Director Rob Burnett on ‘The Fundamentals of Caregiving’, Paul Rudd, and David Letterman
Summary
TLDRIn this interview, the director discusses his new film, which blends comedy with tragedy, starring Paul Rudd and Craig Roberts. The film, initially a longer cut, was refined to a tighter 93-minute runtime. The director shares his experience working with Rudd, who contributed significantly both on and off-camera. Challenges faced during production included harsh winter conditions in Atlanta and the necessity of cutting beloved scenes to serve the story. The director reflects on his growth, learning to adapt and be more flexible in his approach to filmmaking.
Takeaways
- 😀 The interviewee has been a fan of the interviewer's work since 'Ed' and they have maintained a friendship with Tom Cavanagh, which is a cherished outcome of that show.
- 🎬 The interviewee's son is a big fan of 'The Flash' and had an exciting encounter with the show's cast at Comic-Con.
- 🌟 The interviewee's movie got into Sundance Film Festival, which was a thrilling and unexpected moment for them.
- 📚 The movie is based on a book by Jonathan Edison and uniquely blends comedy with deep tragedy.
- 🎭 Paul Rudd plays a significant role in the movie, bringing both emotional depth and humor to his character.
- 🏆 Financing for the movie became easier once Paul Rudd agreed to join the project, highlighting his influence in the industry.
- 🎥 The interviewee values preparedness on set but also the flexibility to find the moment while shooting, a skill honed from directing 'Ed'.
- ⏰ The shooting schedule was tight, with only 24 days, and the team had to adapt to challenging weather conditions in Atlanta.
- ✂️ The initial cut of the movie was over two hours, but through editing, it was refined to a tighter runtime to maintain pacing and audience engagement.
- 📊 Test screenings provided valuable feedback, particularly in balancing the movie's tone between comedy and drama.
- 📽️ The interviewee's experience includes a memorable moment with David Letterman and Johnny Carson, illustrating the surreal nature of working in show business.
Q & A
What was one of the best things that came out of the interviewee’s involvement with 'The Flash'?
-One of the best things was the friendship with Tom Cavanagh, with whom the interviewee is still in touch almost daily.
How did the interviewee's son react to meeting 'The Flash' cast at Comic-Con?
-The interviewee's son was so excited that he humorously described it as his son’s head 'coming off his body,' showcasing the son's enthusiasm for meeting the cast.
What is the premise of the interviewee's Sundance film?
-The film is based on a book by Jonathan Emison. It follows a man (played by Paul Rudd) who becomes a caregiver for an 18-year-old with muscular dystrophy, and together they embark on a road trip, picking up broken souls along the way.
How did Paul Rudd’s involvement impact the film's financing?
-Paul Rudd’s agreement to be part of the film led to almost instantaneous financing, reflecting his strong appeal in the industry.
What qualities did the interviewee see in Paul Rudd that made him the right fit for the film?
-The interviewee needed an actor who could handle both the emotional depth and the comedic aspects of the character, and Paul Rudd fit this small group of actors who could balance both well.
How did the cold weather in Atlanta impact the film shoot?
-The weather was extremely cold, with temperatures dropping to 18 degrees, which challenged the crew. However, the snowfall led to an unexpected but beautiful shot of the house covered in snow.
How does the interviewee describe their directing style on set?
-The interviewee prides themselves on being very prepared, with a strong plan for each scene, but also remains flexible enough to adjust when needed, especially due to time constraints or unexpected changes.
What was a key adjustment made in the editing process of the film?
-A significant sequence of travel was cut to improve the film's pacing, leading to a shorter runtime of 93 minutes from an initial 2-hour cut.
What was the most challenging part of balancing the tone of the movie?
-Balancing the transitions between comedy and serious moments was the most challenging part, with the team adjusting emotional scenes to ensure they didn’t lose the audience by going too far into serious territory.
How does the interviewee reflect on working with David Letterman and Johnny Carson?
-One of the interviewee’s favorite memories was a humorous interaction between Johnny Carson and David Letterman at an Emmy dinner, where they both made fun of Letterman, marking an out-of-body experience for the interviewee.
Outlines
😀 Interview Kickoff and Flashback
The interview begins with a warm exchange between the host and the guest, who is in great spirits. The guest expresses admiration for the host's work, particularly recalling the show 'ED' and the memorable character, Tom. The conversation quickly shifts to the guest's current project, a movie that has been accepted into Sundance. The guest shares the excitement of receiving the acceptance call and the subsequent screenings in Los Angeles, which included an unexpected visit from John Cooper, a significant figure in the film industry. The guest's son is also mentioned, who is a fan of 'The Flash', creating a humorous anecdote about his son's enthusiasm for the show.
🎬 Behind the Scenes of a Sundance Film
The discussion delves into the guest's new movie, which is based on a book by Jonathan Edison and uniquely blends comedy with tragedy. The film stars Paul Rudd as a caregiver to an 18-year-old with muscular dystrophy, played by Craig Roberts, and their journey together becomes both comedic and poignant. The guest shares the challenges of financing the movie, which became easier once Paul Rudd joined the project. The interview also covers the process of casting and working with Paul Rudd, who not only acted but also contributed creatively to the film. The guest praises Rudd's ability to handle both emotional and comedic aspects of the role, making him an invaluable asset to the film.
🌨️ Challenges and Creativity in Filmmaking
The conversation moves to the challenges faced during the film's production, particularly the harsh winter conditions in Atlanta. The guest recounts an unexpected snowfall that provided a natural backdrop for a scene, highlighting the need for adaptability in filmmaking. The guest also discusses their approach to directing, emphasizing the importance of preparation and flexibility. They share insights into working with a strong cast, which includes Paul Rudd, Craig Roberts, Selena Gomez, and others, and how their performances greatly influenced the film's outcome. The guest reflects on the editing process, explaining how the film's initial cut was significantly longer and how it was refined to meet the desired pace and tone.
📽️ Balancing Tone and Editing a Film
The guest continues to discuss the delicate balance between the film's comedic and dramatic elements, highlighting the importance of maintaining the right tone. They share insights from test screenings that helped shape the final cut, emphasizing the need to avoid overly emotional sections that could alienate the audience. The guest also talks about the editing process, where entire scenes had to be removed to serve the bigger picture, even if it meant letting go of some great performances. They express the importance of honesty and communication with the actors, especially when scenes they were proud of had to be cut.
🤝 Reflections on a Career and Memorable Moments
In the final part of the interview, the guest reflects on their career, sharing how their approach to filmmaking has evolved over time. They discuss the importance of learning new techniques and being adaptable, using experiences from directing television as a foundation. The conversation concludes with a humorous anecdote involving the guest, David Letterman, and Johnny Carson, which underscores the guest's memorable experiences in the entertainment industry.
Mindmap
Keywords
💡Sundance
💡Caregiver
💡Muscular Dystrophy
💡Comedy and Tragedy
💡Road Trip
💡Character Development
💡Ad-lib
💡Editing Process
💡Test Screenings
💡Indie Filmmaking
Highlights
The interviewee expresses gratitude for being a fan and discusses their long-standing friendship with Tom Cavanagh.
Mention of attending Comic-Con with their son, who is a big fan of 'The Flash'.
Receiving the call that the movie was accepted into Sundance in November.
The movie is a comedy based on a tragic premise, starring Paul Rudd and Craig Roberts.
Paul Rudd's casting significantly influenced the movie's financing.
The director's approach to writing with Paul Rudd in mind and their first meeting to discuss the project.
Paul Rudd's contributions off-camera, including script notes and character development.
The shooting schedule of 24 days in Atlanta during an unusually cold winter.
The director's preparation and flexibility on set, influenced by experience in television.
The importance of having talented actors to facilitate a smooth shooting process.
The first cut of the movie was over two hours, but the final version is under 100 minutes.
Learnings from test screenings, particularly balancing comedy and drama.
The challenge of cutting scenes and performances that didn't serve the overall narrative.
The director's connection to the material and the unique approach to the caregiver story.
Evolution in the director's approach and learning from each project.
Anecdote about an Emmy dinner where Johnny Carson and the director made fun of David Letterman.
Transcripts
are you doing today sir I'm great so
what's interesting is I've been a fan of
your work since ed oh thank you because
i watch the show back in the day thank
you do you still get thank yous from Tom
for helping them book the flash big
compound I was one of my favorite humans
we are very good friends and touch
almost on the daily basis one of the
best things that came out of that for me
is my friendship with Tom Cavanagh so
are you caught up on flash or do not
watch my son knows more about flash than
Tom does oh it's one of those yes so
have you not tried to like get him an
extra gig working on set one day you
know what happened was we went to
comic-con this year and my son's head
actually came off his body when he did
call the flash people we had to call
somebody that reattach it and then he
ran into the family guy people it came
off again oh that's great yeah that I
think that probably has to be one of the
really cool perks of the gig of what's
the only reason to be in show business
the only reason it's to do stuff for
your kids Oh jumping into why I get to
talk to you today congrats on having a
movie get into Sundance thank you old
when did you get the call that it was
accepted it was I believe in November as
I remember it we had a couple of
screenings in Los Angeles big screenings
with two or three hundred people general
public we also had some buyers they are
looking at the film and I heard after
the fact that John Cooper was at one of
the screenings so I was retro actively
nauseous I was like wait what he was
there and he they called up the next day
and said you're a closing night film so
I just thought is this a prank really
yes we're thrilled really happy um
ninety-nine point nine percent of the
people watching this interview right now
will know nothing about your movie
because it's so you know premiering at
sundance and you know what i mean so I
hate saying it but can you talk a little
bit about what it's about yeah yeah it's
based on a book by a great author
Jonathan Edison
and our movie is it's a it's an odd
movie because it's bathed in tragedy but
is actually a comedy and gets along
laughs Paul Rudd plays a guy who has
suffered a horrible tragedy and he ends
up learning to be a caregiver and his
first client is Craig Roberts who is an
18 year old kid with muscular dystrophy
and while this can sound that you're in
a very depressing space one guy's
paralyzed emotionally one paralyzed
physically but they're both really funny
and it's this odd odd couple movie they
end up going on this road trip where
they pick up a couple of other broken
Souls Selena Gomez along the way
hitchhiking from the Pacific Northwest
down to utah and megan ferguson a
hapless pregnant woman on the side of
the road how tough was it for you to get
financing for the movie it was almost
instantaneous after Paul Rudd said that
he would be in the movie it was really
that best yes that's that's what Paul
does for you let's talk a little bit
about landing Paul was it someone that
you knew was it someone that you went
after were you always envisioning him in
the movie as I was writing the movie I I
knew that we needed somebody that was a
very very good actor because there was a
real emotional undercurrent to the movie
but I also knew that I needed someone
that could be really funny and that's
such a small handful of guys that can
pull that material off so as I was
writing I found myself dreaming of Paul
Rudd over and over again I did not know
Paul we had met a couple of times
through the Late Show we know a lot of
the same people being new york comedy
guys and I really just reached out him
directly asked if he'd have a cup of
coffee with me we met I told him about
the project I gave him the script as I
recall I didn't hear anything back from
him for four or five weeks and each day
became more and more nauseous I thought
he was secretly having me removed from
show business possibly trying to have me
killed I didn't know but as it turned
out he loved the script and and said he
would do it so we were super psyched
yeah he is an actor that just men and
women both love he's one of those every
man kind of people and yes he can do a
lot
in terms of performance he's also quite
good at writing himself yeah so talk a
little bit about working with someone
who is a very easy talented writer yes
and maybe how that changes the dynamic
of the delivery dialogue or does he have
notes you know you know what I mean yeah
this is a great family Pole to use a
sports analogy you know he's not only
good on the field he's also great in the
locker room what's great for me is that
he and I have a very similar sensibility
we see things the same way we're
shooting at the same target so he was a
huge asset to me off camera as well as
on he had great notes on the script had
great great instincts with his character
of course gave him free rein to ad-lib
whatever he wanted in fact one of the
funnier scenes the movie is largely I'd
lived by Paul so yes he was an asset up
and down for me and you know if I if I
had my way if I were doing another film
and I couldn't have him in it i'd asked
him to come and either you know write it
or produce it or just just hang out with
me on set because he's he's a valuable
asset turn a little bit about your
shooting schedule was one of these
back-breaking like 20 days or was it it
was pretty it was 24 days um you know I
I think has there ever been a movie that
has enough time I think no right an
inner ought to is screaming that I only
had nine months for the revenant you
know you need like it's no matter what
it is you're doing it's never enough it
was it was difficult we shot in Atlanta
last January February it was
extraordinarily cold there it was a very
bitter winter was many times 18 degrees
outside with the wind it actually snowed
one day in Atlanta in fact we were
shooting inside of Craig's characters
house and it's snowing and I quickly
said take the cameras outside and shoot
the snow because and there's a shot of
the movie of the house covered in snow
which works beautifully to kind of show
a passage of time we did not have the
budget to create to create our own our
own snow the other thing you know is if
you're shooting in Atlanta when you get
one sixty fourth of an inch
now it all shuts down absolutely
everyone's done they're done that's it
every way to get the kids home from
school there's one sixty fourth of an
inch of snow on the ground how are you
as a filmmaker on set in terms of
storyboarding all the material and
thinking you're going to shoot it a
certain way versus finding it in the
moment while you're there it's a great
question I like to pride myself on being
extraordinarily prepared I go in with
everything very thought out I wouldn't
say quite storyboarded something
storyboarded but a very strong plan of
what it is that we want to accomplish I
had a great DP on this movie Giles nut
shins we would meet every Sunday and go
over that week's shooting because I kind
of feel like you want to have time to be
flexible and the only way you can have
that time to be flexible is if you're
prepared so the biggest changes in
shooting for me were sometimes because
of the schedule i know there was one
sequence in the movie that i had a I
think like a 16 or 17 shot sequence that
I had planned out and I was just looking
at it was a location that we weren't
going to be able to afford to get back
and I had you know that that's the time
we have to really adjust I'll tell you
honestly ed is the best possible
training ground for that directing one
hour television you're shooting eight
pages a day that's breakneck for real so
you get very used to as the day's going
on saying oh you know what those two
people at the diner can be sitting on
the same side of the table so you have
to do some of that but also helpful and
hugely important that I think doesn't
maybe gets overlooked in that discussion
is how good your actors are you know
that's that's kind of everything and
this was like driving the world's
fastest race car you know I I with Paul
and Craig who was just amazing in the
movie Selena Megan jennifer ehle all of
them they're so good that you didn't
need 20 takes to get what you need
did you got what you needed in one or
two takes and then if you have the
luxury of trying some other stuff you
could do it but if you have the right
actors it makes all of this extremely
easy how long was your first take versus
the finished film the first cut yeah um
sorry the first hey I'm like yeah the
for the first I think the editors cut of
the movie was probably came in at around
two hours and 10 minutes I think I think
we're now at 93 16 oh wow it's it's this
movie is meant to be short I think not
too short but it's it's it's not I don't
think this movie is meant to be anything
over 105 minutes at the outside and I
think two hours would be a mistake I
feel very comfortable with the length of
a movie now it moves very quickly it has
a lot of playability you know audiences
respond to it and I think part of it is
the pace what did you learn from the
test screenings / friends and family
screenings that may be dictated how the
finished film looks we had unfortunately
did not have a lot of time to have a ton
of those I would have liked to have more
we had one screening a friends and
family screen and actually was not we
never even had a friends and family we
had 30 person screening of a sort of
semi recruited audience of strangers
when the film was very rough and that
was when it was two hours plus and you
learn certain things what's tricky about
this movie is that totally you were you
were moving back and forth from being
funny and being serious and that's what
the screenings got the most of there was
there was sort of a section in the three
quarters into the movie that we may be
were going to emotional too too too much
and too much of it and we realized we
were starting to lose them they're a
little bit so we pulled back on that it
was just a little bit of a dance to try
to get the comedy and the drama right
not unlike ed you know it's a similar
tone to add the truth is in our first
meeting I said to Paul you know often
these types of
is that are funny or funny they're not
they don't make you laugh they're
delightful they are amusing they're
clever but I said I think the two of us
together can make a movie that will be
emotional and uplifting and moving but
will actually make a movie theater
laughs and I think some of this goes
back to my letterman instincts as a guy
who has stood on the floor of a studio
for 20-plus years this is kind of in my
DNA so all I can tell you factually is
that in the three or four big screenings
we've had of two or three hundred people
the movie has in fact achieved that it
that the movie gets very big laughs in
with with pretty treacherous material
you mentioned that there's like your
editors cut was 210 and now it's but 93
we're there was it a lot of tightening
up scenes or was a full on pulling
scenes out no both both of course
there's there's kind of a almost an
entire day of there you know at some
point it becomes a road a road movie
they're traveling and at one point we we
kind of just took out we'd realize you
know we could just take out an entire
day and a lot of good stuff you know
life it's tough it's the old expression
you have to kill your darlings but
everything has to serve the bigger
picture you know there's some there's
some heartbreakingly great performances
from from megan ferguson in particular
Selena had a beautiful scene that was
really cut that was not the hardest cut
for me to make but it just felt like we
needed to move at that point and you
have to serve the big picture so is it
one of these things where you have
called them on the phone and already
said hey by the way I know you were
awesome well I just feel like you know
my what I believe the actors give you so
much you know they're so vulnerable they
have to you know my job's easy I get to
sit behind a camera
bark things they have to actually do
this stuff and it's really hard so I
think all I can provide for them is
honesty and straightforwardness that's
kind of what I pride myself on so I felt
a need to talk to both Megan and Selena
and tell them this stuff was cut I loved
your performance if I didn't love their
performance I would have said you know
what this didn't come out great because
by the way their performance were a part
where partner what they're doing my
words right so we're in that together
it's not just on them if it doesn't if
it doesn't work it's on me equally but
in this case it was just really really
difficult stuff to take out what was it
about this material that got you because
every film is like you're putting the
heart and soul in it for a year or two
yes you know so what was it about the
material that said I have to make this
yeah I think Jonathan Emison did such a
beautiful job with the novel where
you're reading this story that is
incredibly tragic and yet it's not told
in a tragic way and I think what
interested me about this was the usual
version of this story that you see is
you have an irascible caregiver come in
and breathe life into the ill or injured
in fact there was a beautiful French
movie called Untouchables that was
coming out right as I was buying the
rights this book and I rushed to the
theater to see it you know is this going
to be in my way and I thought that movie
was fantastic but it was that story and
I thought the interesting thing about
this story is that the caregiver is
equally if not more so damaged than the
kid they're both completely damaged
Souls and if and and the other thing
that I think is difficult but
interesting is that this entire story
takes place in the aftermath of the
action Paul's tragedy has already taken
place Craig already has Duchenne
muscular dystrophy and now they're just
living so it's hard because you've lost
a lot of that drama but there's
something so interesting in the nuance
these characters who by the way will
never overcome these things Paul will
never get over this tragedy this kid
will never conquer the disease but I
think what we've achieved is that when
you see these two go from being
completely detached from life to living
just a little bit it's very emotional
and it's very moving and in that way I
think reflects you know on all of us in
our own in our own worlds as you have
directed more and more what have you
learned about the process that maybe
you've refined as the career has gone on
maybe you were certain way at the
beginning and now you're more
comfortable with certain things or how
haven't changed yes you try to evolve
constantly I mean some of it is just
brute for some of it is is you know
learning picking up things of camera
Muno a great thing that I really feel
like I learned in this movie from Giles
who is just a brilliant cinematographer
was the idea of having characters move
into frame it's a very basic concepts
not something that I had never thought
of before but he was very very good at
this so in other words instead of
setting you know we're here instead of
setting something right close maybe it's
close and then the character is going to
move into that you know you mean this is
a some of it is just technique and it's
I just feel like the more you do it the
more tools you have in your bag all the
time in the big picture I think that I'm
probably a little more flexible than I
was originally because I was I think
originally very focused on we need to do
abcdefg now I try to separate what I
think is essential and what I think is
something I would like to have I did
that a lot on this movie i literally
would have list
of have to have would like to have if
there's time would have it's very
practical but it helps sure you know
it's like the old you know the Mike
Tyson quote everyone has a plan until
they get punched in the face that's what
indie filmmaking is you know everybody
you know you go in there with you no
plans and cranes and this and that and
then you get there and it's like oh ok
this is it all right well but let's dig
in and let's figure out how how we're
going to make this work on very short
amount of time yeah it's so funny
because I have this conversation with so
many indie directors of people like not
even in D just every director you're
you're forced to adapt to the challenges
of the day yes whether an actor is sick
whatever the reason is yes and in
ultimately when the critics and everyone
sees it none of that matters right and
you have to do the best you can well the
interesting thing about filmmaking I
think as in as an art form is that you
don't have a the ability to do it for as
long as another when you're when you're
writing a script you can spend as much
time as you want unless you're on some
come deadline from outside and you're
sort of responsible for those are the
choices you made here it's a little bit
like being a downhill skier you know in
the Olympics yeah you want to hit every
gate but guess what sometimes you're out
there and you're like I'm missing gates
I've missed this and you hope not to
miss it an open there's things about the
movie that I wish I had done better you
know that's just how that's the nature
of making movies one hundred percent my
last question for you because I have to
go and I'm sure you do too um you got to
work with Dave for for so long and i'm
sure you have amazing memories and I
could talk for an hour just about that
but is there a day or two they always
remember that really stands out from the
show or it's just like maybe it's a
crazy off-the-wall story of just like I
mean if you know what I mean right and
by the way I'm putting like years and
years and to get a one-story yeah um oh
god
my head is not at all or maybe or maybe
like you met a an actor or director or
musician that really you know impound
I'll tell you you know as you kind of
chug along in your little show business
career I think you have these moments
where you have kind of these out-of-body
experiences and I remember once we were
at an Emmy dinner in California and I
was sitting at a table with david
letterman and Johnny Carson and maybe
six other people and someone came over
and started talking to Dave it was the
girlfriend of the chef I think whatever
look and she said I once saw you in an
elevator and you were so tall so what
taller it was very awkward and strange
and Dave didn't know what to do with
this and all of a sudden johnny is
sitting over here I'm over here and
Johnny Dave's just caught he's
handcuffed now by this woman who keeps
telling him that he's tall you know and
all of a sudden johnny almost under his
breath says all he's big he's a please a
big man and I just instinctively with
Adam I thought about it another second I
would have not had the courage but I
then just turned to Johnny I'm like oh
god he's huge look at him and Johnny's
like yeah Johnny and I are going back
and forth I'm like what are you supposed
to go like that buys clothes and dave is
dealing with this one moved very well
aware that Johnny Carson and I are
making front of him and it's one of
these moments where if ever in my life I
thought that I would be sitting at a
table a Johnny Carson and I would be
together making fun of David Letterman
I'm out tombstone written I'm done thank
you
yeah it was it's one of my favorite
things um thank you so much for your
time thank you I'll wait to see your
movie I appreciate it have a fantastic
day let me hit stop
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