Pixels CEO Interview💎The Importance of NFT Interoperability with Ronin

Summary

In this Tech Path interview, Luke Barowski, founder of Pixels, discusses the evolution of their web3 gaming platform. He highlights the importance of gameplay and integrating unique web3 elements, such as NFT avatars and play-to-earn mechanics. The conversation also touches on the challenges of user acquisition in web3 and the strategic shift from Polygon to Ronin, emphasizing the value of mentorship and distribution. Barowski shares insights on the future of gaming, the potential of guilds, and the upcoming Chapter 2 update for Pixels, which aims to enhance the player experience and ecosystem spending.

Takeaways

• 🎮 Paul Baron interviews Luke Barowski, the CEO of Pixels, a web3 gaming project focused on gameplay and leveraging unique web3 features to enhance the gaming experience.
• 🕹️ Pixels is a web3 native game that has evolved significantly since its initial release two years ago, drawing inspiration from casual games like Stardew Valley and Farmville.
• 🔗 The game emphasizes interoperability, integrating over 90 NFT collections for use as avatars within the game, showcasing the interconnectedness of web3 projects.
• 💰 Play-to-earn mechanics are a key aspect of Pixels' strategy, with the belief that this model will become prevalent in the gaming industry over the next 5-10 years.
• 🌐 The decision to move from Polygon to Ronin as the underlying blockchain was driven by the latter's experience in scaling web3 games and the potential for user acquisition and distribution.
• 🔄 Despite the move to Ronin, Pixels aims to maintain interoperability with other chains, such as Ethereum, for their NFTs like Farmland, to keep options open for users.
• 📈 The focus on user retention and in-game token holding is seen as a positive sign for the ecosystem's health, with less need for on-chain transactions.
• 🤝 Partnerships with other web3 projects, like Mocha, are crucial for growth and interoperability, providing mutual benefits and shared user bases.
• 📱 Mobile gaming is considered for Pixels, with the potential for companion apps or casual games that are mobile-friendly and iOS native.
• 🚀 The roadmap for the next 12-24 months includes enhancing the game's economy, introducing new progression systems, and increasing spend within the ecosystem.
• 💡 The guild system in Pixels is designed to incentivize user growth and retention, offering rewards for contributing to the game's expansion and fostering social dynamics.

Q & A

What is the core focus of the Pixels project?

The core focus of the Pixels project is web3 gaming, with an emphasis on gameplay and leveraging unique aspects of web3 to enhance the gaming experience.

How does Pixels differentiate itself from other game studios?

Pixels differentiates itself by taking a unique approach that focuses on integrating web3 mechanics in a way that makes gaming more interesting and engaging, rather than just adopting web3 technologies for the sake of it.

What is the gameplay loop of Pixels like?

The gameplay loop of Pixels is similar to Stardew Valley if it were a massively multiplayer online (MMO) game, with inspiration from casual games like Farmville.

How has Pixels evolved since its first release?

Pixels has evolved significantly since its first release two years ago, with continuous improvements and community involvement that has led to a much better game experience.

What is the significance of NFT avatar integrations in Pixels?

NFT avatar integrations in Pixels allow for interoperability with over 90 NFT collections, enabling users to use these NFTs as avatars within the game and showcasing the interconnectedness of web3 experiences.

Why did Pixels decide to move from Polygon to Ronin?

Pixels moved to Ronin because of the mentorship and experience the Ronin team offered, having successfully scaled a web3 game before with Axie Infinity, as well as the potential for user acquisition and distribution that Ronin provided.

How does the play-to-earn model fit into Pixels' vision for the future of gaming?

Pixels views play-to-earn as the next evolution of gaming, where users can earn while playing, and they believe it will become a dominant model in the gaming industry over the next five to ten years.

What are the benefits of having some assets on L1 and others on L2 or L3 chains?

Having assets on different layers provides a balance between liquidity, cross-game functionality, and the need for decentralization. It allows for optimal use cases, such as keeping highly liquid assets on L1 and less liquid or game-specific assets on L2 or L3 chains.

How does Pixels plan to address the onboarding challenge in web3 gaming?

Pixels believes that if there's a compelling reason for users to join a web3 ecosystem, onboarding becomes less of an issue. They focus on creating incentive structures that encourage user growth and retention.

What can we expect from Pixels in terms of mobile gaming?

Pixels is working on mobile browser compatibility, with about 30% of their user base already playing via mobile browsers. They are also considering releasing casual games that are mobile-friendly and iOS native, potentially using the token in different ways.

What is the role of guilds in the Pixels ecosystem?

Guilds in Pixels serve as a social feature that integrates friend tech with web3 gaming, offering incentive structures for groups of users to grow their own subgroup within the ecosystem and enhancing the overall gaming experience through social dynamics.

Outlines

00:00

📌 Introduction and Overview of Pixels

The paragraph introduces the interview with Luke Barowski from Pixels, a web3 gaming project. Luke discusses the focus on gameplay and the unique aspects of web3 that enhance gaming experiences. Pixels, inspired by casual games like Stardew Valley and Farmville, aims to integrate various web3 mechanics, such as NFT avatars, into a single experience. The game has evolved significantly since its initial release two years ago, with a focus on play-to-earn mechanics and token implementation as key components for user acquisition and growth.

05:01

🚀 Shift from Polygon to Ronin and its Implications

This section delves into Pixels' decision to move from the Polygon network to Ronin, highlighting the challenges of scaling a web3 game and the importance of partnering with a team that has prior experience in this area. The Ronin team's successful scaling of Axie Infinity was a significant factor in the decision. The move also aimed to leverage Ronin's existing user base for easier acquisition and distribution. Despite the transition, Pixels still values interoperability and maintains the option for users to engage with their assets on different platforms.

10:02

🔄 Interoperability and User Engagement

The discussion focuses on the importance of interoperability and its impact on user engagement and token activity within the Pixels ecosystem. While there is a desire for cross-chain functionality, the current size of Pixels allows for a focus on internal growth. The balance between on-chain and off-chain activities is also explored, with an emphasis on providing transparency and value to users without overcomplicating the gaming experience.

15:02

📈 Growth Strategies and Future Plans

This part of the conversation explores Pixels' strategies for user growth and retention, including the use of incentives and social dynamics. The integration with other web3 projects like Moche is highlighted as a successful example of cross-promotion and shared rewards. The roadmap for the next 12 months includes the introduction of Chapter 2, which aims to enhance the game's progression system, introduce new monetization methods, and increase social interactions through guilds.

20:04

🤝 Collaboration and the Creator Economy

The final section discusses the potential for collaboration within the web3 gaming space, particularly the creator economy and the role of guilds in incentivizing user growth and enhancing the gaming experience. The guild system in Pixels is described as a way to reward users for contributing to the community, with the possibility of more casual games in the future that leverage the token economy and expand the reach of the Pixels ecosystem.

Keywords

💡Web 3

Web 3, or Web 3.0, refers to the next generation of the internet that is decentralized, secure, and user-centric. In the context of the video, Web 3 is associated with gaming and the unique gaming experiences it offers, such as interoperability and play-to-earn mechanics. The video discusses how Pixels, a Web 3 native game, leverages these features to enhance gameplay and user engagement.

💡Pixels

Pixels is a Web 3 native game mentioned in the video. It is described as a game that combines elements of Stardew Valley and MMO games, with a focus on casual gameplay. The game integrates NFT avatars and explores the unique aspects of Web 3 that can improve the gaming experience, such as interoperability and play-to-earn mechanics. It also emphasizes community involvement in the game's development and evolution.

💡NFT

NFT stands for Non-Fungible Token, which is a unique digital asset that is indivisible and cannot be exchanged on a one-to-one basis with another token. In the video, NFTs are used as avatars within the game Pixels, showcasing the interoperability of different NFT collections. This integration of NFTs into gaming is a key aspect of Web 3 gaming, allowing players to use their digital assets across different platforms and games.

💡Play-to-Earn

Play-to-Earn is a gaming model where players can earn real-world value through their in-game activities and achievements. This concept has become popular in the context of Web 3 gaming, as it allows players to monetize their skills and contributions to the game. In the video, the game Pixels is exploring play-to-earn mechanics as a way to enhance user engagement and provide an incentive for players to help grow the game's community.

💡Interoperability

Interoperability refers to the ability of different systems or platforms to work together and exchange information seamlessly. In the context of the video, it is a key feature of Web 3 gaming that allows games like Pixels to integrate NFTs from various collections and other blockchains. This creates a more connected and dynamic gaming ecosystem, where digital assets can be used across multiple games and platforms.

💡Ronin

Ronin is a blockchain network specifically designed for gaming and NFTs. It is mentioned in the video as the blockchain that Pixels has transitioned to, in order to benefit from the network's focus on user acquisition and distribution. The move to Ronin is seen as a strategic decision to leverage the network's existing infrastructure and user base, as well as the experience of the team behind it, particularly their success with scaling Axie Infinity.

💡Axie Infinity

Axie Infinity is a popular blockchain-based game that introduced the play-to-earn model to the mainstream. It is often cited as a reference point in discussions about Web 3 gaming and its impact on the gaming industry. In the video, Axie Infinity's success and the lessons learned from its development and scaling are used as a benchmark for Pixels' own growth and strategic decisions.

💡Guilds

In the context of the video, guilds refer to social structures within the game Pixels that integrate gameplay and incentivize user growth. Guilds are seen as a way to create a more engaging and social gaming experience, where players are rewarded for contributing to the community and helping to expand the game's user base. This concept aligns with the broader theme of community involvement and collaboration in Web 3 gaming ecosystems.

💡Token

In the context of the video, a token refers to the in-game currency or utility token that players can use, earn, or trade. The Pixel token, for example, is used within the game and has been launched to help grow the game and facilitate various in-game transactions. Tokens are a crucial aspect of Web 3 gaming, as they often have real-world value and can be used across different platforms, contributing to the game's economy and user engagement.

💡User Acquisition

User acquisition is the process of attracting new users to a product or service, such as a game. In the video, it is highlighted as a significant challenge in the Web 3 gaming space, where attracting and retaining users is crucial for the success and growth of a game like Pixels. The discussion around user acquisition touches on strategies such as partnerships, referral programs, and creating compelling gameplay experiences that incentivize players to join and stay within the game.

💡Mobile Gaming

Mobile gaming refers to playing games on mobile devices, such as smartphones and tablets. In the video, the discussion around mobile gaming relates to the potential for Pixels to expand its reach by developing mobile-friendly games and companion apps. This is seen as a strategic move to tap into the large mobile gaming market and make Web 3 gaming more accessible to a broader audience.

Highlights

Interview with Luke Barowski, founder and CEO of Pixels, a web3 gaming project.

Pixels focuses on web3 gaming with an emphasis on core gameplay loops and leveraging unique web3 features to enhance the gaming experience.

The game has evolved significantly since its initial release two years ago, with a current gameplay style similar to Stardew Valley in an MMO format.

Pixels has integrated over 90 NFT collections for use as avatars within the game, showcasing interoperability within the web3 space.

The play-to-earn model is a key aspect of Pixels' strategy, aiming to drive user acquisition and retention in the gaming ecosystem.

Tokens play a crucial role in the growth of the game, with the recent launch of the Pixel token being a significant milestone.

Pixels transitioned from the Polygon network to the Ronin network to benefit from their experience in scaling web3 games and user acquisition.

The Ronin network already had a base of gamers, making it a strategic move for Pixels to tap into that existing community.

The decision to move to Ronin was also influenced by the potential to resurrect inactive users from the Axie Infinity ecosystem.

Pixels aims to maintain interoperability with other chains, such as Ethereum, despite being primarily on the Ronin network.

The game's economy is designed to encourage players to keep tokens within the game, which is seen as a positive sign for the ecosystem's health.

Interoperability is not currently a significant growth driver for Pixels, as the game primarily drives its own user growth.

Pixels is exploring the idea of creating casual, mobile-friendly games that are not directly related to the main Pixels gameplay but utilize the token in different ways.

The upcoming Chapter 2 update for Pixels will introduce new progression systems, social dynamics like guilds, and additional monetization options.

Guilds in Pixels serve as a unique incentive structure, rewarding users for helping grow the game and enhancing social connections within the ecosystem.

The overall goal for Pixels over the next 12 to 24 months is to increase spending within the ecosystem, focusing on sustainable growth and user retention.

Transcripts

all right today we're going to be diving

into a web three project out there and

of course as you guys know we try to do

this from time to time and today will be

an interview with a founder and CEO so

it's going to be a good one stick around

my name is Paul bar and welcome back in

Tech path joining me today is Luke

barowski who is coming in from pixels

great to have you Luke how's it going

yeah thanks very much for having me um

yeah it's good it's good it's been a

busy time at pixels the last couple

months but it's kind of easing now so

now we can kind of focus on what's up

for the next year um excited to be here

today so let's get into it a little bit

I just want to let our audience know a

little bit about pixels as a project if

you can kind of give maybe someone

that's just brand new to web 3 and

understanding what's happening a rundown

on

pixels yeah so at pixels I would say

that we love web3 gaming and we are a

web3 native game at the core of it now

we also really care about gameplay and

love what we're building here when it

comes to the core gameplay Loops what

we've tried to figure out is what are

the unique parts of web 3 that actually

make gameplay better so if you've been

following pixels or if you don't know

anything about pixels we take a pretty

different approach to a lot of game

studios and how we actually go and build

this game we actually released the first

version of pixels about two years ago

and how the game kind of looks and plays

now is it plays like stardo Valley if it

was an MMO I have a big fondant for uh

casual games and I love games like like

Farmville so we took inspiration from

those initial games the very beginning

of what we were doing but we released

the game two years ago and we have been

building with Community for over two

years now so the game's evolved a ton in

the last two years first version of the

game that came out in like January 2022

wasn't very good um but it's gotten

better and better and one of the things

that we've been trying to figure out at

pixels is what are the elements of web 3

that make gaming actually interesting so

it's actually become quite an

interesting like hjh of a lot of

different web three mechanics because

we've been trying things a lot so it's

really interoperable that's one of the

first things you'll notice when you come

and play pixels where we do this cool

thing of nft Avatar Integrations we've

worked at over 90 nft collections to

this point we've put them inside the

game to use them as avatars inside of

our game so you'll notice when you first

come into our game there's like a lot of

different characters inside of it

because it's actually all nfts that we

didn't release that you can actually use

inside of the game as an avatar and

that's one of those first things when

you see pixels it kind of starts to

click in your mind oh this is an

interesting part about web 3 like

there's all these other things inside of

web 3 that we're combining into this one

experience and we've continued to build

with this approach one of the things

that we've honed in on now is the play

the earn mechanics which is an

interesting one because play the earn

became really popular about two years

ago with axi infinity and it's one of

those things that you know took the

World by storm for a short period of

time kind of went back into the back

burner and now you know we're trying to

come back with play to earn again now

play to earn maybe didn't work as well

the first time we kind of believe that

it's the future of how games will evolve

and actually most games will be played

to earn in like the next five to 10

years we kind of view it as the

evolution of gaming where you know 10

years ago you used to only buy games you

would pay like if you were even on the

iPhone you would pay like5 to10 for

download of a game yeah then freeo play

came out and we think that play to earn

is kind of the next evolution of gaming

user acquisition so we've done a lot of

work in there we just launched the token

about two months ago and that was really

the big kickoff for us and that you know

got us a lot more attention inside of

the web 3 space sure and yeah we're

experimenting a lot with how you can use

tokens to grow games in ways that you

couldn't do it in web 2 and that's a lot

of been that's been a lot of our core

Tech too kind of figuring out you know

how tokens are used what part about web

3 is interesting how you can make a

really competitive game experience

against web 2 and really leaning into

the interesting parts of web 3 I want to

get into some of the mechanics behind

this because this obviously gets into

how games will uh Faire you know from a

sustainability standpoint meaning how

long will they last uh one of the things

of course that was big news is um you

guys shifting over from polygon to Ronin

uh within that with that move I guess

why did you move first of all and also

kind of as a follow on is how much of

pixels is still on polygon and not on

Ronin so web 3 is is still in a really

early spot where nobody really knows

what's going to work and what's not

going to work and what we do know inside

of web 3 is user acquisition is very

difficult and it's very expensive so we

were built on polygon for a while and I

have a lot of love for what polygon is

doing I have a lot of respect for that

team I have nothing negative to say

about polygon but what we were looking

for with a partnership with a chain was

somebody who could help us with user

acquisition and distribution in a way

that didn't really exist for us on

polygon and working with the Ronin team

was really attractive to me because

really they were the only team who had

experience scaling a web 3 game before

and that is not an easy thing to do and

scaling a web 3 game is very very

difficult and it comes with a lot of

lessons learned as well too so I really

wanted to work with somebody who had

kind of been there and done that before

and yeah Ronin the sky Mavis team um

they had scaled axi infinity and you

know I had own criticisms of AI Infinity

before I joined web 3 and got into the

space but as I started building a web 3

I developed a much deeper sense of

empathy with the people who came before

us essentially and I started to realize

how difficult it is to build in the

space and what the Lessons Learned in

that space actually give you and how

valuable it could be to work with a team

who's done it before so part of the

reason why we want to move with to Ronin

was that mentorship aspect and it's been

invaluable I can't speak enough on

knowledge of that team what they bring

to the table and you know how smart that

team is and then the other thing is

obviously the distribution aspect too so

they had already done the hard work of

onboarding millions and millions of

users onto the Ronin chain and though ax

da might have been down when we

initially moved there our bet was that

we could probably resurrect a lot of

these users we had already been

onboarded into the ren chain because

really the onboarding part is the hard

expensive part and argue that though in

the sense that axi was the early mover

in web 3 but at the same time we saw a

large amount of people abandon that game

you know as many more compet competitive

games came to Market and obviously the

multi-chain capacity you know would

would you be trading off you know the

existing potential uh of what's

happening over on the polygon Network

and also some of the interoperability by

going into axi well into Ronin uh with

more of a closed chain ecosystem just

think of that as a a tradeoff you know

for you guys at

pixels yeah so we had talked to

basically every chain and really

consider the options before we moved

over to Ronin and again just like

building in a space I had a steep

understanding of the value that actually

meant to on board those initial users at

the beginning um and the reality is

Ronan had Gamers on the chain and no

other chain had that there might have

been some defi or some other aspects in

top of these games but otherwise

if we were moving to other chain it

would really be us you know creating

more users or more Gamers on top of that

chain so there was really good Mutual

benefit for us moving to Ronin because

they already had these Gamers onboarded

and the bet that we were making was okay

can we start to reurn on some of these

users and it was one of those things

before we moved I got a lot of push back

from different stakeholders or mentors

or other people in the space but now

that we've made that move I don't think

anybody's criticized it on our end

that's what I can say interesting okay

so with the fact that it's not uh pixels

may not be on Magic Eden or on Open Sea

I'm just looking at and I think about

you know just the Farmland side of

things how will that progress I mean if

this continues to move as it migrates

onto Ronin will this disappear from Open

Sea I know Open Sea one of your

investors but is this something that

will continue to operate within the Open

Sea and potentially magic Eden

communities how how will that

transact so generally what we saw with

our farmland f is the engagement of our

own player base is what's driving the

volume on these exchanges and really we

want to be where our players are when we

think about the you know nft and any of

the large assets that we hold um so I

also when I think about nfts and onchain

assets I like to think about them in

different tiers and categories and I

think there are benefits to having some

assets on the L1 on eth and then other

assets

that are you know they have less need

for liquidity or cross game

functionality essentially to be on a

chain like Ronin or an L2 or even an L3

so our Farmland nft is one of those ones

where you know it hasn't actually

happened yet but we'd love to see more

interoperability from other games to our

nft farmland and leaving it on E leaves

that option where we have like a two-way

bridge to Ronin and Open Seas so we

don't close that door you know other

people actually want to use our assets

inside of their games um and you know we

still maintain optionality where if

people do really feel like it's better

to be on eth they can have it on there

our token is the same way the pixel

token is on eth and it's on Ronin you

see a lot of exchange volume on the l1s

but also all our users use it mostly on

Ronin and in terms of the because you

keep mentioning the users I'm looking at

token terminal here on uh on Ronin in

general with uh with what's happening

here and if you look at the transaction

Count versus say uh users U being active

users daily um I mean first of all the

the fact that you know mainly transa or

active users is going up but daily

transactions not necessarily or

transaction count I should say is going

up as much considering this many players

that potentially are on the network um

why do you think there's such a

disparity in in that uh right now within

the network versus uh

transactions that's actually better

ecosystem Health in my opinion because

that means that most most of the tokens

are staying inside the game so we do

some things onchain we do some things

offchain we used to have

a when I first joined web 3 I had this

mindset that everything needs to be

decentralized everything needs to be on

chain and we actually had almost all of

the ownership of our game assets on

chain that means like literally every

single farm that people every single

crop people farmed was on chain one day

when we had that it broke and it was

broke for like four 5 days and none of

our users noticed and they didn't care

basically so what we found is there are

certain R inside game yeah so you're

exactly exactly so there are certain

things that people want on chain and we

actually don't need things on chain

until the last minute a lot of the times

when people want to take particular

actions like sell the token or sell an

nft that's when they need it on chain

but until then it doesn't really need to

be on chain um as long as you're giving

people transparency into like some of

the statistics they want there's some

value in having like maybe Marketplace

volume on chain but honestly we have

people that made third party tools with

our apis where they get 90% of the value

as it would be on chain and it saves us

so much time and complexity all this too

so yeah you might not be seeing all

these transactions on chain with a pixel

token but it's because it's happening in

game or they're keeping their tokens in

game which is actually better for theem

with the with the fact of uh

interoperability on chain you know kind

of being a big deal I think for most web

3 projects obviously this will start to

isolate pixels into Ronin because you

know it's not a chain that is

interoperable with others um with that

being the case do you feel like that is

going to be you know a deterrent for

growth or do you feel like no this is

this is going to be a huge ecosystem

we're going to have a very centralized

player Network here that's going to be

able to piggyback on what Ronin has

built and uh we're going to continue to

see that change just become the dominant

out there

what's your

opinion yeah so we've done so many

experiments with interoperability at

this point and we still read from other

chains so we actually do read polygon

nfts inside of our game right now where

if I don't think we support that many

because again I don't want to say

anything bad but like there's really not

that much nft activity on side of

polygon where it makes sense for us to

put a lot of resources into creating

interoperable experiences with the

activity there um but we still support

like 80s something nft collections on

eth the interesting thing is pixels is

at the size right now where

interoperability isn't really a huge

growth driver for us it's something fun

and it provides value to the users but

whenever you work with an nft collection

like specifically like a 10K pfp

collection really there's maybe like

three to 400 active users inside of

those nft Collections and then maybe

you'll convert like 10 to 20% on a good

day with these nft collections so it's

like it's not a huge um lift so we do

like the idea of like deeper

interoperability with maybe larger

ecosystems but it's funny because we're

in a spot right now where we drive most

of our own user growth and we move most

people to wherever we go essentially

where where does that user growth come

from so it's in the incentive design and

that's a lot of the work that we've been

figuring out so I love play to earn and

I love thinking about creating

incentives that help our users help us

grow the key you feel like that's been

like word of mouth or or has it been you

know just the relationship with Ronin or

or what is it social what's driving it

though I'm just gonna yeah so we've

experimented with a bunch um we've run

some campaigns where we really turn on

the growth inside of our own ecosystem

that means things like incentivized

sharing incentivized referrals all of

this and we've done that in short bursts

so we ran the first play the air drop

it's funny because play the airdrop is

this whole new meta now we were the ones

that coined that term and we did this in

like August 2022 um so we've been on top

of the meta and like kind of setting

some of the meta like that um so we

think about incentivized growth in those

ways and then we also think about um

literally just creating incentive

structures that help our users help us

grow so we have been growing organically

since we've had the token out um but

it's because of these incentive

structures that we place inside the game

and some of the play the earn mechanics

they're inherently viral um axi Infinity

they didn't really put that much money

in Mar they had very similar yeah you're

right they had a very similar uh

scenario play out for them uh I want to

play a clip for you this is yatsu

obviously of vam Moka Brands and he's

talking a little bit more around the

mocha verse I want to get your opinion

on this let me play this clip for you

pixels was was a you know an interesting

game on a on a new blockchain and we'

bought you know I don't know how many

people you mock bought into it but you

know it's about a third of the traffic

came in from from Mo yeah mooche has

risen in value but you will notice very

very few nfts are actually on sale

versus maybe some nft collections that

have much more liquidity but also

they're held by a more Deen community

that actually tradeing and you kind of

need both right you know um companies

like SK Sky MERS have demonstrated with

ax Infinity um you know and Ronin of

course that you need a healthy mix of

you know both to create a market I mean

if you want to build North Korea go

ahead right you know then you don't open

don't you have a market right but then

why are you in web 3 to begin with I

mean it's there's no point being in web

3 if you're building a Clos

ecosystem okay so you kind of see you

know ysu's point right there what what

we thoughts about

that yeah so there's I would say there's

a few Partnerships inside the web 3

right now that are like difference

makers when we're thinking about like

the scale that we have because we have

700,000 daily active addresses playing

the game probably like 500,000 real

daily active users probably more about

600,000 now and mo verse is one of those

projects where you know I'm really

bought into the vision of them and yeah

it was like a win-win for both of us

essentially we drove a ton of users to

them they drove a lot of users to us too

and as more and more people come into

the space then it starts getting more

interesting for us when it comes to

deeper interoperability as well okay the

moche integration with us was like a

cool one because it wasn't just an nft

integration it was a very deep

integration where there was gameplay

there was like shared rewards between

both ecosystems and we love that stuff

but it has to be like moving the needle

for us to do it right now oh no doubt

you've got to have these Partnerships

really resolve into some sort of you

know advancement for the project in

terms of Mobile you know and you look at

what mobile has been able to do axi not

launching on iOS uh what's the plan for

pixels how what's the mobile road map

for you guys yeah so we work in mobile

browsers right now and about 30% of our

user base plays in mobile browsers so

when we think about yeah when we think

about actually mobile native it's still

not an easy path to get a web 3 game

into the App Store and truthfully our

strategy is probably companion apps or

secondary apps that aren't core pixels

gameplay but maybe like we've been

talking a lot about what does it look

like when we start to scale horizontally

um and when do we start pulling the

trigger on that we're probably planting

the seeds on that now but like you could

probably expect us to release some

casual games that aren't necessarily

directly related to pixels but mobile

friendly like iOS native um and then

likely using the token but in a

different way potentially yeah well I

could see that being kind of a marketing

plug because obviously you're going to

get some more Gamers being able to pull

them into you know the browser side of

things but onboarding is still still an

issue that I think we're going to

continue to see in web 3 what do you

think is going to be kind of the Holy

Grail for what you guys are doing now

that you're on the Ronin chain in terms

of

onboarding yeah I have a maybe

controversial take here where again axi

Infinity when it really started scaling

the onboarding experience was so much

worse than what the Rona network is now

and they still got millions of users if

there's a compelling enough reason for

people to be you know coming into a web

3 ecosystem then I don't think

onboarding is as big of an issue and I

don't think the web you feel it's good

enough now you feel like good enough now

okay all right that's interesting I like

that because uh that you know most

people are trying to perfect that

onboarding experience but you're right

there is there's a lot of players I

think that especially if you get into

gen Z that are one much more digitally

native they they kind of understand the

process of kind of coming on you know

and I think you know anybody that's been

around crypto is probably already down

that road as well all right so uh I

guess the next question want get into um

you you for you guys it's going to be

the Ronin wallet so all of your users

you're really promoting the fact that

they would get a ronin wallet is that

kind of the the process here so we have

social login inside of the game too and

I think about like 20% of users

initially sign up with a social login

but then in order to interact with the

like web three components you're going

to need to get a wallet essentially and

that's kind of the idea where we want a

flow into the game that doesn't NE

necessarily require it but you're going

to get more of the game experience once

you on board in the crypto yeah yeah

we're looking at the login and sign up

uh there on your site uh I think this is

cool I think the the key here is as we

start to see web 3 gaming really become

a major category which is really

starting now I think this year I've said

it many times I think 24 is the breakout

year for it whether we get a big

Breakout game or just a lot of these

games much like what you guys are doing

starting to really grow Road mapap wise

uh for chapter two what's it look like

down say across the next 12 months yeah

so I would say we have one kpi when it

comes to all the things we're thinking

about over the next 12 to 24 months and

it's really increasing spend inside the

ecosystem it sounds weird to say that

when I'm talking about players but um

mization is actually really important

for sustainability inside of web 3

gaming and when we think a lot about the

economics of the business model it

revolves around basically you know

creating

more interesting gameplay that leads to

spend which you can then funnel back in

user acquisition or things like play to

earn all of this so chapter 2 is our big

initiative with changing some of the

economics inside of the game um there's

a lot of complexities when you start to

release a web 3 game when it comes to

reward distribution and our chapter 2 is

partly

in when we think about releasing it one

way to get more rewards to better users

inside of the game we're essentially

adding more progression the game's going

to feel a lot more like a traditional

MMO when it comes to progression tearing

all this kind of stuff and then we're

also thinking about more monetization

reals inside of the game as well too so

right now really the monetization that

we have inside of pixels you can buy the

IP pass which is a subscription it's

about like 10 US dollar a month um we do

a couple mints every now and then you

can buy coins inside of the game we're

going to start giving our users more

reasons to be able to use the token

inside of the game in Chapter 2 and add

it into progression and it's kind of a

similar way to how a game like Clash of

Clans monetized where it's not supposed

to interfere with core gameplay but it

makes the gameplay a bit better for the

people who want to be participating in

that and then yeah we also think the

game's just going a lot more interesting

when we release chapter 2 as well it

introduces a lot more social dynamics we

have guilds tightly integrated into the

game play and we're really excited about

it's the best I felt about our gameplay

the plan around it and what we're about

to do and it's an exciting time yeah

what about uh you know when you look at

just the Creator economy much that has

been built I I would say sandbox is a

good example of that but you know the

opportunity here with what axi has done

with gaming guilds we've seen the

expansion now you've got the Ronin

Network really starting to move into

multiple game uh n really kind of become

a game network um and you look at the

Creator economy is that something that

will apply to pixels as well yeah that's

somewhat of the intention behind guilds

too what we think a lot about is how do

we create incentive structures natively

inside the game that reward people for

helping us grow and we've done some

things like referrals or like

incentivized content creation we love

the idea of guilds because it basically

creates this new incentive structure

where if you are a group of users you're

incentivized to go help grow your own

subgroup of users inside of this

ecosystem also the social connection

makes the retention a lot stickier and

it makes the gameplay like just feel a

bit better too so yeah there's some

interesting aspects with the guild

system that we're creating if you

haven't followed along how our guilds

kind of work is it's social fish where

it feels a little bit like friend Tech

meets web 3 gaming where yeah if you uh

purchase a membership into a guild you

actually to buy a membership with a

pixel token um part of that membership

it's taken out as a fee and distributed

back to the guild so they actually get a

little bit of a treasury to go and do

whatever they want that's nice um

hopefully some user

acquisition well that's some good

strategies you know because I think

that's one of the things that is and has

been missing with a lot of web 3

projects is just the economy strategies

being built into it we've learned a lot

you know from the axi Infiniti days you

know of really understanding how to get

into uh you know reducing fees

increasing player volume and then

obviously really kind of get that um

that stickiness or that Viral nature of

game so definitely going to be one to

watch uh Luke it's been great having you

on the show thanks so much for stopping

in today we appreciate it yeah thanks

for having me you bet all right so you

guys uh are tuned in here and if you

like these kind of web 3 project

breakdowns whether it's games or other

sty styles of projects out there around

web 3 make sure and drop some comments

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it's just Paul Baron we'll catch you

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