Million-Dollar Champions

Pigeon racing began in Belgium in the 19th century and has since become a lucrative sport, especially in Asia. Pigeons are trained to race home from distant locations, using their superior homing abilities. The sport has gained popularity in countries like China and Taiwan, where wealthy individuals have driven up prices for champion pigeons. In recent years, top racing pigeons have sold for millions of dollars, with prize pools in competitions reaching tens of millions. Pigeons are bred and trained for optimal performance, and a thriving economy has emerged around pigeon care and racing.

15:03

🌆 Pigeons in Urban Environments: An Ongoing Challenge

Feral pigeons have thrived in cities due to their adaptability and close association with human environments. Pigeons are non-migratory, breed year-round, and can survive on discarded food, making urban centers like San Francisco ideal habitats. Despite efforts to control them, pigeon populations remain resilient, thanks in part to individuals who feed them. Pigeons have been blamed for significant structural damage to buildings and vehicles due to their acidic droppings, costing cities billions of dollars in damages annually.

🚫 Humane Pigeon Control: From Netting to Low-Voltage Solutions

Modern pigeon control has shifted from extermination to humane removal and prevention. Companies like Bird Busters use various tools such as nets, spikes, and low-voltage deterrents to keep pigeons away from structures. Dave Champagne’s company charges from hundreds to six-figure sums, depending on the complexity of the job. While pigeons can be a nuisance, Champagne acknowledges that they are simply trying to survive. Journalist Andrew Blackman urges people to view pigeons more positively, as resilient creatures that have been part of human civilization for thousands of years.

Keywords

💡Pigeons

Pigeons are central to the video, depicted as both a nuisance in urban environments and revered creatures throughout history. The video explains how pigeons have become a common sight in cities, causing structural damage and posing health risks. Yet, they were once highly regarded for their intelligence and adaptability, being used in war, racing, and communication.

💡Bird Busters Incorporated

Bird Busters Incorporated is the company owned by Dave Champagne, which specializes in bird removal, particularly pigeons. The company plays a significant role in urban bird control, working with major companies to manage pigeon infestations that cause structural damage and other issues in cities like San Francisco.

💡Pigeon Racing

Pigeon racing is highlighted as a competitive sport where pigeons are released from a distance and return to their home lofts, sometimes flying hundreds of miles. The video notes that this sport, which started in Belgium, continues today with a new demographic, especially in China, where high-priced pigeons and massive prize pools are involved.

💡Feral Pigeons

Feral pigeons are wild pigeons that have escaped domestication and now thrive in urban environments. The video discusses their rapid reproduction, adaptability to city life, and their transformation from domesticated birds to a problem in cities. These pigeons are often the target of control efforts like those of Bird Busters.

💡Structural Damage

Structural damage caused by pigeons is a recurring theme, as their acidic droppings erode buildings, car paint, and solar panels. This damage creates the need for bird control services like Bird Busters. The video emphasizes the economic impact of pigeon-related destruction, which totals over a billion dollars annually in the U.S.

💡Pigeon Poop

Pigeon poop is a major issue discussed in the video, as it causes significant structural damage and health risks in urban environments. Its acidity can destroy rooftops, solar panels, and car paint, and it harbors bacteria and fungi. Companies like Bird Busters work to prevent pigeon nesting and the accumulation of droppings.

💡Pigeon Intelligence

Pigeons are described as highly intelligent birds capable of extraordinary feats, such as returning home from hundreds of miles away. This intelligence made them valuable during wars and for communication before modern technology. Pigeons' sense of direction is linked to magnetite in their brains, allowing them to navigate using Earth's magnetic field.

💡Magnetite

Magnetite is a mineral in pigeons’ brains that helps them detect Earth’s magnetic field. This unique ability allows pigeons to navigate long distances with precision, an essential trait for their use in message delivery and racing. The video highlights this as one reason pigeons are 'designed' perfectly for these tasks.

💡Pigeon Messaging

Pigeon messaging refers to the historical use of pigeons to deliver messages over long distances, especially before the telegraph. The video recounts how pigeons were used during wars and by figures like Paul Julius Reuter to transmit important information. Pigeons' reliability in message delivery made them valuable in many major conflicts.

💡Pigeon Prevention Methods

Pigeon prevention methods include tools and techniques like netting, spikes, bird wire, and low-voltage electric tracks to keep pigeons from roosting in urban areas. Companies like Bird Busters use these methods to prevent pigeons from nesting in buildings and causing damage. The video explains how these measures are more humane alternatives to older methods like poisoning.

Highlights

Dave Champagne is the owner of Bird Busters, Inc., a company that specializes in removing pigeons from San Francisco's buildings.

Pigeons cause significant structural damage in cities due to their acidic droppings, which can corrode buildings, car paint, and solar panels.

Pigeons are not migratory; they tend to settle down and breed year-round, making them a constant issue in urban environments.

Feral pigeons in North America are descendants of rock doves brought over by European settlers as a food source in the 1600s.

Pigeons have been utilized for thousands of years for tasks such as delivering messages, due to their intelligence and strong homing instincts.

Pigeons were once revered, worshipped in ancient civilizations, and used by Egyptians to fertilize crops with their excrement.

During both World Wars, pigeons were used for military communication, with a success rate of 95% in message delivery.

Notable pigeons like Cher Ami and G.I. Joe saved lives during war by delivering critical messages despite being injured.

The sport of pigeon racing is highly lucrative, with prize-winning pigeons being sold for millions of dollars, particularly in China and Taiwan.

Bird control experts like Dave Champagne now focus on humane methods of pigeon removal, using nets, spikes, bird wire, and electric tracks.

Pigeons are highly adaptable and can survive on human food waste in cities, making it difficult to reduce their population.

Despite their nuisance in cities, pigeons are extremely athletic and have an advanced sense of direction, able to travel hundreds of miles back to their home.

Bird Busters charges clients from $600 to six figures for bird removal, depending on the complexity of the job.

Some experts argue that pigeons are misunderstood and should be appreciated for their resilience and historical importance.

There is a growing industry around pigeon control, with companies developing various products and tools to prevent pigeons from nesting in urban areas.

Transcripts

on any given week Dave Champagne can be

found scouring the nooks and crannies of

San Francisco in an effort to hunt down

one of the city's most notorious pests

the worst jobs of the church Steeples

they're normally infested and it's you

got to suit up like a space suit to

clean it they're smart animals you know

if you have something missing a spike

falls down if you don't do something

right they find a breach they will

capitalize on it

champagne doesn't deal with rats

squirrels or termites he's the owner of

a company called bird Busters

Incorporated and one bird in particular

makes up the bulk of his

business pigeons you know you think

they're not too bright but they're

pretty tenacious considering they're

still here once they find a place to

live they're not going to leave it's

estimated that there are more than 8

million pigeons living on the streets of

North American cities most of them are

concentrated in busy Urban centers they

gather in enormous flocks in Parks they

Roost on roofs in light Wells and under

bridges and their acidic poop eats away

at buildings car paint and solar panels

cities pay companies like bird Busters

millions of dollars a year to get rid of

them but before pigeons were a pest they

were celebrated and even woried it's

really only in England and America that

we see them as so-called Rats of the Sky

the reality is that it's a very very

gentle

creature the only real problem is when

there's just too many of

them for the fre economics radio network

this is the economics of everyday things

I'm Zachary Crockett today

pigeons pigeons weren't always a

nuisance most feral pigeons are

descendants of the rock do a part of the

colid family of birds in fact there's

not much difference between a Street

Pigeon and the most romantic bird on

earth the white doves that are released

at weddings are just pigeons that happen

to be colored white that's Andrew

blechman he's a journalist and the

author of the book pigeons the

fascinating Saga of the world's most

revered and reviled bird pigeons have

been worshipped since we've been Homo

sapiens they were seen as fertility

goddesses they're all through the

[Music]

Bible by most

pigeons are the world's oldest

domesticated bird they were collected

and trained as far back as 10,000 years

ago in

Mesopotamia ancient Egyptians kept huge

flocks of them for food and used their

excrement to fertilize vegetables and

fruit trees but over time humans

discovered another use for the pigeon

they're extremely intelligent you train

them as to where home is and then you

take them somewhere and then they'll go

back home and you can tie a little

message to their legs and they'll fly it

back some of these pigeons can fly 600

to 1,000 mil away they will hone in on

their Loft literally like a laser guided

missile from a th000 miles away and

they'll go through without food without

water they'll go through different

weather pigeons can fly for up to 16

hours straight and hit speeds of 60

MPH they couple this athleticism with an

astonishing sense of direction that some

scientists say stems from Tiny bits of

magnetite in their

brains they use that to detect the

Earth's magnetic field it's almost like

they were designed perfectly to do this

in a way they were they were selectively

bred over centuries to fly further

distances and return home and in the

years before the widespread use of the

telegraph that wasn't just a parlor

trick in 1851 for instance a German book

publisher named Paul Julius reuter used

pigeons to deliver stock prices from

Belgium to Germany a distance of 400

miles there was a telegraph wire that

was laid between Brussels and Berlin but

there was a gap in the Arden and reuter

came up with the idea of filling it with

pigeons so he was the first one to get

the news to Berlin from uh Brussels and

from Brussels to Berlin that's literally

how reuter's news service began it was

on the backs of

pigeons the pigeons talents were also

put to to use on the

battlefield every major superpower in

all of world history utilized pigeons

during the Franco Prussian war in 1870

the French military used pigeons to send

thousands of messages past Enemy Lines

by World War I the US even had a

dedicated pigeon Corp that bred and

trained the birds to deliver messages

while Under Siege by War's end pigeons

had a 95% success rate Telegraph wires

can get cut

you know wires can also be intercepted

pigeons are the lowest Tech you can use

and sometimes lowest Tech is the best

tech some pigeons exhibited legendary

acts of Valor when Allied troops were

surrounded by German soldiers during an

attack in October 1918 they relied on a

pigeon named Sher Ami to call for help

he was shot through the breast blinded

in one eye and nearly lost his leg but

he managed to fly 25 mil back to

headquarters in less than half an hour

sherem went through all the gunfire all

the guns were trained on it and somehow

he made it back barely breathing during

World War II the US used 54,000 War

pigeons including the legendary gii Joe

he delivered an order to call off the

bombing of an Italian city saving the

lives of at least a thousand Allied

troops what they performed were massive

Feats of heroism and they say saved tens

of thousands of lives you're talking

people's Sons people's husbands people's

fathers who came home from the war

thanks to you know like a 3B bird when

the dickin award the highest honor for

animals who served in the military was

created in 1943 the first three

recipients were pigeons today 75 of

those medals have been awarded and

pigeons hold 32 of them but pigeons

don't just deliver things the Coast

Guard has listed them in search and

rescue efforts they've fared out

defective drug capsules at

pharmaceutical factories and they've

made a name for themselves as Elite

athletes in the sport of Pigeon

Racing they're trucked out to a distant

spot and then they're released from

these trucks that have these trap doors

that just open on both sides I mean and

these are like 18 wheelers just filled

with pigeons so it's like a giant

Starting Gate and you'll have some kind

a judge or witness to make sure it's

done properly there's one starting gate

but unlike a racetrack with the horses

they're flying all over the place to

like endless Finish Lines rooftops all

over Brooklyn Queens North Jersey parts

of Westchester they hone in on their

home Loft and they land and then they're

all wearing a special race bracelet

across an ankle and they're scanned in

quickly and it's all computerized and

then it's all sent to a central database

Pigeon Racing first achieved popularity

in Belgium toward the end of the 19th

century for a while it was a popular

sport for the working class these days

it's less popular but it has attracted a

new demographic with much deeper pockets

in China and

Taiwan in 2019 a top racing pigeon named

Armando sold to a Chinese buyer for $14

million that record was broken a few

months later when the Belgian race new

Kim went for 1.9 million after a heated

bidding war in Asia prize pots for the

largest pigeon races can reach into the

tens of millions of dollars and a

champion pigeon can continue printing

money even after its career is over the

winners I mean they're studded out

essentially so just like horses are the

sperm of one of these Racers can go for

you know hundreds of thousands of

dollars so it's big business there's a

small but thriving economy that caters

to the Pigeon Racing Community selling

natural grain mixes supplements and

antibiotics you know you're not going to

feed an athlete mac and cheese off of

the supermarket shelf I mean there's

endless formulas they're looking for

carbohydrate content for protein content

for the highest source of a certain seed

whole businesses have grown up around

it but today the biggest industry around

pigeons is the one trying to to get rid

of them around the world cities have

been plagued by millions of feral

pigeons who Roost in local businesses

and cover sidewalks in acidic poop so

how exactly did pigeons go from fancy to

feral and what kind of work goes into

reclaiming the city streets from these

resilient Birds I do a billboard every

six months now and I've taken out 2,000

lb of bird crap and I swear when I'm up

there this is what I think I went to

college for

this that's coming

[Music]

up pigeons are thought to have first

arrived in America in the 1600s when

European settlers brought rock dobs over

on ships as a source of food but over

time many domestic pigeons escaped and

became feral these populations of wild

pigeons increased dramatically in the

first half of the 20th century when

racing pigeons left rooftop CPS in

cities like New York for a life on the

streets they love to be on cliffs you

will not see them in trees our cities

are really just concrete mountains you

know they're just concrete Cliffs

everywhere again that's Andrew Blackman

so that's why they're on our Ledges

that's why they're on our Bridge

superstructures that's why they're on

the eye beams and the reality is they

like being around

us so why are there there's so many

feral pigeons in places like San

Francisco and New York City well for

starters pigeons aren't migratory when

they're not made to deliver messages

hundreds of miles away they prefer to

find a good ledge somewhere and settle

down they breed basically year round

have a fast reproduction cycle and can

survive on the streets for 3 to 5 years

they're also highly adaptable and eats

just about anything humans discard from

pizza crust to Fried Chicken

every city will have the proverbial

crazy older person who at 3:00 or 4: in

the morning will go out into the streets

when they're not being spotted and open

up giant bags of feed like 30 40 pound

bags of feed to feed their pigeons and

that will cause overbreeding which

actually stresses the population out in

some cities it's now illegal to feed

pigeons but that hasn't stopped feral

populations from thriving City dwellers

either love them like Bert from Sesame

Street I love pigeons and I love how

they walk and I've created a really cool

dance called doing the

pigeon or hate them like the 1950s

singer songwriter Tom larer all the

world seems in tune on a spring

afternoon when we're poisoning pigeons

in the

park one thing is certain all of these

pigeons can cause a lot of damage an

estimate from 2000 put total pigeon

related structural damage in the US at

over a billion dollars a year that has

spawned a big business for bird control

professionals like Dave

Champagne I'm from Louisiana originally

so I visit my cousin down there and they

kind of laugh that I do bird stuff

because where I'm from they just shoot

them champagne started his company bird

Busters nearly 30 years ago after

noticing that the big Pest Control firms

often didn't know how to deal with birds

a lot of pest control companies aren't

good at it because it's tricky they like

to spray and bait that's the main money

for those smaller comp you know the ones

on the ground we have to get up in the

air it's not easy the stuff we do today

he helps businesses and cities across

Northern California get rid of unwanted

Birds I work with everybody from

Salesforce to you know Google to Amazon

all of them hire us I've done Bridges

freeways the big billboard you see on

the freeway no one escapes a bird

problem champagne deals with all kinds

of flying creatures seagulls owls

swallows Hawks but he says around 60% of

his business comes from pigeons which

like to roost in local businesses and

private

residences most of the buildings we deal

with like victorians they love

victorians I mean there's nooks and

crannies and little ornate balconies we

do a lot of light Wells it's like a few

living City you open up your bathroom

windows in an apartment there's this

shaft that goes down between the

buildings people open these windows and

all a sudden there's four or five birds

that have been nesting there all winter

clients call Bird Busters for a few

reasons for starters pigeons produce a

tremendous amount of poop about 25 lbs

per bird per year they cause a lot of

structural damage when they sit in a

spot and crap all day and their poop

it's a high in acidity and it will wreck

a car paint job wow sometimes it's just

staying side to side a building and I

can scrub it and clean it and disinfect

it but the damage is done this can

especially be a problem for people with

solar panels they're a perfect place for

pigeons to Nest under I mean they love

them and then what happens is the poop

slopes downhill it clogs the gutters up

and it starts to destroy the roof

excessive pigeon droppings can also pose

health hazards like any excrement it's

filled with fungi and bacteria that can

be harmful if inhaled pigeon related

infections in humans are pretty rare but

hospitals private businesses and cities

don't want to take on that

risk and then there's the

sound the sound they make the harmonic

it vibrates through the house they coup

all morning long cuz they're hanging out

deciding what to do and they normally go

out out and eat and party all day or

loaf they come back in the evening and

they do the same thing and people it

drives them crazy when champagne's team

is called to a job the first step is to

get the pigeons out and that part isn't

too

complicated you just chase them out

pigeons are so chill they never come at

you they don't attack anyone they're

puppy dogs I mean they just don't care

if you had a problem with pigeons 100

years ago you just shoot them or kill

them with poison pellets even today

there aren't any federal laws that

prevent the slaughter of pigeons the

USDA labels them as an invasive species

and the migratory bird treaty Act of

1918 which protects many species of

native bird does not apply to feral

pigeons but in most cities including San

Francisco the pigeon control industry

has shifted from killing pigeons to

humanely removing them the modern day

focus is on moving pigeons elsewhere and

preventing them from coming back the

same birds will come back it's crazy

they keep scoping out their old home and

I I didn't believe that but I've seen it

so many times there are dozens of

companies with names like bird barrier

bird beone and bird X that manufacture

and sell pigeon prevention products to

guys like champagne the market is full

of all kinds of devices sticky gels that

smell like garlic holographic prisms

that reflect sunlight and plastic decoy

owls champagne uses different pigeon

tools for different jobs one of the most

popular options is netting that's a

primary thing for loading docks parking

garages big areas where you're just not

going to chase the birds around it's

more cost effective because you could do

a big area with like big pieces of net

we net the entire loading dock ceiling

to where the birds can't land on any PL

they can't get up in the duct work the

mechanical boxes so basically when they

fly in they hit the net they bounce they

leave for tall Ledges fire escapes and

rooftops he'll employ rows of spikes or

bird wire that make it hard for pigeons

to land it's a thin wire that's coated

and what you do is you attach it to a

post and then you run it to another pose

with a spring on it so when the birds

come in the land they hit the wire and

it bounces back they can't grab onto the

wire it's too thin one of his favorite

pigeon prevention measures is something

called the bird track if the birds land

on it every 4 seconds it just sends a

low low low voltage out it gives them a

little zap and I've not seen birds come

back for a second try for his Services

champagne charges anywhere from around

600 bucks to six figures depending on

the complexity of the job the pigeon

removal business has put his three

daughters through college and it's

afforded him a nice nest in the San

Francisco suburbs and even though he

spends his days evicting pigeons he has

no beef with the birds I think they're

just trying to survive like everyone

else Andrew Blackman the journalist who

spent several years chronicling pigeons

understands the need for urban bird

control but he doesn't think that

pigeons deserve the bad rap that they

often get the way we look at pigeons is

just unfair why not see them as the

Whimsical happen stance in a concrete

jungle they've been with us since the

very beginning they like being with us

they're incredibly docel creatures

they're tremendous

athletes I would just urge people to

kind of take a new look at them and see

them for what they are which is just you

know a wing creature that chooses to

live amongst

us for the economics of everyday things

I'm Zachary

Crockett this episode was produced by me

and Sarah Lily and mixed by Jeremy

Johnston we had help from Daniel morit

[Music]

rapson steroids are a problem in Pigeon

Racing so yeah I guess the only way to

put is like that's a lot of breast

meat the Freakonomics radio network the

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