Proton released...a Bitcoin wallet 🤨

Summary

The video discusses the surprising release of a Bitcoin wallet by Proton, a company known for its privacy-focused services. The host expresses concern over the choice of Bitcoin due to its lack of privacy, contrasting with Proton's mission. They question why Proton didn't opt for more private cryptocurrencies like Monero and criticize the company's stance as potentially hypocritical. The host also mentions the absence of basic privacy tools in the wallet and Proton's refusal to accept Monero for subscriptions, suggesting a shift in Proton's values and a move towards Bitcoin maximalism.

Takeaways

• 😕 Proton's launch of a Bitcoin wallet feels inconsistent with its privacy-focused mission.
• 💭 The speaker is unsure why Proton chose Bitcoin over more private cryptocurrencies like Monero.
• 📧 Bitcoin transactions are public and traceable, which contradicts Proton's emphasis on privacy.
• 🚫 Proton's decision to not include privacy-enhancing features like coinjoin and silent payments is criticized.
• 🤔 The speaker questions Proton's commitment to privacy by not accepting Monero for subscriptions.
• 💡 There's a concern that Proton's choice might alienate privacy advocates and cryptocurrency enthusiasts.
• 📉 The script suggests that Proton's move could be driven by a desire to associate with Bitcoin's popularity rather than privacy.
• 🔑 The speaker highlights the irony of Proton, a privacy company, promoting a cryptocurrency that lacks strong privacy features.
• 🤝 Proton's refusal to accept Monero payments contrasts with other privacy-focused companies that do.
• 📈 The speaker speculates that Proton might be diversifying beyond privacy to become a crypto company, which confuses its mission.
• 📱 Despite the concerns, the speaker acknowledges Proton's other products like Proton Pass are still highly regarded.

Q & A

What is the main concern the speaker has about Proton releasing a Bitcoin wallet?

The speaker is concerned that Proton, a company that emphasizes privacy, has released a Bitcoin wallet which does not offer strong privacy protection by default.

Why does the speaker find it strange for Proton to release a Bitcoin wallet?

The speaker finds it strange because Bitcoin lacks fundamental privacy benefits and Proton's mission is centered around privacy.

What is the speaker's opinion on Bitcoin's privacy compared to traditional banking?

The speaker argues that Bitcoin is worse than traditional banking in terms of privacy because Bitcoin transactions are publicly recorded on a ledger.

What features does the speaker believe are missing from Proton's Bitcoin wallet that would enhance privacy?

The speaker mentions that features like coin join and silent payments, which are designed to improve Bitcoin's privacy, are missing from Proton's wallet.

What is the speaker's view on the justification Proton gives for not using more private cryptocurrencies like Monero?

The speaker is critical of Proton's justification for not using Monero, stating that Proton's reasoning seems to favor Bitcoin's market dominance over privacy considerations.

What does the speaker think about Proton's stance on 'altcoins'?

The speaker believes Proton's dismissal of altcoins as unsustainable businesses is biased and does not align with Proton's privacy-focused mission.

Why does the speaker question Proton's commitment to privacy with the release of the Bitcoin wallet?

The speaker questions Proton's commitment to privacy because the Bitcoin wallet does not implement basic privacy tools that are now standard in the industry.

What other cryptocurrencies does the speaker suggest Proton could have considered for better privacy?

The speaker suggests Monero as an alternative cryptocurrency that offers more privacy than Bitcoin.

What is the speaker's opinion on Proton's overall direction with the release of the Bitcoin wallet?

The speaker feels that Proton's direction with the Bitcoin wallet release seems more focused on hype and market trends rather than on privacy and quality.

What is the speaker's concern regarding Proton's statement that they are not a crypto company?

The speaker is concerned because Proton's actions with the Bitcoin wallet seem to contradict their claim of not being a crypto company, creating confusion about their mission.

How does the speaker feel about Proton's other products, such as Proton Pass, in light of the Bitcoin wallet release?

The speaker still appreciates Proton's other products like Proton Pass, but the Bitcoin wallet release has made them second-guess their support for Proton.

Outlines

00:00

🤔 Proton's Bitcoin Wallet: A Privacy Concern

The speaker begins by expressing their initial thoughts on Proton's announcement of a Bitcoin wallet, noting that it has been only recently announced. They mention that the wallet will use Proton's email alias for transactions, which is a new feature that they haven't tested yet. The speaker is concerned about the privacy implications of a Bitcoin wallet, especially since Bitcoin does not offer strong privacy protection and can be worse than traditional banking systems. They also mention that Proton, known for its privacy focus, has not included privacy-enhancing features like coin join or silent payments in their wallet. The speaker is frustrated because Proton's choice of Bitcoin seems to go against their privacy mission, and they question why Proton did not choose a more privacy-focused cryptocurrency like Monero.

05:00

🚫 Proton's Stance on Privacy and Cryptocurrencies

The speaker continues to discuss Proton's decision to focus on Bitcoin, expressing confusion as to why a privacy company would choose a cryptocurrency that does not prioritize privacy. They mention that Proton has not accepted Monero for payments, which is a stark contrast to other privacy-focused companies. The speaker also highlights community reactions, including a thread by 'untraceable' that criticizes Proton's lack of commitment to privacy in their wallet. They note that Proton's stance seems to be influenced by a 'Bitcoin maxi' perspective, which prioritizes Bitcoin over other cryptocurrencies, even those with better privacy features. The speaker also points out that Proton has not been transparent about their reasoning, which is concerning given their mission to prioritize privacy.

10:01

🧐 Reevaluating Proton's Mission

In the final paragraph, the speaker reflects on Proton's recent moves, including the release of a Bitcoin wallet and an AI feature, and questions whether the company is shifting its focus towards hype rather than quality. They express disappointment and confusion, as these moves do not align with Proton's privacy mission. The speaker acknowledges that Proton's other tools, like Proton Pass, are excellent but is concerned about the company's direction. They invite the audience to share their thoughts on Proton's Bitcoin wallet and whether it fits with Proton's privacy mission. The speaker concludes by stating that they will continue to use Proton's services but is reconsidering their support due to these recent developments.

Keywords

💡Proton

Proton refers to Proton Technologies AG, a company known for its suite of privacy-focused services including ProtonMail, ProtonVPN, and ProtonCalendar. In the video, the speaker expresses concern about Proton's launch of a Bitcoin wallet, which seems to contradict the company's privacy-centric mission.

💡Bitcoin wallet

A Bitcoin wallet is a digital tool that allows individuals to store and manage their Bitcoin transactions. In the context of the video, Proton's release of a Bitcoin wallet is controversial because Bitcoin transactions are not private by default, which clashes with Proton's privacy-focused image.

💡Privacy

Privacy, in the video, is a core value that Proton is expected to uphold. The speaker is concerned that Proton's Bitcoin wallet does not align with the principle of privacy, as Bitcoin transactions are publicly recorded on a blockchain, which is contrary to what one would expect from a privacy-first company.

💡Email alias

An email alias is an alternate email address that forwards to a primary email. The video mentions that Proton's Bitcoin wallet will use email aliases for transactions, which is unusual and raises questions about the integration of email services with cryptocurrency transactions.

💡Public Ledger

A public ledger refers to the transparent and immutable record of all Bitcoin transactions. The video script points out that Bitcoin's public ledger is a privacy concern because it allows anyone to trace transactions, which is a departure from the privacy one might expect from Proton.

💡Coin join

Coin join is a privacy feature that mixes transactions from multiple users to obfuscate the source of funds. The video discusses that Proton's Bitcoin wallet lacks features like coin join, which are essential for enhancing privacy in Bitcoin transactions.

💡Silent payments

Silent payments are a Bitcoin feature that allows transactions to be made without broadcasting them to the entire network, thus providing privacy. The video notes the absence of such features in Proton's wallet, which is a point of contention given Proton's focus on privacy.

💡Monero

Monero is a cryptocurrency designed with a strong focus on privacy and anonymity. The video contrasts Bitcoin with Monero, suggesting that Proton should have considered a more private cryptocurrency like Monero for its wallet instead of Bitcoin.

💡Cryptocurrency

Cryptocurrency is a digital or virtual currency that uses cryptography for security. The video discusses cryptocurrencies in the context of privacy, with Bitcoin being criticized for lacking privacy features compared to other cryptocurrencies like Monero.

💡Litigation

Litigation refers to the process of taking legal disputes to a court. The video mentions that the future of financial privacy might be decided by litigation, implying that legal battles could shape how cryptocurrencies are regulated and perceived in terms of privacy.

💡Bitcoin maxy

A 'Bitcoin maxy' is someone who believes Bitcoin is the only cryptocurrency that matters and often dismisses other cryptocurrencies. The video suggests that Proton's stance on cryptocurrencies seems biased towards Bitcoin, which is unusual for a privacy-focused company.

Highlights

Proton releases a Bitcoin wallet, surprising many users.

Proton's Bitcoin wallet will use email aliases for transactions.

The speaker plans to review the wallet in detail but shares initial thoughts.

Proton is known for privacy, but Bitcoin offers limited privacy protection.

Bitcoin transactions are public and traceable, unlike traditional banking.

Proton acknowledges that advanced Bitcoin privacy tools are legally risky.

Proton's choice of Bitcoin over more private cryptocurrencies is criticized.

Proton argues against altcoins, favoring Bitcoin's dominance.

The speaker questions Proton's commitment to privacy with this move.

Proton's decision to not support Monero for payments is highlighted.

Other privacy-focused companies support Monero, contrasting with Proton.

Proton's stance is seen as pro-Bitcoin and anti-privacy by some.

The speaker is concerned about Proton's positioning amid privacy and cryptocurrency.

Proton's blog post is criticized for being biased towards Bitcoin.

The speaker is unsure if Proton is now aiming to be a crypto company.

Proton's decision is compared to Google's mixed privacy practices.

The speaker expresses disappointment and will reevaluate Proton's tools.

The speaker invites discussion on whether Proton's move aligns with its privacy mission.

The speaker remains positive about Proton Pass but is conflicted about Proton's direction.

Transcripts

proton what the hell okay so I don't

really have a script for this video um

these are kind of my initial thoughts

please keep in mind this has only been

announced for about a day or two but

yeah proton released a Bitcoin wallet

and I feel very weird about it and I

think a lot of people feel weird about

it with the exception of one demographic

and so I want to talk about kind of

what's happening in my eyes and why I'm

frustrated um as well as some other

people I've spoken to and I'm going to

try to relay those as best I can now you

might be wondering what's different

about this well the main thing is in

some way it's going to use emails like

your proton email alias in order to send

money to other proton users um I still

have yet to test this this is not a

review I will probably do an upcoming

review actually diving into this more

thoroughly um but I just kind of wanted

to give the general thoughts so far

because this came out of left field for

a lot of people I kind of want to start

this by talking about in my eyes and

what I think a lot of people think of

proton is is a private alternative to

the Google Suite with overall good

privacy by default not the best but good

and that's even in kind of their mission

statement here proton privacy by default

a better internet starts with privacy

and freedom um take control of your data

and then they have all their things now

it includes proton wallet didn't include

that like two days ago essentially

privacy for a better world is kind of

the big thing that proton does and

that's their selling point my first

thing that I was really frustrated by is

two things one it's a Bitcoin wallet

only and for those who've watched the

channel and who are in any way familiar

with cryptocurrencies Bitcoin doesn't

offer very much privacy protection and I

would argue in a lot of cases it

actually is worse than a traditional

banking system because here's the thing

with a bank with a bank the person you

just sent money can't directly figure

out where you're sending other money or

how much money is in your wallet unlike

Bitcoin where it's just a public Ledger

now I'm simplifying this I know there's

a lot of Bitcoin Technologies now that

can improve this issue at least on a

surface level but the root issue still

exists which is that Bitcoin is lacking

some very fundamental privacy benefits

so it's already kind of strange for me

that a company that prioritizes privacy

as its number one thing chooses to

release a Bitcoin wallet especially when

it's lacking some basic features like

coin join and Silent payments that

actually try to make Bitcoin a little

bit more private but even proton

acknowledges here that coin joint is

dangerous to use because now you're

actively mixing currency which is

illegal so proton has now chosen a

cryptocurrency that doesn't offer good

enough default privacy and if they want

to make it more private they're now

jeopardizing themselves from a liability

perspective and they even say that here

the future of financial privacy May

therefore be decided by ongoing

litigation in the next decade and

privacy Advocates should support these

efforts how are they supporting these

efforts now the other big thing is you

might be thinking what about Monero

right because Monero is probably I'd say

the most popular and successful uh

privacy crypto project look I actually

wouldn't be upset if proton opted for

anything that offered more privacy than

Bitcoin does because again they're

privacy company but here's their

justification proliferation of altcoins

and other unsustainable businesses

became known as crypto and has taken

attention and market share away from

Bitcoin altcoins simply cannot compete

even if they have some perceived

advantages such as higher throughput or

privacy I actually talked about this on

Twitter a little bit and proton in their

history has never directly stated that

privacy is not a good enough reason to

use a more privacy respecting technology

in the past they might have said yes

this is more private but we aren't able

to do it because of technological reason

or usability concern or something like

that I go back to the two password mode

uh for proton which still exists for the

record um where essentially you can add

a second password so that you need that

password to decrypt your emails after

you log in with your normal credentials

this used to be I believe a default or

it was very easy to enable back in the

day for proton but they actually opted

to not use it because of the usability

concerns and people getting locked out

of their emails but the feature still

exists and it makes sense why they would

do that now for them to just say there

are perceived advantages like privacy

for other projects and say and not give

a reason as to why you're not pursuing

it outside of Bitcoin is the biggest and

we like Bitcoin it it seems really

strange to me from again a privacy

company and you might be thinking well

this is brand new are they going to

release more it's hard to know because

they specifically said we're not

interested in shitcoins which is a very

like Bitcoin maxy thing to say to

prevent other projects from ever being

legitimized and I think that's actually

what's really concerning here is the

proton blog is written very objectively

as if this is all true but a lot of this

is actually very debatable you know you

can say that many all coins pre-mined by

their creators and that it's just taking

energy away from Bitcoin but that's

coming from the perspective of someone

that only cares about Bitcoin I really

liked this thread by Vinnie here it just

deliberately rejects tools with higher

throughput of privacy rejecting reality

according to the author's biased Market

Opinion um I really don't understand why

a privacy company would go all in on a

project that clearly over time has just

not committed itself to privacy uh there

was actually a really good thread by

untraceable here which is you know

protons at privacy Cent company Bitcoin

is anti- privacy and the wallet itself

offers very little privacy tools at

launch like coin join silent payments

Etc it's also worth mentioning that uh

they've simply never accepted Monero

even to pay for proton so you can't give

proton Monero to get your proton

subscription that goes against many

other like really hardcore privacy

companies that we talk about back here

like mulvad and ivpn and even Tuda

supports Monero so these are all

organizations that have acknowledged

that there are privacy benefits for

their users to use Monero and of course

Fiat is more popular than Monero but

that's not a good enough reason for

again a privacy organization to

prioritize privacy tools that people

might need access to zth is probably one

of the most noteworthy people in the

space when it comes to privacy and

cryptocurrency and even he said as a

response to this threat I can't help but

air on your side here the whole

situation is extremely odd and reeks of

a lasery maxi for people who aren't

familiar with cryptocurrency stuff um

essentially a maxi is someone who only

cares about their coin and nothing else

which I'm not inherently opposed to

bitcoin I just don't think a privacy

organization should be opting to use

Bitcoin as a form of privacy um it's

really dangerous for their users it's

really not great for their users there's

a big liability for them in the process

and they're not even implementing basic

privacy tools that are now standard and

he says here none of it makes sense in

light of the broader mission of proton

without the planned Whirlpool

integration now it's kind of cool

because Seth is going to have Andy Yen

the CEO of proton um on a podcast

episode of opt out I've actually been on

opt out uh I was the first person on the

show um so if you want to check out

Seth's uh podcast opt out I'll leave it

down in the description so you all can

get uh the actual statement from Andy

once it comes out but they haven't

really spoken too much about it there

was this Reddit thread uh responding to

Monero where they even say that Monero

has a great team they're very focused

they offer a lot of privacy but they

don't want to associate proton with

criminality and I totally get that but

then they say we're not a crypto company

at the bottom so what is proton is my

next question if proton is a privacy

company then they don't release a

Bitcoin wallet which makes me think okay

are they trying to be a crypto company

then and offer multiple options for

their users with varying degrees of

privacy and then they say no we're not a

crypto company so back to my original

statement I made I think there's only

one demographic of people who are

genuinely excited for this and it's

Bitcoin people that's it it seems like

this entire product was developed and

advertised and marketed to not only only

be Pro Bitcoin but to actually be anti

everything else which is really

concerning given again the Privacy

implications of Bitcoin I've actually

made several videos talking about why

Bitcoin despite some popular belief out

there still is not an anonymous

cryptocurrency in fact by default with

many Bitcoin wallets if you send me

money or I send you money you can just

look up all the transaction history I've

ever done with that wallet it's really

bad and it's public information

essentially it's pretty much a public

Ledger of where everyone sent their

money and the tools to be able to users

are really really sophisticated and it's

even been stated by some people that

Bitcoin is actually easier to track in

Fiat so I don't really know you know I'm

trying to be levelheaded about this at

the end of the day this doesn't impact

proton's other tools it's funny because

I just made this video about proton pass

and how I've been loving proton pass so

now I'm like what the hell like it just

sucks because when you build a suite

like this now you're starting to get

into issues like Google has which is

okay Google makes nice phones but their

search engine tracks you in this way but

then they do this over here which is

pretty nice and it starts getting more

nuanced and it seems like proton is

there now where yeah maybe a couple

things they do a really solid couple

things they do aren't solid personally I

wish that proton I say this so much but

I wish they focused on actually building

out their ecosystem making everything

better making it better for people who

already pay to be in the ecosystem

instead of targeting new users all the

time um this especially it's just been

tough you know this has been a really

weird thing for me it's made me really

rethink what protons mission is uh

because just recently they released the

AI thing now they released the Bitcoin

thing and it seems like they're aiming

more towards hype than quality that's

just my opinion um we still use proton

here for techlore but I can't say I'm

not second guessing that right now um

just at the moment I feel like this is

the worst of it but you know if they

keep doing stuff like this I don't know

why I'm going to want to keep supporting

them and I say this having just released

my proton pass video like within the

last week which is Ultra positive and

like wow they really kicked ass with

proton pass and I still stand by that

proton pass does kick ass and I think

proton m is overall really solid but

it's just really hard to get it's just

really hard to understand and be a part

of a company when you don't understand

why they do what they're doing it

doesn't feel like they're being

transparent it doesn't feel like they're

being honest right now in the context of

this and it's just really hard to get

behind that um but I don't know if I'm

maybe wrong about this my perspectives

aren't fully up to date um again again I

think when things happen like this

that's when we have the most emotion so

I'm trying to be levelheaded about it

right now but I think I'm going to

process a little bit more but I'm really

curious for everyone's thoughts about

this um thoughts about if they should

have done this in the first place if

they should have done something

different with it um maybe you actually

love it and if you do love it please

explain to me like how you see this

fitting into the proton mission of

privacy but not being a crypto company

um again I want to highlight here I do

see the use case of Bitcoin in terms of

getting away from the traditional

banking system and owning your keys

owning your money getting away from all

that I get it but that's a different

goal than privacy very different goal

and that's why there's even tools like

Monero because Monero people are going

yeah you know well we understand the use

case for you wanting to get away from

the banking system but if there's no

privacy then there's some serious issues

with that especially with people who

need financial privacy proton is not

committed to your financial privacy

right now they're committed to your

financial sovereignty your you know

being able to handle your keys being

able to store your own money and I think

that's commendable but it's not the

proton mission that I'm familiar with so

yeah if you do agree with this I'd love

to hear your thoughts as to why you

think they did a good job and uh why you

think this fits in the mission that's

all I got I really appreciate you all

tuning in and I'll see you next time