Alex Gorsky on Leadership Challenges at Johnson & Johnson

Summary

In this insightful conversation, Alex Gorsky, CEO and Chairman of Johnson & Johnson, discusses the complexities of leadership, particularly the challenging decisions that impact employees and families. Gorsky emphasizes the importance of assembling the right team, fostering open debate, and considering diverse perspectives to ensure well-thought-out decisions. He also highlights the evolution of his leadership style, moving from working through others to understanding the global implications of decisions. Furthermore, Gorsky stresses the significance of developing future leaders and the enduring values of Johnson & Johnson's Credo in guiding the company's ethical and cultural compass.

Takeaways

• 😀 Alex Gorsky, CEO of Johnson & Johnson, emphasizes the importance of making tough decisions with care, empathy, and a well-thought-out process.
• 🤔 Gorsky highlights the significance of having the right team to support decision-making and fostering an environment for debate and challenge within the company.
• 🔄 He discusses the evolution of his leadership style, moving from individual contribution to working through others, considering global impacts, and predicting strategic implications.
• 🌐 Gorsky underscores the global impact of decisions, noting that every decision can affect various locations from Mumbai to Miami.
• 💡 He shares an example of challenging the status quo by asking a law firm to argue the opposite point of view to ensure thorough consideration of all implications.
• 🛡 The CEO talks about his experience with the U.S. Military Academy at West Point and how it influenced his leadership approach, especially in terms of service to stakeholders.
• 🌟 Gorsky expresses pride in developing leaders and the importance he places on a leader's track record in nurturing future talent.
• 🤝 He stresses the importance of a leader's commitment to high performance, development of future leaders, and alignment with the company's credo.
• 👥 Gorsky advises new leaders to be authentic, embrace humility, and understand that making mistakes is part of the growth process.
• 📜 He addresses the importance of the Johnson & Johnson Credo, which has guided the company for over 70 years and continues to be a moral compass for decision-making.
• 🔄 Gorsky discusses the process of keeping the Credo relevant, including Credo challenge sessions to ensure its principles remain integral to the company's culture and operations.

Q & A

What is the primary challenge Alex Gorsky has faced in his role as CEO of Johnson & Johnson?

The primary challenge Alex Gorsky has faced is making significant organizational and people changes within the company, especially those that can impact employees and their families.

How does Alex Gorsky approach decision-making in a large company like Johnson & Johnson?

Alex Gorsky approaches decision-making by ensuring he has the right team around him, fostering an atmosphere of debate and challenge, and encouraging diversity of opinion, even to the point of having people argue the opposite of the proposed direction.

Can you provide an example of how Alex Gorsky stimulated diverse opinions during a decision-making process?

Alex Gorsky once asked the chief counsel to have a law firm argue the opposite point of view on a product recommendation, ensuring that all implications were thoroughly considered before making a decision.

How has Alex Gorsky's leadership style evolved over his career at Johnson & Johnson?

Alex Gorsky's leadership style has evolved to focus more on working through others, understanding the global impact of decisions, and predicting strategic implications for the long-term sustainability of the company.

What is the most significant myth about leadership that Alex Gorsky believes people often get wrong?

The most significant myth is the belief that the top leader is there to just make decisions, rather than being in service to those who will be impacted by those decisions.

What advice does Alex Gorsky have for new leaders stepping into significant leadership roles?

Alex Gorsky advises new leaders to be themselves, approach their roles with humility, understand that they will make mistakes, and learn to care for the people working with them.

What is the importance of the Credo at Johnson & Johnson, and how does it guide the company's decisions?

The Credo serves as a moral compass and a guide for the company's decisions, outlining responsibilities to various stakeholders and emphasizing service to customers, employees, communities, and shareholders.

How does Johnson & Johnson ensure that the Credo remains relevant and alive within the organization?

Johnson & Johnson ensures the Credo's relevance through town hall meetings, outreach programs, and Credo challenge sessions, where the document is reviewed line by line to maintain its significance in decision-making.

What is Alex Gorsky's view on the role of a leader in developing other leaders within an organization?

Alex Gorsky believes that a leader's ability to develop other leaders is a key indicator of their effectiveness, and he focuses on their track record of performance, people development, and alignment with the company's Credo.

How does Alex Gorsky define success or accomplishment in his career at Johnson & Johnson?

Alex Gorsky defines success as the ability to develop great leaders who have taken on significant responsibilities within and outside Johnson & Johnson, and who have made a positive impact on patients and consumers.

Outlines

00:00

😇 Leadership and Decision-Making at Johnson & Johnson

In this segment, Alex Gorsky, CEO and Chairman of Johnson & Johnson, discusses the challenges of making tough decisions, especially those affecting employees and their families. He emphasizes the importance of having the right team, fostering an environment of debate and challenge, and ensuring a diversity of opinions. Gorsky shares an example of seeking an opposing legal opinion to strengthen their decision-making process. He also talks about the evolution of his leadership style, moving from an individual contributor to leading a large organization, and the importance of considering the global impact of decisions.

05:01

🌐 Evolving Leadership and Global Impact

Alex Gorsky reflects on his leadership journey, highlighting the shift from individual contributions to working through others. He stresses the need for managers to learn how to lead effectively by leveraging the skills of their team members. Gorsky also discusses the evolution of his leadership approach, particularly the growing awareness of the global impact of decisions made at Johnson & Johnson. He talks about the importance of considering the long-term strategic implications of decisions, not just the immediate effects, and the responsibility to future generations, given the company's long history.

10:02

🛠 Developing Leaders and the Importance of the Credo

Gorsky shares his insights on identifying and developing future leaders, focusing on their performance, their track record in developing other leaders, and their alignment with Johnson & Johnson's Credo. He explains how he assesses potential leaders by their ability to develop talent and their commitment to the company's values. The conversation also touches on common misconceptions about leadership, with Gorsky emphasizing the service-oriented nature of his role and the importance of decisions being in service to various stakeholders. He discusses his pride in the leaders he has helped develop and the satisfaction derived from knowing the company's products and services contribute to healthier lives.

👋 Advice for New Leaders and the Enduring Credo

Alex Gorsky offers advice for new leaders, encouraging them to be authentic, embrace humility, and understand that they will make mistakes. He stresses the importance of learning and caring for the people they work with. Gorsky also addresses the significance of Johnson & Johnson's Credo, which has guided the company for over 70 years. He talks about the importance of keeping the Credo relevant and alive within the organization, ensuring it serves as a moral compass and unifying force. The conversation concludes with Gorsky's commitment to upholding the values and culture of Johnson & Johnson.

Keywords

💡Leadership

Leadership in this context refers to the ability to guide, influence, and inspire a group of people towards achieving a common goal. It is a central theme of the video, as Alex Gorsky discusses his experiences and challenges in leading Johnson & Johnson, a company with over 130,000 employees. The concept is illustrated through his emphasis on making decisions in service of stakeholders and the importance of evolving leadership styles as one's role expands.

💡Decision-making

Decision-making is the process of selecting a course of action from multiple alternatives. In the video, Alex Gorsky highlights the importance of thoughtful and careful decision-making, especially when it impacts employees and their families. He discusses the strategy of encouraging diverse opinions and challenging the status quo to ensure well-considered decisions.

💡Organizational Change

Organizational change refers to the transformation of a company's structure, processes, or culture. Alex Gorsky identifies significant organizational and people changes as some of the most challenging aspects of his role, emphasizing the need for empathy and care when making changes that affect employees' futures.

💡Stakeholders

Stakeholders are individuals or groups that have an interest or concern in the organization's actions and decisions. The video emphasizes that leaders are in service to their stakeholders, including customers, employees, communities, and shareholders. Alex Gorsky discusses aligning decisions with the needs and objectives of these various stakeholders.

💡Empathy

Empathy is the ability to understand and share the feelings of others. In the context of the video, empathy is crucial when making decisions that impact employees and their families. Alex Gorsky stresses the importance of approaching such decisions with a lot of thought, care, and empathy.

💡Diversity of Opinion

Diversity of opinion refers to the inclusion of various perspectives and viewpoints in discussions and decision-making processes. Alex Gorsky mentions the value of encouraging different opinions, even challenging the direction the company is heading, to ensure thorough consideration of all implications.

💡Credo

The Credo is a guiding principle or set of values that an organization adheres to. Johnson & Johnson's Credo, mentioned in the video, outlines the company's responsibilities to its stakeholders and serves as a moral compass. Alex Gorsky discusses the importance of bringing the Credo to life and ensuring it remains relevant in guiding daily decisions.

💡Global Impact

Global impact refers to the worldwide effects or influences of actions or decisions. As Alex Gorsky's leadership role has expanded, he has had to consider the global implications of his decisions, affecting locations from Mumbai to Minneapolis and Warsaw to Miami.

💡Strategic Implications

Strategic implications are the long-term consequences and effects of a decision on an organization's goals and direction. Alex Gorsky talks about thinking beyond immediate impacts and considering second or third order consequences when making decisions, especially in the context of Johnson & Johnson's long history and future sustainability.

💡Leadership Development

Leadership development is the process of nurturing and preparing individuals to take on leadership roles. Alex Gorsky emphasizes the importance of developing future leaders and assesses potential leaders based on their track record in developing others, which he sees as a key indicator of effective leadership.

💡Humility

Humility is the quality of being modest and respectful toward others. In the video, Alex Gorsky advises new leaders to approach their roles with humility, acknowledging that they will make mistakes and learn from them. This mindset helps build trust and rapport with team members.

Highlights

Alex Gorsky discusses the challenge of making significant organizational and people changes, emphasizing the need for thought, care, and empathy in such decisions.

Gorsky highlights the importance of having the right team and encouraging a diversity of opinion to reach well-rounded decisions.

He shares an example of bringing in external counsel to argue the opposite viewpoint on a major product decision, enhancing confidence in their final choice.

Gorsky reflects on his leadership evolution, from leading no one to managing a large organization, and the importance of working through others to achieve goals.

He emphasizes the global impact of decisions made at the top, considering the implications for a wide range of stakeholders across the world.

Gorsky discusses the need to predict the strategic implications of decisions, looking beyond immediate impacts to long-term consequences.

He values leaders with a track record of developing other leaders, viewing it as a key indicator of leadership quality.

Gorsky talks about the misconception that top leaders simply make decisions, instead of serving those impacted by their decisions.

He expresses pride in the leaders he has helped develop, noting their positive impact within Johnson & Johnson and beyond.

For new leaders, Gorsky advises being authentic, embracing humility, and being willing to learn from mistakes.

He stresses the importance of maintaining high ethical standards and values, as outlined in Johnson & Johnson's credo.

Gorsky mentions Johnson & Johnson's credo challenge sessions, where the relevance of the credo is regularly assessed and reinforced.

He explains that the credo serves as a moral compass and unifying force for the organization, guiding decision-making.

Gorsky underscores the significance of sustaining a strong company culture and values, particularly in a global context.

He concludes by emphasizing the role of leaders in upholding company values and leading with a service-oriented mindset.

Transcripts

this is my q-see mime with my colleague

Adam grant and today we're going to talk

with Alex Gorsky chief executive and

chair of the board of Johnson & Johnson

a company with about a hundred and

thirty thousand employees it's part of

the Dow Jones Industrial Average annual

revenue somewhere north of seventy

billion dollars in two hundred and fifty

companies around the world Alex welcome

and today I'm going to just jump right

in with a question about some of the

tougher decisions you've made in fact

let me make it the toughest decision

that you made in the last year so if you

could just describe the decision what

were the conflicting concerns and then

how did you work that one through given

the fact that you lead a rather large

company well you might Adam thank you

first of all very much for having me

here and on behalf of all the employees

of Johnson and Johnson I'm really proud

to be here to be able to talk to you

about some of the issues and thank you

for all the things that you're doing

here at Wharton you Mike fortunately or

unfortunately during my career I've had

a chance to be part of some pretty

significant decisions along the way be

it strategic business operational but

I've got to say I think some of the most

challenging and probably the most

challenging has been as it relates to

very significant organizational and

people changes within our company and

particularly when you know that this is

something that can impact employees

future that can affect families those

are things that you always want to do

with a lot of thought with a lot of care

and a lot of empathy and so though those

types of decisions for me personally

have always been some of the most

challenging and there's a few things

that we try to do obviously the first is

make sure that you've got the right team

around you you know somebody the

decisions that ultimately and they're

what line their way to me have by and

large been decided by a great group of

leaders who have a tremendous amount of

responsibility in terms of their

businesses and the organizations that

they represent - it's to make sure that

as you're going through and making those

decisions that you provide an atmosphere

where you can really have debate where

you can really have challenge where

there's not just a preordained recommend

a

and frankly we're one plus one can equal

four or five in the whole

decision-making process and I've always

found that encouraging a diversity of

opinion by different members sometimes

even challenging people to come in and

argue the opposite of the direction that

we're heading to really make sure that

you've thought through the implications

and then last but not least it's once

you've made that decision recognizing

that there's going to be different

points of view of getting full alignment

around your leadership team said that

you had you're speaking then in one

voice and in a common direction and you

know that's what I've seen be some of

the one of the biggest challenges but

that's the way that we tried to deal

with it to make sure that you know we're

ultimately making the best decisions for

the company and all of our stakeholders

great thank you Alex Alex is there an

example that stands out particularly

when it comes to challenging people to

bring different opinions or maybe even

argue for the opposite of what they

believe where you're able to stimulate

that and it had a positive effect yeah

you know there's I've had a number along

the way but I think you know one in

particular is that for me you know

related to you know one of our products

where we were making a specific

recommendation about it on the market

and there's a lot of pressure tied to

the issue and right before we actually

made that decision I remember calling

our chief counsel that night and I said

you know I'd like you to talk to a law

firm and actually have them argue the

opposite point of view so we actually

want X outside the company you know and

had them and what I found through that

process was we we ended up staying in

the right decision but it made sure that

I think we had much more confidence and

conviction in the particular position

that we took by taking that pause you

know I think that as a senior executive

yes you want to be decisive but you also

got to realize the impact that your

decisions can have and so I think taking

that extra moment having that extra

challenge is good practice Alex you came

out of the US Military Academy at West

Point took a job pretty much at the

ground level in a unit at Johnson &

Johnson and in your first job as I

recall you led nobody you were pretty

much on your own but you moved up 3303

thousand and now 130,000 question about

how you've had to change your leadership

style going from nobody to a few than a

lot and now over a hundred thousand how

was your thinking about leadership

evolved what's different now from the

way you would have led save ten years

ago and the way you operate sure Mike

well your leadership does need to evolve

as you move through an organization and

I think there's a lot of lessons you

learn some that I've learned along the

way is number one is learning the

importance of it's not really what I do

but it's about what the people who you

work with do and working through others

I think that's one of the biggest

challenges facing managers learning that

skill where you're no longer the

individual contributor but you're

contributing by bringing together a

group of people who have different

skills different capabilities and

working through them to accomplish a

particular task and I see that as you

know being a significant challenge

facing many leaders as they move through

an organization that was certainly one

for me the second one is really

understanding the global impact of your

decision when you're starting in one

particular area and you have a rather

local impact to today where every

decision you have can have an impact

globally you know from Mumbai to

Minneapolis from Warsaw you know to

Miami and always considering what that

true global impact of a particular

decision can be and I would say last but

not least it's about you know always

trying to predict what the strategic

implications are so what are the second

or third order consequences of a

particular decision versus the immediate

impact you know Johnson & Johnson for

Singh is a company that's been around

for over 126 years and I'm always trying

to think about what is it over the next

ten years not the next just one year or

two years and certainly there's always

an issue de jour that we're working on

but I'm trying to think about what it

were the decisions that we can make what

are the directions we can go that is

going to continue our track record of

sustainability for the next decade for

the for the next hundred years right

Alex you're known not only at some

cares a lot about developing leaders but

also about your leaders developing

leaders below them how do you figure out

one who those people are that are likely

to be good at leadership development and

and two what do you actually teach them

yeah that's a great question and I do

believe that one of the best indicators

of leadership is a leaders track record

in developing leaders and I will

frequently focus on three areas when I'm

interviewing or what I'm talking to

people and one is certainly on

performance because you always want to

have leaders who are committed to high

performance and good markets bad markets

diverse global markets handling a wide

range of different scenarios secondly I

always focus on what's their track

record of developing future leaders and

one of my favorite questions is to ask

people and name the three or four

leaders that if I went out and asked you

know them who had the biggest impact on

their career and how they do that who

are those four people that you would

name in at a senior level if they can't

name three or four fairly senior level

people then immediately I question their

wherewithal in people development and

last I'll ask how do they move their

businesses how do they develop talent

with our credo in mind and so for me it

gives me an indication of how committed

they are to developing individuals to

developing teams you know and frankly

figuring out how to work through others

to get their jobs done

you know Alex's people look at a high

office whether community the mayor

company chief executive the country the

president people are looking in and

sometimes their perceptions are on the

money and sometimes they're wrong being

inside that room at Johnson & Johnson

what do you think is the perception of

leadership in general maybe leadership

in particular in your own experience

that turns out to be most incorrect

where do people looking at leaders often

not see what's really there the way they

ought to well I think that one of the

one of the most significant myths about

leadership is that you know the top

leader is there then to just make the

decision versus taking much more of a

service-oriented protein

you're in service to many of those who

in fact are going to be impacted by your

decision and you know I can tell you

right now that I i definitely approach

the job from the latter and always

trying to understand the consequences

the implications that your decisions are

going to have on your different

stakeholders ranging from customers the

communities that you work in your

shareholders your employees all the

people that you know that might be

touched and and learning at the end of

the day we're really in service to them

and that the jobs that we do the roles

that we whole have got to be ultimately

to helping all of those stakeholders

realize their objectives and and I think

you know frequently it's it's not about

that the quote boss making a certain

decision is about the decisions we make

in service of those stakeholders that's

really important so it's building on

that what is the success or

accomplishment of your career that

you're most proud of you know I think

the the thing that I'm most proud of are

the great leaders that I've had a chance

to work with along the way who have gone

on to take great positions of

responsibility and frankly make a

difference within J&J and of course in

other areas as well you know I've had

the opportunity to work with a broad

number of people through my you know

several decades now and frankly starting

with my time in the military

starting with my time as a coach with my

son's teams to my time Johnson & Johnson

some time at Novartis as well there's

nothing that gives me greater

satisfaction than knowing that people

have been able to go on and frankly do a

lot of good things for patients for

consumers along the way that's a great

deal of satisfaction and of course most

importantly just knowing that the

products and the services that we're

offering every day hopefully are helping

people live longer healthier and happier

lives that that's a great sense of

satisfaction Alex a question for people

who are just coming into leadership

responsibilities so think about the

first job when you had a response

for others I think maybe even later on

but especially for those who are first

taking on a significant leadership role

from your own experience what are the

one or two lines of advice that you like

to pass on to them so they can get to

where they want to get to and taking on

that leadership obligation

look I didn't a couple of things one I

would say is it's really important for

early leaders is to be themselves you

know so often leaders get into a role

and they maybe have some idea of what it

is to be a leader that they try to be

and I think the most important thing

that a new leader can have stepping into

a role is humility is understanding that

they're going to learn that they're

going to make mistakes and to you know

approach the scenarios something where

they're going to have to grow into and

and I think having that kind of a

mindset will immediately endear the

people who are working with you and

around you they're not looking for a

perfect leader they want a leader that

cares about them is going to help them

try to be better and I think as a new

leader if you remember that that they

expect you to be human that you're going

to make mistakes and that as long as you

learn and care for the people who are

working with you I think that's the most

important thing that you can do quick

final add-on question on that as you

come to lead more and more people

high-touch becomes more difficult

you've got people all over the world and

thus the tone you set at the top the

culture the ethics the values become

critical Johnson & Johnson has a very

famous crate o 300 and a few words that

say we're here on earth to serve people

that need our products great community

great employment setting and then we

work for shareholders as well when I was

in your headquarters a couple years ago

I noticed that that crate o is carved in

stone on the main floor of headquarters

what happens if you want to change the

crate oh well look Mike as you know that

the the crate o is our aspiration of

Johnson & Johnson written over 70 years

ago by General Robert Wood Johnson

himself it's been a great source of

inspiration

and it does outline our responsibilities

to our different stakeholders all that

you mentioned customers employees

communities as well as you know

shareholders ultimately and and in

through the years there been a few times

when it has been updated but the core

principles are something that we don't

think should change and you know as I

stepped into this role just as my

predecessors I think one of the first

things we've always tried to do Israel's

embodied in that document now I think as

as we what's more important for me as in

the organization is how we bring that

cradle to life and how do you make sure

that every day when decisions are made

in many different areas around the world

and different business organizations

that the cradle remains kind of our

moral compass the glue that holds us

together and that's something that we

constantly reinforce through town hall

meetings through outreach programs in

fact just this year is the 70th

anniversary of our credo we're having a

credo challenge sessions where every

board the 250 companies that you

mentioned earlier is challenging the

relevance of our credo and going through

it line by line and I think it's through

that is you keep that alive in the

organization again which we think is

incredibly important to make sure that

we do the right thing it's all about

leading people it's all about leading

values and it's all about sustaining

their cultures so Alex thank you for

joining us today we really appreciate it

thanks very much thank you Mike thank

you Anna thanks Alex

you