AWS Skilled-Based HIRING PROGRAM w. Director of Recruiting (AWS)

Summary

In this insightful video, Holly Lee, founder of Holly Le, and Matt, a senior director at Amazon, discuss Amazon's rigorous hiring process and the company's innovative approach to talent acquisition. They delve into the STAR method for answering interview questions, the importance of Amazon's leadership principles, and the recent skill-based hiring initiative that opens opportunities to candidates without a four-year degree. Matt shares his 13-year journey at Amazon, from a contract recruiter to his current role, emphasizing the value of continuous learning and adaptability in the fast-paced tech industry.

Takeaways

• 😀 Holly Lee is the founder of Holly Le, dieo and a VIP coach, known for her expertise in Amazon's hiring process.
• 🏆 Matt has been with Amazon for over 13 years, starting as a contract recruiter and moving through various roles, including Director of AWS early career.
• 🤖 Matt's early roles at Amazon involved supporting the fraud prevention business and being part of one of the first teams to delve into machine learning.
• 📚 Matt helped create and scale the 'Amazon Future Engineer' program, which provided computer science education to millions of students globally.
• 🌐 The 'Amazon Future Engineer' program expanded beyond the US and Canada to the UK, France, Germany, and India, impacting international education systems.
• 🛠️ Matt discussed the 'bar raiser' program at Amazon, emphasizing the importance of leadership principles and the STAR method in interviews.
• 🎓 Amazon has been focusing on skill-based hiring, targeting individuals without four-year degrees and engaging with community colleges for talent development.
• 💼 Holly emphasized the importance of concise communication, advocating for a '16-second Spiel' to effectively convey one's points in a快节奏 environment.
• 🔑 Matt shared insights on interviewing for higher-level positions at AWS, noting the importance of demonstrating impact and understanding business scale.
• 🔄 Holly addressed concerns about career gaps, advising job seekers to focus on storytelling and not to let gaps affect their confidence during interviews.
• 🔑 Matt confirmed that AWS is open to hiring those with career gaps, highlighting the importance of how candidates present their experiences and reasons for the gap.

Q & A

Who is Holly Lee and what is her role?

Holly Lee is the founder of Holly Le, dieo, and she runs a VIP coach and cohort. She is known for her expertise in coaching for Amazon interviews, although she clarifies that she is not an Amazon coach herself.

What is Matt's background at Amazon?

Matt joined Amazon 13 years ago as a contract recruiter, supporting the fraud prevention business. He moved to various roles including a full-time role, recruiting manager, and later led recruiting teams for events and software engineers. He also helped hire economists and machine learning scientists for Amazon's Consumer division.

What is the STAR method mentioned in the script?

The STAR method is a structured way of answering behavioral interview questions. It stands for Situation, Task, Action, and Result. Holly Lee emphasizes its importance in Amazon's high hiring bar for critical thinking and answering interview questions effectively.

Can you explain the Amazon Future Engineer program that Matt worked on?

The Amazon Future Engineer program was an initiative aimed at providing high-quality Computer Science Education to all students, with a focus on underrepresented and underserved students. Matt helped scale the program globally, reaching about 10 million students, including offering full computer science courses and professional development for teachers.

What is Matt's current role at Amazon?

Matt is currently the Director of AWS Early Career, a role he has been in for about 3 years. His responsibilities include hiring on a large scale for AWS, particularly focusing on early career opportunities.

What is the 'bar raiser' program at Amazon?

The 'bar raiser' program at Amazon is a training program for employees who are involved in the hiring process. It helps them to maintain high hiring standards across the company. Matt has participated in and facilitated this program.

What does Holly Lee mean by the '16-second spiel' in the context of Amazon interviews?

Holly Lee refers to the concept of condensing one's responses to interview questions into a concise format that can be delivered within 16 seconds. This is based on her experience that Amazon executives expect quick, clear, and impactful answers.

How does Matt approach interviewing candidates for technical roles when he is not technically inclined?

Matt focuses on the leadership principles and competencies, as well as the candidate's ability to articulate their impact and results. He leaves the technical evaluation to those with the relevant expertise.

What advice does Matt give for candidates interviewing for level seven and level eight positions at AWS?

Matt suggests that candidates should clearly articulate the scope and scale of their past experiences and accomplishments. He also emphasizes the importance of understanding the leadership principles and being able to quantify the impact of their work.

What is the skill-based program at Amazon and who is the target audience?

The skill-based program at Amazon is aimed at hiring individuals who may not have a four-year degree but possess valuable skills and potential. It targets various roles, including those in AWS and data centers, and is also focused on providing professional readiness to students from community colleges.

How does Amazon handle career gaps on resumes?

According to Holly Lee, Amazon does not necessarily view career gaps negatively. It's more about the story behind the gap and how candidates explain their time off and its relevance to the role they are applying for.

Outlines

00:00

😀 Introduction to Holly Lee and Matt's Amazon Journey

Holly Lee introduces herself as the founder of Holly Le,dieo and a VIP coach, emphasizing her experience with Amazon's rigorous hiring process. She introduces Matt, who has been with Amazon for over a decade, starting as a contract recruiter and moving through various roles, including supporting machine learning initiatives and launching the Amazon Future Engineer program. Matt's role has evolved to Director of AWS early career, highlighting the difficulty of promotions within Amazon and the high hiring bar.

05:02

📚 Amazon's Skill-Based Hiring and Education Initiatives

The discussion shifts to Amazon's new focus on skill-based hiring, targeting individuals without four-year degrees who could be valuable contributors. Initiatives include partnerships with community colleges and a micro-internship program to provide paid, flexible work opportunities for students. Matt's involvement as a 'bar raiser' at Amazon is highlighted, along with his experience in interviewing candidates across various roles and the importance of Amazon's leadership principles.

10:02

🕒 The Art of Concise Communication in Interviews

Holly and Matt delve into the importance of concise communication during interviews, with Holly advocating for a '16-second spiel' to quickly and effectively convey one's message. They discuss the STAR method for answering interview questions and the need to inspire dialogue. Matt shares his personal experience of refining his interview responses to be more succinct and the value of clear, impactful storytelling.

15:03

💼 Insights on Interviewing for Senior Roles at AWS

Matt provides advice for candidates interviewing for level seven and eight positions at AWS, emphasizing the importance of demonstrating scope and scale in one's accomplishments. He discusses the need to understand the size of the business one is interviewing for and to articulate one's impact effectively. The conversation also touches on the availability of graduate and intern positions and the upcoming skill-based program.

20:04

🔍 Navigating the Amazon Hiring Process and Career Gaps

The final paragraph addresses strategies for maximizing one's chances of getting an interview at Amazon, including understanding and practicing responses to leadership principle questions. Matt advises on the importance of quantifying results in interview answers and warns against using recent examples without clear outcomes. The conversation also covers the handling of career gaps, with Holly asserting that the narrative around the gap is more important than the gap itself.

Keywords

💡Amazon

Amazon is a multinational technology company known for its e-commerce platform, but also for its cloud computing services through Amazon Web Services (AWS). In the video, Amazon is portrayed as a high-bar employer with a rigorous hiring process and a culture of innovation. The script discusses the experiences of individuals working at Amazon, highlighting the company's emphasis on leadership principles and the STAR method for answering interview questions.

💡STAR method

The STAR method is a structured approach to responding to behavioral interview questions. It stands for Situation, Task, Action, and Result. The script emphasizes the importance of this method at Amazon, suggesting that candidates should be well-versed in using it to answer interview questions effectively, as it helps in demonstrating one's problem-solving skills and impact.

💡VIP coach

A VIP coach, as mentioned in the script, is a personal or professional coach who provides high-level, often exclusive, guidance and support. Holly Lee introduces herself as a VIP coach, indicating that she offers premium coaching services, particularly for navigating the hiring process at high-standard companies like Amazon.

💡Machine learning

Machine learning is a subset of artificial intelligence that allows computers to learn and improve from experience without being explicitly programmed. In the context of the video, it is noted that the speaker's early roles at Amazon involved supporting a technical organization that was pioneering in machine learning, indicating the company's advanced technical nature and the importance of this field in their business.

💡Recruiting manager

A recruiting manager is responsible for overseeing the recruitment process within an organization. The script mentions the speaker's transition from a contract recruiter to a full-time role and then to a recruiting manager, highlighting a career progression path within Amazon and the importance of recruitment in supporting business needs.

💡Amazon Future Engineer

Amazon Future Engineer is an educational program aimed at providing underrepresented and underserved students with access to high-quality computer science education. The script describes the speaker's role in creating and scaling this program, reaching millions of students globally, which underscores Amazon's commitment to education and diversity in the tech industry.

💡Leadership principles

Amazon's leadership principles are a set of values and behaviors that the company expects from its employees. The script refers to these principles as a key focus area during the interview process, suggesting that candidates must not only demonstrate technical skills but also align with Amazon's core values and culture.

💡Bar raiser

A 'bar raiser' at Amazon is an employee who has undergone training to participate in the hiring process, ensuring that candidates meet the company's high standards. The script mentions the speaker's experience as a bar raiser, indicating the rigorous and participatory nature of Amazon's recruitment culture.

💡Skill-based program

The skill-based program discussed in the script refers to Amazon's initiative to hire candidates based on their skills rather than traditional educational qualifications like a four-year degree. This approach aims to broaden the talent pool and recognize diverse backgrounds and experiences, as illustrated by the speaker's work with community colleges and the micro-internship concept.

💡Micro-internship

A micro-internship, as described in the script, is a short-term, paid work opportunity that allows students to gain experience in a field without committing to a traditional, longer-term internship. Amazon's exploration of this concept with North Virginia Community College is an example of the company's innovative approach to providing accessible learning and work opportunities.

💡Career gap

A career gap refers to a period of time where an individual is not working in their professional field. In the script, the discussion around career gaps addresses concerns about how they might impact job prospects. The advice given is to focus on the story behind the gap and to present it positively, emphasizing personal growth or new skills acquired during that time.

Highlights

Introduction of Holly Lee, founder of Holly Le, dieo, and her VIP coach and cohort experience.

Matt's 13-year journey at Amazon, starting as a contract recruiter and moving through various roles including machine learning and fraud prevention.

The significance of Amazon's early adoption of machine learning and its impact on recruiting roles.

Holly's focus on Amazon's high hiring bar and the STAR method for answering interview questions.

Matt's involvement in creating and scaling the Amazon Future Engineer program, reaching 10 million students globally.

The importance of professional development for teachers in the Amazon Future Engineer program.

Matt's transition to Director of AWS Early Career and the scale of hiring for AWS.

The introduction of Amazon's skill-based hiring program, focusing on removing degree requirements for certain roles.

The concept of micro internships, offering paid experience for students who cannot commit to traditional internships.

Matt's role as a bar raiser at Amazon and the importance of the leadership principles in the hiring process.

Holly's emphasis on the 16-second spiel for concise communication in interviews and presentations.

Matt's perspective on the importance of scope and scale in presenting one's experience during interviews for higher-level positions.

Tips for interviewing at AWS, including understanding leadership principles and practicing the STAR method.

The availability of AWS graduate and intern positions, and advice on applying early and networking.

Holly's advice on handling career gaps in resumes and the importance of storytelling in interviews.

Matt's recommendation for senior directors seeking jobs outside of Amazon, emphasizing the importance of role appropriateness and continuous learning.

Closing remarks from Holly and Matt, thanking the audience for their participation and support.

Transcripts

[Music]

hello everybody if you guys are tuning

in for the very first time my name is

Holly Lee I am the founder of Holly Le

dieo I run a VIP coach and cohort for

the longest time for the last nearly

five years I nominated by my YouTube and

Linkedin commun to be the Amazon coach

but I am not again I am not an Amazon

coach but I love to live and brece

through the Amazon's High hiring bar of

diving deep on thinking really critical

in answering your interview questions

using the star method again Amazon did

not invented the star method but the bar

it is extremely high out of all the

employer that I've worked for and I have

worked for most of the 90% of the

maintained companies out there but

enough about all of that I wanted to

quickly introduce you to Matt so I

joined Amazon about 13 years years ago I

actually joined as a contract recruiter

supporting our fraud prevention business

moved to full-time role supporting that

business then moved to a recruiting

manager role for that business that was

an interesting business to support it

was very technical organization they

were one of the first in Amazon to

really get into machine learning as well

and so those roles became important for

the organizations from there as Holly

mentioned we had some reorganization

within Amazon there was was a bigger

consumer organization coming together

our recruiting organizations did the

same thing and at that time I moved to

kind of some centers of excellence type

recruiting teams and leading those

around events recruiting where we had

some teams based in Seattle recruiting

together for software engineers and then

also helped hire some of the first

economists in Amazon supporting our

cheap economists at the time and some of

our research scientists machine learning

scientists for Consumer I did that for

four or five years and then I kind of

leaned into Amazon's working backwards

process and narrative writing culture

and I wrote an idea around a program

called Amazon future engineer this

program at a high level was interested

in making sure all students particularly

underrepresented and underserved

students had access to highquality

Computer Science Education and then that

became my next job and so I was

fortunate to get some support from our

business teams to start this program and

then eventually scale the program in my

time with the program we reached about

10 million students globally with

Computer Science Education including

about 130,000 students in the US with a

full computer science course and

focusing on helping teachers with

professional development so they could

bring a computer science course to their

school and then my last with that

program I was supporting International

launches and we've launched that program

now outside the US and Canada the UK

France Germany and India and I believe

since I've moved on they've launched and

a few more but that was really

interesting work dealing with the public

education system I'd never had

experience with before and public

Educators and students KES or 12 very

interesting and then education systems

outside the US and then also what the

perceptions were of Amazon working with

public schools and things like that was

very interesting I moved about 3 years

ago into the role I'm in now which is

director of AWS early career and have

been doing this role I didn't have

experience prior with AWS so this was a

new business for me to support and then

early career space was new for me as

well so it's been really interesting

learning and then hiring on a scale that

I never would have dreamed of before to

to AWS and so that's been a great

experience so yeah that's a bit about my

journey here at Amazon and then most

recently moving to AWS the bridge

between the last two roles was I was

helping a lot of Young Learners learn

about technology and computer science

education and I was really key on like

how can we bridge that to great jobs and

specifically an early career I think

you're underselling yourself a little

bit it's not about uh Matt's background

being in talent talent acquisition

meaning recruiting right it is hard to

get promoted within Amazon and doing it

multiple times it is rare most people at

Amazon I'm not saying this to freak you

guys out it is true and I'm very matter

of fact you know you guys are here

because you know that I'm very

transparent I don't tell you things you

want to hear I tell you things you need

to know a lot of people retire as a

level seven because it's very hard to

get promoted from 5 to six and once

you're at that six uh level six that is

Mark Amazon to me because I have work at

Microsoft I worked at meta most recently

Facebook I work at Google in my earlier

on the career even though it is level to

level on than to thing but the hiring

bar and the scope and scale on Amazon is

too stripe above I can confidently share

that with you as well Matt because I was

there even as level seven at M is really

when you look at scoop and scale is more

like a five so let's chat a little bit

about the skill-based program it was

launched I believe I saw an article

pretty recently what is that about and

who would be the Right audience for it

as a part of the early career remit we

you might think of that primarily as

hiring from universities and forye

schools globally and that's true but

we've also started to get more into what

we described skill space hiring which

might be hiring folks who may not have a

4-year degree and this has already been

happening historically in our data

center hiring but now we're looking at

it in other areas and the essential

notion is we believe we call that

Amazon's raising the bar so we believe

there's bar raising Builders who might

not have a four-year degree that would

still be a valuable employee at Amazon

AWS and so for that notion looking at

where we might be able to remove degree

requirements we don't think it's

necessary to hire a bar raising Builder

the second part is focusing on

communities of talent that we can

support into getting into these pools

and primarily in the last year so's been

focusing on me college ships notably the

Seattle college system at which is in of

course Seattle but it's it's a few

community colleges in the Seattle area

and then also overlapping our hq2 region

around Arlington working with North

Virginia Community College on some

programming and working with their

students where we have these jobs

available and then the last part that we

mentioned in that an article was around

a micro internship concept that we're

going to start with North Virginia

Community College but it'll essentially

be some asynchronous work and tasks

which students do get paid for but

accommodate something outside your

traditional 12we internship

understanding that some students may not

be able to relocate across the country

or step out for 12 weeks to do a

traditional internship and they'll still

give them an opportunity to get some

paid experience working with along with

North Virginia Community College

so all the times that you have been with

Amazon Matt now did you participate or

were you facilitator in any of the

training any training bar raiser program

or anything like do you have do you have

time for that stuff yeah I'm a bar

raiser at Amazon so I've gone through

the bar raiser program participate at

active barer at Amazon and I

interestingly I did that training at the

beginning on my last role when we were

in the business and that exposed me to

then baring for all sorts of roles

across Amazon including some roles I

never had been familiar with before we

had a Services business and we were

hiring full-time electricians you know I

had to learn about and get experience i'

been pretty active in barer and then

also I've supported other barers in

training as they've been doing that and

supporting their process as well so

mostly in that and then towards my

earlier time at Amazon was more I

supported some of them making great

hiring decisions training that happens

for folks to get prepared to interview

others at Amazon now what type of

questions were you asking for an e guy I

mean this is completely outside of your

software consumer and product background

what were the competency or LP that you

were focusing I mean you really have to

lean in and especially as a bar raiser a

non-technical bar raiser on maybe a

technical Loop generally you really have

to lean into the leadership principles

and there's generally most the

competencies are oriented around that

and then we'll have some folks that can

look at the technical competencies those

leadership principles along with being

prepared for questions like tell me

about a time type of thing he should be

prepared for and those are the types of

questions that I would ask and I think

you'll get I didn't find it too unusual

to interview that so you can still get a

good sense of their impact and should

they as you mentioning towards the start

of this like working through the star

mes that getting to the results and

quantifying results you can still get a

good sense of their work and impact the

one thing I talk a lot about is the 16

second Spiel I know a lot of amazonians

especially the one who's been there for

10 plus years some of them may not agree

with me but and Matt I would love to

hear your point in that and I like to

ask a lot of the folks who are still at

Amazon for their feedback so basically

how I came up with the 60c not elevator

pitch but basically per each answer as

in playing ping pong we're not talking

about the entire interview each question

is a minute to wrap it up it usually

takes about 10 minutes or so even longer

but what I'm trying to teach my audience

in private coaching or my VIP uh

coaching program is going back and forth

like playing pingpong um because it all

started in Alexa where I have been yell

that a lot I'm very transparent but I

love love my growth opportunity at

Amazon is because it doesn't matter how

good you are it doesn't matter if you

have a lot of data it matters how incise

your data your matri are and you're able

to present that so because of being the

room with all these executive from

consumer to Alexa and then Kindle and

whatnot I've learned to tie myself 60c

from the moment I start making a

presentation no more than 60c or

someone's going to tell me to get the

hell out of the room to to avoid doing

so I taught myself a 16 minute Spiel so

I when I left Amazon I tried a same

Spiel at meta they did not like that

they asked me to slow down they're thing

I actually I man I would I've been

called I'm too Amazonian and they

haven't even worked at Amazon yet by the

way they're like yeah we have some

Amazonian in here they don't work out

cuz they're going too fast no I want to

see your white paper I'm like what no

white paper then how do you know what

what you how to build entire strategy

right so nothing like nope we don't want

to know we don't just tell us what you

need I'm like well I I need data to

prove my point the whole theory of the

60-second elevator speech or to time

yourself is you actually have 8 to 10

sentences to answer every single

interview answer what is your take on

that in the 60c or less being simple

concise is good a minute sounds fast but

as you get up to talking to yeah

director V level you definitely have

limited time to make your point to give

some context so when you switch roles at

Amazon you have to interview I had to do

that in a role I'm in currently and I

hadn't done it for a while I practiced

interviewing and I would Zoom tape

myself and I was looking at the time

coming down I didn't get down to a

minute it was coming down from initially

like 5 to six minute responses to maybe

like a third of that and I think what

helped was like you get what you said

get your main points in order to

understand the structure of how you want

to your answers and then agree that you

want to inspire a dialogue and and 2-way

conversation and if you go on for 5 six

minutes you kind of sucked the air out

of the room and the person might have

wanted to get in there in between and

you didn't allow for it so I think you

know one to two minutes is probably a

sweet spot on initial response and

generally being clear concise but also

getting through the entire kind of star

process and method is is important and

generally works well when it comes to

making presentations and being able to

influence at a level seven and level

eight levels man and this is more

appropriate for for you at the moment

what would you say it it is the best

tips that you could provide for those

who's interviewing for level seven and

level eight what is what differentiate

the two level when it comes to how they

show up for their interview at AWS it's

I a lot of it's kind of the scope and

scale of what you've done I think in

terms of how you present yourself and

communication those are finer points

that I believe get taken into

consideration but there's really kind of

a scope and scale that usually is a

determining factor and I think it's

important then as you're demonstrating

your abilities and talking about your

experience to make sure that's very

clear in what you've accomplished and

well articulated documented in your

resume hopefully so that comes across to

the interviewer it's helpful also to

understand if you're interviewing for

certain business or something you

understand the size and scope by which

they're operating and then you might be

able to kind of merge those two things a

bit to understand better where the

expectations might fly but that's really

the part that I think would

differentiate fol and you know you might

have done some like a kind of a project

but if you're doing it for some hundreds

of folks versus some millions of folks

that town and like even small problems

can become quite large at different

scales and so I think it's important to

if you have been operating at a very

large scale Andor built thing from the

ground up that you able to walk through

and want to that impact is Amazon and

the group companies including AWS

releasing graduate position for the

states yeah we have been making some

hires in some areas and certainly

interns intern positions have been open

and I would keep an eye out you know as

potentially business conditions change

that can change as well so you might

have observed just a more limited volume

if you've been been following like

year-over year but I believe we have had

Su they just might have come and gone

Pretty When does the Live program starts

I'm just going to assume that it is a

skill-based program has that started yet

met yeah so the skills based I mean it's

really more of an internal program the

opportunity for folks to apply to roles

without degrees exists now and it's

there's not necessarily one spot where

you can find all these roles that may

not require a degree but you can look at

some of the support roles in AWS some of

the data center roles and you'll see

that opportunity where we're working

with some of the community colleges that

is active happening right now we also

keep your eyes peeled but we do

sometimes School agnostic events and

virtual sometimes including over twitch

and running some of those sessions and

those are Global so we've done some of

those in India we've done some of those

in the states um so you can keep an eye

open for that and those are good I would

say professional preparation type

workshops we'll have Business Leaders on

the call we'll do mock interviews you'll

hear from some of the recruiters and

then they'll also talk about some of the

open positions so those are ongoing and

then the last on the micro internship

that will probably be coming with is

specific initially with the northern

Virginia College and that's coming

probably towards the if you're familiar

with the Amazon hiring process what do

you actually look for how can I maximize

my chances of getting an interview so

definitely you need to understand the

leadership principles of Amazon study

them I think you can find pretty good

resources publicly on the types of

questions which may get asked against

those leadership principles I definitely

think it's worth the time and effort to

practice I agree with Holly on thinking

practicing your answer having your keep

wies mapped out making sure when you

give a response you're able to Traverse

the whole starve process and then

particularly where folk I see folks

typically drop off is or whatever they

just the result is missing of and their

answer or it's it might be there but

hard to quantify and then also i'

probably be careful of giving examples

where you have maybe a good example but

it's fairly recent and you don't have a

result yet those are those are hard then

as a a person interviewing you to make

sense of is this raising the bar or not

cuz I can't quantify then hence like the

scope and size of what you're talking

about I can't really figure out yet so

I'd be careful on those those responses

and then after that I think where you're

able to give like a more novel answer or

something that might differentiate you a

bit from what you think the your

interviewer might hear a lot those are

good but more importantly I think is

getting through that whole star process

and having a good size and scope of

impact I recently interview for aw as

intrm this summer but I was notified

that I'm put on a weight list due to

access head count is there something I

can do to get off the weight list if

that was the case and you're not a fight

of that I don't have any VI information

we do have a certain volume of

internship available any given Year and

that said I would definitely be try to

be earlier than later of course when

you're applying and trying to network

maybe to get interviews for the

internship I think that is key depending

on the season and where you go to School

you may or may not see AWS

Representatives any given year so

definitely you be proactive self-drive

that um and also it's on the wait list

opportunities could come depending on

different business conditions that may

arise but yeah I wouldn't have any

additional information beyond that just

general tips that I'm able to offer is

there any chance will the skill-based

program be open as application for

people who already have a bachelor's

degree and who want to work with AWS

through this program yeah I mean again

the if you want to up app to rules that

don't require a degree and you have a

degree that's fine and then there's just

additional programming so the example I

use a lot when I talk is your average

and I've been I'm in Nashville now but

I've been based in Seattle for quite a

while your average computer science

student at University of Washington

usually has a lot of resources in the

form of their peers or maybe their

Professor that can speak to them a bit

about what it's like to interview and

even interm at Amazon and that's really

help your average student maybe at North

seatt College where they do now offer a

four-year care science degree may not

have those safe resources and so what

we're trying to do there is just make

sure there's a professional Readiness

Equity that we can provide both sets of

students that might be Ling for jobs so

that that's there regardless and then in

the case you might be interested in some

of the jobs that don't have a degree

requirement you have a degree is

perfectly fine do you have any

recommendation on how a senior director

can land a job outside of being able to

articulate and sharing their example

around the St method and all of that you

have to look at the size and the company

you're at with respect not just Amazon

but wherever you're looking so I think

that's important to make sure you're

looking at appropriate roles and

engaging around in appropriate roles so

that might be you know a lot of places

are smaller than Amazon so you might

need to look at roles that would be

different not not necessarily a director

title and it can go the other way too if

you're at a bigger company going a

smaller company or something the titles

might be so I think kind of helpful to

make sure you're trying to engage and

apply and get into the interview process

on appropriate roles so making sure

you're doing that in terms of technology

I mean I don't know if I have anything

novel other than technology is kind of

changing by the day lately and you know

generative Ai and all that I think at

the very least it's good to be up the

speed on those things being curious

about those things of course learn and

be curious is an important leadership

principle at Amazon so where you might

not have direct professional experience

maybe you're seeking certifications that

aw offers or learning modules that AWS

offers to show that Curiosity you're

trying to keep up with the the new

technology even though it might not be

prevalent from your company I think can

show a good sign of initiative and

curiosity just wanted to know if there's

any job opportunities Happ career Gap

and since I felt that my resume is not

getting shortlisted maybe because of

less experience let me ask you a

clarifying questions Emma When you

mention career Gap what are we referring

to is it one year 5 years 10 years I can

tell you right now this is the number

one questions that I'm getting a lot

average of 3 to 5 years and I think

that's forgiven since Co right A lot of

people are struggling to come back and

land the right role many have to pay the

bill I get it you're the head of househ

or your single mom or dad but I

personally do not think that career Gap

is an issue is about the story behind it

and I also have some Customer because

they were laid off at Co they went back

and got a master's degree or PhD

whatever your priority is it's about how

you tell your story and why you're

taking time off so don't let that Amper

your confident level and also should

probably say that many of you are afraid

to negotiate when it comes to salary two

years is nothing oh come on two years is

nothing I mentioned Co that's four years

ago 10 years I've heard 10 years 5 years

in average so remember tell a good story

and why you're taking a gap do not share

things that are personal to the

interviewer thank you so much everybody

for being there either you're new or

you're old thank you so much for your

support please thank Matt for his time

being there and thank you so much

everyone have a great day