How to Instantly Achieve a Calm State | Sam Harris on Impact Theory

Summary

In this impactful discussion, neuroscientist and philosopher Sam Harris delves into the nature of anxiety, the malleability of belief systems, and the pursuit of well-being. Harris emphasizes the power of framing and mindfulness in altering our emotional responses, suggesting that our internal narratives significantly shape our experiences. He advocates for a scientific mindset, applying critical thinking to all aspects of life, including spirituality and ethics. The conversation explores the importance of aligning our actions with a broader social good and the potential for meditation to cultivate mental resilience and clarity.

Takeaways

• 🧠 The human experience of anxiety and excitement share similar physiological responses, with the key difference being the framing and story we tell ourselves about the situation.
• 🌏 Sam Harris, a neuroscientist, philosopher, and best-selling author, is known for his unique perspective on a wide range of complex subjects and his ability to communicate difficult ideas clearly.
• 💡 The concept of a 'good life' is open-ended and involves the pursuit of human well-being, which includes effortless cooperation with others and the reduction of suffering and conflict.
• 🤔 Harris emphasizes the importance of having a personal 'north star' or purpose, which can guide one's life direction and provide a sense of meaning and utility.
• 📚 He advocates for a scientific attitude towards life, suggesting that beliefs should be malleable and open to new evidence and better arguments.
• 🧘‍♂️ Meditation is presented as a skill that can provide immense utility by allowing individuals to observe their emotions, including anxiety, from a place of indifference and without reactivity.
• 💪 The idea that skills have utility and can be developed for personal growth and to serve others is a central theme, with the suggestion that this pursuit can lead to a fulfilling life.
• 🧐 Harris discusses the tension between the need for personal well-being and the impact one has on the world, suggesting that a balance between internal states and external altruism is important.
• 📈 He also talks about the dangers of dogmatism and the necessity of maintaining an open mind to new ideas and perspectives for personal and societal growth.
• 🌱 The concept of mindfulness is introduced as a way to reframe negative emotions and cultivate a more positive and present mindset.
• 📚 Lastly, Harris shares his learning process, which involves a broad and continuous intake of information from various sources without a strict method or optimization.

Q & A

What is the main idea discussed by the speaker regarding the nature of anxiety and excitement?

The speaker suggests that anxiety and excitement are physiologically similar, with the main difference being the framing or the story one tells oneself about the situation. This implies that changing one's perspective can alter the experience of these emotions.

How does the speaker describe the relationship between our beliefs and our well-being?

The speaker posits that our beliefs should map onto reality to ensure well-being. Holding beliefs that are out of alignment with reality can lead to suffering, while being open to new evidence and better arguments can help maintain this alignment.

What is the role of conversation in understanding reality according to the speaker?

The speaker emphasizes that conversation is the primary mechanism for understanding reality. It allows for the possibility of being wrong and for error correction, which is essential for adapting to new information and maintaining a true perspective.

How does the speaker define a good life?

The speaker defines a good life as one that is open-ended and focused on human flourishing. It involves effortlessly cooperating with others, building a civilization where everyone can thrive, and avoiding the pitfalls of tribalism and partisanship.

What is the importance of skills in personal development according to the speaker?

The speaker highlights that skills have utility and are essential for personal development. Learning new skills can increase one's ability to serve oneself and others, contributing to a meaningful and impactful life.

How does the speaker view the concept of dogmatism in relation to beliefs?

The speaker views dogmatism as a hindrance to understanding reality. It involves holding onto beliefs regardless of evidence or argument, which can lead to conflict and a disconnect with the world and others.

What is the speaker's perspective on the potential of human well-being?

The speaker believes that the potential for human well-being is open-ended and possibly limitless. However, he acknowledges that we currently have a limited understanding of what ultimate flourishing for conscious minds might entail.

What is the role of institutions, laws, and norms in creating a thriving civilization, according to the speaker?

The speaker suggests that institutions, laws, and norms are necessary to reduce friction in interactions with strangers and to promote a civilization where everyone can thrive, based on cooperation and non-paranoid interactions.

How does the speaker relate the practice of meditation to the concept of a 'state shift'?

The speaker relates meditation to a 'state shift' by describing it as a practice that allows one to reset independently of external circumstances, enabling a change in one's internal state and fostering intrinsic well-being.

What does the speaker suggest as a method to combat negative emotions or a sense of being lost in life?

The speaker suggests mindfulness and reframing as methods to combat negative emotions. Mindfulness involves becoming aware of and interrupting negative thought patterns, while reframing involves telling oneself a better, more positive story.

How does the speaker describe the impact of beliefs and ideas on society and the importance of malleability in belief systems?

The speaker describes the impact of beliefs and ideas as potentially dangerous, especially when they are rigid and dogmatic. He emphasizes the importance of malleability in belief systems, allowing for adaptation and growth in response to new evidence and understanding.

What is the speaker's view on the role of technology and its potential impact on society if we fail to address psychological and social challenges?

The speaker views technology, particularly increasingly destructive technology, as a potential threat to society if psychological and social challenges are not addressed. He suggests that our current state of partisanship, tribalism, and fear of other groups may become unsustainable in the face of such technological advancements.

What does the speaker mean when he refers to the 'half-life of negative emotions'?

The speaker refers to the 'half-life of negative emotions' as the duration for which negative emotions persist. He suggests that through mindfulness and meditation, one can reduce this duration, allowing negative emotions to dissipate more quickly.

How does the speaker connect the practice of Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu (BJJ) with the practice of meditation?

The speaker connects BJJ with meditation by highlighting the importance of being relaxed yet effective in both practices. He suggests that BJJ is like 'jiu-jitsu for the mind,' requiring awareness, control, and the ability to respond to challenging situations with calmness and skill.

Outlines

00:00

🧠 Cognitive Reframing of Anxiety and Excitement

The speaker discusses the close physiological similarity between anxiety and excitement, highlighting that the difference lies in our perception and the narrative we create around these feelings. They emphasize the importance of recognizing the transient nature of negative emotions and how mindfulness can help us reframe our experience, allowing us to be indifferent to anxiety and other emotions, thus improving our mental well-being.

05:00

🌟 The Pursuit of Human Flourishing and Constructive Interaction

The paragraph introduces the guest, Sam Harris, a neuroscientist, philosopher, and best-selling author, who discusses his views on human well-being and the importance of building a society that fosters cooperation and happiness. He stresses the need for psychological and social evolution to avoid conflict and the potential unsustainability of current societal models, especially with the advancement of destructive technologies.

10:02

🚀 Defining Personal Purpose and the Impact of Belief Systems

The conversation explores the concept of personal purpose and the idea that individuals might have different aims in life, such as maximizing their potential or using marketable skills for philanthropy. The discussion touches on the malleability of belief systems and the potential for beliefs to be both liberating and constraining, emphasizing the importance of aligning our beliefs with actions that promote well-being for oneself and others.

15:05

📚 The Importance of Aligning Beliefs with Reality and Openness to New Ideas

The speaker advocates for a belief system that maps onto reality and the necessity of being open to new evidence and arguments. He criticizes dogmatism and the dangers of holding onto beliefs without evidence, particularly in the context of religion. The paragraph underscores the value of a scientific attitude in all aspects of life and the rejection of partitioning thinking, where some areas are considered too important to be scrutinized rigorously.

20:06

🤝 The Role of Conversation in Shaping Reality Understanding and Personal Growth

The paragraph emphasizes the importance of human conversation as a tool for understanding reality and personal growth. It discusses the need for continuous learning, surrounding oneself with smart people, and being open to the ideas of others. The speaker also shares his personal approach to reading and consuming information, which involves a passive yet constant intake from various sources.

25:06

💪 Overcoming Emotional States and the Power of Laughter

The speaker shares a personal anecdote about overcoming anger and the role of laughter in shifting emotional states. He discusses the idea that we have control over our emotions and that by consciously choosing to laugh, we can change our emotional state. This story illustrates the power of reframing negative emotions and the importance of being aware of our emotional responses.

30:07

🧘‍♂️ The Martial Arts of the Mind: Meditation as a Skill for Mental Control

The paragraph delves into the comparison between martial arts and meditation, likening the latter to a form of mental jiu-jitsu. It discusses the idea of meditation as a skill that allows us to control our minds and reactions, similar to how martial arts techniques are used for physical control. The speaker reflects on his initial resistance to meditation due to its perceived femininity and how he later embraced it as a powerful tool for mental strength.

35:10

🌅 Finding Selflessness in Moments of Connection and the Nature of the Ego

The speaker explores the concept of selflessness and the sense of self, discussing how moments of deep connection with life, such as appreciating a beautiful sunset, can lead to a loss of self-awareness. He contrasts these moments with the constant state of ego and contraction that arises from identifying with thoughts, which often leads to suffering. The paragraph examines the nature of the ego and the importance of recognizing the impermanent and fluid nature of our sense of self.

40:11

💭 The Stream of Consciousness and the Illusion of the Unchanging Self

This paragraph delves into the nature of consciousness and the illusion of an unchanging self. It discusses the idea that our sense of self is often tied to a sense of being a passenger in our bodies, observing the world from behind our eyes. The speaker challenges this notion, suggesting that there is no fixed point of consciousness within the brain and that we are, in fact, identical to the ever-changing flow of experience.

45:13

🌱 Cultivating Intrinsic Well-Being and the Role of Meditation

The speaker discusses the concept of intrinsic well-being and the role of meditation in achieving it. He differentiates between the experiencing self and the remembering self, emphasizing the importance of living in the moment and finding satisfaction in the present. Meditation is presented as a tool for resetting one's state independent of external circumstances and for developing a superpower of well-being that transcends specific life events.

50:14

🛤️ Navigating Life's Meaning and Purpose in the Face of Existential Crisis

The paragraph addresses the issue of finding meaning and purpose in life, especially for those who feel lost or are experiencing a sense of existential crisis. The speaker suggests that the feeling of being lost is often a result of being lost in thought without awareness. He recommends several antidotes, including medication for clinical depression, maintaining healthy habits, and practicing mindfulness and reframing negative thoughts. The speaker also introduces the concept of using gratitude and negative imagination as tools for changing one's perspective and finding meaning.

🌐 Sam Harris's Mission to Engage with Consequential Ideas

In the final paragraph, Sam Harris reflects on his mission to engage with intellectually interesting and consequential ideas, such as artificial intelligence, which have significant implications for the future of humanity. He emphasizes the importance of having honest conversations about these topics and encourages his audience to explore his work, including his podcast, meditation app, and website, to expand their consciousness and discover new capabilities.

Keywords

💡Anxiety

Anxiety is a feeling of unease, such as worry or fear, that can be mild or severe. In the video, it is discussed as a state that is physiologically close to excitement, differing mainly in the framing and story one tells oneself. The script mentions how anxiety can be reframed to reduce its negative impact, highlighting the power of perception in emotional experiences.

💡Excitement

Excitement is a state of enthusiasm or eagerness, often in anticipation of a particular event. The video script draws a parallel between excitement and anxiety, suggesting that the physiological responses are similar, but the cognitive framing differs. Excitement is typically seen as positive, while anxiety is viewed as negative, illustrating the importance of perspective in emotional states.

💡Framing

Framing refers to the cognitive process of conceptualizing or interpreting a situation or information. The video emphasizes the power of framing in shaping one's emotional response, such as viewing anxiety as a form of excitement. The concept is used to demonstrate how changing the narrative or interpretation of an emotion can alter one's experience of it.

💡Mindfulness Meditation

Mindfulness Meditation is a practice of focusing one's attention on the present moment, often used for cultivating awareness and achieving a state of mental clarity. The script discusses mindfulness as a skill that can be learned to manage emotions and achieve a more indifferent stance towards negative feelings, such as anxiety.

💡Neuroscience

Neuroscience is the scientific study of the nervous system and brain functions. The video features a guest with a background in neuroscience, indicating the discussion's grounding in scientific understanding of mental processes and behaviors, including the exploration of emotions and their physiological basis.

💡Philosophy

Philosophy is the study of general and fundamental questions about existence, knowledge, values, reason, mind, and language. The guest's background in philosophy is mentioned, suggesting that the video delves into profound and conceptual topics, possibly examining the nature of consciousness and the human experience.

💡Emotional Regulation

Emotional Regulation refers to the ability to manage and control one's emotions. The video script discusses the skill of emotional regulation in the context of mindfulness and meditation, suggesting that individuals can learn to control their emotional responses, such as not staying angry or anxious for extended periods.

💡Ted Talks

Ted Talks are a series of global conferences where invited speakers share their ideas and experiences in various fields. The video mentions the guest's involvement in Ted Talks, indicating the guest's expertise and the potential influence of their ideas, which are likely discussed in the video.

💡Non-Duality

Non-Duality is a philosophical concept where the existence of only one reality is considered true, as opposed to seeing the world as composed of separate entities. The script touches on the idea of losing the sense of self, which is related to non-dualistic experiences where the distinction between self and other dissolves.

💡Purpose

Purpose refers to the reason for which something exists or is done, often implying a goal or objective. The video discusses the concept of having a purpose in life, suggesting that individuals should aim to maximize their potential and acquire meaningful skills, which can serve both themselves and others.

💡Dogmatism

Dogmatism is the tendency to hold strong opinions or beliefs without being open to alternative viewpoints. The script warns against dogmatism, advocating for an open-minded approach to beliefs and ideas, which is essential for adapting to new information and understanding reality.

Highlights

Anxiety and excitement share similar physiological responses, differing mainly in the framing and narrative we apply to the experience.

The power of reframing can help us realize that negative emotions have a short half-life and can be managed effectively.

Sam Harris, a neuroscientist, philosopher, and author, discusses the importance of aligning our beliefs with reality for well-being.

Harris emphasizes the need for open conversation and the acceptance of new evidence to challenge and refine our beliefs.

Dogmatism, or holding onto ideas without evidence, is identified as a hindrance to understanding reality and personal growth.

The concept of 'skills having utility' is introduced as a driving force for personal development and effectiveness in life.

Harris shares his personal journey of transforming from an employee to an entrepreneur, highlighting the importance of changing belief systems.

The idea that mindfulness and meditation are skills that can be learned and applied to improve emotional regulation is discussed.

Harris explains how meditation is akin to martial arts for the mind, requiring practice and discipline to master.

The importance of not identifying with thoughts and the benefits of breaking the spell of constant thinking are highlighted.

Harris talks about the difference between the experiencing self and the remembering self, and how they relate to life satisfaction and meaning.

The role of gratitude and reframing negative thoughts through 'negative imagination' as a tool for emotional well-being is mentioned.

Harris discusses the impact of his work, focusing on engaging with intellectually interesting and consequential ideas.

The potential of meditation to reset well-being independent of external circumstances is explored.

The conversation touches on the importance of aligning our intrinsic well-being with the effects we have on the world and vice versa.

Harris shares his approach to learning and consuming information, emphasizing the importance of being open to a wide range of topics.

The discussion concludes with Harris's advice for people feeling lost or lacking a sense of purpose or meaning in life.

Transcripts

if you're feeling anxiety

there's actually a place from which you

can just feel it right and

and be

actually indifferent to it or anything

else you could be feeling i mean first

you can notice that anxiety isn't even

that unpleasant it's so close to

excitement in its actual physiology that

really the difference between excitement

and anxiety is more

or less just the the framing it's just

the story you're telling yourself you

know if you felt these these tingles

and this you know slightly adrenalized

response

right before you know you're about to go

on a roller coaster that's part of why

you're going on the roller coaster you

like that experience right but the fact

that you feel that way when you're about

to have an interview or you're about to

you know walk out on stage that's

intolerable right so just dropping back

and realizing the the power of the

framing it has immense utility because

then you can realize that the

the half-life of negative emotions is

incredibly short

[Music]

hey everybody welcome to impact theory

our goal with this show and company is

to introduce you to the people and ideas

that will help you actually execute on

your dreams all right today's guest is a

neuroscientist philosopher and a

five-time new york times best-selling

author his book the end of faith won the

2005 pen award for non-fiction and spent

an astonishing 33 weeks on the new york

times bestseller list he has a degree in

philosophy from stanford a phd in

neuroscience and he's practiced

meditation for more than 30 years a

combination that gives him a very unique

perspective that has made him one of the

most sought after thinkers on the planet

he's given multiple ted talks with

millions of views and his written works

have been translated into more than 20

different languages additionally he's

written for some of the most prestigious

publications around including the new

york times the los angeles times and the

annals of neurology to name but a few a

clear and rational voice almost without

peer on some of today's most difficult

subjects when he speaks thousands of

people show up in real life and millions

listen online

and his ideas have been discussed by

some of the most visible and

well-respected outlets in the world

including time the new york times

scientific american nature and countless

others he's also the host of the webby

award-winning podcast making sense which

was named by apple as one of the itunes

best

so please help me in welcoming the man

who has spent roughly two years in

aggregated silent contemplation one of

the four horsemen of the non-apocalypse

sam harris

[Applause]

thank you

absolute pleasure to have you

yeah pleasure to be here i am really

excited to dive into some of these

subjects which i think you have

just such a fascinating take on and the

thing that i've drawn the most wisdom

from with you is what and and these are

very much my words

how to live a good life

and that's where i want to start and

it'd be really interesting to hear your

definition of like what kind of life and

way of thinking should we be aiming for

yeah well it's a hard question because

my notion of human well-being is really

open-ended i don't think we understand

what the horizon is

if in fact there is one for kind of

ultimate flourishing of conscious minds

we have a pretty good sense of what we

don't want and are right not to want we

don't want to be terrorized

and uh depressed and

find ourselves constantly in conflict

with strangers finding our aims

frustrated so the generic situation we

want to find ourselves in more and more

is to effortlessly cooperate with

creative and happy strangers right i

mean where there's seven billion of us

we need institutions and laws and norms

uh and ways of thinking that take the

friction out of

pleasurable and non-paranoid interaction

with strangers it's not just about

having you know five or

so close friends who's got who have your

back right i mean you like

clearly

we're all on the same team on some basic

level and if we can't figure out how to

build a civilization where

everyone thrives to some degree

we'll have the world we currently have

until it becomes unsustainable because

we're in a situation now where

i think

it's reasonable to worry that

our default state of partisanship and

tribalism and

rational fear of the incompatible aims

of you know other groups and other

people

is unsustainable in the presence of more

and more destructive technology i just

think i think we have to get our act

together psychologically and socially in

a way that we haven't yet

and when you think about that coming

down to the personal level

do you think about people as having a

north star or a purpose that they should

be pursuing and to contextualize that

i'll say

because i always found myself wanting to

ask people that i ended up answering the

question for myself and so for me the

purpose of my life from my perspective

is to

see how much of my potential i can

actuate so how how many skills can i

acquire that have meaning and utility to

me that allow me to serve not only

myself but others and so that sense of

pushing myself to always get better to

always improve to show up every day

and not think about whether i

get something cross some finish line

generate a certain amount of wealth or

anything like that but just

do i sincerely approach the idea of

bettering myself in a very specific

direction based on what i want to

accomplish in my life or not and if i do

that sincerely then i say that the day

or the life has been a victory and if i

don't do that then to me i'm pointed in

the wrong direction do you have any sort

of guiding light like that that say you

would try to pass on to your children or

that you yourself have for you well i

think that's a good one and i share it

but i can imagine

uh

other versions of having a an aim which

don't really totally overlap with that i

mean you know it would be you know

someone could decide for instance that

they have a talent

that is highly marketable

and what they want to do is make as much

money as possible so that they can give

a lot of it away to help people i mean

money money is is just energy right it

just you know if you are making billions

of dollars and you're giving billions of

dollars away to good causes

well that you know on an effective

altruism metric that's

that's much better than you going to

africa yourself and handing out food you

know in a famine right you want to be

bankrolling thousands of people to do

that right

uh and if you have a skill you know if

you're a great singer or whatever and

and

uh it may be some a skill that you

didn't spend a lot of time to acquire

right so you you don't have this whole

mastery

story that you have and that actually

resonates with me

so that that would be a good life you

know provided you can extract the

psychological satisfaction from it

because most of what we experience in

philanthropy is

when it when it's telescopic in this way

when you're just signing a check you're

not necessarily connected to the good

you're doing and i can imagine

someone doing

immense good in the world by signing

very large checks but not actually

internalizing the gratification of that

on some level we have to be aware of the

possibility of rowing in two boats

simultaneously there's what

the effects

are in the world of how we're living so

you know we want to have a good impact

on others

but we actually want

our

conscious states of psychological

pain and pleasure to be mapped in some

rational way to the kinds of effects

we're having right so you don't want to

be a callous person who's just leaving

devastated and unhappy people in your

wake and taking pleasure in that i mean

that you're you're a psychopath if

that's that's how you're tuned

but you also don't want to be

a person who's

doing a lot of good in the world but not

able to internalize the felt sense of

your connectedness to others because

you're you know you're too neurotic or

you're too distracted or you're just not

you know connecting with others so it's

really interesting and i don't think

i've ever heard anybody else talk about

that notion of making sure that you're

mapping what you're doing to sort of be

outwardly altruistic to actually map to

your own

internal state of well-being if you will

and

hearing the discussions that you've been

around islam and how beliefs and ideas

can be really dangerous

made me ask a question

of how

and basically i'll i'll quickly

summarize so you've got people that they

have a book and the book has ideas and

things that they are meant to believe

and then act in accordance with and

because of where they grew up or you

know what their parents and the society

around them taught them they

internalized those beliefs and if we

could through

communicating our ideas well to them get

them to see

something that caused

more well-being for other people that

that would be a better way to move their

belief system

so one do you believe that a belief

system is malleable in that there's some

element of well you could choose this

set of ideology or you could choose this

and i don't know if you would say that

one of those is is more true than the

other but certainly one may take us

closer to well-being than the other

and if you think that belief systems are

by their very nature malleable things

what would sort of be the belief system

in just like a couple tenants that you

could hand to somebody that you think

would help them maximize their own

well-being as well as serve a greater

good

speaking generically i think

having our beliefs map onto reality to

some degree is obviously good because if

they're not you're just bumping into

hard objects

like if your map is completely wrong

you are bound to suffer right so we have

to be in a situation where

radical ignorance can't be bliss right

so that's that's one principle now there

could be a looseness of fit there could

be situations where

being

strictly right about what's true

may be non-optimal right there may be it

may be useful to have a slightly

delusional

self-serving bias right to think you're

coming off better than you are like it

may give you more enthusiasm for your

life more confidence but

anything that's too

out of register is just delusion right

and other people notice and other people

treat you like somebody who's just not

tracking in a reality

and so

that's one principle so i think we want

our beliefs

to be

true in some basic sense

and

therefore we want to be open to new

evidence and better arguments

perpetually right because if you're if

you close yourself off if you say well

listen i'm done i'm done thinking about

reality

and i know what's true

then again when more data comes in

you know when something's surprising

when one of your intuitions proves to be

faulty

if you can't error correct again you're

just going to fall out of alignment with

what's going on in the world and what

with what other people think is true as

well so the really the only mechanism we

have to do that

is human conversation right we have to

be open to

having other people point out errors in

our thinking and we ha in and in the

conversation we have with ourselves we

have to do likewise we have to be

continually open to the possibility that

we might be wrong and in fact we're very

likely to be wrong a lot of the time

and

so then you know then hence the virtue

of getting educated and surrounding

yourself with smart people and reading

good books and just exposing yourself to

the kinds of lessons that

other people

have learned over you know thousands of

years and are learning in real time

right now and

you can live vicariously through you

don't have to make all the errors that

everyone is made right around you so you

don't have to it's like you can look at

lance armstrong and say okay well it's

probably not a good idea to lie you know

relentlessly about something and then

try to punish the people who caught you

in your lives and then get caught and

have to wind up on oprah apologizing

right i mean that's you know you can you

can internalize that lesson and

understand something about the ethics

and reputational costs of lying

uh

so

given that given the conversation and an

openness to the intrusions of other

people's thinking is

really the the best game in town for

understanding what reality is and how to

navigate within it

then you can see how

non-optimal

and you know ultimately dangerous

dogmatism is now dogmatism is just

holding to an idea no matter what else

comes into view right so there's nothing

you can say to challenge this i'm so you

know i'll talk to you about all this

stuff but over here there's something

that i care about some proposition you

know some assertion that something is

true that i care about so much i'm so

emotionally attached to it that

not only is it non-negotiable

if you continue to push over here i'm

going to get angrier and angrier right

i'm going to i'm going to threaten you

with violence right that is the default

state of organized religion right

historically and let me say that you

know certain religions now have kind of

relaxed their

intolerance to a degree where the the

violence isn't explicit

but

that is the not only is that the default

of faith-based religion

they have a a way of thinking about

dogma i mean dogmatism is a good word in

the context of religion i mean christian

dogma is not is not a derogatory term

they call it dogma for a reason right i

can't certainly cat the catholics do so

the this this notion that you can

believe something strongly without

evidence or certainly without good

evidence without evidence that can

survive pressure from outside so the the

idea that wanting evidence is a

perversion of your circumstance right so

like you know you really if you if you

buy this thing in the bag that you keep

that i haven't shown you

you are that redounds to your credit

right uh it's just it's one it's not

true because the experiential core of

these religions i mean experiences like

unconditional love say

those can be experienced i mean it's not

that everything in our religious

literature is untrue but there's nothing

that has to be believed on insufficient

evidence to be explored and so what i

recommend here is that we really

adopt a scientific attitude

everywhere we don't partition our

thinking about reality where we say well

here's the stuff over here where

super important but we can't think about

it too rigorously right in fact i think

about it too rigorously is to corrupt it

and then over here we've got you know

science and technology and you know

engineers calculating whether a bridge

is going to you know withstand the

weight of the traffic on it and there we

can think rigorously so you know don't

tell me about

rigor with respect to meaning and you

know what what's worth living for and

what's worth dying for and you know what

what is love and compassion and

well-being like that's all that has to

be

just

we have to be hostage to a conversation

that our ancestors were having 2 000

years ago and we have to imagine that

certain of our books were dictated by

the creator of the universe to organize

all that but over here let's get let's

get it all dialed in because we really

care about how our smartphones work

right it makes it makes no sense it's

trying to trying to resolve that tension

is something i've spent a lot of time on

it's it's interesting to me that that

tension exists and it makes me come back

to okay why doesn't that tension exist

in my own life and the organizing

principle that i use

and i think a lot about like what would

somebody pass on to their children now

i've decided not to have kids so i will

never get to answer this but i spent a

lot of time thinking about what are the

organizing principles you've referred to

ideas as sort of the operating system of

the mind

and that seems very apt to me so what

are the organizing principles that i

would give somebody to think in a

certain way and one of the things i'm

obsessed with and i think i explain this

so poorly i don't see it light people's

eyes up and i'd love to figure out how

to say it well which is this skills have

utility now what i mean by that is

learning architecture is interesting

because it allows you to build a

structure that could protect somebody

allows you to build a structure that to

really make it basic

like the one i forget exactly what

country it's in but the seed vault right

like you understand architecture well

enough and how to ventilate things and

all the things that seeds would need to

like live for a very long time so we

could replant if we had to

learning those skills

had a purpose and that purpose allows

for something to happen and so let's

take brazilian jiu jitsu which i know

that you do jiu jitsu

everything that you learn in jiu jitsu

has a real world implication and that

real world implication is one if you got

into a fight you'd probably be more

likely to be able to successfully defend

yourself and that in and of itself is is

so profound as to be worth the time now

there's obviously all kinds of other

benefits as well but

once people understand oh okay these

skills have utility then i need to be

fiendish about increasing my skill set

because it has this real world

application so the problem that i get

into where people are dogmatic about

anything whether it's religion or like i

wrote this belief system okay it was the

25 things that i had to do to my mind in

order to go from

being a good employee which i always

lovingly refer to as sort of a

slave-like mentality i kept my head down

did as little work as possible and

avoided punishment at all costs that's

where i started that's what my parents

taught me to do

and to get out of that and to become an

entrepreneur there were these very

simple write-downable things that i had

to choose to believe and act in

accordance with

and if you came to me and said hey tom

by the way number 14 on your list

doesn't make sense and it doesn't make

sense for this reason i think you

misunderstood something about your own

journey i'd be like that's so rad

because now you're giving me something

that has more utility than the thing

that i've used right thus far

one why do you think that breaks down

what is it that people value more than

that is there some internal thing and

then what process can people use to

become more aware of

what's guiding their decision making

because i think a lot of people i don't

know if it's just at a feeling level

it's like a limbic thing or what

well i think it's a framing problem

because

most of what people care about can be

thought of as a skill i mean well-being

is it's a skill not suffering

unnecessarily is a skill

regulating

noticing your emotional life and

regulating negative emotion is a skill i

saw you know i have a meditation app and

you know meditation is a skill it's a

very useful one and i'm spending a lot

of time teaching

what's now referred to as mindfulness

meditation

and

the moment you begin practicing

mindfulness which is just just learning

to pay close attention

to the nature of your experience you're

not adding anything to your experience

you're just noticing what it's like to

be you moment to moment but in a way

that is

not reactive you're not grasping at

what's pleasant or pushing what's

unpleasant away you're just i mean to

make this concrete and let's say you

have a fear of public speaking right so

you about to go down out on stage and

you feel anxiety

the the usual the default state of

someone who doesn't want to have that

experience it's just trying to figure is

is one to you know in advance worry

about that experience i mean the anxiety

is kindled just by the mere thought of

what you have to do

then

once you feel the butterflies

you

are at war with them right your contract

your mind contracts around it your

conversation with yourself is is an

unhappy one it's like why the am i

this person who just can't like i see

people do this all the time they're

they're relaxed i'm unhappy you know

when am i and you're you're talking to

yourself you're not noticing it because

your the thoughts just come up from

behind you as fast as as as they can and

they seem to be you right you're

identified with each thought that

emerges in consciousness

and most people live their lives as

though there's no alternative

we're not given a rule book for how to

operate a human mind right and there's

no place in a normal education where

we're

where it's even indicated that there's

an alternative here and

so we get we kind of stumble out into

adulthood

more or less assuming that we have we'll

always have the minds we have and that

really there's you know we the only

thing we can do to really upgrade our

firmware is to

just add new content you know we can

read books we can we can

develop interests but

there's nothing

at the sort of root level of our

emotional and cognitive life that can

change and so mindfulness is a way of

kind of dropping a little bit lower and

realizing so in this case

if you're feeling anxiety

there's actually a place from which you

can just feel it right and

and be

actually indifferent to it or anything

else you could be feeling i mean just

just notice that there's even an

unpleasant sensation

i mean first you can notice that anxiety

isn't even that unpleasant it's so close

to excitement in its actual physiology

that really the difference between

excitement and anxiety is more

or less just the the framing it's just

the story you're telling yourself you

know if you felt these these

tingles

and this you know slightly adrenalized

response

right before you know you're about to go

on a roller coaster that's part of why

you're going on the roller coaster you

like that experience right but the fact

that you feel that way when you're about

to have an interview or you're about to

you know walk out on stage that's

intolerable right so just dropping back

and realizing the the power of the

framing is is again this is a skill that

is a fairly esoteric one but now you

know many people are learning it you

know the secrets out

and it has immense utility because then

you can realize that the

the half-life of negative emotions is

incredibly short i mean one you could

you can actually be

psychologically free even in their

presence right your freedom and your

well-being isn't even predicated on

getting rid of the physiology right like

it can still be there but

if you're not

continually thinking about all the

reasons why you should be anxious

the physiology dissipates very very

quickly and that's true for anger it's

true for anything that that is

classically negative

and

so to come back to your question

many of the things that people think

they want out of life

they either think our or many or many of

the the

the ways they're keeping score about how

good their lives are or aren't

they're not seen as these are either

you know this experience is being

delivered to them either based on the

skills they have or the skills they've

never thought to acquire right and

uh yeah so that's uh that's one thing i

would add to the picture of the the

usefulness of skills i want to talk

about the emotional control that you

bring up i think that's super powerful

when my wife and i were first

married my problem was i have a very

slow fuse or a very long fuse and so it

takes a lot to get me angry and that was

actually a big complaint of hers she'd

be really annoyed something would happen

someone cut in front of us in line and i

wouldn't freak out and she wanted me to

freak out and she wanted me to like just

bask in how unjust it was

and

she would really lament that and it just

seemed so strange to me but then when i

got mad i would stay mad and there were

times i would stay mad 8 10 12 hours and

i was working so much at the beginning

of our relationship the only time that

we really had together as husband and

wife would be for part of a saturday

and i would inevitably she would say

something it would upset me i would get

pissed and i would stay pissed the

entire time but then as you said once

you stop reinforcing it which i would do

unfortunately i'd be reinforcing

reinforcing and reinforcing it then

something would happen it would change

my neurochemistry i'd forget like why

was i so mad

every single time i was like

why did i just waste that time being mad

so i end up writing myself this letter

and i gave it to my wife and i said read

that to me the next time i get pissed

off

and in the letter i said hey me it's me

i have no hidden agenda here as to why i

want you to calm down other than the

fact that you know

that if you end up being pissed for

several hours you're going to regret it

every single time and

right now i want you to laugh out loud

and for however long it takes just laugh

out loud you know studies show that you

can't laugh out loud and remain pissed

and so

i gave it to her i got pissed she read

it she only had to read it once it was

so profoundly transformational to see

that just by laughing out loud i

couldn't stay angry that it really

helped me get control of my emotions so

that i knew i can do uh what i'll call a

state shift i don't think i've ever

heard you use that kind of language but

if i'm angry i'm choosing to stay angry

yeah

unfortunately i hadn't found meditation

at that point so i had to sort of brute

force my way to that what can people do

to learn to get control of their

emotions

well the first thing to realize is that

they already have control

virtually anyone watching this i would

expect can do this under certain

circumstances so the one example i would

have you recall is i'm sure this has

happened to almost everyone you're in

some state like that you're you're angry

you've just gotten triggered by

something

but then the phone rings right and the

phone it's you're getting called by

somebody who this is not someone for you

to process your anger with this is like

a business call or you have to function

right

and it actually

perfectly interrupts your state you

actually can just reset and

have the conversation and the physiology

is dissipating very very quickly there

your attention is on something else and

you're just having to function now of

course if somebody if it's a friend or

your mother or somebody who you can

complain to well then you'll jump on and

you'll you'll amplify this state because

you'll have a reason to talk about it

uh so you you can interrupt these states

and simply put your attention on

something else and and then you know and

then it dissipates

one thing that uh i'm really curious to

know you seem just

freakishly educated on a whole lot of

topics what is your process for learning

how do you go about

in taking data how do you start do you

pull threads what thread do you pull

first if you do like how do you really

begin to educate yourself on any given

topic

well i don't really have uh i mean i

take in a lot of information and i

always have so that's you know

and not in necessarily an efficient or

smart way i mean i don't have you know

life hacks that

that

optimize me as a

a consumer of information so you're like

you know

i know there are ways that are

recommended to read a book so as to

extract the the the actionable

information as as quickly as possible

from it

i have never been

uh an adopter of any of those ways so

like you know and i mean we're still

i basically read everything at the same

speed so like i read everything like a

scripture so if it's you know you know

people magazine in a waiting room of a

dentist's office i'm reading that at the

same speed that i'm reading you know a

work of philosophy or neuroscience and

the big change of late i mean you know i

guess this has probably happened

somewhere around 10 years ago is that

once i realized that

there's functionally an infinite amount

of information to consume you know it's

doubling in the sciences every three to

five years and you know there are

literally thousands of good books that i

will wish i had read but i will never

get around to reading

i've become a very

fickle reader

in the sense that i you know i cut my

losses very early the sunk cost fallacy

has completely disappeared for me the

idea that i've you know spent five hours

or five days on this thing so i better

just finish it right that used to be my

orientation with respect to reading

books now i'll i'll discard a book uh

you know just on a whim because i know

there's an infinite amount of stuff i

want to read you know i don't go into

the table of contents and look at the

structure of the book and then go to the

index and then look at the topics and

then i mean i i just start on page one

and start reading and then when i get

bored i stop you know and

uh

so that's uh you know do it do with what

do with that life hack what you will

but

i do

continually i mean i'm either listening

to audio books or podcasts or the news

when i'm

working out or commuting or or

you know i'm just uh

you know constantly taking in

information you know fairly passively

when i'm multitasking

uh so there's not you know i mean the

one thing that that i don't have a lot

of in my life is music because i you

know i can't write to to music certainly

about music with lyrics i can't podcast

music obviously

uh and

i've decided that there's so much that

i'm interested in there's so much that i

want to know

that basically

i just hear music by accident now i mean

i just like if someone else is playing

music or if i walk into a store there's

music associated with the film it's

getting in but

otherwise i'm just you know i'm just a

fire hose of information pointed at my

head most of the time yeah i get that

so

despite the uh that per chance haphazard

way that you're reading it does seem at

least from the outside that you are

striving i would say pretty truly for

excellence

helped me reconcile so

one of the things i struggled with with

meditation was it felt decidedly

feminine

and in a way that as somebody who i felt

i felt that certainly growing up that i

was far more on the feminine end of

being a guy than anything else and so

for me my journey certainly to being an

entrepreneur was one of toughening up um

and so anything that that made me sort

of feel that old school sort of gentle

way

i would push back on and it's why i

didn't meditate for a long time

but i see you you're doing brazilian jiu

jitsu you're somebody who obviously

cares about martial arts and being able

to fight and defend yourself i've heard

you talk very eloquently about

violence and clearly in your

professional life you've

just even just what you've done in the

writing let alone the lecturing you've

already achieved such massive success

refused to believe that there wasn't a

just massive amount of energy behind

that

so how do you think about meditation in

that context is this like going to war

with your mind and you're i'm going to

come out the other side having face

demons uh and having won some sort of

victory that allows me to perform at a

higher level or am i totally missing all

of this and it needs to be a letting go

a more peaceful relaxed

sort of transient experience yeah well

at first it's a very common association

i totally understand it and it's

presented in many ways

where yeah you under that framing you

can just feel the testosterone leaving

your body you know

so

uh yeah that's not my orientation it is

a lot like

jiu-jitsu for the mind and it's and it's

a lot like it i mean what's so beautiful

about jiu jitsu

in particular is that

you can have this massive effect in the

domain of violence

while being relaxed it is what aikido

off you know advertises itself to be but

it's a much more you know at least in my

estimation a much more effective version

of that same

underlying ethic where you can like you

can

control someone

uh

and

use as little violence as as necessary

and basically just use

a superior knowledge of physics and

leverage and position against them so

it's a very

it can be incredibly relaxed and yet

um

given what the circumstance is it can be

a a very high testosterone experience

you know it's not it's a kind of

quintessentially

uh

masculine thing to be doing

but

you can internalize the same sort of

structure

and

that's largely what meditation is

because basically

the default state is one of being

attacked and ambushed all the time

by your thoughts and by your reactivity

and by

uh you are being taken in

by assumptions and and illusions and not

knowing just you just you're in a fog

not you personally but you know one is

and

um

you know even when you learn to meditate

you're in this fog most of the time i

mean and you're cut so the practice

is one of continually breaking the spell

you were constantly on the mat

constantly finding yourself in a

position

of some surprising disadvantage right

like it's like all of a sudden there's a

rear naked choke that's you know three

quarters applied right

and

you need an answer for that and

not knowing the answer is just

synonymous with death right it's like

you're you're just getting you know

you're just you'll be as miserable for

as long as as

circumstances dictate in the absence of

this

and i shudder to interrupt this because

i find it so interesting tying it to bjj

but um i need to know why is it or i

want it said

why is it that the identification with

the eye or the these never-ending

thoughts why do they create

well it's just the ego is

at bottom it is itself a kind of

contraction i mean when you look at what

you your this feeling of self is right

so

let's just talk about what the the sense

of self is

the sense of self for most of us is not

a feeling that we're identical with our

bodies most people don't feel identical

with their physical bodies they feel

like they're passengers inside their

bodies right they like my body's down

here like these are my hands these are

my legs you know i obviously care about

these things you know if you know i i

you know this these were my pains and

pleasures are coming from

but i'm up here in the head

and

i'm a kind of passenger i'm a witness

of this

and if you look i mean most people when

they try to pay attention they try to

find themselves they try to you know

they

they try to meditate

they feel that they're a locust of

attention in the head

behind their face behind their eyes you

know looking out at the world and the

world is not self you know you're you're

over there i'm looking across space at

you i'm here behind my face

and my face is a kind of mask really i

mean it's like i'm not identical to my

face i mean i it's

it's states matter to me like if i have

some weird expression on my face you

know like someone said like well

can we take a picture of you and you

can't figure out how to smile and you

feel uptight like you're reading the

state of your face as

your emotions are playing on your on

your face right

the signature of the emotion you're

feeling has a lot to do with what you

feel in your face

um and it feeds back into your mind if

you force yourself to smile you can you

actually feel a state of happiness

coming in your in your mind

uh

but people feel like they're behind

their face in their head right and so

that

you know kind of homunculus that that

that person in the head

which we know doesn't make any sense

neurologically there's no place in the

brain where there could be a little you

know consciousness that is one thing

that is this stable self that's looking

out through the eyes right

there's a flow of experience and you

know it is

invoking you know many regions of the

brain at all times

and

there is no you you are identical

to this flow of experience this the

stream of consciousness

is what you are as a matter of

subjectivity right i'm not i'm not

saying that it's not a horizon in the

brain or that bodies aren't real or that

there's no physical universe i'm saying

as a matter of experience

there is just this flow of consciousness

and its contents and

yet we seem to put this unchanging

center to it and

that is a

the what what that is you know what the

what is giving us that feeling that

there is an unchanging center to this

flow

is

this sort of this contracted

identification with thought it is a kind

of thought it is just each moment of you

know if i'm saying something

and it doesn't make sense or it sounds

like

the part of it the part the the

experience in you which says oh that's

not right right that

feels like you right i mean you're not

you're not witnessing

it as an object and consciousness just

arise and pass away it sort of has come

up from behind and it just feels like

that's me right and but that thing is

always happening that that's me feeling

is always happening and so

you just feel like you're in your head

behind your face right

well for two reasons there's two sides

of this coin

so much of our of of what we're thinking

is making us miserable right so much of

it is unpleasant so much of it is

causing anxiety we got you look at your

to-do list you got 50 things on it you

just feel like oh my this is the day is

not long enough right this is

you know the state and that's a good you

know that's a you know a high-class

problem to have right i mean you know

there are worse problems

this is the state we're in

and the obverse of that is when we're

really just

connecting with life in a joyful

creative beautiful way like when you

look out the window and it's the most

beautiful sunset ever

and you are just looking at the sunset

right you're not like you're fully

connected with its beauty

those are all moments where you're

losing this sense of of self but the

difference between meditation and those

moments is that

you're not really aware of losing the

sense of self in those moments you're

not really aware of what is

freeing about those moments and you

can't do it

in other circumstances like you can't

like you know i need the i need the

beautiful sunset just looking at your

shoe isn't it good enough for me right

but with meditation i can actually look

at your shoe in the same way that i look

at the sunset right so that's the like

what's what's happening for people

most people is that they're waiting for

the world to give them a good enough

reason to just be present and to be

present so fully that they lose their

sense of of self right that they're no

longer behind their face

you know

just waiting for something good to

happen right or figuring out how to

change the experience enough

so that

again they can stop they're no longer at

war i mean we're

to a greater or lesser degree

we're always

at war i mean we're always fighting

something you know there's always this

like you know you're always noticing

something wrong you're feeling

uncomfortable in your body you're

reacting to something that somebody did

or you thought they did you're

navigating a social encounter that seems

off-kilter you know it's awkward and

like you're trying to figure out what to

say and that that sounded stupid and

like you're you're you're just being

blown around

and

the moments where you really feel good

are moments where you can you are there

there isn't a a coming to rest right

where it's not about the past or future

you know it's not even about it's not

about half a second ago it's not about

half a second from now and

the ultimate version of that is

to ju

entails the dropping of this this

sense of self

is everything you do about flourishing

for you unfortunately not i mean

you know i mean wisdom

would be

really being able to track what is going

to matter you know at the end of the day

or at the end of a life for me

flourishing

is a matter of

spending your time

pleasantly

and happily and creatively

and having fun

but in all the ways which

it at every moment when someone asks you

well you know that last hour that last

day that last week that last year

do you feel good about that was that a

good use of your time

that remembering self that retrospective

gesture

that's where people worry about things

like meaning right i mean that's like so

it's like there's two i mean to use you

know danny kahneman's

framing here there's the experiencing

self and there's the remembering self

and the the remembering self is the self

that you're talking to when you say you

know are you satisfied with your life

whether you're asking yourself or

someone's asking you

and

the answers that are available

in the in those moments

really determine whether or not somebody

has a kind of global life satisfaction

whether they have meaning and those are

that's the those are the moments where

people feel like you know i need

religion i need to know i you know i

need to know how the the far future is

going to be i need like i need some

story

to tell myself that is fundamentally

consoling but the experiencing self the

ex the self that is just going moment to

moment

feeling pains and pleasure and

uh just dealing with dealing with this

the very short you know time horizon

uh

i think that is

that's fundamentally our real self i

mean the remembering self is the

is a version of that you know if you ask

me are you satisfied with your life and

i you know spend the next 30 seconds

telling you about that that is yet

another you know brief chapter in my

experiencing self right and

most of life

is it is

a story is is you know is getting

getting summed over this this

this lifeline of the experience itself

and

their

questions of meaning

and a kind of global story to tell

yourself about what this is all about

are are far less important than people

think i mean i think you want to be

playing both games intelligently you

don't want

to be absorbed in in pleasures which

every time you think about your life

have you feeling

god i'm just wasting my life i'm just

you know i'm a superficial guy you know

i've you know i got wealthy and now i

just you know do heroin and play golf

right and it's just fun you know like

whenever you check in with me i feel

pretty good because i have you know an

unlimited supply of heroin and golf

uh but

it's

you know i can't really you know i'm

sort of embarrassed by it every time i

have to talk about it right that like

that's not the you know you you do want

so over here you still do want

you want your pleasures

to be justified

by good relationships and and a world

that

cares about your inputs and outputs

right so you're like you want

you know you want what you're paying

attention to all day long to matter to

someone else and we're so deeply social

it's not wrong to want those things

but again

it's possible to have a

purchase on well-being that is deeper

than any one of those things so that

when you lose one of those things right

when you find out that the the thing you

thought

people would love they actually hated

right you know the television show you

wrote or the novel you wrote or whatever

you invested all this time you had a

hope for this thing but your hopes were

disappointed how long do you suffer over

that right

in the absence of

and

this sort of superpower that where you

can actually find an intrinsic

well-being to consciousness

it will be for as long as you know your

you know bad genes and bad life

experiences dictate right it's like it's

just you're at the mercy of who you were

yesterday and so met you know as a skill

meditation is fairly unique in that

you can actually reset independent of

what's going on but again it's not a

reason to become

uh

totally immune

to your integra you know the effects

you're having on the world and what the

world is telling you because ultimately

you are going to spend most of your time

asleep and dreaming you know this in

this

state with you know

in conversation with yourself and in

conversation with others no matter how

much you meditate i mean i you know i

think ultimately there are people who

get

you know quote fully enlightened and

completely break the spell of being

identified with with thoughts

um you know i'm not one of those people

or certainly not yet and uh so

i experienced this fluctuation

but the the

the fluctuation

is so important for

my well-being that i imagine that i can

talk about it without you know

hesitation

what do you say to people who the deep

fundamental problem in their life is

that they're lost they have no sense of

meaning or purpose they don't know what

direction to go into they're sliding

towards depression because

it all seems so pointless um that that's

something that i encounter with people a

lot um people will stop me randomly and

just be like help

and

i'd love to know

knowing that you have a very limited

window of time with that person

you know what would you say in like 60

or 90 seconds that would hopefully send

them on a path that would actually be

useful

well i would just point out the

mechanics of it which is what is

actually going on is that they're lost

in thought they're they're thinking

without knowing that they're thinking

basically every moment of their waking

life right and the and the character of

that story in this case is depressing or

or

uh you know

certainly productive of unhappiness

now

there are two

there's three at least three possible

antidotes to that and

they should try all of them right so

like if we're talking about a clinical

depression it's it's useful to say that

there's a physiology to this that you

know can be

driven from below in a way that's not

narrowly responsive to their thinking

right so it's it'll tend to produce

depressive thoughts and the depressive

thoughts will tend to feed back on the

state but

you know i don't think all

forms of depression are just a matter of

what a person's thinking it can be

really it's it's best viewed as a kind

of disease you know of physiology and

so you know i'm not against

antidepressants at all i know many

people who've you know received a lot of

help from them and i hope we get better

ones in the future and and pharmacology

is definitely a piece of the of the

solution for for many people

and everything else that is good to do

that people sort of lose their

commitment

to doing at the worst possible time

should be done i mean you have to sort

of get behind yourself and push

to exercise and to socialize and to do

things that you know you you may not

want to do because those are good for

you and help

you know break and can break you out of

it but the normal

range of psychological suffering

you know not clinical depression but

just feeling like you know life sucks

and you're a failure and there's nothing

you know it's like

you're just it's you're stuck

that is a story of

telling yourself a story you're thinking

and you can

either become more and more mindful of

that and interrupt that more and more

and or and it should be and

you can

reframe

this continually and tell yourself a

better story right you can actually just

engineer

you know you can you can change the code

that you're that you're

you know

uh running moment to moment

and

i mean just you know a very simple one

which i you know i use and i actually

recently recorded this

in a lesson on the app you know just

gratitude just thinking this is actually

you know this particular maneuver is

i believe comes from stoic philosophy i

didn't actually get it from stoic

philosophy but this this sort of

use of negative imagination where you

think of

all of the bad things that haven't

happened to you right so if you're just

you know if you're stuck in traffic

driving to the job that you don't like

and

you're you're frustrated

you can think of all the things that

could happen to you right that haven't

and if any one of them happened to you

you would consider your prayers answered

if you could just be returned to this

moment right like you haven't been

diagnosed with cancer right you've got

two young kids say

you know you want to live to see them

grow up and you could be the guy who

today is going to find out you've got

two months to live right and you have to

then the next two months is spent

just

unwinding your worldly affairs right

you're not that guy right that hasn't

happened to you yet

that's just more thinking

but it can have a profound effect you

can you can reframe your experience in a

way that doesn't actually change

anything material about your

circumstance

and it can let the light in and there

are many techniques like that that are

just a matter of invoking useful

concepts skillfully

tell these guys where they can find you

online the making sense podcast is

something i spend a lot of time doing

my meditation app is at wakingup.com

it's called waking up

and

otherwise i'm just my website sam

harris.org i'm on twitter it's also sam

harris org there's no dot

but

you just put in sam harris and you'll

get an eyeful

yes very true

what's the impact that you want to have

on the world

well you know i

what i'm spending my time doing is

trying to engage

honestly with

interesting and consequential ideas i

mean so the net the the the venn diagram

i i have you know i don't think about it

a lot but when i

think about you know retrospectively

what i have been spending a lot of time

doing

i i seem to keep finding the

intersection

of intellectually interesting ideas they

have to have some con connection to

science or philosophy or it just

has to be the kind of thing that someone

would may want to think about anyway

because they're just cool ideas so

something like artificial intelligence

right

very interesting to think about

but it's also

hugely consequential you know

increasingly so and if we get it wrong

it will

you know redown to our misery right if

not extinction right so like that is

that's

the the center of the bull's-eye for me

something that's interesting

something that's consequential something

that that getting it the difference

between getting it right and wrong is

enormous right and that's so so those

are that's sort of the landscape where

i'm trying to continually focus my

conversations i love that

all right guys truly there are a few

people on this planet that have

influenced my thinking more than this

man i hope that you will dive in his

world and let it expand your own

consciousness and and discover new

things that you're capable of

if you haven't already be sure to

subscribe and until next time my friends

be legendary take care

sam jesus dude how many times have you

robbed the bank

i have the bank the way uh

you mean as in went into a one and stole

the cash four times wow and stole money

virtually dozens of times