The Memecoin Dilemma: Fueling Adoption or Derailing Progress? | Analyst Round Table
Summary
TLDRIn this episode of ZeroX Research, the team discusses various updates in the crypto space, including Zerion's L2 announcement, Starbucks' closure of their NFT platform, and the rise of meme coins. They also delve into the legitimacy of meme coins and their impact on the market, highlighting the significant trading volumes and revenue generated. The conversation touches on the potential risks and frothy market sentiment surrounding meme coins, emphasizing the need for awareness among investors.
Takeaways
- 📈 The podcast discusses various updates in the crypto space, including Zerion's L2 announcement and Starbucks shutting down their NFT platform, Odyssey.
- 💡 The hosts debate the efficacy of L2 solutions and the potential for wallets to leverage them, comparing it to MetaMask's potential influence.
- 🚀 Starbuck's closure of Odyssey is seen as a disappointment, with the hosts noting the platform's UX issues and the high cost of earning rewards.
- 🤔 The conversation touches on the challenges of Web3/Web2 partnerships, especially from a consumer perspective, and the need for native teams to succeed.
- 💰 The hosts discuss the draining of My Lady treasury and the impact on NFT valuations, as well as Uber's Southeast Asia branch, Grab, allowing crypto onramp options.
- 🌐 The podcast highlights the importance of ZK bridging and interoperability between chains like Bitcoin and Ethereum, with Polyhedra CL's strategic funding round indicating market interest.
- 🔧 The successful implementation of Ethereum's 444 upgrade is celebrated, with a focus on the reduction of L2 transaction costs.
- 🎉 The hosts discuss the Avo airdrop and the performance of the Micro Strategy pair trade, highlighting the company's financial maneuvers.
- 📊 The podcast features a discussion with Mag, co-founder of Skip, about their partnership with dydx and the development of their order book discrepancy dashboard.
- 🔮 The concept of 'Stinky', a tool for sovereign chains to build their own Oracle, is introduced, with potential applications for DEX teams like dydx.
- 🛠️ Updates on the Block SDK are provided, with chains like Osmosis and Neutron adopting it for free transactions and MEV lanes.
Q & A
What is the significance of the 30% APY being offered by a certain platform mentioned in the transcript?
-The 30% APY (Annual Percentage Yield) being offered represents a high return on investment, which is significant because it indicates an attractive opportunity for investors. However, the speaker notes that they are only seeing 18% of that return, with the rest being held in EtherFi tokens, highlighting a potential discrepancy between promised returns and actual earnings.
What is the main reason behind Starbucks shutting down their NFT platform, Odyssey?
-Starbucks is shutting down the Odyssey platform due to lack of traction and a suboptimal user experience. The platform required users to engage in complex tasks to earn stamps, which were then exchanged for NFTs and rewards. The process was not user-friendly, and the rewards were not substantial enough to maintain user interest and participation.
What was the main challenge faced by Starbucks in their attempt to integrate NFTs into their customer loyalty program?
-The main challenge was the lack of product-market fit. The user experience was clunky, requiring customers to interact with their website, wallet on Polygon, and trade stamp NFTs, which was not appealing to the users. Additionally, the rewards, such as a free coffee, required a significant amount of stamps, making the process less attractive.
What does the term 'L2' refer to in the context of the transcript?
-In the context of the transcript, 'L2' refers to 'Layer 2' solutions in blockchain technology. These are protocols or platforms built on top of an existing blockchain (the 'Layer 1') to improve its scalability, speed, and cost-efficiency. For instance, Zerion's announcement about an L2 solution for wallets is discussed, indicating a trend in the industry to leverage Layer 2 technologies.
What is the significance of the implementation of 444 on Ethereum?
-The implementation of 444 on Ethereum is significant as it represents a successful live upgrade to the network. This upgrade likely refers to a protocol upgrade aimed at improving Ethereum's performance, possibly related to its transition to Proof of Stake (PoS) and the introduction of sharding, which are part of Ethereum 2.0 upgrades.
What was the main takeaway from the discussion about the My Lady treasury being drained of 110 NFTs?
-The main takeaway was that the draining of the My Lady treasury resulted in a significant drop in the floor price of the NFTs, indicating a strong correlation between the availability of NFTs in the market and their value. This event highlights the volatility of the NFT market and the impact of large-scale transactions on asset prices.
What is the role of the 'Block SDK' mentioned in the transcript?
-The Block SDK is an open-source software development kit that allows blockchains to split their blocks into different lanes with varying ordering and execution rules. It has been adopted by chains like Osmosis and Neutron, primarily for enabling free transactions and for implementing mev (miner extractable value) lanes, where a portion of the block space is dedicated to transactions that the network wants to subsidize.
What is the 'Slinky' tool developed by the team behind Skip?
-Slinky is a tool that allows for the creation of a sovereign, stake-native Oracle using a validator set of the user's choice. It is designed for high performance and can deliver a large number of currency pairs with low latency. The tool is aimed at enabling new permissionless markets in a verifiable and safe way, potentially expanding the range of available markets significantly.
What is the 'stinky' project mentioned in the transcript?
-The 'stinky' project is not explicitly defined in the transcript. However, based on the context, it could be a project or initiative related to the development of tooling for sovereign chains, possibly in relation to the work being done by the team behind Skip.
What was the main reason for the disappointment expressed towards the Starbucks Odyssey platform?
-The disappointment stems from the platform's failure to engage users effectively. The user experience was not smooth, and the rewards system was not enticing enough, requiring a large number of stamps to earn a significant reward, such as a free coffee. This led to a lack of product-market fit and ultimately the decision to shut down the platform.
What does the acronym 'L2' stand for in the context of blockchain and Ethereum?
-In the context of blockchain and Ethereum, 'L2' stands for 'Layer 2', which refers to solutions built on top of the base blockchain layer to improve scalability, reduce transaction costs, and increase transaction throughput. These Layer 2 solutions are essential for handling more transactions without compromising the security of the main blockchain.
Outlines
🎙️ Podcast Introduction and Disclaimer
The podcast begins with a discussion about the current state of a 30% APY investment, with only 18% returns being observed. The hosts share a light-hearted moment about a cat valuation before stating the podcast's disclaimer. They clarify that the views expressed are personal and do not represent any associated organizations. The disclaimer also mentions that the content should not be taken as financial, technical, tax, or legal advice.
📰 News and Governance Updates
The hosts discuss recent news and governance updates in the crypto space. They mention Zerion's announcement about an L2 wallet, which they find interesting despite questioning its necessity. They also discuss Starbucks closing their NFT platform, Odyssey, and the transfer of NFTs to the Nifty Gateway marketplace. The hosts express disappointment over the closure, but acknowledge the platform's UX issues and lack of product-market fit.
🚀 Opportunities in User Experience and L2 Developments
The conversation turns to the potential for improved user experiences in crypto, particularly in relation to wallets and L2 solutions. The hosts suggest that a better UX could lead to increased adoption. They also discuss the My Lady treasury's NFT drain, Uber's crypto onramp options, and the strategic funding round for Polyhedra CL. The segment ends with a discussion on the implementation of Ethereum's 444 upgrade and its impact on L2 transaction costs.
🤝 dydx Segment with Skip Protocol
The podcast features a segment with the co-founder of Skip Protocol. They discuss the partnership with dydx and the development of a dashboard to monitor sovereign entities within the dydx ecosystem. The dashboard helps identify MEV (miner extractable value) and has led to validators seeking ways to reduce their order book discrepancy. The conversation also covers the launch of Stinky, a tool for building sovereign chains, and its potential to enable new permissionless markets with verifiable safety.
🎲 Shuffle Protocol and Meme Coin Dynamics
The hosts discuss Shuffle Protocol, a gambling application with casino-style games and sports betting. They highlight Shuffle's airdrop strategy, market cap, and the platform's unique approach to incentivizing users with their native token. The conversation delves into the potential of gambling protocols within the crypto space and the challenges of differentiating in a growing market.
📈 Meme Coin Legitimacy and Market Concerns
The discussion focuses on the growing legitimacy of meme coins in the crypto market. The hosts note the increasing acceptance by traditional finance and the cultural impact of meme coins. They express concerns about the potential negative image of crypto as a giant casino and the risks associated with the frothy market dynamics of meme coins. The segment ends with a debate on whether meme coin activity will increase or decrease in future market cycles.
Mindmap
Keywords
💡apy
💡L2
💡NFT
💡Governance
💡DeFi
💡Wallet
💡Liquid Staking
💡Rollup
💡Oracle
💡MEV
Highlights
Zerion, a wallet platform, announces plans to subsidize user transactions on Layer 2 (L2) networks, indicating a growing trend of crypto platforms moving towards L2 solutions for efficiency.
Starbucks is closing its NFT platform, Odyssey, on the last day of March, transferring NFTS to the Nifty Gateway marketplace. This move reflects a shift in the company's digital asset strategy.
The My Lady treasury was drained of 110 NFTs, resulting in a 20% drop in the floor price, showcasing the volatility and liquidity issues within the NFT market.
Uber of Southeast Asia, Grab, now allows for crypto onramp options via Triaa, enabling users to transact with BTC, ETH, USDC, and other cryptocurrencies, marking a significant step for crypto adoption in the region.
Polyhedra CL secures a $20 million strategic funding round at a $1 billion valuation, highlighting the high valuations in the middleware infrastructure sector of the crypto market.
The successful implementation of Ethereum's 444 upgrade, with minimal issues, demonstrates the network's ability to perform complex upgrades without major disruptions.
The AVO airdrop is underway, encouraging users to claim their AO tokens and participate in the latest token distribution event.
MicroStrategy's stock price increase and subsequent convertible notes issuance to finance more Bitcoin purchases, as announced by Michael Saylor, showcases the company's continued commitment to Bitcoin.
The discussion on the potential of Layer 2 solutions and the execution of Ethereum's 4444 upgrade indicates a shift towards more efficient and cost-effective blockchain transactions.
The introduction of Slinky, a tool for building sovereign chain-native oracles, aims to enable more powerful and verifiable permissionless markets in the DeFi ecosystem.
The Block SDK release by the guest's company allows chains to split their blocks into different lanes with varied ordering and execution rules, marking a significant development in blockchain technology.
Etherfy, a liquid staking platform for Ethereum, has raised $35 million and launched a governance token, highlighting the growth and investor interest in Ethereum staking solutions.
The launch of Etherfy's automated yield strategy for staked ETH, which deploys into various DeFi strategies, indicates a trend towards more passive income opportunities for Ethereum holders.
The discussion on the potential overvaluation of Etherfy's token and its comparison to Lido's market cap reflects the ongoing debate around token valuations in the DeFi space.
The mention of Shuffle, a gambling application with casino-like games and sports betting, and its recent LBP launch, highlights the growing interest in crypto-based gambling platforms.
The Shuffle platform's airdrop strategy, which rewards users based on their betting volume, demonstrates a unique approach to token distribution and user engagement.
The discussion on the potential impact of meme coins on the broader crypto market and their role in attracting new users versus the risks associated with their speculative nature.
The mention of the Bom meme coin and its rapid growth in liquidity and market cap, as well as the associated risks of pre-sale scams, underscores the wild west nature of the current meme coin market.
The exploration of the future of meme coins and their potential to either continue growing in popularity or face a market correction, reflecting the cyclical nature of the crypto space.
Transcripts
it's offering like 30% apy and you're
seeing like 18% of that return or 18%
apy is sitting in ether fi
tokens we got to restart this this I got
to put this cat
outside meowing up a
[Laughter]
storm the cat thinks the valuation is
too high
yeah before we get into today's episode
just a quick disclaimer the views
expressed on this podcast by either
myself or any guests are their personal
views and do not represent the views of
any Associated organization nothing in
this episode should be construed or
relied upon as Financial technical tax
legal or other advice all right let's
jump into the episode what's up everyone
welcome back to another episode of zerox
research the blockworks research team is
back to bring you another episode of an
analyst round table today is Monday
March 18th and today we are joined by
Ryan a new face of the block research
team and ZX pibbles um Ren how about I
kick it over to you to discuss some of
the latest news and governance updates
definitely thank you Sam so for the
first news and governance update it's
zerion I don't know how to pronounce the
name zerion announc announces an L2 uh
I'm not really sure what a wallet needs
an L2 for but apparently they're going
to subsidize users transactions I also
don't think zaren is like a that wide to
use as a wallet but it seems like
everyone's launching in L2 so I guess
it'll be interesting to see a wallet um
sort of launch in L2 to sort of new jerk
reaction is that a wallet does kind of
have like the distribution in crypto
because everyone interacts with crypto
through a wallet so you know if like
metam Mas launched an L2 I think it
would actually be pretty powerful and
you can think of I guess a coinbase
wallet they launch your 02 base so this
might be a fun experiment but yeah we'll
see um another news governance update is
that Starbucks shuttering or is
shuttering their nftd Odyssey platform
it's going to close the last day of
March I think it was one of the
relatively hype deals that occurred in
the last bull market I know there was a
lot of like talk behind the scenes about
like how much was really spent on that
deal and I do think it was quite a high
sum but yeah um NF customers could earn
through the AY program and then they
could earn stamps I know this was a
crowd favorite for Sam um but yeah these
n ofs are now going to be transferred to
the NFD platform Nifty Gateway where
they can continue to be bought and sold
I think it's a bit disappointing that
they're shutting this down I feel like
it was a fun experiment but I feel like
we're going to see a lot more of these
like Customer Loyalty fan engagement
type of like nft programs in the coming
yours any thoughts on those two news
updates I feel kind of attacked here I
know pibbles is a sucker for Starbucks
LTE as well so I'm I'm definitely going
to call you out there two pibbles but uh
yeah kind of disappointed in this one
obviously there just like wasn't very
good traction to be honest the ux was
like super clunky like the last thing I
want to do is log into my website
browser check out my wallet on polygon
and like trade these little stamp nfts
so I I definitely understand why they're
shutting it down it there like wasn't
product Market fit there like the most
you got was like a free coffee and that
that took like a ton of stamps that you
had to collect I'm pretty sure I paid
like $1,000 dollar for one of these
stamps too that are probably worth
nothing now but nevertheless sad to see
it but uh at least they gave it the old
College try I guess the Odyssey was a
lot of work too like it was like watch
this 2hour documentary on the origin of
our beans and then take a quiz about it
to get a stamp and like you have to get
a ton of stamps to get the slightest
reward so um I I quit after the first
week yeah as did
I uh I I admit that I didn't use used
the product I like logged in once I
picked I think I became like a tiger or
something and then I immediately logged
off um I think the takeaway for me
though is that um these like Web Two web
3 Partnerships are really hard to pull
off especially on the consumer side like
I think about like gamei and Defi and
the reason that they worked to any
degree I think is that they were built
by crypto native teams and if you look
at like early internet or early mobile
apps the really successful ones were all
like the native teams like early
internet Amazon eBay Yahoo PayPal right
like Banks could have easily entered
payments but they didn't uh a net new
startup had to like enter that
Marketplace and same thing on mobile
like Instagram WhatsApp like Spotify
right like apple was Miles Ahead of
Spotify in terms of like music
distribution and streaming and they
still lost out uh they were beaten by um
like a mobile native startup and um and
and Starbucks just wasn't native enough
I
think I do think that there's an
opportunity to try this again but maybe
a few months down the road with like a
much better user experience I'm sure we
gave people like a free pumpkin spice
latte and then they can create like a
wallet to like ZK login instead of like
creating their own wallet with like a
12w seed face like that'll probably be a
much better user experience and make it
like like like a Robin Hood Type
interface you know like you like swipe
to like sell your nft you don't need to
like approve transactions and whatnot um
but yeah I guess good luck Starbucks a
few other news and governance updates um
the My Lady treasury was drained of 110
nfts as a result the floor price I think
is 20% lower than where it was before it
was drained a grab which is sort of like
uber of Southeast Asia allows for crypto
onramp options now via triaa you can use
BTC e x SGD uscc and your C and I think
that's like a pretty nice uh uh a pretty
nice option for a lot of people because
a lot of the time just the offramp
process is quite a pain in the ass to be
honest so just sending it to a product
or service that you use commonly and
being able to pay for that in crypto is
a pretty big unlock and another thing
that occurs along that front is I think
the nosis pay cards are starting to go
out and so far I've heard like
relatively okay things about them I know
some people have mentioned like they're
getting like really really big slippage
when they're transferring or swapping
from like another
sort of stable coin that's in another
currency but it'll probably take some
time before those really take off
polyhedra CL a 20 million strategic
funding round at $1 billion so this
feels like another like really high
valuation for sort of like middleware
infrastructure and I wouldn't be
surprised just looking at the state of
the market and where the worm air drop
is probably going to launch at um but
yeah any thoughts on those three bullet
points I got a question on Paul hedra
what even are they building exactly it's
like been too long I'm almost afraid to
ask at this
point so P just main product if I'm not
wrong is uh ZK bridge and the ZK Bridge
basically operates across multiple
networks and it's not just like one VM
it's across like evm chains um and also
Bitcoin so for example I think they're
going to leverage igen layer to sort of
build build out interoperability between
Bitcoin and ethereum if I'm not wrong
but yeah it's like ZK bridging think of
it as
like Wormhole is interested in like a ZK
sort of like end game so I think
probably he just like trying to work
towards that right now I guess but yeah
ZK bridging is the tldr but all right
moving on to some last news and
governance updates 444 was finally
implemented congratulations eum with a
pretty minim hiccups outside of a slight
uptick in Miss slots and vorks and I
think the cost of L2 transactions has
dropped at least in order of magnitude
across all rollups which is pretty
pretty damn good you know uh I feel like
it's always very very impressive when
ethereum pulls off these like live
upgrades considering ethereum's this
massive Network it's a complicated
system and you're just upgrading it on
the flight it's like really really
impressive another news in governance
update is that the Avo airdrop is
underway so if you have go and claim
your AO token
and lastly the BTC micro strategy pair
trade Michael strategy has absolutely
ran it up turbo in the last few weeks um
so micro strategy is up while BTC was
down likely due to traders long BTC and
shorting micro strategy as Market
participants expected the premium
applied to micro strategy would dissolve
post ETF approval but that just has not
happened as Michael sailor announced his
private offering after private offering
it kind of feels like a infinite money
glitch I know it's not an infinite money
glitch but it kind of feels like an
infinite money glitch any comments on
those yeah I had sailor on the the cool
Throne last week it's just pretty wild
that he's able to run up the equity
price and then do more you know
convertiable notes and essentially
leverage that high Equity value in order
to basically Finance more Bitcoin
purchases so good on him over there in
terms of 4844 my main takeaway is if
you're not experimenting at the VM level
as a rollup then you need to start if
you're not like the arbitrum or optimism
of the world because obviously they've
established some T of some type of uh
Network effect in community but if you
just look at Raw performance like we're
still seeing fees at the L2 level grind
higher just because of the constraints
of the evm at the execution layer and
not necessarily the L1 settlement costs
of these l2s so very excited to see
things like manad uh Eclipse there's all
sorts of other uh projects kind of
experimenting a little bit in the VM
space at the L2 level so excited to
watch this play out over this cycle I
think they'll be big
Winners yeah following on that it feels
like we've hit a point with celesa and
Igan da probably coming online sometime
later this year where perhaps da isn't
constrained for l2s anymore it's
execution so it'll be interesting to see
how L2 sort of like tackle that as
especially considering that most l2s
have like a centralized sequencer today
and it'll be interesting to see if they
sort of like boost up the execution
component of the
L2 but all right uh we're going to move
on to our dydx segment this week and
this week we have skip protocol all
right guys welcome to this week's dydx
segment this week we have mag co-founder
of skip thank you so much for coming on
mag thanks friend appreciate it all
right so getting straight to it skip
received the ground from dydx to Monitor
and analyze Sovereign me within the dydx
ecosystem could you talk a little bit
more about the partnership and the
efficacy of the order book discrepancy
dashboard that you guys have
built yeah sure uh so I think a large
part of it was just realizing like what
is meev on an order book right this was
a question that I don't think anyone had
really explored prior to us looking at
it with dydx research and I think what
we discovered was you know when you have
a chain with multiple different
validators the difference in how those
validators order their orders or how
they process them is actually very
indicative of how much me is being
extracted so this concept of order book
discrepancy actually serves as a very
good proxy for figuring out what me is
and the dashboard you know has been live
for a while and I think one really cool
thing that we've noticed is validators
have come to us asking us how to reduce
their amount of order book discrepancy
which one decreases meev but then two
just makes for a better trading
experience and it's come to the you know
there have been a couple cases where
people exceeded the you know socially
allowed amount of order book discrepancy
and those folks have taken extra
measures to make sure they've reduced it
so at a minimum it served as a great way
of like making these metrics more
transparent and for folks to realize how
they're doing along these
lines okay that's super interesting I
wouldn't have guessed um that badad
would come to you asking how to reduce
their discrepancy but that that kind of
makes sense whether that's like
malicious or not malicious another super
exciting thing that you guys are working
on is stinky which you guys announced
earlier this year could you walk us
through what that is and why it's so
important yeah so we're big Believers in
building tooling that allows for
Sovereign chains more powerful and
Slinky is exactly that right so
basically what Slinky allows you to do
is to uh build your own restak native
Oracle that uses your own validator set
to run and retrieve your own Oracle
prices um it's also heavily geared
towards performance and so it can
deliver you know upwards of a thousand
uh currency pairs on a per on a per
block basis with very little latency and
so in many ways it was almost custom
designed for DDX uh it was built with
their needs in mind and you know we're
we're actively working with the DX team
to explore you know whether it's a
viable option to actually run the Oracle
on
bdx um but at a minimum what it should
allow for is tons and tons of new
permissionless markets in a much more uh
in a much more uh verifiable and Safe
Way and so that's one thing that we're
really excited to work on with the idx
is how do we get the idx from you know
75 markets to over
10,000 yeah that's super exciting I
think permissionless listings are a
great thing and I think reducing the
sort of like trust assumptions that you
need to have for example like most
prexes they need to have like another
set of trust assumptions with the oracle
and so just bringing that inhouse and
trusting the same batt data set seems
like a very natural thing to do I think
one last question I wanted to ask is
what's the update on the Block SDK you
guys released that a while back and I
was super interested in the entire
concept of it and it seems like etherum
like slowly trying to move in that
direction and so I want to ask has
anyone adopted it and how are
applications using it right
now yeah uh so the block CK was a little
bit of a departure from our normal way
of Building Product uh it's a fully
open- Source SDK that allows for chains
to you know split up their block into
different lanes that have different
ordering and execution rules um we've
seen two chains adopted uh so osmosis
and neutron are both you know uh
shipping with the block SDK in their
most recent releas or their next release
and the main use case we've seen for it
right now is enabling for enabling free
transactions so basically uh having a
dedicated amount of block space that is
given to uh types of transactions and
types of actors that should be sub that
this the network wants to subsidize
right we've also seen a lot of use for
the meev lane so the concept of you know
Sovereign me or recapturing me profit
for your community instead of letting it
leak out of the system has been very
popular and the way that that's
implemented in the block SDK is via top
block auction so those two things have
been very uh popular I think the Hub is
right like right around the corner from
launching with the block SDK to have an
EIP 1559 fee Market um which should you
know reduce some of their congestion
issues and especially in periods of high
load makes it a lot harder to Doss the
network gotcha that's super exciting to
hear unfortunately that's all we have
time for today but thank you so much for
coming on mag and now moving on to our
hot seed C drone segment moving on to
this week's hot seat Kone segment uh
zerox pivos I'm going to throw it over
to you this week
first yeah I'm going to start with a
cool Throne it's ethery which is liquid
reaking so I just wrote a report uh
probably about a month ago on um liquid
staking for ethereum and how it's a cash
flow machine and today was a good
morning to wake up and see The Ether
fire a drop they just raised like 35 mil
a few weeks ago in their second round
and then they launched this ether fi
governance token
uh at like a four Bill valuation I think
it's like around 400 mil circulating
market cap um but ether fry has just
been like a really great product to use
over the past year for staking ethereum
um particularly because you get IG layer
points as well as ether points which
have now converted to a token they also
launched a new um it's a new strategy I
think it's called liquid and it auto
deploys your Stak eth in ether
into like various defi strategies I
think I saw a tweet that was like
ether's launch price today is like a
20,000x return for for seed investors
which is pretty insane um they also
launched a new like defi strategy today
so you can take your staked eth and
ethery and it will go into a vault and
it auto deploys into various defi
strategies like on Pendle um it's paying
30% apy where 18% of that is is more
ethery tokens and then 12% of that is
like actual native eth and you continue
to earn more ethery and Ian layer points
so it it's kind of like a nice suite for
like people who want ethereum exposure
but don't want to have to actively
manage what they're actually doing with
that yeah I feel
like that felt very fast I felt like I
would have expected a lot of these like
LRT protocols to sort of push out or
like prolong the tokens as fast as
possible but I mean like if you're just
looking at all of the valuations that a
lot of these air drops are launching at
and I feel like considering the amount
of tvl in their protocol they're
probably thinking that you're not going
to get much more like marginal tvl even
with like additional incentives or
additional points or whatever so you
might as well just launch the points now
and be sort of like the first LRT
protocol with a live token and everyone
will look at that and then they'll
probably go okay this is the only LT
with a token I'm going to ape it because
this I need like my LRT protocol like
exposure and so yeah I think overall
it's a good move it's interesting to see
them launch that sort of like automated
yield strategy uh I think over the past
year we've seen protocols such as like
Somer do quite well with sort of like
yield Vault and yield management so
it'll be interesting to see how much
people ape into the yield strategies and
I think it makes sense considering that
you're depositing e into all of these
protocols and I can layer for yield
anyway that's kind of the whole premise
that you're providing security and in
return you get like some tokens which
you can think of as yield and so they
might as well like manage that e or the
e e for you and sort of try to generate
additional yield on top of it I'll be
really interested to see once I can ler
launches how these LRT protocols
differentiate themselves will they have
like a different basket of abss will
they ultimately all have the same basket
of abss since there's probably like a
soci like good basket version of ABS is
like it'll probably be obvious to most
people like which ones are like BS and
which ones are good so it'll be
interesting to see those Dynamics play
out and whether it'll be like a winner
take all Market or there'll be for
example like 10 LT protocols one year
from
now I just pulled up the Lio chart just
kind of like looking at the market cap
at two and a half billion versus ether
F's 4 billion pibbles would you say this
is like under or overvalued if you had
to put a put a rating on it ethery
probably
overvalued it it just depends like like
Ren said with like the AVS strategy so
like obviously this like liquid strategy
Vault they just launched it kind of lays
like the preliminary architecture for a
managed ABS Vault where you just deposit
your eth to be restak and then they kind
of like Auto pick depending on like your
risk Tolerance on like what ABS is you
want to help direct your eth to
secure on a similar note for um liquid
reaking I'll talk a little bit about one
of my hot seed Cru drones then um swell
which is another liquid reaking protocol
they have around 840 million in tvl um
and they both have a liquid staking
token and a liquid reaking token so
between those two in total they have
around one billion in tvl uh rather than
launching a token theyve decided to
launch a restake rollup um so like
everyone else is rollup season and I
think this just keeps on happening as
much as our friend and analyst Dan Smith
is so sick of l2s launching again and
again um but yeah the spe R has a few
benefits which I I think this part is
like relatively interesting for what
it's worth um since it's a restake roll
up and they I guess will be able to
provide like several I'm not sure if ABS
is is the right term here but several
like features within their vake devel up
so for example decentralized sequencing
decentralized verification and using
sort of IG layer for a fast finality
there I think it'll be interesting to
see what that looks like I feel like all
three of these are a little bit of like
buzz wordss that we haven't seen go live
into production yet um although I know n
has like a fast finality later but yeah
I mean if you just think about it from
like a logical perspective if blast was
the L2 that's built for like native
taking yield then the obvious evolution
of that was that there was going to be
an L2 built with Native reaking yield I
think it's really obvious that that
would have happened sooner later I
wouldn't be too surprised to see blast
like eventually incorporate ltis of some
sort um down the road once it's sort of
like a bit more established but yeah I
think SW has mentioned that they're
going to have all of like the familiar
D5 Primitives but they're probably also
going to have primatives built on Native
staking and reaking yield and the native
gas token of their chain will be rwe
which is their liquid raking token not
their liquid staking token and I feel
like that that was an a relatively
interesting choice to be honest cuz
their liquid staking token has a TV of
840 million versus their liquid reaking
token of that has a TV of roughly 150
million so it could be a bid to sort of
increase the TV of the liquid sing token
increase the adoption and sort of its
utility around its own defi Eco system
but I'll be really interested to see
what type of dabs launch there to be
honest I'm struggling Beyond like the
normal like you know dexes money markets
maybe like a per Dex with liquid resing
token as collateral uh but yeah let's
just see how this experiment plays out
and um it's going to use ion da and it's
going to be built using the polygon ZK
evm yeah I can't wait to farm the swell
swap air drop and swell end it's going
be good stuff um it it's cool to see
them launch this L2 strategy along with
every else and I know like ether fight
also put an L2 in their road map uh I
think it's pretty safe to say blockworks
research is going to have its own L2 uh
by the end of the year just for
fun I think going completely off topic
here but another thing that you're
seeing or you're starting to see is l2s
not just on ethereum like on salana too
and I feel like just L2 season is going
to get CER and CER like everyone on even
if it doesn't make sense it's just going
to launch an L2 I think by the end of
the year mer probably can to get brain
damage of some form if he already
doesn't have any damage from all of the
l2s that of launched but for example
Zeta markets is launching his own L2 on
salana grass is launching its own L2 on
salana I think you can make an argument
for like those two like kind of make
sense um but you know on the other hand
you've also seen people sort of take the
svm and build out their own kind of L1
so for example like piff piff has their
own network built using the svm so it's
interesting to see that choice between
l2s and L1 and I don't think we have a
lot of salana l2s today if any at all so
it'll be interesting to see what that
user experience looks like compared to
sort of like ethereum
l2s yeah I think the biggest question
here is do they actually work um like if
if you're seeing like tons of
transaction is getting dropped on salana
and every block right now what happens
when you're an L2 on salana and you're
trying to like just function as a chain
yeah I I got to go back and like study
up on this but I feel like I've like
seen Anatoli say multiple times like I
don't know why you would build an L2 on
Sala like you you don't like you
wouldn't get any benefits per se but
yeah I I don't have enough knowledge on
why you would need to build a salana L2
to actually have like an intelligent
take here to be be
honest I think the reason stated for at
least the grass L2 is that the amount of
data or transactions they will need to
process in order to support the entire
like decentralized AI like information
gathering stack is just orders of
magnitudes larger than whatever like
salana is able to support today and so
that's the reason they need an L2 cuz I
mean like sure sana's like put is pretty
good today if off the top of my head
just trying to think of like the TPS
non-vote tps's it's probably around like
I want to say 800 to a th000 and I can
definitely see like there's some crazy
use cases out there which require a much
higher DPS than that um but yeah that
sort of set of protocols or applications
that really need that level of like
performance and through is probably very
very limited and I know there's like a
number that's thrown out there in terms
of sana's like da capacity um and I know
that number is wrong but I think the
number that was thr around was like 150
uh mb per second but I know that
specifically refers to like something
else so realistically it's probably a
lot lower than that um but yeah like da
probably definitely is not the
constraint for salana l2s it's probably
going to be execution
too roping this back into swell too like
what is the difference between ether and
swell are they more or less competing
within the same vertical would you guys
say yeah I think they're like basically
the same um the only difference right
now is like ethery already uses obal to
implement like DVT I'm not sure if swell
has something like
that gotcha well I can take it over with
my cool Throne this week I've got
Shuffle uh it just concluded its LBP it
launched with about $10 million of
liquidity paired with usdc on ethereum
mainnet Shuffle is a gambling
application that supports like Casino
like games like slots and crabs
Blackjack Etc as well as a sports book
for things like college basketball NFL
NBA Etc all the sports you'd expect to
see on a traditional book it launched at
a $35 million market cap or roughly $600
million fdv apparently a jump tagged
address uh participated in the LBP and
deposited 1 million into there so
they're basically running in my eyes the
dydx Playbook kind of like a low float
high fdv in order to keep the value of
incentives really high and keep volume
coming back uh and trading for more to
get those incentives and I view that as
kind of attractive in relation to other
gamble five projects that we've seen in
the past it's either been yes they have
a token to use for incentivization but
they kind of have that cold start
problem and can't really get the volume
uh and the the incentives value
therefore suffer and then with roll bit
we saw them obviously explode around six
to 12 months ago but they do not really
have a token that they can use to
incentivize so I've been looking for a
project like this and I feel like
Shuffle checks a lot of the boxes they
did about $150 million of volume the
other day this is likely inflated due to
the airdrop occurring but nonetheless
$150 million of volume is a lot I also
like the way they designed their airdrop
so basically if you uh um bet on the
platform between February 2023 and
February 24 you got an air drop based on
the amount of volume that you actually
beted but what I liked about this is
that 20% was available on tge but then
the remaining 80% vests over three
months with the exception that if you
bet more volume then your airdrop vest
is expedited and you can actually use
the shuffle tokens to bet on the
platform which uh in my opinion just
ultimately means that people who
received an airdrop will likely gamble
it away as opposed to selling it on
dex's because gamblers like to gamble um
15% of the non Shuffle denominated
Revenue will be used to buy back and
burn the token and 30% of the shuffle
denominated Revenue will also be used to
buy back and burn the token so just
running some backup napkin numbers if
you assume like a 5% or even a 1% margin
on the 150 mil volume that'd be you know
$7 million of Revenue in seven days so I
think people are underestimating the the
amount of Buybacks in Burns this hasn't
actually taken place yet I checked the
burn address this morning but I think
that we will see people threading about
this one in the coming weeks could
definitely be wrong not Financial advice
but I've just been looking for a gamble
five project because I find the product
Market fit with crypto to be absolutely
perfect and just no one's kind of nailed
this on the head yet but curious if you
guys have any
thoughts I think it's looking pretty
healthy uh strong on liquidity this is
my first time looking at the chart um
disgustingly low float like I think this
is a a banger play I would like to buy
this
security I I got a quick question um you
mentioned that 20% is available post tge
and 80% investing then in the over 3
months for the speeding up part is it
only with uh volume that you wager like
post tge or is it like looking at the
volume that you had pre tge yeah just
post tge volume so you're kind of
incentivized to bet more in order to get
your tokens you probably lose you get
your tokens you're like all right I'm
going to make it all back in one bet and
then you lose that then all of a sudden
Shuffle tokens are getting burned that's
kind of that's kind of the thesis in a
nutshell gotcha and then is it like um
it accelerates the burn based on like uh
sorry it accelerates the vesting based
on like cures if you bet more than like
$10,000 it like vest like two weeks
earlier if you bet more than $100,000 it
vest like like one month earlier like
what does it look like it's something
like that I'll be honest I haven't
looked into it cuz I didn't personally
get the airdrop because this is like
they're very very strict on their terms
of services like they will kick you off
of the platform if you bet more than
like 500 bucks so that's another reason
why I'm actually kind of bullish on this
project like it seems like they are
actually following the rules unlike a
lot of other you know competitors so I I
would just like to see a well-run and
actually compliant gambling platform
that integrates crypto and and Shuffle
seems to be the number one Contender
there I also believe uh the Founder's
brother is the founder of manad I'm I'm
pretty sure I don't think I'm messing
that up but that's like kind of another
good sign you know this guy's well
connected and knows what he's doing in
the crypto space gotcha gotcha and I
don't gamble it at all so I'm G to have
a lot of questions one more question I
want to ask is you mentioned that you
can wager sorry I gamble but I don't do
like gambling in terms of like Shuffle
type Gam let me let me clarify that um
you mentioned that you can use um
Shuffle to wager so for example like I
don't know you want to bet on like
yesterday's like FA Cup match between
Manu and Liverpool are there two
separate po there like one is like a
shuffle denominated like order book and
there's another like USD denominated
order book or like what does that look
like specifically or is it just like
using Shuffle as a
collateral you would use Shuffle as the
collateral and all the bets are Deni
nominated in USD so I'm not sure how
that actually operates under the hood
I'll be completely honest there's a good
bit of opacity in the the design of
Shuffle like that's another one of the
main tips with rbit it's like we can't
actually see what's going on here
they're supposed to be releasing an
analytics dashboard that gives more
insights into the specific types of
wager volume Revenue burn Etc things
like that so definitely looking forward
to that but in terms of how it works on
the back end like it does give me mango
like Vibes like letting people you know
bet on your platform with the native
token so not sure how they actually
translate that into dollars on the back
end whether they sell the tokens for
dollars right when they receive them
because there is like a deposit and
withdrawal like you can deposit from any
chain you can be on salana you can be on
ethereum Etc just deposit into the
platform and then you have a dollar
balance but that dollar balance does
fluctuate while it's in the platform as
well so not sure if they're like
transferring it to Dollars and then not
taking on the price volatility or if
they're actually holding the underlying
assets and wallet addresses I would
assume the latter but not 100% sure
sorry Ren yeah no worries and I think
another interesting point that you
mentioned was that they're like mostly
following the rules and they're for
example like limiting the amount that
you can deposit or wager I think is you
mentioned I think that might be like a
really good thing obviously both from
like a regulatory standpoint they have
to follow the regulations but also for
their market makers if that's the
correct term um for like a gambling
protocol because if you think about it
like you kind of don't want adverse
selection you don't want to be the
market maker on the opposite side of
like someone being 100x long with on vit
like that'll be a pretty disastrous
outcome but if you limit like the size
to like $500 then I think it's safe to
say like chances are you're getting like
pretty silly retail flow rather than
like super gig Chad like uh whale flow
and so that's probably like another
reason that will help sort of like
accelerate the fly re between like
volume liquidity and
activity yeah I guess it's worth noting
too that like obviously there's quite a
bit of inflation from airdrop one
there's going to be multiple air drops
coming in the future the vests and
cliffs are like relatively short so the
question is kind of going to become like
is the amount of Revenue they're
bringing in offsetting the inflation I
don't know if it really matters because
we're in a bit of a bull market right
now and all it takes is like a narrative
to start up but there's definitely like
some question marks given the high
inflation early
on yeah I think on the market making
Point like if someone just wins too much
you just don't let them withdraw that
seems to work it's a pretty good
strategy in
crypto yeah their terms of services
definitely says like we reserve the
right to just rug you essentially so I
wouldn't try like going on there with
significant sums of money it's it's more
of something that you should test out
out and and have fun with just as a a
casual
hobby I have a question for you guys do
you think like gambling protocols
gambling in terms of like you can do
like sports betting blackjack poker like
that type of gambling do you think that
takes a backseat in the bull market just
given like sort of onchain like meme
coin activities or do you think I'm not
sure if this is the correct magic but
like gambling market share increases
versus like meme coin volume I guess cuz
I I feel like I could see it both ways
to be honest on one hand I feel like you
know like if it's a complete like bull
market you're getting at Le like 100 X's
every day on Salan like maybe I don't
want to like do sports betting and
gambling and like play poker onchain
instead I want to go like eat all of
these meme coins but I could also see
just like overall degenerate activity
increasing in a bull
market yeah my guess would be meme coin
volume maintains its dominance over
traditional gambling volume by by quite
a mile to be honest but I think it's two
separate cohorts of users like if you're
using Shuffle you can hardly even tell
that you're using crypto at all really
the only crypto component is depositing
assets and I think that giving like kind
of a a universal like global system
where you can deposit from any chain and
have like a clean front end for gambling
I think that has like an actual chance
to onboard new users as opposed to just
just the same people playing musical
chairs on salana today in mem
coins I think is a perfect spot to pass
it off to uh Ryan for his hot seat at or
Cruses because I know it has something
to do with me coins totally yeah so my
cool Throne is uh memec coin
legitimacy so we all know that as
memecoins are becoming the bulk of
crypto Market activity activity today
we're actually seeing the market uh
investors traditional Finance even begin
to intellectualize and um legitimize
mcoin trading in this Behavior Uh we've
seen Bowden and Trump uh Being Framed as
continuous prediction markets which is a
metaphor that I love uh we're seeing
with Pepe Bon uh being referred to as
cultural spot assets by
VCS and we're seeing uh even protocols
like Bon uh a meme with the team and Bon
bot uh actually generate real revenues
uh I think they hit over I think it was
over 120 million in trading volume and
generated 700,000 in Revenue yesterday
or 1.1 million in Revenue yesterday just
from Trading fees um that's like
fundamentals right um this activity is
being legitimized you're seeing the VC
think Pieces come out I even saw on
Twitter yesterday a legal argument for
the legitimacy of M coins right that the
teams that make these like they don't
stick around there is no team uh the
thing has no utility so it can't be a
security right so it's completely
legitimized uh I'm not a legal expert
don't take my legal advice it's just a
tweet I saw
um
and what's interesting is that like
potential hot seat when we start to
legitimize these things when we start
saying that you know defi is the Future
Finance or game BU as the future of
gaming kind of a top signal so my cool
Throne uh Is MeMe coin legitimacy but it
could very well also be a hot suat as
well yeah I think um meance right now
it's it's like making me increasingly
more uncomfortable in holding anything
besides Bitcoin because it's the only
one with like true institutional flows
like if if meme coins keep blowing up
like this
then you you're kind of like creating a
horrible image for crypto like we just
beat out the the criminal image and like
the moneya laundering image and I was
like okay we are just a giant Casino it
it makes me want to distance myself from
that entire sector and like just hold
Bitcoin because this is definitely not
helping us in the public eye at
all I don't know I feel like okay sure
like gambling and being the general like
probably isn't that good for the Public
Image but I feel like a lot of like
Society at large just like to speculate
on like the most stupid or ridiculous
things sure like maybe we shouldn't be
speculating on like which dog is the
best or I I feel like people definitely
want to speculate on for example like
who's going to win the presidential
election but for example if you made a
meme coin for every single like
boyfriend that Taylor Swift has had and
gave that to like the Taylor sft crowd
to speculate on I bet you that would
probably like assuming like you abstract
the weight off the complexities of like
interacting with crypto like that would
do an insane amount of numbers like
every time tayor sft switches a
boyfriend um but yeah I I don't think
I'll go so far to say like you know like
meme coin super cycle but I do think
that there's like a long-term Trend and
narrative there both in terms of like
just Society at large wanting to be
degenerate you see that and like
increase gambling volume like year over
year I think last or this year was like
the largest like betting volume for
Super Bowl like ever by a wide margin
gambling is an industry it has like a
20% like year on your growth rate the
amount of volume traded in zero Daya
expiry options which I think is mostly
driven by retail also has exploded in
the past few years and I think those are
like long-term trends that just continue
to hold and as right mentioned you know
rather than trying to speculate on that
in like a prediction Market where right
now if you bet on PO Market the best you
walk away with is like a 2X after the
election happens you might as well just
go ape into like Trump or like V in you
know because there's that continuous
element to it it'll probably still trade
after the election happens for example
all the way into like the fouryear terms
of these like the new president but also
like the upside is quotee unquote
Unlimited um so I do think there's
something to be Sav for like the
long-term staying power of like maybe
not meme coins in terms of like dogs and
cats but like meme coins that like
represent certain cultural events for
lack of a better
term I don't know I'd take pibbles as
side on this one I see like just New
Meme coins with hundreds of million
dollars of volume and they acrew these
ridiculous ftvs or market caps and it's
it gives people this false sense of
wealth when in reality it's only a
handful of people who can actually Cash
Out given the amount of liquidity on the
asset that they're trading so it it
makes me feel like it's incredibly
frothy and it scares me this early in a
bull market as if like we need to reset
back down to like 55 60k Bitcoin
somewhere around there but it's just a
game of musical chairs I just think
people need to be aware of the game that
they're playing because I think a lot of
people have made a ton of money on these
meme coins and they're still sitting in
them and once the Music Stops like the
liquidity dries up pretty quick and
those paper gains can run away in a
hurry so makes me nervous too
pibbles yeah and people will say like oh
crypto has found like pmf but I think we
live in a vacuum and I think we're
spending like eight hours a day
subconsciously on crypto Twitter and
we're like oh this is the future like
everyone's doing it what if no one
outside of crypto is touching these
because who has that much money in
crypto to throw $5,000 at a mcoin
besides us
like I think we're just getting really
detached from reality here and like it's
blatantly obvious but everyone's going
to continue continue to ignore
it so you're telling me that people
sending pre-sale soul to random
addresses is in a top signal I mean come
on we saw what $30 million sent to like
random addresses is this bom I I
actually have not even caught up on the
bom stuff so if anyone can shed some
light on what happened there that'd be
great too yeah I can shed some light on
sort of like the prale situation that's
my hot seat for uh this week so bom is I
don't even know what it is basically a s
like book of meme um it was created by
this Twitter account called Dark farms
and they're known for like the Pepe meme
um but yeah people send I don't know the
numbers here but they send like a lot of
money to this guy um and basically it
has a ridiculous amount of liquidity
just looking at it right now it has $66
million of liquidity and that trumps
like most assets uh on salana at some
point it traded at roughly like a two
billion FTV and it went from zero to 2
billion in like three days I think it's
one of the crazier if not the craziest
things that probably a lot of us have
seen in crypto in a very very long time
orever and that was like just the start
as soon as like that overnight success
occurred I think you saw over hundred
million sent through various pre-sales
in the last 48 hours and basically how
it works is like some K some influence
on Twitter mentions that they're doing a
pre-sale um it's a minimum of like one
Soul sometimes there's a maximum for
example of like three so you send it to
this address and then all of that so is
used for liquidity you get like a
percentage allocation of the initial
token Supply most of the time it's like
50% is given to people who like bought
into the pre-sale the other 50% is
deposited into the liquidity Po and most
of these people uh burn the
liquidity um but yeah I I feel like it's
gotten pretty crazy I think the craziest
example I saw on my timeline was some
person raising $30 million in 30 minutes
and sometimes you think to yourself like
how did these people just have so much
money that's sitting
around and they're just waiting to just
give it to like a random person person
in hopes that they don't get completely
rugged and another example of this or
sorry another example of getting rugged
is this token called slurf S slurf I
don't know how to pronounce it but they
raised 10 million dollar um they burned
the lp but they also burn the tokens
that were set aside for the pre-sale
allocation uh and this guy basically
revokes the Min Authority so there's
nothing he can do like quite literally
nothing he can do it's just like a big
oopsies and $10 million
and so is just now gone forever um I
feel like there's some legal liability
there for whoever did this but yeah it
definitely feels toy when a hundred
million dollar in so has been sent to
random Twitter accounts in the past 48
hours I'm not sure how you don't look at
that and like sorry how you look at that
and don't think it feels like a little
Toppy and a little frogy in the markets
right
now it certainly feels toppy um but
let's fast forward four years to the
next cycle is mcoin activity larger than
it is today or smaller than it is today
I would take today today I would say
larger I feel like every cycle it just
gets larger it probably increases like
by less orders of magnitudes every cycle
but if you look at like Doge it hit 80
billion market cap last cycle and ship
was like a fraction of that I don't
think it's too crazy to like CS go like
1X or like sorry 2x like higher than
that what we did last cycle just looking
at the state of the market right
now but when you multiply the number of
coins just naturally like the volume and
market caps of these coins tends to go
up so it's a bit like people taking nfts
and being like Oh the floor price is one
you got a collection of 10,000 the
market cap is one e times 10,000 in the
collection it's like okay yes that's the
market cap but is it really is there
really 10,000 eth worth of liquidity on
the other side of that trade like
probably
not I think I don't know if this like
the right way of thinking about it but
yeah obviously a lot of people are
sitting on like paper gains of like 5
million 10 million 20 million whatever
in their like wallets but one way I like
to look at a lot of these meme coins is
just look at the liquidity and then if
you divide it by like half so say like a
mecoin has like 50 billion in liquidity
and then if you take half of that that's
like 25 million in liquidity sorry 25
million of like Soul or like usdc and
then the other 25 million is like the
mean Point itself and that's like how
much money people have spent buying that
Meme coin you know rather than like
these like sort of like artificial paper
gains and I'll be quite curious to see
what the total amount of like liquidity
divided by two for all of these salon
meme coins is because it sometimes it
doesn't take that much like net dollar
spent buying to like push these meme
coins to like ridiculous like
proportions for example if you look at
like whiff it has like $21.1 million in
liquidity so just from like a number
standpoint oh sorry 71.1 million in the
largest poo so just from like a number
standpoint like only 10.5 million so has
been spent in like net buying pressure
on whin that's not that much to be
honest from my point of view like in the
grand scheme of things considering like
100 billion has been sent to Sal on
mcoin free sales in the last 48
hours yeah the thing is you don't need a
lot of new capital to really make market
cap accelerate like I know that there's
um a a pretty tried andrue paper in
trafi that shows that um for every $1 in
ETF inflows you get you get three to
five increase in market cap I imagine
it's way higher you know with these
small cap coins uh and it doesn't take a
lot of new people playing the game to
really push these things especially when
they're price and
sensitive but yeah I know there's like a
lot of like meme coin boo posting on the
timeline I feel like Andrew Kang is
probably one of like the larger mem coin
boo posters and I think his prediction
is like with and like
one or two of like the presidential
coins like ends up in the top 10 and I
don't think that's outside the realm of
possibility just because like this
election feels really contested and you
know like it's sort of like interesting