Coilovers VS Shocks & Springs with Goodwin Racing
Summary
TLDRIn this video, Ryan from Good Racing discusses the nuances between shocks and springs versus coilovers, highlighting their features, differences, and considerations for vehicle upgrades. He clarifies misconceptions, emphasizing that coilovers aren't necessarily easier to install despite being a complete assembly. Ryan also addresses the importance of spring rates and shock tuning, cautioning that budget coilovers often compromise on shock quality for ride comfort. He suggests that for street cars prioritizing ride quality, high-end coilovers or a combination of shocks and springs might be more suitable.
Takeaways
- 🔧 Shocks and springs are interchangeable with factory parts, allowing for piecemeal upgrades over time.
- 🌟 A coilover is a full assembly that replaces the entire shock and spring assembly, providing a more integrated system.
- 🔩 The adjustable features of coilovers, such as threaded bodies, allow for infinite ride height adjustments.
- 🚗 The installation of coilovers can be more involved due to the need for fine-tuning the ride height and shock settings.
- 🏎 Coilovers are designed for improved handling and performance, often with stiffer spring rates than factory setups.
- 💸 Budget coilovers may compromise on shock quality and tuning, which significantly impacts ride quality.
- 🛣 For street use where ride comfort is a priority, higher-end coilovers or a combination of shocks and springs may be more suitable.
- 🔨 Installing shocks and springs requires a spring compressor and can be a more straightforward process compared to coilovers.
- 🔄 Adjustable shocks allow for personal preference in terms of stiffness and can be easily adjusted without major installation hassles.
- 🏁 On a track, budget coilovers can provide a fun experience, but their ride quality may suffer on regular roads.
- ⚖️ The choice between shocks/springs and coilovers should be guided by the car's intended use and personal preferences for ride and handling.
Q & A
What is the main difference between shocks and springs versus coilovers?
-The main difference is that coilovers are a full assembly that replaces the entire shock and spring assembly on a car, while shocks and springs are interchangeable with factory parts and can be upgraded piecemeal.
Why are coilovers sometimes referred to as 'shocks and springs' in the older car community?
-In the older car community, 'coilovers' might refer to a different setup where the shock is in one place and the spring is somewhere else in the suspension system, unlike modern coilovers where the spring is over the shock.
What is the advantage of having a removable spring perch on shocks?
-A removable spring perch allows for adjustments in ride height by moving the perch to different grooves on the shock body, providing some control over the ride height that is not typically available with just shocks and springs.
How does the adjustability of coilovers affect the installation process?
-The adjustability of coilovers means that during installation, the car will need to be raised and lowered multiple times to achieve the desired ride height, making the installation process more involved compared to shocks and springs.
Why might coilovers come with stiffer springs than factory springs?
-Coilovers are designed to improve handling and performance, and stiffer springs help with cornering, reducing dive and nose-dive under braking, which are essential for performance driving.
What is the misconception about budget coilovers that the video script aims to clarify?
-The misconception is that budget coilovers are suitable for street cars that are not used for racing, as they are thought to be sufficient for occasional spirited driving. However, the video explains that budget coilovers often compromise on shock quality and tuning, which affects ride quality on the street.
Why are higher-end coilovers recommended for street cars where ride quality is a priority?
-Higher-end coilovers, like Öhlins, are recommended for street cars because they offer better shock tuning and quality, which translates to a better ride quality despite having stiffer spring rates.
What is the role of bump stops in a suspension upgrade and why are they important?
-Bump stops prevent the suspension from bottoming out, and they are important to replace when lowering a car, as worn-out factory bump stops can be harsher than new ones. Replacing them at the same time as shocks and springs avoids the need for additional work.
What is the purpose of the threading on the body of a coilover?
-The threading on the body of a coilover allows for infinite adjustability of the ride height by threading the bottom cup and lower spring perch up or down the shock body.
Why might someone choose shocks and springs over coilovers for their vehicle?
-Someone might choose shocks and springs over coilovers if they prefer a simpler installation process, want to maintain the ability to use factory parts, or if they are looking for a more straightforward upgrade without the complexity of adjustable components.
Outlines
🔧 Understanding Shocks, Springs, and Coilovers
Ryan from Good Racing discusses the differences between shocks and springs versus coilovers. He clarifies misconceptions and explains the pros and cons of each, advising on what to consider for one's own vehicle. The conversation starts with the semantics of 'coilovers,' explaining that on older cars, the spring and shock are separate, but on newer models like the Miata, the coil spring is over the shock, making it a coilover. The video aims to provide clarity on these terms and their applications in aftermarket car modifications.
🛠️ Features of Shocks and Springs
The script explains that shocks and springs are interchangeable with factory parts, allowing for piecemeal upgrades over time. It highlights the importance of replacing factory bump stops when lowering a car. The video showcases specific products like Koni Sport shocks and Eibach springs, emphasizing the compatibility and upgradeability of these components. A unique feature of some shocks is the removable spring perch, which allows for ride height adjustments without changing the spring itself.
🌟 The Advantages of Coilovers
Coilovers offer infinite adjustability in ride height due to their threaded design, which is a significant feature over traditional shocks and springs. The video points out that coilovers always come with stiffer springs than factory setups, designed to improve handling and performance. It also mentions that the shock in a coilover system is tuned for the specific spring rate, ensuring optimal performance. However, the script warns that the ease of installation is not a benefit of coilovers, as they require fine-tuning and adjustments to achieve the desired ride height.
🚗 Choosing the Right Suspension Upgrade
The script advises against choosing coilovers for the wrong reasons, such as ease of installation, and emphasizes the importance of understanding one's driving needs. It discusses the misconception that budget coilovers can provide both performance and comfort, explaining that compromises are often made in shock quality and tuning at lower price points. The video suggests that for street cars where ride quality is a priority, higher-end coilovers or a combination of shocks and springs might be more suitable. It concludes by encouraging viewers to contact the company for personalized advice on choosing the right suspension components for their specific vehicle and usage.
Mindmap
Keywords
💡Shocks and Springs
💡Coilovers
💡Pros and Cons
💡Ride Height
💡Spring Perch
💡Bump Stops
💡Adjustable Shocks
💡Threaded Body
💡Budget Coilovers
💡Ride Quality
Highlights
Discussing the differences between shocks and springs versus coilovers.
Explaining the misconceptions about shocks, springs, and coilovers.
Defining coilovers and their components.
The importance of compatibility with factory parts.
The benefits of piecemeal upgrades over time.
The necessity of replacing bump stops when lowering a car.
The adjustable feature of Koni shocks and its impact on ride height.
Threading on coilovers for infinite adjustability of ride height.
The inclusion of stiffer springs with coilovers and their impact on handling.
The misconception that coilovers are easier to install than shocks and springs.
The importance of shock tuning for different spring rates.
The difference between adjustable shocks and coilovers in terms of installation and adjustment.
Why budget coilovers may not be the best choice for street cars.
The gold standard for ride quality with performance shocks.
The analogy between budget coilovers and Porsche ride quality.
Recommendations for street cars considering ride quality and handling.
The importance of understanding the compromises made in budget coilovers.
Offering assistance for specific car recommendations through the Contact Us page.
Transcripts
it is Ryan with good racing and we're
going to talk about shocks and springs
versus coilovers we're going to kind of
cover the features and the differences
between both the pros and cons of each
and most importantly what you might want
to consider for your own vehicle if
you're trying to decide between the two
there are a lot of misconceptions that
we see when people are talking about the
pros and cons of these so we'll try to
set that straight and cover those in
this video
now talking about coil overs wouldn't be
complete if we didn't start with at
least covering a bit of semantics if
you're talking to somebody who maybe
works more with muscle cars or someone
who's a little more old-school if you
say coil overs they may be thinking
something a little different than what
you're talking about
on a lot of older cars trucks to this
day etc you have a shock in one place on
the vehicle and you have a spring
somewhere else in the suspension system
they are not together but on a Miata the
spring the coil is already over the
shock this is effectively a coil spring
on shock assembly it's a coil over so
rocky here at Rocky's me automotive
anytime somebody comes by and says that
they're thinking about putting a coil
over on their Miata
he likes to have it a little bit of fun
and he says well me out has come with
coil overs and he's right mostly he's
just having fun being ornery but he is
absolutely right but in the aftermarket
world and the vocabulary used in the
aftermarket this is still a shock and a
spring this is a coil over coil over is
sort of shorthand to refer to a full
assembly that replaces the entire shock
and spring assembly on your car so with
a coil over you're getting the shock
body you're getting the spring the bump
stop assembly all the little hardware it
mounts to the bottom of the suspension
and usually it comes with the top hat as
well there are some cases where you're
going to reuse a factory top hat but for
the most part you're looking at a full
assembly okay now when we're talking
about the features of shocks and springs
the important thing to sort
keep in mind is that these are all
interchangeable with the factory parts
that are in the suspension already so
this shock can just replace a factory
shocking will work with the factory
Springs or you can replace these factory
Springs with some aftermarket lowering
springs like this and those can go right
on a factory shock because of that inter
compatibility with your factory parts
you can piecemeal this over time you can
do shocks now on factory springs and
then upgrade to your progress Springs
later something like that the other
thing is that as you are shopping for
stuff you are piecing together the parts
that you've decided you want to put
together as a kit so these are our
popular very popular coney sport shocks
and these are our progress springs these
are our bump stops that we sell on the
site very important to do bump stops
when you're doing shocks and springs if
you lower the car at all then you don't
want to use factory lanes bump stops
also the factory bump stops at rubber
and usually once you've got some miles
on the car they will have worn out and
so they'll actually be harsher than they
were when they were when the car was new
so bump stops are a good thing to
replace at the same time because it's no
extra work when you have those out of
the car to just put the new bump stops
on whereas you don't want to do it as
its own job because you have to remove
the entire shock and spring to replace
the bump stops now on the Kony's and
this is a feature that does not it's not
available on all companies but on some
of the companies you will see that there
are and hopefully you can see this there
are additional grooves on the body of
the shock now lots of replacement shocks
will just have a lower spring perch that
is welded to the shock body and at that
point you're just married to whatever
ride height the spring that you choose
gives you that's the right height that
you get kind of a cool feature with some
of the Kony's is that the perch is
removable and there's this c-clip which
clips into that groove so you can pull
the c-clip off of the shock body and you
can actually move it to one of these
other grooves that effectively means
that the shock I'm sorry the spring
perch will sit lower on the shock body
and that lowers the right height we do
have for the generations of Miata that
this is available on the Kony's we do
have notes about you know what those
different groove positions will get you
in terms of changing ride height but
that's kind of a really cool feature
because at least you get a little bit of
control over your ride height which you
usually don't get when you're dealing
with just shocks and springs now when
we're talking about coil overs there's a
lot going on here
but ultimately the main feature that
separates a coil over from a replacement
shock is going to be that the body of
the coil over is all threaded and
hopefully you can also see that in the
video here but the reason for that
threading is that this bottom cup which
has the lower mounting point that mounts
to the suspension this is threaded
inside so you can loosen this lock
collar and this entire cup here
will thread up and down on the shock
body similarly the lower spring perch is
also threaded on the inside so you can
loosen to the lower lock color that's
here and then by hand you can just turn
this entire spring perch and lower it or
raise it on the shock body which both of
those effectively change the ride height
of the vehicle and so because you've got
this this long threaded area you now
have a huge range that you can play with
to adjust your ride height also changing
the shock length or the entire shock
overall length has some other benefits
we won't it's a little too complicated
to get into here but you can actually
set your your total bump travel and
things like that by way of changing your
your overall shock length and so that
infinite adjustability within that range
is what you get with a coil over that
you don't get with shocks now another
thing to keep in mind is the coil overs
are always coming with much stiffer
springs than your factory Springs
there's a huge range of what spring
rates they may come
each manufacturer picks different rates
and you know it depends on what the
coilover is sort of aimed at doing and
where it's supposed to be used you know
it's offensive full race setup then you
may be doing with massively higher rates
if it's something that's supposed to be
sort of straddling between track and
street use it may be not too extreme but
it's always going to be significantly
stiffer than factory spring rates and
the key is that the shock then at least
with quality coilovers the shock is
going to be tuned for that spring rate
so whereas a shock that was really
designed around working with a factory
spring with that you can go a little bit
stiffer on the spring but not massively
you can't do four times the stiffness or
something like that the shop won't
really work right with that spring on a
coilover it will it will work for
whatever spring rate it is designed for
and so you have coilovers that have
significantly different spring rates
than the factory and it works it's all
designed as a unit to work together now
something that we see occasionally
people talk about wanting to do coil
overs because it's a whole assembly and
they figure it's going to be an easier
install with a coil over versus a
assembly where they have to carry over
some factory parts and that is not the
right reason to be deciding between
shocks or coil overs and here's why with
a shock and spring replacement yes
you're gonna have to take the factory
spring and shock out of the car and
you're going to need a spring compressor
which is a little extra step because
you're going to need to disassemble that
assembly and move some of the factory
parts over to your new assembly but
don't be afraid of that if the shotgun
spring is the right thing for you and
how you're using the car that's just
what you need to do the coil over while
it may seem appealing that hey it's it's
a full assembly top-to-bottom I don't
need to rent that spring compressor to
because I don't have to disassemble my
factory spring and shock
because I don't have to carry anything
over to it there's a whole separate side
of things that come with adjustable
coilovers that make the install more
involved not less so the adjustability
the infinite adjustability that you get
on a coil over here this is a
double-edged sword it's a great thing
from the perspective of you can dial it
in to be exactly what you want and a lot
of people are looking for that but ease
of install isn't something that it's
trying to accomplish I have never seen
somebody take a coil over install it on
their car put the car in the ground and
just go it's perfect it doesn't happen
we've got three and sees out there and
every one of them if you put the same
coil over on and you set it on the
ground it's going to sit as a slightly
different height and that's for a lot of
different reasons different weights
between different cars with different
configurations
you know the bushings different ages on
the bushings they bind a little bit more
a little less every car is gonna sit a
little differently you're going to have
to take that coil over install it in the
car put it on the ground step back take
your measurements of your ride height
and you go okay that's you know I want
to change this by a half inch here and a
quarter inch there you're gonna put it
back in the air you're gonna make some
adjustments you put it back on the
ground
you're gonna go okay that's closer but
it's still not there you're gonna have
the car up and down up and down several
times during the installation process
that is just that double-edged sword
that comes with a lot of adjustability
on a coilover if you're one of those
guys who says you know what that's more
than I want to deal with you just want
something that you install in the car
and put it on the ground and forget
about it and just go enjoy the car shock
and spring might be the right choice for
you on that same note the adjustable
shocks I like to cover sometimes I hear
people echoing that same sentiment they
want something that's just an install
and forget it and they're sort of scared
of the adjustable shock that you get
with like a coney where you can make it
stiffer or softer
I try to emphasize to people that that
is not a bad thing it's not quite the
same as the adjustable ride height where
you really have to sit there and spend
time with it and to get it right for
your car with the shock I usually say
set it to the middle and basically the
midpoint in the range between stiff and
firm stiff and firm between stiff firm
and soft and then go drive it you drive
it one time you're going to immediately
see what it feels like and you're going
to say I wanted a little stiffer I want
a little softer and you can just reach
in there turn that knob and if you're
the type of guy who wants to pick a
setting and just forget about it then
you can you may never have to adjust
that shock after day 1 day 1 you do a
couple of test drives you find the shock
setting that you like and then you leave
it forever but the cool thing about
having the adjustable shock that you
don't get with a shock that's not
adjustable in that regard is that you
can dial it in to your your taste your
preference everybody's you know got a
different version of what's right it's a
lot like exhaust we always say you know
one guy's version of too loud is the
next guy's version of too quiet same
with shocks one guys version of too
stiff is the next guys version of too
soft you know one guy wants this car to
feel like a race car and one guy wants
something that's you know rides really
nice so having that adjustability lets
you dial it in for what you want the car
to feel like so don't be afraid of that
adjustment it's certainly not the
Pandora's box that can be the the
adjustable threaded body on a coilover
now while we're talking about reasons
that one or the other might be the right
way to go for you there's another
element to definitely mention and that
is that the coil overs as I said always
come good bit stiffer on spring rates
than your factory setup or then most of
yours you know lowering springs are
going to be offered in now a coil over
is designed for improving the handling
of the car and making it corner flatter
and dive nosedive less under braking and
all of that things that when you're
doing performance driving though
things that you want so the the stiffer
spring rates are an important piece to
that puzzle but it's important to keep
in mind that it's very difficult to make
a stiff spring ride well now that's not
to say that it can't be done
the öhlins that i've got right here this
is what we consider the gold standard
for ride quality with a performance
shock
well lynnes does a phenomenal job this
is a dual flow valve that actually soaks
up harsh it's better than most of the
competition this rides really nicely and
it's surprising that it can ride as well
as it does for the supreme rates that it
comes with but you kind of get into a
trap when you start looking at budget
coilovers and so that brings up a point
that i think is really important to
cover and perhaps the largest
misconception that we hear all the time
go something like this we'll be talking
with somebody and they'll say hey i'm
shopping for coilovers i don't know
which ones i should be picking can help
and so we'll always ask what are you
doing with your car what's your priority
and we do that because how you're using
your car dictates what the right tool is
for the job and they'll reply with
something like this very often well it's
my street car and i have fun in the
twisties now and again but it's my
street car I'm not racing I'm not going
to the track so I figured a budget
coil-over is going to do everything that
I need I don't need something super
fancy and while that makes sense on the
surface that's actually completely
backwards and here's why when you look
at a coilover assembly that's a lot of
pieces and I'm just talking about
individual components not even
mentioning the R&D all the R&D that goes
into making a good coil over that all
works cohesively now if we're talking
about a budget coil or something in the
thousand dollar $1,200 range this is a
lot to try to make for a retail of $250
you know a thousand dollar coil over is
for coil overs so you have to do this
entire thing for a retail price of 250
bottom line is you can't
do that and achieve everything that's
something like the olan's here achieves
now that's not to say that all budget
coilovers are bad but budget coilovers
must make compromises somewhere and
usually where we see the greatest
compromise is being made is in the shock
the quality of the shock the tuning of
the shock and the shock is the key to
ride quality and so the higher end stuff
while it also performs well on the
racetrack better the big difference is
that it's gonna ride a lot better it's
going to be able to handle bumps better
now I can go to the racetrack on a
budget coil over and I can have fun all
day long at the racetrack I'm not
worried about rag quality I don't care
if fun is the number one priority then I
can have a blast on a budget coilover
it's a little you know it's stiffer it
gets the car lower and so a lot of those
things that you need for just kind of
the car not feeling out of place at a
racetrack a budget coilover will be able
to deliver that have a ball at a
racetrack on a budget of coilover now if
we're talking about racing some sort of
competition something we're lap times
mattered then obviously a higher end
coil-over is going to again be what's
important because that better shock and
the better shop tuning is going to all
be able to keep the tire on the ground
and connected with the ground better
than a lower end shock but for fun
factor you can have a ton of fun with a
budget coil over at a racetrack but when
you take that same budget coil over and
you drive onto a regular road now ride
quality is a big you know priority now
on the regular street as I'm going over
potholes and railroad tracks and hitting
bumps that is going to be disappointing
and that's where the disappointment of a
budget coilover comes in or shows itself
the most
so that is why particularly for a fun
street car we recommend the öhlins
almost every time the ol ends are gold
as I said gold standard for ride quality
these ride
really well for having the sticker
spring needs now even that even the old
ones it should be noted is not gonna
ride like a Cadillac they do have
stiffer spring rates but I'd like to
draw the analogy and that it's kind of
like a Porsche
you know it's firmer but it's not harsh
and that's the key the more budget
oriented stuff is going to be harsh now
we do have some great budget coilover
options and that's not to say that those
may not be the right thing for you it's
just important to understand that there
are compromises that are made as you
look at different tiers and different
price points so for a street car where
ride quality is one of the top concerns
and you also want good handling and all
of that you actually really want to be
considering either on the lower end for
for budget you either want to do the
shock and perhaps a vinyl lower in
spring that will ride beautifully and
there are a lot of combinations of the
different perch height so in the
different Springs that you might pick
that might get you the right height that
you want or you want to skip over the
budget coilover block and really be
considering something in the upper end
because that's going to deliver the ride
quality that you're looking for in a
street car now between different
generations of Miata there are various
features of different coil overs and
what certain parts can give you and
which lowering springs are available for
that year and and all of those things
and this video isn't about trying to
cover all those different details across
the generations this video is already
long enough as it is but that's why we
have a Contact Us page on our website
we've got our phone and our email there
give us a ring shoot us an email we'll
be more than happy to go over your
specific car with you how you're using
it and help you find the right tool for
the job so that you can have the most
fun with your car possible so look
forward to talking to you soon and have
a great day
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